Guild Wars 2

I’m going to assume you have read the title.

Most zerk players (me included) agree that any current permanent content can be completed by a full zerk group. A non-zerk player will simply slow down the group. This type of system in GW2 alienates zerk players from non-zerk players.

Thus, a solution must be found.

The solution, to be honest, is quite simple. CREATE A NEED FOR NON-ZERK PLAYERS. Create dungeons, events, bosses, or whatever. BUT MAKE SURE THAT NON-ZERK PLAYERS ARE NEEDED TO FUFILL CERTAIN ROLES THAT ARE NEEDED TO CLEAR CONTENT. An example could be a dungeon that needs a tank, or a healer, or WHATEVER. Otherwise, non-zerk players will always be shunned by zerk players. Zerk players will always be abused by non-zerk players. And in the end, nothing will ever change.

Really? Not only is it a duplicate thread over the “zerk” bullkitten (of which there’s 98324756238479560348756239875613980745623084795623948576 of already), it’s a duplicate of how the game needs the enemies reworked (8726592837 of those), and a duplicate of how the game (does not) needs the “kitten Trinity” (982374569238 of those).

…

Oh, I also forgot, it’s another “zerk or gtfo” duplicate (999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 of those).

Not a good idea. As soon as developers create a need for any specific build, then that puts the nail in the coffin of all those groups where people bring what they want.

The real solution is for people to give up on the idea that it’s their right to have access to every group, with the convenience of the LFG tool. Exclusion is and always will be a people issue, so it cannot be solved with a gameplay solution. Gameplay solutions will only transfer the specifics of the exclusion.

There is a need for non-zerk players.

I myself run Soldier’s gear, because I like to do a lot of WvW and EoTM, and during 6 dungeon runs in the past week, everyone in the party has got downed by a powerful attack, except me, and ive had to run round reviving everyone.

“Zerker is the best dps”

Sorry, dead people don’t do DPS, get out of my dungeon group.

“But you can dodge, even with zerker gear”

Yes, you can dodge twice in roughly 15 seconds without Vigor…Then what?…If the boss decides they want to attack for a 3rd time in a row, you’re downed. Im seriously debating about refusing players with berserker’s stat armour from my dungeon groups, just because im sick of having to revive players who refuse to embrace a toughness stat.

Argon.1563:

There is a need for non-zerk players.

I myself run Soldier’s gear, because I like to do a lot of WvW and EoTM, and during 6 dungeon runs in the past week, everyone in the party has got downed by a powerful attack, except me, and ive had to run round reviving everyone.

“Zerker is the best dps”

Sorry, dead people don’t do DPS, get out of my dungeon group.

“But you can dodge, even with zerker gear”

Yes, you can dodge twice in roughly 15 seconds without Vigor…Then what?…If the boss decides they want to attack for a 3rd time in a row, you’re downed. Im seriously debating about refusing players with berserker’s stat armour from my dungeon groups, just because im sick of having to revive players who refuse to embrace a toughness stat.

This is diferent topic I think. You played with unskilled players and If they had full soldier gear, you will revive them only every 2nd powerful atack = nothing change

I think the best method would be – since zerk gear typically has no toughness – to add a negative value to toughness and further increase their power.
This would make them capable of dying in a single hit.

Currently all armor classes have a base toughness that is sufficient for end-game content w/o the dire need for toughness (it helps – but it’s not needed).
Since we know damage is calculated by…

(Power * Weapon damage * skill coefficient) / (Toughness + Defense)

…We can easily see how if we pulled – say, 1,000 toughness away from them – they should die from just about any hit.
This will create a need for a support class to accompany the zerkers – and since all classes can support with AoE healing and such – it would balance the game far more.

Many people would rage if the zerk bars got nerfed – but it would make the community much more tolerable in the long run imo.

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

I think the best method would be – since zerk gear typically has no toughness – to add a negative value to toughness and further increase their power.
This would make them capable of dying in a single hit.

Currently all armor classes have a base toughness that is sufficient for end-game content w/o the dire need for toughness (it helps – but it’s not needed).
Since we know damage is calculated by…

(Power * Weapon damage * skill coefficient) / (Toughness + Defense)

…We can easily see how if we pulled – say, 1,000 toughness away from them – they should die from just about any hit.
This will create a need for a support class to accompany the zerkers – and since all classes can support with AoE healing and such – it would balance the game far more.

Many people would rage if the zerk bars got nerfed – but it would make the community much more tolerable in the long run imo.

Berserk armored thieves, eles and guardians already die from a single hit. Rest of the classes take 2 hits to go down. Non skilled player using berserk gear will be a burden to any team but a skilled player will be able to mitigate that incoming damage with evades, blocks, blinds, invulnerabilities and other means.

Try meleeing the ettin in uncategorized fractal at lvl 50 and you’ll realise that berserk armor is fine as it is.

Also…

I like my solution better:

Please make LFG comments that say exactly what type of players you’d like in your group. Those comments that just say “P1”? Yeah, those are the parties where everyone gets angry at each other for dying “because that other guy was using the wrong gear set.”

Also, please read LFG comments before joining and abide by them. Please don’t be that person that joins a Zerk only party but is “secretly” wearing another armor type. You’re basically like that guy in wvw who is “secretly” underleveled that is hanging out in the zerg.

I’ve cleared every dungeon and every scale of fractal with pretty much every random setup you could think of. For the majority content the zerker mentality is mostly in player’s minds. There’s actually a lot more fights in game that benefit from having stat hybrids in group than are better off full zerk. There’s plenty of stuff that can’t just be whacked in 10 seconds by a zerk group and you actually get more damage over time from a semi tank group healing eachother to keep sustained damage instead of having zerkers dodging on cooldown and switching to ranged to kite.

But despite the fact there’s actually plenty of fights that are not designed with zerker stacking in mind, the really farmable stuff is best with zerkers because you get that daily bonus chest 3 minutes sooner and there’s really hard stuff that’s gonna OHK a tank anyway and the health pools are so high that without 5x good zerkers it’ll take 20 minutes to kill each boss.

What I’m getting at is if you really want to worry about this dungeoning thing, instead of complaining about what people want to run any particular content with, farm and learn more than one spec. There’s times when I put on my PVT stuff and go shout heals and there’s times (albeit more often than not) when I go full zojja’s and all DPS traits. The game isn’t really one spec fits all and the game isn’t all spec fits all either, never will be. The devs could balance fights til they’re blue in the face and they’d never stop players from finding the most popular builds and the easiest to farm paths. If you absolutely will never consider making a zerk set and learning a zerk spec, you just want to sit in your one spec you like to play, join or list groups without the word zerker in the title. That’s really the solution to the whole complaint, because the complaint is about people not the game in 99.5% of situations.

Argon.1563:

There is a need for non-zerk players.

I myself run Soldier’s gear, because I like to do a lot of WvW and EoTM, and during 6 dungeon runs in the past week, everyone in the party has got downed by a powerful attack, except me, and ive had to run round reviving everyone.

“Zerker is the best dps”

Sorry, dead people don’t do DPS, get out of my dungeon group.

“But you can dodge, even with zerker gear”

Yes, you can dodge twice in roughly 15 seconds without Vigor…Then what?…If the boss decides they want to attack for a 3rd time in a row, you’re downed. Im seriously debating about refusing players with berserker’s stat armour from my dungeon groups, just because im sick of having to revive players who refuse to embrace a toughness stat.

Energy sigil, endurance food, weapon evades, weapon blocks, vigour on crit traits.

Please tell us more about how bad players in your party went down, it would have happened no matter what gear they were wearing, it’s nothing to do with “dead dps = no dps”.

God Of Mustard.6354:

An example could be a dungeon that needs a tank, or a healer, or WHATEVER.

There is no tank. There is no healer. Because there is no trinity.
The zerk meta is in direct correlation to GW2 not having the trinity. All that matters is damage.

it was pointed out in another post, the problem is not zerker, its because there is only one combat role in this game, and thats DPS, even if they dismantle power, prec and ferocity, ppl will just look for the next strongest DPS build and that wil become the new “zerker” however ive joined zerker partys before and ran knights armour or power prec, condition damage armour, know one even knew.

The only zerk hate seems to be on the forums.

Argon.1563:

There is a need for non-zerk players.

I myself run Soldier’s gear, because I like to do a lot of WvW and EoTM, and during 6 dungeon runs in the past week, everyone in the party has got downed by a powerful attack, except me, and ive had to run round reviving everyone.

“Zerker is the best dps”

Sorry, dead people don’t do DPS, get out of my dungeon group.

“But you can dodge, even with zerker gear”

Yes, you can dodge twice in roughly 15 seconds without Vigor…Then what?…If the boss decides they want to attack for a 3rd time in a row, you’re downed. Im seriously debating about refusing players with berserker’s stat armour from my dungeon groups, just because im sick of having to revive players who refuse to embrace a toughness stat.

The reduced DPS you’re doing may have allowed the boss to live long enough to do it’s bigger attacks. Seriously go watch some speed run videos on youtube, you’ll notice most bosses can be downed in like 15 seconds by a good team.

Surviving doesn’t inherently make you a good player if at the end of it you’re not really contributing to the bosses death, few people want to spend 40 minutes doing a run that can be done in 9 minutes.

God Of Mustard.6354:

I’m going to assume you have read the title.

Most zerk players (me included) agree that any current permanent content can be completed by a full zerk group. A non-zerk player will simply slow down the group. This type of system in GW2 alienates zerk players from non-zerk players.

Thus, a solution must be found.

The solution, to be honest, is quite simple. CREATE A NEED FOR NON-ZERK PLAYERS. Create dungeons, events, bosses, or whatever. BUT MAKE SURE THAT NON-ZERK PLAYERS ARE NEEDED TO FUFILL CERTAIN ROLES THAT ARE NEEDED TO CLEAR CONTENT. An example could be a dungeon that needs a tank, or a healer, or WHATEVER. Otherwise, non-zerk players will always be shunned by zerk players. Zerk players will always be abused by non-zerk players. And in the end, nothing will ever change.

No.
Let’s not ruin this game with tanks and healers. There’s WOW for that if people want it.

If you force certain roles what makes you think players who don’t zerk today ( non-meta players) will fill those roles?
They’ll be filled by meta players in other gear. People who are currently not being taken on dungeon runs ( because non-meta or new) will still not be taken on dungeon runs.

Legit question:

Can’t zerk haters just form their own group? hell, can’t they just form their own community and leave us zerkers alone?

You zerk haters run how you want to run, we zerk users run how we want to run. Let’s NOT group together as our ideals are very different. Let’s NOT cross each other’s path. If you see a lfg zerk ping gear, just ignore it.

i could be wrong….

but hasn’t every single game, mmo, thing… whatever… EVER been about Damage

you play a healer so that you can keep the tank alive so that the tank can keep the agro off the DPS.

so the DPS can kill the thing….

you took extra vitality or toughness or whatever so that you could stay alive long enough to kill the thing.

… o.0

it has always been. and always will be, about damage. In order to “win”, the bad thing has to go away…….

its nice to know I have trained combat medics on the spec ops team. but instead of you standing in the back with your crash kit waiting for something to happen, pick up your weapon and get yer butt up here and be usefull.

Ropechef.6192:

i could be wrong….

but hasn’t every single game, mmo, thing… whatever… EVER been about Damage

you play a healer so that you can keep the tank alive so that the tank can keep the agro off the DPS.

so the DPS can kill the thing….

you took extra vitality or toughness or whatever so that you could stay alive long enough to kill the thing.

… o.0

it has always been. and always will be, about damage. In order to “win”, the bad thing has to go away…….

its nice to know I have trained combat medics on the spec ops team. but instead of you standing in the back with your crash kit waiting for something to happen, pick up your weapon and get yer butt up here and be usefull.

Maybe anet should change pve to domination game mode, like conquest is?

@Protoavis " few people want to spend 40 minutes doing a run that can be done in 9 minutes."
I agree with this IF groups are doing the speed run grind.

But dungeons CAN be completed with any gear group of people. There are those that are grinding it out and only want to play with certain gear/experience, that’s fine and dandy. Which is why LFG tool is so important.

There are also those that enjoy playing the dungeons with a group of people to have fun and therefore, it does not matter what they are gearing up with.
The fun (or challenge) is getting through the dungeon regardless of the gear and experience players have, doesn’t matter if it takes you 10 minutes or 40 minutes. The whole point of the “no trinity required” equals no one NEEDING a particular profession to get through it.

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

Argon.1563:

There is a need for non-zerk players.

I myself run Soldier’s gear, because I like to do a lot of WvW and EoTM, and during 6 dungeon runs in the past week, everyone in the party has got downed by a powerful attack, except me, and ive had to run round reviving everyone.

“Zerker is the best dps”

Sorry, dead people don’t do DPS, get out of my dungeon group.

“But you can dodge, even with zerker gear”

Yes, you can dodge twice in roughly 15 seconds without Vigor…Then what?…If the boss decides they want to attack for a 3rd time in a row, you’re downed. Im seriously debating about refusing players with berserker’s stat armour from my dungeon groups, just because im sick of having to revive players who refuse to embrace a toughness stat.

That is not you dear fellow. That is level scaling. If everyone got downed, it is because they’re either level capped or new to dungeons. It matters not what your toughness is in fractals when you get over lvl 30. Just about all trash mobs can, and will one shot you despite your toughness and massive vit. Screen pollution and not being able to see what is happening only makes it worse. Not to mention most bosses reflection doesn’t work on now and blindness has been reduced on them to 10%..that’s why they died. Bad boss mechanics. Your toughness didn’t save you, luck did.

Bad players = bad players. Good players = good players.

It’s that simple. A good group with good players in any set-up will run dungeons faster than bad players in full zerk. The problem with the “meta” is that bad players hit 80, hear “well you pretty much need to go zerk or go home”, get a bunch of zerk gear and then think they are hot kitten, but die constantly in dungeons, slowing their whole group down.

In my experience, more often than not the zerk player goes down the most. But a good zerk player is indeed valuable, which is why I have a short list of acceptable zerk players I will play with. I don’t PUG zerkers, that’s just asking for trouble.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

“LFWF (looking for water fields)” sometimes can save your skin.

X)

The OP is the wolf in sheeps clothing, leading our lambs to the slaughter! Stop him before the thread of prophecy has been severed!!

IndigoSundown.5419:

Not a good idea. As soon as developers create a need for any specific build, then that puts the nail in the coffin of all those groups where people bring what they want.

Not sure if serious…………………………

How is “bring zerker or gtfo” bringing what you want ?
Just because it is convenient for young kids not to have creativity needed
doesn’t mean other people are not allowed to have fun.

And thank goodness A-Net figured out.
Keep the zerkers out of the game is like a relief.
Zerker can stay in PvP or WvW. I couldn’t care less because people can’t be kicked out.
But finally we descent people who just want an awesome time with epic storys and actually roles in a roleplay game get what we well deserve.
Beside that i guess i don’t have to mention who of the comunity would be able to spend money at the gem store. Daddys wallet isn’t always available.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

Yeah, well Anet’s intention was to remove the trinity by making a multitude of builds viable. Instead of having the game restricted to 3 roles, they wanted many many roles. But what did we end up with? One role. Zerker.

knives.6132:

Legit question:

Can’t zerk haters just form their own group? hell, can’t they just form their own community and leave us zerkers alone?

You zerk haters run how you want to run, we zerk users run how we want to run. Let’s NOT group together as our ideals are very different. Let’s NOT cross each other’s path. If you see a lfg zerk ping gear, just ignore it.

No worries, A-Net has taken care of this.
July 1st will be a relief for all of us since the events will no open zerker fests anymore.
People can go back to actually enjoy the game again.
Until then i keep my usual way of leaving zerkers at the ground and let them
respawn at a waypoint.

My solution would’ve been keeping the AR system from GW1 and removing the stat trees entirely – leaving it up to builds and traits with weapon and armor stats being presented rather plainly.

I felt it was much simpler, there was never a question about balance or attribute points in GW1 – skill balancing was the #1 priority.

I love zerk players. They drop lots of bags when they explode in WvW.

Silly ’zerkers.

Xenon.4537:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

Yeah, well Anet’s intention was to remove the trinity by making a multitude of builds viable. Instead of having the game restricted to 3 roles, they wanted many many roles. But what did we end up with? One role. Zerker.

How is a stat combination a role? Like, literally what made you draw that conclusion? If apothecary was the meta would that mean that “apothecary” was this supposed one role?

Zerkers got too much survivability with huge amount of damage that’s the only problem in here.

I started with a Tank-Support warrior my journey into Gw2 lvl 80 world…I had no problem with party they saw warrior it was good.
It was fine and nice everything I survived almost every boss encounter,I was the last stand and all in one but the problem was my other 4 teammates lied dead and I had no real damage to finish the boss in time even from 25% hp.

I played him somewhat longer,trying to get something out from him but had no way…the loss of DPS said his word and my missing damage to the boss was the nail in our coffin…Some runs took around 20-25minutes in this way…

Now I switched to full Berserker armor and accesories now the runs is around 7-15 minutes with a very good zerk team even 5-8 minutes…(Ascalon,Caudecus mainly)AND I still have the survivability through dodge and Heavy armor+food and other small things…and even if I was downed 4 other took me up in seconds and I was able to continue with dps.

maha.7902:

Xenon.4537:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

Yeah, well Anet’s intention was to remove the trinity by making a multitude of builds viable. Instead of having the game restricted to 3 roles, they wanted many many roles. But what did we end up with? One role. Zerker.

How is a stat combination a role? Like, literally what made you draw that conclusion? If apothecary was the meta would that mean that “apothecary” was this supposed one role?

Straight up DPS is the role. For example if Defiant weren’t so prohibitive, CC could be a role.

But you just said a stat combination was a role. It’s not. Why did you call a stat combination a role? Does this mean “soldier” is a role in WvW? Does this mean when I do PvP I play the “rabid” role?

Straight up DPS is the role. For example if Defiant weren’t so prohibitive, CC could be a role.

It really comes down to “I can play how I want and so everyone has to play how I want”. The Zerker only people aren’t making you play Zerker, but they can play how they want and that’s the way they want to play. I don’t play full Berserker, but I don’t see the problem. I just open my own dungeon groups, we fill up in a few minutes and then we run the dungeon.

@maha

Zerker has become synonymous with DPS, and I think it was pretty obvious that I was referring to the role of DPS. You’re just trying to redefine the context of my statement for your own benefit.

P.S. Good job linking me to a bunch of videos with might stacking zerkers. Just because the video is titled “control” doesn’t mean they aren’t all a bunch of DPS zerker meta builds using reflects and dodging to mitigate damage. You’re only further proving my point.

And yet I showed you three videos demonstrating that damage per second isn’t the only role and you completely dismissed them. Do I need to link more videos and explain in every single one of them the control and support aspects present?

maha.7902:

And yet I showed you three videos demonstrating that damage per second isn’t the only role and you completely dismissed them. Do I need to link more videos and explain in every single one of them the control and support aspects present?

Yes. Please link me more videos of might stacking zerkers using reflects and dodging to “prove” to me that there are other roles in this game.

to have a great damage, you don’t have to be full zerk.

Xenon.4537:

maha.7902:

And yet I showed you three videos demonstrating that damage per second isn’t the only role and you completely dismissed them. Do I need to link more videos and explain in every single one of them the control and support aspects present?

Yes. Please link me more videos of might stacking zerkers using reflects and dodging to “prove” to me that there are other roles in this game.

Reflects are support, might stacking is support. Protection from hammer guards in FOTM is support. Dropping stability against bosses that can ragdoll you is support.

So now that we’ve got that out the way – my original point is that control exists in this game.

The difference is, you don’t have a buffbot, you don’t have a control bot, you don’t have a healer. You don’t have players who are just dedicated 100% to one thing and suck at doing anything else – you’re expected to pull your weight in all three departments.

“Just DPS” is what you do in bad groups. They don’t support each other effectively (or at all). They don’t control bosses. They just smash keys and hope everything dies. If you want to play the game to a good standard however, support and control are integral parts of boss fights.

If zerk is synonymous with DPS, what is synonymous with rampagers, rabid, carrion, Knight, valkyrie, cavaliers and few others. Just keep in mind there are only 3 roles – DPS, support and control.

haviz.1340:

If zerk is synonymous with DPS, what is synonymous with rampagers, rabid, carrion, Knight, valkyrie, cavaliers and few others. Just keep in mind there are only 3 roles – DPS, support and control.

Support is pretty much Cleric or Zealot.
Control is uninstall and find a game that doesn’t spit on you.
Bunker (a very real role in some modes) is Sentinel or Cleric.

haviz.1340:

If zerk is synonymous with DPS, what is synonymous with rampagers, rabid, carrion, Knight, valkyrie, cavaliers and few others. Just keep in mind there are only 3 roles – DPS, support and control.

Those are just the roles popularized by WoW. The actual concept of “role” can be pretty diverse, to a point where Zerker can be a role – it’s a defined role within GW2. The definition of a role doesn’t have to stick with the WoW schematic – especially not as more and more popular games change the face of the MMORPG genre.

Although I wouldn’t say Zerker is justified as a role. I mean…I play the same way whether I’m using Zerker, Knight’s or Soldier’s gear. It just depends on how much Toughness and Health I want to add to my character.

That’s getting into semantics though.

Azrael.4960:

The only zerk hate seems to be on the forums.

I see it a lot in game as well.

Anyway, this thread contributes very little to the whole zerk thing. The OP’s solution to the problem is to “solve the problem”. Particularly with the trinity. Somehow.

It is a bit more complicated than that. For one, the trinity sucks. Gear is about preference in play, not role in play. The roles are more subtle, and not based upon statistical fortitude.

Xenon.4537:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“we decided to remove Monk. We saw a lot of players LF monk…LF monk..this looked like players waiting to have fun, but not having fun…”

See what I did there?..making dungeosn that now requires non zerker set up= LF monk, LF monk,.LF non zerker..LF non zerker..

Defies the whole point of removing monk in the first place.

Yeah, well Anet’s intention was to remove the trinity by making a multitude of builds viable. Instead of having the game restricted to 3 roles, they wanted many many roles. But what did we end up with? One role. Zerker.

Gear stat combo is not a “role.” Much like using all Cleric’s won’t make anyone a “Healer”. I assume you meant “only DPS matters” but that is only partially true depending on your bias.

It is totally a lie that no Trinity means that only DPS matters. ANet never claimed as much. In fact, this is clearly shown to be wrong in the other modes of play. Therefore, what needs to change are the enemy encounters, not “requiring” healing, tanking, etc. (and even then, Berserker’s should always be the most powerful direct damage combo, with also the higher risk along with all other zero defensive stat gear-Rampager’s, Assassin’s, etc.)

Plus many playstyles are valid for Dungeons and the such. What happens is that some of them will be rejected by the meta crowd. What to do? Use your favorite build and Professions with players that don’t follow the meta, and be happy. No one needs the meta to enjoy GW2 (not even to make gold, really.)

Those “zerk” requirements see on the LFG tool are not the ways GW2 should be played. GW2 is not a speedrun-speed-running IS a choice, and not forced on anyone’s throat. It’s not hard to find a group that meets your own criteria on how you enjoy playing GW2 the most (or start it yourself, and find a group rather quickly.) IF you follow the meta, then that’s your choice-don’t then claim that on GW2 “only DPS matters”, for you have chosen your own “zerk” fate in that case.

(I do disagree that “only Berserker’s matters” for PvE, and that the other gear sets are only for WvW, etc. All gear is valid for any type of content, with various levels of effectiveness-traits , playstyle, and even player experience are actually more important. And no, not all experienced players feel they must use Berserker’s, for whatever valid reasons.)

Nike.2631:

Support is pretty much Cleric or Zealot.
Control is uninstall and find a game that doesn’t spit on you.
Bunker (a very real role in some modes) is Sentinel or Cleric.

Only one boon is affected by healing power so how exactly does it make clerics support?

haviz.1340:

Nike.2631:

Support is pretty much Cleric or Zealot.
Control is uninstall and find a game that doesn’t spit on you.
Bunker (a very real role in some modes) is Sentinel or Cleric.

Only one boon is affected by healing power so how exactly does it make clerics support?

Or Zealot for that matter (power precision healing power? How is that support?)

hannah mee.7925:

Those are just the roles popularized by WoW. The actual concept of “role” can be pretty diverse, to a point where Zerker can be a role – it’s a defined role within GW2. The definition of a role doesn’t have to stick with the WoW schematic – especially not as more and more popular games change the face of the MMORPG genre.

Although I wouldn’t say Zerker is justified as a role. I mean…I play the same way whether I’m using Zerker, Knight’s or Soldier’s gear. It just depends on how much Toughness and Health I want to add to my character.

That’s getting into semantics though.

Those roles were created by anet so how exactly were they popularized by wow?

The problem is inherent of the stats system. You can go full offensive or full defensive in the first place.

Offensive stats should have been in weapons, defensive stats in armor, then like with the insignia in ascended gear, half the trinkets offensive, half the trinkets defensive, and then back and amulet have some versatile utility stats instead mere offensive or defensive, like +boon duration.

Same with attributes. The 14 points should have been divided in 7 offensive and 7 defensive, and each attribute line having one offensive and one defensive attribute, then adding a defensive point to that line would add its defensive stat, and an offensive point its offensive stat.

That way, players would have to choose between what kind of damage and what kind of defense they want, not between damage and defense altogether.

When players can go full offensive or full defensive, you will end up with things like boring bunkers in PvP and players demanding berserkers in dungeons.

haviz.1340:

If zerk is synonymous with DPS, what is synonymous with rampagers, rabid, carrion, Knight, valkyrie, cavaliers and few others. Just keep in mind there are only 3 roles – DPS, support and control.

In terms of gear, there is only 1 viable role. We don’t have gear for support (not heal) or control.

The elephant in ANet’s room is lack of communication. It looks like gear was designed in room A while traits and skills in room B. Gear fits the trinity perfect while the trait and skills does not (and game).

Is not players hating zerk but its a repressed hate to the game for such flaw in their design. Content could also help and be less carebear with zerk players. Currently the game is easy as hell with a party of full zerks.

This will require a full revamp of the combat system with several diversity tweaks:

1. a full restoration of CC, Support, Condition usefulness
2. improvement across all classes of pets/summons defenses against AOE attacks by adding a 85-90% immunity to AOEs and improvement on their AI (running out of bomb zones, turrets circles)
3. retracing the entire trait system to make sure all classes have equal access to certain defense/utility choices (such as removal of conditions, movement speed increase to 25%)
4. adding more weapon choices with multiple skill options for the bar to enhance the diversity of combat.
5. adding post max level advancement to add even more choices to the system for diversity of builds.
6. float the XIII traits so they can be placed anywhere on the grandemaster column. so they can in fact improve diversity.