Requirement for Berserker. Really?
No, they’re inherently bad because they limit build choices. You can’t successfuly beat enrage timers with anything but a heavy amount of glass cannon dps.
And that’s your opinion, but not mine.
TBH honest, i’m not a fan of straight overall timer for the boss, but I’m a very big fan of dps checks like gorseval fight where you need to dps him enough before he does it’s big attack twice in a phase.
Have the humility to understand that other people like other kind of stuff than you. Some people wanted that kind of stuff for raids and I’m aware that it’s not something that everybody like.
I don’t like everything in the game, but I’m able to understand that other people might love it that way and it’s cool with me.
Timers are a really boring mechanic because it says “my way or the highway” I mean you can learn the strategy, and execute the mechanics flawlessly but still fail just due to a gear check. When the only difference between success and failure is gear? That’s a boring mechanic.
I’m SLIGHTLY less critical about forcing a really narrow spectrum of gear stats in an instanced raid but it doesn’t belong in open world events at all. Open world events are a large PUG where you really have no control over what people on the map are wearing. I say as long as you can organize people to execute the strategy you should be able to complete open world events, rather than requiring a gear check for an open world PUG.
The only way to try to enforce what people are wearing in an open world event is to be a part of a massive guild like TTS where they can spam maps until they find one that is completely empty, and then fill it with nothing but their guild, but 99% of the guilds in game cannot effectively do that. In fact, TTS can’t even really do that entirely in guild, there are always PuGs joining and they just give them the teamspeak info. Luckily the triple worms, while requiring a good amount of coordination and each having a strategy that needed to be executed, had a timer generous enough that it didn’t have any real gear requirements (though a condi geared team did help), it actually sort of helped that for most of the boss you could not crit, so you didn’t need zerker, and the fight was balanced around dps not being able to crit.
You can crit Chak Garent, and therefore, everyone being in optimal dps gear (zerker/sinister/viper) is paramount, because the fight is tuned assuming that everyone in the lane is in optimal dps gear, and the timer is fairly tight. Organization and strategy isn’t enough, having enough people in optimal DPS gear is necessary., but a gear check on an open world map that anyone could join? Not cool.
Well all they have to do is increase the timer and make the boss do more undodgeable 1 hit KO attacks to anyone who has less than 1500 toughness. Now you can wear all the tanky gear you want but will still face the pressure with the lower Dps even after they extended the timer. Would you have any problems with that? Well I think you would because it would exactly be the same as if you were in zerkers gear now. Let’s face it, people complaining aren’t complaining because they have to be in zerkers, they are complaining because they can’t beat the raid. Difficulty is difficulty, whether you are in zerkers or nomads the boss can be scaled to make it difficult, it’s not the gear you guys have a problem with its your skill lvl. If the boss was changed to do 5 times more dmg, you can wear nomads but you’ll still probably die.
At the end of the day even if Anet nerfed raids and maybe made other armor stats required, it won’t affect the people now who have currently cleared raids or are still trying. The people who are not complaining now will always be able to clear content no matter what changes happen to them. But Guess what? The people who are complaining now will still be complaining after Anet changes raids. As Long as you are unable to beat the raid you will find some form of excuse to try to blame Anet. I Guess it’s just your personality, it has nothing to do with gear, skill lvl, or ‘elitism’. At the end of the day the problem will be your unwillingness to adapt, to try, to put in effort to get what you want. At the end of the day you just want things handed to you or catered to your exact skill lvl.
People saying ‘elitist’ are bad people should really question themselves. So far many good players I meet who asks for gear checks or food checks are friendly people who talk laugh and have fun at what they are doing. No matter what the content be it hard, easy, exploitable, or impossible atm they always have fun and try to win it. The bad people IMO are the ones complaining, the ones who assumes everyone shares the same opinion as them, the ones who want every single content developed to cater to their exact skill lvl as if they were the only ones who payed for the game. If you take a step back and look, ‘elitist’ don’t really care what content they get, they just try their best. Some ‘elitist’ might be egoistic and rude but that’s like only the minority. asking for food checks and gear checks doesn’t make you a bad person, it makes you a good leader. Have you ever thought maybe ‘elitist’ squad leaders don’t want to waste their members time so they ask for such requirements? 9 times an hour is 9 hours of collective game time. Just take a step back think about what I just said.
(edited by Zach.2618)
For The OP, you can try and join a non-competitive causal guild that just wants to have fun and don’t enforce anything on anyone…
IF you are in the American servers you are welcomed to join our guild, we are a casual friendly guild that try to do everything in game but we aren’t obsessed about it.
Timers are a really boring mechanic because it says “my way or the highway” I mean you can learn the strategy, and execute the mechanics flawlessly but still fail just due to a gear check. When the only difference between success and failure is gear? That’s a boring mechanic.
I’m SLIGHTLY less critical about forcing a really narrow spectrum of gear stats in an instanced raid but it doesn’t belong in open world events at all. Open world events are a large PUG where you really have no control over what people on the map are wearing. I say as long as you can organize people to execute the strategy you should be able to complete open world events, rather than requiring a gear check for an open world PUG.
The only way to try to enforce what people are wearing in an open world event is to be a part of a massive guild like TTS where they can spam maps until they find one that is completely empty, and then fill it with nothing but their guild, but 99% of the guilds in game cannot effectively do that. In fact, TTS can’t even really do that entirely in guild, there are always PuGs joining and they just give them the teamspeak info. Luckily the triple worms, while requiring a good amount of coordination and each having a strategy that needed to be executed, had a timer generous enough that it didn’t have any real gear requirements (though a condi geared team did help), it actually sort of helped that for most of the boss you could not crit, so you didn’t need zerker, and the fight was balanced around dps not being able to crit.
You can crit Chak Garent, and therefore, everyone being in optimal dps gear (zerker/sinister/viper) is paramount, because the fight is tuned assuming that everyone in the lane is in optimal dps gear, and the timer is fairly tight. Organization and strategy isn’t enough, having enough people in optimal DPS gear is necessary., but a gear check on an open world map that anyone could join? Not cool.
Ok well again it’s your opinion not mine. You see, for me the timer put dps pressure on the group. The group need to have a good dps and for that he need a good composition. You need to think about what class you bring to make sure you bring all the buff you need and the best gear possible. With 8 people in glass canon gear, you now have a lot of pressure on these guys. There don’t have room for error because those error will kill you. I can’t ignore these little bright ball at red guardian because they gonna kill me. I need to pay extreme attention to seekers because they gonna kill me. That pressure is what will likely kill you. To me, no dps check = boring because I can just facetank a good portion of the mechnics. No dps check = more room for errors and I don’t like that in raid.
That said, I think that anet made an error about timers. When they first announced raid were coming in the game I had 3 points that I wanted .
1) Difficult : they pretty much got it.
2) Push players to use as much gameplay mechnics as possible : They kind of got it right, but not that much. They added CC, healing and a bit of boon rip, but that pretty much it. No real need for stab or condition removal, the boon rip need is small, etc.
3) Variable difficulty. They didn’t got this one at all.
The raid can’t be for everybody with 1 difficulty setting. Anet can’t put too much money into a content that only a small portion of the community can play. But you don’t want an easy raid because that kill the point. The worst part is that an easy mode would be very easy to make. They could have been lazy and simply make an easy mode by removing the timer on all bosses, adding 2-4 updraft at Gorseval, etc. Modulate the reward in consequence and voila. You got a content that everybody can enjoy.
As for the Chak Gerent Event. I don’t consider this event to be a dps check. It’s more than often the phase that lure the boss out of the ground that fail or take too long. And be fair, it’s not like the majority of world event are like that. It’s the only one like that. I would leave it like that for like 1 or 2 months and see if the community were able to improve themselves over the holidays. If the rate success of this event is still as bad after that time, maybe Anet should look at it a bit closely and change some stuff to make it a bit more accessible. It’s nice to have a world event that is hard, but so far it’s a bit too much. But like I said. I would prefer to see if the community can figure a way to kill him more regularly with tactics and strategy and for that more people need to know how the fight work. Too much people go in with very little idea how the fight work.
Thaddeauz [xQCx]- QC GUILD
I cannot find it but i can swear i recall a dev saying something along the lines of ….“Everything has a meta.” Might have been an interview or something.
Raids are going to be no different.
You can either be stubborn and not adapt to that, or be flexible. Your call, one has 0 chance at success in raids, the other has a much greater chance.
As long as you do not dissect this in context just looking the word “meta” is no use at all.
Actually everything has a ‘meta’ ! As most oftenly used as meaning that above all things there is a further strategizing/pattern creation/scheming layer above it when groups of people interact.The way that “meta” is misused on the forums in the gw2 context on the other hand means something that formerly was more fittingly called out as “cookie cutter play”, meaning that brainless people just use a random premade cutter shape to do what they do.
Which is what GW2 “meta” is about: People just copy-cat-ing anything that a website or the most prominent forum troll announces without further reflection of the matter presented. Which leads to lots of people playing with a template instead of playing themselves, thus leaving them a lot less qualified in the game that they might be if they had spent a few minutes thinking it though themselves.
Okay. What you see as copy’ing others see as the formula for success. That formula came from many players trial and error. Thus they did develop a meta. Like all things the meta is subject to shift. If and when balance patches happen, or a boss gets some mechanic overhaul you’ll notice this more-so. In the interim what will drive the meta forward is the group people are condemning, those looking to speed-run because as is speed (time) is the only measurement we have for optimization.
That means that, unfortunately some players will have a harder time fitting into a role than others as their role may be niche, or already filled. This is the exact case the OP ran into.
I don’t know how else i can explain this to you or anyone else really. Every piece of content in this game has a meta. Due to that being a true statement, people will naturally be excluded. The only way to get around that is to have less stringent events that are open to many people (Open World) or to change the very way the content is designed. However, i would not look toward raids getting a major overhaul anytime soon. They are designed in such a way that it did open up more roles/versatility, unfortunately it’s done on such a scale that people who want to do the same things together may never see it.
I think you need to just accept that maybe raiding isn’t content designed for you?
Also, I’ve seen groups kill Vale Guardian in 6 minutes and others struggle to make it at the 10 minute market. A 4 minute difference is rather significant, but it also means Anet did not balance this content with everyone being mind-bogglingly perfect.
The 4 minute gap tells me the content is reasonably balanced for a decent group.
And to be fair, you did say you spent 98% of your time solo. Raiding is obviously a non-solo activity.
Must have ascended gear to even join? Errr that’s just outrageous elitist meta garbage! Besides, last I checked, it’s skill that makes a difference, not so much the gear quality, as long as it’s the right gear for the situation.
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Must have ascended gear to even join? Errr that’s just outrageous elitist meta garbage! Besides, last I checked, it’s skill that makes a difference, not so much the gear quality, as long as it’s the right gear for the situation.
We did the 1st boss with several exotic armors with no problem. I’ll reserve my final judgment for the 2nd boss, but so far I can’t see why a group of 10 players without ascended armors couldn’t do it if they have a good composition with ascended weapons/trinkets, good build and good foods.
Thaddeauz [xQCx]- QC GUILD
Must have ascended gear to even join? Errr that’s just outrageous elitist meta garbage! Besides, last I checked, it’s skill that makes a difference, not so much the gear quality, as long as it’s the right gear for the situation.
If ascended gives about 10% DPS increase and you have ten people that’s like having 11 people in comparison to a group that has all exotic. Of course damage rotations and being able to follow the mechanics is important but still losing out on “a whole person” is kind of a big deal if your group keeps getting close but not close enough.
No, they’re inherently bad because they limit build choices. You can’t successfuly beat enrage timers with anything but a heavy amount of glass cannon dps.
And that’s your opinion, but not mine.
TBH honest, i’m not a fan of straight overall timer for the boss, but I’m a very big fan of dps checks like gorseval fight where you need to dps him enough before he does it’s big attack twice in a phase.
Have the humility to understand that other people like other kind of stuff than you. Some people wanted that kind of stuff for raids and I’m aware that it’s not something that everybody like.
I don’t like everything in the game, but I’m able to understand that other people might love it that way and it’s cool with me.
Timers are a really boring mechanic because it says “my way or the highway” I mean you can learn the strategy, and execute the mechanics flawlessly but still fail just due to a gear check. When the only difference between success and failure is gear? That’s a boring mechanic.
I’m SLIGHTLY less critical about forcing a really narrow spectrum of gear stats in an instanced raid but it doesn’t belong in open world events at all. Open world events are a large PUG where you really have no control over what people on the map are wearing. I say as long as you can organize people to execute the strategy you should be able to complete open world events, rather than requiring a gear check for an open world PUG.
The only way to try to enforce what people are wearing in an open world event is to be a part of a massive guild like TTS where they can spam maps until they find one that is completely empty, and then fill it with nothing but their guild, but 99% of the guilds in game cannot effectively do that. In fact, TTS can’t even really do that entirely in guild, there are always PuGs joining and they just give them the teamspeak info. Luckily the triple worms, while requiring a good amount of coordination and each having a strategy that needed to be executed, had a timer generous enough that it didn’t have any real gear requirements (though a condi geared team did help), it actually sort of helped that for most of the boss you could not crit, so you didn’t need zerker, and the fight was balanced around dps not being able to crit.
You can crit Chak Garent, and therefore, everyone being in optimal dps gear (zerker/sinister/viper) is paramount, because the fight is tuned assuming that everyone in the lane is in optimal dps gear, and the timer is fairly tight. Organization and strategy isn’t enough, having enough people in optimal DPS gear is necessary., but a gear check on an open world map that anyone could join? Not cool.
Well all they have to do is increase the timer and make the boss do more undodgeable 1 hit KO attacks to anyone who has less than 1500 toughness. Now you can wear all the tanky gear you want but will still face the pressure with the lower Dps even after they extended the timer. Would you have any problems with that? Well I think you would because it would exactly be the same as if you were in zerkers gear now. Let’s face it, people complaining aren’t complaining because they have to be in zerkers, they are complaining because they can’t beat the raid. Difficulty is difficulty, whether you are in zerkers or nomads the boss can be scaled to make it difficult, it’s not the gear you guys have a problem with its your skill lvl. If the boss was changed to do 5 times more dmg, you can wear nomads but you’ll still probably die.
At the end of the day even if Anet nerfed raids and maybe made other armor stats required, it won’t affect the people now who have currently cleared raids or are still trying. The people who are not complaining now will always be able to clear content no matter what changes happen to them. But Guess what? The people who are complaining now will still be complaining after Anet changes raids. As Long as you are unable to beat the raid you will find some form of excuse to try to blame Anet. I Guess it’s just your personality, it has nothing to do with gear, skill lvl, or ‘elitism’. At the end of the day the problem will be your unwillingness to adapt, to try, to put in effort to get what you want. At the end of the day you just want things handed to you or catered to your exact skill lvl.
People saying ‘elitist’ are bad people should really question themselves. So far many good players I meet who asks for gear checks or food checks are friendly people who talk laugh and have fun at what they are doing. No matter what the content be it hard, easy, exploitable, or impossible atm they always have fun and try to win it. The bad people IMO are the ones complaining, the ones who assumes everyone shares the same opinion as them, the ones who want every single content developed to cater to their exact skill lvl as if they were the only ones who payed for the game. If you take a step back and look, ‘elitist’ don’t really care what content they get, they just try their best. Some ‘elitist’ might be egoistic and rude but that’s like only the minority. asking for food checks and gear checks doesn’t make you a bad person, it makes you a good leader. Have you ever thought maybe ‘elitist’ squad leaders don’t want to waste their members time so they ask for such requirements? 9 times an hour is 9 hours of collective game time. Just take a step back think about what I just said.
The bosses already do one shot mechanics on anything except warriors and necromancers, scaled up high enough a world boss will even 1 shot those on every hit.
My complaint is that people opt to wear different gear setups not everyone has optimal dps gear. I do, but I can’t do enough dps to carry 4 other people’s lack of DPS. The fact that they feel the need to wear tankier gear to survive means that they scale up the mob’s health and damage more than they contribute to helping kill it when there’s a dps race timer involved.
While some people would say “well just have everyone wear optimized dps gear if they want to complete the content”, that’s infeasible because I cannot go around and force everyone to wear optimal dps gear and have optimal builds. You have to deal with the fact that in a map wide pug there will be a lot of less than optimal dps builds and gear and that’s what you have to take down a boss with a tight timer with. It doesn’t work very well.
I’d prefer the timer be looser on Garent to be rational about the fact that this is a PuG, and there will be a ton of people in non optimized gear so DPS will be slower.
There’s also other mechanics on the Garent meta event that are just in need of change, such as the fact that the entire expansion trains you to break breakbars to give moments of high vulnerability/burn phases in world bosses and champion fights…. except this one, if you burn his break bar he charges away, which ultimately slows down the fight and makes it harder to make the timer.
You can try to tell people in map chat not to use CC, but like I said, the entire expansion trains you to use CC to break a breakbar any time you see one up. To have this be an exception is unintuitive, and in a giant PuG, it just doesn’t fly.
Every other map, the instructions on what to do are clear and intuitive. TD it’s not, that’s why it’s relatively common to find maps doing T4 Brink all Champions, T4 AB, and successful Dragon’s Stands…. but TD almost never gets successfully completed, because it has a very tight timer on the boss requiring optimized dps gear, no in game timer for the entire meta (requiring people to use a third party site if they want to know when the meta will start), and unintuitive break bar mechanics
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
(edited by Devildoc.6721)
If they made raids so easy so people who cant solo openworld content (lol) then there would be no hard content left again, except a few of the highend fractals.
ive spend like 8-10 hours with the first raid boss before completing it the first time, then for the reset we killed the bokittend try. as for the 2nd raid boss it took us around 5 hours, and everyone was with no toughness/vital gear, except the tank who had like 100 extra toughness just to get aggo, and even then we died to the timer with the boss having 1% hp half the time.
People have been begging for hard content the last 3 years and now its finally here, it would seem unfair that all the content is to make casuals happy, as it has always been untill now, the only hard fight before HoT has been liadri with her 8 orbs.
i wouldent mind if they made a “learning version” of raids u could enter, where u choose timer/his hp/his damage. but you would not get any loot or achievements at all. just to help people improve.
TL;DR make an effort and get better, or play the 98% of the game that is for casuals.
This is simply bugging me, it is.
I am not one to run the Berserker build, I don’t like it, I have tried it many times in the last 3+ years and it just doesn’t mesh with me. Yet it never hindered my gameplay until… now… seemingly.
I run a tank build, so does my husband. If not Tank then Condition. This is my choice. This choice never seemed to affect how I far I got into the game until the release of the Raids.
It seems almost impossible for me to get into a raid party. I see people starting up Raid parties with the following demands:
15k+ AP, full set of Ascended Berserker Gear, that MUST be pinged to squad leader before he even CONSIDERS you to be apart of the party.
This to me is… absurd, I’m sorry.
Tangled Depths Meta. I still have yet to learn this event, and I WANT to, yet just the other night, no one doing it would take me in their squad because I wasn’t running berserker.
Listen, I understand completely why this build is strongly coveted, but… but not everyone can run that build successfully.
Is it really fair to punish those of us who are not Berserkers? Heck, even me and my husband last night set up out alternate account to have a Beserker Reverent. I ran her and kept dying left and right left and right, left and right…
Listen, playing the game of “Let’s see who dies first” may be for for you, but it isn’t to me. I’m allowed to partake in these events too, ya know. And I am hitting a point now where I am beginning to not even want to play at all cause people won’t let me join the events.
Don’t punish me…
You need to find a guild with a dynamic that you and your hubby can mesh with.
Trust me; it’s a LOT more fun to know you are playing with people you know you will enjoy playing with. When you know you’re with a group you will have fun with, you tend to relax a bit more and actually play better because of it.
All MMOs have this kind of attitude. Neverwinter really got bad when they released the Tiamat “raid” (lowercase and in quotes ’cause it was never a real Raid). Everyone wanted to run it but only the elitists were able to at first. After a while, some adjustments were made (and people learned how to run it efficiently) and it opened up for more players.
I’m biding my time on running a Raid so I’m not in a hurry to get rejected.
15k+ AP, full set of Ascended Berserker Gear, that MUST be pinged to squad leader
This to me is… absurd, I’m sorry.
There’s nothing you can do about players who insist there’s only one way to play the game…except to thank them for being clear in their LFG that they are closed-minded, making it easy for you to avoid them.
Until people can reliably beat the raids and learn exactly what works, some folks (especially in PUGs) will be convinced that there’s a “best” way or at least a requirement for succeeding with their group. Reddit posts from successful guild and PUG runs show how varied the comps can be. As with most of the game, player skill matters more and there’s no way anyone can determine that from AP or gear checks.
So: don’t join those groups. Make your own or look for guilds that are more interested in working together to iterate its own way towards victory.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”