Guild Wars 2

What of players that never or barely use the Mystic Forge? What do they get, instead of piles and piles of materials they’ll never use?

Maybe an option to buy other items that they actually want and will use? We should have options – this seems very restrictive.

Exactly what do you use them for if not the mystic forge?

Try to use it. SP is pretty much gold.

And many times when SP dont’ seem profitable, it can serve to “save money”.

For example, you have tier 5 blood but want tier 6 blood. Instead of selling the tier 5 blood and loss out on tax. Promote it to tier 6. And you end up getting the tier 6 blood much cheaper.

Ayrilana.1396:

Exactly what do you use them for if not the mystic forge?

Well, currently you use them for skills of course. But this will change – they will be worthless and you’ll be given piles of mats for the forge. Which some players will never use, or have no interest in. What do they do? Personally I think you should be given options to get other things.

Why do you not use the forge? I wasn’t aware people purposely avoided it till recently.

I try to avoid the forge as much as possible. It makes no sense to me and I have having to look up recipes for everything.

In addition to that it is nothing more than a knock off Horadric Cube, with a terrible RNG attached.

Touched it once and never again. Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me.

What exactly is the MF forge item they’re changing SP to?

I can’t think of anything I regularly do that needs the forge. Its pretty useless to me outside of dailies.

After you gain all the skills in the game, the ONLY use for skill points is for mystic forge materials.

In effect Anet is saying, you will not lose your old skill points – they will be directly converted to mystic forge material. By converting extra skill points the players lose nothing, as extra skills points were only used for mystic forge materials anyway.

There is no reason to gain something other than mystic forge materials, because that’s effectively all they were before. The real question is: Will these take up bank space or not (if so, then we are losing space, but nothing else).

MashMash.1645:

Ayrilana.1396:

Exactly what do you use them for if not the mystic forge?

Well, currently you use them for skills of course. But this will change – they will be worthless and you’ll be given piles of mats for the forge. Which some players will never use, or have no interest in. What do they do? Personally I think you should be given options to get other things.

There are only so many skills to spend them on. If you aren’t doing anything with those excess now this change is basically irrelevant since excess would be useless both before and after.

What is SP?????

I’ve read the recipes where you get gold from upgrading mats. Because of RNG, you don’t always make a profit. You are expected to do it sufficient numbers of time that RNGeesus smiles upon you. An example I read explaining how to use it said they refined and upgraded over 12,000 elder wood logs. Another person tried 50,000 green planks, and still lost gold because their RNG didn’t reach enough upgraded mats back per try that is needed to break even.

I just don’t have the patience to mess with the mystic forge and its RNG. I would rather sell these scrolls to people that do want to spend time in front of a spreadsheet, calculating the odds and how much profit per skillpoint. That way is not how I want to play the game though.

Instead of piles of piles of skill points, now you have piles of piles of materials. Which is kind of the same thing. But it might use bank space now.

Quite honestly, almost all my money is made from skill point. It’s not necessary the best way to make money. But it’s the most fun. Since I can play however I want since almost everything gives skill points.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I’ve read the recipes where you get gold from upgrading mats. Because of RNG, you don’t always make a profit. You are expected to do it sufficient numbers of time that RNGeesus smiles upon you. An example I read explaining how to use it said they refined and upgraded over 12,000 elder wood logs. Another person tried 50,000 green planks, and still lost gold because their RNG didn’t reach enough upgraded mats back per try that is needed to break even.

I just don’t have the patience to mess with the mystic forge and its RNG. I would rather sell these scrolls to people that do want to spend time in front of a spreadsheet, calculating the odds and how much profit per skillpoint. That way is not how I want to play the game though.

There are MF recipes that have guaranteed outcomes that can be used to turn Skill points into money. Superior Siege is a great example; Get a few siege master’s guides with your skill points, buy a bunch of blueprints with Marks of Honor (even if you don’t Wuv, you probably have a bunch from chevo milestone chests) and throw in the guides, the blueprints, some mithril ore and elder wood, and BAM! A superior siege blueprint you can sell on the TP for what was probably pure profit.

For those willing to risk a higher front-end investment, there are tones of weapons skins unique to the mystic forge that can be sold for a profit. The Mystic Weapons anabasis mentioned are a good choice, but my favorite example of this is The Anomaly, it’s about 90g worth of ectos and Mystic coins, true, but if you’re sitting on a full stack of skill point scrolls, you can make that skin, put it on the AH for about 120g and make a (after fees) ~20-25g profit.

We don’t know what skill points will purchase in the future; we only know what they are used for today.

After HoT, the following might require skill-point-based materials:

• Legendary and Precursor collections (e.g. to upgrade an item).
• Dragonite converter (similar to Mawdrey II for bloodstone dust).
• Ascended weapon stat converter (instead of crafting a new ascended item, change the stats, using some T6, T6 mats + skill point mat).

Currently, skill point scrolls etc have no value to people who avoid the mystic forge, so at worst, this will be status quo for a lot of the community, while at best, there could be some useful purchases for more of us going forward.

tl;dr don’t panic; wait to read the relevant Hitchhiker’s Guide to Heart of Thorns

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I’ve read the recipes where you get gold from upgrading mats. Because of RNG, you don’t always make a profit. You are expected to do it sufficient numbers of time that RNGeesus smiles upon you. An example I read explaining how to use it said they refined and upgraded over 12,000 elder wood logs. Another person tried 50,000 green planks, and still lost gold because their RNG didn’t reach enough upgraded mats back per try that is needed to break even.

I just don’t have the patience to mess with the mystic forge and its RNG. I would rather sell these scrolls to people that do want to spend time in front of a spreadsheet, calculating the odds and how much profit per skillpoint. That way is not how I want to play the game though.

I respect most of your posts on this forum, but I really feel like I want to clarify this perspective here. Although there is some RNG, the promotion formula is much more forgiving than the other RNG-heavy thing the mystic forge is known for, which is precursor-fishing. Because we have a lot more data on forge promotion, we can work out a general sort of average output over a large number.

Forge promotion alone is not enough to guarantee a profit – one must also be familiar with the cost price of the raw material and the sell price of the result material, and be able to buy when the raw material is at a low point, and hold to sell when the result is at a high point. I think I saw the post you’re referring to about the guy who did 50k green planks and if I remember right he was very careless about when he decided to sell the soft wood.

Knowing the input price, the average expected output and having a target sell price can make forge promotion a steady and predictable way of converting SP into gold.

What I want to figure out, and hope to learn in the AMA tomorrow, is whether unlocking utilities with skill points will result in a fuller slate of skills for my alts once HoT comes, or be wasted on them because only the unlocked skill challenges in the world will contribute.

Though I could be getting mixed up with the latter being only to unlock traits and skills still come the old way but with a new UI?

Khisanth.2948:

MashMash.1645:

Ayrilana.1396:

Exactly what do you use them for if not the mystic forge?

Well, currently you use them for skills of course. But this will change – they will be worthless and you’ll be given piles of mats for the forge. Which some players will never use, or have no interest in. What do they do? Personally I think you should be given options to get other things.

There are only so many skills to spend them on. If you aren’t doing anything with those excess now this change is basically irrelevant since excess would be useless both before and after.

Yeah, that’s what I was getting at with the OP. If they have tons of skill points then they’re not really using them.

nyctalopia.4735:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I’ve read the recipes where you get gold from upgrading mats. Because of RNG, you don’t always make a profit. You are expected to do it sufficient numbers of time that RNGeesus smiles upon you. An example I read explaining how to use it said they refined and upgraded over 12,000 elder wood logs. Another person tried 50,000 green planks, and still lost gold because their RNG didn’t reach enough upgraded mats back per try that is needed to break even.

I just don’t have the patience to mess with the mystic forge and its RNG. I would rather sell these scrolls to people that do want to spend time in front of a spreadsheet, calculating the odds and how much profit per skillpoint. That way is not how I want to play the game though.

I respect most of your posts on this forum, but I really feel like I want to clarify this perspective here. Although there is some RNG, the promotion formula is much more forgiving than the other RNG-heavy thing the mystic forge is known for, which is precursor-fishing. Because we have a lot more data on forge promotion, we can work out a general sort of average output over a large number.

Forge promotion alone is not enough to guarantee a profit – one must also be familiar with the cost price of the raw material and the sell price of the result material, and be able to buy when the raw material is at a low point, and hold to sell when the result is at a high point. I think I saw the post you’re referring to about the guy who did 50k green planks and if I remember right he was very careless about when he decided to sell the soft wood.

Knowing the input price, the average expected output and having a target sell price can make forge promotion a steady and predictable way of converting SP into gold.

It was this thread here: Best way to turn skill points into gold. Where the 50k planks guy said he got an average of 69 planks back from that, when the break even point was around 80. He didn’t say anything about selling them. Then you said that 200 stacks of green planks wasn’t really very much (and then went on to talk about spreadsheets, which is one of the things I said I wasn’t interested in doing when playing the game).

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

I also made 50+ gold from 5 skill points promoting planks before.

It’s called RNG.

That being said, if you spend enough skill points, like 100. You pretty much guarantee profits. Since on average it’ll give profit.

I have no idea what the wood planking promoting(or bronze ingot) is doing right now. I havn’t done it in a while.

Looks like nearly 1g / sp. Less for the ingots.

Pockets.3201:

I can’t think of anything I regularly do that needs the forge. Its pretty useless to me outside of dailies.

what are skill points useful to you for right now?

i say this because the only thing skill points used for right now after unlocking skills is the forge, far as i know

My skill points tend to just sit there, collecting dust. I have every skill unlocked, and I tend to buy items I need for legendaries and such in advance of when I actually will use them. Maybe I’ll forge some more superior siege or something.

phys.7689:

Pockets.3201:

I can’t think of anything I regularly do that needs the forge. Its pretty useless to me outside of dailies.

what are skill points useful to you for right now?

i say this because the only thing skill points used for right now after unlocking skills is the forge, far as i know

I can answer for myself and say that it removes one of its functionalities. I was planning to use them on any alt I might one day decide to level and I was planning to use it on my Revenant, level her with tomes then she would start out with all skills unlocked and some skill points extra if needed to buy traits.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

phys.7689:

Pockets.3201:

I can’t think of anything I regularly do that needs the forge. Its pretty useless to me outside of dailies.

what are skill points useful to you for right now?

i say this because the only thing skill points used for right now after unlocking skills is the forge, far as i know

I can answer for myself and say that it removes one of its functionalities. I was planning to use them on any alt I might one day decide to level and I was planning to use it on my Revenant, level her with tomes then she would start out with all skills unlocked and some skill points extra if needed to buy traits.

oh you mean transfering skill points between charachters?
yeah looks like that is essentially dead.

Well hopefully this new currency goes into the account wallet. They can add all of the other ones too while they’re at it.

They are revamping the trait and skill system as well. So if you don’t use SP for forging then they literally have no value anymore. Added to the fact they are being switched to forge mats, there is no other uses.

E: Using SP scrolls for alts will be dead, but it all depends on how the new system works on if that will even be an issue.

I just wonder in what kind of currency they’ll change ir (crystals, stones, siege guides, etc.) I tend to keep my scrolls because I don’t know where I want to spend my points on…

Just a flesh wound.3589:

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

Why not use them for your own good then? It’s a resource you’ve collected by playing the game, and you can spend them to get some cool skins (e.g. I crafted the mystic sword and focus for my guardian and the Song of the Numberless Pac for my ele because the skins go well with their outfits), weapon stats, or items for some of the collections you may be interested in.

Check out the wiki entry on the eldritch scroll to get an idea of what kind of non-rng recipies there are for the forge, and use your excess skill points to your advantage.

Yeah so I have like 2,000 SPs and I hope there’s added a more no-brainer spammable recipe that I can do without market watching.

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

Why not use them for your own good then? It’s a resource you’ve collected by playing the game, and you can spend them to get some cool skins (e.g. I crafted the mystic sword and focus for my guardian and the Song of the Numberless Pac for my ele because the skins go well with their outfits), weapon stats, or items for some of the collections you may be interested in.

Check out the wiki entry on the eldritch scroll to get an idea of what kind of non-rng recipies there are for the forge, and use your excess skill points to your advantage.

I did use some to craft some skins for myself. Vision of the Mists. Mjolnir. Anomaly. Mystic axe.

I could craft a bunch of other skins, but none of the others are anything that I particularly want to use, which makes crafting them feel like a waste of gold if I’m just doing it to fill up my wardrobe without intent to use. But it might be worth looking into, just to fill up the wardrobe.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

Why not use them for your own good then? It’s a resource you’ve collected by playing the game, and you can spend them to get some cool skins (e.g. I crafted the mystic sword and focus for my guardian and the Song of the Numberless Pac for my ele because the skins go well with their outfits), weapon stats, or items for some of the collections you may be interested in.

Check out the wiki entry on the eldritch scroll to get an idea of what kind of non-rng recipies there are for the forge, and use your excess skill points to your advantage.

I did use some to craft some skins for myself. Vision of the Mists. Mjolnir. Anomaly. Mystic axe.

I could craft a bunch of other skins, but none of the others are anything that I particularly I want to use, which makes crafting them feel like a waste of gold if I’m just doing it to fill up my wardrobe without intent to use,

Then treat them just like badges of honor, fractal relics, or any other currency people have aquired that they don’t plan on spending because there’s nothing to have that currently is worth it for them .

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

Why not use them for your own good then? It’s a resource you’ve collected by playing the game, and you can spend them to get some cool skins (e.g. I crafted the mystic sword and focus for my guardian and the Song of the Numberless Pac for my ele because the skins go well with their outfits), weapon stats, or items for some of the collections you may be interested in.

Check out the wiki entry on the eldritch scroll to get an idea of what kind of non-rng recipies there are for the forge, and use your excess skill points to your advantage.

I did use some to craft some skins for myself. Vision of the Mists. Mjolnir. Anomaly. Mystic axe.

I could craft a bunch of other skins, but none of the others are anything that I particularly I want to use, which makes crafting them feel like a waste of gold if I’m just doing it to fill up my wardrobe without intent to use,

Then treat them just like badges of honor, fractal relics, or any other currency people have aquired that they don’t plan on spending because there’s nothing to have that currently is worth it for them .

It’s a thought. The problem with the wardrobe is that it’s poorly designed from a collectors point of view. It ranges from easy to get to difficult to get (extreme RNG needed) to not available in the actual game (gem store items) to impossible to get (not currently available by any method). It needs to be reworked with gem store items and black lion chest skins and achievement skins in their own categories. If the wardrobe can not be filled in 100%, it puts a bit of a damper on the desire to fill it in.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Rasimir.6239:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

That way of earning gold is all about spreadsheets and RNG. Both of which I’m not in favor of as a play style.

Why not use them for your own good then? It’s a resource you’ve collected by playing the game, and you can spend them to get some cool skins (e.g. I crafted the mystic sword and focus for my guardian and the Song of the Numberless Pac for my ele because the skins go well with their outfits), weapon stats, or items for some of the collections you may be interested in.

Check out the wiki entry on the eldritch scroll to get an idea of what kind of non-rng recipies there are for the forge, and use your excess skill points to your advantage.

I did use some to craft some skins for myself. Vision of the Mists. Mjolnir. Anomaly. Mystic axe.

I could craft a bunch of other skins, but none of the others are anything that I particularly I want to use, which makes crafting them feel like a waste of gold if I’m just doing it to fill up my wardrobe without intent to use,

Then treat them just like badges of honor, fractal relics, or any other currency people have aquired that they don’t plan on spending because there’s nothing to have that currently is worth it for them .

It’s a thought. The problem with the wardrobe is that it’s poorly designed from a collectors point of view. It ranges from easy to get to difficult to get (extreme RNG needed) to not available in the actual game (gem store items) to impossible to get (not currently available by any method). It needs to be reworked with gem store items and black lion chest skins and achievement skins in their own categories. If the wardrobe can not be filled in 100%, it puts a bit of a damper on the desire to fill it in.

I know what you mean. Personally, I’m always irritated when checking the wardrobe on my asura-only twink account and finding most of the locked armor skins either being gemstore only (many of which I simply don’t like the looks of on my (female) asura) or racials for other races. Additional filter options like “unlocked only” or “usable only” (filtering out all other races racial armors as well as non-usable weapons) would be great, altough I’m not yet sure how that could best be incorporated into the ui that currently filters by category only.

Back to use for unused skill points: I’m still dreaming of recipies for minis, kind of like the princess miya recipe from super adventure box. Drop parts of minis on certain mobs, bosses, chests etc. throughout the world, and combine them with whatever forge currency looks suitable for exclusive in-game minis. An asura can dream, right?