Guild Wars 2

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

Seriously, I love the art, lore, gameplay, but is that really enough to make someone log in and stay logged in? Trying to re invent the wheel can only go so far. I would love to see this game get more than a hundred views on twitch, and more people logging in and playing. But having to use a website to find a group for PVE content was kinda the nail in the coffin for me. What are some of everyone’s thoughts on this? I mean let’s all take our “Fan-Boy” frame of mind out and be no partisan on this topic and get some good discussion going, and who knows maybe arena net will take notice.

Are you saying if we don’t specifically complain about something, we are being partisan? If we are fans of the game, are our opinions worth naught?

I am afraid I can not agree with everything you are complaining about. I’ve yet to encounter said ‘tiny bosses’, but then I probably haven’t encountered every boss in the game. I feel my characters progress, but maybe that’s just me. I am not a fan of ‘raiding’, what can I say? This is supposed to be a game that focuses more on aesthetics than gear stats, not sure what you are asking for there. I was very excited when Dusk dropped for me a couple of days ago, though I will admit it wasn’t off a boss, but a level 6 Jungle Raptor Hatchling.

I am sure there are many ways to improve the game. I am not sure making judgements about those who may post here will improve the community, though. =)

This is precisely the kind of complaint that I like to see. An itemized list of “problems” with the PvE in this game. It’s some of the very things you dislike that others like about this game. It’s not necessarily something “wrong with the game” here, but just a difference in play style. Here’s a response to the individual numbers.

1). Dungeons are boring in your opinion but some people like that. The idea of meaningful loot is what you end up with in “loot based games”. Skyrim has little meaningful loot either, but a lot of people liked it.

2) Big bosses is a design choice very much embraced by a certain generation. I dislike big bosses immensely. Shiro was a boss in Guild Wars 1, and I liked him a whole lot better than Abbadon. Why does a boss have to be “big”? There are big bosses in this game and there are small bosses too. Variety is the spice of life.

3) I don’t get one shot a lot, but I’m not running around in zerker gear either. I generally don’t like one shot mechanics….so it’s good I’m not often one shot.

4) This is probably the most valid complain from my point of view on the list. The game needs more to work towards.

5) The idea that once you hit exotics and that’s it is exactly what Guild Wars 1 is based on and it’s the basis of LOTS of complaints. Tons. Do you realize how many people left this game because Anet introduced ascended items. This is a deliberate design feature that many people came here for.

6) There’s some organization necessarily for guild missions, some of the temples, even the karka queen event but yes, there could be more stuff for large guilds to do together.

7) The zero exciting loot mostly goes back to Guild Wars 1 again. It’s just not about loot. Those who think it is…they’re missing what the devs are trying to do here.

8) But again MANY people want nothing but skins. This was a deliberate design decision by the devs, and the game was sold based on cosmetic progression. Many people on this forum who are complaining are complaining about vertical progression. The game was supposed to have none of it.

While some of your complaints are certainly justfied some of them seem to go against the developer’s intention designs. Which is fine, except I wouldn’t go to a WoW forum and ask for them to take out the raids. I don’t see why you’d post to a Guild Wars 2 forum and ask for non-cosmetic weapon and armor upgrades.

i don’t know if i agree to the other points, but loot is seriously lacking

Right now, for 99% of the drops, its either:
-blue, greens → vendor junk
-rare → either salvage for ecto, or mystic toilet fodder
-exo → directly to trading post, unless it’s a pre or i like the skin ( in which case i probably already have one )

There is just no excitement to it, feels like i’m just dropping money in physical form..

I’m not going to do an itemised list of responses because it will be almost exactly like Vaynes. But I will say I’ve been playing this game since launch, at least a few hours every day (unless I’m not at home) and I’ve done almost nothing but PvE. I love it and I have a great time doing it.

I think the big difference is before GW2 I had mainly played GW1 and single-player RPGs, not other MMOs. So that’s the basis of my expectations for a game – something where the focus is on the storyline and experiencing the content and character progression and loot are just mechanics to help that along.

If I get a shiny new sword from a dungeon that’s better than my old one then great, fights will be slightly easier now. If not then it doesn’t matter, I got to play through the dungeon and I’ll be able to play through the next one without needing that sword.

Aegis.9724:

i don’t know if i agree to the other points, but loot is seriously lacking

Right now, for 99% of the drops, its either:
-blue, greens -> vendor junk
-rare -> either salvage for ecto, or mystic toilet fodder
-exo -> directly to trading post, unless it’s a pre or i like the skin ( in which case i probably already have one )

There is just no excitement to it, feels like i’m just dropping money in physical form..

Just out of interest have you played a game where you get regular loot drops and most of them are things you can use? Because whilst I agree that it would be nice I can’t think of a way they could do it and I don’t think I’ve ever seen it done.

All I can think of is either your armor and weapons decay over time so you’re always looking for replacements (which I have seen done and IMO it’s a terrible system), or all the drops are money or some other token that you exchange for things you need, and whilst it would make them all useful I think it would also be fairly boring.

Alternatively they could have a system like the Zelda games where most of the items you find are either money or ammunition for various weapons, but that would require a major re-vamp of the weapon and combat system and again I don’t think it would really solve the problem. I know I don’t need the majority of things I find in Zelda games.

seriously people how can you not see that pve needs more work across the board…..

Most of your complains sum up to:
1. This game doesn’t have gear progression
and
2. This game doesn’t have raids.
These are deliberate design choices. I suggest you look for a game that has those instead of trying to introduce them to GW2.

Bazookajoe.5624:

seriously people how can you not see that pve needs more work across the board…..

How can you NOT see that PvE needs work for someone with YOUR play style and needs considerably LESS work (not no work) for people with my play style.

The problem is, people with your play style have countless games to play. Making this game into that game isn’t going to be good for this game. The biggest thing that game has going for it is that it’s not those other games.

Yes, PvE needs some work. Absolutely true. But if the work it needs goes in the direction of your ideas, then this game will cease to be a better game for those who share my play style. And it seems like Anet’s intention was to make the game that’s here, not the game that’s elsewhere.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

Seriously, I love the art, lore, gameplay, but is that really enough to make someone log in and stay logged in? Trying to re invent the wheel can only go so far. I would love to see this game get more than a hundred views on twitch, and more people logging in and playing. But having to use a website to find a group for PVE content was kinda the nail in the coffin for me. What are some of everyone’s thoughts on this? I mean let’s all take our “Fan-Boy” frame of mind out and be no partisan on this topic and get some good discussion going, and who knows maybe arena net will take notice.

1. I agree
2. I don’t really care
3. I disagree. 1 shot mechanics are awesome. I mean, it would be more awesome if a player would die immediately instead of being downed. But must give change to dodge.
4. That’s what happens when we balance around and separate the pvp/wvw/pve content
5. I want gear threadmill too – but with my work, I would easily be left behind so no.
6. I agree. I never played WoW, but the concept would be good.
7. I agree.
8. I disagree – as a poor individual in-game, I don’t have the luxury of getting whatever skin I want. lol

—All are based on what I feel.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

Seriously, I love the art, lore, gameplay, but is that really enough to make someone log in and stay logged in? Trying to re invent the wheel can only go so far. I would love to see this game get more than a hundred views on twitch, and more people logging in and playing. But having to use a website to find a group for PVE content was kinda the nail in the coffin for me. What are some of everyone’s thoughts on this? I mean let’s all take our “Fan-Boy” frame of mind out and be no partisan on this topic and get some good discussion going, and who knows maybe arena net will take notice.

1) Valid issue. Once you’ve done it once, there’s no inherent challenge except for Arah P3. May as well just join first-timer groups to see how hard they can make it for you.
2) How zoomed out is your camera? Unless you’re playing in a party full of full-size male Norn/Charr, I don’t think that should happen most of the time.
3) L2P issue.
4) I see what you’re saying here.
5) Skins. Also, GW1 was pretty much the same too. Mostly just differently skinned armour, with the same stats.
6) World bosses. JK.
7) Meh… ANet want you to farm but they don’t at the same time.
8) GW1 was the same. I don’t spend all my time trying to farm or get skins, so y’know, this isn’t really an issue for me.

1) I can see the issue here. However, define ‘exciting and meaningful loot’?
2) I don’t have a problem with this, personally.
3) Agree and disagree to an extent. There are mechanics there that are potentially interesting, but aren’t made important enough so you can brute force through them.
4) Leveling, Crafting, Personal Story, Achievements, Unlocking Skills, Fractal Levels. These are all forms of progression. Unless you mean constantly bigger stats, then I’m glad to agree with you. That’s the reason I bought this game, to get away from that.
5) I personally don’t see an issue with this.
6) This is what the Meta-Events and big boss open world battles should be.
7) As above. Also, define ‘exciting’ loot. I personally don’t play for loot, so I don’t get what you mean by this.
8) I personally don’t get excited at the idea of having to constantly be gearing up in order to content, so this is a non-issue for me.

In short, I don’t see the need for a constant gear treadmill (it adds absolutely nothing to the game short of making players play longer and gating content), or instanced raids (big open-world fights should be improved to fulfill this)

Bazookajoe.5624:

4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.

Fractals level?
PVP Rank?
WvW Rank?
Achievement Points?

Bazookajoe.5624:

Bla bla bla

Most of your issues come from the fact you want a WoW clone – a game in which the goal is to grind levels and then grind gear. The original intention behind Guild Wars 2 was to avoid exactly those things (see the link in my signature). So I can’t say I’m sad you are not happy with the game.

I agree with the rewards system. They are working on it tho.

The boss combat could not only use an adjustment to how long they have immunity to CC they could improve the AI so it doesn’t drop an AOE damage spot right on top of an AOE heal spot 98% of the time or 1 shot people I agree.

They could improve the way the condition builds do damage by extending the torment concept to other conditions. and improve the way conditions work overall. Poison for example has been used in murder mysteries both in fiction and real life for centuries in the human world but is a tickle to most mobs in Tyria.

The gear wall is particularly harsh when you’ve spent hours crafting to get to 400 make your stuff and then poof nothing else to make because the T6 mats to make runes/sigils are all but unavailable.

Support and CC are completely useless as builds in the game with the current mechanics for combat.

I am like you I love lots of things about this game, the scenery, the way they handle the resources, the ability to explore, the hidden aspects of the open world, the very concept of DEs/metas, but there’s alot to work on before it becomes amazing and combat is a very big thing to work on right now.

Oh and I understand OP that you don’t want to grind gear but currency wouldn’t be a bad thing, one that would allow you to purchase the skins you want without having to spend forever doing the same thing over again. Trust me no one wants more RNG as a solution to RNG.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. )
I mean let’s all take our “Fan-Boy” frame of mind out and be no partisan on this topic and get some good discussion going, and who knows maybe arena net will take notice.

I would suggest that, before pre-chastising anyone for being a “Fan-Boy”, you take the time to think about their point-of-view. People post this kind of thing here frequently, and I think a lot of us have started seeing it for what it is: Complaining that the game isn’t exactly like every other MMO ever created.

If you want to run like a hamster on a gear treadmill, that’s totally fine, but this game doesn’t have that “feature”. As a matter of fact, for many of us, this was/is a major selling point. Chasing incremental upgrades is an ultimately fruitless endeavor in most games, because you’re either getting better gear so that you can get past the artificial gating mechanic and into the next raid, where you do the same thing again, OR the next expansion comes out, raising the level cap so that the gear you worked so long and hard for becomes utterly useless in a matter of 3-4 levels. How is this “fun”?

I’m not going to flame you for mentioning raids, but I would like to know: Does raising the cap on party size necessarily make thngs more"fun" for you? Is it not possible to tune 5-man content to be just as challenging as something requiring 10, 25, 40, or even more? My experience with raiding on other games has taught me that the more people it requires, the more of a hassle it’s going to be. Not that the content is harder in any way, just that the more people you try to get doing the same thing at the same time significantly increases potential drama & bullkitten.

Your comment on one-shot mechanics and your complaint about having to use gw2lfg.com belong together. You’re getting one-shotted and having a bad tme in dungeons because you’re insisting on PUGing everything. Taking the time to find a good guild with helpful, knowledgeable folks is definitely worth it, because playing with people you like and who communicate well can easily triple the amount of fun you’re capable of having in this game.

You are essentially walking into a Burger King, after eating McDonalds for years, and then loudly complaining that they don’t serve Big Macs.

I applaud Arenanet for having the balls to try to break some of the traditions that have permeated almost every other MMO for as long as MMOs have existed. Sure, the execution could have been better (couldn’t it always?), but when you consider how much some of ANet’s design decisions have really improved the experience (no ninja looters, no gathering node stealing, no kill stealing, just to name a few), I’m more than willing to overlook a few flaws. Especially when I know that most gripes that I do have with the game have either already been addressed, or are currently being worked on, per ANet.

Can PVE be improved, of course there’s nothing that’s perfect, everything can be tweaked here and there. Although I think (and hope) ANet is fully aware of that fact as well and they’re playing around and see what does and doesn’t work. As players the best we can do is point out specific things that don’t work and things that do work. Saying that dungeons are boring is all find and good, but is there perhaps something you find exciting? Something you’d want to see more of? Or perhaps you have a suggestion to improve it in some way?

maddoctor.2738:

Bazookajoe.5624:

4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.

Fractals level?
PVP Rank?
WvW Rank?
Achievement Points?

I find it pathetic when people try to make a point with things similar to this. Clearly the OP is trying to explain that there is no enriching variety of endgame play. Grinding for achievement points or a higher rank/level in the exact same thing over and over does NOT count as a good variety of endgame. That makes no sense. Some people are completionists, most are not. If you decide to post your two cents, think about forming a proper rebuttal next time, this is juvenile.

Kryptonite.9376:

maddoctor.2738:

Bazookajoe.5624:

4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.

Fractals level?
PVP Rank?
WvW Rank?
Achievement Points?

I find it pathetic when people try to make a point with things similar to this. Clearly the OP is trying to explain that there is no enriching variety of endgame play. Grinding for achievement points or a higher rank/level in the exact same thing over and over does NOT count as a good variety of endgame. That makes no sense. Some people are completionists, most are not. If you decide to post your two cents, think about forming a proper rebuttal next time, this is juvenile.

Then enlighten me what counts as good endgame variety without adding different gear tiers and a gear treadmill.

I think one reason loot is lackluster is that we don’t need to compete with loot. If loot was as good as in other games, there’d be a surplus of good loot in game, driving prices waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down.

Kryptonite.9376:

maddoctor.2738:

Bazookajoe.5624:

4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.

Fractals level?
PVP Rank?
WvW Rank?
Achievement Points?

I find it pathetic when people try to make a point with things similar to this. Clearly the OP is trying to explain that there is no enriching variety of endgame play.

Nope. The words the OP used were ‘Zero personal progression’. I really can’t see how you can construe ‘zero personal progression’ for ‘lack of variety at endgame’.

Now, it might not be the OP’s idea of progression, but to say there is none at all is wrong.

Kryptonite.9376:

Grinding for achievement points or a higher rank/level in the exact same thing over and over does NOT count as a good variety of endgame. That makes no sense. Some people are completionists, most are not. If you decide to post your two cents, think about forming a proper rebuttal next time, this is juvenile.

I can’t say I’ve seen an MMO that doesn’t revolve around repeating the same things over and over again regardless of whether it’s PvE or PvE, gear, reputation / faction, achievements, dungeons, dailies. Their all repetitive tasks, and usually don’t amount to variety.

If you’re going to post your two cents, try to back up your points with some valid examples and arguments in context to the point, instead of telling the guy, who did make a valid point, that they’re wrong because you decided something meant something different.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

1. I agree 100%. In GW2 bosses had unique skins and stats. We have some of that in GW2 but they are almost always merch food.
2. I disagree with this, I find them mostly so big I cant seen them in their entirety.
3. I dislike one shot mechanics but that is what GW2 is all about really
4. I agree 100% as well there is zero personal progression
5. There are legendary weapons but since I have 1000 hours and the most valuable drop I have had was worth 5g 4 months ago I have 0 faith in ever EVER getting a legendary.
6. I agree as well. I miss the 12 man deep/urgoz runs from GW1, they were fun and rewarding.
7. I agree 100%. ALL of the world meta events are stale at this point and I have yet to get a decent reward from any of them. Jormag takes too much time and effort for an average 13silver(not including wp costs) reward.
8. The fun thing about GW1 was if I got bored of my weapons sets I would sell them and get something new. GW2 doesnt have that since everything gets soulbound. I also believe that there are very few skins as a whole from this game without having to enter the RNG cash grab that Anet offers.

My main concern with PvE (and GW2 in general) is that it does not reward you for improving your skills and being better. Rewards are either RNG or fixed, regardless of your personal skill level.

Casual rage in 3… 2… 1…

The risk vs reward in GW2 is terrible, especially compared to GW1. In GW1 if we failed UW/FoW then the whole team got booted. If you completed the missions then you got a chance at a rare item while the whole time getting ecto/shards.
Where are the dungeons in GW2 that offer that? There is nowhere in the game where your skill in defeating difficult content is rewarded appropriately .

Kryptonite.9376:

I find it pathetic when people try to make a point with things similar to this. Clearly the OP is trying to explain that there is no enriching variety of endgame play. Grinding for achievement points or a higher rank/level in the exact same thing over and over does NOT count as a good variety of endgame. That makes no sense. Some people are completionists, most are not. If you decide to post your two cents, think about forming a proper rebuttal next time, this is juvenile.

Yeah! I agree completely. Repeatedly running Raid Dungeon A to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon B to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon C to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon D to prepare for the expansion and gear reset where you repeatedly run Raid Dungeon A to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon B to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon C to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon D to prepare for the expansion and gear reset…

Well, that’s all just an incredibly boring waste of time. It’s a good thing that we have an entire world to explore and that every month there’s a new story to experience. This game doesn’t get old and boring like those other MMOs.

I wonder if people would still like raiding if the gear you got from it was just a unique style and not something with better stats.

Maybe they should introduce raids that allow you to get your Legendary earlier. Parts to it drop in the raid as loot. They’d have to make it so the raid is challenging but doesn’t require the trinity system. This could be simulated via clever zone mechanics, such as a bubble that the tank stands in to receive a boost to defense, a bubble the ‘healers’ stand in to do more group healing etc..

tolunart.2095:

Kryptonite.9376:

I find it pathetic when people try to make a point with things similar to this. Clearly the OP is trying to explain that there is no enriching variety of endgame play. Grinding for achievement points or a higher rank/level in the exact same thing over and over does NOT count as a good variety of endgame. That makes no sense. Some people are completionists, most are not. If you decide to post your two cents, think about forming a proper rebuttal next time, this is juvenile.

Yeah! I agree completely. Repeatedly running Raid Dungeon A to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon B to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon C to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon D to prepare for the expansion and gear reset where you repeatedly run Raid Dungeon A to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon B to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon C to gear up for repeatedly running Raid Dungeon D to prepare for the expansion and gear reset…

Well, that’s all just an incredibly boring waste of time. It’s a good thing that we have an entire world to explore and that every month there’s a new story to experience. This game doesn’t get old and boring like those other MMOs.

At least it would give us something to do…
The only reason I do dungeons now is if there is a daily that requires it. Why would I do a dungeon if I don’t want any of the skins or have enough tokens not to bother?

Fun? I dont find really any of the dungeons fun in comparison to GW1 and other MMOs.

Rewards? The money earned from runs is pretty terrible with the exception of the only run in the game…you guessed it…COF1…which I refuse to do ad nauseum. In GW1 we could get good rewards from UW/FoW/DoA and many EotN dungeons, some diversity helps longevity.

Challenge? Why would I waste money on repairs if there wasn’t an adequate reward waiting for me in the end. The only reason to do Arah P4 is the title that would come with it…is that reward enough? Is there a reason to do it more than once? Is it even that challenging?

You discuss having an entire world to explore but if I have done it already why would I bother doing hearts and JP again? What is my incentive?

You also discuss having a new story every month….well I am sorry but that scooby doo kittenty mystery is just the most pathetic writing that I have ever seen in a game with the exception of http://games.kidswb.com/official-site/scooby-doo-and-the-spooky-swamp/

Stormcrow.7513:

You discuss having an entire world to explore but if I have done it already why would I bother doing hearts and JP again? What is my incentive?

I have 14 character slots levels 3-80. I’ve been playing the game off and on since last September and I haven’t run out of things to do.

Yes, fun. It’s a game, if it’s not fun any more, don’t do it.

You sir are one of the few then that haven’t found the content getting dull.

I would be ok if I never had to do a World Event ever again unless they change the “hit toe to get gold”™ mentality of them.

The lack of risk vs reward and challenging content with meaningful mechanics hurts GW2 alot

I really really want this game to be better than it is and constructive criticism is what motivates any developer and makes the game better.

int main()
{
key = search_keyword();
if (key == "reward" || key == "loot"){
               pile_of_inconstructive_threads[i] = *this_thread;
               i++;
               printf ( "You can play plenty of other games, in which you can chase carrots. We like the game as it is.");
}
return 0;
}

Stormcrow.7513:

You sir are one of the few then that haven’t found the content getting dull.

Well it’s still not boring for me either. Not being much of a WvW/ Spvp player my rotation follows this:
doing events and dailies until I have enough money to gear up a new level 80 (that includes buying expensive skins like T3) → leveling that said alt to level 80 → running fractals to get 20 dailies to get the rings for the alt.
This is normally interrupted by new monthly living story events, doing my monthly, helping guildies with dungeon runs, doing guild missions, playing around with new stuff like the horn from the gem store.
So no matter when I log in there’s something to do for me

Stormcrow.7513:

You sir are one of the few then that haven’t found the content getting dull.

I would be ok if I never had to do a World Event ever again unless they change the “hit toe to get gold”™ mentality of them.

The lack of risk vs reward and challenging content with meaningful mechanics hurts GW2 alot

I really really want this game to be better than it is and constructive criticism is what motivates any developer and makes the game better.

I’ll keep that in mind, if I should come across some of that constructive criticism.

1 “Dungeons are boring” – I find some dungeons boring because the easiest way to run them is to stack in a corner and spam all of your abilities. I like the AC revamp, the bosses now have more engaging mechanics, but some of them can still be exploited this way. It is a shame that bosses don’t have loot tables, and most times looting a chest is underwhelming. I like earning tokens, but that sense of reward only happens AFTER the run. Boss pathing and AI needs to be improved, as such that they can’t just be LOSed into a corner and bursted down. Give them more cleave/AoE attacks. Force players to take advantage of space. You didn’t really mention why found them boring, OP, care to elaborate?

2 “Tiny Bosses” – Yes. I started this game with a charr, and tiny bosses are difficult to fight because you can’t see their animation, which leads to the next point.

3 “One shot attacks” – I think one shot attacks are fine, as long the attack is clearly telegraphed (kohler’s chain pull). The problem with this is that there are way too many flashy spell effects in the game, and often times I find it difficult to pay attention to enemy tells. I don’t know which attacks to dodge and which to take. There needs to be a slider for spell effects, and during one of Guru’s SOTG podcasts, an anet dev said that they were working on spell effect culling in PvP. This needs to be in PvE.

4 “Zero personal progression” – Agreed. Once I have ascended gear and the cosmetics I want, there’s nothing else to look forward to. Extending the progression path and making it more time consuming isn’t the solution. Maybe collecting armor and weapon sets can be another form of progression. With this they’ll need to add an equipment locker for PvE. Collecting sets could reward achievements and titles. There also needs to be more types of rewards to work toward. Titles, minis, and tonics are other forms of reward, but I don’t feel that that’s enough.

5 “Gear wall” – Gear wall ends at Ascended by the way. This ties in with the personal progression issue.

6. “Large scale organized PvE” – There are Guild Missions. I like Guild Rush and Puzzle. Some bounty targets have challenging mechanics that can’t be surpassed even when you throw more people at it (Looking at you 2MUlT), but having to look for them is just annoying. I don’t like game mechanics that have to rely on outside sources (dulfy guides). This is the same reason I’m not a fan of trek. Guild Challenges suffer from “just throw more people at it” syndrome. I hear that anet is working on their version of “raid” content, we’ll have to see.

7. “World bosses” – The dragon fights have mechanics in them that are wildly ignored, like when fighting Tequatl. This may be a scaling issue, since you can ignore 90% of the adds, the bone wall, and the megalazer fires on its own without help. Jormag’s mechanics are a bit more demanding, but people just stand in a safe spot and plug away with their ranged attacks. The fight itself is also way too repetitive. How many times do I have to walk these golems. The Karka Queen was an attempt at making world bosses more challenging, but I don’t know, I can’t articulate what’s wrong with it exactly but it feels tedious rather than challenging.

8. “Skins” – This ties into the personal progression point. Once you have the skins you want, then what? I have a dozen different looking backpieces spread across a few alts. But we shouldn’t have to reroll to take advantage of skins.

I still log in and play this game daily for long stretches of time, but I do find myself going AFK a lot. This game is perfect for people who don’t have much time to play due to the micro updates, low stat ceiling, and casual world boss encounters. People who have more time to dedicate to this game will run into the aforementioned issues. Addressing them will only increase the longevity of the game for people on both sides of the camp.

EDIT : “f k” without the space is filtered?

I was excited when I got Vera from the Shatterer

Also agree with stefanos :p

Torpian.9142:

I wonder if people would still like raiding if the gear you got from it was just a unique style and not something with better stats.

Maybe they should introduce raids that allow you to get your Legendary earlier. Parts to it drop in the raid as loot. They’d have to make it so the raid is challenging but doesn’t require the trinity system. This could be simulated via clever zone mechanics, such as a bubble that the tank stands in to receive a boost to defense, a bubble the ‘healers’ stand in to do more group healing etc..

Challenge in the form of what? Marathon CCing?

This game is apparently casual… not sure people want challenging content.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

1.) I agree on the loot. Loot in the game is boring. It’s not just because of the way stats are distributed. The dungeon skins that do exist are mostly pretty bad and boring. There are few exceptions. ANet also failed to deliver on variety of skins. Prior to launch, they talked about having at least two skins per armor class per dungeon. They also talked about story mode providing a token for a cool weapon skins, with each dungeon offering a skin for each and every weapon.

Cosmetics in lieu of stats can work, if the skins are sufficiently desirable and vafriety is offered. ANet has completely dropped the ball on this.

2. Agreed. Most bosses are underwhelming. Mobs are very well done in the game in general, but they completely failed on producing “big kitten monsters”. We have a few huge, immobile world bosses, but very few BAMs.

3. Agreed. Someone seems to think annoying and overpowered = challenging and fun. Seems like poor design to me.

4. & 5. I don’t completely agree with this. I’ve played over 1600 hours and continue to find play worth while with out gear inflation. It might be nice if we could have some expensive, balanced but viscerally very cool skills to unlock once we hit 80 and start accumulating excess skill points. I also wish there were a lot more cool skins about a quarter less difficult to obtain than legendaries. Alternative rewards can work, ANet just hasn’t done much to make the concept work.

6. I personally loath raids. I’m fine with offering options that I don’t personally care for, but I’m wary because other MMOs with Raids tend to make raids the focus of ongoing development, at the cost of the other 90% who don’t like raids. Now, if they could pull off what Wildstar is promising, dungeons that scale from solo all the way up to raid size, then I’d be fine with that.

7. Touched on above. The game needs exciting BAMs. The game needs more exciting rewards, but that doesn’t have to mean stat inflation.

8. I’d be much more excited about skins if they worked much differently. Too many skins are less than stellar. Too many skins are too rare to be something you actually work towards. Random luck does not equal rewarding effort. Once a skin is applied it’s character bound. I’d prefer more flexibility. Too few skins in general.

I’d like to see the entire skin system revamped and have them used more as rewards you work towards and collect.

Stormcrow.7513:

You sir are one of the few then that haven’t found the content getting dull.

I would be ok if I never had to do a World Event ever again unless they change the “hit toe to get gold”™ mentality of them.

The lack of risk vs reward and challenging content with meaningful mechanics hurts GW2 alot

I really really want this game to be better than it is and constructive criticism is what motivates any developer and makes the game better.

Why do you make the claim that so and so is one of the few who aren’t bored. Did you poll everyone playing the game? I’m curious because I’ve heard other people claim this too.

Let’s put it another way. What was the last game you played for ten months straight that didn’t bore you. I got bored of Skyrim before that. I got bored of WoW before that, I got rid of Lotro before that.

There are no games, particularly at release, that weren’t boring months later. Rift lasted me 3 months. Guild Wars 2 lasted me about 9.

But am I bored because there’s nothing to do, or am I bored because I’m waiting for new content.

One of the biggest complaints about WoW is boredom. How do you fight it? You play with friends or a guild.

Yes Vayne, there was a poll. Didn’t you fill it in?

nirvana.8245:

Yes Vayne, there was a poll. Didn’t you fill it in?

LMAO! No, I was absent that day.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

1.) I’d say the loot in general is awful. My Warrior in GW1 has almost all the sets of elite armor except like 3 or so. Most were payed for by lucky drops, which were often in GW1. Selling a Black Dye meant that you had almost enough to buy a set of max stat armor, and I’ve had dozens upon dozens of Black Dyes drop for me. My first set of elite armor was payed for thanks to a Superior Absorption Rune which sold for 90k at the time. By comparison, the most expensive drop I’ve seen in GW2 was a White Dye which sold for 5 gold. I’ve been playing since head start and only 1 exotic dropped for me. One.
3.) I don’t like the one shot mechanics in GW2 because the ‘tells’ are sometimes difficult to read and/or obscured by the ridiculous spell effects. I’m in the downed state wondering WTF just happened due to poor design. It’s frustrating. Allow us to adjust the opacity of enemy/friendly spell effects please.
5.) I hate gear progression. Exotics should be the only top tier, and if it were up to me Ascended gear would’ve never existed.
7.) The main reason I bought GW2 is because how awesome the open world sounded, but after spending most of my time in it, I’m very disappointed. The boring world boss fights are part of that reason. They have no cool mechanics to make the fights fun nor challenging, they’re just a big punching bag with tons of health. They don’t even move.
8.) As I said, I hate gear progression so skins are fine with me, but they should add unique skins like I mentioned earlier.

I’m fighting the urge to add more complaints only because it would take me quite a while to type up.

If raids became a thing in this game I would still run WvW exclusively. If gear progression became a thing it would blow WvW balance to hell and I’d be forced to quit. So raids, whatever, swing for the fences. Gear progression, no.

OP you are playing the wrong game.
You might find Rift or DDO or any of the other bazillion MMo’s out there more to you liking.
That is as polite as I am going to get because you seem to think that the people this game was designed for, who enjoy it for what it is are blind fanboys.

So please stop trying to “fix” our game with your suggestions on what you think makes a good game.

Gear progression is just one type of progression, it was the most obvious for WoW and players embraced it. Now it’s going to be so hard to find another type of progression that will ‘wean’ players away.

I’ve been talking about it in this thread, how to motivate players to play in other ways. At the end of the day you need to know what people want and then channel that want in a way that’s good for the game. I think MMO players have proven they will so very extream things to get what they want. Some guys I saw spending £300 to get a skin.. I also remember seeing players literally camping at their computer to get the Time Lost proto drake in WoW. Want in there, it doesn’t have to be progressive gear.

I think at the end of the day players want to be rewarded for their efforts and this mechanism is very underwhelming in Guild Wars 2. I fought tooth and nail last night, doing an event solo in the burning steps, it felt like a long time with many close calls before I finally stood victorious over the body of the final boss. My loot reward? A blue mace.

Did enjoy the fight, hell yes. Is that reward enough in itself? I’m not sure, I’m a big fan of getting rid of gear treadmills but I can’t help feeling like this epic fight (which must be replicated across the game world thousands of times in a day) ended on a bit of a low.

Honestly this game could do with some form of AA (alternative advancement) similar to what you have in WvW for example. It isn’t gear grind, it doesn’t make THAT much of a difference, but it gives people somethiung to work for.

AA was good in games like AoC and Rift. It can work here too.

Erasculio.2914:

Bazookajoe.5624:

Bla bla bla

Most of your issues come from the fact you want a WoW clone – a game in which the goal is to grind levels and then grind gear. The original intention behind Guild Wars 2 was to avoid exactly those things (see the link in my signature). So I can’t say I’m sad you are not happy with the game.

Yes, in the beginning it is not a gear grind. In the beginning it is not a level grind.
But that all change when Fractals appears. No matter how much you and others try to defend Fractals, it is still a grind. However, compared with WoW, we have a choice on if we want to grind or not. That is all.

Bazookajoe.5624:

1. ) Dungeons are boring, lack of “exciting” and “meaningful” loot.
2.) Bosses are tiny and often overshadowed by larger scale characters.
3.) Waaaaay too many 1 shot mechanics. Takes away from interesting gameplay.
4.) Zero personal progression and a severe lack of “Reward”.
5.) Once you hit the gear wall, and have all exotics……. thats it…. lame.
6.) No large scale organized PVE, dare I say raids…… Inc Flame.
7.) Sorry excuse for world bosses with zero exciting loot.
8.) skins are only sooo exciting for soooo long….. /sadface.

Seriously, I love the art, lore, gameplay, but is that really enough to make someone log in and stay logged in? Trying to re invent the wheel can only go so far. I would love to see this game get more than a hundred views on twitch, and more people logging in and playing. But having to use a website to find a group for PVE content was kinda the nail in the coffin for me. What are some of everyone’s thoughts on this? I mean let’s all take our “Fan-Boy” frame of mind out and be no partisan on this topic and get some good discussion going, and who knows maybe arena net will take notice.

sounds like most of the MMO’s out there, tbh, in fact all of them (according to the respective forums) have the same problem.

SirDrygan.1823:

Erasculio.2914:

Bazookajoe.5624:

Bla bla bla

Most of your issues come from the fact you want a WoW clone – a game in which the goal is to grind levels and then grind gear. The original intention behind Guild Wars 2 was to avoid exactly those things (see the link in my signature). So I can’t say I’m sad you are not happy with the game.

Yes, in the beginning it is not a gear grind. In the beginning it is not a level grind.
But that all change when Fractals appears. No matter how much you and others try to defend Fractals, it is still a grind. However, compared with WoW, we have a choice on if we want to grind or not. That is all.

Of course Fractals is a grind. It was designed to give people who want to grind something to do. It was always meant to be a grind. It was also meant to be optional.

This game has tried to give different players different ways to play. Grinding was pretty much missing from the original game, so they threw a bone to the grinders.

You can also do what I do and play the Fractals every now and again as your mood takes you. In which case, you’re not grinding them.

I think this game lacks of high-end content and challenging raids akka hardmode. The only stuff is high-lvl fractals, which requires skill and is a challenge indeed. On the other hand we have CoF p1. If we compare these two dungeons in terms of skill/effort and then in terms of rewards, I’m not sure if I should laugh or cry about that.
The skill-reward/loot-scale is definitely not in place. I can’t see any structure on loots.

Vayne.8563:

Honestly this game could do with some form of AA (alternative advancement) similar to what you have in WvW for example. It isn’t gear grind, it doesn’t make THAT much of a difference, but it gives people somethiung to work for.

AA was good in games like AoC and Rift. It can work here too.

I agree. While the WXP system of advancement in WvW isn’t perfect, I do think it shows a willingness on the part of the developers to look at alternative advancement. I don’t know whether something like this is being considered for PVE, but I’m hoping it is.

For PvE i would like to see some new hard and complex dungeons which some amazing rewards for their difficulty
And for amazing rewards I mean new skins and something that would make those dungeons the most worthwhile way to make golds (if played with skill)
Maybe 2 difficulty, an easy one for casuals, good for farming tokens but less favorable for golds and an kittene, good for farming golds and with some unique skins (for example armor skins could be awarded with easy and hard mode tokens, weapons skins only with hard mode tokens).

p.s.
Sorry for my bad english!