Guild Wars 2

if I want to get WvW 100% I will log on a toon that has not got 100% yet (I have 2 that has 100% world maps)
I will then tag up and say “i are commander 100% map, come with me if u want to explore”. I get a lot of ppl following me and we take out the towers / camps they need for PoI.

a nice little motto that will help u a lot later on in mmos

" I DONT GIVE A kitten !!!" simple and very effective in getting your own way in game.

Olvendred.3027:

Sorry. It turns out that adopting a patronising tone does not make you correct.

lol look who’s talking

So when is the weekly reset when the maps change, if at all?

Most people don’t care as long as you do the right things and wear the right gear. It is the same if a wvw player wants to do dungeons (cough zerker cough) But shouting out in map chat “kitten COMANDER JUST TAKE VELOKA ALREADY” or something similar is going to get you abuse. If you ask them politely I am sure they will appease you as soon as they can.

Dave.2536:

JustTrogdor.7892:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

Other than that I see no problem with people doing map completion, have fun!

Players doing map completion in WvW, even during queues, have just as much right to be there as anyone else since it is indeed required for map completion. If you don’t like that perhaps you should lobby for removal of WvW from the map completion requirement.

You have the right to do map completion in WvW. You do not have a right to be shielded from being (correctly) told that you are a liability for the server.

You really shouldn’t blame the people for playing the game as intended. Those players have as much right to be there as anyone else.

If you dislike that, you should be asking Anet to rmove WvW maps from the world completion. Funny thing is, wheneve such proposition gets raised on these forums, it’s the WvW players that are quite insistent that the WvW map completion should stay.

I’m all in favor of removing WvW from world completion. It never made that much sense to me in the first place because the vast majority of world-completion objectives are in PvE; it always seemed to me like a cheap attempt to get players to do WvW. I’ve tried WvW several times a couple of years ago and found I didn’t like it very much (and I just don’t do PvP), so I resent it that I have to do something that I’m not very interested in doing if I want map completion, one of the sine qua nons for crafting a legendary weapon.

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

No. This is anet’s own fault for making WvW part of world completion. As a PvE player, do you think I liked going to that toxic cesspit?

Indeed. I still need to wait for Devona’s Rest to go blue so I can get some POIs and Vistas in keeps / towers.

It is also Anet’s fault for making PvE part of world completion. Why would I need to explore an ENTIRE PVE WORLD that I am NOT interested of to get 100%. Anet should get rid of world completion in PvE and just leave it in WvW. I would be happy, and so will EVERYONE. I can ASSURE you.

Once when i was leading a guy whispered me that he needed a POI in some enemie tower, i asnwered “10 gold”. It was some paper or t1-2 tower so i went for it just to keep it flipped and when i did opened it, i got a mail with 10 gold from that guy =)

For all the guys that doing map completition in wvw and braging about it – i will go to your fractal 50 last boss with friend and kick you all from dungeuon.

Need completition – go for it, but it’s open pvp zone and be ready to get pvp’d in chat and ingame by other players =)))

or better go cry to remove that completition from wvw, cause y i agree it’s kinda annoying sometimes for both sides of conflict.

nGumball.1283:

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

No. This is anet’s own fault for making WvW part of world completion. As a PvE player, do you think I liked going to that toxic cesspit?

Indeed. I still need to wait for Devona’s Rest to go blue so I can get some POIs and Vistas in keeps / towers.

It is also Anet’s fault for making PvE part of world completion. Why would I need to explore an ENTIRE PVE WORLD that I am NOT interested of to get 100%. Anet should get rid of world completion in PvE and just leave it in WvW. I would be happy, and so will EVERYONE. I can ASSURE you.

I knew this argument was going to come up at some point so I prepared for that:

It’s not the same. And here is why: When a WvW player goes to the pve world for map completion, he doesn’t become a liability for the entire server and there are no qeue’s for pve maps either. So it’s comparing sticks with stones.

Astralporing.1957:

Dave.2536:

JustTrogdor.7892:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

Other than that I see no problem with people doing map completion, have fun!

Players doing map completion in WvW, even during queues, have just as much right to be there as anyone else since it is indeed required for map completion. If you don’t like that perhaps you should lobby for removal of WvW from the map completion requirement.

You have the right to do map completion in WvW. You do not have a right to be shielded from being (correctly) told that you are a liability for the server.

You really shouldn’t blame the people for playing the game as intended. Those players have as much right to be there as anyone else.

If you dislike that, you should be asking Anet to rmove WvW maps from the world completion. Funny thing is, wheneve such proposition gets raised on these forums, it’s the WvW players that are quite insistent that the WvW map completion should stay.

That last point I agree on, as I stated earlier. It does seem hypocritical that WvW players argue so fervently for the retention of WvW map completion, then get outraged when PvE players come to WvW maps to get the vistas and PoI’s they need.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

nGumball.1283:

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

No. This is anet’s own fault for making WvW part of world completion. As a PvE player, do you think I liked going to that toxic cesspit?

Indeed. I still need to wait for Devona’s Rest to go blue so I can get some POIs and Vistas in keeps / towers.

It is also Anet’s fault for making PvE part of world completion. Why would I need to explore an ENTIRE PVE WORLD that I am NOT interested of to get 100%. Anet should get rid of world completion in PvE and just leave it in WvW. I would be happy, and so will EVERYONE. I can ASSURE you.

I knew this argument was going to come up at some point so I prepared for that:

It’s not the same. And here is why: When a WvW player goes to the pve world for map completion, he doesn’t become a liability for the entire server and there are no qeue’s for pve maps either. So it’s comparing sticks with stones.

Then remove WvW areas from map completion requirements. Problem solved.

joe.7684:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

nGumball.1283:

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

No. This is anet’s own fault for making WvW part of world completion. As a PvE player, do you think I liked going to that toxic cesspit?

Indeed. I still need to wait for Devona’s Rest to go blue so I can get some POIs and Vistas in keeps / towers.

It is also Anet’s fault for making PvE part of world completion. Why would I need to explore an ENTIRE PVE WORLD that I am NOT interested of to get 100%. Anet should get rid of world completion in PvE and just leave it in WvW. I would be happy, and so will EVERYONE. I can ASSURE you.

I knew this argument was going to come up at some point so I prepared for that:

It’s not the same. And here is why: When a WvW player goes to the pve world for map completion, he doesn’t become a liability for the entire server and there are no qeue’s for pve maps either. So it’s comparing sticks with stones.

Then remove WvW areas from map completion requirements. Problem solved.

That’s what I’ve been asking for since release! But everytime I ask that, we get that stupid “WvW players have to go to pve, so remove pve from map completion plox” argument.

Koviko.3248:

Olvendred.3027:

Sorry. It turns out that adopting a patronising tone does not make you correct.

lol look who’s talking

Yes. The correct one.

joe.7684:

Then remove WvW areas from map completion requirements. Problem solved.

Or how about adjust the queue system to prioritize by rank. Rank 500+, you automatically bump to top of queue. Rank 1 guy looking to just map complete WvW, well they will have to wait behind people that clearly are interested in doing WvW competitively.

I honestly feel that the higher ranked players should start getting some added benefit for their time spent in WvW. Having queue priority would be a nice perk and it would reduce the number of PvEers in the map. You couldn’t eliminate it entirely as once someone joined, they couldn’t be kicked out, but at least you know that if you are a true WvWer that when you queue you will bypass all of the PvEers working on map complete.

Then of course there is the “passive mode” option (got the idea from GTA5 Online). You flag yourself as “passive”, you become semi-transparent, cannot capture any points, cannot attack players, cannot be attacked, cannot use chat functions, but you can collect POIs, skill points, and vistas. If your side doesn’t have a tower, you will still have to wait until it is flipped. This mode would not count toward the population total of each server.

Draknar.5748:

joe.7684:

Then remove WvW areas from map completion requirements. Problem solved.

Or how about adjust the queue system to prioritize by rank. Rank 500+, you automatically bump to top of queue. Rank 1 guy looking to just map complete WvW, well they will have to wait behind people that clearly are interested in doing WvW competitively.

I honestly feel that the higher ranked players should start getting some added benefit for their time spent in WvW. Having queue priority would be a nice perk and it would reduce the number of PvEers in the map. You couldn’t eliminate it entirely as once someone joined, they couldn’t be kicked out, but at least you know that if you are a true WvWer that when you queue you will bypass all of the PvEers working on map complete.

Then of course there is the “passive mode” option (got the idea from GTA5 Online). You flag yourself as “passive”, you become semi-transparent, cannot capture any points, cannot attack players, cannot be attacked, cannot use chat functions, but you can collect POIs, skill points, and vistas. If your side doesn’t have a tower, you will still have to wait until it is flipped. This mode would not count toward the population total of each server.

So a dude that grinds himself 10k ranks in eotm should have the priority on a queue over those that actually play the real wvw. No thanks. Wvw completion can be a drag but if you are patient or social enough to ask for some help it is no biggy at all. As i said in my first reply, idm to help those ppl out.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

joe.7684:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

nGumball.1283:

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

root.9415:

If you are doing map completion in wvw while the maps have queues, you will rightfully be told to GTFO.

No. This is anet’s own fault for making WvW part of world completion. As a PvE player, do you think I liked going to that toxic cesspit?

Indeed. I still need to wait for Devona’s Rest to go blue so I can get some POIs and Vistas in keeps / towers.

It is also Anet’s fault for making PvE part of world completion. Why would I need to explore an ENTIRE PVE WORLD that I am NOT interested of to get 100%. Anet should get rid of world completion in PvE and just leave it in WvW. I would be happy, and so will EVERYONE. I can ASSURE you.

I knew this argument was going to come up at some point so I prepared for that:

It’s not the same. And here is why: When a WvW player goes to the pve world for map completion, he doesn’t become a liability for the entire server and there are no qeue’s for pve maps either. So it’s comparing sticks with stones.

Then remove WvW areas from map completion requirements. Problem solved.

That’s what I’ve been asking for since release! But everytime I ask that, we get that stupid “WvW players have to go to pve, so remove pve from map completion plox” argument.

It is not stupid. In the first place, you have no right to insult my opinion just because it doesn’t fit yours.

I dislike PvE. I only play WvW. I want 100% completion. Either you give me that for free or you get traited the same way as I do. Which is, playing a game-mode that you don’t enjoy, putting the effort eitherway, to get that 100% map completion.

There is ALOT of negative things that I have to live with to finish my map completion in PvE.

nGumball.1283:

I dislike PvE. I only play WvW. I want 100% completion. Either you give me that for free or you get traited the same way as I do. Which is, playing a game-mode that you don’t enjoy, putting the effort eitherway, to get that 100% map completion.

There is ALOT of negative things that I have to live with to finish my map completion in PvE.

It’s still not the same. A WvW player going to PvE doesn’t cause problems for the server and players waiting in the qeue.

This is not just about a player not wanting to do certain content, this is about a player unintentionally causing problems for others because of a design flaw. Which isn’t the case when a WvW player goes to PvE.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

It’s still not the same. A WvW player going to PvE doesn’t cause problems for the server and players waiting in the qeue.

This is not just about a player not wanting to do certain content, this is about a player unintentionally causing problems for others because of a design flaw.

I think WvW players are more annoyed about the entitlement and whining of some map completionists than they are about losing 1-2 spots to the queue.

And let’s be honest. Most PvErs complaining about WvW map completion are not doing so because they are clogging up the queue by 1 slot. They are whining because they have to do something they don’t enjoy to get closer to a shiny item.

WvWers asking for PvE open world completion to be removed are doing the same thing in asking to remove something they don’t enjoy that gets in the way of their own shiny item.

Map completion gives 2 Gifts of Exploration anyways. Why not just make it one for open world exploration and one for WvW exploration? While WvW is indeed much smaller than the open world, it presents a different challenge in the way of exploration.

Dave.2536:

Map completion gives 2 Gifts of Exploration anyways. Why not just make it one for open world exploration and one for WvW exploration? While WvW is indeed much smaller than the open world, it presents a different challenge in the way of exploration.

That seems like a great compromise.

^Then almost nobody would bother getting 100% map completion in pve to make a legendary weapon because it would take 10 times longer than wvw to complete. We’re talking about 4 maps vs 30+ maps.

Even though you can’t access everything right away in wvw, if you’re patient and/or follow a good commander around you can usually get inside every towers and keeps pretty fast. On my second 100% map completion I completed all 4 wvw map within 4 hours (granted my server was doing amazing and we had control over most of the maps).

Vincent.7452:

^Then almost nobody would bother getting 100% map completion in pve to make a legendary weapon because it would take 10 times longer than wvw to complete. We’re talking about 4 maps vs 30+ maps.

Only if you want 1 legendary and not more.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

It’s still not the same. A WvW player going to PvE doesn’t cause problems for the server and players waiting in the qeue.

This is not just about a player not wanting to do certain content, this is about a player unintentionally causing problems for others because of a design flaw. Which isn’t the case when a WvW player goes to PvE.

“Hey, there Teq is about to start in 4 mins, can everybody who’s doing map completion leave the map so my friends can join?”

Really happenend. And I guess it happens more often than that one time.

Jana.6831:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

It’s still not the same. A WvW player going to PvE doesn’t cause problems for the server and players waiting in the qeue.

This is not just about a player not wanting to do certain content, this is about a player unintentionally causing problems for others because of a design flaw. Which isn’t the case when a WvW player goes to PvE.

“Hey, there Teq is about to start in 4 mins, can everybody who’s doing map completion leave the map so my friends can join?”

Really happenend. And I guess it happens more often than that one time.

That’s why PvE has overflows. If the teq map is full: Leave map, enter again, problem solved.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Vincent.7452:

^Then almost nobody would bother getting 100% map completion in pve to make a legendary weapon because it would take 10 times longer than wvw to complete. We’re talking about 4 maps vs 30+ maps.

Only if you want 1 legendary and not more.

For any amount of legendaries actually. You could just make a new character and do your wvw maps again.

Iyeru.5240:

So when is the weekly reset when the maps change, if at all?

“Friday” depending on timezone. There is also a couple hours difference between EU and NA.

http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups has a countdown. The live maps are also useful if you are only interested in doing map completion …

Vincent.7452:

^Then almost nobody would bother getting 100% map completion in pve to make a legendary weapon because it would take 10 times longer than wvw to complete. We’re talking about 4 maps vs 30+ maps.

Even though you can’t access everything right away in wvw, if you’re patient and/or follow a good commander around you can usually get inside every towers and keeps pretty fast. On my second 100% map completion I completed all 4 wvw map within 4 hours (granted my server was doing amazing and we had control over most of the maps).

So WvW completion can’t be rewarding because you did it quickly? And PvE completion can’t be deemphasized because it was long for you? Nice egocentric logic here. I don’t see anything in your argument that amounts to more than a bitter desire to make everyone go through the same masochistic experience you had.

Consider that you’re asking for qualities (patience, persistence) in WvW that many of the PvErs in this thread do not have when it comes to PvP content and you’ll see why they would be okay with this sort of split. Very many here would much rather go through 60+ PvE maps (2 figts in the hypothetical system) over even 1 WvW map.

I have to agree with Dave here. I would rather play through all the maps in pve than do WvW, not because wvw is bad but simply because it isn’t my thing. PvE is.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

That’s why PvE has overflows. If the teq map is full: Leave map, enter again, problem solved.

Yeah sure, to get on a map without commanders and without people that is about to fail.
It wasn’t me who wanted people to leave btw., for some reason I never demand anything. That was just to show that PvE players see problems with their maps as well.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

I have to agree with Dave here.

I am Iyeru, and I am not making an I approve of this message joke.

You could even maintain that the “tryhard star” still requires completion of both WvW and PvE so there’s still some reason/incentive to do both.

Jana.6831:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

That’s why PvE has overflows. If the teq map is full: Leave map, enter again, problem solved.

Yeah sure, to get on a map without commanders and without people that is about to fail.

If you are a WvW player who is only there for map completion anyway then what does it matter if that particular map is failing at teq? You are not there for Teq anyway.

Iyeru.5240:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

I have to agree with Dave here.

I am Iyeru, and I am not making an I approve of this message joke.

heh?

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Jana.6831:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

That’s why PvE has overflows. If the teq map is full: Leave map, enter again, problem solved.

Yeah sure, to get on a map without commanders and without people that is about to fail.

If you are a WvW player who is only there for map completion anyway then what does it matter if that particular map is failing at teq? You are not there for Teq anyway.

Guess you don’t get my point.. whatever.

Jana.6831:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Jana.6831:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

That’s why PvE has overflows. If the teq map is full: Leave map, enter again, problem solved.

Yeah sure, to get on a map without commanders and without people that is about to fail.

If you are a WvW player who is only there for map completion anyway then what does it matter if that particular map is failing at teq? You are not there for Teq anyway.

Guess you don’t get my point.. whatever.

I guess I don’t then.

Dave.2536:

So WvW completion can’t be rewarding because you did it quickly? And PvE completion can’t be deemphasized because it was long for you? Nice egocentric logic here. I don’t see anything in your argument that amounts to more than a bitter desire to make everyone go through the same masochistic experience you had.

Consider that you’re asking for qualities (patience, persistence) in WvW that many of the PvErs in this thread do not have when it comes to PvP content and you’ll see why they would be okay with this sort of split. Very many here would much rather go through 60+ PvE maps (2 figts in the hypothetical system) over even 1 WvW map.

This is no egocentric logic, while I did finish the wvw map, I still need to complete the entire pve map on my second character to get my new set of legendaries and I would greatly benefit from this myself. However as a pve player who doesn’t care much for wvw, I can safely say that while it is annoying to have to complete the whole wvw map, it isn’t really that hard and doesn’t even come close to being as long as completing the entire pve map.

This isn’t being selfish, this is telling you that this system would be flawed. If you put 2 different systems in place that gives the same reward while one of them is 1/10 as long, there’s obviously something flawed there. World completion is one of the very few requirements that still takes some time and efforts to build a legendary and doesn’t need to be dumbed down to be 10 times easier.

I agree with OP, they should have known that mixing WvW with PVE would cause a toxic environment. The same thing happened in GW1 when PVE and PVP was tied into each other at the beginning, and ppl would argue about it all the time. I don’t understand Anet sometimes, they learned nothing from their mistakes.

Vincent.7452:

This isn’t being selfish, this is telling you that this system would be flawed. If you put 2 different systems in place that gives the same reward while one of them is 1/10 as long, there’s obviously something flawed there. World completion is one of the very few requirements that still takes some time and efforts to build a legendary and doesn’t need to be dumbed down to be 10 times easier.

Yes it is. You cherrypicked the very best time for your server just to be able to get a time that was 1/10 as long.

I challenge you and two others from the other two servers in your WvW matchup to all finish a WvW completion by the end of your current matchup (roughly the amount of time it would take to do the PvE parts).

For most people, on most servers, on most times, it wouldn’t even be 1x easier, much less 10. Do I really need to add some “potential vs reality” meme/joke to make it stick?

Regards,
A player with 4 legendary weapons and 4 more Gifts of Exploration

PS: how would you feel about a PvP rank 30-40 requirement to buy Icy Runestones? PvP is very clearly absent in the legendary weapon acquisition, and I take it you would be one of the first to jump on board as you feel it is “too easy”?

Dave.2536:

Yes it is. You cherrypicked the very best time for your server just to be able to get a time that was 1/10 as long.

And? Everyone is free to do the same thing. Your server isn’t doing great? Complete whatever you can and try again later when it’s doing better or follow a zerg around and wait until you capture whatever you’re missing.

Dave.2536:

I challenge you and two others from the other two servers in your WvW matchup to all finish a WvW completion by the end of your current matchup (roughly the amount of time it would take to do the PvE parts).

That’s not a challenge I can take, I don’t control whoever is on these other servers. These people are free to wait for a different time to get their wvw maps and pick a time that’s more convenient for them. I can guarantee you that every single tower and keep as been flipped times and again during that week (just like every week) and they had opportunities to complete their maps.

I can also tell you that on my first character when I got 100% wvw maps completion my server wasn’t doing great at any given time (we were losing the whole time) and it still wasn’t hard or long. We were losing and I probably spent less than 10 hours total in wvw to complete it.

Dave.2536:

PS: how would you feel about a PvP rank 30-40 requirement to buy Icy Runestones? PvP is very clearly absent in the legendary weapon acquisition, and I take it you would be one of the first to jump on board as you feel it is “too easy”?

If it was part of the requirements and I wanted a legendary? Sure enough I’d jump on board and do it just like I did with the wvw maps. Would I like it? Probably not, just like I don’t like doing wvw maps.

I think you’re missing my point though. Pve map completion is many times longer than wvw map completion any way you look at it and having the 2 give the same reward wouldn’t be fair. That right there is a broken system as far as I’m concerned.

Pve map completion is many times longer than wvw map completion any way you look at it

No. It’s only many times longer when you decide the impact of enemy players is 0. Your inability to see/acknowledge this fact is why you’re being called egocentric.

It is very simple.

IF you aim for map completion you have to go on WvW maps.

I am actually planning to get world completion on my soon-to-be druid. ANet tells me to run around on those maps till I got all shinies. I do NOT care what other players want while I am on my way to achieve my goal.

I really don’t care. Do I ruin anyones fun? Maybe. But don’t hate the player, hate the game.

Now if I am in the mood for trolling, I will let everyone on the map know what I am doing, especially when I was waiting in queue forever to get there.

Working as intended.

Dave.2536:

Pve map completion is many times longer than wvw map completion any way you look at it

No. It’s only many times longer when you decide the impact of enemy players is 0. Your inability to see/acknowledge this fact is why you’re being called egocentric.

I am in no way being egocentric. Never anywhere did I say there was no enemy impact (I even aknowledge that it’s annoying to do), I said that it will not take nearly as long as doing your full pve map and any way you look at it, this is a fact unless you’re doing something awfully wrong.

I still haen’t done my ‘been there’ because the wvw maps are such a kitten. It’s not even the players, its just the maps are awful and annoying and either empty or sudden inescapable death (and thus totally boring if you’re not there for wvw)

root.9415:

Telling them to GTFO has a much better chance of success.

And telling them to GTFO will also drive away a another potential WvW ally. Glad my server people actually heled me with map complete and got me to enjoy the experience enough that I became an avid WvW player instead of just another annoyed and dumped on player by some “elite” few.

Let me guess, you’re also the type to jump servers just to try to be on a winning team?

Vincent.7452:

Dave.2536:

Pve map completion is many times longer than wvw map completion any way you look at it

No. It’s only many times longer when you decide the impact of enemy players is 0. Your inability to see/acknowledge this fact is why you’re being called egocentric.

I am in no way being egocentric. Never anywhere did I say there was no enemy impact (I even aknowledge that it’s annoying to do), I said that it will not take nearly as long as doing your full pve map and any way you look at it, this is a fact unless you’re doing something awfully wrong.

So…are you talking (1) total time spent on the map or (2) total number of hours or days passed between beginning and end?

While (1) may indeed be shorter, even significantly, (2) is nowhere near as trivial. Your refusal/failure/deception when it comes to differentiating (even identifying/acknowledging) the two cases is why you’ve been called and will continue to be called egocentric. The only alternative would be that you were simply that dense or close-minded.

toxic thread is toxic. please close this thread before it sets the whole forum server on fire.

Dave.2536:

Olvendred.3027:

Except that there are multiple scenarios discussed in this thread. And even if there weren’t, it wouldn’t detract from the essence of what I said.

Sorry. It turns out that adopting a patronising tone does not make you correct.

• gets called out
• doubles down without support
• randomly asserts that his bet is 100% safe
• accuses others of the same tone he came to this thread with

Why do I feel like I’m talking to Ken Ham right now? The irony in this one is so strong it’s almost biblical.

You “called me out” on the nit-picking basis there was only one scenario considered in this thread, whereas I had said “different scenarios” (plural). A cursory glance at the first page will show posts talking about: PvE, WvW without queue, WvW with queue and OP not being provocative, and WvW with queue and OP being provocative.

Speaking of irony… you did the exact same thing you accuse me of, except worse, and being incorrect all the while.

And still haven’t managed to address the point I made in my first post, that you are arguing passionately over scenarios you have concocted yourselves, based on unsupported assumptions of the OP’s post.

But I’m sorry I made you feel so insecure about it.

Since it’s abundantly clear ANet won’t detach WvW from map completion, maybe they could ruminate a bit on the idea of providing a PvE/non-PvP version of those maps selectable at entry. The maps already exist, so just turn off the WvW/PvP mechanics and systems and let people explore and do the PvE-style content that already exists the way they would in the open world areas, and be done with it. This eliminates the problems I see upthread for both sides. Well, other than the issue with WvW/PvP specialists not wanting to do any PvE-only content.

The problem even with this seemingly simple suggestion is that the reason for not detaching WvW from map completion remains: ANet feels it necessary to functionally force players to “experience” WvW whether they like it or not, since this whole legendary thing is kinda the cherry everyone’s expected to chase. I personally dislike that methodology. Encouragement to try out game types you’re not interested in is one thing, requirement is another.

Olvendred.3027:

Dave.2536:

Olvendred.3027:

Except that there are multiple scenarios discussed in this thread. And even if there weren’t, it wouldn’t detract from the essence of what I said.

Sorry. It turns out that adopting a patronising tone does not make you correct.

• gets called out
• doubles down without support
• randomly asserts that his bet is 100% safe
• accuses others of the same tone he came to this thread with

Why do I feel like I’m talking to Ken Ham right now? The irony in this one is so strong it’s almost biblical.

You “called me out” on the nit-picking basis there was only one scenario considered in this thread, whereas I had said “different scenarios” (plural). A cursory glance at the first page will show posts talking about: PvE, WvW without queue, WvW with queue and OP not being provocative, and WvW with queue and OP being provocative.

Speaking of irony… you did the exact same thing you accuse me of, except worse, and being incorrect all the while.

And still haven’t managed to address the point I made in my first post, that you are arguing passionately over scenarios you have concocted yourselves, based on unsupported assumptions of the OP’s post.

But I’m sorry I made you feel so insecure about it.

First of all what’s wrong about talking about a more generalized case? People won’t be able to relate perfectly with OP especially given the incoherence of his one and only post.

Yes, the thread adapted and you didn’t. Get over yourself. I sort of ignored that bit of your first post because I didn’t think you’d be dense enough to actually be so serious about it.

You then point out “scenarios” which are basically fragments that aren’t even mutually exclusive, and a few made up ones which exist only in your head and outside this thread.

Trying to refute people by stating and asserting things either without support or so vaguely that they may not technically be wrong…keep it up Ken. Tell me more about Noah’s Ark and tax evasion too.

Dave.2536:

First of all what’s wrong about talking about a more generalized case? People won’t be able to relate perfectly with OP especially given the incoherence of his one and only post. I sort of ignored that bit of your first post because I didn’t think you’d be dense enough to actually be so serious about it.

So, to get this straight: you ignored what my post was actually about… in favour of nitpicking whether something was plural or not.

And now you admit that I was in fact correct: that the OP’s only post is vague and incoherent, and lacking in content, and that most of the robust discussion in this thread is based on assumptions and concocted scenario(s).

One wonders why you bothered to reply at all (and so insultingly!), since we are apparently in agreement. I didn’t say there was anything wrong with it, as it happens, I merely made an observation. It was you who took offence and attacked me about it.

You then point out “scenarios” which are basically fragments that aren’t even mutually exclusive, and a few made up ones which exist only in your head and outside this thread.

The list I mentioned in my last post are all mutually exclusive. Quite obviously. Though I will be happy to explain that to you in an excruciating level of detail, if you ask nicely You do seem very keen on having the last word about this nitpicking business, though.

Trying to refute people by stating and asserting things either without support or so vaguely that they may not technically be wrong…keep it up Ken. Tell me more about Noah’s Ark and tax evasion too.

I haven’t noticed any support for anything you have said in your replies to me. None at all. If you do refute this one… please include support for that too.

And again, calling someone names and making insulting allusions doesn’t make you correct.

You came at this thread with a condescending tone (then ironically accusing me of the same) that extends beyond this thread, and I certainly don’t recall being the instigator for nitpicking, which you have once again proven to have done here.

Yes, while you were technically not wrong in your claim that the thread had deviated from OP, what good have you attained with your technical correctness?

Our disagreement seems to be on your implicit assertion that such deviation was neither productive nor on topic. I argue that OP’s vagueness meant that he never “owned” the “topic” to begin with, and challenge you to actually follow through with some substance to what you imply in your first post. At best you can claim that OP started a meaningless thread that deserves to be closed.

As far as the name calling, I will fight fire with fire. Don’t deal what you can’t take. You have zero moral high ground here.

extra post for new page bug