Guild Wars 2

Hi there.

There has been some problems (whether you’d like to deny their existence or not) with the game since its launch. What many people who quit – including myself – found was that many of these problems actually linked back to the core mechanics of the game. This includes, for instance, the down state. While the idea of taking away the trinity system is great, in reality, it created a chaotic, unstructured dungeon environment, and severely affected the desired outcomes of the fights.

What I’m curious about is what sort of problems were identified as ‘key’ problems in failing to bring back players to this game, and what the team had done to do about it.

I’ve seen in several older patch notes that the team is working to improve the PVP, both structured and World. The problem with launch, of course, is that the PVP system was seriously lackluster, and the team is obviously working to improve that.

But what about the lack of end game? What was done and is being done for the other problems with the game? If anyone could perhaps tell me a little about what was done with the game to address these original problems with the game, I’d greatly appreciate it.

Thanks.

Thinly veiled attempt at a “bring back trinity” thread.

You may not like the lack of trinity, but most do. Furthermore, what you see as an undenyable problem, I see as an opinion on your end. The facts are that looking for group is easier in this game than any other game, teamwork matters and personal skill is what gets you through a dungeon.

Sure for unskilled players that leads to a chaotic unstructured environment. To skilled teams, that leads to a much higher skill cap, because we’re not limited by arbitrary concepts like “trinity”.

The strong points of this game will be improved upon, I’m fairly sure of that. Bringing back the trinity will destroy this game, I don’t think it’s even on the boards in Bellevue.

First step towards fixing a problem is admitting that there is one. You can close your eyes, block your eyes, and refuse to see the problem, but the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself. Any game company that aims for the top, like Arenanet, would take feedback, rather than thinking that ‘most do’ based on personal preference.

The problem isn’t the lack of trinity system. Rather, what was done to replace it, and if it’s working or not. Right now most dungeon fights – especially in the lower level ones – are just zerg fests. It’s chaotic, unstructured, one guy falls, he’s just revived, or runs back after reviving himself.

What the game needs right now isn’t simply an improvement on its strong points. And you’re pathetically naive if you think that will lead this game to be the leading mmo on the rpg. ArenaNet was late in addressing the problems with structured pvp, and look now – what pro gamer pvp community is there in the guild wars 2 pvp right now? And before you deny it – yes, the pvp community is important. The bigger the pvp community, the more attention the higher pvp players receive, which means sponsorship, which means media coverage. Every game involving PVP had this pattern, and you better believe that ArenaNet needs to identify the problems in their limited pvp fanbase.

I never understood the need for “an end game”. But I’m more of “it’s the journey” kind of adventurer/hero. When most people say “end game”, they mean grinding for elite loot running the same set of raids ad infinitum until they are purpled out.

Why bother with making all that beautiful scenery or complex stories and interesting quests if everyone simply blows by it to reach “the end game”? It’s an MMO trope that really needs to be retired or heavily curtailed.

As for the lack of the trinity, everyone in the army knows how to use a gun and do rudimentary medical triage. Doesn’t matter if you are in logistics, a tank jockey or a cook. You can specialize rolls as much as you want but when the crap hits the fan it’s all about shooting back and stem the bleeding. Trinity been around for a long time, as in the first paper RPGs with fighters, mages and clerics. But over time multi class characters became the rule of the day because players want to able to do more than just be the meat shield or the DPSer or the healer. The healer wants to kick butt too. The DPSer doesn’t just want to be the glass canon.

Shouldn’t a player want to able to day any of these rolls rather than being stuck forever and ever in that one role they picked at the moment of character creation?

Jae.5138:

First step towards fixing a problem is admitting that there is one. You can close your eyes, block your eyes, and refuse to see the problem, but the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself. Any game company that aims for the top, like Arenanet, would take feedback, rather than thinking that ‘most do’ based on personal preference.

The problem isn’t the lack of trinity system. Rather, what was done to replace it, and if it’s working or not. Right now most dungeon fights – especially in the lower level ones – are just zerg fests. It’s chaotic, unstructured, one guy falls, he’s just revived, or runs back after reviving himself.

What the game needs right now isn’t simply an improvement on its strong points. And you’re pathetically naive if you think that will lead this game to be the leading mmo on the rpg. ArenaNet was late in addressing the problems with structured pvp, and look now – what pro gamer pvp community is there in the guild wars 2 pvp right now? And before you deny it – yes, the pvp community is important. The bigger the pvp community, the more attention the higher pvp players receive, which means sponsorship, which means media coverage. Every game involving PVP had this pattern, and you better believe that ArenaNet needs to identify the problems in their limited pvp fanbase.

The first step to fixing a problem IS to admit there is one. However, there’s the other side too. There’s seeing problems that are only problems for certain people with certain play styles. Assuredly if you’re a hard core raider, this game is FILLED with problems. From other play style points of view though, those problems don’t exist.

People who come from say Skyrim to Guild Wars 2 don’t feel the lack of end game as keenly as hard core raiders. Hard core PvPers have a completely different set of game requirements than casual PvPers.

So yeah, problems definitely exist for certain play styles. Hell, problems exist from my play style too.

But I’m willing to wager they’re completely different problems than the ones that you see.

The first step to fixing a problem IS to admit there is one. However, there’s the other side too. There’s seeing problems that are only problems for certain people with certain play styles. Assuredly if you’re a hard core raider, this game is FILLED with problems. From other play style points of view though, those problems don’t exist.

People who come from say Skyrim to Guild Wars 2 don’t feel the lack of end game as keenly as hard core raiders. Hard core PvPers have a completely different set of game requirements than casual PvPers.

So yeah, problems definitely exist for certain play styles. Hell, problems exist from my play style too.

But I’m willing to wager they’re completely different problems than the ones that you see.[/quote]

Well said, Vayne. You’re definitely right in that we have to see the other side too, and realize that no gaming companies – including ArenaNet – can please everyone. Now, the problems with GW2 isn’t that it is different. No trinity system? That’s excellent. No end game? No problem. the problem is what was meant to replace these older, well established ideas. While it may be true that many people like to hit max level then go back to lower level areas for the 100% completion, do you honestly believe they’re targetting the majority of the gamer population with that mechanic? Do majority of gamers want to hit the highest level in the game, only to go back to helping farmers collect bunnies?

The core problem with the PVP – since we’re on that topic – was that it catered to neither the hardcore pvp gamers, nor the casual ones. It didn’t cater to the hardcore pvp gamers in that it simply didn’t offer enough. Sure, there were some aesthetic rewards, but these were only obtainable by grinding pvp, hardly a bragging right for a pvp focused player like myself. For casual pvp gamers, they would never be able to get those armors, since the glory was a pure grind system. Of course, ANet is doing many things to change this, so it’ll be much more exciting for the future.

But I’m not here to discuss in which ways ANet has promised us things that they failed to deliver since launch. Rather, I’m here to discuss what sort of process ANet has made so far in keeping their promises to the player base, and what sort of changes are coming. The reason why I stick around is that because of the hype as well as the fun I had with the game, it’s quite sad to see the game change so little in addressing those problems that are making the game lose more and more players.

These problems you speak of… I don’t see and have not seen, certainly since pre-launch. It’s merely a p[roblem you have on something that does not fit your own playstyle and beliefs.

Taking away the Trinity is a bold move and one I have welcomed.. the only thing I would say ANET need to consider is how they add in the opportune ity for players to take a more trinity focused trait line should they want.. but as it is currently I think it works fine.

As for your notion that this is the only game where you can be downed, ressed and run back in… you may want to take a better look out there at how others do exactly that and always have. Heck many allow players to carry portable shrines for all to res up en mass.
As for PvP well I am not that focused on it, but I will say GW1 and GW2 seem to do things better than most – not by any means perfect but to date not at all bad. They have a lots of balancing of classes/skills to polish for sure and perhaps downed state needs a little tweaking around the concepts but its far from a priority 1 issue except maybe to you.. that just your opinion and is not shared by all me thinks.

Yes. There have been many issues since the release of the game, and they are being solved in it’s due pace. However i don’t agree that the problems lies in the core mechanic. The main problem lies in working in 3 different gaming styles (PvE, PvP and WvW), without compromising the integrity of the others.

So, with this being said, i find the trinity system way outdated. Now, all the players are responsible for their own life and have something to say in the life of the others. It’s a more evenly distributed system and the way it should be. Picking your example, if one player is downed, the other players have the responsibility to work towards it’s rescue. Don’t see the chaos here. Maybe you are used to rely on some to do this job. Old habits die hard, i suppose.

About the PvP base? I Agree that the game isn’t suited for more competitive players and definitively not ready for a E-Sport. But it’s getting there. More maps, more gaming modes, more tools (Leaderboards, custom arenas and spectator mode) are being gradually introduced to the game. So, the PvP player base is lower as it used to be, but honestly i can only see it going higher due to this updates).

In the end, the team is correcting some huge mistakes they did upon release. Those corrections may not be faster as the players might want, but they are being done! If it’s not of your liking just move along as a lot of players did.

/Cheers

Bloodstealer.5978:

These problems you speak of… I don’t see and have not seen, certainly since pre-launch. It’s merely a p[roblem you have on something that does not fit your own playstyle and beliefs.

Taking away the Trinity is a bold move and one I have welcomed.. the only thing I would say ANET need to consider is how they add in the opportune ity for players to take a more trinity focused trait line should they want.. but as it is currently I think it works fine.

As for your notion that this is the only game where you can be downed, ressed and run back in… you may want to take a better look out there at how others do exactly that and always have. Heck many allow players to carry portable shrines for all to res up en mass.
As for PvP well I am not that focused on it, but I will say GW1 and GW2 seem to do things better than most – not by any means perfect but to date not at all bad. They have a lots of balancing of classes/skills to polish for sure and perhaps downed state needs a little tweaking around the concepts but its far from a priority 1 issue except maybe to you.. that just your opinion and is not shared by all me thinks.

If you do not see any of those problems mentioned, I’d say you’re the minority here. Like I had said, a new game like Guild Wars 2 should be aiming to increase its player base more and more, with every patch coming out. The game is dying in that the player base is decreasing. There’s no denying this. When a game is losing its player base despite its young age, this is never a good sign.

Yes – the notion of being able to be ressed and jumping into the fight is a good idea. The execution is poor. This is where the poor boss mechanics are not balanced well in addressing this down state notion. Many bosses hit like feathers, but take 10 minutes to kill. When they do have a killing blow, they do it in a manner that can be dodged easily, or not at all (with almost no visual warning). Instead of the tank and spank mechanic, you now have a pure burning the boss down mechanic. To say one’s superior to another would hardly be a comparison, as the latter clearly fails in this regards – again, judged by the player base.

Now, by this point you may have noticed I keep going back to the player base and the number of players. You may argue that it isn’t important that the Guild Wars 2 is losing its players, or that its player base is not as strong as some of the other mmo’s out there. While you may tell yourself that you love the game, everything about it, and everyone else can go kitten themselves, that is what the game’s success is based on. Its player base. This brings in the investors. This brings in the income. This brings in the future content, the bread for the employees. I do hope ANet has big plans to bring back its player base, a better one than simply giving a 30% discount on their game.

Jae.5138:

Do majority of gamers want to hit the highest level in the game, only to go back to helping farmers collect bunnies?

You might be surprised.

LHound.8964:

In the end, the team is correcting some huge mistakes they did upon release. Those corrections may not be faster as the players might want, but they are being done! If it’s not of your liking just move along as a lot of players did.

/Cheers

The problem with innovation is that you’re the first to try it and as a result, you’re the first to fail, as well. ANet has clearly done some things right in abandoning the old trinity system. But was it successful? While you may argue that it’s up to your personal preference, in the adults’ world, this is not so. If they’re intent on keeping this system – where every man’s for himself – the boss mechanic would have to be more complex to address that. Unfortunately, that is not the case right now.

What’s really sad about this whole issue is that many of the GW2 team members have that same attitude – the ‘if you dont like it, leave it’ sort of attitude towards their creations. It’s important to take pride in what you do. But the above quotation is one you can repeat until your game finally has reached down to its last single player remaining. Any good company – not just gaming – knows how to take feedback and turn them into strengths. Your childish ‘take it or leave it’ attitude will, ultimately, destroy a potentially amazing MMO like the GW2.

Jae there are plenty of games out there that have what you’re asking for. Guild wars isn’t even a year old and you’re expecting full on end game to the likes of other MMO’s that have been out for years and years. I suggest taking a break from this game, stop complaining and come back in a years time if you can’t enjoy the game for what it is now. There is end game but if it is not to your tastes, they are your problems and you should be the one to take action and not ANet who are doing a fantastic job so far. The only action you can take for yourself is to quit the game for the time being and wait it out, like I said, plenty of other MMO’s to go play. Unless you want to go get a job working for ANet and actually realise how difficult it is to satisfy everyone at the same time. I’m sure then you wouldn’t be complaining.

Jae.5138:

LHound.8964:

In the end, the team is correcting some huge mistakes they did upon release. Those corrections may not be faster as the players might want, but they are being done! If it’s not of your liking just move along as a lot of players did.

/Cheers

The problem with innovation is that you’re the first to try it and as a result, you’re the first to fail, as well. ANet has clearly done some things right in abandoning the old trinity system. But was it successful? While you may argue that it’s up to your personal preference, in the adults’ world, this is not so. If they’re intent on keeping this system – where every man’s for himself – the boss mechanic would have to be more complex to address that. Unfortunately, that is not the case right now.

What’s really sad about this whole issue is that many of the GW2 team members have that same attitude – the ‘if you dont like it, leave it’ sort of attitude towards their creations. It’s important to take pride in what you do. But the above quotation is one you can repeat until your game finally has reached down to its last single player remaining. Any good company – not just gaming – knows how to take feedback and turn them into strengths. Your childish ‘take it or leave it’ attitude will, ultimately, destroy a potentially amazing MMO like the GW2.

I strongly disagree.

Many players came to play Gw2 because they though it was the holy Panacea for every game out there. This game isn’t suited for everyone, and definitively not all won’t like the game! We can see players wanting the game to move to one direction and players wanting to move the other direction. In the end how can we define what players want and how the game should evolve?

You are absolutely correct that innovation is the key element and while many players strongly are against innovations, other are not. So in what way should your claim of the game current situation be any better than the ones that find it excellent? Indeed they should pride of their work, but shouldn’t they also being able to ignore the comments if that destroys the integrity of their work? How do we stand then?

To the players there is nothing more than the old “Don’t like it? You are free to leave anytime”. If you can’t bear the waiting for the tide of change, just walk along in the beach and try to find another MMO who suits you more! This is the overall picture. I don’t agree that the game will ever reach 1 man standing playing the game. It simply wont. The game will in it’s own way, filter the holy grail chasers and leave the game for those who really enjoy the game for what it is.

Game Progress will walk slowly towards perfection, and still it may not be the perfection you desire. For that it may never be!

/Cheers

Jaall.3420:

Jae there are plenty of games out there that have what you’re asking for. Guild wars isn’t even a year old and you’re expecting full on end game to the likes of other MMO’s that have been out for years and years. I suggest taking a break from this game, stop complaining and come back in a years time if you can’t enjoy the game for what it is now. There is end game but if it is not to your tastes, they are your problems and you should be the one to take action and not ANet who are doing a fantastic job so far. The only action you can take for yourself is to quit the game for the time being and wait it out, like I said, plenty of other MMO’s to go play. Unless you want to go get a job working for ANet and actually realise how difficult it is to satisfy everyone at the same time. I’m sure then you wouldn’t be complaining.

You make some great points there, but there’s something I’d like to point out there. When I was mentioning the things I would love to see in this game, I wasn’t making a reference to other mmo’s I love. Rather, they were things that ANet had promised us before the launch, only to be met by many disappointments, including my own.

You’re definitely right in that they have released plenty of exciting content since the release. But sadly, there doesn’t seem to be much to look forward to in the next year or so. Currently the priorities seem to be based on pumping out new PVE content as well as some pvp features. The resource as well as the talent the company has workin gon the new content is amazing, but the management as well as the direction in which the game is pointed towards seems like it’s headed for yet another disappointment. But this last part, of course, is just a speculation on my very pessimistic self.

Jae.5138:

First step towards fixing a problem is admitting that there is one. You can close your eyes, block your eyes, and refuse to see the problem, but the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself. Any game company that aims for the top, like Arenanet, would take feedback, rather than thinking that ‘most do’ based on personal preference.

Let’s say I do not share your opinion.

The problem isn’t the lack of trinity system. Rather, what was done to replace it, and if it’s working or not. Right now most dungeon fights – especially in the lower level ones – are just zerg fests. It’s chaotic, unstructured, one guy falls, he’s just revived, or runs back after reviving himself.

5-man dungeons don’t even make a sixling let alone they could be zergfests.

What the game needs right now isn’t simply an improvement on its strong points. And you’re pathetically naive if you think that will lead this game to be the leading mmo on the rpg.

I’m very happy with a GW2 that improves on it’s strong points to become a very strong MMO on its own, instead of being a crown pretender like most other WoW-copies are. Becoming a WoW-clone would be disastrous.

GW1 was very strong because it was unique and always kept improving on the strong points. Sure it was a niche game, and probably GW2 will become a niche game (albeit larger than GW1). One doesn’t have to beat WoW to be a top game …

I got to disagree.

The problem is not the lack of trinity or the downed mechanic, the problem is that the dungeons where too much ‘World of Warcraft’ like.

Now you might wondering what I mean with that, well, the dungeons are too much ‘’tank and spank’’ there’s trash mobs everywhere that you just need to AoE down, and the bosses don’t do much either.

However, this is not always the case, some bosses have interesting mechanics and fun battles.

However, I think ArenaNet might have found their ways with dungeons, and that is the use of more puzzles.

I’ve been feeling that there are a few problems too. Except I don’t quite agree with your take on it. But I love what ANet has tried here, and I want this to be my MMO for so many reasons, but I often feel like there are major flaws right in front of me that could be fixed so easily.

I’m from WoW, and have been playing that for about 5 years. These two are the only MMOs that I have experienced, so that is my perspective.

The problem I am finding with the dungeons is that people only want to farm them. I’ve only done 1 story mode dungeon, because no one wants to group with me for them. And my guild are only interested in running CoF repeatedly, because it gives the most coin per hour. Oh, and we do fractals too, of course (which btw – I generally like a lot as dungeons and think they’re quite well designed).

Can we not add incentives for people to do the other dungeons more? Or something?

Also, the PVP. sPvP. Man, I find it so awful. People said that this was a PVP game, but I honestly think that WoW’s PVP scene is so much more enjoyable. WoW has bad systems like having to farm PVP gear, and having multiple tiers so PVP gear with different levels of strength (so not everyone has equal quality gear) – but aside from that I just think that the PVP there is a lot funner to play.

I was honestly close to going back to WoW until I discovered WvW, which delivers enough PVP for me to get my PVP fix. I didn’t think I’d like WvW, because I prefer the small battleground type battles, but WvW has turned out to be the PVP I do in this game.

Um… well, sorry for rambling lol. Although I do not agree that a trinity is needed in PVE, I agree with what you say about the game needing improvements. And I want to see these improvements so that GW2 is the best MMO, like it clearly has the potential to be.

i disagree with your position. i think down state is ok. in pvp both sides have it, so its fair. in pve it prolongs fight, so its nice mechanic.

If you do not see any of those problems mentioned, I’d say you’re the minority here.

very bold claim – how can one determine what is the opinion of the majority without knowing the opinion nearly everyone

… the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself…

another bold claim – how can one know that, without being involved in those sales

What I would like to read from OP is why he is making another trinity complaint thread if he already quit the game? If game is not to your liking, and has fundamental flaws why are you posting your opinions, since you know, you quit…

Saulius.8430:

i disagree with your position. i think down state is ok. in pvp both sides have it, so its fair. in pve it prolongs fight, so its nice mechanic.

If you do not see any of those problems mentioned, I’d say you’re the minority here.

very bold claim – how can one determine what is the opinion of the majority without knowing the opinion nearly everyone

… the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself…

another bold claim – how can one know that, without being involved in those sales

That’s what I meant with I don’t share his opinion. Two extraordinary claims without extraordinary evidence.

1. Removing the holy trinity is a cool idea in theory, but it’s not working… yet

GW1 had an healer, GW1 could have a tank in pve, but GW1 had a much higher diversity of roles than GW2 ever came close to be. Meanwhile, GW2’s roles can be simplified to this:

GW2’s pve roles: Being a zerker zerger;
GW2’s pvp roles: Being a burst roamer, a bunker or (lol) a portal/ time wrap mesmer. (Although some condition builds are decent now).

So, even though GW2 didn’t want to have a three-role setup (dps, healer, tank), it ended mostly with a one-role setup (pve berserker, unless you’re not skilled enough or have latency issues, and need an extra defense) or a two-role setup (for pvp). Although pvp seems to been getting better with more map diversity, and some nerfs and buffs, pve has too many mechanical or design problems that prevent role diversity in this game:

1.1) Investing on party support is not worth it, because the normal pve gaming experience never incentivates people to join in a party, except for the occasional champion and event. And, to make things more restricting, events are so easy and spammable, that you’re much better of aoe zerging everything with yor zerker equipment, than supporting other people. But, this is not even all: events don’t even reward party support, so whoever is unfortunate enough to focus on this role, is getting less loot from monsters, and has a chance to get a silver or bronze award for event completion as well. Finally, when this is usually worth it (when you know you will always have a party, like for dungeon content), you need to spend money warping to a city, spend more money resetting your traits, some more to come back, and finally, once the dungeon is completed, if you wish to do normal pve stuff, repeat the process.

1.2) Condition damage builds suffer a lot from stack capping. So ever though they’re viable for normal content (although not optimal, speed-wise), players are incentivated to not use them, because any other player who happens to have a condition build will fight each other against event/ champion/ dungeon bosses. Especially bad in open world, where you can’t choose whoever is participating in the event. Also, zerker zergers can usually loot steal you in events due to the speed of their killing power versus yours. Loot stealing, as we all know, is against anet’s philosophy, so it’s undoubtly a problem that needs to be fixed.

1.3) Crowd control and disruption are pointless against the bosses where it most matters, due to their anti-control buff. What else is there to say here? This alone renders useless many traits, utilities and even entire weapon sets for pve content.

1.4) Aoe and spash damage is king. You can make the highest bursts in this game with aoe (hundred blades, lightning hammer, guardian’s GS, etc). You can farm events far more effectively by spamming aoe. What’s the point of single target attacks, when aoe is better in almost any situation. Fortunately, we have official confirmation that AoE will be nerfed.

1.5) Normal content is too easy, and GW2’s defensive mechanics place too much emphasis on skills and too little on stats, which makes the high-risk, high-reward zerker zergers builds to actually become a low risk, low effort, high reward builds. With zerker zergers (with some aoe, of course), you’re doing everything correctly. Exploring faster than other players, speed running dungeons faster, and farming for a lot more each event. You just spam your AoEs, like hundred blades, guardian’s gs skillset, elementalists’ aoe bursts, etc, etc, and loot and exp will rain down to you.

(Double-posting due to post restrictions).

2. The world is beautiful, but mathematical and mechanical. Where is the story and the lore behind it?

Seriously, when I explore beatiful places around Tyria, or intriguing places (mount maelstrom comes to mind), I’m always interested to know more about them, and to feel them, and how distinct they are from other places. It happens they usually aren’t, at all.

2.1) Exploring maps becomes a repetitive, mathematical grind very early, very fast. There’s no difficulty most of the time, there’s no interesting storytelling to break the pace, there’s no distinct rewards to break the pace, there’s no diversity to… guess what, break the pace. And we leave them out without knowing much more about those maps than when we first entered them.

2.2) Seriously, why does all events play the same? I can understand that you can only do so much with the system, but I feel that not enough was done. There are times where the devs have tried to express the world’s lore through their events, but first, events are clearly not enough for that, and second, most of the events seem like filler. Not that there’s a big problem with that, but they don’t exctly make the world more interesting, they are just there to keep players busy. I can understand, however, that’s it’s an impossible task to create so many events and keep them fresh. Fortunately, devs are compensating with new story mechanics, like the new living world concept, but there’s still much to evolve.

2.3) Meanwhile, the story in this game doesn’t even bothers to make us interested in the world. I remember when I first entered mount maelstrom, and wondered what the devs have reserved there for the players. After doing exactly the same thing I’ve done in all other maps, I was rather disappointed and tired of it. But then the story took me there. Interesting, I thought! Of course, the story only wanted to present a new character or two, hastily finish its plot arch, and move on. And the same can be said to many other locations in Tyria.

@DiogoSilva I really agree with most of what you’re saying!

I see DiogoSilva’s points, but i think combat wise, what it really boils down to, is that PVE wise, encounters are too simple to bring out the deeper combat systems. The problem though is, they probably cant make the game any harder, people already complain that some things are too hard.
Simply put they need to have a hard mode, that is essentially actively harder, mostly due to better enemy
Also I agree that the CC Buff for bosses is stupid. I understand they dont want people chain stunning things, but the solution they came up with essentially negates part of the trinity they wanted to design for.

CC buff for bosses is stupid

had to say it again, it really doesnt work well with the systems they have in place.

As far as the exploration, you are mostly correct. And its kind of wierd, because on one side you have some pretty unique environments in the world, but on the other side they do make it actually feel pretty mechanical, and only have a few dynamic events/chains that actually reveal something about the area. This wouldnt be as much of an issue if they had something that guided you to, or through, or kept track of the actual dynamic events that are tied to the story/zone better.

They have the basic systems down, but their event planning and linking leaves a lot to be desired.

Jae.5138:

Bloodstealer.5978:

These problems you speak of… I don’t see and have not seen, certainly since pre-launch. It’s merely a p[roblem you have on something that does not fit your own playstyle and beliefs.

Taking away the Trinity is a bold move and one I have welcomed.. the only thing I would say ANET need to consider is how they add in the opportune ity for players to take a more trinity focused trait line should they want.. but as it is currently I think it works fine.

As for your notion that this is the only game where you can be downed, ressed and run back in… you may want to take a better look out there at how others do exactly that and always have. Heck many allow players to carry portable shrines for all to res up en mass.
As for PvP well I am not that focused on it, but I will say GW1 and GW2 seem to do things better than most – not by any means perfect but to date not at all bad. They have a lots of balancing of classes/skills to polish for sure and perhaps downed state needs a little tweaking around the concepts but its far from a priority 1 issue except maybe to you.. that just your opinion and is not shared by all me thinks.

If you do not see any of those problems mentioned, I’d say you’re the minority here. Like I had said, a new game like Guild Wars 2 should be aiming to increase its player base more and more, with every patch coming out. The game is dying in that the player base is decreasing. There’s no denying this. When a game is losing its player base despite its young age, this is never a good sign.

Yes – the notion of being able to be ressed and jumping into the fight is a good idea. The execution is poor. This is where the poor boss mechanics are not balanced well in addressing this down state notion. Many bosses hit like feathers, but take 10 minutes to kill. When they do have a killing blow, they do it in a manner that can be dodged easily, or not at all (with almost no visual warning). Instead of the tank and spank mechanic, you now have a pure burning the boss down mechanic. To say one’s superior to another would hardly be a comparison, as the latter clearly fails in this regards – again, judged by the player base.

Now, by this point you may have noticed I keep going back to the player base and the number of players. You may argue that it isn’t important that the Guild Wars 2 is losing its players, or that its player base is not as strong as some of the other mmo’s out there. While you may tell yourself that you love the game, everything about it, and everyone else can go kitten themselves, that is what the game’s success is based on. Its player base. This brings in the investors. This brings in the income. This brings in the future content, the bread for the employees. I do hope ANet has big plans to bring back its player base, a better one than simply giving a 30% discount on their game.

Ok.. lets take your notion regarding the playerbase decline… where are you getting your information on this.. last time I checked box sales were healthy and that’s pretty much all we can go on .. unlike other MMO’s like SWTOR that release info to support their investor quarterlies… but there in lies a major difference because games like SWTOR (at least until recently) were a sub based revenue stream which relied on players coughing up each month on the dot… F2P or B2P models don’t rely on the same streams, they rely on a cash shop over the top of box sales and last I checked it still looked pretty healthy on those fronts as well.
Your perception of playerbase and its needs are purely opinion and largely unsubstantiated. However I agree GW2, like any other MMO after initial launch will loose players.. some buy, try and discard, other buy try and take a break others simply buy to play occasionally… all of which will show a playerbase that peaks and troughs continually but as all games, suffer natural wastage… some players simply don’t like the game and no matter what, wont come back.. others then jump to the next big thing then either come back or not.
GW2 is designed in such a way as to accommodate all comers in this respect because its what happens in game at the shop that is where they need to work their hardest.
Believe me I think this game is far from polished and has a lot of work to do to secure its place on the MMO ladder, but who said they are looking to oust the big boys at the top.. GW1 quite happily thrived in its own niche area, so will GW2 but yes there are things that need to be done and things that need to be promoted but playerbase numbers mean less in this type of game than a lot of the others out there… especially as its more than likely now entering that period of time after launch where it finds its niche / stable playerbase… and with every new content addition or seasonal delight those numbers will increase and fall again.

I was going to respond until I seen…

“The game is dying in that the player base is decreasing. There’s no denying this. When a game is losing its player base despite its young age, this is never a good sign. "

You started throwing in opinion as fact… Despite the evidence to the contrary.

DiogoSilva.7089:

GW1 had an healer, GW1 could have a tank in pve, but GW1 had a much higher diversity of roles than GW2 ever came close to be.

GW1 was also very nicely done with six classes. After it hit ten, though, the roles and classes got murky and messy. Frankly, Ritualists took over a lot of roles as “most effective” and Assassins played in a certain way walked through a lot of things. The core six classes, however, were very well done and could . . . in theory anyway, work in one role well and one other not so well but passably.

Meanwhile, GW2’s roles can be simplified to this:
GW2’s pve roles: Being a zerker zerger;

. . . yeah, I don’t think so. I do mostly fine not wearing Berserker gear other than one piece (I haven’t replaced it yet). Swarms of players is a natural extension of some other issues which arose in Guild Wars 2’s design, but it’s almost preferable than the alternative. (For reference, that would be “how do we make sure we don’t have players fighting over camps?” and the result opened up the option to just “zerg it”.)

… pve has too many mechanical or design problems that prevent role diversity in this game:

You say “problems”, I say “choices”. Or even “trade-offs”. Again, I disagree there’s only “one role” in PvE. It might seem that way in some instances (speed clear) but there are some definite differences between classes enough to suggest “roles” in a loose way.

1.3) Crowd control and disruption are pointless against the bosses where it most matters, due to their anti-control buff. What else is there to say here? This alone renders useless many traits, utilities and even entire weapon sets for pve content.

Actually, more to blame are the people not watching the buff and just spamming control skills so it resets before anyone can make use of the window to really make it useful. Defiant exists for a reason – to keep mobs from getting stun-locked. And in smaller group encounters, it works very well. In larger, it becomes a little crazy but that’s because . . . as I said, often people just cycle their control skills through spamming for extra DPS. Or they just don’t care.

1.4) Aoe and spash damage is king. You can make the highest bursts in this game with aoe (hundred blades, lightning hammer, guardian’s GS, etc). You can farm events far more effectively by spamming aoe. What’s the point of single target attacks, when aoe is better in almost any situation. Fortunately, we have official confirmation that AoE will be nerfed.

The point of single target attacks? Single target encounters, naturally. Simple answer.

1.5) Normal content is too easy, and GW2’s defensive mechanics place too much emphasis on skills and too little on stats…

Erm, hmm . . . no. This is not a good idea to begin working with. You see, once you decide to start having statistics matter more than skill, you get into that point where it’s stats and not skill which can give you the edge. You’re probably aware of the whole fuss over Ascended gear and it’s stat increase. Now picture if it was made even more important to people who track that, or important at all to those who don’t.

Please. No.

DiogoSilva.7089:

2. The world is beautiful, but mathematical and mechanical. Where is the story and the lore behind it?

Here’s a point where I’ll throw in some support. The lore probably needs to be punched up and shored up with books, historians, et cetera. The Priory exists to discover and record . . . why don’t we have some around Tyria who would be willing even to stand and explain things to players?

Seriously, when I explore beatiful places around Tyria, or intriguing places (mount maelstrom comes to mind), I’m always interested to know more about them, and to feel them, and how distinct they are from other places. It happens they usually aren’t, at all.

Mount Maelstrom is odd because you have a few parts of it which are nods to one of the more famous parts of old Tyria: Droknar’s Forge and the area around it. I say “odd” because there’s lore there, but unlike the Granite Citadel ruins it’s . . . not easy to get to due to the area being kinda-sorta in use by the Inquest.

2.1) Exploring maps becomes a repetitive, mathematical grind very early, very fast. There’s no difficulty most of the time, there’s no interesting storytelling to break the pace, there’s no distinct rewards to break the pace, there’s no diversity to… guess what, break the pace. And we leave them out without knowing much more about those maps than when we first entered them.

I’ve only had this experience a few times. A lot of times, I do remember areas I’ve completed 100% and do remember some of the more interesting ones. Some areas do blend together a bit, I agree. But I’m curious where you get “no diversity” . . . some of those early areas have a pretty diverse feel. And some in the middle also do . . . people can say what they will about Timberline Falls being a “dead zone” but it is actually pretty good to play around in. And Lornar’s Pass has a fair amount of variety as well from north to south. Kessex Hills has at least four distinct regions you can tick off without much effort.

On the flip side, I really have trouble liking the Iron Marches, Dredgehaunt Cliffs, and Brisban Wilderness. It’s not that I dislike them, I just don’t . . . find a use for them.

2.2) Seriously, why do all events play the same? I can understand that you can only do so much with the system, but I feel that not enough was done. There are times where the devs have tried to express the world’s lore through their events, but first, events are clearly not enough for that, and second, most of the events seem like filler.

Actually, a bigger issue is that people don’t pay attention to what’s actually happening in the events lore-wise. More interested in getting it done as quickly as possible.

Fortunately, devs are compensating with new story mechanics, like the new living world concept, but there’s still much to evolve.

The concept is nice, the events they added show some variety, but there really needs to be more of the “pushing things” rather than reusing the same type of events.

Also, please look into scaling on the gathering type events. I know you want to make it so all the active players can contribute but sometimes they pick up players for the scaling who aren’t doing anything . . . making it harder for the two people collecting :P

2.3) Meanwhile, the story in this game doesn’t even bothers to make us interested in the world.

The story just moves too fast sometimes, I agree. Really needed to have the pace varied more with some parts where there’s time to stop and absorb just how things are changing after the mid-point. There’s only one “lull” of sorts, and that’s the first chapter where you are inducted into the order of your choice.

http://www.ugo.com/games/guild-wars-2-attempts-to-change-the-mmo-genre

http://www.guildwars2hub.com/features/interviews/dynamic-events-dev-journal-colin-johanson

http://www.vg247.com/2011/08/24/guild-wars-2-to-feature-over-1500-dynamic-events/

The "end-game for the billionth time IS Dynamic Events. Do them or stay gone

Krosslite.1950:

The "end-game for the billionth time IS Dynamic Events. Do them or stay gone

Stop quoting marketing fluff and admit that there´s a pretty big elephant in the room.
And it´s called Fractal Dungeons.
That and the current FotM Dungeon to rake up the Gold IS the only “endgame”
(for the non PvP crowd!).
Dynamic Events are only used for the Daily grind.

I´m one of those “smell the pixels” types of players and after 8 months I still only bothered to get one of my 8 characters to 80.
The slots I excitedly bought in the beginning to experience all this game has to offer quickly became parking space for inventory mules.

I could now start into my own epic diatribe as to why, but it´s all been said all too often. And it would take away from the OP´s truly epic one.
And the Devs don´t seem to care anyway as they busy with creating even more temporary content that´s vanished and gone this time next month.

HawkMeister.4758:

Krosslite.1950:

The "end-game for the billionth time IS Dynamic Events. Do them or stay gone

Stop quoting marketing fluff and admit that there´s a pretty big elephant in the room.
And it´s called Fractal Dungeons.
That and the current FotM Dungeon to rake up the Gold IS the only “endgame”
(for the non PvP crowd!).
Dynamic Events are only used for the Daily grind.

I´m one of those “smell the pixels” types of players and after 8 months I still only bothered to get one of my 8 characters to 80.
The slots I excitedly bought in the beginning to experience all this game has to offer quickly became parking space for inventory mules.

I could now start into my own epic diatribe as to why, but it´s all been said all too often. And it would take away from the OP´s truly epic one.

I would love if Colin would just say “There is no endgame in GW2, we realized that (end-game) is the problem with mmo’s today. So we introduced living story content, so truly the game never ends, and there is nothing stat wise that you ever need to grind for.”

So that all the people complaining about end-game could just stop complaining and leave..

Why does there have to be an end to the game? Why does there have to be an end rank of gear, items etc? We should be playing the game for the changing content, not to reach the end. This isn’t a console game. People who try and “beat” the game are usually the ones bored and quitting at level 80.

And before people toss that term “progression”, progression does not mean you need to reach the end. It merely means your progressing through the game. Which hopefully the living stories and possible expansions will create.

Everytime I hear end-game, I think of the common argument about the universe. Is it never ending, or does it have an end? People who want an end to every movie, to every game, to everything, probably have some serious trouble even contemplating something could be infinite. But that’s a whole different subject,,.

HawkMeister.4758:

Krosslite.1950:

The "end-game for the billionth time IS Dynamic Events. Do them or stay gone

Stop quoting marketing fluff and admit that there´s a pretty big elephant in the room.
And it´s called Fractal Dungeons.
That and the current FotM Dungeon to rake up the Gold IS the only “endgame”
(for the non PvP crowd!).
Dynamic Events are only used for the Daily grind.

I´m one of those “smell the pixels” types of players and after 8 months I still only bothered to get one of my 8 characters to 80.
The slots I excitedly bought in the beginning to experience all this game has to offer quickly became parking space for inventory mules.

I could now start into my own epic diatribe as to why, but it´s all been said all too often. And it would take away from the OP´s truly epic one.
And the Devs don´t seem to care anyway as they busy with creating even more temporary content that´s vanished and gone this time next month.

So you have figured out all the different endings in all the DE webs in Orr. Wow I’m impressed that you could figure out all these ending.

Of the 1500+ DEs in this game most are in Orr and part of a DE web Meta-event chain.

So share with us all these wonderful toys you got for doing this.

Please… please share

I will stop “quoting marketing fluff” when someone gives me hard documentation that they have mapped out and. Ade a guide of how to get through all the DE web endings in Orr

another thread by someone that doesn’t get it.

The problem isn’t any “lack of trinity”, it’s that there is no hard content that requires roles beside beserker.

In any trinity game notice what happens when people outlevel “trinity” content? They can do it in any spec/class. Trinity doesn’t make content challenging (say hi to dark souls)

Krosslite.1950:

Of the 1500+ DEs in this game most are in Orr and part of a DE web Meta-event chain.

So share with us all these wonderful toys you got for doing this.

Please… please share

What, that you seem to be weirdly in love with one of the most annoying(till lately) “endgame” maps in any MMO I´ve seen or heard of?

I don´t feel like repeating all the points why you are wrong, DiogoSilva´s posts further up pretty much explained that already.

I just want to add for Geotherma´s (and possibly even your´s) enlightenment that, yes that “MMO that shall not be named” usually makes Endgame the standard carrot-on-a-stick Geargrind. But it really was a reason to actually employ special tactics and having to learn how to coordinate.

Up till just very lately the Zerg solved ALL problems in GW2, thus there is no real Endgame.

This is what people crying about the missing endgame mean. A reason to actually wear something else but Berserker gear.

Jae.5138:

I’ve seen in several older patch notes that the team is working to improve the PVP, both structured and World. The problem with launch, of course, is that the PVP system was seriously lackluster, and the team is obviously working to improve that.

The only way to improve sPvP is to bring in different game types and they don’t show any inclination to do that. Funny that they have compromised their principles in so many different ways but not on this.

DiogoSilva.7089:

2. The world is beautiful, but mathematical and mechanical. Where is the story and the lore behind it?

Seriously, when I explore beatiful places around Tyria, or intriguing places (mount maelstrom comes to mind), I’m always interested to know more about them, and to feel them, and how distinct they are from other places. It happens they usually aren’t, at all.

This is exactly why I can’t get world completion.

HawkMeister.4758:

Krosslite.1950:

Of the 1500+ DEs in this game most are in Orr and part of a DE web Meta-event chain.

So share with us all these wonderful toys you got for doing this.

Please… please share

What, that you seem to be weirdly in love with one of the most annoying(till lately) “endgame” maps in any MMO I’ve seen or heard of?

I don´t feel like repeating all the points why you are wrong, DiogoSilva´s posts further up pretty much explained that already.

I just want to add for Geotherma´s (and possibly even your´s) enlightenment that, yes that “MMO that shall not be named” usually makes Endgame the standard carrot-on-a-stick Geargrind. But it really was a reason to actually employ special tactics and having to learn how to coordinate.

Up till just very lately the Zerg solved ALL problems in GW2, thus there is no real Endgame.

This is what people crying about the missing endgame mean. A reason to actually wear something else but Berserker gear.

Ok to simplify your statement:

“I hate where most of the end game is. So you Krosslite are wrong since I refuse to go to where the endgame is there is none.”

Wow that really makes want to run home to mommy and cry.
[Please note the sarcasm]

EDIT: I get it now since an area, which people hate, is too challenging, which is why it is hated. People refuse to go there and so say there is no endgame because they refuse to do the endgame Wow no wonder i cant get a group to get all the goodies..
btw refusing to do content and then complaining about not doing it is really………. sad

Geotherma.2395:

HawkMeister.4758:

Krosslite.1950:

The "end-game for the billionth time IS Dynamic Events. Do them or stay gone

Stop quoting marketing fluff and admit that there´s a pretty big elephant in the room.
And it´s called Fractal Dungeons.
That and the current FotM Dungeon to rake up the Gold IS the only “endgame”
(for the non PvP crowd!).
Dynamic Events are only used for the Daily grind.

I´m one of those “smell the pixels” types of players and after 8 months I still only bothered to get one of my 8 characters to 80.
The slots I excitedly bought in the beginning to experience all this game has to offer quickly became parking space for inventory mules.

I could now start into my own epic diatribe as to why, but it´s all been said all too often. And it would take away from the OP´s truly epic one.

I would love if Colin would just say “There is no endgame in GW2, we realized that (end-game) is the problem with mmo’s today. So we introduced living story content, so truly the game never ends, and there is nothing stat wise that you ever need to grind for.”

So that all the people complaining about end-game could just stop complaining and leave..

Why does there have to be an end to the game? Why does there have to be an end rank of gear, items etc? We should be playing the game for the changing content, not to reach the end. This isn’t a console game. People who try and “beat” the game are usually the ones bored and quitting at level 80.

And before people toss that term “progression”, progression does not mean you need to reach the end. It merely means your progressing through the game. Which hopefully the living stories and possible expansions will create.

Everytime I hear end-game, I think of the common argument about the universe. Is it never ending, or does it have an end? People who want an end to every movie, to every game, to everything, probably have some serious trouble even contemplating something could be infinite. But that’s a whole different subject,,.

Nice idea, except the “changing content” that they have instituted over the last 3 or 4 months takes about 4 hours to complete, and it’s gone in a month. Then you have….the same game you’ve been playing for the last 7 months(which is good, but gets stale to some). If they could add the same amount of content every month that they did in the entire F&F story arc (four hours of playtime per month) I’d go with your idea. But I don’t see it happening.

Behellagh.1468:

I never understood the need for “an end game”. But I’m more of “it’s the journey” kind of adventurer/hero. When most people say “end game”, they mean grinding for elite loot running the same set of raids ad infinitum until they are purpled out.

Why bother with making all that beautiful scenery or complex stories and interesting quests if everyone simply blows by it to reach “the end game”? It’s an MMO trope that really needs to be retired or heavily curtailed.

As for the lack of the trinity, everyone in the army knows how to use a gun and do rudimentary medical triage. Doesn’t matter if you are in logistics, a tank jockey or a cook. You can specialize rolls as much as you want but when the crap hits the fan it’s all about shooting back and stem the bleeding. Trinity been around for a long time, as in the first paper RPGs with fighters, mages and clerics. But over time multi class characters became the rule of the day because players want to able to do more than just be the meat shield or the DPSer or the healer. The healer wants to kick butt too. The DPSer doesn’t just want to be the glass canon.

Shouldn’t a player want to able to day any of these rolls rather than being stuck forever and ever in that one role they picked at the moment of character creation?

because once you have been and seen these interesting stories and places I really dont want to see them again, why? because it was a faceroll, its not so much elite loot as it is seriously challenging content.

I never played WoW but it did take me a long time to finally finish FOW and UW in gw1 I kept going back and trying, not for the drops but because I enjoyed the difficulty.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

The problem is that Anet decided that you either love their game or you are wrong. Just look through the forums. Threads listing issues or talking about quitting due to boredom gets locked within a few hours. The journey is important but Guild Wars 2 dosen’t have anything to offer once you have reached 80. No, people don’t want the classic trinity back and they don’t ask for more instances to grind. (As if the current ones weren’t tedious enough!)

What people are looking forward are fun activities to do year round. Instead of spending time and resources on content that’s only avalaible for a month how about spending them on something fun AND permanent? I hate to bring WoW into this but I have to admit, it has gone a long way. Pet battles? Interesting PvE achivements? Millions of weapons, armours, pets, mounts to collect? Your own farm? Mini games like the Zombies vs. Plants daily in Hillsbrad? None of them require grinding or offer leet rewards yet they keep the people happy and playing.

Your activity in GW2 on level 80 shouldn’t consist solely of either rolling yet another alt or running (high level) fractal all day long because that’s the only dungeon people are still interested in. Or running around in massive zerg groups at WvW if you’re a PvP player.

Locking threads doesn’t mean Anet doesn’t care. I’m pretty sure most MMO official forums don’t allow leaving threads. They don’t serve any purpose. They don’t make the game stronger.

But there are other issues here. What if the people leaving and posting these things aren’t in the majority? What if what they want directly contradicts what other players want, who are still here?

It’s just not as simple as you make it out to be.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

I hate to bring WoW into this but I have to admit, it has gone a long way. Pet battles? Interesting PvE achivements? Millions of weapons, armours, pets, mounts to collect? Your own farm? Mini games like the Zombies vs. Plants daily in Hillsbrad? None of them require grinding or offer leet rewards yet they keep the people happy and playing.

I hate that you brought WoW into it too. Because this looks like Blizzard trying to put more games into their game as “mini games” just to get people to spend more time playing on WoW instead of, you know, those other games. Yes, they keep people happy and playing. So does Farmville, or half a dozen free browser flash games.

I’m playing one in another window right now, mostly to check it out since my brother shot me a link. Frankly, I don’t like what I see in it. And on my iPad I have enough other types of games meant to keep people playing regularly . . . but it’s mostly empty filler of time.

It’s why I like Guild Wars 2’s Daily Achievement system, and the Zaishen Challenges before it. They draw you into actively going out and doing things in the world.

. . . now I haven’t done my dailies in a week, but that’s largely due to my job being night shift and sucking all the energy out of me. And without many of my friends around to play and chatter with? It’s not as much fun. I have a lot of fun on my off days when I can make it on with them.

Also, the whole thing about locking or deleting “I’m leaving!!!!!!!!” threads? Because 9 times out of 10, the replies are either of these sentiments:

“Preach it, brother, this game sucks!”
or
“Bye!”

. . . there’s no discussion there, and it usually devolves into a nice little screaming match on the playground where both sides are not entirely correct, but not entirely wrong either.

Jae.5138:

the dropping sales of the game speaks for itself.

Jae.5138:

problems that are making the game lose more and more players.

Jae.5138:

The game is dying in that the player base is decreasing. There’s no denying this.

Jae.5138:

Guild Wars 2 is losing its players, or that its player base is not as strong as some of the other mmo’s out there.

What evidence are you drawing from?

This is a simple question, and since your assertions entail both that what you are saying is true and claim that the numbers “speak for themselves” and “there’s no denying” them, it should be very simple to answer.

Without this evidence, it is extremely difficult to find any of your arguments sound or worthy of attention. You didn’t begin from a position of stating that these described issues were not to your personal preference as a player and thus disappointing to players of your type; you went straight for the implications regarding ArenaNet’s bottom line.

This brings in the investors.

ArenaNet isn’t a publicly traded company, and I have no idea what you think they’d be counting on or expecting angel investors at this point for anything at all. If you meant to make some broader point about NCSoft’s stock and the future impact it might have then say so- but for the moment that has nothing to do with ArenaNet’s budget/revenue/the development of GW2 so far as we know.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

I hate to bring WoW into this but I have to admit, it has gone a long way. Pet battles? Interesting PvE achivements? Millions of weapons, armours, pets, mounts to collect? Your own farm? Mini games like the Zombies vs. Plants daily in Hillsbrad? None of them require grinding or offer leet rewards yet they keep the people happy and playing.

I hate that you brought WoW into it too. Because this looks like Blizzard trying to put more games into their game as “mini games” just to get people to spend more time playing on WoW instead of, you know, those other games. Yes, they keep people happy and playing. So does Farmville, or half a dozen free browser flash games.

I’m playing one in another window right now, mostly to check it out since my brother shot me a link. Frankly, I don’t like what I see in it. And on my iPad I have enough other types of games meant to keep people playing regularly . . . but it’s mostly empty filler of time.

It’s why I like Guild Wars 2’s Daily Achievement system, and the Zaishen Challenges before it. They draw you into actively going out and doing things in the world.

. . . now I haven’t done my dailies in a week, but that’s largely due to my job being night shift and sucking all the energy out of me. And without many of my friends around to play and chatter with? It’s not as much fun. I have a lot of fun on my off days when I can make it on with them.

Also, the whole thing about locking or deleting “I’m leaving!!!!!!!!” threads? Because 9 times out of 10, the replies are either of these sentiments:

“Preach it, brother, this game sucks!”
or
“Bye!”

. . . there’s no discussion there, and it usually devolves into a nice little screaming match on the playground where both sides are not entirely correct, but not entirely wrong either.

/shrug

I woudl like to find a game that I can stick with. If it means incorporating ideas from numerous other games then so be it. Yes, I could download a thousand little flash games that do the same thing but do I really want to? I can’t talk to my guild members during it and my scores on one flash game has no bearing on the others.

By having them in one game it allows me to do something other than grind [insert latest dungeon here] over and over while also communicating with friends, even doing it together with friends and getting small rewards that do not enchance my character but are either fun or can be used for other activities.

Ex.: Doing a fishing daily then receiving a pet crocodile which then can be used in pet battles, and if you win some pet battles you get a stone with which you can upgrade a pet of your choice, and if you upgraded it you can take on thougher world pet challenges, and earn a title that gives you a nice hat that also gives bonus to pet training…. and so and so forth… You get my point. All the little things are connected and can be done in your own pace and time.

Guild Wars 2 “new content” seems to consist of temporary events that require you to treat them as jobs and work on farming them till you can because they’ll be gone and with them gone the fun skins as well. Oh and of course fractal. Good luck if you are slow on upping your fractal level though, people are looking for 20+ fractal level so they can farm the fractal skins and upgraded equipment.

It’s underwhelming. A lack of activities beyond repeating the same dungeons and the same dynamic events. Daily achivement is basically giving a fancy name to a boring grind. Kill x of y mobs, do x of y events, craft x of y stuff, etc. Same with Zaishan that focuses on just events instead. How is that content?

Except that at 9 months, Guild Wars 2 has more content than WoW did at 9 months. Content takes time to make. WoW has had 8 years to make content.

Either you’re patient or you’re not. Either way, this game will continue.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

It’s quite easy being top dog when others have already paved the path for you.

That explains why so many other games achieved the same level of success this one has in the first three fiscal quarters of their existence! It all makes sense now.

;)

The game will continue, no doubt about that. The question is that with how many players will it continue?

I dunno.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

/shrug

I woudl like to find a game that I can stick with. If it means incorporating ideas from numerous other games then so be it. Yes, I could download a thousand little flash games that do the same thing but do I really want to? I can’t talk to my guild members during it and my scores on one flash game has no bearing on the others.

This is true, and it is a valid point.

However, I would like a game I buy to . . . you know, focus on being the game I bought and not a half-dozen other ones.

Guild Wars 2 “new content” seems to consist of temporary events that require you to treat them as jobs and work on farming them till you can because they’ll be gone and with them gone the fun skins as well.

Farm? Work? Sorry but I cannot agree on that score. I can agree on the temporary content bit, but seeing as how it seems a lot of the forums hated Frost and Flame, Wintersday, and Mad King’s Shadow (at least one of the three anyway) . . .

Temporary is the best thing about them, then.

Oh and of course fractal. Good luck if you are slow on upping your fractal level though, people are looking for 20+ fractal level so they can farm the fractal skins and upgraded equipment.

What upgraded equipment? Oh, right, the rings you can get with Laurels. Silly me

It’s underwhelming. A lack of activities beyond repeating the same dungeons and the same dynamic events. Daily achivement is basically giving a fancy name to a boring grind. Kill x of y mobs, do x of y events, craft x of y stuff, etc. Same with Zaishan that focuses on just events instead. How is that content?

How is “Farmville: Azeroth Edition” content?

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

Vayne.8563:

Except that at 9 months, Guild Wars 2 has more content than WoW did at 9 months. Content takes time to make. WoW has had 8 years to make content.

Either you’re patient or you’re not. Either way, this game will continue.

When WoW came out it didn’t have as many MMOS to take inspiration from. Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, Everquest and Lineage were the more well known and played games in the genre. The company had a lot to plan out when they started working on their product.

Guild Wars 2 came out in 2012. The developers were able to take notes not just from their previous (successful) game but from literally over a thousand MMOs that exists or have existed before. The bad, the good, the fun. Not to mention that some features were only made possible due to technological advancement. It’s quite easy being top dog when others have already paved the path for you.

The game will continue, no doubt about that. The question is that with how many players will it continue?

No one knows. But it seems to me there are far more players in game now then the were after the November patch when a lot of people walked.

Is the game losing popularity or gaining it?

No one really knows.

I think there should be two versions of gw2. One with the current profession structure and one with the good ol trinity, just re-use the world for guild wars 2 (trinity edition). Then you will get the best MMORPG on the market. I bet it will have a massive amount more players than the current version of guild wars 2.

Jordan.6157:

I think there should be two versions of gw2. One with the current profession structure and one with the good ol trinity, just re-use the world for guild wars 2 (trinity edition). Then you will get the best MMORPG on the market. I bet it will have a massive amount more players than the current version of guild wars 2.

I think you’re completely wrong about this, and given how much money it would take to try, we’ll never find out who’s right.