Guild Wars 2

This is related to the dungeon ownership change in regards to dungeons and fractals.

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-It only takes 2 random people who joined your group to kick everyone and invite their friends, no matter who started it. You can no longer safely start a dungeon or fractal if you don’t know the other people in the group.

-If you are soloing and lose connection, it sounds like you will lose your instance (to be confirmed).

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

Potential benefits

-Dungeon starter can now swap characters as needed.

-Dungeon starter can’t be a kitten and get away scotch free anymore (unless the others decide he’s enough of a kitten they want to lose their progress to kick him right now).

-People with unstable connection will be able to create dungeons without causing issues for their party.

Potential fix

-Require 3 people to complete a kick. Have a vote no option for kicks to remove the prompt as right now it stays there until the initiator removes it. While it’s not perfect, it’s a big difference to have 2 vs 3 people join someone and grief them.
*EDIT : Or in a party < 5… if 3 people in party, need 2 to kick. If 4 in party, need either 2 or 3 (whatever you prefer).

-For reporting purposes, save party chat as with whisper chat for example. Also, allow an option to have a game message telling you who joined your party. Example : abcd.3249 joined you party.

That way you have their account name should they grief you.

Honestly these changes leave room for griefers to get away with A LOT and anyone that has paid attention before will know that these griefers usually get away scotch free without even a slap on the wrists even if you report them and at most a temporary ban for a few days (which then rewards them with a free upgrade to the heroic game if they didn’t have it…)

Please, this change will lead to terrible things if you don’t take additional action to prevent griefing! Don’t let it happen!

great analysis man!

One of the potential fix I could think of:

-tag instance owner
-if instance owner gets kicked, the instance should be deleted and the rest of the party gets kicked out
-but if instance owner leaves via ‘leave party’ option, then ownership would be transferred to the next person

Party leader can determine number of votes to kick and who has kick immunity. That would solve everything.

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place, it decreases the value of the reward items associated with that dungeon.

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place.

ArenaNET have stated that they are OK with people selling dungeons as long as no exploits were used. It has been around since Guild Wars 1 : Prophecies.

This is also not the thread to discuss this. Please do not clutter the thread with these offtopic remarks.

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place, it decreases the value of the reward items associated with that dungeon.

Selling dungeons isn’t this issue. Nothing wrong with it, it doesn’t “cause inflation”, or anything, and really does no harm. It benefits the seller, and the buyer who wants the dungeon credit, tokens, reward chest at the end, etc. But that a whole different discussion.

I agree though, this could be a bad thing. However, we still only have a general idea of what it entails. I would think that a “fail safe” would be included to prevent such things from happening. I guess we can only wait and see, or hope that a dev can at least confirm that such things will be addressed and taken care of with such a patch.

Kurr.4179:

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place.

ArenaNET have stated that they are OK with people selling dungeons as long as no exploits were used. It has been around since Guild Wars 1 : Prophecies.

This is also not the thread to discuss this. Please do not clutter the thread with these offtopic remarks.

Oh well so sorry to “clutter” your thread with my opinion that selling dungeon paths is lame. You mentioned anyway and I’m glad the developers didn’t take it into account.

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place.

ArenaNET have stated that they are OK with people selling dungeons as long as no exploits were used. It has been around since Guild Wars 1 : Prophecies.

This is also not the thread to discuss this. Please do not clutter the thread with these offtopic remarks.

Oh well so sorry to “clutter” your thread with my opinion that selling dungeon paths is lame. You mentioned anyway and I’m glad the developers didn’t take it into account.

Lol.

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Xillllix.3485:

Kurr.4179:

Here are potential issues with the change to dungeon ownership

-If you are selling, 2 people can easily kick you and steal your instance, simply killing the boss themselves. Two decent players would be able to do any end boss in Arah quite fast (or even invite their friends afterwards) and honestly griefers could very well use this opportunity to do all arah paths in record time.

People shouldn’t sell dungeon paths in the first place.

ArenaNET have stated that they are OK with people selling dungeons as long as no exploits were used. It has been around since Guild Wars 1 : Prophecies.

This is also not the thread to discuss this. Please do not clutter the thread with these offtopic remarks.

Oh well so sorry to “clutter” your thread with my opinion that selling dungeon paths is lame. You mentioned anyway and I’m glad the developers didn’t take it into account.

You don’t get it. I don’t like dungeon selling. It’s none of my business what they do though and ArenaNET have stated they are OK with it. So I’m not going to be a kitten about it.

Good analysis and I think protecting dungeon runs as a service is worthwhile.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

Party leader can determine number of votes to kick and who has kick immunity. That would solve everything.

The vote for kick count could even appear on LFG tool.

Kick votes should never require less than a majority. I don’t know why they elected to only require 2 votes and have yet to change that.

I’m not on bored with allowing instance "owners" to be immune, but I can why people would think that’s a good idea considerring a majority vote is not required..

synk.6907:

Kick votes should never require less than a majority. I don’t know why they elected to only require 2 votes and have yet to change that.

Agreed. This type of griefing already happens but at the moment at least you can protect yourself. We desperately need a change if instance ownership is going away.

CeruleanRevolver.6085:

great analysis man!

One of the potential fix I could think of:

-tag instance owner
-if instance owner gets kicked, the instance should be deleted and the rest of the party gets kicked out

Sorry but no.Tje instance must never reset.Having instance owner was just crappy design.None other MMO had such thing.It had to go.

One of the devs agreed with the requirement that a majority vote should be the norm but apparently there are some coding issues behind it that mean it won’t be implemented this patch

Yeah, I read that, too, just now. My assumption is that they’ve coded a vote listener that just triggers on an additional click once a kick has been registered rather than one that stores and waits for all party members’ votes and goes with the majority. Perhaps as this moves forward it will get revamped into a proper kick vote system.

I mean… the proposed change is better than it is now. I’m just glad we’ll at least be able to run without worrying who ran into the dungeon first and whether or not his connection sucks or he feels like leaving half way through.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Dungeon-Instance-Owner-change-FTW/first#post4336064

the fix i want is simple, make it so the party LEADER (not the opener but the person who psoted in lfg or invited the first person to the group) can NEVER be kicked, but the instance will not close if he leaves or logs off, (and he will lose his kick immunity if hes gone more than 5 mins)