Guild Wars 2

Scrolled down a few pages to the huge ‘Ascended Gear’ thread but couldn’t find it. So I’ll add my reply in this new thread.

Chris White

We’re very excited about the new content, and from the reactions we have seen, so are many of you.

Thanks for taking our feedback so seriously. No, I mean, really, thank you.

- If this thread becomes another one where people bicker back and forth about Ascended gear, I will close it down. Please continue discussion about Ascended gear in the existing threads on that topic and do not derail every thread that pops up.

If you stopped ignoring people’s concerns about Ascended gear and actually gave some straight answers, people would shut up about it.

Seriously, between those two statements, it helped me to remind why I dislike PR managers so much. But guess what? Ignoring it will not make it go away. Sure, people may quiet down, but on a whole, you’ve taken a hit. And that’s not because of the gear change itself.

I´m still hoping they refer to other content. Fotm is awesome as a dungeon, even if the ascended part is kitten.

ThiBash.5634:

Seriously, between those two statements, it helped me to remind why I dislike PR managers so much. But guess what? Ignoring it will not make it go away.

Ignoring it will make many of us go away, though. Mission accomplished.

Well, it could very well be true.
Keep in mind that it is usually the same people spamming all the threads about how much Ascended gear sucks.

Those that are happy does not hang around on the forums most of the time and even if they do they might not spam all those threads.

I have seen almost as many: “I like this” or “I am okay with this” people as I have seen “This is worthless, ArenaNet lies!!” people. Which most likely would mean that the majority is actually happy or at least okay with it.

lordkrall.7241:

Well, it could very well be true.
Keep in mind that it is usually the same people spamming all the threads about how much Ascended gear sucks.

Those that are happy does not hang around on the forums most of the time and even if they do they might not spam all those threads.

I have seen almost as many: “I like this” or “I am okay with this” people as I have seen “This is worthless, ArenaNet lies!!” people. Which most likely would mean that the majority is actually happy or at least okay with it.

^This

Everyone that complained about the content did it so much that they became the “voice” of the community while the people that enjoy it are playing and not hanging around on the forums!

I don’t mind the ascended gear.

It is not required for anything except FOM level 10+ so I am not really bothering with it right now.

It’s only a 3% difference in total char stats, and by the time they add more pieces, they will make the backpiece and rings as common as exotics, so it’ll only ever be a 3% gap, which is so tiny as to make literally no difference.

Soon they will make it super easy to get anyway, like exotics are now, and then I’ll get it same as everyone else.

I’m happy of ascended gear. When i drop one / able to craft mine, finally allowed to join my friends.

I wanted to post this video to give people an idea of why power creep (aka gear treadmills) can be devastating to video games.

Now, I’m not trying to trudge up the argument, because in all honesty I feel those that felt strongly enough about this turn of events have either accepted it or left already.

EDIT: Reason: Poorly stated comment
This video gives a very well balanced argument towards combating power creep, how power creep can happen in video games, and what power creep can do to a game’s longevity.

(This video in no way has an opinion towards Guild Wars 2 that I know of. This is just a phenomenal series on youtube that gives insight towards game development)

Clicky —> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

Ascended gear is hardly even required until 20+ from what I hear. On level 14 now, and I haven’t yet encountered a situation where my groups were being denied progress solely because of agony.

Ye 10 20 range, you can still attempt to ignore the gear check. Until noone complains of people continuously down.

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

Ye 10 20 range, you can still attempt to ignore the gear check. Until noone complains of people continuously down.

People go down even on level 1-10 though. Without people complaining.

lordkrall.7241:

Well, it could very well be true.
Keep in mind that it is usually the same people spamming all the threads about how much Ascended gear sucks.

Those that are happy does not hang around on the forums most of the time and even if they do they might not spam all those threads.

I have seen almost as many: “I like this” or “I am okay with this” people as I have seen “This is worthless, ArenaNet lies!!” people. Which most likely would mean that the majority is actually happy or at least okay with it.

Majority still doesn’t know that there is a new eq tier. Hell, majority still doesn’t know that this game has forums. And no – remember, that the really unhappy people do not post on this forum at all because they have already left.
Soon though that will be true – the remaining majority will indeed be okay with the game. Until the game bombs, of course, and then everyone will be surprised and outraged.

lordkrall.7241:

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

Ye 10 20 range, you can still attempt to ignore the gear check. Until noone complains of people continuously down.

People go down even on level 1-10 though. Without people complaining.

Me too. I’m happy to help lower levels, and meet talented players.

I still don’t like it. I will grind lvl10 until I get the atts I like, and maybe then, I’ll keep progressing through levels.

I’m Dungeon Master and I almost stoped doing anything else than staying in LA playing TP and doing 1 run on fractals a day.

Still dissapointed for this senseless random grinding.

Most ppl who dosn’t like it are on forums, most of ppl who likes it just play game. Do you think all those who rage on forums are majority of -all- players?

Terkov.4138:

Most ppl who dosn’t like it are on forums, most of ppl who likes it just play game. Do you think all those who rage on forums are majority of -all- players?

Do you think that people that like this new mechanics are majority of all players?

Astralporing.1957:

Do you think that people that like this new mechanics are majority of all players?

I think the people that like it or don’t care about it are the majority of all players yes.

Had a small chat about it in Lions Arch yesterday. First overflow then when server became available continued there.

No one did seem to have a problem with it.

And now you will probably shout about how those that don’t like it don’t play the game anymore, and that is fine.
But keep in mind that I was on overflow, which meant that my server had to be FULL in Lions Arch when I got there, and that does show there are rather many people still playing.

I would have been perfectly happy if it was just another rarity tier, maybe with shiner skins, and harder to obtain than exotics but easier than legendaries. But for godssakes please do away with the stat increases. We don’t need that kitten.

lordkrall.7241:

Astralporing.1957:

Do you think that people that like this new mechanics are majority of all players?

I think the people that like it or don’t care about it are the majority of all players yes.

Had a small chat about it in Lions Arch yesterday. First overflow then when server became available continued there.

No one did seem to have a problem with it.

And now you will probably shout about how those that don’t like it don’t play the game anymore, and that is fine.
But keep in mind that I was on overflow, which meant that my server had to be FULL in Lions Arch when I got there, and that does show there are rather many people still playing.

Because a couple guys wrote “amazing i love it” that makes you think this is the majority of the community?
Just to add, did you ask the same question to some lv1-5 guys no more able to spam LFG fractal lv 1,2,3,4,5?

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

Becasue a couple guys wrote “amazing i love it” that makes you think this is the majority of the community?

No, but the fact that NO ONE complained about it, I would say it is quite safe to assume most people don’t have anything against it, or at least can live with it.

I see, because noone start a Anet flamewar on map, that’s the majority and everyone is happy except people on this forum..

ArenaNet were pretty clear before launch that GW2 wouldn’t be about gear acquisition. Legendaries had the same stats as exotics, and gear-grinding was all about the looks. Suddenly we have Ascended items introduced with slightly better stats than exotic, and Legendaries have had their stats increased to be slightly better than Ascended. All of a sudden we have the start of a gear treadmill that we were told wouldn’t be there.

It’s all very well saying “but the numbers differences are tiny” but tiny differences add up and can end up being quite significant. The numbers are irrelevant though, a treadmill is a treadmill, regardless how shallow the steps are.

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

I see, because noone start a Anet flamewar on map, that’s the majority and everyone is happy except people on this forum..

Oh, so it is okay to say that the “majority” don’t like this based on what a FEW people are saying on the forums, but it is not okay to say that the majority most likely don’t care based on discussions in-game (with more people than those shouting on the forums btw)

Again the vocal minority excuse really?
10300+ posts start to be a statistic proof and a real number….

Proof that people ingame is happy….or that people on forum only are negative….

Otherwise this vocal minority of thousands players is a fact and your theory is just baseless speculation….

P.S: this is not on ascended obviously but on a REAL vocal minority trying to prevale the forum majority with empty excuses…..

P.P.S: and no i asked my friends and they said they arehappy is NOT a statistical evidence or any form of proof.

Lucas, I think you got it exactly right! Haha!

Well, if what you saw 5 minutes on map is majority, i guess it’s useless explain you what non english speakers thinks, the real number of gw2 playerbase thinks, what ALL of them thinks etc. A realistic way to understand what is going on is a survey (then published not filtered making it a fake ) , using multiple languages, asking questions about geargrind and fractals and if they are happy with it, and if they was asking / hoping it. (Not the funny survey we saw recently ) Now, watch the results

It’s outragous. They say they listen and respond to community feedback but a thread with over 10’000 posts, the biggest thread in the entire forum, is ignored and not responded to. They pretend we aren’t upset about this.

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

Well, if what you saw 5 minutes on map is majority, i guess it’s useless explain you what non english speakers thinks, the real number of gw2 playerbase, what ALL of them thinks etc. A realistic way to understand what is going on is a survey , using multiple languages, asking questions about geargrind and fractals and if they are happy with it, and if they was asking / hoping it. (Not the funny survey we saw recently ) Now, watch the results

Wow, you speak with such confidence.
It seems you have gotten it all figured out.

What if the result was something you totally didn’t expect? What then..?

Belteshazzar.6307:

Wow, you speak with such confidence.
It seems you have gotten it all figured out.

What if the result was something you totally didn’t expect? What then..?

Considering i read forums on multiple languages, and all of them are quite similar to this one with similar threads, answer, question, fractal racism, haters, fanboys etc , uhm ye, i’m confident about it.

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

Belteshazzar.6307:

Wow, you speak with such confidence.
It seems you have gotten it all figured out.

What if the result was something you totally didn’t expect? What then..?

Considering i read forums on multiple languages, and all of them are quite similar to this one, uhm ye, i’m confident about it.

Didn’t really answer my question. Haha.

There isn’t a answer, if the behaviour of this forum doesn’t tell you nothing, and 5 minutes on map spamming a “Hey guys do you like fractal farm and fractal racism” waiting a couple guys answer “So cool, ye. LFM fractal lv 21 no noobs, link your gear or kicked”

There are far more people in LA playing FotM than sitting here complaining about ascended gear, you don’t need statistics to prove that. 10000+ posts that contains multiple posters and people that are fine with the change isn’t any better at proving that the majority hate this change. I have a feeling ANet has far better tools at measuring this kind of thing than some forum posters.

Lucas Ashrock.8675:

There isn’t a answer, if the behaviour of this forum doesn’t tell you nothing, and 5 minutes on map spamming a “Hey guys do you like fractal farm and fractal racism” waiting a couple guys answer “So cool, ye. LFM fractal lv 21 no noobs, link your gear or kicked”

Oh, I was just really curious what people would do if they did find out the people complaining were actually the “minority”

I’m just curious haha anyways enjoy your night or day (I don’t know where you’re from so, yea)

I’m not gonne jump into this ascended gear stuff, but its idle to ask for Majorities/Minorities. What I wonder is who did they ask? This survey about Lost-Shore-Event didn’t ask at all about the new tier and they didn’t even mention it on the blog. Also I didn’t see someone taking surveys directely in the game. (Did not bother to check facebook though)

This means for me that this topic is completely ignored.

lordkrall.7241:

Well, it could very well be true.
Keep in mind that it is usually the same people spamming all the threads about how much Ascended gear sucks.

Those that are happy does not hang around on the forums most of the time and even if they do they might not spam all those threads.

I have seen almost as many: “I like this” or “I am okay with this” people as I have seen “This is worthless, ArenaNet lies!!” people. Which most likely would mean that the majority is actually happy or at least okay with it.

Why does everybody assume that not writing here means that u like everything? My whole guild of 35 mebers quitted playing the game because of the patch and NOBODY BUT ME from this guild writes here. All 34 other member just left without leaving a single word here….

Yes, they use for example a dungeon counter, looking how many times that content is used. 10000 runs=success. Doesn’t matter if it’s the same group of players farming 24/7.
Just so you know, a singular map capacity (LA for fractals for example) is not huge as you think, reason because overflow technology exists
Also, don’t forget there are people going to LA for craft, use bank/TP, find a dungeon group

Its not question of a 10k thread, or if the majority of the players like or dislike this, because ad the actual state, we cant know this, we can only see the spread effect around in the net (MMO site, selling site, etc etc).
There is an evident lack of communication, but im hoping for the next monday Q\A on reddit.

Personally im one of those that really dont like this new set, because for me its bad designed, it invalidate too much content around the game in the actual state, like runes and sigils…
And im surprised that there are still people that use a lame argument like : “Its not mandatory.”
Maybe its not mandatory now, but when the full set become released, it will become madatory, too much stats gap! and runes and sigils will become obsolete.

I love my new quiver, I couldn’t care less if it was exotic, rare, masterwork or ascended. I was going to go for this skin regardless of it’s stats. The fact that it’s ascended does bother me because I didn’t want to support ArenaNet metrics that show players are happy to chase after ascended items. One metric I do hope they see is I skipped exotic and went straight for ascended, so even as a progression mechanic all this does is skip exotics and go for ascended, just like how blues, greens and yellows were only worth their vendor price (or their salvage value in the case of yellows), exotics won’t be worth the time when you can just skip to ascended. No problem was solved.

Specific to the OP, just because players were excited about the FotM dungeon and it’s improvements on the old dungeon system (mobs with less health, more interesting mechanics, running all paths instead of one, scaling difficulty which gives access to more people, crazy rewarding loot drops for time spent – seriously, it’s way overbalanced compared with dungeon chests or general PvE) doesn’t mean people like this content because it introduced ascended items. ArenaNet didn’t say (and hopefully don’t think) the people enjoying FotM approve of ascended items.

We’re very excited about the new content, and from the reactions we have seen, so are many of you.

Naw, I’m just keeping a blind eye and moving on with life.

LFM FOTM Level21312049321.

munkiman.3068:

There are far more people in LA playing FotM than sitting here complaining about ascended gear, you don’t need statistics to prove that. 10000+ posts that contains multiple posters and people that are fine with the change isn’t any better at proving that the majority hate this change. I have a feeling ANet has far better tools at measuring this kind of thing than some forum posters.

yeah there are more people FORCED to grind fotm
Many have left the game

Few are doing other activities.
Most of them doesn t have requirements to fotm.

Check for yourself in any server….
I am amongst the mindless farmers, really angry but hoping this madness will stop.

I don’t think players on the whole are against the idea, but rather the way you have to obtain the items, they sold GW2 on the premise they don’t force players to grind for gear and that they don’t wish players to be on the gear grind treadmill, but just look at the materials required for players to obtain them items. Not a grind? I beg to differ.

So the discussion has moved from the pros and cons of ascendant gear to what constitutes the majority view? What’s the actual point in discussing this? Even if this could be taken beyond mere speculation (which it can’t) it’s not an argument to silence either dissenters or supporters, and last I looked MMO’s aren’t democracies; the only people with a vote are the shareholders of the company. ANet can see the server populations, and if they take a huge drop or rise steeply following this patch, they won’t need that much analysis to figure out why.

an official forum simply is just one of the channels where people can let their opinion on things know and be heard… there are other channels and even then I think the majority of the players wont even bother…

most of the people who like the changes will be playing the game…
most of the people who by now hate the game will just leave…

and yes.. a relative small group of people would take the time and effort to post their opinion on these official forums… these in general are people who care about the game in one way (grinding, pvp-ing, im-client, hardcore, casual) or another so ANet should pay attention and try to communicate with them…

that said… they shouldnt be able to decide on what happens in the game since they are a relative small group…

we have ANet for evaluating, deciding en changing stuff… personally I think they are doing a great job.. I enjoy the game a lot and dont care about all these armor, precursor, 200+ gold discussions… so far I’having fun.. that’s what I am here for..

yes… I think ANet could benefit from a little more forum presence… on the other hand, let’s face it.. whatever they will say here – they will never please/satisfy everybody

The shareholders opinion and any users opinion can be completely different to this is no proof at all that they are listening to the com. And I just want to know what these miraculous channels are where the majority leaves their opinion while we dumb minority are left here on that obviously useless forum if we follow ur logic.

Terkov.4138:

Most ppl who dosn’t like it are on forums, most of ppl who likes it just play game. Do you think all those who rage on forums are majority of -all- players?

Anet introduced Ascended gear due to a vocal minority in the forums and now the vastly bigger vocal majority is complaining about it in the forums.

At lvl 55 with my gear being 50+, I found lvl 1 FotM very challenging. It’s mainly due to the stats on the gear and their upgrades. Im not there yet but it appears lvl 60+ gear is the level to become more efficient due to the amount of stats your gear holds. This is why people go down. IF you don’t have them, then your relying heavily upon your party.

I would make FotM all agony. The whole dungeon and any level. Then I would allow any gear to be imbued with a agony slot to fill.

The shareholders opinion and any users opinion can be completely different to this is no proof at all that they are listening to the com. And I just want to know what these miraculous channels are where the majority leaves their opinion while we dumb minority are left here on that obviously useless forum if we follow ur logic.

Not entirely sure if this was directed at my post or Thorgal’s, but if it was mine then you missed my point. My point being that speculating which particular view is the majority one is pretty pointless since it’s just speculation that doesn’t lead anywhere. Stating one’s opinion about something is what the forums are for, certainly. And mind you, a minority can still be right and a majority wrong. Just look at politics, the wrong party always wins! ,-

@Kaleidocope: Nah, sry it was directed towards Thorgal. I said the same about this majority/minority thing before in this thread. Thats not even the problem that I am having. What I don’t like about this blog-statement is that it’s pretending like the whole issue isn’t there. Even half a sentence on that issue would have been enough for me but it’s nothing…

Maybe one day you’ll understand that even if you put all displeased forum posters together, you don’t even amount to 5% of the people playing the game.

Thorgal.1287:

that said… they shouldnt be able to decide on what happens in the game since they are a relative small group…

And yet, according to Anet’s own words, a much smaller group’s QQ resulted in introducing Ascended gear.

RamzaBehoulve.5640:

Maybe one day you’ll understand that even if you put all displeased forum posters together, you don’t even amount to 5% of the people playing the game.

Maybe one day you will understand, that the same goes for everyone on this forum. It doesn’t however mean that the forum does not represent the majority of the players. It does.