Solo-Instance for Dungeons
Just about everyone against this idea seems to believe that this is going to change the original dungeons themselves. Like the concept of “seperate mode” doesn’t apply.
The only reason why finding a group for dungeons in GW1 turned into what it is is because there was no separation from original content. Heroes replaced the party but the dungeons remained. This game doesn’t have heroes and therefore there is nothing to replace the party. Lowering the difficulty and rewards doesn’t require anywhere near an overhaul.
Maybe I just don’t know what the real issue is with it.
Why do dungeon difficulty need to be lower though?.. Low manning it isn’t really that difficult, there are plenty of people that do it daily. The only thing that stands as a huge obstacle for people who prefers to run with less than full party are dungeon paths where they shove “teamwork” down your throat like arah p1 where you need at least 4 on the geysers but other than that everything is perfectly doable.
Just because a certain group can do it solo doesn’t mean that everyone wants to be or is capable of being like that specific group of people. Why not have a separate mode with a lower difficulty and reward? Why does the difficulty have to remain the same? It is pointless.
This isnt a request for a solo mode, its a request for a easy mode.
As soloing, with lesser rewards because soloing generally takes longer than could be managed in a group, already exists I would counter suggest that an easy mode should perhaps not provide rewards at all.
Then don’t play the easy mode.
“Please stop complaining about stuff you don’t even know about.” ~Nocta
Just about everyone against this idea seems to believe that this is going to change the original dungeons themselves. Like the concept of “seperate mode” doesn’t apply.
The only reason why finding a group for dungeons in GW1 turned into what it is is because there was no separation from original content. Heroes replaced the party but the dungeons remained. This game doesn’t have heroes and therefore there is nothing to replace the party. Lowering the difficulty and rewards doesn’t require anywhere near an overhaul.
Maybe I just don’t know what the real issue is with it.
Why do dungeon difficulty need to be lower though?.. Low manning it isn’t really that difficult, there are plenty of people that do it daily. The only thing that stands as a huge obstacle for people who prefers to run with less than full party are dungeon paths where they shove “teamwork” down your throat like arah p1 where you need at least 4 on the geysers but other than that everything is perfectly doable.
Just because a certain group can do it solo doesn’t mean that everyone wants to be or is capable of being like that specific group of people. Why not have a separate mode with a lower difficulty and reward? Why does the difficulty have to remain the same? It is pointless.
So basically you don’t want to be part of the “group” that puts the time and effort to learning how to complete dungeon with low numbers and instead want Anet to implement an easy mode where you can faceroll the dungeon like pretty much every other pve content in this game?…. well lucky for you, the “group” that you don’t want to be part of has already provided alot of knowledge as to how to complete each dungeon solo/duo or whatever. The “easy mode” is already there, just go look up on youtube as to how to complete a dungeon solo and copy them and voila, don’t need Anet to waste resources on a pointless mode.
stuff
20% reduction in strength =/= easy mode.
And did it ever occur to you that providing a solo instance would help players get used to the dungeon mechanics so if and when they want to go for bigger prizes they’ve already done it and not be so PUGy when they join a group?
“Please stop complaining about stuff you don’t even know about.” ~Nocta
The playerbase will simply be divided and it will be harer to find people for a specific dungeon scaling. This will bring back the issue that we got rid off with holy trinity: takes long time to find groups.
There is no big problem with the current system, so it will be a waste of creating a new one that has its’ own share of issues. Not to mention the fact that Anet has been promising players to offer them an experience that is more focused on grouping rather than playing solo.
Scaling instance content will give one more reason to people to not play with eachother. This is not the direction an MMORPG should take.
You really think players are going to go for a third of the rewards each day? Okay lol.
Very much so yes. As I play mostly ranger getting into a party can be hard, usually end up not doing any at all anymore because of that.
So if I could solo I’d much rather get 1/3 of a reward over nothing at all. Plus I could play how I want to. Wouldn’t be forced to play spotter and frost spirit or get kicked
The playerbase will simply be divided and it will be harer to find people for a specific dungeon scaling. This will bring back the issue that we got rid off with holy trinity: takes long time to find groups.
There is no big problem with the current system, so it will be a waste of creating a new one that has its’ own share of issues. Not to mention the fact that Anet has been promising players to offer them an experience that is more focused on grouping rather than playing solo.
Scaling instance content will give one more reason to people to not play with eachother. This is not the direction an MMORPG should take.
You really think players are going to go for a third of the rewards each day? Okay lol.
Very much so yes. As I play mostly ranger getting into a party can be hard, usually end up not doing any at all anymore because of that.
So if I could solo I’d much rather get 1/3 of a reward over nothing at all. Plus I could play how I want to. Wouldn’t be forced to play spotter and frost spirit or get kicked
Lol I should have specified which group. Of course it’ll get people who don’t want to deal with people in LFG into dungeons more, but what I doubt is that the people who already do dungeons now are going to head on over to soloD for a third of the rewards a day.
“Please stop complaining about stuff you don’t even know about.” ~Nocta
As it is, it’s only me and a buddy online nowadays, but we’d have a ball 2-manning dungeons if they were designed for it.
I’m in the same boat. It’s pretty much just me and my best friend playing this game. When we do dungeons we usually just pair up and form our own LFG but it’d be fun if we could just do dungeons by ourselves.
As i have said before, you can already do alot of the dungeons solo. If you want to learn which dungeon path to start first i suggest arah path 2, 3 and all cm paths.
That’s misleading, though. You can’t possibly believe that marginalized tactics is a counterpoint to this discussion without being disingenuous, maybe a little crazy or a min-maxing elitist. Not everyone is out to maximize performance – this discussion gets absurdly old. Guild Wars 2 is, first and foremost, a game – games should provide fun and entertainment, not just another grueling task to excel at.
Myself, my friends, along with every normal person on the face of this planet isn’t going to make a task out of Guild Wars 2 because if we’re going to put any effort into something, it might as well be a job and get more money.
When did i say you have to min-max, some of the safest ways to solo a dungeon aren’t even the most effecient. For instance, there are alot of boss fights in cm where dagger/dagger is the most effecient weapon set for a thief to solo but you can always go sword/pistol which is safer, slower and basically more lazy way of doing it.
You don’t have to min-max to solo a dungeon path, you just need to know the dungeon.
Another thing is If you and your friend just wants to find content where a casual player can breeze through, there are already plenty of content out there for you to do so, low manning dungeon in its current form is the only challenging thing PvE has to offer. Last thing Anet needs to do is make such a content a joke.
You can’t possibly solo a dungeon without some amount of min-maxing. Implying anything else is absurd and disingenuous. Please go tell your glib rhetoric to someone stupid enough to believe it.
I don’t know if the adjustments proposed by the opp really would make it possible to solo dungeons (and I don’t mean the way some players already solo now, but more like it was in a lot of GW 1 dungeon environments). But I do like the idea! This is a part of the content some players never experience simply because they don’t like the hassle of creating a party, running around in a group of players without a way to pause for a while. Not to mention the complaining when you don’t perform the way others want you to. So yes! And if it’s not possible for excisting dungeons, then maybe it can be done for future content.
Scalable dungeons would be great ,one of the things i love about Rift is the 2 player dungeon type things they do so just me and the girlfriend can play how we want without being hassled for not running the “accepted” cookie cutter builds and just having fun.
As it is, it’s only me and a buddy online nowadays, but we’d have a ball 2-manning dungeons if they were designed for it.
I’m in the same boat. It’s pretty much just me and my best friend playing this game. When we do dungeons we usually just pair up and form our own LFG but it’d be fun if we could just do dungeons by ourselves.
As i have said before, you can already do alot of the dungeons solo. If you want to learn which dungeon path to start first i suggest arah path 2, 3 and all cm paths.
That’s misleading, though. You can’t possibly believe that marginalized tactics is a counterpoint to this discussion without being disingenuous, maybe a little crazy or a min-maxing elitist. Not everyone is out to maximize performance – this discussion gets absurdly old. Guild Wars 2 is, first and foremost, a game – games should provide fun and entertainment, not just another grueling task to excel at.
Myself, my friends, along with every normal person on the face of this planet isn’t going to make a task out of Guild Wars 2 because if we’re going to put any effort into something, it might as well be a job and get more money.
When did i say you have to min-max, some of the safest ways to solo a dungeon aren’t even the most effecient. For instance, there are alot of boss fights in cm where dagger/dagger is the most effecient weapon set for a thief to solo but you can always go sword/pistol which is safer, slower and basically more lazy way of doing it.
You don’t have to min-max to solo a dungeon path, you just need to know the dungeon.
Another thing is If you and your friend just wants to find content where a casual player can breeze through, there are already plenty of content out there for you to do so, low manning dungeon in its current form is the only challenging thing PvE has to offer. Last thing Anet needs to do is make such a content a joke.
You can’t possibly solo a dungeon without some amount of min-maxing. Implying anything else is absurd and disingenuous. Please go tell your glib rhetoric to someone stupid enough to believe it.
If you mean learning how to dodge and play your class as “min-maxing” then ok you might as well say this game is all about min-maxing then.
As it is, it’s only me and a buddy online nowadays, but we’d have a ball 2-manning dungeons if they were designed for it.
I’m in the same boat. It’s pretty much just me and my best friend playing this game. When we do dungeons we usually just pair up and form our own LFG but it’d be fun if we could just do dungeons by ourselves.
As i have said before, you can already do alot of the dungeons solo. If you want to learn which dungeon path to start first i suggest arah path 2, 3 and all cm paths.
That’s misleading, though. You can’t possibly believe that marginalized tactics is a counterpoint to this discussion without being disingenuous, maybe a little crazy or a min-maxing elitist. Not everyone is out to maximize performance – this discussion gets absurdly old. Guild Wars 2 is, first and foremost, a game – games should provide fun and entertainment, not just another grueling task to excel at.
Myself, my friends, along with every normal person on the face of this planet isn’t going to make a task out of Guild Wars 2 because if we’re going to put any effort into something, it might as well be a job and get more money.
When did i say you have to min-max, some of the safest ways to solo a dungeon aren’t even the most effecient. For instance, there are alot of boss fights in cm where dagger/dagger is the most effecient weapon set for a thief to solo but you can always go sword/pistol which is safer, slower and basically more lazy way of doing it.
You don’t have to min-max to solo a dungeon path, you just need to know the dungeon.
Another thing is If you and your friend just wants to find content where a casual player can breeze through, there are already plenty of content out there for you to do so, low manning dungeon in its current form is the only challenging thing PvE has to offer. Last thing Anet needs to do is make such a content a joke.
You can’t possibly solo a dungeon without some amount of min-maxing. Implying anything else is absurd and disingenuous. Please go tell your glib rhetoric to someone stupid enough to believe it.
Challenge accepted.
I find it odd that when solo dungeons are mentioned people invariably respond that soloing dungeons is already possible if you are good enough.
If players are good enough to solo a dungeon as is, then I don’t see the problem either solo or in a group. For me, the whole point of a solo dungeon would be the ability to learn, or perhaps just accept being limited to my own personal skill cap, without having to drag down or be carried by 4 other players who know what they are doing and/or have more skill.
Solo-instances would be cool. Or maybe helper NPCs to jump in with you.
In GW1 it works well. Everyday I see people find groups with other players easily if it’s for a hard mode Zaishen daily mission or bounty as well as people just porting into the outpost/town with their own heroes to do their own thing.
I’d definitely be for this even if there were a significant hit to the rewards at the end for the solo’ers.
The playerbase will simply be divided and it will be harer to find people for a specific dungeon scaling. This will bring back the issue that we got rid off with holy trinity: takes long time to find groups.
There is no big problem with the current system, so it will be a waste of creating a new one that has its’ own share of issues. Not to mention the fact that Anet has been promising players to offer them an experience that is more focused on grouping rather than playing solo.
Scaling instance content will give one more reason to people to not play with eachother. This is not the direction an MMORPG should take.
You really think those players are going to go to soloD for a third of the rewards each day? Okay lol.
1/3 of the reward is the guy crazy if you want to make a 5 man into a 1 man then its 1/5 of the reward buddy.
So instead of 69 with 3 boss bags you get 14
The notion that this idea will somehow ‘hurt’ grouping players is ridiculous. If Silverwastes, and what’s coming with Heart of Thorns, is any indication, we’re already forced to group or zerg to see content succeed toward each stage or tier.
And, realistically, soloing players aren’t grouping for dungeons anyway. They’re pretty much ignoring dungeons to begin with because it all but requires a group.
There’s a reason there’s so much backlash when two fractals hit the daily PvE requirements.
Being able to play solo was the best thing about GW1 for me. I played through almost all content of GW1 on my own with my heros.
I’d be super happy if they would add a solo mode so you can play on your own terms with whatever build and class you like.
There are many single player games that have optional coop play, why not have a multiplayer game with optional solo play.
I agree completely with this post! Heros would allow players (like myself) who would rather play solo or with one other person do dungeons and you wouldn’t have to change the dungeon itself. Building heros in GW1 was a very unique challenge and creating a hero party that worked well took skill. I would welcome that in GW2.
1/3 of the reward is the guy crazy if you want to make a 5 man into a 1 man then its 1/5 of the reward buddy.
So instead of 69 with 3 boss bags you get 14
If we are going by that kind of logic, I could argue that the reward could still be 69 since everyone in the group gets the same amount at the end of the dungeon. 5(69)/5 = 69
The point of the reduced cost it to keep group dungeons more profitable. If you really want it 20% of the rewards then I am pretty sure reducing the strength of enemies up to 50% would be adequate compensation.
“Please stop complaining about stuff you don’t even know about.” ~Nocta
1/3 of the reward is the guy crazy if you want to make a 5 man into a 1 man then its 1/5 of the reward buddy.
So instead of 69 with 3 boss bags you get 14If we are going by that kind of logic, I could argue that the reward could still be 69 since everyone in the group gets the same amount at the end of the dungeon. 5(69)/5 = 69
The point of the reduced cost it to keep group dungeons more profitable. If you really want it 20% of the rewards then I am pretty sure reducing the strength of enemies up to 50% would be adequate compensation.
20% would be ridiculous unless it was so fast and easy you could clear all paths solo faster than a 5 man group. I think reducing the dungeon currency rewards by 1/3 (so from 60 to 40) for one player, and then scaling by 5 for each player up to 60 would be perfect. Oh, and those +3 bonus bags? Leave those as a bonus for a full group of 5. Now the gold reward should probably be reduced by 2/3’s for a solo player and scale by ~ 17% per additional player up to the (current) reward for a full group of 5. This makes it worthwhile for the solo player, but each additional player nicely scales the rewards for everyone.
Just about everyone against this idea seems to believe that this is going to change the original dungeons themselves. Like the concept of “seperate mode” doesn’t apply.
The only reason why finding a group for dungeons in GW1 turned into what it is is because there was no separation from original content. Heroes replaced the party but the dungeons remained. This game doesn’t have heroes and therefore there is nothing to replace the party. Lowering the difficulty and rewards doesn’t require anywhere near an overhaul.
Maybe I just don’t know what the real issue is with it.
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
It’s just another way to divide that part of the playerbase, which is probably less than it used to be, because people are burned out on those dungeons anyway.
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
That’s why what I really wish for is a solo “learning” mode, where you can learn what to do for each boss, where to go, try out a new class, explore, etc, without being totally useless to a group due to having absolutely no clue what to do, and no experience actively using my skills in a dungeon type encounter. Ideally you’d gain the confidence to join in with a group for the full experience and full rewards.
(edited by DavidH.7380)
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
To be completely honest, only a handful of people “experience” the content. It is always sped through so quickly that there is rarely much time to do so. So in a way, allowing the solo dungeon would not only be paced at the rate the person is doing it but they have the choice of just kicking back and actually “experience” it at their leisure.
EDIT: I understand that one can simply ask, but them most often than not someone is inconvenienced.
“Please stop complaining about stuff you don’t even know about.” ~Nocta
(edited by yolo swaggins.2570)
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
To be completely honest, only a handful of people “experience” the content. It is always sped through so quickly that there is rarely much time to do so. So in a way, allowing the solo dungeon would not only be paced at the rate the person is doing it but they have the choice of just kicking back and actually “experience” it at their leisure.
But it’s not always sped through quickly. It’s often sped through quickly but dungeon runners who use LFG, but then, my guild runs dungeons all the time and often with new or inexperienced people. We tend to take dungeons slowly and many others do too.
That’s why joining a random group never really works for me. I don’t know or care about the skips or the exploits. I’m not really a fan of stacking either (but I’ve learned to endure it).
But at the end of the day, there are people out there experiencing dungeons still.
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
That’s why what I really wish for is a solo “learning” mode, where you can learn what to do for each boss, where to go, try out a new class, explore, etc, without being totally useless to a group due to having absolutely no clue what to do, and no experience actively using my skills in a dungeon type encounter. Ideally you’d gain the confidence to join in with a group for the full experience and full rewards.
But is that really a better option than joining a casual guild that runs dungeons for fun and learning with them and making some friends in the process?
The issue is it will take people out of the dungeon running pool and it will be harder to find groups. That’s the issue.
Some people are forced out if their comfort zones to do dungeons. Take all those people out of the equation and there’ll be less people running dungeons the “old” way.
I wonder what percentage of that group does dungeons outside their comfort zone and what percentage just avoids them and finds something else to do.
I don’t know if I’m the exception or the norm for that group, but I have a warrior, guardian, and ranger at 80 and still haven’t done a dungeon, even though I like the content, specifically because of the need to group.
But the dungeon content in this game, in many ways is DESIGNED around a group.
There’s a destroyer boss in COE in the middle of a platform. There are three lasers that target this boss and platforms leading down to him. The challenge is to coordinate all three people to use the lasers and then have everyone converge on the boss after taking down his shield. That shield comes back too, so you have to get back up before the shield comes back up and dodge dropping dragon teeth in order to progress.
You make those solo, you’ve destroyed the soul of that encounter. You may get your solo dungeon eventually. But you’ll never experience that content the way it was meant to be experienced.
To be completely honest, only a handful of people “experience” the content. It is always sped through so quickly that there is rarely much time to do so. So in a way, allowing the solo dungeon would not only be paced at the rate the person is doing it but they have the choice of just kicking back and actually “experience” it at their leisure.
All that can be done with the lfg or the noob guild that run dungeons with people
Very interestingly the reason why I personally don’t like the dungeons in this game that much (including fractals) is because I think that 5 as a group size is too small. I would much more enjoy a dungeon experience in a group of let’s say 8.
But back to topic: if you have played more than one MMO you have surely come across a lot of mechanics/game modes/features that you think should be present in your current MMO-love. For me thats on the one hand crafting/harvesting as in Ryzom, on the other hand random dungeon missions like in Anarchy Online. Imagine you’d go to a white board, pick up a random mission that is generated for you or your group (depending on whether you are in a group when looking at the white board), you travel there and do that dungeon. It is generated randomly and scales to the group size you had when you accepted the mission. Feel ready for a challenge? Get the mission with a full group, then do it solo. Reward coulds be given out in form of mystic coin, laurels, any other existing currency.
Solo dungeons do not necessarily need to be smaller versions of the existing dungeons, the system could be completely independent.