Guild Wars 2

Flissy.4093:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Warrior by a mile. They have been the most played class the last time we got numbers and they only got stronger. No reason to play anything else beside a warrior, unless you get bored.

Oh look, another typical player who thinks Warrior is the best at anything.

Warriors are only useful until both Banner of Discipline and Strength are taken. After that, either pick up more reflections, or a higher damage profession.

But @OP, Warrior is the most used class for the wrong belief they are the best damage (they are not, Thief, Mesmer, Ele and even Guardian are all higher in PvE).

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside, it doesn’t matter in the slightest that warrior’s do not deal the greatest damage. They still top out high in nearly every area while having the greatest defensive output with the least costs requirements.

Giotto.2607:

This video is funny!!!
So it is the Ele killed the boss, not the 3 Wars and the Mesmer!!!
The ele in that video only did a flame+blast stack might, staff fire 3+5, icebow 5, so it’s the ele killed the boss, biggest joke ever heard.

Did you even watch the video? The ele could have cast meteor shower and gone on a coffee break and he still would have out-damaged the absolute max DPS a warrior could ever hope to achieve.

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

On topic, most used class is warrior.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Highest HP
Highest toughness
Highest armor
Highest mobility
Highest damage
Highest condition removal
Highest weapon swap time
Highest healing without even healing

- Necro.
- Equal with Guardian, guardi also spams protection, sooooooo…..
- Armour/toughness are the same.
- Highest mobility?? That’s Thief. Warrior has highest consistent land speed, but ele FGS outruns warrior during its time. (mobility and land speed are not the same, warrior has no mobility, but has lots of land speed IF BUILT FOR IT)
- Ele.
- Ele or guard for Condi removals.
- Weapon swap times? Engineer has 0 or 1 second swap times.
- Highest healing skill without healing? Signet of malice (thief)

Warrior is not listed once, besides equal first at toughness.

Don’t spout nonsense because its become the mainstream thing to do. Spout logic and facts.

Nobody thinks engineers are the most used class in PVE?

Rynn.1324:

Nobody thinks engineers are the most used class in PVE?

Engineers are pretty rare in dungeons, that’s for sure. And the few you see are baddies camping FT or AAing with pistol.

Conncept.7638:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

Please tell us more about those amazing defensive builds for PvE.

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

Please tell us more about those amazing defensive builds for PvE.

I’m curious the know as well since every single one of my PvE builds are full zerk pure DPS with little to no damage mitigation skills, except for my Guardian he is full zerk with some defensive utilities cause that is his job.

Julie Yann.5379:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

Please tell us more about those amazing defensive builds for PvE.

I’m curious the know as well since every single one of my PvE builds are full zerk pure DPS with little to no damage mitigation skills, except for my Guardian he is full zerk with some defensive utilities cause that is his job.

I believe Conncept is saying that Berserk War are really popular because they can easily obtain good level of defense with very tiny investment. And can spend the rest for damage, thus bringing high dps with good defense.

Other classes have to specialize in damage or defense, but War can produce nearly the same output as other classes on and get more on other area.

The topic is which class is most used in PvE and I have to agree that is the case. War is the most forgiving class with a lot to offer.

They are so popular because of a large list. They just simply tick a lot of boxes on a casual players list.

-They have a very, very easy leveling.

-They have this illusion that they do massive earth shattering amounts of dps, which is proven as fact that they are actually on the lower end of the spectrum.

-Just all around new/and or bad player friendly, extremely forgiving to play.

-Access to multiple weapons, this was a big plus for me when starting, like OMG I can use ALL these weapons! zomg so kewl1!!

-The class reputation has become this warriors are kings of everything, EVERYTHING!!
This is because bad warriors out perform people playing other classes poorly, so these people assume warriors are PvE god mode, when in fact they are just lack any form of correct knowledge on their own class so on, so in the end everyone and their mothers main a warrior. ¬ . ¬

- Large build diversity.

-This is opinion, but almost everyone I’ve spoken to agree heavy armour looks the best. Play a warrior? Look cooler!

-DPS rotation. This is opinion, but if you play the meta pve builds, and see the different class rotations, I have to say that warrior has it far more fun, it’s fluid, more engaging so on. Staff ele? 5,2,1. Guardian? 1111. Ranger? 1111 (Probably not quite accurate, but most classes seem to use 2-3 skills for max dps, it’s boring.)

There is probably more I can list. But like I said at the start, warriors just tick so many boxes on a bad players list, or on a casual players list it’s insane.

phandaria.4891:

Julie Yann.5379:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

Please tell us more about those amazing defensive builds for PvE.

I’m curious the know as well since every single one of my PvE builds are full zerk pure DPS with little to no damage mitigation skills, except for my Guardian he is full zerk with some defensive utilities cause that is his job.

I believe Conncept is saying that Berserk War are really popular because they can easily obtain good level of defense with very tiny investment. And can spend the rest for damage, thus bringing high dps with good defense.

Other classes have to specialize in damage or defense, but War can produce nearly the same output as other classes on and get more on other area.

The topic is which class is most used in PvE and I have to agree that is the case. War is the most forgiving class with a lot to offer.

Hey look, someone who can read. Pay attention Spuke and Jules, you could learn a thing or two from this guy.

I main an elementalist and I can build to out DPS any warrior on any build, and (so far as I know) most builds period. But I’ll also die from a light breeze, since the elementalist has ZERO inherent defense. The warrior does not, it has high base armor and HP, and gains yet more just from incidental trait and ability choices. It can build full offense, because it HAS defense without building for it.

And don’t BS me about not using any damage mitigation, haven’t seen a warrior in 6 months or more without healing signet. That skill bring nothing to the table but the most passive and cheapest damage mitigation in the bleeding game.

Mjgander.1905:

-DPS rotation. This is opinion, but if you play the meta pve builds, and see the different class rotations, I have to say that warrior has it far more fun, it’s fluid, more engaging so on. Staff ele? 5,2,1. Guardian? 1111. Ranger? 1111 (Probably not quite accurate, but most classes seem to use 2-3 skills for max dps, it’s boring.)

Is this accurate? My warrior is only 31 so far, so I’m not sure about it. But all of my various engineer builds use like every ability I have and generally require specific timing. Even our best heal (healing turret) requires a specific trigger pattern to ensure you get both the cleanse and the blast combo. T_T

Warriors are hands down the most popular PvE class and for good reason. They have the following:

1. Highest base HP
2. Highest base Armor/Toughness
3. Highest landspeed/mobility without having to waste multiple utilities to do so
4. Highest average damage (ele can get higher in ideal situations, but that never happens in normal fights)

The only thing they don’t offer is the team defense abilities of a guardian. So unless you want to be the team defense then there is no reason to play anything else other than a warrior.

Rynn.1324:

Mjgander.1905:

-DPS rotation. This is opinion, but if you play the meta pve builds, and see the different class rotations, I have to say that warrior has it far more fun, it’s fluid, more engaging so on. Staff ele? 5,2,1. Guardian? 1111. Ranger? 1111 (Probably not quite accurate, but most classes seem to use 2-3 skills for max dps, it’s boring.)

Is this accurate? My warrior is only 31 so far, so I’m not sure about it. But all of my various engineer builds use like every ability I have and generally require specific timing. Even our best heal (healing turret) requires a specific trigger pattern to ensure you get both the cleanse and the blast combo. T_T

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

Conncept.7638:

phandaria.4891:

Julie Yann.5379:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

Spiuk.8421:

Conncept.7638:

This game is almost entirely defense, with offense only throw in in as an aside

Simple fact, look at every overpowered build and strategy we have had since launch, what do they all have in common? Was the healing guardian at launch offense based? How about the cantrip DD bunker ele? The clone/confusion spam memser? Stealth/evade spam thieves? The hambow/stance warriors? Every single one based on their method of preventing, rather than dealing, damage. Low investment, high uptime defensive mechanics (the more passive the better) rule this game with an iron fist.

Why do you think there isn’t a PvP build worth its salt right now that doesn’t give ridiculous uptime on vigor or tons of endurance regen? Why is the warrior the preffered zerker dungeon runner when it is proven that other classes can pull more DPS?

Because those vigor traits are a tiny investment for a ridiculous defensive uptime. The warrior has the perfect storm of passive affects with little to no investment; high health and armor, the most passive healing, the best passive condi-cleanse.

Please tell us more about those amazing defensive builds for PvE.

I’m curious the know as well since every single one of my PvE builds are full zerk pure DPS with little to no damage mitigation skills, except for my Guardian he is full zerk with some defensive utilities cause that is his job.

I believe Conncept is saying that Berserk War are really popular because they can easily obtain good level of defense with very tiny investment. And can spend the rest for damage, thus bringing high dps with good defense.

Other classes have to specialize in damage or defense, but War can produce nearly the same output as other classes on and get more on other area.

The topic is which class is most used in PvE and I have to agree that is the case. War is the most forgiving class with a lot to offer.

Hey look, someone who can read. Pay attention Spuke and Jules, you could learn a thing or two from this guy.

I main an elementalist and I can build to out DPS any warrior on any build, and (so far as I know) most builds period. But I’ll also die from a light breeze, since the elementalist has ZERO inherent defense. The warrior does not, it has high base armor and HP, and gains yet more just from incidental trait and ability choices. It can build full offense, because it HAS defense without building for it.

And don’t BS me about not using any damage mitigation, haven’t seen a warrior in 6 months or more without healing signet. That skill bring nothing to the table but the most passive and cheapest damage mitigation in the bleeding game.

That’s funny, 3 of my guildmates run full zerk eles in PvE and survive just as good as any warrior, my own ele is moslty zerk with a little PVT the only defensive skills I have on my bar is a heal and myst form which I use to reposition myself when I get caught in a bad spot. It’s f’in PvE, fully scripted, highly telegraphed fights, all you need to do is know when to dodge to survive. Granted, it is easier to survive on a warrior or guardian cause they allow room for errors but in truth defensive traits and utilities aren’t really needed.

BTW my warrior runs with healing surge so that I can keep full adrenaline at all times.

Clumsy.6257:

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

gs/axe rotation uses dps-cooldowns from gs and aa from axe. Now lets look at some other metas:

- guardian. same as warrior, but with 10 sec cd.
- thief. 5-1111-5-1111-5-1111…
- ranger. 111111111…
- necro. uses mostly 1 and maybe 1-2 skills on cd. Oh, and f1 flash on cd.
- staff ele. 12111-12111-121111…
- lh ele. F11111111111111F11111111111…
- mesmer. unless you need a good reflection uptime with warden: just use every phantasm on cd and then 111111111…

d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer are probably the only two rotations that are more complex then the warriors.

Molch.2078:

Clumsy.6257:

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

gs/axe rotation uses dps-cooldowns from gs and aa from axe. Now lets look at some other metas:

- guardian. same as warrior, but with 10 sec cd.
- thief. 5-1111-5-1111-5-1111…
- ranger. 111111111…
- necro. uses mostly 1 and maybe 1-2 skills on cd. Oh, and f1 flash on cd.
- staff ele. 12111-12111-121111…
- lh ele. F11111111111111F11111111111…
- mesmer. unless you need a good reflection uptime with warden: just use every phantasm on cd and then 111111111…

d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer are probably the only two rotations that are more complex then the warriors.

If ANet would at least make shatter mesmer viable in PvE again, you had one class more with a true rotations list.

Molch.2078:

Clumsy.6257:

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

gs/axe rotation uses dps-cooldowns from gs and aa from axe. Now lets look at some other metas:

- guardian. same as warrior, but with 10 sec cd.
- thief. 5-1111-5-1111-5-1111…
- ranger. 111111111…
- necro. uses mostly 1 and maybe 1-2 skills on cd. Oh, and f1 flash on cd.
- staff ele. 12111-12111-121111…
- lh ele. F11111111111111F11111111111…
- mesmer. unless you need a good reflection uptime with warden: just use every phantasm on cd and then 111111111…

d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer are probably the only two rotations that are more complex then the warriors.

My warrior rotation looks a lot like

GS-2-5-3, swap A111111-2,M4 swap GS 2-5-3 if I need a heal I eviscerate first then healing surge then go back to the rotation.

My staff Ele is way more complex than what you said since I also lay down fields and blast them for my teammates and stack might on attunement swaps. It’s probably more complex then my warrior rotation.

Warrior has a higher actual HP pool BUT most other classes have better defense in general, with mesmer probably being the tankiest. That’s speaking from a zerker meta perspective, no one really cares exactly how well you survive when full cleric is enough to facetank everything in the game without dodging.

Let’s compare warrior vs. mesmer:

Health: Healing Signet and Signet of Ethers both heal almost exactly the same total % of the class’s respective max health per second, both in terms of active and passive.

Armor: Mesmer has light armor, which means it takes about 15% more damage. That’s not a huge difference.

Active defenses:
Mesmer has access to:
- Perma-vigor (50% after whenever the nerf is)
- Perma-regen
- Perma-reflect
- Blurred Frenzy (2.5s invul every 12s traited)
- Illusionary Riposte (blocks one attack every 13s OR 1s daze every 13s)
- Distortion (3s invul every 51s)
- 4 conditions removed (for everyone) every 25s
- 2 stun breaks every 30s (if used immediately)

Warrior:
- Whirlwind Attack (.75s invul every 11s if you’re not using it for DPS)
- Tremor (2s knockdown every 26s)
- No vigor
- No self-applied regen, protection, etc.
- No stun breaks
- No condition removal

Having an extra 3k health and 15% damage reduction isn’t going to make up for the warrior’s sheer lack of defensive tools. It only seems that way if you’re not using any of said defensive tools anyway, i.e. 99% of pugs.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

In general?

Warrior by a mile. They have been the most played class the last time we got numbers and they only got stronger. No reason to play anything else beside a warrior, unless you get bored.

Personally?

If I find any motivation to log in, Mesmer 70%, Necro 30%.

Your post is self-contradictory.

Warrior is the most boring class to play, so whenever you get bored with GW2, pick whichever class but a warrior.

Ranger/Guardian/Engineer – the most demanding and enjoyable classes in the game.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

snip

Health: Healing Signet and Signet of Ethers both heal almost exactly the same total % of the class’s respective max health per second, both in terms of active and passive.

Armor: Mesmer has light armor, which means it takes about 15% more damage. That’s not a huge difference.

more snip

Are you taking drugs? Comparing Healing Signet with Signet of the Ethers and say they are pretty much the same?

Even with three illusions out, the mesmer signet heals less than the warrior signet.
The warrior can run around and heal about 400 unbuffed every second for just running away, hiding, or trolling.
Passive healing for the mesmer is exactly zero without an illusion out. And it heals only in 3 second intervals, so good luck to have the illusions alive on a tick.

I am a mesmer and I would trade Signet of the Ethers in a heartbeat, giving up the phantasm reset for what Healing Signet offers.

And can you tell me what it is good for that you talk about the percentage of the class hp is healed about the same, mesmers take more damage because of less armor and the mobs do not say: “Hey it is a mesmer, so lets do less damage to him, because he also heals for less.”

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Warrior:
- Whirlwind Attack (.75s invul every 11s if you’re not using it for DPS)
- Tremor (2s knockdown every 26s)
- No vigor
- No self-applied regen, protection, etc.
- No stun breaks
- No condition removal

Have you ever played a warrior?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Stamina
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Shake_It_Off!%22
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cleansing_Ire

Just to list some of the stuff…

If ANet would at least make shatter mesmer viable in PvE again, you had one class more with a true rotations list.

Shatter was never viable in PvE.

Have you ever played a warrior?
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Stamina
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Shake_It_Off!%22
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cleansing_Ire
Just to list some of the stuff…

Quite clearly it’s you who hasn’t played warrior since the bottom two aren’t even used by any decent warrior PvE build, and shake it off and signet of stamina are extremely fringe. The stock warrior loadout is FGJ, banner and signet of fury. if the lone warrior, maybe double banner and fury signet. If banners are covered, the next warrior takes FGJ and signet of might and fury.

hendo.1940:

If ANet would at least make shatter mesmer viable in PvE again, you had one class more with a true rotations list.

Shatter was never viable in PvE.

Have you ever played a warrior?
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Stamina
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Shake_It_Off!%22
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cleansing_Ire
Just to list some of the stuff…

Quite clearly it’s you who hasn’t played warrior since the bottom two aren’t even used by any decent warrior PvE build, and shake it off and signet of stamina are extremely fringe. The stock warrior loadout is FGJ, banner and signet of fury. if the lone warrior, maybe double banner and fury signet. If banners are covered, the next warrior takes FGJ and signet of might and fury.

I might be the only one who sees a difference between no condition removal and the option to slot it.
Just imagine, players choosing condition removal stuff because they know they will need it, crazy idea!

Sure, if you are dungeon running with a fixed group, you will not need it, but you won’t need the mesmer either unless you want to skip the content.

And yes, I know the chart of Guanglai Kangyi where in a perfect world a mesmer with constant 3 phantasms out and rainbow in the skies, the mesmer will be top damage.

Cleansing a single condition every 25 seconds is not even close to good condition removal. Cleansing all conditions off yourself every 36 seconds (traited) isn’t either. All warrior condition removal is complete trash and not even worth taking besides like I said, fringe situations. The two traits are not used in good PvE warrior builds either. So for all intents and purposes, warriors might as well have zero condition removal.

hendo.1940:

Shatter was never viable in PvE.

Btw, this must be new to you, but outside of dungeons, most of the time shatter still beats phantasm builds.

But yeah, PvE is only dungeoneering. ^^

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Warrior:
- Whirlwind Attack (.75s invul every 11s if you’re not using it for DPS)
- Tremor (2s knockdown every 26s)
- No vigor
- No self-applied regen, protection, etc.
- No stun breaks
- No condition removal

Are you kidding?? Please tell me you are.. Warriors can achieve perma-vigor (perma-dodge rather), you are wrong about that. Then again most classes can if traited correctly and using right gear. We have HS to make up for our lack of regen/prot, and no stun-breaks are you kidding me?? All classes have 4-6 stun-breaks and warrior is no exception to that rule. We also have decent condition removal, Shake it Off! or SoS for multiple condis both of which are viable in a PvE build. Most of your info is dead wrong.

nagr.1593:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Warrior:
- Whirlwind Attack (.75s invul every 11s if you’re not using it for DPS)
- Tremor (2s knockdown every 26s)
- No vigor
- No self-applied regen, protection, etc.
- No stun breaks
- No condition removal

Are you kidding? Please tell me you are.. Warriors can achieve perma-vigor (perma-dodge rather), you are wrong about that. Then again most classes can if traited correctly and using right gear. We have HS to make up for our lack of regen/prot, and no stun-breaks are you kidding me?? All classes have 4-6 stun-breaks and warrior is no exception to that rule. We also have decent condition removal, Shake it Off! or SoS for multiple condis. Most of your info is dead wrong.

Guanglai Kangyi has always been a theorycrafter, so he only sees the current dungeon meta and makes his conclusion.

Go to the group finder.

Every rush advertised has either one mesmer or guardian (sometimes one ele) and is looking for 4 warriors.
Sounds balanced to me.

As long as you are a warrior.

Warrior, because it’s op in dungeons.

Btw, this must be new to you, but outside of dungeons, most of the time shatter still beats phantasm builds.
But yeah, PvE is only dungeoneering. ^^

I’m pretty sure casting a phantasm, swapping weapon, casting a phantasm and mob dying is more efficient than smashing a bunch of useless skills and then using the f1 shatter. I’d like to see you solo open world champions with a shatter build and watch as you castrate your own DPS by destroying your phantasms over and over again.

Are you kidding?? Please tell me you are.. Warriors can achieve perma-vigor (perma-dodge rather), you are wrong about that. Then again most classes can if traited correctly and using right gear. We have HS to make up for our lack of regen/prot, and no stun-breaks are you kidding me?? All classes have 4-6 stun-breaks and warrior is no exception to that rule. We also have decent condition removal, Shake it Off! or SoS for multiple condis both of which are viable in a PvE build. Most of your info is dead wrong.

Warriors will enter basically every dungeon fight with zero stunbreakers, zero condition removal, zero sources of vigour and zero sources of regeneration or protection, because anythinga warrior has that can provide that is just subpar, and therefore not worth taking.

Every rush advertised has either one mesmer or guardian (sometimes one ele) and is looking for 4 warriors.
Sounds balanced to me.

Those are the very groups you should avoid because no competent player ever asks for “heavies only” or “wars only”. I avoid those lfgs like the plague.

hendo.1940:

Btw, this must be new to you, but outside of dungeons, most of the time shatter still beats phantasm builds.
But yeah, PvE is only dungeoneering. ^^

I’m pretty sure casting a phantasm, swapping weapon, casting a phantasm and mob dying is more efficient than smashing a bunch of useless skills and then using the f1 shatter. I’d like to see you solo open world champions with a shatter build and watch as you castrate your own DPS by destroying your phantasms over and over again.

If you run 20/20/0/0/30 for open world you can simply switch traits for champions an you will do fine.
Good luck with your phantasm build in (zerg) events, when you tag exactly nothing. And the fact, that you can aoe with shatter and you are not as reliant on the cooldowns of your phantasms makes it easier to blow through anything that is below elite. But who would play a mesmer in a zerg anyway…

But hey, this is about the most used class, which is not mesmer, it is warrior.

hendo.1940:

Warriors will enter basically every dungeon fight with zero stunbreakers, zero condition removal, zero sources of vigour and zero sources of regeneration or protection, because anythinga warrior has that can provide that is just subpar, and therefore not worth taking.

I would seriously take a few moments to consider whether what I say is true before bashing on warriors or any other class.. there are certain cases in dungeons where its more sensible to carry stun-breaks/vigor/condi removal than to carry a useless dps signet like Fury that will get you downed in an instant since it offers no protection from anything. For instance the AC P1 endboss, with all the mobs and condis (confusion, bleed, cripple etc.) a warrior with meta skills (FGJ, banner, fury) would die in an instant if he got knocked down. I usually take stunbreak, condi-removal and vigor for fights like these. Also for Malrona in TA, I swap out my mace to a shield, and carry Endure Pain (invuln) so that I am not downed by her AoE when she uses it. Would it make more sense dps wise to get hit by her poison and crit her for 100k+ damage and then use invuln/block so you don’t interrupt your rotation, or carry a useless signet like Fury and get downed and maybe die after a single burst of HB? You clearly are misinformed.

If you run 20/20/0/0/30 for open world you can simply switch traits for champions an you will do fine.
Good luck with your phantasm build in (zerg) events, when you tag exactly nothing. And the fact, that you can aoe with shatter and you are not as reliant on the cooldowns of your phantasms makes it easier to blow through anything that is below elite. But who would play a mesmer in a zerg anyway…
But hey, this is about the most used class, which is not mesmer, it is warrior.

Because phantasms builds can’t use shatter skills apparently.

I would seriously take a few moments to consider whether what I say is true before bashing on warriors or any other class.. there are certain cases in dungeons where its more sensible to carry stun-breaks/vigor/condi removal than to carry a useless dps signet like Fury that will get you downed in an instant since it offers no protection from anything. For instance the AC P1 endboss, with all the mobs and condis (confusion, bleed, cripple etc.) a warrior with meta skills (FGJ, banner, fury) would die in an instant if he got knocked down

Take meta traits, make sure not to stand in front (or if you are in front, dodge), spam DPS rotation. The p1 boss will die before the adds even reach you, you have plenty of time. And this is without fgs, just pure conventional DPS.

Also for Malrona in TA, I swap out my mace to a shield, and carry Endure Pain (invuln) so that I am not downed by her AoE when she uses it. Would it make more sense dps wise to get hit by her poison and crit her for 100k+ damage and then use invuln/block so you don’t interrupt your rotation, or carry a useless signet like Fury and get downed and maybe die after a single burst of HB? You clearly are misinformed.

Take the poison, enjoy the massive damage modifier and dodge the AOE. If you don’t feel you’ll be up for dodging it, take axe/sword since it will block all attacks for its duration and it has a 4 skill which deals a bit of DoT.

If you want to argue how misinformed I am, feel free to tune in to any DnT dungeon streams and bring up any of these issues and I’m sure we can answer.

nagr.1593:

hendo.1940:

Warriors will enter basically every dungeon fight with zero stunbreakers, zero condition removal, zero sources of vigour and zero sources of regeneration or protection, because anythinga warrior has that can provide that is just subpar, and therefore not worth taking.

For instance the AC P1 endboss, with all the mobs and condis (confusion, bleed, cripple etc.) a warrior with meta skills (FGJ, banner, fury) would [b]die in an instant if he got knocked down.[b]

That guy dies even before those mobs reach you with a good group. Also, hallowed ground can save everyone and is a fire field. Perfect for stacking might in cojunction with a LH ele

I usually take stunbreak, condi-removal and vigor for fights like these. Also for Malrona in TA, I swap out my mace to a shield, and carry Endure Pain (invuln) so that I am not downed by her AoE when she uses it.

Reflects and eat the poison. Boss is now dead.

hendo.1940:

If you run 20/20/0/0/30 for open world you can simply switch traits for champions an you will do fine.
Good luck with your phantasm build in (zerg) events, when you tag exactly nothing. And the fact, that you can aoe with shatter and you are not as reliant on the cooldowns of your phantasms makes it easier to blow through anything that is below elite. But who would play a mesmer in a zerg anyway…
But hey, this is about the most used class, which is not mesmer, it is warrior.

Because phantasms builds can’t use shatter skills apparently.

Non-shatter builds have higher shatter cooldowns and less clone generation.
And non crits might be under the threshold to tag the mobs.

So yes, using shatter as phantasm mesmer in events fails pretty hard.

Warriors aren’t highest damage… they have no sustained DPS, only burst… Guardians do more sustained

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Flissy.4093:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Warrior by a mile. They have been the most played class the last time we got numbers and they only got stronger. No reason to play anything else beside a warrior, unless you get bored.

Oh look, another typical player who thinks Warrior is the best at anything.

Warriors are only useful until both Banner of Discipline and Strength are taken. After that, either pick up more reflections, or a higher damage profession.

But @OP, Warrior is the most used class for the wrong belief they are the best damage (they are not, Thief, Mesmer, Ele and even Guardian are all higher in PvE).

The titel of thread: “PVE most used class”

Which is warrior. Which is the best PVE profession. Which is why you have so many of them. Which is why I posted it.

Let’s look what a base warrior offers:

Highest HP
Highest toughness
Highest armor
Highest mobility
Highest damage
Highest condition removal
Highest weapon swap time
Highest healing without even healing

All at the same time.

It is hard to fail in PvE as a warrior.

Id have to agree with this guy on this one. Greatsword warrior > any other class in terms of burst and sustained dps.

Heavy armor.
Good mobility/survivability
Boon potential.

Id think warrior is the most OP and over played class in the game.

Edit: I play a thief and mesmer as mains…

So basically:

Warrior can sacrifice a considerable chunk of their DPS contribution (which includes their own DPS + whatever they boost their party by) to get a weak personal condition removal OR stunbreak.

Mesmer can INCREASE their DPS (which is already extremely high) by slotting skills that ALSO give them extremely strong party-wide condition removal and stunbreak.

Also, because mesmers have more active defenses, they have a higher effective HP. As such, % healed is a better indication of actual heal effectiveness than the raw number of hit points restored. The fact that the mesmer is losing overall health slower than the warrior but restoring it at the same rate means that he’s got better defense overall.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

So basically:

Warrior can sacrifice a considerable chunk of their DPS contribution (which includes their own DPS + whatever they boost their party by) to get a weak personal condition removal OR stunbreak.

Mesmer can INCREASE their DPS (which is already extremely high) by slotting skills that ALSO give them extremely strong party-wide condition removal and stunbreak.

Also, because mesmers have more active defenses, they have a higher effective HP. As such, % healed is a better indication of actual heal effectiveness than the raw number of hit points restored. The fact that the mesmer is losing overall health slower than the warrior but restoring it at the same rate means that he’s got better defense overall.

That’s why you see all those mesmers only (maybe with a guardian) dungeon runs.

The class for PvE is warrior, everything else just exists as sidekick.

Luckily for all warriors, ANet is in love with them and they do not want to anger a gros of their playerbase with nerfs right before so many interesting releases. So nothing will change, especially not on the balance patch before Living Sory Season 2.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

So basically:

Warrior can sacrifice a considerable chunk of their DPS contribution (which includes their own DPS + whatever they boost their party by) to get a weak personal condition removal OR stunbreak.

Mesmer can INCREASE their DPS (which is already extremely high) by slotting skills that ALSO give them extremely strong party-wide condition removal and stunbreak.

Also, because mesmers have more active defenses, they have a higher effective HP. As such, % healed is a better indication of actual heal effectiveness than the raw number of hit points restored. The fact that the mesmer is losing overall health slower than the warrior but restoring it at the same rate means that he’s got better defense overall.

That’s why you see all those mesmers only (maybe with a guardian) dungeon runs.

The class for PvE is warrior, everything else just exists as sidekick.

Luckily for all warriors, ANet is in love with them and they do not want to anger a gros of their playerbase with nerfs right before so many interesting releases. So nothing will change, especially not on the balance patch before Living Sory Season 2.

So you’re basing the effectiveness of a class on how popular is in PuG runs? Are you serious?

The only reason pugs stack warriors is because they’re easier to do well with. If you look at most speedruns, they’ll likely have 1 warrior for banner duty, and stack eles for dps.

The amount of misinformation in this forum is down right laughable.

It really is shocking that people actually legitimately BELIEVE that Warriors are overpowered, highest DPS class in dungeons. LOL

Go look at any guild/group that actually knows anything about PvE, they run 1 Warrior MAX, and that is almost purely for the banners, that’s it.

Pugs stack warriors because of the following reasons.

-Easy to do well with.

-They believe the false information that is spewed all over the place.

-Harder to fail with, wiping and so on is less likely with Warrior stacked pug groups.

Ephemeral.5409:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

So basically:

Warrior can sacrifice a considerable chunk of their DPS contribution (which includes their own DPS + whatever they boost their party by) to get a weak personal condition removal OR stunbreak.

Mesmer can INCREASE their DPS (which is already extremely high) by slotting skills that ALSO give them extremely strong party-wide condition removal and stunbreak.

Also, because mesmers have more active defenses, they have a higher effective HP. As such, % healed is a better indication of actual heal effectiveness than the raw number of hit points restored. The fact that the mesmer is losing overall health slower than the warrior but restoring it at the same rate means that he’s got better defense overall.

That’s why you see all those mesmers only (maybe with a guardian) dungeon runs.

The class for PvE is warrior, everything else just exists as sidekick.

Luckily for all warriors, ANet is in love with them and they do not want to anger a gros of their playerbase with nerfs right before so many interesting releases. So nothing will change, especially not on the balance patch before Living Sory Season 2.

So you’re basing the effectiveness of a class on how popular is in PuG runs? Are you serious?

The only reason pugs stack warriors is because they’re easier to do well with. If you look at most speedruns, they’ll likely have 1 warrior for banner duty, and stack eles for dps.

No, this is not just about dungeons, it is about PvE.

Warriors are the easiest profession to level, do perform great in any kind of content, have the highest base hp and armor and can be played well easily. They are the rulers of PvE.

Unless you want the game more difficult than necessary and still not performing superior, you do not play anything else but a warrior in PvE.

Therefore:

Q: PVE most used class?
A: Warrior.

Also because pugs seem to think warriors are automatically top DPS no matter what spec they run, despite the fact that that makes zero sense.

If you want some lulz, try putting up an LFG for “LFG AC P3 (or whatever easy dungeon) speedclear, meta DPS only, ping gear” and just watch the stuff you get from the warriors that join. Some stuff I’ve gotten:

- “[Green Cleric’s Greatsword of Life] it’s okay cleric has power stat so i can dps”
- “[Berserker’s Longbow of Grawl Slaying] im zerk war its fine”
- “[Berserker’s Axe of Force]” but then once the dungeon starts he switches to a rifle (probably PVT stat) and just sits in the back healshouting

All of those people probably genuinely think they’re running a meta DPS spec.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Also because pugs seem to think warriors are automatically top DPS no matter what spec they run, despite the fact that that makes zero sense.

If you want some lulz, try putting up an LFG for “LFG AC P3 (or whatever easy dungeon) speedclear, meta DPS only, ping gear” and just watch the stuff you get from the warriors that join. Some stuff I’ve gotten:

- “[Green Cleric’s Greatsword of Life] it’s okay cleric has power stat so i can dps”
- “[Berserker’s Longbow of Grawl Slaying] im zerk war its fine”
- “[Berserker’s Axe of Force]” but then once the dungeon starts he switches to a rifle (probably PVT stat) and just sits in the back healshouting

All of those people probably genuinely think they’re running a meta DPS spec.

Also this.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Ephemeral.5409:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

So basically:

Warrior can sacrifice a considerable chunk of their DPS contribution (which includes their own DPS + whatever they boost their party by) to get a weak personal condition removal OR stunbreak.

Mesmer can INCREASE their DPS (which is already extremely high) by slotting skills that ALSO give them extremely strong party-wide condition removal and stunbreak.

Also, because mesmers have more active defenses, they have a higher effective HP. As such, % healed is a better indication of actual heal effectiveness than the raw number of hit points restored. The fact that the mesmer is losing overall health slower than the warrior but restoring it at the same rate means that he’s got better defense overall.

That’s why you see all those mesmers only (maybe with a guardian) dungeon runs.

The class for PvE is warrior, everything else just exists as sidekick.

Luckily for all warriors, ANet is in love with them and they do not want to anger a gros of their playerbase with nerfs right before so many interesting releases. So nothing will change, especially not on the balance patch before Living Sory Season 2.

So you’re basing the effectiveness of a class on how popular is in PuG runs? Are you serious?

The only reason pugs stack warriors is because they’re easier to do well with. If you look at most speedruns, they’ll likely have 1 warrior for banner duty, and stack eles for dps.

No, this is not just about dungeons, it is about PvE.

Warriors are the easiest profession to level, do perform great in any kind of content, have the highest base hp and armor and can be played well easily. They are the rulers of PvE.

Unless you want the game more difficult than necessary and still not performing superior, you do not play anything else but a warrior in PvE.

Therefore:

Q: PVE most used class?
A: Warrior.

…because they’re easier to play? I seriously don’t get all of this QQ about warriors. When you’re solo, sure you’ll be somewhat more effective than other classes due to your offensive buffs. But as soon as you’re in a group situation in PVE, where everyone has the same buffs, they’re easily outclassed. They aren’t superior to eles in DPS, they can’t provide mass condi removal effectively or put up reflects like mesmers/guardians. In a fully buffed group in PVE, their DPS is in the middle, with eles/thieves(single target) easily outclassing them.

As well as that, warriors can’t effectively stack perma fury on their team, or stack 15+ stacks of might like eles.

Mjgander.1905:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Also because pugs seem to think warriors are automatically top DPS no matter what spec they run, despite the fact that that makes zero sense.

If you want some lulz, try putting up an LFG for “LFG AC P3 (or whatever easy dungeon) speedclear, meta DPS only, ping gear” and just watch the stuff you get from the warriors that join. Some stuff I’ve gotten:

- “[Green Cleric’s Greatsword of Life] it’s okay cleric has power stat so i can dps”
- “[Berserker’s Longbow of Grawl Slaying] im zerk war its fine”
- “[Berserker’s Axe of Force]” but then once the dungeon starts he switches to a rifle (probably PVT stat) and just sits in the back healshouting

All of those people probably genuinely think they’re running a meta DPS spec.

Also this.

This just shows, that anyone can get to 80 without any skill or knowledge, especially if he plays a warrior. And that you can get along with bad equip, as long as you play a warrior, because it is so easy.

And to address the survivability point: mesmers and guardians are so much easier to survive with. With guardian, if you have atleast 15 points in radiance you can just spam virtue of justice as you kill mobs to get permablinds. You have 2 aegis (1 via VoC, 1 via retreat), a heal that’s also a block, as well as a ton of other blinds via sword/focus and GS, and perma prot via hammer.

With mesmer, you have sword #2, sword #4, distortion, perma vigor, and good hp pool to soak up hits.

And this is all available without affecting your DPS negatively (other than distortion). For warriors to have more defensive options, they have to switch out banners/signets/FGJ to get the same rsult.

Molch.2078:

Clumsy.6257:

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

gs/axe rotation uses dps-cooldowns from gs and aa from axe. Now lets look at some other metas:

- guardian. same as warrior, but with 10 sec cd.
- thief. 5-1111-5-1111-5-1111…
- ranger. 111111111…
- necro. uses mostly 1 and maybe 1-2 skills on cd. Oh, and f1 flash on cd.
- staff ele. 12111-12111-121111…
- lh ele. F11111111111111F11111111111…
- mesmer. unless you need a good reflection uptime with warden: just use every phantasm on cd and then 111111111…

d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer are probably the only two rotations that are more complex then the warriors.

Apparently you’ve never played guardian, staff ele, or LH ele. Guardians rotation is more like GS, 2, 3, 5, s/f, 1,1,1,1,1,1. Thats without utilities and using aegis to block strong attacks. Staff ele is more like earth, 2, fire, 2, arc. bril., arc. wave, 1,1,1,2. LH ele has a ridiculous rotation. Fire, 2, 4, 3, earth, arc. bril., arc. wave, 4, swap to focus, 4, LH, 1…., then repeat.

Staff ele’s optimal DPS rotation is Earth 2 > Fire 2 > Fire 3 (If targets are not burning) > Fire 5 > 2 > 1,1,1,1 > 2 > Repeat from fire 3.

Arcane Wave and brilliance are used in the first lava font to generate might and fury.

Clumsy.6257:

Giotto.2607:

This video is funny!!!
So it is the Ele killed the boss, not the 3 Wars and the Mesmer!!!
The ele in that video only did a flame+blast stack might, staff fire 3+5, icebow 5, so it’s the ele killed the boss, biggest joke ever heard.

Did you even watch the video? The ele could have cast meteor shower and gone on a coffee break and he still would have out-damaged the absolute max DPS a warrior could ever hope to achieve.

Sure, then should I say the wars could have a cast on thousands blades and gone on a coffee break and he still would have out-damaged the absolute max DPS of all other classes?

Clumsy.6257:

Molch.2078:

Clumsy.6257:

Thats just not true. Warriors skill rotation is by far the simplest in the game. The 2 most complex would be d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer.

gs/axe rotation uses dps-cooldowns from gs and aa from axe. Now lets look at some other metas:

- guardian. same as warrior, but with 10 sec cd.
- thief. 5-1111-5-1111-5-1111…
- ranger. 111111111…
- necro. uses mostly 1 and maybe 1-2 skills on cd. Oh, and f1 flash on cd.
- staff ele. 12111-12111-121111…
- lh ele. F11111111111111F11111111111…
- mesmer. unless you need a good reflection uptime with warden: just use every phantasm on cd and then 111111111…

d/f elementalist and might stacking engineer are probably the only two rotations that are more complex then the warriors.

Apparently you’ve never played guardian, staff ele, or LH ele. Guardians rotation is more like GS, 2, 3, 5, s/f, 1,1,1,1,1,1. Thats without utilities and using aegis to block strong attacks. Staff ele is more like earth, 2, fire, 2, arc. bril., arc. wave, 1,1,1,2. LH ele has a ridiculous rotation. Fire, 2, 4, 3, earth, arc. bril., arc. wave, 4, swap to focus, 4, LH, 1…., then repeat.

If 1 1 1 1 counts rotation? should i say wars rotation should be gs 2, 3, 1 1 1 1, the out damage every other classes?