Guild Wars 2

So Protection will reduce condition damage by 33% and Retaliation will work against condition damage as well right? That’s the only way I can see justifying the Vulnerability changes. Seems insanely strong for classes like Engineer and Necromancer, even a Shatter Mesmer can hit 25 stacks of Vul.

I was thinking exactly the same. Specifically comparison of retaliation vs confusion.

This has to be true or else conditions will be godly. Sinister Engineer will be able to destroy anyone. Protection and Retaliation should 100% work with condis or else direct damage will be useless. Good catch.

Retaliation shouldn’t work with condition damage, as the attacker has zero control over whether they take the damage or not once the condition is applied. Direct attacks can be stopped as soon as retaliation pops if you want to avoid the damage.

Protection against conditions? Not sure that’s necessary since resistance 100% nullifies them for its duration. That said it seems much harder to get than protection.

Protection working on Conditions: Great Idea!

Retaliation procing on conditions OH GOD NO!

Your typical condition user is using many conditions. If every applied condition caused retaliation, then a condi user would be eating around 5-8 ticks of retaliation damage ON TOP of physical attacks.

Arioso.8519:

Protection working on Conditions: Great Idea!

Retaliation procing on conditions OH GOD NO!

Your typical condition user is using many conditions. If every applied condition caused retaliation, then a condi user would be eating around 5-8 ticks of retaliation damage ON TOP of physical attacks.

I’m sure they could figure out how to balance the damage.

dszteina.4058:

Palindrome.8904:

Retaliation shouldn’t work with condition damage, as the attacker has zero control over whether they take the damage or not once the condition is applied. Direct attacks can be stopped as soon as retaliation pops if you want to avoid the damage.

Protection against conditions? Not sure that’s necessary since resistance 100% nullifies them for its duration. That said it seems much harder to get than protection.

Then conditions shouldn’t work with Vulnerability. They already have lots of additional effects. Poisons reduce healing, torment does double damage when you move, confusion deals damage when you use any attack. Then there’s 2 more damaging conditions, burn and bleed which only require condition damage stats to do reasonable damage. Leaving two more stats to be used defensively. So super dire tank condition necro with 100% crit chance from traits and 25% vul nearly all the time is unaffected by protection and retaliation? Pleaaaase

As if condi bomb mesmer and engi couldn’t already deal totally BS amounts of damage with ridiculous mitigation.

I guess everyone’s building sinister now, right?

With these changes, the mobility changes, the trait revamp, the removal of stats from trait, they’ll literally have to re-balance the entire game.

Hard to believe that the entire game will be rebalanced successfully on the first try. Some classes are going to completely destroy other classes for a while I fear.

Hi guys, my name is Resistance. How are you today?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Resistance

Resistance is only available on Revenant.

Ragnarox.9601:

Resistance is only available on Revenant.

You should probably actually read the bottom of that page, and also bear in mind there are still quite a few specializations to be revealed.

If they put in a once per second tick on retaliation for pve/wvw, then I’d be fine with it applying to conditions. spvp you could leave it to tick multiple times on multiple targets as it’s not much of an issue when there is a maximum of 5 targets and more likely one or possibly two that you are hitting who might have retal up.

If there isn’t an internal cooldown then no way for wvw…

Retaliation already works against conditions. Every condition is applied by hitting someone, which procs retaliation. The only difference is that the hit that triggered the retaliation was small and most of its damage is spread over time, but that doesn’t matter, since retaliation doesn’t scale up with damage recieved.

Protection should work on conditions, to counter Vulnerability, unless Resistance becomes much more widespread and easier to apply.

dszteina.4058:

dszteina.4058:

Palindrome.8904:

Retaliation shouldn’t work with condition damage, as the attacker has zero control over whether they take the damage or not once the condition is applied. Direct attacks can be stopped as soon as retaliation pops if you want to avoid the damage.

Protection against conditions? Not sure that’s necessary since resistance 100% nullifies them for its duration. That said it seems much harder to get than protection.

Then conditions shouldn’t work with Vulnerability. They already have lots of additional effects. Poisons reduce healing, torment does double damage when you move, confusion deals damage when you use any attack. Then there’s 2 more damaging conditions, burn and bleed which only require condition damage stats to do reasonable damage. Leaving two more stats to be used defensively. So super dire tank condition necro with 100% crit chance from traits and 25% vul nearly all the time is unaffected by protection and retaliation? Pleaaaase

Retaliation affecting condis would insta-kill almost any condi build, or close to it. You have zero control over taking that damage or not.

Protection needs to work on conditions absolutely.

Retaliation will effect the skill that applied the condition to the same degree that it will function against a power build, so there should be no change to retal.

Linnael.1069:

Protection needs to work on conditions absolutely.

Retaliation will effect the skill that applied the condition to the same degree that it will function against a power build, so there should be no change to retal.

With the amount of condition clear in the game and access to Stability, having Protection also negate conditions would be absolute overkill. It would undermine everything they’re currently doing to buff conditions.

Some people here would really benefit from multidimensional thinking, as opposed to a single track.

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Ghotistyx.6942:

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Maybe google the definition of compensation. This would be balancing.

As for resistance. 1 skill granting resistance for a few seconds isnt much for counter play. I am willing to bet 100$ that if the new condi changes are released exactly how they described it will be nerfed/changed within 2 weeks.

Drakonath.7096:

Ghotistyx.6942:

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Maybe google the definition of compensation. This would be balancing.

As for resistance. 1 skill granting resistance for a few seconds isnt much for counter play. I am willing to bet 100$ that if the new condi changes are released exactly how they described it will be nerfed/changed within 2 weeks.

They ignore the PvP and WvW communities too much, so I’d say maybe six months on the next “feature pack” for a balance change.

Drakonath.7096:

Ghotistyx.6942:

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Maybe google the definition of compensation. This would be balancing.

As for resistance. 1 skill granting resistance for a few seconds isnt much for counter play. I am willing to bet 100$ that if the new condi changes are released exactly how they described it will be nerfed/changed within 2 weeks.

No amount of googling is going to change the fact you aren’t owed anything. Considering the way they’ve described condition changes is pretty broad, I’m also fairly sure it could be interpreted many different ways, and none of them could be the way Anet is working on.

WhiteCrow.5310:

Linnael.1069:

Protection needs to work on conditions absolutely.

Retaliation will effect the skill that applied the condition to the same degree that it will function against a power build, so there should be no change to retal.

With the amount of condition clear in the game and access to Stability, having Protection also negate conditions would be absolute overkill. It would undermine everything they’re currently doing to buff conditions.

Some people here would really benefit from multidimensional thinking, as opposed to a single track.

You would benefit from thinking about things less poorly.

First of all stability doesn’t do jack to conditions and is infinitely more effective when used against power builds. Power builds rely on setups to land big animations, condi builds just spray autoattacks and sigil procs. I don’t even know what you were trying to say here.

Condition spikes are going to go through the roof as multi-stack burning and poison come into play. If you had been looking at things from a few more dimensions you could have recognized how the stacking change immediately strips a massive amount of power away from condition removal. We are headed straight back into the full condi meta from a few months ago if nothing changes.

Ghotistyx.6942:

Drakonath.7096:

Ghotistyx.6942:

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Maybe google the definition of compensation. This would be balancing.

As for resistance. 1 skill granting resistance for a few seconds isnt much for counter play. I am willing to bet 100$ that if the new condi changes are released exactly how they described it will be nerfed/changed within 2 weeks.

No amount of googling is going to change the fact you aren’t owed anything. Considering the way they’ve described condition changes is pretty broad, I’m also fairly sure it could be interpreted many different ways, and none of them could be the way Anet is working on.

Would you be so kind as to locate where I stated I felt as if I was owed anything? Don’t just pull stuff out of your kitten and claim I am asking for compensation or feel like I am owed anything. I merely pointing out a potentially huge balancing issue with negating condition damage vs negating direct damage.

Back to being on topic. The fact conditions are now compatible with vulnerability and have no cap, while burning and poison are able to stack intensively means that we need more counter play for conditions. It’s pretty simple.

I made a statement. The way in which you responded made it clear you had apparently taken exception to my statement about compensation, though it was never directed at you to begin with. The obvious response on my end was to reaffirm that you (singular) and you (plural, for anyone else) are not owed anything based on mechanical changes.

Whether or not you actually believe this is yet to be determined, as you haven’t expressly stated one way or the other. I don’t really care too much if you implied it either. I just want to end that discussion before it begins.

Drakonath.7096:

Ghotistyx.6942:

Resistance is 100% condition damage reduction. Much more potent than 33% (also, thieves and warriors get access off the top of my head, so it’s not revenant only).

Also, vitality becomes that much more important. Shaman, magi, carrion, sentinel, valkyrie, all that.

Like someone else already mentioned, retal procs on attacks, conditions are applied by attacks.

Just because one thing changes didn’t mean you’re owed “compensation”

Maybe google the definition of compensation. This would be balancing.

As for resistance. 1 skill granting resistance for a few seconds isnt much for counter play. I am willing to bet 100$ that if the new condi changes are released exactly how they described it will be nerfed/changed within 2 weeks.

I can already see the new WvW meta: zerg focusing single target player. Gonna be epically frustrating. Once more, like the stability changes, it favors the larger groups to the sacrifice of the out-manned team.

Linnael.1069:

WhiteCrow.5310:

Linnael.1069:

Protection needs to work on conditions absolutely.

Retaliation will effect the skill that applied the condition to the same degree that it will function against a power build, so there should be no change to retal.

With the amount of condition clear in the game and access to Stability, having Protection also negate conditions would be absolute overkill. It would undermine everything they’re currently doing to buff conditions.

Some people here would really benefit from multidimensional thinking, as opposed to a single track.

You would benefit from thinking about things less poorly.

First of all stability doesn’t do jack to conditions and is infinitely more effective when used against power builds. Power builds rely on setups to land big animations, condi builds just spray autoattacks and sigil procs. I don’t even know what you were trying to say here.

Condition spikes are going to go through the roof as multi-stack burning and poison come into play. If you had been looking at things from a few more dimensions you could have recognized how the stacking change immediately strips a massive amount of power away from condition removal. We are headed straight back into the full condi meta from a few months ago if nothing changes.

Once again, you’re a prime example of the allstar reading comprehension of the average user on these forums. I mentioned Stability as an addition to the other defensive/negation mechanics in the game, of which we’re also getting another: Resistance. There is plenty of counterplay in the game, and it’s up to the player to properly use them. Throwing Protection into the condition mix is completely asinine and the result of fear mongering, which the rest of your post clearly illustrates.

Tbh im more concerned about Protection having such a pointlessly short duration..

Arioso.8519:

Protection working on Conditions: Great Idea!

Retaliation procing on conditions OH GOD NO!

Your typical condition user is using many conditions. If every applied condition caused retaliation, then a condi user would be eating around 5-8 ticks of retaliation damage ON TOP of physical attacks.

yeah for them to balance it, Retal would follow the same pattern with condi damage as it does with power for condi’s. Therefore, for many power specs it will likely scale to not much. So I dont see a reason why it shouldnt as long as it scaled with condi damage for condi’s.

Then the immediate hard counter to all condi specs, burn guard.