Guild Wars 2

Why does crafting even exist? While you are leveling, it is hard to maintain your crafting level relevant to your character level. Crafted gear can be sold, but that is only a slight offset to the cost of doing it in the first place. Ascended armor, which for all the effort to put into it including the time-gating mechanics, make it very punishing with minimal return of 5% over exotic gear. I have read developers’ stance that play should be about how you play and not your stats. But leveling crafting all seems to support gear grinding, not the philosophy of playing your character.

It’s not a grind if you don’t have to do it. I’ve played many characters without crafting gear for them- I just used gear that dropped for me (and swapped when I found something with better stats), bought from vendors/renowned heart merchants and bought stuff from the TP.

In no way are you forced to craft for you character, in fact, it’s the more expensive route.

That being said, my first few characters I made I crafted almost everything on them. I didn’t find it difficult at all to maintain gear-level/crafting level relevant to my character. At every 10 levels I would do another 50 crafting levels, which meant that I was crafting stuff I could use each time. I sold the left-over gear I made, or salvaged if that was more profitable/useful for me.

I found crafting fun, and it adds another dimension to game play. Overall it gives players access to many account bound/time gated items in a more interesting way than just speaking to a merchankittens in with gathering, which in my opinion is one of the highlights of exploring as you are further interacting with your environment.

For me, there was no grind behind it as I didn’t have to tediously repeat certain tasks to be able to craft the gear I wanted. All the materials I needed dropped for me whilst doing events and exploring.

So, if you believe that crafting isn’t a positive experience/is a grind, what do you propose as a change or solution?

Crimson Clouds.4853:

It’s not a grind if you don’t have to do it. I’ve played many characters without crafting gear for them- I just used gear that dropped for me (and swapped when I found something with better stats), bought from vendors/renowned heart merchants and bought stuff from the TP.

In no way are you forced to craft for you character, in fact, it’s the more expensive route.

That being said, my first few characters I made I crafted almost everything on them. I didn’t find it difficult at all to maintain gear-level/crafting level relevant to my character. At every 10 levels I would do another 50 crafting levels, which meant that I was crafting stuff I could use each time. I sold the left-over gear I made, or salvaged if that was more profitable/useful for me.

I found crafting fun, and it adds another dimension to game play. Overall it gives players access to many account bound/time gated items in a more interesting way than just speaking to a merchankittens in with gathering, which in my opinion is one of the highlights of exploring as you are further interacting with your environment.

For me, there was no grind behind it as I didn’t have to tediously repeat certain tasks to be able to craft the gear I wanted. All the materials I needed dropped for me whilst doing events and exploring.

So, if you believe that crafting isn’t a positive experience/is a grind, what do you propose as a change or solution?

You cant get ascended armor without crafting. Unless you magically get the set you want dropped from npcs, anyway.

Effectively that means you cant have infusions on your armor without crafting, along with the minor stat increases.

Crafting was most certainly useful in the beginning of the game when it wasn’t so easy to obtain exotic equipment. It was also important for Legendary crafting if your intention was to use a precourser for such.

It’s established that the reasons for getting ascended equipment are either Fractals for the agony resistance you get more economically, or for WvW where 5% over other players will give you an edge.

Envy.1679:

You cant get ascended armor without crafting.

Effectively that means you cant have infusions on your armor without crafting, along with the minor stat increases.

Well you can, but not particularly effectively or in a guaranteed fashion.

You can get two (?) pieces of ascended armour through achievements, and then the rest you have to get lucky with drops (but if you run fractals often enough you should be ok). You can even change the stats in the forge without any crafting if you just buy the insignias you want from TP.

But anyhow, it was imperative that ascended armour had a guaranteed method of obtaining it (i.e. through crafting). If there wasn’t, the amount of complaints would be ridiculous- areas of the game would be completely and indefinitely locked out for the more unlucky people.

Why does PvP exist? I can do PvP for six hours straight, yet I have nothing to show for it afterwards.

Why does jumping puzzles exist? They are very hard to find, and even harer to do. Just a waste of time.

Why does heart events exist? They don’t give all that much XP, and dynamic events are far more fun anyway.

Why do we have to harvest our crafting materials? Just a waste of time. We could simply buy the stuff we want in the trading post, or even get it for free to save time.

Why do we have dyes? How often do you bother dye your clothes when leveling? Or even at max level?

Why do we have several playable races? They don’t do anything different other than a couple of racial skills no one uses, and a quick, personal story that all leads up to the same point.

Why do… well, you get the idea. Different people like different things. I like crafting to give my alts good stuff, and to see what I can learn to create. For me, the crafting is a lot of fun. I’ll gladly do a lot of crafting just to enjoy myself.

Regarding making a profit through crafting: if it was ever profitable to buy some items, craft something, and then sell it on for a profit, then we would all be doing it; we would all be doing it until the activity is done so much that the prices of the items are affected and it stop being profitable.

Bob F It.5701:

Regarding making a profit through crafting: if it was ever profitable to buy some items, craft something, and then sell it on for a profit, then we would all be doing it; we would all be doing it until the activity is done so much that the prices of the items are affected and it stop being profitable.

It is profitable to craft quite a few items currently, namely anything that is time-gated or require an account-bound recipe.

There are a few others that I have heard of, but I don’t think that they are the things that are constantly profitable, but become so when their material prices dip.

Some like to craft, sell stuff and make money.
Some like to buy the stuff they need/want from people who craft.

I’d say that’s a win-win.

I have master craftsman and its nothing but a means to gouge the players wallet when the map is as stingy with mats as is.

Profit? Good luck with that when the TP drives down the sell price below the cost of what the mats are selling for. In fact this is the stingiest game I’ve ever played concerning crafters.

I did it because I hate to level and I wanted the level boost along with the achievement. Beyond that it has been a money pit in favor of the game, not the player.

Kamara.4187:

I have master craftsman and its nothing but a means to gouge the players wallet when the map is as stingy with mats as is.

Profit? Good luck with that when the TP drives down the sell price below the cost of what the mats are selling for. In fact this is the stingiest game I’ve ever played concerning crafters.

I did it because I hate to level and I wanted the level boost along with the achievement. Beyond that it has been a money pit in favor of the game, not the player.

I make a hefty profit from crafting every day, of course not all items will be profitable. If you’re looking to make money you have to find the items that are highest in demand.

There are a few reasons why GW2’s crafting isn’t as lucrative as it is in other games, mostly because of A-net’s ethos to make the game fair and inclusive for all players. Here are what other games have in place to make crafting riskier, but more lucrative for some:

- In other games, players have to “fight” to get to a material node before other players can harvest them. Luckily, in GW2, everybody has equal rights to nodes on maps.

-More difficulty to raise crafting level. If it is incredibly costly for players to get to a high crafting level, then they can sell high level crafted gear to other players for a profit as there is a captive audience. Equally, if recipes aren’t present by default, or are particular costly or difficult to get, we’ll see a similar outcome.

-Materials spread in elite areas. Some games are designed so that materials used to craft particular gear is very difficult to obtain in themselves, or only drop from particular mobs. In GW2, there aren’t really many mob-specific drops (all I can think of is stuff that drops from aetherblades and karka shells, for instance). Here it isn’t difficult to obtain the things you need as a lot of the ingredients are very generic.

-Failed crafting/critical crafting. In a few games, there’s a random mechanic where it is possible to not receive any item when gathering or crafting. You also lose out on the materials if you fail to craft the item. This means that people are more likely to pay a premium when buying the item from another person, just to avoid massively losing out. (Very much like using the mystic forge to make a precursor).

-Crafted armour having better stats than any armour that drops.

Just my opinion here- sure, it would be nice if crafting felt more meaningful in GW2. However, think about the consequences of such mechanics, listed above. It means people are losing out- that the game becomes a grind or difficult for the majority, whilst a few people are making a huge profit. We already have areas of crafting affected by these mechanics (e.g. ascended crafting being time and level gated, and also having better stats), but luckily this only affects a small area of crafting instead of its entirety.

It’s cheaper to make a few particular items than to buy it yourself, typically revolving around consumables.

I could just sell my mithril ore and t5 dust and buy hardened sharpening stones, or I can just make them myself without having to go through the tp’s 15% if I sold the ore and such, having to wait on buy/sell orders.

I am not barking at the people that craft for fun, nor am I barking at people who want ascended for fractals or WvW. Would anyone agree with me that crafting could be more personalized? Meaning it has something to show for towards your character’s development besides just in case you want that little extra icing on the cake for elite end game content?

Crafting is also great if you tend to experiment around with new builds and gear combinations and you have an okay collection of mats. You can also make runes and bags as well. Crafting isn’t that great if you’re new and don’t have a lot of mats saved up but later on, it will save you a good deal of $ if you’re able to craft, say, 3/6 Ranger runes or some pieces of exotic armor and buy the rest. You could also just craft high level items and sell them if you have the mats already and it’ll be profitable.

Will.8056:

I am not barking at the people that craft for fun, nor am I barking at people who want ascended for fractals or WvW. Would anyone agree with me that crafting could be more personalized? Meaning it has something to show for towards your character’s development besides just in case you want that little extra icing on the cake for elite end game content?

Yes and no.

It would have to be something purely cosmetic as we’ve seen that A-net tries to avoid directly benefiting one group of people more than another. It is a “play how you want, do what you want” game, so putting something significant in to crafting would be a step in the wrong direction.

But we already have some aesthetic things- the crafting backpieces, for example, are an excellent step in the right direction. Mawdrey also went hand-in-hand with crafting- not totally sure if crafting was necessary for her, but at least very useful.

We can just have our fingers crossed that in HoT there will be more crafting-only account bound skins

ArchonWing.9480:

It’s cheaper to make a few particular items than to buy it yourself, typically revolving around consumables.

I could just sell my mithril ore and t5 dust and buy hardened sharpening stones, or I can just make them myself without having to go through the tp’s 15% if I sold the ore and such, having to wait on buy/sell orders.

I’ll agree with this in some cases, but in most I’ve found that the mats sell for more over all than an actual crafted product. Which can be attributed to the scarcity of/from nodes.

Kamara.4187:

ArchonWing.9480:

It’s cheaper to make a few particular items than to buy it yourself, typically revolving around consumables.

I could just sell my mithril ore and t5 dust and buy hardened sharpening stones, or I can just make them myself without having to go through the tp’s 15% if I sold the ore and such, having to wait on buy/sell orders.

I’ll agree with this in some cases, but in most I’ve found that the mats sell for more over all than an actual crafted product.

Yep, that is certainly the case with a lot of things. There is higher demand for the materials than the crafted item, hence the slightly higher price.

Even with the raw materials and the first refined step, there can be a price discrepancy- sometimes the raw material overall is more expensive because refining it can give useful crafting exp.

Kamara.4187:

ArchonWing.9480:

It’s cheaper to make a few particular items than to buy it yourself, typically revolving around consumables.

I could just sell my mithril ore and t5 dust and buy hardened sharpening stones, or I can just make them myself without having to go through the tp’s 15% if I sold the ore and such, having to wait on buy/sell orders.

I’ll agree with this in some cases, but in most I’ve found that the mats sell for more over all than an actual crafted product. Which can be attributed to the scarcity of/from nodes.

Not gonna dispute that; you certainly aren’t going to make much profit in most scenarios, but there’s definitely a few niche items here and there. In my case, mithril is just that common.

A lot of chef stuff tends to be better in that regards as well.

I wish crafting had more purpose aside from end game gears.

Would be great if they added in some unique skins that can’t be sold once crafted. Would give some initiative to doing it. Especially if there was 1 unique skin per crafting tier.

The point of crafting is that people would have complained if there wasn’t a crafting system, since most mmos have one.

It is also a great money sink for the economy, and a way for someone to buy levels without anet getting yelled at for literally selling levels.

From the player perspective: fancy backpacks and the fastest, but most expensive, route to full ascended.

As Morrow points out, the point of crafting is to make that bear taxidermy backpack. Someday I might make ascended armor, but today I have a silly bear head knapsack. My 80 wears light armor and I’ll probably delete my ranger when I get bored of it. But I have a bear taxidermy backpack and that was enough to get me to level leatherworking.

Ascended armor really only has one major value, which is having infusion slots that you absolutely need to run high level fractals.

And yea, I agree, the standard crafting system in MMOs where you’re just milling out garbage items nobody wants for the sole purpose of eventually building a single set of endgame items for yourself that nobody else is allowed to wear is really tiresome. It just has nothing to do with being a crafter, it’s just grind.

I have to agree, it’s a grind, especially when the recipes must be looked up on the net and some of them aren’t easily found even then.

We don’t get mats for the levels we need – not even for the levels we are – left with tens of thousands of spikes, and other useless materials that gain us nothing and wouldn’t even be “found” if we were killing enemies while gathering.

Drops for any many kinds of materials just don’t fit what we are “expected” to be able to accomplish – and therein lies the truth, Anet doesn’t want you to be able to craft easily – otherwise their little cash store would have many fewer people buying gold to try to get to the magic 500 to make what costs even more – and more gold.

The drops are abysmal – regardless of whether you are crafting to 400 or need to craft to 500 for ascended materials.

To quote another poster, MMO’s are just a broad list of things to do. Crafting is one of them.

Will.8056:

I am not barking at the people that craft for fun, nor am I barking at people who want ascended for fractals or WvW. Would anyone agree with me that crafting could be more personalized? Meaning it has something to show for towards your character’s development besides just in case you want that little extra icing on the cake for elite end game content?

Such as?

Personalized anything gets thrown out the window the moment you realize there are going to be hundreds of thousands of people with the exact same thing.

So you can level alts, mass produce rares for ectos and exotics for dark matters, and craft ascended gear at the cost of a lot of time and gold.

creafting ascended gear, getting pretty rich… thats crafting for… +200g every single week
XD

Crafting is really useful for me actually, but that’s because I’m running a hardcore character that isn’t allowed to make weapon, armor, rune, sigil or jewelry purchases. This is great fun for me, but not so much for anyone playing the game normally.

I think that the underlying problem is that players can sell base crafting materials to each other.

Currently, if you want a set of exotics, and have the materials, you can sell the mats, and buy the equipment AND STILL MAKE PROFIT

Will.8056:

Why does crafting even exist?

Crafting is an excuse for that person with the super banana to annoy you while you get 15-20 free adventure levels until that other person covers the crafting station with their bowbear and also because reasons….

If there was no crafting there would be no purpose for gathering and the gathering nodes which is something a lot of people like to do in the game.

Basically it’s not ONLY about the crafting aspect it’s about the economy as well as having other things in the game to do (crafting/gathering).

I get what you are saying about not being able to keep your craft levels the same as your char level as I have had that issue too. Even now after sending 10 chars through world complete and gathering everything along the way I still do not have all crafts maxed out yet.

I don’t see this as a bad thing tho as it means gathering is still something worthwhile for me to do and I can still get to continue crafting. For myself I like to unlock every recipe in the discovery panel for each craft. So even if I max out a craft I don’t consider it truly done until I have all the discovery’s done. In a way this makes it a game within itself for me and can help break up the gameplay some instead of just running around killing things all day long. It’s things like this that this game needs MORE of imo.

Really just ascended and some exotics. You can turn a profit on some stuff but due to the ease of crafting it’s usually a saturated market.

While there is meaning in crafting, it has much less effect in GW2 than in other games.