Path of Fire US and Eu price
Some will say that US prices doesn’t include VAT, while EU price has to.
But for me is that it’s easier for them, and that the will earn more money this way. Too bad they don’t equal pounds to euros to dollars.
I think the price in euros also include the European Union value added tax (VAT)
I strongly suspect ANet has lawyers on either staff or retainer who would advise them if their business practices could attract legal action.
As to why… I seem to remember that when I worked for a US-Based company that had international clients, those clients, largely governments, paid in dollars rather than their own currency so that the company did not have to pay a bank fee to convert the currency. If I, as a private citizen in the U.S., were to somehow get some euros, I would have to convert them to dollars to be able to spend the money in the U.S, and my bank would charge a fee for that.
I’m unsure what the current state of international finance is with regard to a U.S.-based company like ANet receiving foreign currency, but I would not be surprised if they were having to pay a fee. If that is the case, then they may be passing the cost on to the European consumer just as my favorite hole-in-the-wall restaurant passes on their financing costs by charging a fee for using a credit card.
Of course, the real reason may have nothing to do with my speculation, but I suspect that passing on costs of some sort is at least part of the reason.
Its pretty common for software-companies to use a 1:1 conversion and its perfectly legal as they are basically free to charge whatever they wanna charge in different countries.
It would be a little bit strange if companies were forced to use just the “normal” exchange-rates as different countries have different buying powers, taxes, living expenses, wages, etc.
When you buy something in Euros, they have to convert those Euros into Dollars before ArenaNet can use them. That conversion process not only costs money, but also delays the receipt of funds. Rather than trying to constantly hit a moving target in terms of conversion rate and exchange fees/interest, it’s easier to just set a static price and let the chips fall where they may in terms of net revenue.
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Well… VAT isn’t a good reason cause 29.99$=25.41€
VAT is 20% so without VAT (29.99€x80/100) the game would cost = 23.99€
As a european, I feel scammed by Anet here…
And i was only talking for the standard version.
Deluxe version : 54.99$=46.59€ 54.99€=64.90$ (like 10$(8€) more cause i’m european)
Ultimate version : 79.99$= 67.78€ 79.99€=94.40$ (like 14-15$(11€) more cause i’m european)
Conversion rates between currencies change daily and sometimes hourly, it all depends. Plus foreign transactions fees per country can be very high or very low also depending on various things including if each country has a good relationship with the other. If a country no longer views another country as allies then the money market parts may go haywire.
I assume the $1 = 1€ = £0.85 was fixed back in the day and may be determined by NCSOFT. That’s the ratio for gems prices since day one.
Checking the exchange rate on Google, $54.99 = 46.59€, 46.59€ + 20% VAT = 55.91€
So don’t see the issue. In the US, we are charged tax on top of the cost, UK and European taxes are baked in..
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
There is so much more than just money. They need a service provider who changes currency. That costs money. They need to offer global payment systems. That costs extra money (because they use american system anyway as their company is located there).
Currency is always risk. So you estimate a higher price. You have to add Tax to the US Price. And so on… Be happy about 1:1, there are companies who charge more € than $…
Well to be fair HoT did take the currency value difference into acc and you payed less euros then dollars, bottom line being same price for both. So i find OP post absolutely on the spot and logical.
Well… VAT isn’t a good reason cause 29.99$=25.41€
VAT is 20% so without VAT (29.99€x80/100) the game would cost = 23.99€
As a european, I feel scammed by Anet here…
And i was only talking for the standard version.
Deluxe version : 54.99$=46.59€ 54.99€=64.90$ (like 10$(8€) more cause i’m european)
Ultimate version : 79.99$= 67.78€ 79.99€=94.40$ (like 14-15$(11€) more cause i’m european)
You’re doing it the other way round though. $29.99 is the price without vat so the EU price without vat should be 25.41 now adding Vat to that depending on the country say 20% that would mean 25.41 / 100 × 120 = 30.5 euro. so if you’re in a country with 20% vat you’re actually betting a good price.
that being said some countries have lower VAT in my country VAT is 18% and price should be a microscopic amount lower then 29.9 (29.983)
if we do the same with the ultimate edition
$79.99 = 67.80 euro / 100 × 118 = 80 euro
so prices seem good to me
Well all European sales go through the UK office so it’s the UK 20% VAT that’s used.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
They are making a distinction between Europe and USA, creating different treatments between Europeans and Americans.
I can’t remember the proper word for it in English.
This is the best elementalist build: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh5zjK7ITpQ
I can’t remember for sure, but wasn’t HoT more expensive at launch than PoF is gonna be?
I can’t remember for sure, but wasn’t HoT more expensive at launch than PoF is gonna be?
Yep, HoT was $49.99 at launch, now $29.99, bundle with PoF, $19.99.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
They are making a distinction between Europe and USA, creating different treatments between Europeans and Americans.
I can’t remember the proper word for it in English.
Except they’re not. They have to include VAT when listing the EU/UK price, US price doesn’t include tax. Already showed there is virtually no difference between US price without tax and EU price with VAT.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
:/ Can I get it for 29.99 CND plz?
“I control time and space; you can’t break free.~”
“Maybe I was the illusion all along!”
“Maybe I was the illusion all along!”
Well… VAT isn’t a good reason cause 29.99$=25.41€
VAT is 20% so without VAT (29.99€x80/100) the game would cost = 23.99€
As a european, I feel scammed by Anet here…
Really? You feel “scammed”? According to your figures $29.99 is €25.41, right?
If they were to charge you in US dollars they would have to charge 20% VAT on that (which is EU law). 20% of €25.41 would be €5.08.
€25.41 + €5.08 = €30.49. So you’re actually getting a 50c discount.
Regardless, it’s a fairly standard business practice to pick a price point (that includes the relevant taxes) and to stick to it, to not change your products prices constantly just because of some currency exchange rate fluctuation.
Edit: ah, I see Galen Grey already said this, I missed the post somehow.
(edited by Pifil.5193)
Can someone pls close this topic as the Topicowner just misunderstood it and it is answered allready?
In a nutshell: European prices are slightly lower than the US prices when compared as US prices not including taxes while EU prices does so it is like 35$ US vs 30€ which is basically the prize to pay here. In fact the game itself is only 24,99 but because of the taxes you pay 29,99€ in total while the original price should be arround 25,51€ so we allready pay less than the actual ratio but we have to deal with the taxes. If arenanet wanted to let us pay the correct prize it would be not 29,99€ but 30,61€.
Well… VAT isn’t a good reason cause 29.99$=25.41€
VAT is 20% so without VAT (29.99€x80/100) the game would cost = 23.99€
As a european, I feel scammed by Anet here…
Really? You feel “scammed”? According to your figures $29.99 is €25.41, right?
If they were to charge you in US dollars they would have to charge 20% VAT on that (which is EU law). 20% of €25.41 would be €5.08.
€25.41 + €5.08 = €30.49. So you’re actually getting a 50c discount.
Regardless, it’s a fairly standard business practice to pick a price point (that includes the relevant taxes) and to stick to it, to not change your products prices constantly just because of some currency exchange rate fluctuation.
Edit: ah, I see Galen Grey already said this, I missed the post somehow.
What about the people in norway that have no vat but are forced to pay it anyway since it go through england?
People in Norway are free to bring their dire grievances to the united nations council, I’m sure they’ll drop everything they’re doing and get right on this earth shattering atrocity!
What about the people in norway that have no vat but are forced to pay it anyway since it go through england?
What about them? There’s no such thing as a “fair” price of, well, any product. There’s what the manufacturer charges, what the retailers charge after mark up, and what the consumer is willing to spend.
At any give point during the day, the value of currency A compared to B varies. At any given point, those who own currency A might not be willing to sell for currency B, unless the price is right and at some points, holders of A are ready to dump all they have for B.
In the end, it’s just easier for the retailer (in this case, DigitalRiver, who handles sales for ANet) to set a fixed price in a fixed number of currencies. And it’s simpler for them to pick a single number for all three currencies, even though sometimes dollars are worth more sterling, sometimes less; sometimes more euro, sometimes less.
If you think you can beat the arbitrage, then you can buy your own dollars & purchase the game via a US outlet (it unlocks accounts for EU just the same). Or you can pay the price in Euros/Sterling and chalk up the differences to convenience & other arbitrary service fees.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
Get it from Amazon.com or from some other physical retailer. It’ll probably work with your European GW2 account.
You’ll have to pay shipping though, and maybe import duties. Amazon.co.uk would probably work too and the GBP/NOK exchange rate may work out better for you. And with both countries being members of the EU/European Single Market you won’t have to pay any import duties from the UK.
Neither are currently stocking the game so you’ll have to wait until closer to release.
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
Why does that have to be a qualification? It’s up to you to find a way (and there are others besides using VPN), if you’re convinced that you’re overpaying by spending €30 when the price near ANet HQ is US$30.
DigitalRiver invests in the infrastructure that makes it possible for us to buy games in various countries and for ANet to be able to sell them and collect the funds. That’s not ‘free’ or without its own headaches.
The larger point remains that there’s no such thing as a “fair” conversion price. There’s just the price. If it’s more than you’re willing to spend, then don’t pay.
There are only a few industries which charge customers differently depending on their willingness to pay, notably airlines & tour companies (you can sit next to someone who paid triple what you paid for a nearly-identical flying experience). With games, there’s just the one price.
The alternative would be that the Euro price would change by the minute, depending on conversion rates. DigitalRiver would include an explicit fee for the transaction, to cover their overhead, including owning enough dollars (that they can use to pay ANet) or paying their bankers to convert them. It might work out that some days you’d pay a smaller number, but it might also work out that you’d pay a bigger number some days, too.
And it would create all sorts of annoying issues, as two players buying the game within the same hour might pay differing amounts. The person who pre-ordered might end up paying less than the person who buys 3 months after launch. It would be hard to know when the game was discounted and by how much.
So again, if you think it’s cheaper to buy in dollars, go ahead and do that. I realize that easier said than done, but it’s also easier said than done to sell the game at different prices depending on the vagaries of the currency markets.
It’s simply simpler to charge one number in a limited number of markets.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
:’c
Dear Arena Net, just let us pay for American product in American prices – in USD, what is so strange, then no one will feel ‘scammed’ or whatever.
@Edit: @Just a flesh wound, hmm maybe you are right, it’s a bit screwed up or hard to imagine for us, Europeans so if we could compare it during purchase it would be just fine.
Also it’s hard to find some info about how taxes works in USA, it looks like there are different laws in every state etv. I would not ask for usd prices if I could see it, so thank you for bringing the numbers
(edited by Rong.5470)
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
:’c
Dear Arena Net, just let us pay for American product in American prices – in USD, what is so strange, then no one will feel ‘scammed’ or whatever.
Will you then also pay US taxes that are added to the purchase and that don’t show up on the price listed?
My taxes for the Ultimate added an additional $6.60 to the total.
Edit: a major difference between the two is EU has the tax added to the listed purchase price and the US tax doesn’t show up until purchase.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
(edited by Just a flesh wound.3589)
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
:’c
Dear Arena Net, just let us pay for American product in American prices – in USD, what is so strange, then no one will feel ‘scammed’ or whatever.
Will you then also pay US taxes that are added to with purchase and that don’t show up on the price listed?
My taxes for the Ultimate added an additional $6.60 to the total.
So $36.59 in total then, that’d be €31.11 at current exchange rates, so it’s actually currently more expensive than the euro price.
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
:’c
Dear Arena Net, just let us pay for American product in American prices – in USD, what is so strange, then no one will feel ‘scammed’ or whatever.
Will you then also pay US taxes that are added to with purchase and that don’t show up on the price listed?
My taxes for the Ultimate added an additional $6.60 to the total.
So $36.59 in total then, that’d be €31.11 at current exchange rates, so it’s actually currently more expensive than the euro price.
I got the Ultimate, $79.99 plus $6.60 in taxes to make a total of $86.59.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
I also got a HoT alt account. The taxes for it was $2.02, making a total price of $32.01
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
Yes please point me to a way to buy with dollars without vpn and I will do it gladly.
:’c
Dear Arena Net, just let us pay for American product in American prices – in USD, what is so strange, then no one will feel ‘scammed’ or whatever.
Will you then also pay US taxes that are added to with purchase and that don’t show up on the price listed?
My taxes for the Ultimate added an additional $6.60 to the total.
So $36.59 in total then, that’d be €31.11 at current exchange rates, so it’s actually currently more expensive than the euro price.
I got the Ultimate, $79.99 plus $6.60 in taxes to make a total of $86.59.
Oh sorry, I misunderstood. Still $32.01 is €27.21 so it looks less and less like a reason for rioting to me.
(edited by Pifil.5193)
Sucks to be you just a flesh wound but.
Still people saying well you have a higher price becouse of Vat when not all countries have vat.
You pay what your state say why cant I pay what my country say?
Edit
If I buy from steam I dont have to pay vat, if I buy from ebay my credit card take out a fee to convert to pounds or dollars or yen.
So why do anet have to have digital river doing it when my bank is already doing it?
A web search shows that VAT (sales tax) in Norway is 25%, so you’re doing pretty well out of those other methods. Edit: although I would bet that Steam’s prices include applicable taxes.
ArenaNet are using digital river in order to be tax compliant in the countries they operate in. At least they won’t get sued by the EU (and others) that way. I presume they use euro for everyone in Europe outside the UK. Sucks a bit but is easier and more predictable that way.
(edited by Pifil.5193)
Honestly, those unhappy with the price-point differences between the USA & EU are failing to understand or accept the long-existing institutions of currency exchanges and currency valuation differences; and how the global economy works. The Pound is worth more than the Euro (generally), the Euro is worth more than the US Dollar (generally), and the US Dollar is worth more than the Canadian Dollar (generally), et al. Right now, as I write this, $1 US is $0.85 Euro; so the $29.99 US price is $25.50 Euro; or the $29.99 Euro price is $35.27 US. For Canadians, $29.99 US is $38.37 Canadian. Canadians often do buy using US Dollars, and thus they have to pay currency conversion and exchange fees – however they still pay $38.37 Canadian for a $29.99 US item (unless of course they have US currency available to them) – where does the difference in price go? The Governments sometimes take conversion taxes and the banks always charge conversion fees; and sometimes brokers and other institutions may take a portion depending on how your local commercial and banking system is.
So while you, the non-US Consumer may seem to be paying more than $29.99 US – ArenaNet only receives $29.99 US from your purchase. It is your banks, payment processors, credit card companies, et al. that are keeping the price differences as fees and taxes. ArenaNet is not cheating you – your institutions and Governments are.
The price differences have little to do with VAT and US Sales Taxes; except that US & Canadian consumers often pay more than a listed prices after-the-fact. In the US/Canadian systems, it is the consumer that pays a tax to purchase something. In the European system, the VAT – erroneously described as “baked in to the cost of an item” -tax is actually paid by the Retailer or Seller; a portion of the profits or value of the item is paid as tax. European Sellers pay tax on value/profit – American/Canadian Consumers pay tax on purchase/ownership. Taxation affects American & Canadian consumers more greatly than European.
If Europeans were to be subjected to American Taxation systems, you might firstly be subjected to import/export Tariffs from Governments on all sides. You likely would NOT pay actual US or Canadian Sales Taxes; only Tariffs. If you were to pay US Sales Taxes – to over-simplify – some States require their local Taxation rates to be paid for online purchases and others require Taxation rates to be based upon the rates for where the retailer is physically located. So (as an example for where I live) you could either pay a 9.6% Sales Tax or you may pay whatever the Taxation rate is for where ArenaNet or DigitalRiver is physically located. I personally have to pay my local Sales Tax, and thus the basic expansion was $32.82 for me – about a 9.6% Sales Tax – one of the highest Taxation Rates in the USA.
Perhaps being provided the option to pay in US Dollars would provide the European consumer more transparency in the financial process. You yourself would be paying and seeing the currency exchange fees versus the current system where (is DigitalRiver the payment processor for European customers?) ArenaNet is paying the currency exchange fees. This might also give European consumers the power to shop-around for Banks and Credit Institutions that provide more favorable currency conversion rates and fees. However, though, this is not ArenaNet cheating you or duping you.
And yes, it is legal for a producer, retailer, seller, et al. to determine the valuation of their produce and to charge for that. If you as a consumer think that something is too expensive – it is your right to boycott or refuse patronage and purchase of said “over-priced” produce.
Just because the Euro is worth more than the Dollar does not mean an American good is worth less.
Just be glad you’re not trying to buy the game with Rubles or Pesos. Honestly.
Sucks to be you just a flesh wound but.
Still people saying well you have a higher price becouse of Vat when not all countries have vat.You pay what your state say why cant I pay what my country say?
Edit
If I buy from steam I dont have to pay vat, if I buy from ebay my credit card take out a fee to convert to pounds or dollars or yen.So why do anet have to have digital river doing it when my bank is already doing it?
Maybe not now you don’t pay taxes on Steam, but I wouldn’t bet that governments will continue with this. For example, UK closing tax loophole on Steam game downloads
Edit:
Sucks to be you just a flesh wound
Errrr, we both are paying taxes. You with VAT and me with state/local. So… that comment applies to you also. EU prices look so much higher because the taxes are added up front to the total price. US prices are before taxes, and so look lower. The taxes don’t show up until purchase.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
(edited by Just a flesh wound.3589)
A web search shows that VAT (sales tax) in Norway is 25%, so you’re doing pretty well out of those other methods. Edit: although I would bet that Steam’s prices include applicable taxes.
ArenaNet are using digital river in order to be tax compliant in the countries they operate in. At least they won’t get sued by the EU (and others) that way. I presume they use euro for everyone in Europe outside the UK. Sucks a bit but is easier and more predictable that way.
You sir/mam are correct I actualy started paying vat tax 2017 havent noticed it.