Guild Wars 2

As i’m sure everyone knows the devs who were working on our promised new legendary weapons have been removed to work on the LS since legendary weapons only affect a small number of players.

However I am not convinced that is actually true. Pretty much everyone I know in game has or is working towards a legendary weapon collection.

I have to wonder if this decision is actually based on reality or just weird developer bias.

I would love to see some number on how many separate accounts participate in the following in a given week:

1. Raids
2. Legendary weapon collections
3. sPvP
4. WvW

I can’t imagine the numbers here are that far apart. I have a very hard time believing that more people raid than are working on a legendary weapon collection. Based on PvP wait times and the $200,000 prize pools for PvP I can’t imagine wasting devs on PvP is a good economic decision on time/money per active PvP account. WvW has been a barren dying wasteland for over a year now. I doubt they have many more active players than raids do.

It would seem to me that pulling devs from raids or PvP or WvW would all have been more sensible places since they seem to have a smaller population overall than the number of people who are working on legendary weapons.

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

I was playing PvP, but the league match making sapped all the fun out of it for me.

Legendary crafting? I’m not actively working on it. If I happen to be on a map and end up doing an event tied to it, great, otherwise I really don’t care.

WvW, it was fun for a little bit, but then only during the tournament.

Raids, not touched them, cant say I’m even interested.

I am not working on legendary weapons because it is too much of a time and gold sink and I would rather being doing stuff than wasting my time on a weapon that looks ugly like Kudzu when you can play all of the game without one.

There are probably more people in wvw which is currently dead than people working towards a legendary as most people just get Twilight as a Rng drop then stick with that.

It takes 25 days to make the tier 1 ravenwood branch, and it costs more overall to do that then make the ravenwood staff than to just buy the bifrost outright. Same stats and less time trying to get it.

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

I don’t get why raids were added when there weren’t even enough resources for PvE, PvP and WvW.

Ashen.2907:

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

What do you do in this game for 3.5 years if you’ve never made a legendary? After about a year that is the only interesting content left.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Ashen.2907:

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

What do you do in this game for 3.5 years if you’ve never made a legendary? After about a year that is the only interesting content left.

How are they interesting?

Personally I find the legendaries to be ugly and/or obnoxious.

To me skins are not content, they are rewards for playing content. Is there any content that you can play while pursuing a legendary that I cannot play while not pursuing one? A secret legendary only dungeon somewhere?

Ashen.2907:

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

Same here, except that I only came on board shortly after release. Never found a precursor, never cared enough to buy one.^^

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Ashen.2907:

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

What do you do in this game for 3.5 years if you’ve never made a legendary? After about a year that is the only interesting content left.

Been here since beta, played more hours than I want to admit to, and no legendary.

Because they be UGLY!!!

ZudetGambeous.9573:

I have to wonder if this decision is actually based on reality or just weird developer bias.

everyone can immediately experience ls
everyone can immediately experience legendary grind
everyone will leave if there is only grind
nufsed

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Ashen.2907:

Vavume.8065:

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Hi, welcome to GW2.

Been here since beta, but thanks anyway.

What do you do in this game for 3.5 years if you’ve never made a legendary? After about a year that is the only interesting content left.

This is an amazing little case of perspective. I, too, have been playing since beta, and I’ve yet to even start seriously working towards a legendary. You’d be surprised by how many different ways people find to spend their time.

Actually, I don’t do WvW, PvP, Raids, or legendaries, so this entire list misses what I do in-game.

Been here since GW1 and no legendary despite the fact i’ve 6 looted precursors sitting in my bank. Didnt even bother to make a single legendary. Why for ?

To answer your question :
Raids : No
Legendary weapon collection : Hell no !
sPvP : No
WvW : Yes

Legendary stuff is a choice just like Obsidian Armor in GW1. It’s prestige and work. But it also indicates a certain dedication in game.

GW2 has many more such things. And now different ways besides MF and buying to acquire.

The only thing I’m truly thankful for is all but one of the “rainbow bright” joke legendaries have an alternative now.

Sorry mirror ball mains ;-)

Sylv.5324:

I don’t get why raids were added when there weren’t even enough resources for PvE, PvP and WvW.

This. They spent the first 3 years focusing mostly on LS to the detriment of the game. I’m not sure what they thought would happen with raids. I mean they couldn’t even support dungeons and raids are much more complicated. ANet needs to desperately restructure their development team and that includes management. They’ve been slow at developing for awhile and the work put out is fairly slapdash. I think they need to put a little more money into keeping devs that know what they are doing and growing the team than to keep investors happy.

Sylv.5324:

I don’t get why raids were added when there weren’t even enough resources for PvE, PvP and WvW.

The whole thing is starting to sound like the dev line from Blizzard (WoW) where they say, “If you want it, it will cost you a raid tier.” But in this case, the raid cost us a Legendary tier.

As too the OP’s question, I don’t do what’s on his list. I’ve been primarily PvE, although I was considering one of the new upcoming Legendaries if they made one to my taste.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Sylv.5324:

I don’t get why raids were added when there weren’t even enough resources for PvE, PvP and WvW.

The whole thing is starting to sound like the dev line from Blizzard (WoW) where they say, “If you want it, it will cost you a raid tier.” But in this case, the raid cost us a Legendary tier.

As too the OP’s question, I don’t do what’s on his list. I’ve been primarily PvE, although I was considering one of the new upcoming Legendaries if they made one to my taste.

The raids didn’t cost you anything. They’re the only team putting out content at the moment so I say props to them. Legendaries are so specific in who they target it is not even funny and they need to shoe horn them into existing content. If you say raids target a specific group of people as well, I counter with the fact that it is not as narrow as Legendaries.
1) Everyone can go into a raid
2) Not everyone has a class that can use a shortbow (hello theif and ranger), this can be said about every Legendary weapon that comes out. The closest to being for everyone is Staff.
3) Not everyone has the money to get a Legendary (and Ascended armor costs less than a Legendary so don’t give me that excuse)
4) We need something PvE wise that requires you to not be a total idiot at this game (would love Fractals 101-110 be all new fractals on same difficulty with raids for 5 man content)

That’s my rambling for today.

Edit: And don’t be calling me a white knight. There are a ton of things I think A-net could do better. And yes, I am somewhat sad we won’t be getting new Legendaries. But raids are not the problem.

Azoqu.8917:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Sylv.5324:

I don’t get why raids were added when there weren’t even enough resources for PvE, PvP and WvW.

The whole thing is starting to sound like the dev line from Blizzard (WoW) where they say, “If you want it, it will cost you a raid tier.” But in this case, the raid cost us a Legendary tier.

As too the OP’s question, I don’t do what’s on his list. I’ve been primarily PvE, although I was considering one of the new upcoming Legendaries if they made one to my taste.

The raids didn’t cost you anything. They’re the only team putting out content at the moment so I say props to them. Legendaries are so specific in who they target it is not even funny and they need to shoe horn them into existing content. If you say raids target a specific group of people as well, I counter with the fact that it is not as narrow as Legendaries.
1) Everyone can go into a raid
2) Not everyone has a class that can use a shortbow (hello theif and ranger), this can be said about every Legendary weapon that comes out. The closest to being for everyone is Staff.
3) Not everyone has the money to get a Legendary (and Ascended armor costs less than a Legendary so don’t give me that excuse)
4) We need something PvE wise that requires you to not be a total idiot at this game (would love Fractals 101-110 be all new fractals on same difficulty with raids for 5 man content)

That’s my rambling for today.

Edit: And don’t be calling me a white knight. There are a ton of things I think A-net could do better. And yes, I am somewhat sad we won’t be getting new Legendaries. But raids are not the problem.

Thanks for the post. It missed the analogy though.

Azoqu.8917:

The raids didn’t cost you anything.

6 devs in a Legendaries team. 6 devs working on a single raid wing. They could have pulled either team, but they decided on legendaries. So yeah, legendary set was worth a raid wing.

It could be coincidence, but I tend to agree with Astralporing here. Maybe cost is a harsh word for that, devs were obviously spread out too far and the raid team is one of several teams.

Of course the decision was easy which team would be axed, the third raid wing at least has to appear or Anet would look even more like clowns than they already do with this legendaries fiasco.

Astralporing.1957:

Azoqu.8917:

The raids didn’t cost you anything.

6 devs in a Legendaries team. 6 devs working on a single raid wing. They could have pulled either team, but they decided on legendaries. So yeah, legendary set was worth a raid wing.

But we are talking one team 2/3rds of the way done with it’s promised content Vs another team that’s only 1/3rd done which at their current pace may be done in 2019. They’re only equivalent as bullet points on a promised feature list.

Behellagh.1468:

Astralporing.1957:

Azoqu.8917:

The raids didn’t cost you anything.

6 devs in a Legendaries team. 6 devs working on a single raid wing. They could have pulled either team, but they decided on legendaries. So yeah, legendary set was worth a raid wing.

But we are talking one team 2/3rds of the way done with it’s promised content Vs another team that’s only 1/3rd done which at their current pace may be done in 2019. They’re only equivalent as bullet points on a promised feature list.

If they didn’t have the 6 Devs working on raids then those Devs could have been working
on other content. They wouldn’t have been so far behind and needed to pull the Devs off the Legendaries. Therefore, the Devs working on raids cost us the Legendaries.

Behellagh.1468:

Astralporing.1957:

Azoqu.8917:

The raids didn’t cost you anything.

6 devs in a Legendaries team. 6 devs working on a single raid wing. They could have pulled either team, but they decided on legendaries. So yeah, legendary set was worth a raid wing.

But we are talking one team 2/3rds of the way done with it’s promised content Vs another team that’s only 1/3rd done which at their current pace may be done in 2019. They’re only equivalent as bullet points on a promised feature list.

We don’t know how close they were to completion on other legendaries. We do know that at least Mace wasn’t long behind the shortbow, and that all of the rest were in some partial stages.
Still doesn’t change anything. That next raid wing did cost us legendaries.

Also, as Just a Flesh Wound said, if the Raids were never a thing, then those developer slots could have been assigned to LS long ago and we’d never be in this situation.

And we wouldn’t have ended with Legendary Armor gated behind a content aimed at a tiny minority, which would be an additional gain in my eyes.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Behellagh.1468:

Astralporing.1957:

Azoqu.8917:

The raids didn’t cost you anything.

6 devs in a Legendaries team. 6 devs working on a single raid wing. They could have pulled either team, but they decided on legendaries. So yeah, legendary set was worth a raid wing.

But we are talking one team 2/3rds of the way done with it’s promised content Vs another team that’s only 1/3rd done which at their current pace may be done in 2019. They’re only equivalent as bullet points on a promised feature list.

If they didn’t have the 6 Devs working on raids then those Devs could have been working
on other content. They wouldn’t have been so far behind and needed to pull the Devs off the Legendaries. Therefore, the Devs working on raids cost us the Legendaries.

But at least raids are repeatable content. And 6 people on the legendary team probably wasn’t enough anyway if it took them 4 months to finish one legendary journey. At that pace it would take them years to complete all 16 weapons. Also, the community would riot either way, both raids and legendaries were promised.

I’m having the feeling that Colin had too many plans and too little planning, and Mike is the one to deal with it now. Colin had a winning smile and said he was against too many sword swings. But guess what, while he was in charge of the game the necessary swings increased from day to day, and now Mike has to dedicate major parts of the quarterly patch to undo that.

On another note, taking even a single person from the WvW team would probably cause a massive riot even greater than this one. WvW has been neglected since forever and is in a worse state than PvE ever was or will be. It doesn’t take much to lose a lot of players there, as they are not as invested as PvE players. Stuff has been boiling for too long there.

Not sure about PvP, but it seems they aren’t too happy either.

@dubstax: that’s ridiculous. We don’t even know what they are working on. But anyway, let’s just wait and see what the april patch brings us.

Ashen.2907:

Weird, no one I know in game has a legendary or is working on one.

Meanwhile, everyone I’ve met, and almost all my guildmates (And they’re pretty casual. My guilds are strictly social) are working toward a legendary. Usually just one.

When you see the amount of work/grind that has to go into each step of the new legendarys-I hate to think of the amount of coding to produce this. You only have to take a look a the bug thread or reddit to see how easy these are to mess up. Given the state of wvw and the general discontent with game, legendary development seems to be a luxury item that can possibly be put on the back burner.

What do we want?? Game content or legendary weaps….legendary is only something I do if I’m bored and have some gold to waste. Since gold is not so easy to make these days welp I’m gonna go for content, wvw first and foremost. I have made 3 legendaries and currently in the finishing stages of Astralaria….darned if I want to go through making another of these new legendaries-just too much grind.

Be easier to go back to the old way of precursor drop or buying from tp-save all that coding work and bugs to “collection” events introduced with every patch! Hey, everyone likes the thought of a precursor drop-kinda lessens the fun to know that you aren’t going to get one of the new ones as a drop.

AS for legendary armour and backpacks…meh who wants more power creep? Not me, balance is broken enough. Give us something to play- I don’t want to stand at the crafting station or mystic forge getting more rsi from clicking!!

Raids-seem to me to have a limited audience, are quite exclusive on a number of levels. Alot of work for the coders but are there the numbers playing that type of content to justify?

The only thing that cost you the legendary team is the ridiculous precursor hunt. Even if they didn’t disband the team the legendary collection wouldn’t have been done till the next xpac (just look at the time it took them for a single weapon), so please stop blaming other game modes for what was an inherently terrible and unsustainable idea.

Frankly there never should have been a raid design team to begin with. That would have fixed that problem right there.

As for the Legendary problem. That could have been fixed by never letting the economics team anywhere near the project. Every time they’ve touched something in the name of “economic health” it’s just turned the game into even more of a grinding chore.

cranos.5913:

an inherently terrible and unsustainable idea.

Like having so many people work on the next “expansion” when they have not even completed the previous one. kitten poor planning produces kitten poor performance. Honestly, until they stop misleading their customers, I will not spend another penny on this game. I will encourage my friends to do the same.

RustyMech.9876:

cranos.5913:

an inherently terrible and unsustainable idea.

Like having so many people work on the next “expansion” when they have not even completed the previous one. kitten poor planning produces kitten poor results.

That’s a different discussion entirely. People here feel the need to say how much superior their needs are compared to people that like instanced play, wvw or spvp. We all play this game for different reasons and we all feel kittened over by what happened here, but it isn’t the fault of them producing different kinds of content.

Not only was the concept extremely flawed to begin with, it’s been planned extremely poorly, as well as you just said 70 people are already working on the next expansion. Focus on those issues, instead of advocating they get rid of the team that made the only instanced group content in over 2 years.

And as a last note, we all know making skins doesn’t cost them THAT much time. We’ve seen the pace at which they release gem store items. It’s obviously the precursor hunt that takes a ridiculous amount of time, keeping 6 people busy full time for 4 months for 1 legendary. So say whatever you want, raid team or no raid team, those people were not being productive enough where they were to keep them in that position. At the pace they were going they could release 2 more expansions before the legendaries would be done.

cranos.5913:

RustyMech.9876:

cranos.5913:

an inherently terrible and unsustainable idea.

Like having so many people work on the next “expansion” when they have not even completed the previous one. kitten poor planning produces kitten poor results.

That’s a different discussion entirely. People here feel the need to say how much superior their needs are compared to people that like instanced play, wvw or spvp.

It is not a different discussion, it is one of the major contributors to the problem. If they had more people fixing/working on the current expansion and not the next one this thread probably would not even exist in the first place.

WvW shouldn’t have a Vs. it simply doesn’t exist

Also Raids being more used in this game than any other MMO seems completely plausible and accurate.

It’s simple really all the other MMO’s have BALANCED CONTENT

The Dungeoneers, WvW, and heck PVE in general have been abandoned by Anet and have obviously got tired of waiting 6 months after release for content and left the game or rather play much less than they used too. The raiders are practially all that’s left I know without a doubt I’ve never seen the in game population this low in all my years playing the game. Even LFG is full of nothing but LFR and an occasional SW far fewer options than I remember. This is how MMO’s die catering to the hardcore because the hardcore or a minority and the completely neglected the casual. Before someone says they haven’t catered to the hardcore in three years prior well that’s since launch and that means this obvious isn’t a game for hardcore players also you stood around for three years asking for it. Casuals are not going to stick around like that and the mass exodus of the casual do to their new dedication to grind and raids is why we are in the current situation.

Also why a game with only one raid wing well two now has the highest percentage of raiders than any other MMO’s because those other MMO’s are balanced and non-raiders stick around because they have something worthwhile to do unlike this game.

RustyMech.9876:

cranos.5913:

RustyMech.9876:

cranos.5913:

an inherently terrible and unsustainable idea.

Like having so many people work on the next “expansion” when they have not even completed the previous one. kitten poor planning produces kitten poor results.

That’s a different discussion entirely. People here feel the need to say how much superior their needs are compared to people that like instanced play, wvw or spvp.

It is not a different discussion, it is one of the major contributors to the problem. If they had more people fixing/working on the current expansion and not the next one this thread probably would not even exist in the first place.

Wait you’re nitpicking on part of my post while I basically agree with you later on… xD

In any case to finish the legendaries in a timely matter it’s looking more like they have to put all 70 ppl on legendaries. It’s a ridiculous undertaking that requires lots more work than they anticipated. Why they don’t just revert back to the old system or revise the precursor crafting to be just that… crafting, that I can’t rly understand. In any case those 6 people were getting nowhere any time soon.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

As i’m sure everyone knows the devs who were working on our promised new legendary weapons have been removed to work on the LS since legendary weapons only affect a small number of players.

However I am not convinced that is actually true. Pretty much everyone I know in game has or is working towards a legendary weapon collection.

I have to wonder if this decision is actually based on reality or just weird developer bias.

I would love to see some number on how many separate accounts participate in the following in a given week:

1. Raids
2. Legendary weapon collections
3. sPvP
4. WvW

I can’t imagine the numbers here are that far apart. I have a very hard time believing that more people raid than are working on a legendary weapon collection. Based on PvP wait times and the $200,000 prize pools for PvP I can’t imagine wasting devs on PvP is a good economic decision on time/money per active PvP account. WvW has been a barren dying wasteland for over a year now. I doubt they have many more active players than raids do.

It would seem to me that pulling devs from raids or PvP or WvW would all have been more sensible places since they seem to have a smaller population overall than the number of people who are working on legendary weapons.

6 work on raids, 6 on legendarys .. thats it .. ANet has only 12 content designer it seems
the rest is designing Iron Man armors for the gemshop

I’d like to understand the way things work better. I thought the five people working on raids wasn’t affecting Living Story… but apparently the six people working on a single shortbow can make all the difference?

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I’d like to understand the way things work better. I thought the five people working on raids wasn’t affecting Living Story… but apparently the six people working on a single shortbow can make all the difference?

If only 6 people are all that is needed to restart LS .. it makes a big difference if
those 6 people work on raids .. or on LS.

I have no clue what the rest is doing .. but it seems the core of ANet are these
2 6 man teams .. so its either raids, legendarys or LS.

But for me they should simply bring out the skins of the new legendary and
go back to the old system with dropped / forged precursors. The whole
precurser hunt made legendarys only more expensive than just buying one.