Guild Wars 2

I’m starting this thread as a discussion because ANet seem to be genuinely listening to the community and trying to give players what they’ve been asking for. They have made two decisions lately that I consider controversial, and I thought it would be useful to provide community feedback:

1) Okaying the SAB tribulation exploit, which devalued the tribulation skins (in terms of exclusiveness, but not gold value).
2) Added old skins to the mystic forge, which devalued them (in terms of exclusiveness and in terms of gold value).

I’d also say that this goes back to previous skins which were exclusive such as the Fervid Censer and the Wizard Hat.

I just thought that, as ANet are listening, it might be a good idea to talk. This seems to be an issue where there is division among players, but both sides can’t be made perfectly happy.

For me, I think that the trib skins and the Fervid Censer should have remained exclusive, for the sole reason that there were alternative palette swaps available, which seemed a good compromise. Things like the Wizard Hat and Halloween skins, I’m less sure.

As far as the SAB skins go, Anet released a statement about it. While they weren’t going to punish those who used the exploit, they were going to work to remove it before next year.

From a financial standpoint limiting access seems pointless. They have to spend time which is money to pay these people to develop skins. Limiting availability to them is an absolute waste. When they make a skin they need to leave the method of acquisition in the game. Even if it is seasonal – like SAB, Wintersday, etc… Making a skin show up briefly never to be seen again is a waste of money.

Same goes for stuff like Living story season 1. The marionette should be back as a world boss. The dungeons that were made should be left permanently. They spent time and money making content just to take it out. Mechanics are there, stuff is designed, leave it out there.

“Should any skins be exclusive?” – I think it’s okay if some skins are restricted / rare but they should come back at least once or twice a year to give new players a fair chance to get them (events or gem store sales like the bunny ears). This is important since GW2’s endgame is mostly about collecting stuff including skins and people enjoy customizing their characters. We are talking about pixels in a video game, I don’t see the point of exclusive virtual items.

IMO, exclusivity should only be linked to play quality. Some things could be rare, that’s ok, but “exclusive”? That word should only apply to things really hard to obtain, gameplay-wise NOT through RNG, NOT through wallet prowess.

TLDR: Exclusive items/skins should only be obtained through gameplay, and Account Bound on Acquire.

I think exclusive is ok, but it should be for specific things, not a ton of different things. I think there needs to be a healthy balance.

The halloween items for example should never have been exclusive. They weren’t announced a exclusive, they were announced as halloween items. It was expected they’d return the following holiday, but when they didn’t it drove up the price artificially. That is the bad kind of exclusive.

On the other hand, items associated with season 1 LS should have remained exclusive, or at least a few of them. We knew well in advance it was a limited time evolving story in which you were rewarded for being there when it was released. These skins should have been exclusive to that time period. However they also should have been less RNG and more hard work and effort, so that you could get the exclusive reward if you wanted it, but it wasn’t just up to luck.

Other rewards should be exclusive to finishing hard content, but always be available. Things like lindari, raid armor, PvP back piece, etc. These are locked behind specific content but anyone can do this content and earn the reward. This imo is the best exclusive reward as it allows anyone at anytime to get it if they are willing to put in the work that everyone else did.

In summary there are 3 kinds of “exclusive” rewards.

1. RNG exclusive, this is not a good kind and should not exist
2. Time exclusive, this is better and ok for big events but should be used sparingly
3. Work/content exclusive, this is the best kind of exclusive and should be present in all parts of the game.

I’ve always thought discontinued yet tradable items have a place in mmorpgs. Mind you I started off on Runescape where discontinued items were a large part of the economy due to being the pinnacle of fashionscape/status. We’re spoiled for choice in Fashion Wars 2 and we have legendary weapons that kind of fill that niche. GW2 is also a bit different in regards to hoarding; it’s easier to control a discontinued market like that due to being able to see all orders and listings on the TP.

That being said, it sounds like they’re super rare from the Mystic Forge which I think is a reasonable middle ground. I’d be livid if they had done something similar to what they did for the Aetherpath weapons. Basically I am happy for them to have a supply that sees these types of weapons in the 200 – 800g range rather than the 2000+ range.

What confuses me is just the seemingly random nature of what skins Anet have decided they will bring back. Can we expect to see every single tradable discontinued skin come back now in some form? It seems arbitrary and unfair if it isn’t the case. I can’t wait to see the Molten Jetpack return. Why do I have a bad feeling they’re going to be really inconsistent on this.

I’m 100% against limited skins, all they do is add to ones “special snowflake” status, which isn’t a good thing.

cakemonkey.6347:

From a financial standpoint limiting access seems pointless. They have to spend time which is money to pay these people to develop skins. Limiting availability to them is an absolute waste.

However this isn’t true. Limited items and/or limited time releases are intended to create a buying frenzy. “Only available for x days”; makes a person think if I don’t get it now I might not get it, so if you think you might want it you better get it or you may miss out completely.

Miku.6297:

I’m 100% against limited skins, all they do is add to ones “special snowflake” status, which isn’t a good thing.

I don’t agree with the special snowflake thing. Partly because I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it, but also because having goals is important to the game.

If everything is easily gettable, then what are players supposed to do to entertain themselves during content droughts. The mechanics of the game are good, and the world is fun to explore, but after three and a half years things can get a bit repetitive. That’s why having targets to work towards is a good thing.

If people can just get everything really easily (SAB trib skins) or really cheaply (Halloween skins), then what is there to keep people coming back year after year? If you see something you like, you just get it, wear it and then… what?

i am waiting for thereturn of the molten backpack and the glorious day they add BLC weapons ingame, to make room for the hundred new ones…

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Miku.6297:

I’m 100% against limited skins, all they do is add to ones “special snowflake” status, which isn’t a good thing.

I don’t agree with the special snowflake thing. Partly because I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it, but also because having goals is important to the game.

If everything is easily gettable, then what are players supposed to do to entertain themselves during content droughts. The mechanics of the game are good, and the world is fun to explore, but after three and a half years things can get a bit repetitive. That’s why having targets to work towards is a good thing.

If people can just get everything really easily (SAB trib skins) or really cheaply (Halloween skins), then what is there to keep people coming back year after year? If you see something you like, you just get it, wear it and then… what?

Well, I know ONE thing they won’t be doing during content droughts – Getting limited items that are no longer available.

Miku.6297:

I’m 100% against limited skins, all they do is add to ones “special snowflake” status, which isn’t a good thing.

cakemonkey.6347:

From a financial standpoint limiting access seems pointless. They have to spend time which is money to pay these people to develop skins. Limiting availability to them is an absolute waste.

However this isn’t true. Limited items and/or limited time releases are intended to create a buying frenzy. “Only available for x days”; makes a person think if I don’t get it now I might not get it, so if you think you might want it you better get it or you may miss out completely.

Without sales data you can’t tell if it’s true or not. Do you want money you spend on this game going to temporary content for few, or content for many? That’s the issue at hand.

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I don’t agree with the special snowflake thing. Partly because I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it, but also because having goals is important to the game.

If everything is easily gettable, then what are players supposed to do to entertain themselves during content droughts.

That flat out doesn’t make sense… If an item is unavailable how can that be your “goal”… You can’t get it, it’s not a matter of easily or hard to get, it’s NOT available. If earning an unavailable item is your goal, you can’t even really work towards that goal, you just wait and hope it shows up again some day, which you have literally no influence on when/if that happens.

cakemonkey.6347:

Without sales data you can’t tell if it’s true or not. Do you want money you spend on this game going to temporary content for few, or content for many? That’s the issue at hand.

Pretty sure there is a reason many online game companies, and retailers feature items/offers like that. A-net doesn’t provide sales data, but you can extrapolate from other sources to figure out a possible trend in marketing. To answer your question at the end, obvious I would prefer unlimited/non temporary content, like I said at the start of my post

Permanently exclusive items? No. This creates resentment in the player base who missed the item.

Previously exclusive but later easy to obtain items? No. This creates resentment in the player base who already own the item.

Previously exclusive items that return and require effort to get? Yes. This allows the items to have value to old and new owners alike. This is a compromise that is inclusive to all parties.

~EW

Miku.6297:

A-net doesn’t provide sales data, but you can extrapolate from other sources to figure out a possible trend in marketing.

If it’s that profitable then the easy answer is we need more exclusive temporary content in order to keep the game running. That would be best use of developer time.

My opinion is that everyone should have the opportunity to earn the skins and items they want.

For example the Clockheart mini pet is exclusive to people who complete all the Aetherpath achievements and is arguably a prestigious reward item. But no one is locked out of getting it – the dungeon and the achievements are available to everyone to do. (And yes I realise some players have disabilities, valid reasons to refuse to ever play in a party or whatever else which means they are unable to complete those achievements and that is a valid concern, but my point is the option to attempt it is there.)

Whereas the mini Mr. Sparkles is exclusive to people who attended a few specific real-life events in 2013 or bought 4,000 gems (with cash) during December 2013. It doesn’t matter if someone attends one of those events at any other time, or buys 4,000, 5,000 or even 10,000 gems in any other month. No matter what they do, or are willing to do, they cannot get it.

IMO the first example is absolutely fine and the second is a problem which should be addressed.

(BTW if anyone’s wondering I don’t have a mini Clockheart yet and I do have Mr. Sparkles.)

The same goes for other items. Some are a bit more of a grey area like the Halloween skins which were technically still available (through the TP) for anyone who wanted them, but the cost was disproportionately high compared to the cost of getting them when they were originally available.

But in general I’d much rather everyone could work towards items they want than some people get arbitrarily locked out just so some of those who have it can imagine it’s a bit more special.

cakemonkey.6347:

Miku.6297:

A-net doesn’t provide sales data, but you can extrapolate from other sources to figure out a possible trend in marketing.

If it’s that profitable then the easy answer is we need more exclusive temporary content in order to keep the game running. That would be best use of developer time.

Unfortunately it may be… Example: Look at the frenzy bunny ears caused by being “limited” when they first showed up. Then the hype train got going for maybe getting them back, I’m curious how many ears A-net sold on that last re-release.

Simple answer is no. Some skins should be hard to get. Spending thousands of gold is not being exclusive. Having skins locked behind yearly content is ok, as long as you can earn them every year. I personally want thing I can work towards, not pray to RNGsus. I think 99% of the skins I use where in the game from day 1, or are still available to get now. I think the only exception to this is the mad memories (both books). I have no problem with ANet making this item available again. Or anything else. Just because I don’t want skins dose not me other people should not be able to get them, as long as they put in the effort, and not get lucky.

There should definitely be exclusive or obscenly rare skins (either ultra low chance to find it, like precusor or less chance or more work than a mere legendary). It is hard to find anything in this game that other people cannot get, too. Even legendaries are easy to mass produce (at least for me).
This is a game where we have cosmetic progression over statistical progression, but I am not feeling it. Other than a few few untradeable retired skins or the 29k+ achievement point skins there is nothing in this game you cant get in a short amount of time.
Personally I am very disappointed of Anets new direction which I consider “cosmetic communism”. It is devaluing peoples work/time/luck/money they spent on getting those rare skins.
And before people start with their stupid definitions of prestige, I can tell you the real meaning of prestige from a wordbook: it comes from the latin word “praestigia” and means “delusion, illusion, trick”

Danikat.8537:

My opinion is that everyone should have the opportunity to earn the skins and items they want.

For example the Clockheart mini pet is exclusive to people who complete all the Aetherpath achievements and is arguably a prestigious reward item. But no one is locked out of getting it – the dungeon and the achievements are available to everyone to do. (And yes I realise some players have disabilities, valid reasons to refuse to ever play in a party or whatever else which means they are unable to complete those achievements and that is a valid concern, but my point is the option to attempt it is there.)

Whereas the mini Mr. Sparkles is exclusive to people who attended a few specific real-life events in 2013 or bought 4,000 gems (with cash) during December 2013. It doesn’t matter if someone attends one of those events at any other time, or buys 4,000, 5,000 or even 10,000 gems in any other month. No matter what they do, or are willing to do, they cannot get it.

IMO the first example is absolutely fine and the second is a problem which should be addressed.

(BTW if anyone’s wondering I don’t have a mini Clockheart yet and I do have Mr. Sparkles.)

The same goes for other items. Some are a bit more of a grey area like the Halloween skins which were technically still available (through the TP) for anyone who wanted them, but the cost was disproportionately high compared to the cost of getting them when they were originally available.

But in general I’d much rather everyone could work towards items they want than some people get arbitrarily locked out just so some of those who have it can imagine it’s a bit more special.

Oh please, the clockwork miniature has zero prestige. You can get all the achievements in one play through of that dungeon path. And if you are desperate you can pay people 30g to boost you through those achievements.
Mini Sparkles on the other hand is prestigious because it is almost impossible to get (there are probably some codes for it left over out there, but probably hard to find someone willing to give/sell it to you)

Malediktus.9250:

Oh please, the clockwork miniature has zero prestige. You can get all the achievements in one play through of that dungeon path. And if you are desperate you can pay people 30g to boost you through those achievements.
Mini Sparkles on the other hand is prestigious because it is almost impossible to get (there are probably some codes for it left over out there, but probably hard to find someone willing to give/sell it to you)

I disagree, the clock work mini has more prestige, it’s something you can earn through in game play. Yes you could buy people to carry you through the cheevos, but you could also get them the normal way.

Items that you can ONLY earn by buying them aren’t prestigious, that’s why the new legendary weapons aren’t trade able… To preserve the prestige of having them.

Malediktus.9250:

Danikat.8537:

My opinion is that everyone should have the opportunity to earn the skins and items they want.

For example the Clockheart mini pet is exclusive to people who complete all the Aetherpath achievements and is arguably a prestigious reward item. But no one is locked out of getting it – the dungeon and the achievements are available to everyone to do. (And yes I realise some players have disabilities, valid reasons to refuse to ever play in a party or whatever else which means they are unable to complete those achievements and that is a valid concern, but my point is the option to attempt it is there.)

Whereas the mini Mr. Sparkles is exclusive to people who attended a few specific real-life events in 2013 or bought 4,000 gems (with cash) during December 2013. It doesn’t matter if someone attends one of those events at any other time, or buys 4,000, 5,000 or even 10,000 gems in any other month. No matter what they do, or are willing to do, they cannot get it.

IMO the first example is absolutely fine and the second is a problem which should be addressed.

(BTW if anyone’s wondering I don’t have a mini Clockheart yet and I do have Mr. Sparkles.)

The same goes for other items. Some are a bit more of a grey area like the Halloween skins which were technically still available (through the TP) for anyone who wanted them, but the cost was disproportionately high compared to the cost of getting them when they were originally available.

But in general I’d much rather everyone could work towards items they want than some people get arbitrarily locked out just so some of those who have it can imagine it’s a bit more special.

Oh please, the clockwork miniature has zero prestige. You can get all the achievements in one play through of that dungeon path. And if you are desperate you can pay people 30g to boost you through those achievements.
Mini Sparkles on the other hand is prestigious because it is almost impossible to get (there are probably some codes for it left over out there, but probably hard to find someone willing to give/sell it to you)

That’s why I said “arguably prestigious”.

The usual argument in favour of exclusive items is that they ‘show you were there’ or ‘show you did X’. Getting the mini Clockheart shows you completed the Aetherblade achievements. (Of course it doesn’t show how you did it, but that’s true of everything. I won a mini Llama in the Tournament of Legends 2…because the other team didn’t show up for the match so we went through automatically.)

I wasn’t trying to suggest that the Clockheart mini is the ultimate example of the rarest of the rare rewards in the entire game, it’s just one random example that happened to be on my mind when I wrote that post. I could have used any other meta-achievement reward (that’s still available), or black lion skins, or even a birthday present. I just happened to pick that one.

Miku.6297:

Malediktus.9250:

Oh please, the clockwork miniature has zero prestige. You can get all the achievements in one play through of that dungeon path. And if you are desperate you can pay people 30g to boost you through those achievements.
Mini Sparkles on the other hand is prestigious because it is almost impossible to get (there are probably some codes for it left over out there, but probably hard to find someone willing to give/sell it to you)

I disagree, the clock work mini has more prestige, it’s something you can earn through in game play. Yes you could buy people to carry you through the cheevos, but you could also get them the normal way.

Items that you can ONLY earn by buying them aren’t prestigious, that’s why the new legendary weapons aren’t trade able… To preserve the prestige of having them.

Guess what you have to earn everything in this game even if it is something miniscule. Even login rewards are “earned”. Does not make them prestigious. Same with that 30min (good group) to 2 hour (bad group) miniature. Call me elitist, but that is how I see it. Even the raid skins have very little prestige to me since the raids are also easy (takes our guilds ~2h to do both wings and our guild is nowhere as elitist as other raidguilds like snow crows)
So since there is no super hard content in this game currently, prestigious skins have either super low droprate, super expensive (3k+) or need massive amounts of time (5k+ hours for AP skins).

So you are saying in your opinion, someone plunking real money down for an item earns them more prestige in game then something they can earn in game?

A brand new player with tons of money buys gems and converts to gold, then buys tons of rare stuff (he will not have anything you would have to earn yourself), this makes him more prestigious then a 3 year veteran who has things that can’t be bought?

“Exclusive” as in an item that is no longer obtainable in game by any means except maybe a ridiculous amount of gold on the TP?

Hell no.

That sort of thing only caters to the type of people that can only find happiness by making sure other people can’t have things. Rather sad, actually.

Miku.6297:

So you are saying in your opinion, someone plunking real money down for an item earns them more prestige in game then something they can earn in game?

A brand new player with tons of money buys gems and converts to gold, then buys tons of rare stuff (he will not have anything you would have to earn yourself), this makes him more prestigious then a 3 year veteran who has things that can’t be bought?

Indeed, that is the nature of a game where you are allowed to trade money (gems to gold) for ingame currency. Especially since the same person can use the money he got by converting gems to buy raid kills and achievement runs.
We would need challenging content where everyone needs to play to the maximum if you want prestige = skill. Either solo challenges like Liadri or dungeons/raids where everyone needs to be very good so selling slots would be impossible even for top guilds.

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I’m starting this thread as a discussion because ANet seem to be genuinely listening to the community and trying to give players what they’ve been asking for. They have made two decisions lately that I consider controversial, and I thought it would be useful to provide community feedback:

1) Okaying the SAB tribulation exploit, which devalued the tribulation skins (in terms of exclusiveness, but not gold value).
2) Added old skins to the mystic forge, which devalued them (in terms of exclusiveness and in terms of gold value).

I’d also say that this goes back to previous skins which were exclusive such as the Fervid Censer and the Wizard Hat.

I just thought that, as ANet are listening, it might be a good idea to talk. This seems to be an issue where there is division among players, but both sides can’t be made perfectly happy.

---

For me, I think that the trib skins and the Fervid Censer should have remained exclusive, for the sole reason that there were alternative palette swaps available, which seemed a good compromise. Things like the Wizard Hat and Halloween skins, I’m less sure.

As a general principle, I think it’s good when a game includes some exclusivity, including:

• Game-mode based (wvw vs pvp vs pve, dungeon vs fractal, etc)
• Skill-based (in this game: arguably raid-based rewards, SAB skins, …).
• Participation, aka “I was there when…” (wintersday, baseball cap, …)
• Loyalty (HoM skins, AP skins)

However, these should amount to a tiny portion of all available skins (my list above is more or less in order of most to least, in my opinion).

The idea is to offer some extra reward/incentive for participation. In general, we can use the TP to convert any non-exclusive items we don’t like to gold and use that gold to buy any non-exclusive skins we do like. Making a small subset of skins exclusive gives those who obtain them an extra bit of fun (while still allowing anyone else to choose to participate at the same level, and gain the same things).

tl;dr in general, yes, as long as it’s limited in number relative to all obtainable skins.

I don’t have any particular opinion about which skins ought to be exclusive, although I think it’s bad practice in general to arbitrarily exclude items (it should always be done with deliberation). It’s even worse to arbitrarily remove an exclusion, since it tells the “haves” that they can’t have and tells the “have nots” that they can always complain and get what they want.

Hmm or maybe prestige could = lots of play and work in game? VS simply using a credit card…. Isn’t that why the devs decided to not have the new legendary weapons be sellable?

You don’t need challenging content etc etc for prestige to = skill. Dedication and effort in earning something that can’t be obtained with a purchase is all that’s needed and we do have some parts of that.

I guess all in all, buying lots of things doesn’t make you a better player =/= more prestigious then someone who has not.

Miku.6297:

Hmm or maybe prestige could = lots of play and work in game? VS simply using a credit card…. Isn’t that why the devs decided to not have the new legendary weapons be sellable?

You don’t need challenging content etc etc for prestige to = skill. Dedication and effort in earning something that can’t be obtained with a purchase is all that’s needed and we do have some parts of that.

I guess all in all, buying lots of things doesn’t make you a better player =/= more prestigious then someone who has not.

The problem is nothing in this game requires you to be “really good”. Sure you can get things done faster if you are “really good” but you will get everywhere just fine if you are average or slighly below average. So how do you earn prestige by being really good?
I like skins you have to work for, but it is really hard if everything is tradeable one way or another. The only exception are a few retired skins (you had to be playing the right content at the right time like mad memoires or tribal armor) and AP skins.

Malediktus.9250:

I like skins you have to work for, but it is really hard if everything is tradeable one way or another.

There are parts of the new legendary weapons you can’t trade. There are things you have to be there and do.

Prestige does not have to mean “really good” it could mean a long time player etc, I just don’t feel showing off how much money you have is prestigious it’s more like being a braggart.

I don’t think anything should be exclusive, I’m even happy for the halloween items being available again even though I had a great saw for ages.

I dont think that there is any more prestige inherent in having bought the game before someone else, or having logged in on a day when someone else did not, than having earned enough money to be able to afford something that someone else cannot. The opposite perhaps. “I worked my kitten off to put myself through college and then again to advance in my career and can now afford X,” seems more prestigious than, “I logged into a video game on a Tuesday,” to me.

That said, I answer yes to the OP’s question. But I think that the exclusivity should encompass a variety of approaches. Some through specific difficult content. Some to show you were there on that special day. Some to show your dedication over time through farming, grinding, etc. And, perhaps, some that can be bought.

Some skins should stay exclusive like the ball cap from beta/launch or the witch hat/emissary title from the Mad King etc. It’s not our (betas) problem someone wasn’t there to receive those items for whatever reason. And apparently it is special, else ANET wouldn’t have given them out. If things were in the gem shop during S1 then by all means let the latecomers have them but ANY event items that you HAD to be there for should stay entirely exclusive. GAME ON

As usual I’m all for exclusivity in nearly every form. It’s what I get most of my fun and gameplay from.
Skins like living world, SAB,Liandri etc anything that’s locked to game-play or limited time and gameplay is what motivates me, along with the higher prestige the better (just to curtail any off topic prestige is purely up to my interpretation of it as long as I perceive a skin as prestigious it’s fine).
Anything based off gold or for everyone doesn’t (why bother I effectively already have it anyway). I like to be challenged but also equally rewarded for which skins are perfect.
Limited time skins, like for anniversary’s , special happenings etc are also good they create differences between the players and give them something to treasure.
Gold exclusives are my least favourite (especially in a game with a gem to gold conversion) because they tend to not end up in the hands of the best players but rather ones that gained a lot of gold. I still support the existence of some of them, it would be a very boring game if every item was just another generic item to get.

The re-introduction of so many of the exclusive skins has actually cost me a lot of my in game friends, they don’t feel the game is respecting their time and ability, they felt like just generic players. If they logged in today there’d be no way to tell they were elite players who actually played well and experienced the unique story back when they played because they’d look just like any other player. leaving no way to stand out and no rewards worth getting.

@Ashen, It’s your hobby your ability within a hobby can be as important to a person as anything else in their life, doesn’t matter if it’s Olympic swimming, card shuffling, ping pong, grass growing or MMO gaming. The “prestige” is contained within the activity (no one’s arguing that putting yourself through college and being good at a game are comparable).
(Actually that’s why gold conversion irks me so much you’re using an external force to influence your position in the hobby unfairly rather than improving as a hobbiest in the activity.)

Conski Deshan.2057:

I like to be challenged but also equally rewarded for which skins are perfect.
Limited time skins, like for anniversary’s , special happenings etc are also good they create differences between the players and give them something to treasure.
Gold exclusives are my least favourite (especially in a game with a gem to gold conversion) because they tend to not end up in the hands of the best players but rather ones that gained a lot of gold.

So limited time things like anniversary items, and events are more likely to end up in skilled players hands then gold exclusives? Just because you logged in on x week at y time and got the skin, I don’t really see how that makes you any better of a player then those who gained gold.

Should any skins be exclusive?

Yes, they should be exclusive skins only available from and or during certain “events”.

Dungeon skins are exclusive to players who play the specific dungeons, nobody is complaining about that (yet….)
Karma vendor skins are also exclusive.

Annual festival skins/minipets are also okay (as long as they are within the normal limits… getting 1-3 sab skins per year (realistically) form the available 68 is super bad…and then theres also those radios and moto backpacks and minipets that take away my baublebubbles…

Old pvp skins, and other skins that got removed from the game should be re added into the game via mf (the simplest way) or via karma vendor, or via laurel vendor, or via wvw token vendor.

Miku.6297:

Conski Deshan.2057:

I like to be challenged but also equally rewarded for which skins are perfect.
Limited time skins, like for anniversary’s , special happenings etc are also good they create differences between the players and give them something to treasure.
Gold exclusives are my least favourite (especially in a game with a gem to gold conversion) because they tend to not end up in the hands of the best players but rather ones that gained a lot of gold.

So limited time things like anniversary items, and events are more likely to end up in skilled players hands then gold exclusives? Just because you logged in on x week at y time and got the skin, I don’t really see how that makes you any better of a player then those who gained gold.

There’s a full stop between those two sentences. In the first:
Limited time items are good for creating general player differences (I.E ensuring not too many players are running round in the same gear and having the same pool of items to choose from). Logging in and doing some easy meta achievement is still worth more than just getting it for gold.

In the second:
Gold exclusive items are a poorer choice, as they tend to be hoarded by TP players or bought out by gem conversion gold. I DO NOT consider playing the TP to be a valid form of gameplay, I want players out doing content not sitting in LA. It creates situations where a 3k playtime all rounder elite who has done pretty much everything in the game has less of a selection available than a 500 hour TP player who has displayed no affinity for the game.

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I’m starting this thread as a discussion because ANet seem to be genuinely listening to the community and trying to give players what they’ve been asking for. They have made two decisions lately that I consider controversial, and I thought it would be useful to provide community feedback:

1) Okaying the SAB tribulation exploit, which devalued the tribulation skins (in terms of exclusiveness, but not gold value).

This was not “okay” in the way you believe. It was “okay” in the same way guardians running Symbolic Avenger were “okay” to use it, even if the trait meant you did +10% damage for EACH symbol the target stood in (13:00 teq anyone?). They werent going to sanction anyone for it while making people know that it WAS exploiting a bug in the game, but they made kitten sure you understood it was being fixed and would be gone at some point. There’s a difference between using an exploit is allowed, and use it if you want, it’s getting fixed asap.

2) Added old skins to the mystic forge, which devalued them (in terms of exclusiveness and in terms of gold value).

Their value is approximately zero. It is the individual players that create an artificial value. Additionally, the skins/weapons they added, are weapons that players can no longer obtain for themselves no matter HOW LONG they played as a result of those skins being in LS1. There’s a vast difference between being “exclusive due to difficulty” (trib stuff) and being “exclusive because you didnt play then” (most LS1 stuff as well as ‘decommissioned’ gemstore stuff).

I’d also say that this goes back to previous skins which were exclusive such as the Fervid Censer and the Wizard Hat.

See above.

I just thought that, as ANet are listening, it might be a good idea to talk. This seems to be an issue where there is division among players, but both sides can’t be made perfectly happy.

---

For me, I think that the trib skins and the Fervid Censer should have remained exclusive, for the sole reason that there were alternative palette swaps available, which seemed a good compromise. Things like the Wizard Hat and Halloween skins, I’m less sure.

Frankly, who cares whether a skin is no longer “exclusive and expensive”? Just the fools who didnt diversify or capitalized when they should have. AB skins? As I said above, there’s a vast difference between the two intents behind the word “exclusive.”

Conski Deshan.2057:

There’s a full stop between those two sentences. In the first:
Limited time items are good for creating general player differences (I.E ensuring not too many players are running round in the same gear and having the same pool of items to choose from). Logging in and doing some easy meta achievement is still worth more than just getting it for gold.

In the second:
Gold exclusive items are a poorer choice, as they tend to be hoarded by TP players or bought out by gem conversion gold. I DO NOT consider playing the TP to be a valid form of gameplay, I want players out doing content not sitting in LA. It creates situations where a 3k playtime all rounder elite who has done pretty much everything in the game has less of a selection available than a 500 hour TP player who has displayed no affinity for the game.

Full stop or not, my question is still pretty much the same question. Do you think logging in for some easy meta, or just being there for the limited time window to buy/get the items makes them more likely to land in the hands of the “best players” vs gold items?

One is bought the other is just randomly logged into get. I just don’t see how either option makes the item more likely to and in a better players hands.

Personally I like exclusive skins/stuff when it’s things that you need to work for and earn; essentially, skill-gated items. The Liadri mini, for example.

Stuff that’s exclusive because you had to be around when it was available isn’t really that great imo. It’s all right if the means to aquire them returns periodically (SAB, from now on), but otherwise I don’t think it’s really a good system.

It’s a game. There is no actual prestige in a game. There just isn’t. There is only perceived prestige and that depends entirely on each individual person’s point of view.

Every single thing in GW2 boils down to one or several of these four things:

1. You had enough time to play the game to get X.
2. You had enough RL money to buy X.
3. You were able to play the game at the right time to get X.
4. You had someone help you to get X or buy X or give RL money to you to buy X.

I chuckle at people who hop around in front of me so I notice their precious legendary weapons which I just find so horribly ugly. I roll my eyes at people who get upset because new players get something for free which took them weeks to obtain. I shrug my shoulders at people who flaunt their 30k AP because I know not everyone has that kind of time to play a game.

Find what you enjoy in GW2 and make it yours. Forget about the rest. It is so ridiculous to tell other people “But I am better than you because I have X!”. That seriously is Kindergarten level folks.

An example to finish this off:
I got my Liadri mini by defeating her before Anet nerfed the fight and made it super easy. To me my Liadri is prestigious but I realize to everyone else she probably isn’t because they don’t know how hard it was to get that catbaby of an achievement. It’s the same with EVERYTHING else in a game. No exceptions.

exclusive weapons/armor is something different from exclusive skins, skins should be available to everyone no matter the time/skill level.
however, really powerful weapons/armor should be difficult to get, a legendary gear type should be just as difficult to get.

it’s really simple, a skin should never be behind a big paywall, RNG or extremely hard achievement, actual gear does.

sorudo.9054:

exclusive weapons/armor is something different from exclusive skins, skins should be available to everyone no matter the time/skill level.
however, really powerful weapons/armor should be difficult to get, a legendary gear type should be just as difficult to get.

it’s really simple, a skin should never be behind a big paywall, RNG or extremely hard achievement, actual gear does.

Eh… this is Guild Wars, where gear is less important than cosmetics. Gear needs to be available to everyone, for the sake of balance and fairness. Skins can be locked away behind paywalls, RNG, achievements, etc. They are what people see, and are what are aimed for.

Frankly the worst sort of exclusive item is the “Time locked” ones – “Be here now, or never get it ever.” I don’t mind RNG that much, because it’s rare, yet still available. But “Lost forever” is the absolute worst thing ever. (I don’t mind the baseball cap, though. That’s a silly souvenir)

sorudo.9054:

it’s really simple, a skin should never be behind a big paywall, RNG or extremely hard achievement, actual gear does.

I think your paywall idea is bad. Things that don’t have any impact on game performance are good to have behind a paywall… it’s the best use of microtransactions in a game that has microtransactions.

To put gear behind a paywall/microtransaction promotes Pay-to-Win. PtW is not desirable in any way from a player standpoint.

The rest of your point of RNG or achievments; I think both gear and skins can be behind RNG and achievements without being a detriment to the game. It feels really good to have something to show you succeeded at a challenge. It also feels really good to have an awesome stroke of luck.

~EW

I just like nice-looking skins. I don’t care who gets them or how, as long as there’s a wide variety to choose from.

A little exclusivity is alright. Some people need this, it’s not unreasonable for the game to offer a few hard to get items. I don’t care for it though, I want everyone to be able to look awesome and unique. The more options the better.

Sartharina.3542:

sorudo.9054:

exclusive weapons/armor is something different from exclusive skins, skins should be available to everyone no matter the time/skill level.
however, really powerful weapons/armor should be difficult to get, a legendary gear type should be just as difficult to get.

it’s really simple, a skin should never be behind a big paywall, RNG or extremely hard achievement, actual gear does.

Eh… this is Guild Wars, where gear is less important than cosmetics. Gear needs to be available to everyone, for the sake of balance and fairness. Skins can be locked away behind paywalls, RNG, achievements, etc. They are what people see, and are what are aimed for.

Frankly the worst sort of exclusive item is the “Time locked” ones – “Be here now, or never get it ever.” I don’t mind RNG that much, because it’s rare, yet still available. But “Lost forever” is the absolute worst thing ever. (I don’t mind the baseball cap, though. That’s a silly souvenir)

if good skins are behind paywalls and achievements all the time then only the rich and plenty of time ppl can get them, ppl with an actual job to pay the bills and not much time to play will never get any of them.
and yes, this is guild wars…..no wait, this is guild wars 2, guild wars has all the armor skins IN the game and available for everybody regardless of time spend.
guild wars 2 has everything good looking behind an unbelievable massive grind, ether that or quite some paywalls to cross.

this is one of the most expansive armors in GW, an armor that is maxed out in every way.
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Necromancer_Vabbian_armor
yet i could get the whole set, the reason is because i can buy it in a normal and stable way.

this is one of the most expansive armors in GW2, an armor that only reaches rare quality.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Human_cultural_armor
yet, it’s quite a grind to get and still you have nothing really useful.

yes, this is GW2, a GW version done wrong.

sorudo.9054:

this is one of the most expansive armors in GW, an armor that is maxed out in every way.
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Necromancer_Vabbian_armor
yet i could get the whole set, the reason is because i can buy it in a normal and stable way.

Try Obsidian armor instead. With Chaos Gloves. And dye it black.

this is one of the most expansive armors in GW2, an armor that only reaches rare quality.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Human_cultural_armor
yet, it’s quite a grind to get and still you have nothing really useful.

… the T3 armor really should be exotic quality.

Sartharina.3542:

Try Obsidian armor instead. With Chaos Gloves. And dye it black.

except for the armor, that’s nose picking easy…..

Vukorep.3081:

Should any skins be exclusive?

Yes, they should be exclusive skins only available from and or during certain “events”.

Dungeon skins are exclusive to players who play the specific dungeons, nobody is complaining about that (yet….)
Karma vendor skins are also exclusive.

Annual festival skins/minipets are also okay (as long as they are within the normal limits… getting 1-3 sab skins per year (realistically) form the available 68 is super bad…and then theres also those radios and moto backpacks and minipets that take away my baublebubbles…

Old pvp skins, and other skins that got removed from the game should be re added into the game via mf (the simplest way) or via karma vendor, or via laurel vendor, or via wvw token vendor.

You are wrong on the dungeon skins, you can already get them via pvp reward tracks (and now also wvw tracks). PvP tracks are the fastest way to get dungeon skins since you are not timegated there.
As for SAB skins, it finished all 4 sets this time, so if you can only get 3 out of 68 skins in 20 days you are doing something wrong. I also got the moto backpack and the blue sab cover.

Malediktus.9250:

As for SAB skins, it finished all 4 sets this time, so if you can only get 3 out of 68 skins in 20 days you are doing something wrong. I also got the moto backpack and the blue sab cover.

Yeah, pulling 1 every 2 days just by running all of the worlds daily was more then doable.