I feel that the game would benefit more, and player retention would be stronger, if elite specs were released with more regularity outside of xpac elite specs. I would also like to suggest selling these elite specs on the cash shop to improve funding for development.
Edit- I respectfully ask to keep personal opinions regarding the previous elite specs vs core specs out of the discussion. This is not a debate about new “stuff” vs core “stuff”…
Also, to play elites we have to pay to access them anyway… It’s not productive to the conversation to say new elites would be “pay to win” considering the last set of elites were gated behind a buy to play xpac. Elites will have to be paid for one way or another….
This game, unlike many other games that pump out +levels and regearing requirements in their xpacs, stays at level cap and doesn’t diminish your lvl 80 gear… BUT some of those games do update their classes in bigger ways and more frequently, and that’s missing here…
(edited by Swagger.1459)
Cannot support having elite specs in the cash shop. Cannot support having new weapon types for classes in the cash shop. Cannot support having new skills in the cash shop.
Your proposition screams Pay2win to me, OP. Besides, do you really think they have the resources, the time and the ideas to provide elite specs on a regular basis ? What about balance ?
Note that back in 2015, conversion from f2p to purchase was the pain point, not cash shop income, which was still good and solid.
Also, generally speaking, “you would make money doing X” is a very poor argument to present to game developers to support your idea. You should focus, instead, on why you think it is good, fun, and makes the game better.
Basically, only ANet have the tooling to answer questions about how much money may, or may not, be made by introducing something. Your speculation may be fun, but it’s not what they are looking for here.
Ditto player retention, something you have even less insight into than the financials, because one of these two gets a semi-regular infodump, and the other just doesn’t.
Instead, what they want is to hear what you enjoy, and why. Especially why, which is the most important thing.
Your post doesn’t say anything about why more elite specs would be good, or fun, or anything like that. All we know is that you think it’s a good idea, and would make money.
Cannot support having elite specs in the cash shop. Cannot support having new weapon types for classes in the cash shop. Cannot support having new skills in the cash shop.
But we have to pay to gain access to xpac elites through the cash shop anyway, it’s not like they are going to be free.
Your proposition screams Pay2win to me, OP. Besides, do you really think they have the resources, the time and the ideas to provide elite specs on a regular basis ? What about balance ?
You have to buy xpacs to play new elites anyway…
This idea is a win-win. Has been done before in other games, and in this game through HoT. It will help generate resources and provide players more profession gameplay options.
I don’t know about you, but the game gets pretty stale by only having decent profession updates every 2-3 years.
Lol, god no.
Stay at the Expansion Rate, anything else is just beyond ridiculously impossible.
Can only fully agree here with OriOri.
This idea is not win-win, it’s nonsense.
If you buy the expansion, you get the Elite-Specs that come with it. Period.
There is no need to buy any Specs through the Gemstore just only because you want Anet to add faster more Specs somehow.
Fact is, wouldn’t have ANet rushed it so much with HoT’s Release, then they could have better used it to implement with HoT directly per Class at least 2 E-Specs to give players a bit more variety through them and people wouldn’t scream now already for more of them, when the Game isn’t even barely balanced around the first set we got still due to outdated Game Mechanics and an massively overenriched Boon/Condition System that has been for years now now harmony anymore with the Games Skill and Traits, where the addition of the Elite-Specs was just only oil to the fire, which could have been prevented, if Anet prepared first the Game and its Gameplay Mechanics better before adding the Elite-Specs to quickly to the Game, due to the whole Game Balance and its outdated mechanics all being still balanced around a State of the game, where all the Specs, where the Condition Changes and Trait Changes were all not part of the original Game Balance for which the original Game Mechanics were designed around for.
If Anet would first update the outdated Combat System completely, then and only then will this Game be first ready for adding more Elite Specs.
If they now repeat with the second Expansion just again the same mistake they did with HoT, by adding just again more E-Specs to the game too early, before they rebalanced the Game’s Core Mechanics of the Combat System first, then this won’t end well.
You can take poison on this! That will be so sure, like the Amen in the church, if you believe me, or not!
The Game doesn’t need decent Profession Updates, what it finally needs is a proper Rebalance of its Combat Mechanics to bring them up to date with the recently made Changes of the Game from the last 2 years, so that stuff like Upgrades, Boons/Conditions, Attributes, Health and all this outdated stuff gets back in line to harmonize with each other again for all Game Modes.
If Anet seriously has any intentions of keeping their game balanced for long, then are these over short or long just inevitable.
Sooner or later has to make Anet a massive update of all these outdated mechanics, or this game’s balance wil lbreak in like a house of card, whose most important card has been pulled out which gave the fragile construct some stability.
Don’t you find it weird too, that Anet has done in all those freaking 5 years so far just only ONCE a bigger update on Upgrades? 1 single Balance Update to Upgrades, and in 99% of all other Cases they do nothing else, but only Number Changes on Skilsl and Traits.
Do you seriously believe, that this is a good way to balance a massive Game, like GW2, by doing only Number Changes on Skills & Traits and ignoring mostly all of the rest of the Game Mechanics that play a big role in the Combat System?
I can’t be seriously the only person in this whole forum here, who finds this method of balancing very wrong.
Especially when Anet showed us already multiple times that they also do not fear to make more impactful changes to parts of the Combat System if they think its neccessary – they just redesigned the whole Trait System like 3 times in 5 years!!!
For that they had the time and the ressources, but for all other core combat mechanics ironically they didn’t have had it.
Who knows, maybe they thought in all this time, that these things absolutely have no priority at all and are unimportant – what do I know, but if I know one thing, then that this game surely needs now not more Profession Updates.
At least until they have fixed first some other things, that are currently way more important to work on, than overwhelming the game now with Elite Specs, before the Game is ready for them.
^ And that do I say as most likely the Games most biggest supporter of Character Progression, which initiated basically with the idea of Sub Classes presented in the CDI that we have today even at all Elite-Specs. (See Sig)
Would I have known how quickly ANet rushes the ideas they collected from the CDIS into the HoT expansion, god beware, then I would have never suggested in the Character Progression CDI that ANet should add Sub Classes to the Game and would have most likely proposed something completely different first, like a Talent System similar to the Masteries, but just alot more class based, or I would have suggested a concept of mine about Skill Proficiency Ranks to become able to “Upgrade” Skills and level our Weapon Skills and and change them alot more into various customizable way, better and more detailed, than what Traits do.
But back then I just thought, something like Sub Classes would be more impactful for the Games future and for sure also a alot better as sales point for the marketing of the expansions, if somethign great like this would be made to give Classes truly more depth with them (also in hope Anet uses it to implement new weapon types in my mind with them)
However, I’m no fortuneteller, so i could’t foresee what Anet dos, Heck I gave my idea from begin on even not a chanc,e that it would see actually ever the day of light in this game under naturally a different name/term being used for it.
Never would I have believed it, that they add something as huge as like E-Specs into an totally unprepared Game State, just a few weeks after the massive Condition System Change Update.
Your proposition screams Pay2win to me, OP. Besides, do you really think they have the resources, the time and the ideas to provide elite specs on a regular basis ? What about balance ?
You have to buy xpacs to play new elites anyway…
This idea is a win-win. Has been done before in other games, and in this game through HoT. It will help generate resources and provide players more profession gameplay options.
I don’t know about you, but the game gets pretty stale by only having decent profession updates every 2-3 years.
Yes we have to buy the next elite spec, let us not pay more just to play a completely unbalanced game become they would not think things through enough as to the design of next elite specs….Remember how specs were OP at the release ? Like slick shoes engineer, daze on guardian traps, chill necro, 66% alacrity mesmers with distortion well, etc….I certainly do not want to reiterate the same experience with elite specs that come out the gem store. If you are bored because the game is getting stale for you, may I suggest a little break ?
Your proposition screams Pay2win to me, OP. Besides, do you really think they have the resources, the time and the ideas to provide elite specs on a regular basis ? What about balance ?
You have to buy xpacs to play new elites anyway…
This idea is a win-win. Has been done before in other games, and in this game through HoT. It will help generate resources and provide players more profession gameplay options.
I don’t know about you, but the game gets pretty stale by only having decent profession updates every 2-3 years.
Yes we have to buy the next elite spec, let us not pay more just to play a completely unbalanced game become they would not think things through enough as to the design of next elite specs….Remember how specs were OP at the release ? Like slick shoes engineer, daze on guardian traps, chill necro, 66% alacrity mesmers with distortion well, etc….I certainly do not want to reiterate the same experience with elite specs that come out the gem store. If you are bored because the game is getting stale for you, may I suggest a little break ?
That’s not a strong argument at all.
Cannot support having elite specs in the cash shop. Cannot support having new weapon types for classes in the cash shop. Cannot support having new skills in the cash shop.
But we have to pay to gain access to xpac elites through the cash shop anyway, it’s not like they are going to be free.
No, we do not pay through the cash shop for the xpac. We buy the expac or we don’t; the cash shop is there regardless.
Besides which, SlippyCheeze is right (as always): gem sales are still strong (roughly unchanged). (In fact, GW2 income is strong for a 4.3 year old game; game sales just didn’t come close to investor expectations.)
If you want to help ANet generate more income, help them to get more F2P players to upgrade to the full game.
Cannot support having elite specs in the cash shop. Cannot support having new weapon types for classes in the cash shop. Cannot support having new skills in the cash shop.
But we have to pay to gain access to xpac elites through the cash shop anyway, it’s not like they are going to be free.
No, we do not pay through the cash shop for the xpac. We buy the expac or we don’t; the cash shop is there regardless.
Besides which, SlippyCheeze is right (as always): gem sales are still strong (roughly unchanged). (In fact, GW2 income is strong for a 4.3 year old game; game sales just didn’t come close to investor expectations.)
If you want to help ANet generate more income, help them to get more F2P players to upgrade to the full game.
How technical do you want to get on the wording? Cash shop, shop, buy for credit card…
So you’re saying anet would not welcome improving their cash flow and boosting player retention though profession updates?
I’m talking about a specific topic. Perhaps later I will have an idea to help convert “play for free” players to “buy to play” players.
(edited by Swagger.1459)
So you’re saying anet would not welcome improving their cash flow and boosting player retention though profession updates?
I’m saying that the idea in the original post wouldn’t manage to do that.
Perhaps later I will have an idea to help convert “play for free” players to “buy to play” players.
Whereas this would — gem store sales are strong; game sales are “acceptable,” but less than predicted by investors. The main failing seems to be F2P converting to paying players.
So you’re saying anet would not welcome improving their cash flow and boosting player retention though profession updates?
I’m saying that the idea in the original post wouldn’t manage to do that.
Perhaps later I will have an idea to help convert “play for free” players to “buy to play” players.
Whereas this would — gem store sales are strong; game sales are “acceptable,” but less than predicted by investors. The main failing seems to be F2P converting to paying players.
Are you so sure that players would not be interested in purchasing elite unlocks in-between waiting 2-3 years for an xpac with an elite?
I’m not concered with that topic atm. This is about offering elites outside of xpacs for money.
I empathize with the OP’s concern. Roughly before HoT’s release and the unveiling of the elite specs system, we were told the overall layout was there, and that it’d allow a faster developement. Elite specs are supposed to bring flavour and diversity.
I agree that they’re bringing more diversity, yet also a kind of power creep. The issue is, if the next ones come too late, they’ll totally shadow the current ones because “they’re new”, and maybe “better” too. My fear is : when GW2’s time will come, we’ll only have 2 Elite specs lines in the hero panel.
I understand (and mostly share) Orpheal’s concern too, but the very idea of elite specs makes no sense if there isn’t a fair amount of choice at a given time. Otherwise, they feel like half baked profession updates, which they’re not, and which I wouldn’t want, because I also hope for a core combat system and profession revamp that’d make more than 20% of vanilla viable.
That said, I’m mixed feelings about the cash shop thing. Maybe the “more elite specs” thing implies to disconnect them for expansion packs, so, why not in the cash shop ? But I’m not very sure about all this.
Don’t you find it weird too, that Anet has done in all those freaking 5 years so far just only ONCE a bigger update on Upgrades? 1 single Balance Update to Upgrades, and in 99% of all other Cases they do nothing else, but only Number Changes on Skilsl and Traits.
Do you seriously believe, that this is a good way to balance a massive Game, like GW2, by doing only Number Changes on Skills & Traits and ignoring mostly all of the rest of the Game Mechanics that play a big role in the Combat System?
I can’t be seriously the only person in this whole forum here, who finds this method of balancing very wrong.
Especially when Anet showed us already multiple times that they also do not fear to make more impactful changes to parts of the Combat System if they think its neccessary – they just redesigned the whole Trait System like 3 times in 5 years!!!For that they had the time and the ressources, but for all other core combat mechanics ironically they didn’t have had it.
Who knows, maybe they thought in all this time, that these things absolutely have no priority at all and are unimportant – (…)
That part also bewilders me.
About the traits, let’s just say there was the initial thing, that worked more or less. Then, they updated it, but it was clearly worse, so they updated it again towards the current system, ok for 3. Could have been 2, but one missed, which can be understood.
For skills, I remember there’s been, say 1 or 2 big revamps of functionnality for some skills, more or less at the same time than changes of trait systems, now that I’m thinking of it.
So, I suppose they had a lead that focused on the core system, and they actually worked on it, but for some reason, they switched their objectives, and let the opened work in its current state, whereas it was needing more improvement and balance.
And I’m not even talking about even deeper things like CC and conditions.
Things were trimmed to fit their esport wishes now that idea has failed they decided to expand things a bit with elites.
The issue currently is the esport push on class balance and mechanics still remain to say some skills that were perfectly fine in the past were removed or butchered. A ranger would like his pets to move again or a Mesmer who would like some PVE clone death even the guardian who’d like to excel at spirit weapons. Underwater has numerous skills that don’t even work while above ground class sets are missing heals and elites. A ranger can have spirits in all utilities, heal, and elite while Mesmers lack an elite mantra and others lack a heal or elite.
Gw1 had a ton of skills and they reduced skills in gw2 because of that burden of so many. But Gw2 is outright laughable with so few skills after an expansion too. For a game that ties skills to weapons it’s also laughable we have access to so few weapons. We have missing skills but every weapon should be available to every class or at least the vast majority and those weapons should be continuation of skill builds. Elite specialization weapons tie in with their new skills. Even prior while a vampiric necro is surly missing skills the dagger still had a drain ability and worked with it.
We have weapons that don’t really don’t synergize well and others that do. So more weapons to fatten up neglected builds in this game.
I’m against cash shop as that is the realm of skins but the game is in a dire need of additional skills weapons and traits. In addition weapons locked to the elites are troublesome too. I have a single main and I don’t see the point investing in a legendary that’s locked to an elite because that legendary will be completely unusable while in another elite. In addition to weapons like offhand necro axe or mainhand Mesmer pistol if those are ever elite choices then those classes would miss out on a new legendary bracket for use while those are some of the most requested weapons for those classes. They should just be straight up gifted to the core classes.
I’m very strongly against selling something like elite specs in the gem store. Cosmetic and convenience items, sure. But not elite specs.
And just imagine if it actually did happen. Elite specs were generally much overpowered and imbalanced when they shipped. And they needed to be nerfed and balanced. Just think how angry people would be if they paid gems for an elite spec and Anet goes and nerfs it later on. Just imagine that. There would be cries of “false advertising” and “bait and switch”, etc… It would be a PR disaster. If Anet had the guts to nerf and balance the gem store elite specs. And if they didn’t, then it would pretty much be pay to win.
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