Guild Wars 2

I will get into a fresh Silverwastes, and create a group in the LFG tool to taxi people into an otherwise fairly empty map.

I will have people join my group, then hijack it for other purposes. They never taxi into Silverwastes. They end up kicking me from the group I myself started, informing me in the process that the group is “not an SW taxi group!”

This is not a big problem (at worst, a small amount of time wasted), but does qualify (IMO) as a bit of a bizarre and senseless non-sequitur. Why would people do this? How could people be this confused?

Happens to me reliably a couple times a week, including just before posting this.

First Update: Happened to me AGAIN, just after posting this (19:10 server time), by a character named “Alexito”. Started a taxi group, random people joined but did not taxi, then I was kicked from the group. Sent annoyed whispers to perpetrator, received no response. If this is going to happen frequently, it WILL be a big problem.

See attached screen shot.

Second Update: Second screen shot is of the earlier incident that triggered this post. If you read the fine print in the second screen shot, it appears my group was hijacked for a level 9 fractal! First screen shot is of subsequent incident described in my “Update”. All users reported in-game for LFG abuse.

Are people hijacking unrelated groups because they are suppressed? If so, I need a way to report this!!! Could this be a bug in the LFG tool and just an honest mistake? Has anyone else seen anything like this?

Might be that some group miss merged with you.

What’s your LFG description? They might be joining thinking that you are doing something else. Taxi people in quite a bit and don’t run into this. Sometimes I might have people linger a little but they usually get the idea as the group fills and empties pretty quick.

The reverse happened to me and I was quite puzzled by it. I was setting up a defense party for Teq and people that joined it kept getting kicked. When I asked why I was told that it was ‘reserved’ to taxi people in. Letting them have their taxi I left to form an actual defense party. Then at the last minute, after saying nothing for almost an hour, they announced they were the ‘real’ defense party for that location and nobody should listen to me (I was organizing other parties and the whole event so it probably confused the whole map).

As to why it happens? I am not sure. Even when the purpose of the party is clear in both of our cases people want to make the party something else. So no, it is not a LFG problem as I was using /map … maybe it is a communications problem somehow?

You can report for LFG abuse, which this certainly is.

TheGrimm.5624:

What’s your LFG description?

See my screenshot, which I probably added (to the original post) after you replied.

I ALWAYS use something like “SW X% N/4”, etc. I.e. “SW”, plus a summary of map progress, plus optional instructions like “taxi” and/or “plz taxi and leave thx”, etc.

ALWAYS.

Hard to imagine these people are confused regarding MY intent (they could always be confused about what THEY may be trying to do). But… after thinking about it, I suspect they are suppressed (or just griefing) and doing it deliberately… which makes it harassment as far as I am concerned.

Menadena.7482:

The reverse happened to me and I was quite puzzled by it. I was setting up a defense party for Teq and people that joined it kept getting kicked. When I asked why I was told that it was ‘reserved’ to taxi people in. Letting them have their taxi I left to form an actual defense party. Then at the last minute, after saying nothing for almost an hour, they announced they were the ‘real’ defense party for that location and nobody should listen to me (I was organizing other parties and the whole event so it probably confused the whole map).

As to why it happens? I am not sure. Even when the purpose of the party is clear in both of our cases people want to make the party something else. So no, it is not a LFG problem as I was using /map … maybe it is a communications problem somehow?

I wonder if I was there. I joined someone who was starting n hills. Got kicked seconds later and when I asked why, they said they were defense but currently doing taxis. One minute to teq spawn and people start screaming there’s no n hills lol.

I have had people join my lfg and kick me or leave party so it’s removed. This only happens in SW or teq, I just assume they’re trolling or trying to remove other maps’ lfgs so theirs fills first.

Nope now that you have the screen shot up description doesn’t seem confusing, that is odd.

I had this happen to me while trying to group for HotW p1 and there was this group of 2 people wanting to do story that merged with me and started being kittens and saying this was a story run.

that is like a 1 in a 1000 case

i never had something such weird happen to me

just ignore it and start another lfg
obviously they are the ones who lose out if they dont make use of the taxi

rhapsody.3615:

Menadena.7482:

The reverse happened to me and I was quite puzzled by it. I was setting up a defense party for Teq and people that joined it kept getting kicked. When I asked why I was told that it was ‘reserved’ to taxi people in. Letting them have their taxi I left to form an actual defense party. Then at the last minute, after saying nothing for almost an hour, they announced they were the ‘real’ defense party for that location and nobody should listen to me (I was organizing other parties and the whole event so it probably confused the whole map).

As to why it happens? I am not sure. Even when the purpose of the party is clear in both of our cases people want to make the party something else. So no, it is not a LFG problem as I was using /map … maybe it is a communications problem somehow?

I wonder if I was there. I joined someone who was starting n hills. Got kicked seconds later and when I asked why, they said they were defense but currently doing taxis. One minute to teq spawn and people start screaming there’s no n hills lol.

I have had people join my lfg and kick me or leave party so it’s removed. This only happens in SW or teq, I just assume they’re trolling or trying to remove other maps’ lfgs so theirs fills first.

Yes, that sounds like you were there. The person in it with a purplish cmdr tag was me (but I forget what char I was using that day, maybe Sya). We wound up running to do S hills but the entire time we were keeping an eye peeled for what would happen in n hill.

Having never used LFG I wonder how often what you experienced happens?

Thanks for all the responses. Good to know I am not insane :-).

At this point, I am convinced people are hijacking groups because they are suppressed and can’t form their own… though the theory that people are undermining groups for other maps to promote their own is also viable. Either way: Harrassment!

I will try again later, and follow up here if it happens again (assuming I can find this thread again). Reported all of the associated users (who show in the screen shots), in game, for LFG abuse.

Now that I know what is happening, I can just use the in-game feature to report all who vote to kick me for LFG abuse and get back to playing the game (Unlike the people who drop a merchant/banker and then camp on the big chest in Hidden Depths, to prevent other players from accessing it , there IS a way to report THIS sort of griefing). Screen shots and editing a forum post is time consuming, and probably not necessary :-).

acapela.8215:

I will get into a fresh Silverwastes, and create a group in the LFG tool to taxi people into an otherwise fairly empty map.

I will have people join my group, then hijack it for other purposes. They never taxi into Silverwastes. They end up kicking me from the group I myself started, informing me in the process that the group is “not an SW taxi group!”

This is not a big problem (at worst, a small amount of time wasted), but does qualify (IMO) as a bit of a bizarre and senseless non-sequitur. Why would people do this? How could people be this confused?

Happens to me reliably a couple times a week, including just before posting this.

First Update: Happened to me AGAIN, just after posting this (19:10 server time), by a character named “Alexito”. Started a taxi group, random people joined but did not taxi, then I was kicked from the group. Sent annoyed whispers to perpetrator, received no response. If this is going to happen frequently, it WILL be a big problem.

See attached screen shot.

Second Update: Second screen shot is of the earlier incident that triggered this post. If you read the fine print in the second screen shot, it appears my group was hijacked for a level 9 fractal! First screen shot is of subsequent incident described in my “Update”. All users reported in-game for LFG abuse.

Are people hijacking unrelated groups because they are suppressed? If so, I need a way to report this!!! Could this be a bug in the LFG tool and just an honest mistake? Has anyone else seen anything like this?

Well since you posted this here, I thought I should clarify that the LFG you joined, as the fifth person there for removing the group from the LFG, was for a Fractal listed in the Fractals Category 1-9. See attached for listed under scales 1-9

You can’t name and shame, remove names asap, or.mods will lock thread. ANets rules, not mine.

cbenner.8041:

acapela.8215:

I will get into a fresh Silverwastes, and create a group in the LFG tool to taxi people into an otherwise fairly empty map.

I will have people join my group, then hijack it for other purposes. They never taxi into Silverwastes. They end up kicking me from the group I myself started, informing me in the process that the group is “not an SW taxi group!”

This is not a big problem (at worst, a small amount of time wasted), but does qualify (IMO) as a bit of a bizarre and senseless non-sequitur. Why would people do this? How could people be this confused?

Happens to me reliably a couple times a week, including just before posting this.

First Update: Happened to me AGAIN, just after posting this (19:10 server time), by a character named “Alexito”. Started a taxi group, random people joined but did not taxi, then I was kicked from the group. Sent annoyed whispers to perpetrator, received no response. If this is going to happen frequently, it WILL be a big problem.

See attached screen shot.

Second Update: Second screen shot is of the earlier incident that triggered this post. If you read the fine print in the second screen shot, it appears my group was hijacked for a level 9 fractal! First screen shot is of subsequent incident described in my “Update”. All users reported in-game for LFG abuse.

Are people hijacking unrelated groups because they are suppressed? If so, I need a way to report this!!! Could this be a bug in the LFG tool and just an honest mistake? Has anyone else seen anything like this?

Well since you posted this here, I thought I should clarify that the LFG you joined, as the fifth person there for removing the group from the LFG, was for a Fractal listed in the Fractals Category 1-9. See attached for listed under scales 1-9

Why are you posting Fractal Groups under open world content?

videoboy.4162:

cbenner.8041:

acapela.8215:

I will get into a fresh Silverwastes, and create a group in the LFG tool to taxi people into an otherwise fairly empty map.

I will have people join my group, then hijack it for other purposes. They never taxi into Silverwastes. They end up kicking me from the group I myself started, informing me in the process that the group is “not an SW taxi group!”

This is not a big problem (at worst, a small amount of time wasted), but does qualify (IMO) as a bit of a bizarre and senseless non-sequitur. Why would people do this? How could people be this confused?

Happens to me reliably a couple times a week, including just before posting this.

First Update: Happened to me AGAIN, just after posting this (19:10 server time), by a character named “Alexito”. Started a taxi group, random people joined but did not taxi, then I was kicked from the group. Sent annoyed whispers to perpetrator, received no response. If this is going to happen frequently, it WILL be a big problem.

See attached screen shot.

Second Update: Second screen shot is of the earlier incident that triggered this post. If you read the fine print in the second screen shot, it appears my group was hijacked for a level 9 fractal! First screen shot is of subsequent incident described in my “Update”. All users reported in-game for LFG abuse.

Are people hijacking unrelated groups because they are suppressed? If so, I need a way to report this!!! Could this be a bug in the LFG tool and just an honest mistake? Has anyone else seen anything like this?

Well since you posted this here, I thought I should clarify that the LFG you joined, as the fifth person there for removing the group from the LFG, was for a Fractal listed in the Fractals Category 1-9. See attached for listed under scales 1-9

Why are you posting Fractal Groups under open world content?

If you read the image it is listed under “Scale 1-9” Fractals

Hmm, I wonder how he ended up in there, while looking for SW. Weird. Even weirder that it shows it was changed from it’s original listing.

cbenner.8041:

Well since you posted this here, I thought I should clarify that the LFG you joined, as the fifth person there for removing the group from the LFG, was for a Fractal listed in the Fractals Category 1-9. See attached for listed under scales 1-9

Yeah, you may have joined the group after it had been hijacked. It was originally created (by me) as an SW taxi group.

The creation activity was no longer available in the chat backlog, or I would have included it. Also missing is some party chat from me asking people to please taxi to SW and leave group so I could start a new taxi, followed by one of the party members informing me that my SW taxi group was not an SW taxi group.

What IS included in the chat log is the group listing being changed (to fractal 9 yadda yadda), then me (the original group creator) being kicked.

Note: I will be reporting all members of such a group (i.e. a group created by me and then subsequently hijacked) for LFG abuse, as a matter of course, either at the point I am kicked or I figure out what has happened and leave. I would recommend everyone else do the same.

I probably won’t take the time to try to sort out who could/not reasonably have known the original purpose of the group by parsing the chat log, etc.

Be advised that there are people out there playing these sorts of trick :-(.

Looking at both your screen shots it looks like the game bugged and joined both your LFGs together. You both look like you posted under two separate sections, I can see the Open World Content and the Fractals 1-9 section. Have to admit its cool you both have screens of the issue. Not a griefing issue. Was there a patch today?

videoboy.4162:

Hmm, I wonder how he ended up in there, while looking for SW. Weird. Even weirder that it shows it was changed from it’s original listing.

Can you create a new LFG while in a LFG? At work right now so can’t try this.

TheGrimm.5624:

videoboy.4162:

Hmm, I wonder how he ended up in there, while looking for SW. Weird. Even weirder that it shows it was changed from it’s original listing.

Can you create a new LFG while in a LFG? At work right now so can’t try this.

I have no idea. I just figured it glitched and found it weird.

TheGrimm.5624:

videoboy.4162:

Hmm, I wonder how he ended up in there, while looking for SW. Weird. Even weirder that it shows it was changed from it’s original listing.

Can you create a new LFG while in a LFG? At work right now so can’t try this.

Just tested, if you are in a LFG group already, going to that tab allows you to remove the listing or edit description.

If you join a LFG, same thing as well as in the chat log it says the description has been changed upon joining

Im guessing we did encounter a glitch though because out of the hundred times I have used LFG this is the first I have had that happen, ive had a few crosses before but they were dungeon vs dungeon not fractals vs silverwastes.

TheGrimm.5624:

videoboy.4162:

Hmm, I wonder how he ended up in there, while looking for SW. Weird. Even weirder that it shows it was changed from it’s original listing.

Can you create a new LFG while in a LFG? At work right now so can’t try this.

Any party member can change the current LFG or create a new one.

This system is so ripe for abuse, every time a story like this pops up, I just shake my head and move on.

TheGrimm.5624:

Looking at both your screen shots it looks like the game bugged and joined both your LFGs together. You both look like you posted under two separate sections, I can see the Open World Content and the Fractals 1-9 section. Have to admit its cool you both have screens of the issue. Not a griefing issue. Was there a patch today?

Not certain of this. The order of the messages shown in that screen shot does not quite match what I see when I create a group, and then change the description. See the attached screen shot.

The chat log does not seem to receive messages when people join/leave groups. If it did, we could probably determine from the other user’s screen shot when I joined the group relative to when it description was changed, I was kicked, etc.

Anyway, in the attached screen shot, the first three lines are the group creation. Next line is the description change. Final line is from removal of the group from LFG. Doesn’t look quite the same to me. (Only my character name shows in this scree shot, sorry for the earlier screen shots/etc.) The other user’s screen shot seems to show a description change message, but not a creation message. Part of this hypothetical defect?

Nevertheless, you could be right that we were all innocently caught up in some sort of defect. If so, maybe all of this is enough documentation to give Anet what it needs to address the issue.

Just seems we have had a number of posts pop up just today about weird instances with the LFG tool.

TheGrimm.5624:

Just seems we have had a number of posts pop up just today about weird instances with the LFG tool.

My guess then is we encountered a glitch and hopefully ANet can figure out what caused it

@cbenner, was one of your group Silver Wasting while you were building the fractal group? Almost wonder if they accidentally joined your groups together while waiting and while you were doing your own LFG posting. Still will be watching for weirdness tonight when doing the same kind of taxi jobs and have had people merge groups by accident, but not while creating a new LFG post hence the question about it allowing a listing while already in a LFG group listing. Thanks all for the screen shots, this might help point out an issue in the tool.

@thegrimm, No a guild mate and I had created the group for fractals and had been waiting 5-10 mins before people started to show up in the group so unless one of the others joining was in a silverwastes LFG group and merged parties without knowing, I have no idea how they got merged or crossed

cbenner.8041:

@thegrimm, No a guild mate and I had created the group for fractals and had been waiting 5-10 mins before people started to show up in the group so unless one of the others joining was in a silverwastes LFG group and merged parties without knowing, I have no idea how they got merged or crossed

This is actually a plausible explanation. What gets me is that this apparently happened to me twice in ~20 minutes. REALLY WEIRD!!!

acapela.8215:

cbenner.8041:

@thegrimm, No a guild mate and I had created the group for fractals and had been waiting 5-10 mins before people started to show up in the group so unless one of the others joining was in a silverwastes LFG group and merged parties without knowing, I have no idea how they got merged or crossed

This is actually a plausible explanation. What gets me is that something like this happened to me twice in ~20 minutes. REALLY WEIRD!!!

Twice in~20 mins is weird for sure but then again im sure stranger things have happened before

Ive had this happen to me a few times. A lot of the time I dont get kicked and they just start a dungeon on their own, and i wont figure it out until they start talking in /p about something dungeon related.

Could has something to do with people who dont know how to use LFG and just put everything in the open world section, and then somehow misclick on your group. Not really a bad thing (unless they start sending you hate tells too), but it is odd.

So, out on my hike, I worked through a set of rules or “constraints” that I think could resolve this issue. As follows:

Treat merge actions as “special”, requiring explicit confirmation.

Treat the “originators” of groups listed in LFG as “special”, so they can’t get jerked around by clumsy or malicious people.

Individual players may explicitly invite/join at any time, as they do now (i.e. subject to relevant acceptance/cancellation, etc).

Any group member who lists their pre-existing group in LFG is considered the resulting group’s “originator”. Any individual player who initiates an LFG listing is considered the resulting group’s “originator”.

Any member of a group may initiate a merge of their existing group into a target group. When a merge is initiated, each member of the existing group is prompted; if they answer “yes” they transfer to the target group (subject to other constraints); if they answer “no” or time out, they do not transfer to the target group; if they are the “originator” of the existing group and do not transfer, their group remains listed in LFG (subject to other constraints).

When a merge is initiated from another group, the originator/“leader” of the target group is prompted; if they answer “yes”, players may transfer into the target group (subject to other constraints); if they answer “no” or time out, players may not transfer into the target group; the target group remains listed in LFG (subject to other constraints).

An “originator” cannot be kicked involuntarily from their group. If a vote to kick an “originator” passes, the “originator” is prompted; if they answer “yes” they depart the group; if they answer “no” or time out, they remain in the group. The group remains listed in LFG (subject to other constraints). If the kicking players want their own group, they are free to leave and form one, after first insuring they have successfully taxied wherever they were hoping to end up. This assumes the group has not merged (i.e. the “originator” has never acquiesced to transfer to another group).

The “originator” of the target group that ultimately results from one or more merge actions is considered the “originator” of that ultimate group (i.e. this is the one “originator” who has never acquiesced to transfer to another group; if an “originator” acquiesces to transfer to another group, they cease to be an “originator”; there can be only one).

All existing mechanisms for de-listing groups from LFG apply: group fills, “originator” transfers to another group, “originator” changes maps or disconnects, whatever; I am not necessarily clear on all of these.

Other obvious constraints: groups can’t exceed 5 members, any player transfer as part of a merge that would result in a target group exceeding 5 members will be precluded, etc; I am not necessarily clear on all of these.

Something like this would add some complexity, and require players to be responsive to prompts… but it would preclude weird hijacking behavior such as I have been experiencing, whether deliberate or inadvertent.