Guild Wars 2

Some of the stuff you’re talking about is endemic to MMOs in general. All MMOs have grind of some kind. That’s because no MMO can make content faster than people can clear it. So they have to make ways to slow you down.

There are several ways to do this. There’s grind of course. There’s RNG. There’s time gating. Guild Wars 2 uses a range of these things.

But other MMOs do the same thing, because they also can’t make content fast enough. It’s tough because it could take months to program something that fans can finish in days. There’s no real way for MMO programmers to catch up.

In some games they lock out raids, so you can only do one a week. They make them hard. You have to keep banging your head against them, till you get the drop you want…but unlike in Guild Wars 2, drops aren’t assigned to people. You compete against the rest of your party for them, by “rolling” for them. It causes all sorts of arguments and fights, but there are ways around it.

The bottom line is you still end up repeating the same raid over and over again to get specific gear, so you can get up to the next raid.

All of the things that you say are valid points…if you don’t like the content. I’m not genearally thrilled with raids in other games, and I prefer this system.

http://www.gw2crafts.net/ this site will help you save both time and money when crafting.
Just in case you haven’t been told since nobody has mentioned to you about the Ascended accessories demanding a defensive and offensive utility slot, – you should be able to submit a ticket about it, I think Anet is able to help you get your correct Asc accessory – typing in chat /wiki item will direct you to anything on the GW2Wiki which should be used at any time you are unsure of anything, especially before buying expensive items

I think Vayne is right and summed it up pretty nicely. (Did I just write that?)

None of your complaints are really anything to complain about. I mean you complain about grinding to level up crafting? Leveling up crafting is nowhere near what anyone would consider grinding. It sounds like you don’t have a lot of time to play and when you do, you aren’t spending that time efficiently to get what you want so it seems to you like you are grinding. I’d hate to hear what your thoughts on making ascended equipment are.

Bolam, hit me up in game if you need some help with stuff. I’m a pretty good teacher. I can save you a lot of time and energy most likely.

I’ll forgive your high expectations as you said GW2 is your first MMO, but I’ll say this.

As someone who has been playing F2P games for over a decade, I can easily and without hesitation say that GW2 is by far the highest quality MMO on the market today.

Go check out some other MMORPG’s around, and you’ll be able to see just how good we have it here.

You think the crafting grind is bad? Check out other games where every aspect of them is a grind.

Crafting above 400 (ie, ascended) is designed to be a long term goal, not something achievable in a matter of weeks.

I will agree with you on the game’s lack of guidance and help, this is probably GW2’s major flaw (and the thing the NPE should have, but did not, fix).

What I think you’ve done here is burned yourself out on GW2. Played it too intensively over a period of time.

Take a break from things, chill out a bit (go play some other games for comparison’s sake – you’ll appreciate GW2 a hell of a lot more) and try to just take things slow

I hate to tell you this, but this game is very low grind compared to most MMOs out there.

As far as name changes go, most MMOs charge a decently high price for that. It’s to keep people from jumping from name to name to avoid a bad reputation. You’re right about the cosmetic changes, though. They should be a lot cheaper.

In the end, though, if you’re not having fun then don’t make yourself play. Playing a game when it’s no longer fun will lead to burnout and hating the game. Trust me on this, I did it bad back when I played EverQuest.

Don’t play a game that you “hate” … why do people do this to themselves? You shouldn’t feel tied to the game at all; this is your LIFE we’re talking about, YOUR free time, and you’re spending it doing something you don’t like, all because, what, you feel like you have to, or you’ll miss something with zero real-world value?

You’re absolutely right about the nitpicking.

Many mmo’s out there have taken away the cost of having the ability t ochange your characters look for example. You can in those mmo’s (and yes many of them are F2P with no subscription) change the look at anytime and not pay a single dime in in game or out of game currencies.

Crafting ui has been a mess for a long time now, they tried to clean it up but really it doesn’t always help the way they did it. The list is crazy long still, it includes everything even when you try to truncate it it pops back to default the next day. there is no saving.

The grind is also a huge huge problem. Despite the apologists here that is NOT typical of the genre. There are only a few games out there that have massive grind to do anything meaningful in game, and while that number is growing, they are nothing like great examples like Rift in which normal gameplay gets you there quickly so that you can continue after you’ve quickly geared yourself, to enjoy the rest of the world by doing non-combat activities. This doesn’t happen here in GW2 it might as well have been made in Korea.

Agree with you totally on Achievements. I tried to do those achievements they added for “fun” during the last feature patch. I’m still waiting on certain drops to come down. RNG is from 2004 and for some reason Anet has decided everything would taste so much better with a huge helping of RNG it doesn’t matter what it is, RNG has to be part of it which imo is killing this title. It’s almost like a chef adding raspberry vinaigrette to everything, it doesn’t go with every dish and should permeate the game like a plague.

Yep even though there is a purchase warning, that warning doesn’t tell you about unique equips at all so they might as well be asking you do you want fries with that for all the good that tooltip does you about the unique equip Ascended items.

This game is decidedly made for people who have nothing to do and hours to do it in. It’s not designed for the casual (though you may hear lies to the contrary) you can’t just simply jump in and do something meaningful and actually get rewarded in any sense of the word. They say changes are coming to the dailies and monthlies but I say why stop there, there are plenty of places where rewards are severely lacking have been for years now, and adding a couple of trinkets to the dailies probably won’t fix the drought this game suffers from on many an account. Mine for example, almost never gets exotics and rares, they are like gold pressed latinum, almost impossible to drop.

It’s bothersome it is. I’ve never seen a game designed so foolishly and I’m waiting to see what they do next to correct these problems (don’t even get me started on combat) but I’ve resigned myself to play other things until they actually address these concerns because right now as it stands their game is a boring korean grind fest and we already have plenty of those (sandboxes) out right now.

All you have to do is log in once every two weeks. You don’t have to play. That unlocks the episode account wide forever.

bolam I highly recommend you to change your schedule.
Don’t hunt achievements, they come to you.
In fractals f.e. I unlocked all possible achiviements, just by doing 1 or 2 runs in a week, together with my guild and sometimes suggestions were made like “hey, why not kill all chickens while we’re at it” or " Harpy-run: Who makes it alive to the other side first, gets 1g". We were doing them just for kittens and giggles, and completet them eventually all. Same with other areas of the game, like map-completion. “Up for a jumping puzzle? One is around this area”
If you only do things you’re eager for, you get spammed with loot anyways, which converts to gold, which you can convert to crafting materials. Use the crafting guide, already mentioned above, and complete a profession from 0-400 in a couple of minutes. If you plan to craft ascended stuff, wait a bit longer and bring it up to 500 eventually.
Use the /wiki function to look into expensive items before you purchase them. Saves you a lot of headaches. The wiki also provides lists with merchants for karma / wvw badges / fractal relics, so you can check where to get stuff you want on a cheaper, alternative way, instead of spending gold on the TP.
MMO’s are complex, and their tutorials are often limited, therefore the wiki to the game will always be your best friend, which is true for ALL MMO’s out there.

Just some general tipps.

The only problem I have with the achievements is that some are disproportionately hard compared to others. The problem with this is that someone could be working on the armor, because they want the whole set of luminescent armor. Then, they can’t do one single achievement and they can’t get the set. Which would be fair enough but that achievement shows up after weeks and weeks and weeks of farming.

So if a person isn’t good enough to get that achievement, they wouldn’t have farmed in the first place…but they simply don’t know, because the achievement isn’t out yet.

I don’t personally think I’ll have trouble getting the achievements (I’m only missing one and I came really close to getting it last time I tried) but I can see where someone who isn’t as dextrous or experienced would find that frustrating.

And would feel like they wasted a lot of time working for something that it turned out after the fact they might not be able to get.

bolam.6294:

@Vayne I will be doing that now, would be better if GW2 emailed me about these events so I can do it when necessary.

@Arantheal thank you for your general tips, much appreciated, if you can do that, why can’t GW2, BEFORE its to late that is XP also I’m referring to the Season 2 story achievements, even if someone was willing to help me when I ask, it doesn’t excuse how hard some of them are, like beating the boss without getting hit once, give me a bloody break, and with every new episode, you’re bound to get one like that

You actually should be getting an email usually a few hours after the patch comes out if not: there’s a setting somewhere that you need to go change.

The achievements aren’t generally supposed to be easy… But yea, a great example is the caithe one where you can’t get hit by the charges or knockdowns. (Especially since the AI companion isn’t invulnerable.)

The site Vikkela mentioned, http://www.gw2crafts.net/ will definitely help you level in crafting. I’ve used it, and it helped me quite a bit. Crafting got an major update about the time you started playing, and it’s much easier to craft complex items. But yeah, they did totally neglect the left panel. It’s an oddly glaring oversight. Also the crafting backpacks are among the best back pieces in the game,(better than other Exotics, second only to Ascended) and you can craft them step at a time as you level your crafting.

There are a lot of poorly documented things in GW2.(identical unique Ascended rings for example) But they really beat us over the head with “You must log in every 2 weeks to unlock each chapter of the Living Story or you will have to pay for it.” I still think that’s unfair, and I’m sorry you missed that somehow. You can play that chapter in the party of someone who does have it unlocked, but you won’t progress until you unlock that chapter yourself, and do it again. It isn’t fair.(IMO) And the Anet employees who say “It only takes a minute” are totally ignoring the fact that you have to get a massive update in order to “Simply log in and unlock the story.” In an area with slow broadband, that update can take quite a while. But they did make it very clear, numerous times, that you would have to log in every two weeks to unlock each chapter while LS is being released. Sorry you got bitten by it. I don’t think that there’s anything you can do except just buy it.

I wouldn’t worry about any of your characters looks until you get them to 80 and get your gear fairly well locked in. Your gear will be constantly changing until then, and anything you spend to change your look might be wasted if you don’t like how it goes with your final gear.

I only grind for things that I know the whole process I’ll have to go through. I wouldn’t go for the Luminescent Armor until they’ve made up the last step in the process, and you can read the whole thing in an online guide like Dulfy makes. ( dulfy.net is a great site for guides, btw) I don’t grind for Legendaries, because that process involves RNG,(which I’m unlucky with) jumping puzzles(which I have great difficulty with), and Non-PvE play.(which I don’t do) I am grinding Ascended gear, because I know all the things that I’ll have to do, and there is nothing that I will hate doing. And there’s no RNG, either.
So if you think want to grind for something wait until all the steps have been released, then read a guide and make sure that none of the things that you’ll have to do will be so disagreeable that that it will make you hate playing the game.

And remember that you don’t have to so any of this. It’s a game, for entertainment and enjoyment. If you get burned out you can always take a break. But please remember to log in every day for the daily login rewards(starting 2014-12-16, or maybe the day after) and to unlock Living Story Chapters. Good luck and have fun.

Yea, about the story achievements:
Don’t bother with them.
I did them for the 1st or 2nd release of season 2, but decided that all the repetitive dialogue, without any option for good loot is not worth it.
there are other options to farm AP for me currently, so I rather complete those and don’t give a flying F about story-achievements.
The Story itself is fine IMO, but I can’t be bothered to be forced into the same dialogue multiple times for a tedious, low-AP achievement.
I guess I will complete them for the original personal story, once released, since you can skip dialogues quite easily there.

Anet should be sending you an email about each update. It should go to the email address you used when you registered your account. If you don’t check that one regularly, you might want to start checking it, or change the email address associated with your GW2 account.(the email address Anet is using will be displayed under your account name near the top left of forum pages) This is especially important, because if someone tries to log in to your account from a different ip address, Anet will send you an email asking you to confirm that your ip address has changed. And you’ll be locked out until you can reply to that email.

MMO’s in general are for people who can and like to play a lot. Developers put a lot of things into MMO’s for people to chase, because the people who like to play a lot often also like to have something to shoot for when playing. Things like Legendary weapons, Ascended gear and Achievements serve this purpose in GW2.

Some other people don’t play as much. In many MMO’s, some of the long-term goals might be out of reach unless you “keep up” with the players on the leading edge of the progression curve. Some goals can be achieved individually. In GW2, most long-term goals can be achieved regardless of play time — but some of them take a very long time if you play sporadically.

As you (if you) play long enough, you’ll get a better feel for what’s available, what it takes to get it and can then make decisions as to which goals to pursue and which not to. Take crafting for instance. I know a player who can’t stand crafting in any game. In GW2, he collects the crafting materials in the course of play and sells them. Most of what’s crafted he buys off the TP. He won’t have Ascended Weapons or Armor as a result, but that’s a trade-off he’s willing to make.

As to Unique Ascended rings: these items are Account Bound, whereas the Unique aspect is per character. Should you choose to make another character, you could put the second ring on that character once it gets to 80.

Hope you can get past the upset and continue to enjoy the game once you do. Good luck.

Edit: Also, for future reference, there are usually two different Ascended Rings and Accessories that have the same stats, so you can wear two of the same stat (but with different names). For example, the Power/Precision/Ferocity rings are Ring of the Red Death and Crystalline Band.

Finally, while In game you can type /wiki in chat and a browser with the official GW2 wiki will open. If you want info on something, the wiki can often provide it.

But you’re not getting emails about each Living Story update? That’s odd. You might check your spam/junk mail folder on the 16th, and see if it’s ending up there for some reason.

I read this with one eyebrow raised for a decent portion of the post.

I can’t think of any achievements that require glitching to acquire, it took me very little time to max out my crafting disciplines to the point of feeling like something was wrong (I came from Runescape which took literally years to max out your stats).

I also find it justified for them to charge money on cosmetics every time you want to change your appearance, considering no subscription fee. What I don’t find justified is the lack of attention to long-standing bugs/glitches in the game with movement skills, NPC and boss behavior in dungeons, and various other portions of the game due to the fact that their focus is pretty much only on the gem store and Living Story aspect of the game.

I like just about everything in the game but there’s way too much potential that’s wasted and too many abandoned portions of the game that a sizeable portion of the community play and love. Those are my complaints.

As far as the grinding is concerned, I can’t help but facepalm. Oh, the innocence… you truly have no idea. :P

If you wish to receive emails about upcoming releases, you will need to sign up for the Newsletter:

https://register.guildwars2.com/trial/newsletter

You can, instead or as well, find the same (and more) information here: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ (There is a link to this site/page on almost every GW2 site/page. Community, then News)

The Wiki is a great resource: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Main_Page (Link at top of page)

You can get a replacement for the Unique Trinket/gear you purchased by submitting a ticket here: https://help.guildwars2.com/home (Submit a Request) (Link at top of page)

Good luck.

bolam.6294:

Don’t get me wrong, when I first started playing the game back in April, I thought it was great. I’ve never played an MMO before and it was a unique experience; having 100s of 1000s of other players play in the same world as you made the game feel more alive, and having them help you, instead of relying on dumb AI partners, made the game so much easier to play and enjoy.

Its also great how extensive the RPG element is, from selecting your profession, weapons and skills to how your character looks via costumes and colours; giving you countless of hours of experimenting until you find your very own custom, unique character that matches your play style.

I also found it great how full the world felt; rather than just running through a big world full of empty fields, there was always something happening somewhere, and that’s in addition to new things added every so often.

I started playing the game every day, its even got to the point where I bought a gaming mouse for it.

I’ve been playing it for more than 2 years, every day since August 28th 2012. And I still love it today just as much as I did the day I started playing it. In my opinion you’re doing it wrong. If you would be playing it right, like me, it would still be just as fun as it was at launch. It is for me, I don’t know why it isn’t for you. Altough I will say this. I wish SAB 3 was released in April this year. I expected it and it never came. But everything else was awesome this year.

bolam.6294:

I’ve never played an MMO before

And it definitely shows. Not your fault, everyone has to start somewhere. But unfortunately for your post, it means you are coming at this game without an experienced perspective of what MMORPGs have been like until now, and you lack a lot of relevant context for your points. If you’d played even one or two other MMOs before GW2, I think a lot of your criticisms would either vanish completely, or be heavily altered.

It sort of sounds like somebody complaining about Netflix’s price and selection of titles, when they are completely oblivious that the previous alternative was to drive down to Blockbuster Video and rent a movie for 6 bucks, or just hope that what was on TV at the time was something not terrible.

For example, I really don’t understand people who complain about GW2’s crafting. It gives you a serious XP boost, and keeps you rolling in excellent gear while leveling. You can put any stats you want into your gear. You don’t have to level a “gathering skill” of any kind, and can insert easily-found jewels/crests/runes/sigils into your gear at any time regardless of crafting proficiency. Salvaging unneeded gear even gives you back materials to put toward your crafting. And odds are, the game must have thrown at least one crafting or gathering booster at you by this point. If you use those even remotely intelligently, it will be a huge help. And while it’s not an ideal solution, you can invest some laurels to purchase those crafting material bags for various tiers. And if you want to switch crafting disciplines, you can do so at any time.

Almost all of these points are completely foreign concepts, in any other MMORPG. And while getting the needed materials can cost time/gold in GW2, it is nowhere near the abyssmal level of grind found in any other game. Unless they’re talking about Ascended or Legendary stuff, I just shake my head in disbelief every time somebody complains about “grind” in this game’s crafting or leveling. But even for those, at least they are account-bound and not really needed for anything.

And as for changing your character’s appearance: sure, most games let you change your hair style/color for “free” with in-game gold. But if the game doesn’t outright charge a monthly subscription, they will often lock many exclusive hair styles behind extra purchases anyway. Or if they don’t, I guarantee they make up for it elsewhere by hiding something else behind a pay wall. And when it comes to changing your face, skin color, or race, I don’t know any games that let you do this for free, and some don’t allow it at all.

bolam.6294:

Wow, I’m sorry for how many people I’ve offended with my crafting comment XP was nothing personal.. really..

For what it’s worth, at least I’m not offended.

And everyone else, let’s be honest. It’s not that the crafting system here is good, it’s that most of the other ones we’ve dealt with before are bad.

I think I can shed some light on why crafting seems like such a chore to you: you’re trying to grind your way through it, which is fair enough, but you’re trying to grind low level materials (seeing that you’re at 150/400) with a high level character. The problem is this: even if you go to a low level area with your 80 you pretty much only get lvl 80 drops that, if you salvage them, give you lvl 80 mats.
Thus, the game is really not designed for you to level crafting through “grinding” out the mats – the idea is that you sell the excess mats you get and buy whatever you need. The marketplace isn’t a shortcut or cheat – its an engaging part of the game the game designers want you to use.
Now, the way I see it you have 2 choices: 1) give in to the game design and buy/sell stuff, or 2) start another character just to farm mats with. What you could do is leave the 2nd character at a certain level (whichever one you need mats of) and then transfer drops (mostly gear bags and champ bags) you get on your main to your alt and just salvage it there.

As for the fact that you have to pay for the story-update you missed, consider this: you payed once for this game and you got a ton of content for your money – as much, if not more than a conventional non-mmo would give you. I can understand that you don’t want to pay monthly, but the reality of the matter is that ante are constantly updating the game, so it would kind of be reasonable to pay them a little bit here and there, since you bought the initial game and are getting all these updates “for free”. Personally, I’m more than happy to buy a couple of gems here and there and buy something trivial just to support the game I enjoy – its nice to not HAVE to do that, but I still feel as if I should as long as I enjoy and appreciate the content. Not saying you have to do the same and feel the same way, but hopefully this gave you a perspective from which it doesn’t seem completely unreasonable to spend a few dollars on the game once in a while.
The same goes for the make over kits. I’d prefer them to be free too, but in my mind they need to make money and keep those bills payed *some*how, and I rather they do it by selling cosmetics than by selling game-breaking upgrades. You do get a couple of make over kits and gems from doing achievements btw!

That all said, I don’t disagree with a lot of your critique points, especially that of the crafting UI – it’s suuuuchhh a messssss.

bolam.6294:

Wow, I’m sorry for how many people I’ve offended with my crafting comment XP was nothing personal.. really..

No offense taken, it’s just frustrating to hear someone complain about aspects of this game, which it actually goes to great lengths to improve upon, especially in ways that you would really appreciate if only you had played any other MMO that came before it.

I really don’t know the best way to explain it. Imagine if your city’s fire department was so inept and unresponsive that they only ever put out 10% of fires. So they hire a new fire chief, and under his management strategy they improve performance enough to put out 60% of fires. Then someone comes along the next day, and complains that this new guy “only” gets 60% of fires put out. That’s what your post sounded like, to me.

I don’t blame you for not knowing about what came before. I don’t mean to sound like “it could be worse” is an excuse to ignore any problems in GW2. And I certainly don’t want to give the impression that GW2 is perfect and without flaws. But if you think GW2 is a bad example of grind, achievements, crafting, character customization, etc., let me just advise you right now to never touch another MMO, or you might very well suffer a heart attack. You have no idea how bad it gets. I envy your ignorance on these issues.

Palador.2170:

It’s not that the crafting system here is good, it’s that most of the other ones we’ve dealt with before are bad.

Oh? I think the crafting system in GW2 is quite good. It levels you up, even if your crafting level is far behind your character’s experience level. If you do keep it up, it gives you great gear for your level, of any stat combination you want. It’s incredibly useful and versatile, yet at the same time it’s not required for those who choose to ignore it. I agree that materials like blood/claws/scales/etc. should drop more often, but what is it about the actual crafting system that you think is bad?

Fyrebrand.4859:

For example, I really don’t understand people who complain about GW2’s crafting. It gives you a serious XP boost, and keeps you rolling in excellent gear while leveling. You can put any stats you want into your gear. You don’t have to level a “gathering skill” of any kind, and can insert easily-found jewels/crests/runes/sigils into your gear at any time regardless of crafting proficiency. Salvaging unneeded gear even gives you back materials to put toward your crafting. And odds are, the game must have thrown at least one crafting or gathering booster at you by this point. If you use those even remotely intelligently, it will be a huge help. And while it’s not an ideal solution, you can invest some laurels to purchase those crafting material bags for various tiers. And if you want to switch crafting disciplines, you can do so at any time.

Almost all of these points are completely foreign concepts, in any other MMORPG. And while getting the needed materials can cost time/gold in GW2, it is nowhere near the abyssmal level of grind found in any other game. Unless they’re talking about Ascended or Legendary stuff, I just shake my head in disbelief every time somebody complains about “grind” in this game’s crafting or leveling. But even for those, at least they are account-bound and not really needed for anything.

You’re kidding, right? I’m a new GW2 player and so far my primary disappointment is that crafting is utterly useless while leveling. By the time I finished Metrica Province with my warrior, I had accumulated enough mats to level my weaponsmithing and armorsmithing to 11 and 7 respectively. At which point I started Brisban Wildlands and lost access to copper nodes, and what little light armor dropped from mobs tended to salvage to wool scraps instead of jute scraps.

bolam.6294 is absolutely right about crafting; as best I can tell it’s only relevant to max level characters with the wealth to buy truckloads of mats of the TP, and it’s only useful for creating these ascended gear pieces people talk about. In other games, yes, you can craft your own gear while leveling. Not here, not even close. My warrior has spent about half his time running with a hammer, simply because what I had (personal story reward, I think) was greatly superior to any greatsword I’d found, let alone the greatsword one can craft with starting skill level.

Comparison to other MMOs – lack of gathering skills is nice. When/if I make an alt to do cooking, all those onions, carrots, etc. should come in handy. But other MMOs have something approaching a balance between mat supply while leveling through a zone and the amount of crafting needed to advance to the next tier of mats. GW2 is the one with the abysmal crafting grind. It’s a big market so no doubt there are worse, but not the ones I’ve played (4 years of LOTRO, couple months of Rift – which does have both salvaging and runes to add to existing gear, btw).

On a positive note, I do like how processing a large stack is only marginally more time consuming than making a single such piece. Most of that weaponsmith-11 came from converting logs to planks, which would have required going afk for a while in other MMOs.

Fyrebrand.4859:

Oh? I think the crafting system in GW2 is quite good. It levels you up, even if your crafting level is far behind your character’s experience level. If you do keep it up, it gives you great gear for your level, of any stat combination you want. It’s incredibly useful and versatile, yet at the same time it’s not required for those who choose to ignore it. I agree that materials like blood/claws/scales/etc. should drop more often, but what is it about the actual crafting system that you think is bad?

Well, for starters a lot of the newer stat combos don’t follow the pattern of creation/discovery that all of the original ones did. Exotic Celestial, for example, requires you to not only know how to make the inscription/insignia, but then you have to get a specific recipe to use it to make each item that it can be used in. You can’t just combine an Ori sword blade and hilt with a Celestial inscription in the discovery pannel to make the weapon, you need a recipe to tell you how to make it.

Second, the process is pretty much “press button to create”. Yes, you have to make item A to make item B to make finished item C, but the actual creation process is just pressing a button and that’s it. The thing is made. Something a bit more interactive, perhaps to give a bit more EXP (replacing the bonus you currently get at random), would be more interesting. It would be optional, but there would be a point to using it.

The discovery UI could use a revamp as well, especially for cooking. If you know how to make a component that could be used, it should be on the discovery screen, even if you don’t have any on hand. This would tell you that it still has uses to discover, and help you to figure out if you want to make more of that component to use.

Stat sets as a whole are a pain to deal with, and would be better replaced in crafted items. If I want to make a Power/Condition/Heal item, I should be able to do so by adding the stats to it one at a time as I make it.

Finally, the armor and weapon choices are … limited. Take a look at Infinite Light, the sword. Imagine if there was a way to craft a “Light of Infinity” item, and then use that when crafting a weapon to make it into something like Infinite Light. Yes, it would require an entire set of weapon skins with the same theme, but that’s not a bad thing. Instead, they made those items hit-or-miss and threw them into the Mystic Forge instead. There should be several themed “impressive” sets of both weapons and armor that can only be made by crafting it with special items.

Worblehat.8697:

Fyrebrand.4859:

For example, I really don’t understand people who complain about GW2’s crafting. It gives you a serious XP boost, and keeps you rolling in excellent gear while leveling. You can put any stats you want into your gear. You don’t have to level a “gathering skill” of any kind, and can insert easily-found jewels/crests/runes/sigils into your gear at any time regardless of crafting proficiency. Salvaging unneeded gear even gives you back materials to put toward your crafting. And odds are, the game must have thrown at least one crafting or gathering booster at you by this point. If you use those even remotely intelligently, it will be a huge help. And while it’s not an ideal solution, you can invest some laurels to purchase those crafting material bags for various tiers. And if you want to switch crafting disciplines, you can do so at any time.

Almost all of these points are completely foreign concepts, in any other MMORPG. And while getting the needed materials can cost time/gold in GW2, it is nowhere near the abyssmal level of grind found in any other game. Unless they’re talking about Ascended or Legendary stuff, I just shake my head in disbelief every time somebody complains about “grind” in this game’s crafting or leveling. But even for those, at least they are account-bound and not really needed for anything.

You’re kidding, right? I’m a new GW2 player and so far my primary disappointment is that crafting is utterly useless while leveling. By the time I finished Metrica Province with my warrior, I had accumulated enough mats to level my weaponsmithing and armorsmithing to 11 and 7 respectively. At which point I started Brisban Wildlands and lost access to copper nodes, and what little light armor dropped from mobs tended to salvage to wool scraps instead of jute scraps.

bolam.6294 is absolutely right about crafting; as best I can tell it’s only relevant to max level characters with the wealth to buy truckloads of mats of the TP, and it’s only useful for creating these ascended gear pieces people talk about. In other games, yes, you can craft your own gear while leveling. Not here, not even close. My warrior has spent about half his time running with a hammer, simply because what I had (personal story reward, I think) was greatly superior to any greatsword I’d found, let alone the greatsword one can craft with starting skill level.

Comparison to other MMOs – lack of gathering skills is nice. When/if I make an alt to do cooking, all those onions, carrots, etc. should come in handy. But other MMOs have something approaching a balance between mat supply while leveling through a zone and the amount of crafting needed to advance to the next tier of mats. GW2 is the one with the abysmal crafting grind. It’s a big market so no doubt there are worse, but not the ones I’ve played (4 years of LOTRO, couple months of Rift – which does have both salvaging and runes to add to existing gear, btw).

On a positive note, I do like how processing a large stack is only marginally more time consuming than making a single such piece. Most of that weaponsmith-11 came from converting logs to planks, which would have required going afk for a while in other MMOs.

Because you don’t have to craft at lower levels in this game, that is you can get everything you need quite cheaply without crafting, it’s not a bad thing.\

You seem to be laboring under the assumption that crafting at level is better somehow, than not having to.

I’m not working under that same guideline. What is inherently superior about crafting stuff, rather than not upgrading or buying what you need?

The world itself isn’t difficult enough to upgrade your gear more than once every ten levels.

Also, the speed of the first 15 levels have increased. As you go further in the game, crafting becomes more viable. It’s only the first zone, which is more or less a tutorial zone that really suffers that problem.

I don’t believe you.

If you really hated the game, you wouldn’t be bothered to submit your diatribe to the forums.

I’m pretty sure everyone has their rage moments. The key is to take a breath, make some tea, and watch some Total Dismount videos until there is a smile sufficiently melted upon your face that you are ready to return to the beautiful world of Tyria.

If OP dislikes game then should stop playing it.

bolam.6294:

Wow, I’m sorry for how many people I’ve offended with my crafting comment XP was nothing personal.. really..

Nobody here is offended, it’s just that since this is your first MMORPG the grind can feel bad, but whereas most players have been in other games where the grind has been so sick compared to GW2 they simply have to disagree with you. GW2 is very casual – which I’m very happy about, I don’t wanna spend weeks again getting a few combat levels or murdering thousands of Moss Giants to get some bones.

Look, I even made this picture to help understand what the whole thing is about, I spent like hours in paint with it:

bolam.6294:

Wow, I’m sorry for how many people I’ve offended with my crafting comment XP was nothing personal.. really..

Welcome to the forums.
When the devs said the community was toxic, they weren’t kidding.

Tao.5096:

If OP dislikes game then should stop playing it.

Also, take this guy’s advise.

This could be an argument for not trying GW2 if you have no prior MMO experience: it’s going to ruin your expectations of other MMOs.

Sure, GW2 is pretty grindy, but as far as MMO grinds go it’s on the lower end of the spectrum. If you come to dislike GW2 because of the grind, you’re not going to have a better time anywhere else.

Pandaman.4758:

This could be an argument for not trying GW2 if you have no prior MMO experience: it’s going to ruin your expectations of other MMOs.

Sure, GW2 is pretty grindy, but as far as MMO grinds go it’s on the lower end of the spectrum. If you come to dislike GW2 because of the grind, you’re not going to have a better time anywhere else.

It’s not so much that it’s grindy, but it’s unrewarding.
There is zero incentive to craft or gather materials when I can just buy everything for dirt cheap at the TP and if I want to sell the stuff I crafted for profit then I have to undercut and even then you won’t actually make a profit.
Crafting is a lose lose situation, always.
At least games like FFXIV have players develop a healthy relationship with people that craft since they’re a necessity, not just a gold sink.

Basically, crafting being grindy in an MMO isn’t bad, it adds value to the final product produced by the artisan because regular players aren’t willing to invest themselves in something that’s difficult. Here in GW2 I can produce exotic gear like nobody’s business and if you check the TP, anything that’s crafted is extremely devalued.

Pandaman.4758:

This could be an argument for not trying GW2 if you have no prior MMO experience: it’s going to ruin your expectations of other MMOs.

Sure, GW2 is pretty grindy, but as far as MMO grinds go it’s on the lower end of the spectrum. If you come to dislike GW2 because of the grind, you’re not going to have a better time anywhere else.

Yep.
Lemme allow to introduce for OP couple of games that won’t ruin any expectations of other MMOs:

• World of Warcraft
• Aion The Tower of Eternity
• TERA
• ArcheAge
• Lineage ][

Hence, kitten , just play any MMO that’s korean or has korean MMO basis.

If someone does believe that Guild Wars 2 is even a bit grindy and is unhappy because of it then it’s your time to drop MMO games and stick to Single Player RPG games.

I’ll say it again – GW2 compared to other fancy, shiny super duper MMO games, has unnoticeable amount of grinding and rng.
As I still said, it has some kind of grinding amount, it still is nowhere near “bit” value.

The only thing I really enjoyed in GW2 was the first 2 times I leveled up to 80 on my necro and ele. Those were fun times. Now I am waiting for that same experience in an expansion.

WoW.

OP

Did you even bother to check such sites as http://gw2crafts.net ?
Did you even bother to check any of the fan sites and wiki to check how to efficiently use certain systems – for example craft system?

Story achievements are great and are optional.
You don’t like them?
Then don’t freaking do them.
No one force you to do them.

Regarding ascended gear scenario – stick to exotics and gtfo from it if you don’t like it.
That applies to everyone who have a problem with it.

(…)I still enjoy it,(…)

(…)I just want to vent some frustration right now, (…)

Don’t be a hypocrite, really.

As it may be your first experience with MMO games, I’ll suggest to stop sticking to Personalized Point of View regarding it.
Game provides variety of Optional features that gives you a choice:

• do it
• don’t do it

That’s something you barely will see in other MMO games – you don’t believe it? Go check it out then and experience it yourself.

You complain about things you mostly have no idea and no comparison ability but yet you even mention things where you do not even logically think straight.

For example, character customization.
You’re upset….oh sorry, you said it’s kittening you off, that you have to “pay” for character customization.
To your information.
Every game, even Pay to Play, charge it’s Playerbase for Character Customization, such as Look change, Hairstyle change, Name Change and Gender Change. And Transmutation Stones for gear appearance change are vastly obtainable within game – I don’t know if even someone purchase them in Gem Store.
Fun fact, which you may haven’t yet discovered is that you may use your Gold to exchange to Gems and Purchase such exclusive item from Gem Store.
Which means, you don’t spend even a cent from your IRL pocket.
I personally haven’t seen any other publisher to use such feature in their games – someone can feel free to name them, because I’m curious myself.

You have to remember that Developers are making a game and changes to the game that pleases thousands of other players, not your single Personalized Point of View and Needs.

P.S. – As someone may think I’m upset or anything – I’m not. Just felt to be a bit kitteny, since people seem to understand it better sometimes.

P.S. – Regarding being forced to spend money in Gem Store – Treat it as many do. People who purchase Gems feel that they’re thanking this way for further development of the game. Even if they have enough Gold in game for exchanging for Gems.
I for example do that.

while the idea of quitting and picking up gw2 whenever you wish is great, and somewhat possible.

the game rewards you more if you keep playing, and in my opinion it should.

Why would someone who logged 3 times a month be rewarded and make the same amount of progress as someone who is playing 25 days a month?

The next patch will also add log in rewards that you can get by simply logging in.
While you wont stop or reset your progress if you dont log in a day or two, the person who does log in every day will still have more progress that you will.

Also, i dont understand people that make such a fuss about the need of taking 1 minute to log in the game to unlock daily log in rewards and new living story content…

I mean seriously. We are all spending at least 30 minutes per day on our computer, how hard is it to log in a character and let the world load in the background while you ..idk.. read 9gag or reply to emails.

And for those that hate logging in to the game to unlock a living story or get a free log in reward…why bother playing the game you hate to even log in yet alone spend some time actually playing it?

I don’t find the achievements unrewarding, and guaranteed ascended trinkets for each group.. What else can be offered better than that?

Yay for liking the game still I had so many of the same complaints you did when I first started playing. I was super lucky to have a friend walk me through most of these points, and now I do the same for other players when I can.

Crafting takes a lot of heat, and I’ll admit I was just too dumb to figure it out for the first two characters I made. In general I find there’s not enough in-game explanation for things. Yes, you can turn to a guild or friends to explain things, /but you shouldn’t have to./ But I never felt like I had any problems without crafting at all. The only reason I invested in crafting was to reach 500, which took me well over a year for all six armor/weapon crafts.

The trick with crafting is map complete. Complete zones level 15-65 and you get a good stack of crafting mats as a bonus, plus you get decent drops from mobs along the way. Seriously don’t sweat the mats.

Which materials are you referring to specifically? There are some great online resources that have more information, or you could ask here (though clearly some people prefer just to be openly hostile…)

The achievements for the Living Story stuff are designed to be very difficult. In the past, players complained (quite loudly) that the achievements were too easy to get and so they didn’t feel like they “achieved” anything. Whether these achievements just toe the line between “difficult” and “ridiculous” is up for debate. I didn’t struggle with the Wild Rodeo achievement, but I almost couldn’t complete the champ fight on challenge mode and I certainly never would have completed it without getting hit by wind or sand without massive help. In the end, they’re not required, which is why the reward for completing all of them is actually pretty nice (free ascended armor? yes please).

Vayne really does know his stuff, and if you want I’m more than happy help you out too.

bolam.6294:

Now that I think about it, I could just look at this website’s home page periodically for updates on my phone instead.. still an email would be more practical..

I always get an email from gw2 whenever a new patch goes live. If you’re not getting one, check the site to see if you can sign up for a newsletter. If i remember correctly, someone in this thread posted a link towards it.

@OP: Ya know, this game is really what you make it. You have to go out and find your fun. I dislike the choices ANet makes an i’m VERY vocal about it, but I’ve found my “fun” or my sweetspot in this game. It takes time to find the right group of people and the right content to play, but it is here.

The great thing about this game is you don’t have to pay for it on a monthly basis, so take a break and come back or just log in and do you dailies and then go off to something else.

Tao.5096:

Don’t be a hypocrite, really.

Tao.5096:

I find it obviously being a hypocrite, whenever someone does point random 3* “good” parts of something, and make 10+ negative ones.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

First off, once you created your character, that it, its permanent: Delete the character or use a makeover kit.

The crafting menu is a mess: Use the search button

The amount of grinding you have to do in order to increase your crafting level is insane: Buy materials from BLTP.

Achievements.. Oh my god.. Stop making these kittened up achievements: Don’t do the achievements, it’s not mandatory.

For example, I spent days earning tickets from this world tournament thing, and I decided to spend them on two ascended rings. What I didn’t know is that all ascended gear share this ‘unique’ rule: You can have the same stats but one must be defensive and the other offensive. Read and search the forums before making any mayor investment/purchase.

Now because I’m working, I have less time to play this game, and sometimes I just want do something else other than play GW2: Stop playing.

After about a month of not playing, I’ve come back to it, only to find out that I missed an episode of season 2, which I now have to pay to unlock; what else have I missed? This is exactly why I didn’t want to play WOW, not just for the subscription, but to not have this constant feeling of being tied to the game in order to get my moneys worth: You don t have to pay with real money.

I want to be able to play the game when I want without feeling like I’m being punished: Don’t feel punished, Season 2 isn’t that good anyway

Vikkela.7261:

Look, I even made this picture to help understand what the whole thing is about, I spent like hours in paint with it:

Omg that graph. Ohgod the grind. Completed my 94+ prayer goal then quit but holy dizzle I think I might have gone completely insane while getting it lol

I feel a little ashamed to admit this, but I actually wish we had more crafting skills to grind through that weren’t spent at designated crafting stations. I hated crafts like fishing in RS for example, but now I kind of miss the simple breaks from all the combat and action in a game. In retrospect, the secondary content made the main content shine even brighter, and I haven’t gotten that same vibe from GW2 crafting/gathering sadly.

To the OP……don’t feel like people are offended here by your discussion of the ‘grind’ in GW2. It is just that lots of people here have experienced the real, horrid, make-this-game-a-job-type-time-committment-to-get-anywhere grind of previous mmorpgs. Compared to earlier mmorpgs, GW2 is a godsend…..(some hardcore/purists state that GW2 is too easy, due to this)

If you want to get a taste of what an older mmorpg was like, and how difficult and time consuming it is to get anywhere in the game, go try something like DaoC, Everquest, Lotro, or Eve Online, or ANY Korean title. After 2-3 weeks of the crazy grind in those games, you’ll be ready to throw yourself out a window.

It’s is just that it is all relative, especially to lots of the experienced mmorpg players here. It is great to see a true noob to mmorpgs, but know that some of the things you’re gritching about seem very silly to a lot of us old timers.

Welcome to the game, and enjoy!

Vikkela.7261:

http://www.gw2crafts.net/ this site will help you save both time and money when crafting.

Until you hit level 400. At that point they claim you’re done when you’ve only just begun.

Thanatos.2691:

Vikkela.7261:

Look, I even made this picture to help understand what the whole thing is about, I spent like hours in paint with it:

Omg that graph. Ohgod the grind. Completed my 94+ prayer goal then quit but holy dizzle I think I might have gone completely insane while getting it lol

I feel a little ashamed to admit this, but I actually wish we had more crafting skills to grind through that weren’t spent at designated crafting stations. I hated crafts like fishing in RS for example, but now I kind of miss the simple breaks from all the combat and action in a game. In retrospect, the secondary content made the main content shine even brighter, and I haven’t gotten that same vibe from GW2 crafting/gathering sadly.

One of the things I remember about playing Dark Ages of Camelot, is going to very specific areas for specific types of crafting,(or to your house or guild house that was equipped with the right kind of crafting station and associated merchants) then sitting around, either with friends that you could gab with, or with a few good movies(and hope you had a tv in your computer room) to watch while you spent countless hours/days/weeks getting your crafter up in level, while NOT getting any regular xp points for doing it. Mindless time spent building meaningless stuff that you couldn’t sell for much of anything……just pouring money and time into it all. And that was just for one profession. Some items that you crafted as you got higher up actually required a button press and then waiting for several minutes while the bar slowly filled until that ONE item was completed.

And let’s not forget about crafting in an alchemy based sort of trade, and the fact that some of the things you crafted, when you wanted to speed things up a tad….actually had a chance of blowing up in your face, destroying the materials and sometimes killing your character…….WHAT FUN!!!!!!

I never considered any of the above a ‘nice break’ from the regular parts of the game, nor that it made the rest of the game ‘shine’ more…….bleh……crafting in those older mmorpgs was sheer hell, plain and simple. But it was a required hell to a lot of us that wanted to help our guildies have better items/weaps/armor for a ton cheaper than what you could get from a non-guild crafter.

And back then, we all just considered that part of the “challenge” of becoming a skilled crafter……lol……wow, how mmorpgs have changed, thank goodness.

Bernie.8674:

Vikkela.7261:

http://www.gw2crafts.net/ this site will help you save both time and money when crafting.

Until you hit level 400. At that point they claim you’re done when you’ve only just begun.

There is a 400-500 guide on that site, as well. And yea, it gets really expensive really quickly. Or time consuming, if you farm everything.

Achievements are meant to be hard. Though a lot are not in this game.

You don’t need legendary gear to get those story achievements, you know your hyperbole isn’t valid.

I agree some are harder. But you don’t NEED them. And if you really want them, do what’s needed in order to get them (every single HARD achievement of the story is easier if you go in group, simply put a LFG for that, you’ll be surprised how fast you will get people to do it ). There is no point ranting about it, there is plenty of easy content in this game, a tiny bit of OPTIONAL challenge is refreshing and good. Asking to lower the difficulty is actually selfish, and you should avoid it. Actually, you sound like someone who want’s everything granted, without any effort. Are you ?

bolam.6294:

I feel that the game needs to be more informative with “the point of no return” type of situations, like buying two ascended rings or when story instances are free for a limited time only. Yes you’ll learn after the fact, but you still have to pick up the pieces; it’s going to cost me about 30gp to unlock the missing story instance.

30 gold is farmed within a week, and you can also opt for spending 2,5 euros on unlocking it if you’re feeling lazy. I also seem to remember reading somewhere that you can opt in for newsletters sent by Anet for updates like these?

bolam.6294:

Some of the story achievements are just too unrealistic. With every new episode, you’re guaranteed to get them. Out of all the episodes in season two, there were at least three where I had to get through bugs/glitches; most likely they’ve been “fixed” by now, but not the challenges themselves. Seriously the developers need to understand that not all players have legendary gear and a guild full of helpful players who are willing to go out of their way just to help you when you ask. Yes they’re optional, but that’s not an excuse to make them like this, like survive a 30 minute boss fight without getting hit once or something, like did they even try it for themselves at least? I want to look forward to every new episode, but I get stressed when they come out because I know there’s going to be achievements like this, and I’m very OCD about uncompleted things.

Those challanges are for people seeking a challenge, ofcourse they’re not going to be hard. That being said, I don’t even think about doing them because I know I’d fail miserably, so kudos for you even trying it.