Guild Wars 2

What a baffling change to the staff, it was not broken, don’t fix it. now you made it completely useless…

Did anyone use Wave of Wrath for any reason but as a lootstick?

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Did anyone use Wave of Wrath for any reason but as a lootstick?

I only used mine AS a lootstick in the Labyrinth and the Leather Farm.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Did anyone use Wave of Wrath for any reason but as a lootstick?

What other purpose could it possibly serve?

They nerfed the aa range while they buffed the rest of the weapon….. Hmmm yep cant have that take back the buffs and gimme longer aa…

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

I will miss my lootstick.

I will not miss the fact that a weapon got rebalanced which was called “lootstick”.

The skill as it was, was useless except for taging. Not sure the change makes the skill more usable or useful, it does address the disparity between guardian tagging and all the other classes ingame though.

It’s more than a loot stick…

Its a support weapon with an AA that allows you to get rewards like everyone else who decide to run loot kittening glass cannons.

I support this simply because the change serves absolutely no purpose. No one worth their opinion asked for this.

Oh dear… Could it be guardians now actually work for their loot like the rest of us? HURRAY for the nerf! #lazinessshouldneverwin

zell.3051:

Oh dear… Could it be guardians now actually work for their loot like the rest of us? HURRAY for the nerf! #lazinessshouldneverwin

Nope, hah. We have free access to low cooldown ranged symbols. We can still tag everything with minimal effort.

The fact this could happen at all, with no discussion of how ‘unfair’ staff was is indicative of the reason I just log in once a week.

So far as I know Not One Guard in the guard forum has welcomed this strange change.

I mean seriously, the consensus is that Guard Staff is now effectively useless as a weapon.

We really need a red name explanation here.

Well, it is useless as a weapon. The only thing I use it for is a speed boost on my key runner and as a loot stick.

Which means not that the nerf needs to be reversed but that the Guardian staff needs to be reworked.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Well, it is useless as a weapon. The only thing I use it for is a speed boost on my key runner and as a loot stick.

Which means not that the nerf needs to be reversed but that the Guardian staff needs to be reworked.

Useless?

Only the most common weapon in the game on the most common and meta class (not even HoT, vanilla guard). You’re not even allowed to carry anything but the staff. It’s the primary weapon.

If you play WvW that is.

Since EU was down primetime yesterday we cant really tell the effect but I can tell you… tonights gonna be fun. Oh the rage. The rage of it all.

But granted, I’m guessing this change will only mean that instead of 60/40 guards/necros we will see that inverted… meaning the condi nerf did nothing. Just stack more necros.

Wait did they finally nerf deathly chill so that we can actually use something other than necros?

Logs on to check

Noooooooope.

Lawl.

Dawdler.8521:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Well, it is useless as a weapon. The only thing I use it for is a speed boost on my key runner and as a loot stick.

Which means not that the nerf needs to be reversed but that the Guardian staff needs to be reworked.

Useless?

Only the most common weapon in the game on the most common and meta class (not even HoT, vanilla guard). You’re not even allowed to carry anything but the staff. It’s the primary weapon.

If you play WvW that is.

Since EU was down primetime yesterday we cant really tell the effect but I can tell you… tonights gonna be fun. Oh the rage. The rage of it all.

But granted, I’m guessing this change will only mean that instead of 60/40 guards/necros we will see that inverted… meaning the condi nerf did nothing. Just stack more necros.

Wait did they finally nerf deathly chill so that we can actually use something other than necros?

Logs on to check

Noooooooope.

Lawl.

No one plays WvW. Or at least that’s what they say on the WvW forums. Frequently. ^^

What’s WvW? Is that a misspelling of WOW?

The changes to the Guardian Staff were perhaps the most perplexing of the lot. The Staff was never a strong weapon. But, I almost always had one equipped in the open world and actually felt good about it. I felt good about playing my Guardian with a staff. With this change I will be angry when playing my Guardian with a staff. I guess it’s kindest and most charitable to assume that Anet made these changes on purpose, with the idea that they were improving something and not just to make players angry.

Happy with the change. Too bad that took so long to fix it. No more medicore midline staff camper guard gets rewarded and no more cheesing hills lord room wall to damage people in lords room. Guardians should focus on actual guardian work like cleansing allies, giving stability/boons, CC’s instead mashing only autoattack.

eozturk.7205:

Happy with the change. Too bad that took so long to fix it. No more medicore midline staff camper guard gets rewarded and no more cheesing hills lord room wall to damage people in lords room. Guardians should focus on actual guardian work like cleansing allies, giving stability/boons, CC’s instead mashing only autoattack.

Can still hit through gates and through walls. Point moot.

eozturk.7205:

Happy with the change. Too bad that took so long to fix it. No more medicore midline staff camper guard gets rewarded and no more cheesing hills lord room wall to damage people in lords room. Guardians should focus on actual guardian work like cleansing allies, giving stability/boons, CC’s instead mashing only autoattack.

Well you go ahead and try it and then don’t come posting about how playing support sucks cause no kills and no loot. If guards up and say forget playing support, yep good luck to all the “skilled” zerglings crying about no frontliners.

The 600 range…on a ranged weapon was clearly game breaking. The risen and centaur mobs were tired of getting abused by guardians and threatened a boycott if this change wasn’t made.

Glad they finally nerfed that lootstick. For the longest of times people had to watch braindead guardians collect loot and rack up wxp by spamming 1. Meanwhile mesmers did just as much supporting and didn’t get anything in return.
10/10 would play mesmer in WvW again.

I don’t really mind the range nerf…. And I main guard.
It might be because I always saw the weapon as a support weapon. Which it now may do even better… though Im unsure how much it matters in comparison to other professions.

I wouldnt mind it getting a more physical looking staff swipe animation for it though. Never lliked wave of wrath.

Well up the damage with 100% since range was reduced with 100% and its good to go.

FrizzFreston.5290:

I don’t really mind the range nerf…. And I main guard.
It might be because I always saw the weapon as a support weapon. Which it now may do even better… though Im unsure how much it matters in comparison to other professions.

I wouldnt mind it getting a more physical looking staff swipe animation for it though. Never lliked wave of wrath.

I don’t think you main guard. The staff isn’t a support weapon. Mace / shield or focus is. The staff is the only midrange damage weapon. The auto attack is the only real damage the weapon does. The orb is meh, and reserved for healing anyway. The symbol does poor aoe damage. That leaves the auto attack. For 5 years this has been the case and has never been an issue. It’s designed to be 600 range because it hits 5 enemies. That means that on average, you are doing the same damage as the auto attack on the GS or hammer which only hits 3. But with 300 range, one will now, probably not hit 5 targets, so the damage is much less. The difference between 300 and 180 is pretty neglegable, especially considering all the movement in the game.

With the staff, we sacrifice having higher burst damage for the other abilities, but if relegated to 300 range, it’s probably better to go with a true melee weapon which will do more dps. And if we want to do some support, a one hand melee with a shield or focus.

And to all you people complaining about a loot stick, I get just as much using a staff on my necro, or a tempest, or thief with a shortbow, etc. If you’re gonna farm stuff, there are some builds and classes that are better at it. Don’t be angry that you aren’t getting as much stuff on a pistol thief, or whatever.

The staff is now totally useless.

Spurnshadow.3678:

FrizzFreston.5290:

I don’t really mind the range nerf…. And I main guard.
It might be because I always saw the weapon as a support weapon. Which it now may do even better… though Im unsure how much it matters in comparison to other professions.

I wouldnt mind it getting a more physical looking staff swipe animation for it though. Never lliked wave of wrath.

I don’t think you main guard. The staff isn’t a support weapon. Mace / shield or focus is. The staff is the only midrange damage weapon. The auto attack is the only real damage the weapon does. The orb is meh, and reserved for healing anyway. The symbol does poor aoe damage. That leaves the auto attack. For 5 years this has been the case and has never been an issue. It’s designed to be 600 range because it hits 5 enemies. That means that on average, you are doing the same damage as the auto attack on the GS or hammer which only hits 3. But with 300 range, one will now, probably not hit 5 targets, so the damage is much less. The difference between 300 and 180 is pretty neglegable, especially considering all the movement in the game.

With the staff, we sacrifice having higher burst damage for the other abilities, but if relegated to 300 range, it’s probably better to go with a true melee weapon which will do more dps. And if we want to do some support, a one hand melee with a shield or focus.

And to all you people complaining about a loot stick, I get just as much using a staff on my necro, or a tempest, or thief with a shortbow, etc. If you’re gonna farm stuff, there are some builds and classes that are better at it. Don’t be angry that you aren’t getting as much stuff on a pistol thief, or whatever.

The staff is now totally useless.

Scepter is the midrange weapon for guardians and staff was supposed to be support.

Spurnshadow.3678:

FrizzFreston.5290:

I don’t really mind the range nerf…. And I main guard.
It might be because I always saw the weapon as a support weapon. Which it now may do even better… though Im unsure how much it matters in comparison to other professions.

I wouldnt mind it getting a more physical looking staff swipe animation for it though. Never lliked wave of wrath.

I don’t think you main guard. The staff isn’t a support weapon. Mace / shield or focus is. The staff is the only midrange damage weapon. The auto attack is the only real damage the weapon does. The orb is meh, and reserved for healing anyway. The symbol does poor aoe damage. That leaves the auto attack. For 5 years this has been the case and has never been an issue. It’s designed to be 600 range because it hits 5 enemies. That means that on average, you are doing the same damage as the auto attack on the GS or hammer which only hits 3. But with 300 range, one will now, probably not hit 5 targets, so the damage is much less. The difference between 300 and 180 is pretty neglegable, especially considering all the movement in the game.

With the staff, we sacrifice having higher burst damage for the other abilities, but if relegated to 300 range, it’s probably better to go with a true melee weapon which will do more dps. And if we want to do some support, a one hand melee with a shield or focus.

And to all you people complaining about a loot stick, I get just as much using a staff on my necro, or a tempest, or thief with a shortbow, etc. If you’re gonna farm stuff, there are some builds and classes that are better at it. Don’t be angry that you aren’t getting as much stuff on a pistol thief, or whatever.

The staff is now totally useless.

You lost me at staff is not a support weapon.
/facepalm.

Staff 2 heals, staff 3 symbol does swiftness and heals if traited. Staff 4 pulses might and healed at the end (and now heals more) staff 5 does no damage and holds enemies back. How is it not a support weapon. the weapon as a whole screams support.

Only the auto attack is offensive oriented. I know the majority of open world players just spam 1, so I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that guard staff is in the players mind only about spamming 1.

Focus support? Yeah the skill 4 bounces and blind removes a condition with some regeneration. but skill 5 is entirely self protective Its more of a tanking offhand. Shield is more of a support offhand.

That said, I said that I don’t mind the change only because there are better options for damage, which I use when I want to do damage. I wouldnt use staff for its damage ever and I never have in 5 years.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

true, a change was required, but still 300… but now is a (almost melee)range no damage weapon xD, in a weapon that is suposed to be used as group support….

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

true, a change was required, but still 300… but now is a (almost melee)range no damage weapon xD, in a weapon that is suposed to be used as group support….

Do you need staff 1 skill for group support? Can you have a different, damage weapon for swap to do damage when needed?

Psyches.9487:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Did anyone use Wave of Wrath for any reason but as a lootstick?

What other purpose could it possibly serve?

Staff Guardian is, err, was the built for WvW to play! Now I very likely will have to put resources into changing all the WvW gear again. <—where is an angry smiley when you need one?

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

true, a change was required, but still 300… but now is a (almost melee)range no damage weapon xD, in a weapon that is suposed to be used as group support….

Do you need staff 1 skill for group support? Can you have a different, damage weapon for swap to do damage when needed?

They buffed mace for that swap imo, the strange thing is staff 1 needed another kind of change besides increase the tag arc with the trade off of the short range, its only about the contradiction that staff 1 ended from the rest of the weapon, its an illogical changes.

Changes just for a change w/o a reason and those kind of changes are bad changes, since isn’t clever nor productive…

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

true, a change was required, but still 300… but now is a (almost melee)range no damage weapon xD, in a weapon that is suposed to be used as group support….

Do you need staff 1 skill for group support? Can you have a different, damage weapon for swap to do damage when needed?

They buffed mace for that swap imo, the strange thing is staff 1 needed another kind of change besides increase the tag arc with the trade off of the short range, its only about the contradiction that staff 1 ended from the rest of the weapon, its an illogical changes.

Changes just for a change w/o a reason and those kind of changes are bad changes, since isn’t clever nor productive…

Presumably all these changes made today are to help the new elite specs each have their niche.
Perhaps the best thing is to wait and see how the Firebrand works out. That may be the new support Guardian.

As a healer that hasn’t been my experience at all. They buffed the healing on this weapon which frankly needed to happen.

They filled the holes in the healing abilities that I always thought were strange.

Now I’m running a staff/bowman healer with a couple of spirit weapons. It’s really nice.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Aeolus.3615:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Pretty much.

Now you know the Devs didn’t design the Guardian staff to be a lootstick for people to get dat phat loot while in a Zerg. It was supposed to be an actual weapon skill. The only thing surprising is it took them so long to nerf it.

true, a change was required, but still 300… but now is a (almost melee)range no damage weapon xD, in a weapon that is suposed to be used as group support….

Do you need staff 1 skill for group support? Can you have a different, damage weapon for swap to do damage when needed?

They buffed mace for that swap imo, the strange thing is staff 1 needed another kind of change besides increase the tag arc with the trade off of the short range, its only about the contradiction that staff 1 ended from the rest of the weapon, its an illogical changes.

Changes just for a change w/o a reason and those kind of changes are bad changes, since isn’t clever nor productive…

Presumably all these changes made today are to help the new elite specs each have their niche.
Perhaps the best thing is to wait and see how the Firebrand works out. That may be the new support Guardian.

That is what i am a bit worried, that ANet enforces firebrand and makes everything older obsolete, and changes are only towards FB, putting DH at core level just like core was to DH… i dont trust ANet class progression it feels not actually what they say it is…

Still to make firebrand or DH better Anet would have to swap /change a few traits wich is what bites me…..What i feel is that ANet is making only firebrand meta(new kids toy that is the only solution viable).

I fear they want to make stuff outside FB much less viable, DH inclueded…they dont tweak much DH so people play with a placebo but it wont be the an equivalent choice, which is what IMO horizontal progression is, what looks like, it is a vertical progression masked with “buy new traitline” to be viable as horizontal progression, they swapped the vertical model of armor stat and changed that as to power creep or performance gap on new skills intead of stats and called it horizontal to trick players.

There are a few change that in my view would open to more choice and more trait combinations, for FB and DH.

PS: firebrand is the new support guard, just check mantra of lore alone…. that looks like *the equivalent to traited shouts with trooper runes alone in one skill….
its a 2 + 2 condi removal with few boons plus weyghlty terms trait its a cc with mantras low cd.

Still better than 3/4rdian coming as a new elite spec.

JakHammer.7094:

The fact this could happen at all, with no discussion of how ‘unfair’ staff was is indicative of the reason I just log in once a week.

So far as I know Not One Guard in the guard forum has welcomed this strange change.

I mean seriously, the consensus is that Guard Staff is now effectively useless as a weapon.

We really need a red name explanation here.

As a guard main who plays GW2 competitively in PvP as well as playing high-end PvE (raid) content, I fully agree.

The guardian staff was already completely useless in every game mode except for WvW zerging and farming trash mobs for loot. Now the staff is completely useless always in every game mode with no exceptions. The other minor buffs staff received are laughable and do not suddenly make the most useless weapon in the game any more useful.

Ah yes, same old Anet.

Came back after 4 years because of PoF hype to play my Guardian.

It’s good to see nothing has changed.

It really suprised me that they flat nerved the auto attack with no real compensation. As it stands staff under performs in all aspects and was only used in wvw. It is a support weapon with a little of healing and the only other unique thing was the auto attack as staff is lacking any value for offensive defensive or utility options. I hope they give staff something new, a new unique identity, to bring it back as a decent choice.

At least the auto attack should have a range of 400, 300 is simply laughable. Or maybe they could add something like they did to frost bow: A new buff applied whenever you hit a foe with the auto attack, that buffs the effectiveness of the other skills.

Here’s a question from someone who does not play WvW/PvP at the moment:
In PvE, apart from some open world events – why would you ever want to even use Staff?

“Guardian was too good at something in this game. We fixed that. Please switch to Shortbow Thief, Flamethrower Engi or Staff Necro now. Guard is back at his supposed spot (garbage).”

Nick.6972:

Here’s a question from someone who does not play WvW/PvP at the moment:
In PvE, apart from some open world events – why would you ever want to even use Staff?

In pve, tagging mobs which seems to upset some even though you cant steal loot like in other mmo:s. The nerf didnt change that, you can still use it to tag for loot since they widen the arc. Which is good since all the profession i play can also spec for tagging.

In wvw the only real damage alternative the core guardian has in frontline zerging. The only usable condition weapon i zergs. None of them work after the nerf.

Seems like a short range for a supposedly ranged weapon.

I primary ran sword focus, with staff as a backup because I liked the visuals, a ranged backup weapon, and the whole battlemage theme. Not sure that I care for the change.

Note that I am not a guardian main, dont really play him that much, so may not be the best judge of balance for the profession…but this change is decidedly un-fun to me.

Its not that tempest could loot as good as the loot stick, it is that tempest has been made to be the new loot stick. Fresh air tempest is the large AoE low damage choice.

There can only be one loot stick, so unless the also buff air overload they can’t revert the range on the loot stick.

I find it funny the people in support of this is probably the same people who spam 1 in WvW and Loot farms \0/. The 50% range deduction was a bit much. It should of been 450

Oh for God’s sake stop whining already. The lootstick was never meant to be just a lootstick, it was supposed to be an actual weapon. The nerf was long overdue.

Adrenalin.5719:

“Guardian was too good at something in this game. We fixed that. Please switch to Shortbow Thief, Flamethrower Engi or Staff Necro now. Guard is back at his supposed spot (garbage).”

You clearly didn’t read anything other than the staff nerf.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Well, it is useless as a weapon. The only thing I use it for is a speed boost on my key runner and as a loot stick.

Which means not that the nerf needs to be reversed but that the Guardian staff needs to be reworked.

This.

If it didn’t have that Swiftness symbol, it wouldn’t get used at all. Maybe for lootsticking, but there are other weapons that just play better overall.

The original staff range was fine. Like others said, a narrower beam/effect would have been an acceptable nerf. As it is, I don’t think the other sidegrades for orb and Asura Poledance Healing make up for the range loss.
With very few, if any, other weapons/utilities having “Warding” abilities, Staff 5 should have been something completely else.

Kazeshini.6710:

Oh for God’s sake stop whining already. The lootstick was never meant to be just a lootstick, it was supposed to be an actual weapon.

It actually was a real weapon before the nerf, now its not. So what Anet has done is taken something that actually worked and broke it.

You need to understand that there’s so much lag in WvW that you can often only auto attack.
To nerf the one skill that you can actually use (for absolutely no reason) is totally ridiculous, and just hilights once again how far out of touch A net are with the game mode.

Kazeshini.6710:

Oh for God’s sake stop whining already. The lootstick was never meant to be just a lootstick, it was supposed to be an actual weapon. The nerf was long overdue.

Adrenalin.5719:

“Guardian was too good at something in this game. We fixed that. Please switch to Shortbow Thief, Flamethrower Engi or Staff Necro now. Guard is back at his supposed spot (garbage).”

You clearly didn’t read anything other than the staff nerf.

Do u mean the 20 angle increase? This will be hardly felt, unlike the giant nerf on the range.

Kazeshini.6710:

Oh for God’s sake stop whining already. The lootstick was never meant to be just a lootstick, it was supposed to be an actual weapon. The nerf was long overdue.

Well and nerfing now made it a decent weapon instead of “just a lootstick”? The key is it should have been changed to something meaningful not blatantly nerfed into uselessness.