Guild Wars 2

Whell, they are, in some way, but what i am trying to points is :

Rifles are good, but owerall they cant be a stand alone. Whats the point of them then?

I mean you can have a sword build and only use your switch weapon if you really need a skill from there, or only if you would like to.
But when you use a rifle you are forced to complete it with other weapons, or skill sets from other weapons.

And not besides, only 2 class can use them.

Engineers can use them well, for cc, but thats all. They have basically 0 dmg, unless you can get close to use a high cooldown blunder buss, whitch is not really a point of a gun…..to use it melee…
(shotgun? its a rifle not a shotgun, deal with it or give engineers a weapon only they can use and name it shotgun… -_- )

Warrior’s can use them quite well for dmg, but they lack all other then. No cc besides the insanely needed, but still quite useless in pvp cripple. There are no real complementer skills eather, since its a weapon for a warrior he can use, but not really his weapon.
( why not just give rifle then to Thief and Ranger then? They could use it atleast to full potential and leave the classes that are not fit for it then, instead of underdesigned option that can be used up seriously….its just there.)

I kind of wanted to make a decent class centered araund The predator because i loved it, but basically the only 2 options are quite dissapointing…seriously…why are rifles in game at all if they are just an “option”, you cant use to full potential.

Exuse my terrible english, but i was really dissapointed after 2 days of testing in pvp with both classes to decide whitch to play….

Engineers were originally, from what I have heard, not supposed to have Rifles. They were called shot guns (notice how some rifles look like shotguns).

I wish that the Rifle could output more dps in an engineer, but rifle is kit support rather than standalone dps.

I use a rifle on my warrior. It complements a sword MH crit/bleed build exceptionally well, as the rifle auto attack stacks bleed and rifle crits can hit for quite a bit (in addition to stacking more bleeds on crit due to sigil and trait). I could use the rifle as my primary easily without changing my build or gear.

Warrior is perfectly viable for warrior. I don’t have an engineer so I can’t comment there. Would like to see rifle rangers though.

There are some people who use the rifle as their main weapon, and melee weapons as their secondary set. Rifles naturally have the furthest range of all weapons (I think) which might make up for the issues you brought up. I typically use the rifle to pull monsters and take down most of their life before the reach me. I then decide to keep shooting them to death or but out my melee weapon to finish them.

I mean the auto-attack on a rifle for the engineer is hardly “weak”, but the rifle scales extremely well with power as opposed to pistols which scale well with condition dmg. Engineers also have kits, so the rifle is merely one of many tools at your disposal that you use depending on the situation. For example, I use jump shot sometimes as a quick getaway or the knockback shot for a quick interrupt or the net shot if something requires a little CC.

For warriors, it might be weak… but considering the bread n’ butter is in their melee, why would you make them super awesome at range as well?

I swapped my warrior to longbow for its AoE and tricks like blind and immobilize, but I still think the rifle has solid single-target DPS and utility.

But I might be naive?

My main issue with it on warriors is that it uses condition damage on its autoattack. I mean… okay… admittedly I don’t like condition damage, but it’s also pretty out of place with all the rest of its skills. It even has one just for causing vulnerability. You know what vulnerability is really nice for? Not condition damage.

That, and there are no interesting utilities to go with range.

Nekroseth:

Okay, I don’t have anything to say about rifles (I haven’t really had much of a chance to use one), but I did want to correct one thing:

Your English is in no way terrible! If you hadn’t said something I would have had no idea that English was not your first language.

Carry on. :-)

Engineer Rifle deals really good damage actually, you have to understand that not every weapon has it’s 2-5 skills built for dealing more damage than it’s auto-attack.

it shares this trait with a Guardian’s Hammer in that skills 2-4 are mostly situational.

LameFox.6349:

My main issue with it on warriors is that it uses condition damage on its autoattack. I mean… okay… admittedly I don’t like condition damage, but it’s also pretty out of place with all the rest of its skills. It even has one just for causing vulnerability. You know what vulnerability is really nice for? Not condition damage.

That, and there are no interesting utilities to go with range.

Actually, vulnerability does impact condition dmg… it’s just barely noticeable because 1% increased dmg on a 100 dmg/tick isn’t as noticeable as 1% increased dmg on an attack that’s typically closer to that 1000+ dmg range. Even at 25 stacks (25% increased dmg), it still favors direct dmg…. That’s because conditions ignore armor anyway whereas direct damage doesn’t and is multiplied by the ratio of power to defense.

@Lorana Frankly, I wish that was how most skill sets worked. The most effective weapon kits seem to be ones with a strong autoattack, a single powerful damage skill, and then the rest being situation or utility skills. That said, I’d like it if Blunderbuss either had better range or damage, but I’m rather pleased with engineer rifles in general, it being a versatile ranged weapon with a powerful close-range focus.

Oh, and I wish that Jump Shot didn’t root you at the end. That blows.

yeah, the engi rifle damage by itself isn’t great. Blunderbus has a nice short cooldown, though and the jump attack does some pretty good damage but it’s made terrible by the fact that you are vulnerable to damage during the second long duration of the jump. Rifle 4 even breaks snares which is awesome.

To make the most use out of the rifle, though, you should be dropping combo fields and shooting through them. There are a ton of them available.

I would have thought it would be far more noticeable, considering it would change from 100 100 100 to 101 101 101 instead of the direct attack which varies a lot anyway. I’ll mess around with it on target golems when I wake up and see. Mainly I expected it only to affect direct damage because of the way it’s worded in the wiki (plus that it says vulnerability increases direct damage, but makes no mention of it when talking about condition damage; see http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Damage ).

I could be wrong… but I guess when I have 16-25 stacks of bleeds going and I notice the numbers getting progressively larger as vulnerability stacks increase, I sort of put the two together without actually seeing if that was the reason

Pretty much all builds in this game are much more effective when swapping weapons/kits/elements regularly or even require doing so to function at all, that seems to be part of the design. The exception are some cheesy burst builds.

For Warrior Rifle/Bow for a pure ranged character has some good synergy, imo it’s mostly suited to a support build and not that good 1vs1 though. Same goes for the popular Rifle/Sword+Warhorn combination. Rifle and 2xSword can stack bleeds with the best of them and is excellent sustained damage in a condition based build. Some people also go with Rifle and Axes in a power based build, I haven’t tried that myself though.

One thing you have to keep in mind regarding ranged weapons in general is that they do less damage than melee by design, so when using a primarily ranged build going full glass cannon is usually a bad idea. You either need tons of control ( i.e. be a Ranger ) or go for some defensive stats and utilities in a more balanced build.

for those concerned about the Engineers Jump Shot, i’ll bring this video to your attention.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUAGHoZOur4

bug or not, look at how smooth that landing is.

I got a talent on my engineer that can have the rifle cause blindness on crits. Haven’t tested it out yet but I like the idea of being able to blind things on an auto attack.

Hmm, whell i must admit, i read quite many (!!!) interesting posts.
First of all thank you Mimbaguy .

Second, i realized, there are decent uses (if its the truth) for both Engineer and Warrior, even with only slight weapon swaps, and use of kits.

The combo field-shoot trough sounds quite good, considering how good some cc can be in a real pvp fight, trough i still hate the shotgun concept and the melee ranges on Engineer. (even trough i must melee quite to much in pvp).
-And the whole thing of : shooting from the hip with the Predator , that clearly looks like a supersniper rifle.

Third. Whell i was thinking on warriors, why does it feel strange to see them use rifles as they do, even trough they use it in some quite awesome way. (even considering they lack utility and cc when dooing so→not counting utility slots)
Warriors are not supposed to be a class that can use a rifle with high precision, making Aimed shot’s, and Kill shots, i can accept the rest of the skills trough.
-the whole feeling it gives is like, it should be a Thief or Assasin skill set.
It is there role to make percise, aimed shots, with big lethality. Warrior is a more frontal and direct class, he should be having the more shotgun like skills, instead of Engineer.

Whell owerall, i still miss a bit of indetail work with the weapon considering the current state, but i am a bit more satisfied now, after hearing all these, the more i think abaut it i want to play a Warrior, the more i let my feelings guide me, i want to play an Engineer.

Might be for the reson, there are so many topics abaut Engineer to have a way to use rifle in some more ranged way (like a sniper kit), it might be really implemented afterall in the moderate future. Your opinions on this?

I am also going to make a suggestion for Engineer (not sure here or suggestion topic?) to have its shoot animation revorked for atleast auto shoot when using The predator…(the shoot from hip really looks odd…..)