Guild Wars 2

Interesting to hear about this, since the begining the devs have stated that there was no grinding in GW2, not that anybody believed them, but now they pulled 180.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/the-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-economy/
“I want to be up front: scarcity is important.”

What they said and what they actually do have little in common.

If you enjoy grinding you can do that,but you dont need to grind at all to play end game

That’s pretty much what I read too, even from the Legendary blog post.

Looks like a lot of grinding is coming in the future. Rather disheartening to be honest. I actually used to like this game, but now it is starting to feel like a job than a game. Games are supposed to be fun, this isn’t fun.

lol now you’ll need ascneded for endgame… It’s somewhat more expensive then normal exotic gear…

The one thing that he wants to be scarce is in-game gold. But this isn’t new. Limiting gold acquisition has been GW2’s plan all along.

Players then want to buy gems to convert to gold.

In Be4: “What? Gold is easy to get in this game! I make 5K gold a week and all I do are my dailies!”

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

lol now you’ll need ascneded for endgame… It’s somewhat more expensive then normal exotic gear…

No you don’t need, it is recommended.
Also, you know you can get ascended trinkets after a while by just logging into the game, right?
Ascended weapons is WAY more accessible then armor, if you have asc trinkets and weapons and exotic armor you barely have any difference from a full asc player.

BTW there is no grind in GW2, you grind only if you want to, no content at all requires you to be full ascended and much less legendaries.

Dunno why people are complaining about “grinding” it’s something for you to do on the side when you’re bored. It’s a journey and if everyone could do it quickly the items wouldn’t feel legendary at all.

Belzebu.3912:

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

lol now you’ll need ascneded for endgame… It’s somewhat more expensive then normal exotic gear…

No you don’t need, it is recommended.
Also, you know you can get ascended trinkets after a while by just logging into the game, right?
Ascended weapons is WAY more accessible then armor, if you have asc trinkets and weapons and exotic armor you barely have any difference from a full asc player.

BTW there is no grind in GW2, you grind only if you want to, no content at all requires you to be full ascended and much less legendaries.

Cups are “recommended” in Football… ask any guy who’s ever been stepped on by a cleat as to whether or not it was needed lololol same applies here

Let me preface this by saying that I’m not endorsing anything releasing in HoT, nor do I have an opinion on what they just released on the blogs or what they said around release time. I just want to address the idea of grinding being a foreign idea in gaming- or even a bad idea.

Grinding by my definition would simply be repeating simple tasks over and over to achieve a desired result. It can be a small amount, or it could be ad nauseum, but every game has a grind to it.

1) Minecraft – Mine for materials over and over to get what you want to build what you want.

2) Standard RPG (thinking of Dragon Age while typing this) – Kill enemies over and over and run around clicking on things over and over to further a story or get that extra skill point that makes your build come together.

Grind in and of itself is not a bad thing, just like the term ‘casual gamer’ (which I would claim to be). It’s simply if we enjoy the reward enough (or the process of doing that grind) that justifies the grindy actions.

Tl;dr – Grind’s not objectively bad. Let’s provide constructive criticism of their approach to things with feedback that helps.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

Solomon Darkfury.3729:

Belzebu.3912:

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

lol now you’ll need ascneded for endgame… It’s somewhat more expensive then normal exotic gear…

No you don’t need, it is recommended.
Also, you know you can get ascended trinkets after a while by just logging into the game, right?
Ascended weapons is WAY more accessible then armor, if you have asc trinkets and weapons and exotic armor you barely have any difference from a full asc player.

BTW there is no grind in GW2, you grind only if you want to, no content at all requires you to be full ascended and much less legendaries.

Cups are “recommended” in Football… ask any guy who’s ever been stepped on by a cleat as to whether or not it was needed lololol same applies here

yeah, i’ve been stepped on by a cleat before, got a few gashes on the back of my leg. But man! That cup helped a lot!

Celtic Lady.3729:

The one thing that he wants to be scarce is in-game gold. But this isn’t new. Limiting gold acquisition has been GW2’s plan all along.

Players then want to buy gems to convert to gold.

In Be4: “What? Gold is easy to get in this game! I make 5K gold a week and all I do are my dailies!”

Gold availability has no impact on how available gems are, because gem price is supposed to be based on gold sold, thus if less gold is available the gold price of gems will decrease, lowering the availability of gold has no impact on the status quo regarding gem availability to players.

You guys forget that these coming changes are options in game. They do not require anyone to do to it to have fun. It’s there for players who wants to have more stuffs to do in game.

There are a lot players don’t know what to do if there is no grinding.

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Apolo.5942:

Interesting to hear about this, since the begining the devs have stated that there was no grinding in GW2, not that anybody believed them, but now they pulled 180.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/the-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-economy/
“I want to be up front: scarcity is important.”

Not sure you understand the concept here. There is no required grinding in GW2. None. Never has been. If you decide to “grind” out content, that’s your choice. The way the game is designed, you play the content in one story, and you move onto the next.

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Guess this link needs posted again.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

it is required if you want to do good, and it should be that way, raids are the most endest of all end game content for any game, they are supposed to be unnervingly hard, and generally supply some of the best items in the game, or in this case special skins as I understand it.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Apolo.5942:

Interesting to hear about this, since the begining the devs have stated that there was no grinding in GW2, not that anybody believed them, but now they pulled 180.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/the-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-economy/
“I want to be up front: scarcity is important.”

Not sure you understand the concept here. There is no required grinding in GW2. None. Never has been. If you decide to “grind” out content, that’s your choice. The way the game is designed, you play the content in one story, and you move onto the next.

You don’t have to grind, but most of what they are giving us to do is grind based.

Masteries, raids, legendaries, etc.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Guess this link needs posted again.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

Which isn’t exactly new gear needed just to do Raids.

All MMOs have grinding in them.
Its absolutely essential but not compulsory , and this is simply because it takes far longer to design and add new content, than it does for the playerbase to play the new content.
As the playerbase in MMOs wont do anything unless they get a reward for doing it , some content has to be made repetitive and to provide sufficent reward for repeating the content , the reward has to be worth while for the repeated effort.
So the usual way is to use the RNG, ie sometimes a Mega fantastic item drops.
If this wasnt done, then the playerbase would simply get to the level cap, and then complain that there was nothing for them to do.

It’s either grind or whip out that CC and buy gems. Which is fine with me. I would prefer to spend more money to buy the gems if it rewards us.

Solomon Darkfury.3729:

Belzebu.3912:

No you don’t need, it is recommended.
Also, you know you can get ascended trinkets after a while by just logging into the game, right?
Ascended weapons is WAY more accessible then armor, if you have asc trinkets and weapons and exotic armor you barely have any difference from a full asc player.

BTW there is no grind in GW2, you grind only if you want to, no content at all requires you to be full ascended and much less legendaries.

Cups are “recommended” in Football… ask any guy who’s ever been stepped on by a cleat as to whether or not it was needed lololol same applies here

HAHA exactly.
Cups gives a good error margin where if “fecal matter” happens you won’t suffer too much, just like full ascended.

It’s not grinding, it’s reasons to continue playing the game beyond the story.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Apolo.5942:

Interesting to hear about this, since the begining the devs have stated that there was no grinding in GW2, not that anybody believed them, but now they pulled 180.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/the-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-economy/
“I want to be up front: scarcity is important.”

Not sure you understand the concept here. There is no required grinding in GW2. None. Never has been. If you decide to “grind” out content, that’s your choice. The way the game is designed, you play the content in one story, and you move onto the next.

I take it you have neither reached a full set of ascended gear or reached Fractals lvl 50.

for me i see no grinding at all in this game. and i think it is only thos who do not play much or thos maybe who play 3 times a week or so . to them there might be this so called grinding. but that is every ones choice to do so . to me i find a whole lot of fun in this game . and to me that is what counts the most . others it might be something different . i but no where at all do i see this game at all with any so called grinding

Once again, we have a grind thread where no real discussion can take place because we all have a different definition of what grind is. lol

The way I read the economic rebalance post reminds me of Warframe. Not sure if anyone has played it but it’s essentially the grindiest game in the USA based solely around RNG. Probably not as bad as what they have in Korea but terrible by North America standards. I stopped playing because the developers were proactively looking for ways to increase the grind. It was/is a toxic and adversarial relationship.

What I like about GW2 is there isn’t a ton of RNG and the little amount of RNG is generally known. We know what the ecto drop rate is supposed to be, dark matter drop rate, etc… However, they are now saying they want “more scarcity” and they need to “adjust salvage rates”. I highly doubt this is to the effect of “gosh, people are working too hard to get ecto”.

I like that they are moving away from RNG on the Legendaries but worry they’re just shifting the RNG from the precursor to the salvaging which will impact a lot more than just legendaries.

Secondarily, I think their artificial push to make people play what game mode they think is best for us is worrisome. Anytime a game maker says “we know what’s best for you so just take it” rather than “we see the population likes this and we are going to cater to our CUSTOMERS”, I am worried. I can’t imagine dungeons cost Anet any actual cost in real life. They’ve been programmed and haven’t been updated since as far back as I can remember. Anyone that’s run COF P2 knows what I"m talking about (mag gets stuck 50% of the time). So why move players away from something they enjoy that costs Anet nothing? That I don’t have an answer to.

They’re adjusting drop rates for things like Thick Leather, which is effectively worthless.

This is the problem with talking about any economic changes before stating specifics – people are all doom and gloom.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Once again, we have a grind thread where no real discussion can take place because we all have a different definition of what grind is. lol

It is a bit worse than that. I started skimming for a bit, so I apologize if this hasn’t been explained.

Economics is a bit backwards in how it defines things. Particularly, while the layman would define “economics” as something like the study of trade, economists define economics as “the choices that people make dealing with scarcity”. While we see “scarcity” as meaning hard to find or rare, an economist sees scarcity as meaning a limited production rate or amount.

Smith’s concern being that, if we could easily get everything, then there wouldn’t be any trade. The production of any of the crafting materials has to be low enough that demand will outstrip supply. If not, then you end up with what happened to many of the mid-tier gemstones. In order to solve the current problem where lower and mid level materials are hard to get on max level players, they have to solve the new problem that map specific rewards will cause: over-abundance.

So salvaging will be nerfed, so that guaranteed farming can be created. Overall Anet doesn’t want the markets to go totally out of whack, as most things are in a good place right now. From the buyers perspective, things should even out to there being no difference in prices. From the sellers perspective, the mats you gain will be more from map specific events than from salvaging random stuff that fills your inventory.

Frank.7452:

They’re adjusting drop rates for things like Thick Leather, which is effectively worthless.

This is the problem with talking about any economic changes before stating specifics – people are all doom and gloom.

Makes me glad I bought thousands of units of thick leather when I saw how cheap it was and factored in what John Smith did to silk. Even if they nerf the drop rate to basically zero I should still have enough to last me for my own personal use. But it makes me sad for the people who didn’t drop a handful of gold to hoard a common mat. I like the idea of the map rewards system, but I don’t like people effectively being forced to farm events to maybe get a piece of leather.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Guess this link needs posted again.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

Guess this link needs to be posted as well -

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Raids-Required-Ascended/first#post5577142

Playing a game is grinding, you need to grind your fingers on your keyboard after all. Grind grind grin. Even opening loot bags is such a grind, grinding my finger on the mouse click button. Everything I don’t like to do is a grind. I don’t think people know what grinding means anymore. People just throw the word grind out when they find some content they don’t like. So my solution is if you don’t wanna grind, than don’t do it it’s so simple.

Ascended only gives a 12.5% stat increase which is technically not a big deal. In all my dungeon and fractal runs I’ve seen more people who don’t use 2 food consumables than those who do. Food gives you 10% plus about 5-8% extra dps. So food gives on average 16.5% dps increase, if you don’t usually bother about eating food I don’t think you would feel the diff between exotics and ascended.

It feels like the economy changes are basically – we took the things you enjoyed doing in the vanilla game, that gave you rewards, and took those rewards and put them in something you don’t enjoy doing so if you want to keep having fun you need to buy the new content (because we also made sure that stuff is rewarding) otherwise you are just going to be farming nodes n stuff like that.

Equilibriator.8741:

It feels like the economy changes are basically – we took the things you enjoyed doing in the vanilla game, that gave you rewards, and took those rewards and put them in something you don’t enjoy doing so if you want to keep having fun you need to buy the new content (because we also made sure that stuff is rewarding) otherwise you are just going to be farming nodes n stuff like that.

basically this there is such a driving force behind to FORCE you to upgrade to the expac.
as it stands ok so you giving us 4 new maps(while they may be bigger they are still maps and maps don’t take long to fully complete exploring wise), no new max level while nice there isn’t that need to spend a good amount of time leveling like other mmos do to help spread out the game so to speak ffxiv did it pretty terribly since they nerf Heavenswards fates to worst then base games so basically quest old fates and dungeons to level to 60. don’t mind but there is non of that fluff to slow down players.

I’ve been reading basically the three legendaries they show are the only ones ready. as well as raids not being there at launch
so we are basically getting bit new pvp stuff new wvw map 4maps and fractals. and basic features like guild halls finally. I did not pre-order heart of thorns I am putting my foot down And waiting for third party site deals I not paying full price for some of an expac.

the main problem is the cloth, its price is already pretty high and i am hoping that it will not raise because every ascended armor piece/weapon needs a bolt of damask

Vella the knight.6072:

Equilibriator.8741:

It feels like the economy changes are basically – we took the things you enjoyed doing in the vanilla game, that gave you rewards, and took those rewards and put them in something you don’t enjoy doing so if you want to keep having fun you need to buy the new content (because we also made sure that stuff is rewarding) otherwise you are just going to be farming nodes n stuff like that.

basically this there is such a driving force behind to FORCE you to upgrade to the expac.
as it stands ok so you giving us 4 new maps(while they may be bigger they are still maps and maps don’t take long to fully complete exploring wise), no new max level while nice there isn’t that need to spend a good amount of time leveling like other mmos do to help spread out the game so to speak ffxiv did it pretty terribly since they nerf Heavenswards fates to worst then base games so basically quest old fates and dungeons to level to 60. don’t mind but there is non of that fluff to slow down players.

I’ve been reading basically the three legendaries they show are the only ones ready. as well as raids not being there at launch
so we are basically getting bit new pvp stuff new wvw map 4maps and fractals. and basic features like guild halls finally. I did not pre-order heart of thorns I am putting my foot down And waiting for third party site deals I not paying full price for some of an expac.

yeh i didnt preorder – no flipping chance im going to either when my only reward is what? a character slot!? bahahahaha. Halo is coming out this month – im getting that. thats an actual full game and i think its the same price.

Ill get this eventually but i wont be in a rush to do it. and if it turns out i need to spend 10 quid on top to get the “living story” content which i’ve missed (which should be all free seeing as they said the expansion gives you the living story) I will never be getting this “expansion” – at least for another year or two……which by then ill have found a different mmo.

i really like guild wars 2 but i cant help but feel like this may be the death of it for me. ill let others review and make a judgement call.

It’s hard to say what motives Anet has for changes like this. But looking at the fact that players need to gather lots of stuff to create good items in the expansion, it is fair to assume it’s done to keep them playing longer by grinding a lot. Same for (minor) changes like this one.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Guess this link needs posted again.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

You can post it all you want, but all that was said by Anet was that it was balanced around ascended gear. Anet clearly said you wouldn’t need ascended gear. By clearly as in directly.

AdaephonDelat.3890:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Sizer.3987:

The “no grind” philosophy means a new set of gear with higher stats wont be required every time new content comes out. It was broken once when ascended gear and fractals came out, which people hated, but by now they have either gotten used to it or quit. Raids do not break it as ascended gear is not required for them.

It also doesnt mean high end cosmetic items wont be expensive.

Guess this link needs posted again.

http://dulfy.net/2015/09/30/gw2-ascended-gear-will-be-needed-in-raids/

Guess this link needs to be posted as well -

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Raids-Required-Ascended/first#post5577142

Thank you for finding that. I was looking for awhile.

So Nyah to all the people saying “its required!”

Also, Duffy messed up there and inflated the problem with that kind of heading. There is a difference between “should” and “required”.

“Should” I kill this mob in front of me? Nah, I can go around.
There is a mob in front of me I cannot bypass, I am “Required” to kill it.

I love how people still complain about Ascended gear 3 years after it’s been out, as if it’s some new tier. The Ascended tier came out 3 months after the game launched, time to quit yer whining and get the gear that’s been top tier since literally 2012. There’s no excuse for it at this point. The gear treadmill complaints were appropriate in 2012, 2013, and possibly early 2014 (for those that really wanted to hang onto the “Anet lied to us all!” battlecry). But it’s almost 2016. Ascended is the top stat tier, has been the top stat tier, and will continue to be the top stat tier. It’s time to GET OVER IT.

I am so darned tired of this “Grind Wars 2” comments, they are so stupid and sad.

I have said this so many times but I have played this game since 3-days headstart and the most I have ever grinded or farmed, whatever you call it is during a LS in Southsun cove becouse I wanted a rare drop there and I farmed for 1 hour a day for a week then no more. But I never though it was booring becouse if I would have thought so I wouldn’t have done it.

I don’t have a Legendary (Mostly becouse I dislike them, other weapons are cooler) and I have never got a precursor drop. I did manage to get both Scarlets Kiss and Rainbow during the last Episoned of LS season 1.

I have one full ascended set for my Engineer and one almost full for my Guardian and a few ascended parts for my other alts and I have never farmed gold or mats to be able to craft them. Sure 20% of the Ascended gear I have are from PvP and it helped me alot when they made so we could change stats on asceded gear.

I do not like farming or Grinding, I get bored quickly of it and I don’t play games I find booring becouse games for me are meant to entertain.

So what I am saying is that I have never been forced to farm or grind anything in this game to enjoy it, sure I have been forced to farm and grind to get some specific cosmetic but nothing that makes me better than anyone else, I have just played the game and enjoyed it and suddenly I have what I wanted. Thats the charm with GW2, I can do almost every content in the game and still get to level 80 and have a full Ascended armor and that is what they meant with the no grinding statement for GW2.

With these new changes I can get my hands on good crafting mats without having to kill 8million grawls for example, but I can instead go and enjoy the content of the game and get a neat reward for doing that. So this makes this game even less grindy so I think it is perfect so I am so looking forward to the expac even more now.

Draknar.5748:

I love how people still complain about Ascended gear 3 years after it’s been out, as if it’s some new tier. The Ascended tier came out 3 months after the game launched, time to quit yer whining and get the gear that’s been top tier since literally 2012. There’s no excuse for it at this point. The gear treadmill complaints were appropriate in 2012, 2013, and possibly early 2014 (for those that really wanted to hang onto the “Anet lied to us all!” battlecry). But it’s almost 2016. Ascended is the top stat tier, has been the top stat tier, and will continue to be the top stat tier. It’s time to GET OVER IT.

The problem isn’t that it exists or even that it’s too expensive to make three full sets but rather it being mandatory for some content. It’s the top stat tear, extra stats from exotic won’t be felt if content assumes you have full ascended and would feel more like a deficit and full ascended the bonus won’t be felt either so it’d be like running a dungeon in full greens. It’s like you make this gear with these extra stats to reduce risk and last longer by having better damage output and mitigation then its purpose gets defeated when you can still go down like a wet noodle from some mechanic you can’t even see even with ascended.

See’s Title

nope nope nope nope nope nope nope
*Nopes away

TorsoReaper.8530:

What I like about GW2 is there isn’t a ton of RNG and the little amount of RNG is generally known. We know what the ecto drop rate is supposed to be, dark matter drop rate, etc… However, they are now saying they want “more scarcity” and they need to “adjust salvage rates”. I highly doubt this is to the effect of “gosh, people are working too hard to get ecto”.

Seriously? Youve never spent 2 hours in silverwastes to get a bag full of rares, then salvaged those 50 rares to only get 10 ectos out of it? Man, I envy that.

This game is nothing but RNG. Seriously. Nothing. But. RNG.

Agemnon.4608:

Draknar.5748:

I love how people still complain about Ascended gear 3 years after it’s been out, as if it’s some new tier. The Ascended tier came out 3 months after the game launched, time to quit yer whining and get the gear that’s been top tier since literally 2012. There’s no excuse for it at this point. The gear treadmill complaints were appropriate in 2012, 2013, and possibly early 2014 (for those that really wanted to hang onto the “Anet lied to us all!” battlecry). But it’s almost 2016. Ascended is the top stat tier, has been the top stat tier, and will continue to be the top stat tier. It’s time to GET OVER IT.

The problem isn’t that it exists or even that it’s too expensive to make three full sets but rather it being mandatory for some content. It’s the top stat tear, extra stats from exotic won’t be felt if content assumes you have full ascended and would feel more like a deficit and full ascended the bonus won’t be felt either so it’d be like running a dungeon in full greens. It’s like you make this gear with these extra stats to reduce risk and last longer by having better damage output and mitigation then its purpose gets defeated when you can still go down like a wet noodle from some mechanic you can’t even see even with ascended.

If you eat 2 consumables which boost your targetted stats it gives you a higher boost than ascended to exotics. So do you eat consumables? And what about the times you don’t or forgot to eat consumables, did you feel significantly weaker? I don’t think so.