Guild Wars 2

The Trading Post has always left a bad taste in my mouth in terms of simulating a player run economy. Just like with any Auction House implementation, it destroys a crucial part of the concept of supply and demand, in that global supply becomes the only kind of supply. In reality, this is obviously not the case, and if it were, the world would come crashing down faster than a North Korean rocket.

Enter The Merchant; a player run subsidiary of the Black Lion Trading Post, the Merchant allows players to set up player run shops anywhere in Tyria, bringing a supply of goods to weary travellers and armies that need them. The Merchant is able to set up a shop, that persists as a static NPC, from which players can purchase goods. Naturally, some cut of that profit goes toward maintaining the Merchant’s trading license.

The Merchant’s skills would revolve around improving their shop, for example, being able to stock more or rarer item types, reducing the Black Lion trading license fee, or increasing their inventory space. At high level, the Merchant would gain access to crafting bonuses, and might even be able to sign their crafted insignias, armour or weapons with a “created by” tag.

Naturally, this will tread on some toes: ANet sell increased inventory space for example, and with improved crafting bonuses the Merchant would be a must-have class for all players. Player shops would also increase server load, and persisting across the merge cycles of mega servers would be difficult.

Thanks for the suggestion, but no thanks! Anet set things up perfectly so we are all good!

Take care!

I think your suggestion is developed well but it will never ever happen. Nor do I want it too.

Not only will the entire world become cluttered with afk shops, the risk of scamming increases tenfold as well as chat spam by shops trying to sell their goods.

This extra policing from ANETs point of view will 99% be too much to make the idea worthwhile. On top of this, the trading post is the #1 gold sink in the game and to reduce the amount of items sold on the TP will increase inflation hugely.

Clearly the solution is to delete the Trading Post!

Please no. The downsides would be far greater than you imagine, much in the same way that ANet somehow didn’t foresee the turret farm when they made the centaur farm. Once players get a hold of it, it will become something awful.

Trust the trading post to do its job, and do it well. You may feel such a system wouldn’t work well “in reality”, but we’re not dealing with our reality here. Just assume there’s some magic behind it, and let it do its thing.

I wonder what having a bunch of player created shops, static NPCs and associated inventory all around the maps would do to my FPS. Probably nothing good.

Edit: if a player can put them anywhere what would you like to bet that some….. individuals…. put shops on top of interactable items, like NPCs, nodes, boss chests, etc.

In before every chest in tair is swarmed by player made shops.

I like the idea of player based trading, but I don’t think crafting is, or ever will be, an integral part of this game, as all goods in the metagame are presently avalable to anyone who works hard for it. Besides lessening the goldsink on Black Lion Taxes, the only exclusive things you could really sell would be ascended gear or certain crafted foodstuffs, at least, without undercutting those that prefer using the trading post.

Any idea which artificially creates more zombie player accounts in todays day and age of MMO video gaming is terrible.

This idea specifically has come up in the past and here are some of the major reasons why it does not work well:

1.) performance. This works well in 2d games like ragnarok online or some of the older MMOs with their 2-3k players per server. Does not work so well with megaservers

2.) players actually lose information on products they want to buy/sell. This is one of the biggest “no no”s of this idea. There is enough flipping on the TP as is, no reason to make life even harder on players who don’t want to research every item they trade over google

3.) visual clutter. To some running through a vast forest of afk npc player characters make a city seem more lively. To many others this display is simply freakish and unpleasent. It’s already bad enough to run past those lifeless bots on some maps, absolutely no reason to invite even more of this behavior into the game

4.) these merchant professions eventually turn into “must have” characters which creates even more “work” for casual players.

5.) scaming and the work that would go into preventing scaming and all the resulting developer/csr-player interaction

Some of these points on their own would already warrent to not even consider this idea.

Finally, there won’t be any new classes. The elite specialisation system has made this approach unnecessary.

Absolutely not

They already did it.

The visual clutter could easily be solved by simply downgrading the appearance of player shops; most people have graphics cards nowadays able to handle orders of magnitude more than Guild Wars 2 throws at them. In fact, the main reasons for slow down in the game isn’t even due to the graphics load, it’s the network traffic and hard disk streaming that’s the real culprit.

Scams and the like can be mitigated but certainly not stopped, that’s just the reality of commerce just like in real life.

Finding items is part of the charm, and part of the whole point.

nosleepdemon.1368:

The visual clutter could easily be solved by simply downgrading the appearance of player shops; most people have graphics cards nowadays able to handle orders of magnitude more than Guild Wars 2 throws at them. In fact, the main reasons for slow down in the game isn’t even due to the graphics load, it’s the network traffic and hard disk streaming that’s the real culprit.

Scams and the like can be mitigated but certainly not stopped, that’s just the reality of commerce just like in real life.

Finding items is part of the charm, and part of the whole point.

Anything extras on thee screen which has to be processed will cause the slow down. Pretty much why switching the character model quantity down drastically improves performance.

Anet having to deal with scams consumes resources. I believe the entire point that they didn’t add player to player trading in this game, unlike what was in GW1, was for that very reason.

To be perfectly serious for a moment, I’m almost certain that player to player trading opening up room for scamming was not why ANet prevented trading. They want everything to flow through the TP so that they can tightly monitor and control the economy. Doing it for “the good of the players” was just a neat excuse. Plenty of other games allow player to player trading afterall.

Ugh, for me, I’m not appealed by the idea not a single bit, the scamming and the abuse of such system would be awful, this isn’t eve online we don’t need or want those things in here.

I don’t like it. ESO has guild run merchants scattered around and I absolutely hated that system. I prefer it like it is now.

Anela.3867:

I don’t like it. ESO has guild run merchants scattered around and I absolutely hated that system. I prefer it like it is now.

What was wrong with it? Why did you dislike it?

(This isn’t the first thread on this type of subject I’ve seen and if you have a list of reasons why it’s not a good system I’d like to see it for future reference)

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Anela.3867:

I don’t like it. ESO has guild run merchants scattered around and I absolutely hated that system. I prefer it like it is now.

What was wrong with it? Why did you dislike it?

(This isn’t the first thread on this type of subject I’ve seen and if you have a list of reasons why it’s not a good system I’d like to see it for future reference)

I disliked it because you had to travel to all the different merchants in all the different areas to compare prices and find what you needed. It was extremely time consuming and not fun. Also, you have to be a member of a merchant guild to be able to sell anything and most of those guilds had minimum selling requirements or you were booted and left with no way to sell anything except yelling it out in region chat.

I want to spend my limited time playing the game and not running around to different merchants to buy what I need. I like the one stop shop.

we need communism in guild wars 2

luzonophir.7134:

we need communism in guild wars 2

Raise the minimum wage!

Anela.3867:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Anela.3867:

I don’t like it. ESO has guild run merchants scattered around and I absolutely hated that system. I prefer it like it is now.

What was wrong with it? Why did you dislike it?

(This isn’t the first thread on this type of subject I’ve seen and if you have a list of reasons why it’s not a good system I’d like to see it for future reference)

I disliked it because you had to travel to all the different merchants in all the different areas to compare prices and find what you needed. It was extremely time consuming and not fun. Also, you have to be a member of a merchant guild to be able to sell anything and most of those guilds had minimum selling requirements or you were booted and left with no way to sell anything except yelling it out in region chat.

I want to spend my limited time playing the game and not running around to different merchants to buy what I need. I like the one stop shop.

Thanks for the info.

Maybe Anet should add a new town called Kamadan, where players can stand around and shout out the things they want to buy or sell. Cuz that was so much fun in GW1.

Just another bad idea based on 101ism. There isn’t an economist of merit willing to defend the position that global supply would destroy the real world economy. You are advocating for the addition of market inefficiency and barriers to free trade.

Psientist.6437:

Just another bad idea based on 101ism. There isn’t an economist of merit willing to defend the position that global supply would destroy the real world economy. You are advocating for the addition of market inefficiency and barriers to free trade.

While my OP was somewhat tongue in cheek, I feel like in all seriousness, I may have misunderstood you here.

Are you implying for example, that the struggles faced by North American steel companies in competition with Chinese suppliers isn’t causing all sorts of problems?

Swagger.1459:

Thanks for the suggestion, but no thanks! Anet set things up perfectly so we are all good!

Take care!

Some of you people seem to be completely immune to sarcasm.

I found the OP hysterical — thanks for the laugh, nosleepdemon!

You should also consider that a global TP removes the value of logistical operations, which is not realistic either, which I sort of eluded to in my OP but I suppose I didn’t spell it out. I dunno man, the more I read your reply the more I feel that a) you won’t respond and at the very least b) it’s you that needs the 101 :p

Ashantara.8731:

Swagger.1459:

Thanks for the suggestion, but no thanks! Anet set things up perfectly so we are all good!

Take care!

Some of you people seem to be completely immune to sarcasm.

I found the OP hysterical — thanks for the laugh, nosleepdemon!

As a developer myself, I can only hope that someone at ANet slapped their forehead hard enough to cause a mild concussion upon reading my suggestion.

In a completely new game though, the idea of a Merchant class is fascinating. I’ve always felt like ANet has a few too many keys to the mansion in GW2 as far as the economy is concerned.

That is very true.

Which leads me to the topic of boredom again, because people are shifting their focus to all sorts of stuff in this game to do instead of playing the game, because its replayability isn’t too thrilling (and that’s putting it mildly). Focusing on the market (and playing it as an ecomony simulator) is just one of the things you can do instead. Others focus on collecting legendaries or creating more characters in order to experience the first part of the game (the personal story) in a new way.

nosleepdemon.1368:

You should also consider that a global TP removes the value of logistical operations, which is not realistic either, which I sort of eluded to in my OP but I suppose I didn’t spell it out. I dunno man, the more I read your reply the more I feel that a) you won’t respond and at the very least b) it’s you that needs the 101 :p

101ism describes over generalizing how economies and markets must function based on the simplified abstracts someone learns in Econ 101. Yes, global competition in the steel market does cause ‘problems’, just not economic problems. Economists the world over recommend the open markets that lead to more global supplies. The problems are problems of national interest and do not impact the production of anything that requires steel or economic growth in general. GW2’s global supply can not reproduce those problems.

Just because real world economies and markets have to deal with certain mechanics doesn’t make those mechanics economically necessary. Who cares if GW2’s global supply removes the comparative advantage available from differing “logistical operations”? To maintain comparative advantage, Arenanet would have to employ tactics like limiting the availability of recipes, steeply inclined paths to production efficiencies, and costs for moving materials. Tactics like that work in New Eden but would fall flat in Tyria.

Your argument that Tyria needs certain market mechanics because those mechanics are found in the real world may be tongue in cheek, but it is also trite. Those mechanics would negatively impact something the Tyrian marketplace does well, provide egalitarian access to everything the market has to offer at the most competitive price possible.

edit: To be clear, global markets do not “[remove] the value of logistical operations.” Global markets enhance the value of logistical operations. Access to a larger market rewards the most efficient producers. A divided market makes it easier for less efficient producers to remain competitive. Your idea of a merchant class would result in more work for consumers, and increase the chance that any one consumer would pay more than market value for items.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ashantara.8731:

Swagger.1459:

Thanks for the suggestion, but no thanks! Anet set things up perfectly so we are all good!

Take care!

Some of you people seem to be completely immune to sarcasm.

I found the OP hysterical — thanks for the laugh, nosleepdemon!

As a developer myself, I can only hope that someone at ANet slapped their forehead hard enough to cause a mild concussion upon reading my suggestion.

In a completely new game though, the idea of a Merchant class is fascinating. I’ve always felt like ANet has a few too many keys to the mansion in GW2 as far as the economy is concerned.

Except that people have made equivalent posts in all seriousness. I’ve seen many threads requesting player to player trading as well as 2 or 3 threads asking for the ability to set up small shops that can run 24/7, whether the owner is there are not. I’ve seen threads that ask for complete overhauls of the game or professions or ask for brand new professions, Suggestions made in all seriousness.

When other people have already made multiple serious suggestions similar to yours, then I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect others to catch that you are being sarcastic.

Edit: 2 months ago
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Scrap-TP-and-let-us-set-up-Trading-Stalls/first

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

Yes, the TP reduces the chance for profiteering or charging a premium based on location. The horror.

A global market reduces the threshold for entry and increases the threshold for market manipulation.

Game development is a group effort. If you are a developer and are fortunate enough to be lead on a game’s design, keep that in mind and hire an economist to help.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

Want to know what’s really gross?

Kiosks set up all over communal areas, with players and bots spamming chat trying to sell their items…

Also gross… this will increase player hoarding 100 fold and drive up costs…

Another gross… bot shops, more scams and more gold sellers…

Biggest gross… All this negatively impacts common players, irritates them and alienates them from enjoying the game… and that hurts the bottom line in the long run…

…You obviously didn’t think through the portion of your posts that were half serious. Your posts also highly suggest that you are one of those market manipulator players who wants to abuse systems for person gain only, not to have a overall fair and balanced working game economy.

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

Yes, the TP reduces the chance for profiteering or charging a premium based on location. The horror.

A global market reduces the threshold for entry and increases the threshold for market manipulation.

Game development is a group effort. If you are a developer and are fortunate enough to be lead on a game’s design, keep that in mind and hire an economist to help.

I thought gw2 have a economist and most players dont seem to like the changes he do at all so not sure hiring one would help tbh.

Linken.6345:

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

Yes, the TP reduces the chance for profiteering or charging a premium based on location. The horror.

A global market reduces the threshold for entry and increases the threshold for market manipulation.

Game development is a group effort. If you are a developer and are fortunate enough to be lead on a game’s design, keep that in mind and hire an economist to help.

I thought gw2 have a economist and most players dont seem to like the changes he do at all so not sure hiring one would help tbh.

There’s a difference between what the vocal minority say, and what the majority of players actually do. I’d wager most people don’t post on these forums, so as a developer one would need to be careful about what opinions one takes to heart from anybody posting here. I imagine that most of the decisions made regarding the economy are based on statistics and not forum opinion.

Regarding economics, how does one argue that a global market reduces the cost of entry when the little guy is put in direct competition with established players?

nosleepdemon.1368:

Linken.6345:

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Regarding open markets, I’d argue that in an MMO there is a definite value to obtaining a good location for selling particular goods. For example, a merchant selling health or mana potions in a dangerous zone could reasonably increase their item price “above market value”, because there is value in not having to return to a town to purchase those items. This is something that the TP really mutes. I’d also say that access to a global market would create a high bar for entry, which is something that I think is also seen on the TP, where players with lots of supply have a global effect on the market. This is super convenient to manage, and may be necessary from the point of view of ANet and managing the game’s economy, but it’s also a bit gross.

Yes, the TP reduces the chance for profiteering or charging a premium based on location. The horror.

A global market reduces the threshold for entry and increases the threshold for market manipulation.

Game development is a group effort. If you are a developer and are fortunate enough to be lead on a game’s design, keep that in mind and hire an economist to help.

I thought gw2 have a economist and most players dont seem to like the changes he do at all so not sure hiring one would help tbh.

There’s a difference between what the vocal minority say, and what the majority of players actually do. I’d wager most people don’t post on these forums, so as a developer one would need to be careful about what opinions one takes to heart from anybody posting here. I imagine that most of the decisions made regarding the economy are based on statistics and not forum opinion.

Regarding economics, how does one argue that a global market reduces the cost of entry when the little guy is put in direct competition with established players?

You’d wager? You’re entire first paragraph should be obvious…

Umm perhaps because it becomes centralized so all players can jockey for their own buying and selling price points… Although possible to make profits, the devs didn’t intentionally design the tp so players could rip off others to make gold… which seems to be the theme you are ultimately aiming for.

Your serious input is flawed and shows you didn’t put in enough thought into the subject. Not a developer myself, but it’s obvious you didn’t think past the koisk phase to look at effects on the game as a whole…

I’m unable to support the OP’s suggestion, which depends in large part upon a misunderstanding of this game’s economy.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Just lile with any Auction House implementation, it destroys a crucial part of the concept of supply and demand, in that global supply becomes the only kind of supply. In reality, this is obviously not the case,

I keep parsing this sentence trying to understand how someone would think that a healthy economy would distinguish between local & global supply. One of the worst things about economies in other MMOs is that the supply & demand on each world differs — this allows fewer people to control more markets.

In contrast, in GW2, we all share the same TP. This gives me a larger selection of potential customers for my unneeded loot and a larger selection of potential sellers for the things I want to buy. This is good for nearly everyone in the game, except people attempting to manipulate prices.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

I’m unable to support the OP’s suggestion, which depends in large part upon a misunderstanding of this game’s economy.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Just lile with any Auction House implementation, it destroys a crucial part of the concept of supply and demand, in that global supply becomes the only kind of supply. In reality, this is obviously not the case,

I keep parsing this sentence trying to understand how someone would think that a healthy economy would distinguish between local & global supply. One of the worst things about economies in other MMOs is that the supply & demand on each world differs — this allows fewer people to control more markets.

In contrast, in GW2, we all share the same TP. This gives me a larger selection of potential customers for my unneeded loot and a larger selection of potential sellers for the things I want to buy. This is good for nearly everyone in the game, except people attempting to manipulate prices.

Ah sorry, I miss-wrote that. I’ve fixed it now.

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ah sorry, I miss-wrote that. I’ve fixed it now.

The initial post still claims that global supply is a problem.

Ubi.4136:

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

That would be interesting wouldn’t it? I think reselling is partly kept in check by the listing fee, so there needs to be some variance in price before that becomes profitable, but flippers will always have a lot of power with a centralized system like the TP. With a decentralized system, the exact value of goods would be slightly harder to determine, since players would additionally be weighing up the local price of the competition. It would also factor in the relative danger of transporting the good to that location. I expect it would work a lot better in a more dangerous and expansive environment.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ubi.4136:

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

That would be interesting wouldn’t it? I think reselling is partly kept in check by the listing fee, so there needs to be some variance in price before that becomes profitable, but flippers will always have a lot of power with a centralized system like the TP. With a decentralized system, the exact value of goods would be slightly harder to determine, since players would additionally be weighing up the local price of the competition. It would also factor in the relative danger of transporting the good to that location. I expect it would work a lot better in a more dangerous and expansive environment.

I was tempted to give a well thought out response to your previous post but this post makes question your sincerity. Localized markets where it is more difficult to calculate the market value of an item offer more room for flipping, more advantages for experienced and established players.

I think this thread has run its course or at least my interest in it. The last thing I would add to it is this; a game’s economy, the tools it uses to maintain a marketplace, should resonate with the design intent. A game’s economy shouldn’t be judged by how well it mimics the real world unless mimicry of the real world is the design intent.

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ubi.4136:

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

That would be interesting wouldn’t it? I think reselling is partly kept in check by the listing fee, so there needs to be some variance in price before that becomes profitable, but flippers will always have a lot of power with a centralized system like the TP. With a decentralized system, the exact value of goods would be slightly harder to determine, since players would additionally be weighing up the local price of the competition. It would also factor in the relative danger of transporting the good to that location. I expect it would work a lot better in a more dangerous and expansive environment.

I was tempted to give a well thought out response to your previous post but this post makes question your sincerity. Localized markets where it is more difficult to calculate the market value of an item offer more room for flipping, more advantages for experienced and established players.

I think this thread has run its course or at least my interest in it. The last thing I would add to it is this; a game’s economy, the tools it uses to maintain a marketplace, should resonate with the design intent. A game’s economy shouldn’t be judged by how well it mimics the real world unless mimicry of the real world is the design intent.

Yes and for it to be dangerous to move items the game would have to get open world pvp and this aint the game for that maybe check out ashes of creation mate.

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ubi.4136:

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

That would be interesting wouldn’t it? I think reselling is partly kept in check by the listing fee, so there needs to be some variance in price before that becomes profitable, but flippers will always have a lot of power with a centralized system like the TP. With a decentralized system, the exact value of goods would be slightly harder to determine, since players would additionally be weighing up the local price of the competition. It would also factor in the relative danger of transporting the good to that location. I expect it would work a lot better in a more dangerous and expansive environment.

I was tempted to give a well thought out response to your previous post but this post makes question your sincerity. Localized markets where it is more difficult to calculate the market value of an item offer more room for flipping, more advantages for experienced and established players.

I think this thread has run its course or at least my interest in it. The last thing I would add to it is this; a game’s economy, the tools it uses to maintain a marketplace, should resonate with the design intent. A game’s economy shouldn’t be judged by how well it mimics the real world unless mimicry of the real world is the design intent.

I once knew a guy on WoW who had gold capped several accounts. I didn’t believe him, so he showed me. He attempted to send one copper to a character and received an internal server error. He had single handidly destroyed the gem market on his server. The gem prices on his server were TEN TIMES the average rate on other servers. His tactic was to buyout all gems at a lower price than his own.

The question is: Is this single server an example of a local market dominated by one player (I suppose you would argue yes), or is it an end state for any singular, global market (I would argue yes)? My argument, which is the equivalent of anti-globalization, is that a series of local markets would be more resilient to the take over attempt of one or several allied players.

nosleepdemon.1368:

Psientist.6437:

nosleepdemon.1368:

Ubi.4136:

I would love for them to add a check when selling things on the Trading Post that allows the seller to say “Not for Resale”…so once bought it could not be relisted on the Trading Post.

And, I really would love to see the difference it would make removing the artificial inflation of people just buying and reselling at a higher cost.

I imagine there would be a decent drop in price for a lot of items since the flippers/TP Botters (artificial inflation) would not be able to control the market.

That would be interesting wouldn’t it? I think reselling is partly kept in check by the listing fee, so there needs to be some variance in price before that becomes profitable, but flippers will always have a lot of power with a centralized system like the TP. With a decentralized system, the exact value of goods would be slightly harder to determine, since players would additionally be weighing up the local price of the competition. It would also factor in the relative danger of transporting the good to that location. I expect it would work a lot better in a more dangerous and expansive environment.

I was tempted to give a well thought out response to your previous post but this post makes question your sincerity. Localized markets where it is more difficult to calculate the market value of an item offer more room for flipping, more advantages for experienced and established players.

I think this thread has run its course or at least my interest in it. The last thing I would add to it is this; a game’s economy, the tools it uses to maintain a marketplace, should resonate with the design intent. A game’s economy shouldn’t be judged by how well it mimics the real world unless mimicry of the real world is the design intent.

I once knew a guy on WoW who had gold capped several accounts. I didn’t believe him, so he showed me. He attempted to send one copper to a character and received an internal server error. He had single handidly destroyed the gem market on his server. The gem prices on his server were TEN TIMES the average rate on other servers. His tactic was to buyout all gems at a lower price than his own.

The question is: Is this single server an example of a local market dominated by one player (I suppose you would argue yes), or is it an end state for any singular, global market (I would argue yes)? My argument, which is the equivalent of anti-globalization, is that a series of local markets would be more resilient to the take over attempt of one or several allied players.

And thats alot harder to do in this game since all servers in the same region share the trading post.

nosleepdemon.1368:

I once knew a guy on WoW who had gold capped several accounts. I didn’t believe him, so he showed me. He attempted to send one copper to a character and received an internal server error. He had single handidly destroyed the gem market on his server. The gem prices on his server were TEN TIMES the average rate on other servers. His tactic was to buyout all gems at a lower price than his own.

The question is: Is this single server an example of a local market dominated by one player (I suppose you would argue yes), or is it an end state for any singular, global market (I would argue yes)? My argument, which is the equivalent of anti-globalization, is that a series of local markets would be more resilient to the take over attempt of one or several allied players.

You would be incorrect. If there are 40 local markets, then each potential monopolist needs to be countered 40 times. In a global market, they only need to be countered once — and with more people, it’s far more likely to find at least one person looking at the same niche.

Global markets in MMOs favor the non-mathematical, not-interest-in-power-trading players (i.e. most of the community). Local markets favor the trading-savvy players.

Buying and reselling goods on the TP does not cause inflation.
In fact it does the very opposite, as for every item bought and resold, 15% of the items value in gold is removed from the game.
In any MMO economy, and GW2 is no differant, there is always a price premium for wanting something now , as distinct from being prepared to wait a while for the same item.
This is why there is always a price differance between items being sold now, and the price for ordering the same item.
Unfortunately, too many people think the TP is more like a bargain basement shop where everything should be mega cheap.