Guild Wars 2

Elder wood logs are currently 38c on the trading post. Compare that to Hardwood at 2s19c and Seasoned Wood at 2s29c.

Mithril ore is 47c, while Platinum goes for 1s71c and Iron 1s48c.

T4 and T3 mats are worth 3 to 6 times as much as T5 mats. It makes perfect sense, since the majority of the players in a mature game are running around endgame zones collecting a lot of T5, and ArenaNet has made sure to include lower tier mats in endgame recipes like Ascended gear.

What if the players were enlisted to help rebuild Lion’s Arch by supplying Mitrhil and Elder Wood logs? Put some nice awards for contributing, and help the demand for T5 mats rise to meet the supply.

What if laurels could be earned this way?

i think that is a nice idea
if anet plans to rebuild LA

i have tons of mithril ore sitting in my bank
and still a nice amount of elder wood too

I third this motion!

I hope they do plan on rebuilding it. The city built of ships was a wonderful idea that I’d hate to see gone forever. The recent ambient dialogue between a Citizen of LA, Magnus, and the Hero-Tron points at some kind of change coming to the city.

I’ll admit, the think that got me thinking about this is my recent work on crafting Mawdrey. I decided to get all of the foxfire clusters myself, which means I am now sitting on several thousand elder wood logs.

It takes around 36 common t5 mats (mithril and elder) to craft 1 lvl 80 rare weapon.
And you need around 2000 rare weapons on average to forge a precursor.
So for every copper the price of t5 mats rises, it wil cost 7.2g more to forge a precursor.

Now i dont know which prices you had in mind for those 2 mats but if you plan to raise them to t4 level (hard wood/platinum) you are easily looking at more than 1000g additional costs for forging a precursor with rare weapons.

Wouldnt that be fun….

Wanze.8410:

It takes around 36 common t5 mats (mithril and elder) to craft 1 lvl 80 rare weapon.
And you need around 2000 rare weapons on average to forge a precursor.
So for every copper the price of t5 mats rises, it wil cost 7.2g more to forge a precursor.

Now i dont know which prices you had in mind for those 2 mats but if you plan to raise them to t4 level (hard wood/platinum) you are easily looking at more than 1000g additional costs for forging a precursor with rare weapons.

Wouldnt that be fun….

Thanks for pointing that out. I haven’t messed with legendaries at all.

I have no price in mind for T5 mats. I wasn’t angling to somehow get rich off of them. I was just looking at the thousands of elder wood logs I have in my bank, as well as the oddity of Mithril being a third of the cost of common Iron. If there was something useful to do with the logs I’d probably end up doing that rather than selling them.

With the new precursor crafting in Heart of Thorns, do you think the Mystic Forge will still be a reasonable way to approach getting a precursor? I know we don’t know all the details yet, but I’m kinda expecting precursors will become either ‘buy on the TP’ or craft once that is in game.

Now that I’m thinking about it, based on your response, it sounds like increasing demand for T5 mats would also give a price boost to high level rares, provided people keep gambling for precursors.

Other than people doing that, would an increase price for high level rares be a positive or negative thing? I tend to salvage most of the ones I get as drops for ectos, since they are usually priced a little under the cost of the ectos they will give.

Precursor crafting will only get you one of each, and will likely be very expensive. The Mystic Forge will continue to be a primary source of Precursors going forward.

mtpelion.4562:

Precursor crafting will only get you one of each, and will likely be very expensive. The Mystic Forge will continue to be a primary source of Precursors going forward.

That’ll be interesting to see, if the mats going into precursor crafting will outweigh the cost of making all those rares to gamble.

So T5 mats need to be cheap as dirt because Zomorros is too stingy with his drop rates.

What if they increased demand for T5, then adjusted the Forge to compensate?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/What-s-up-with-Lions-Arch/first#post4307301

No guys. We donated a ton of gold at the last Pavilion Event to rebuild LA and that ended up just being an arbitrary gold sink.

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

It takes around 36 common t5 mats (mithril and elder) to craft 1 lvl 80 rare weapon.
And you need around 2000 rare weapons on average to forge a precursor.
So for every copper the price of t5 mats rises, it wil cost 7.2g more to forge a precursor.

Now i dont know which prices you had in mind for those 2 mats but if you plan to raise them to t4 level (hard wood/platinum) you are easily looking at more than 1000g additional costs for forging a precursor with rare weapons.

Wouldnt that be fun….

Thanks for pointing that out. I haven’t messed with legendaries at all.

I have no price in mind for T5 mats. I wasn’t angling to somehow get rich off of them. I was just looking at the thousands of elder wood logs I have in my bank, as well as the oddity of Mithril being a third of the cost of common Iron. If there was something useful to do with the logs I’d probably end up doing that rather than selling them.
if you also dont know what to do with your t5 fine mats, craft rare lvl 80 inscriptions and sell them via lowest listing
With the new precursor crafting in Heart of Thorns, do you think the Mystic Forge will still be a reasonable way to approach getting a precursor? I know we don’t know all the details yet, but I’m kinda expecting precursors will become either ‘buy on the TP’ or craft once that is in game.
I think people will focus on collecting/crafting the new precursors and not many will go for the old ones. So those that still want one of the old legendaries, will most likely buy the pre off the tp or attempt to forge them
Now that I’m thinking about it, based on your response, it sounds like increasing demand for T5 mats would also give a price boost to high level rares, provided people keep gambling for precursors.
It would result in a price boost for rare weapons of the same type as in demand precursors (GS, Sw, Da, St…) as those are usually used to forge pres, rather than being salvaged for ectos. Rare weapons of the same type as low demand pres (Sp, SG, Tr, Fo, To) wont see much price difference as their price is tied to the value of ectos, as they are usually salvaged.
Other than people doing that, would an increase price for high level rares be a positive or negative thing? I tend to salvage most of the ones I get as drops for ectos, since they are usually priced a little under the cost of the ectos they will give.
It propably wouldnt make too much of a difference, unless you want to buy an expensive precursor and nearly had enough gold to buy it, before their price skyrockets due to high mithril/elder costs. A new player, who didnt start saving gold for his precursor yet, propably will need the same amount of time to farm the gold. He might have to pay 1000g more for his precursor but he will also get substantially more gold, when selling his daily mothril/elder wood. But in general, i would say the mayority of the player base is more interested in a stable economy and prices, rather than price swings of more than 100%.

Checked out the cost of mats over the lifetime of GW2.

Interesting to see t4 and t5 mats running about the same up until the middle of 2013. That’s when T4 mats start a pretty quick climb up to where they are now, while T5 mats bounce around and settle back down to the baseline.

Iason Evan.3806:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/What-s-up-with-Lions-Arch/first#post4307301

No guys. We donated a ton of gold at the last Pavilion Event to rebuild LA and that ended up just being an arbitrary gold sink.

Scam-O-Tron did a nice job there taking our gold. And Ellen Kiel rewarded him with an honorary citizenship of Lions Arch.

She is the source of all evil in Tyria.

Gibson.4036:

Checked out the cost of mats over the lifetime of GW2.

Interesting to see t4 and t5 mats running about the same up until the middle of 2013. That’s when T4 mats start a pretty quick climb up to where they are now, while T5 mats bounce around and settle back down to the baseline.

Thats because the september 2013 patch introduced ascended weaponcrafting, which was a huge additional sink for t2-4 mats.
Ascended crafting is a minor sink for t5 mithril/elder compared to crafting rares for forging pres.

this must include T5 leather as well considering it is…worthless

Gobble D Goop.4081:

this must include T5 leather as well considering it is…worthless

Hard to imagine too much leather going into rebuilding LA, but why not? I suppose it could be used to… uh… lash things together. Yeah.

Wanze.8410:

Thats because the september 2013 patch introduced ascended weaponcrafting, which was a huge additional sink for t2-4 mats.
Ascended crafting is a minor sink for t5 mithril/elder compared to crafting rares for forging pres.

Yep, made that connection, too.

Then there’s another T5, silk. The standard answer on the forum is that the recipes for Ascended armor were intentionally skewed to drive up the price of silk scraps, which were sitting at vendor cost. If that is true, there’s evidence that ArenaNet doesn’t want T5 mats at rock bottom prices, and precedent for doing things in game to adjust them back upward.

I’m not sure that making gambling for a precursor more expensive is problem enough to not try and balance T5 demand against lower tier mats.

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

Thats because the september 2013 patch introduced ascended weaponcrafting, which was a huge additional sink for t2-4 mats.
Ascended crafting is a minor sink for t5 mithril/elder compared to crafting rares for forging pres.

Yep, made that connection, too.

Then there’s another T5, silk. The standard answer on the forum is that the recipes for Ascended armor were intentionally skewed to drive up the price of silk scraps, which were sitting at vendor cost. If that is true, there’s evidence that ArenaNet doesn’t want T5 mats at rock bottom prices, and precedent for doing things in game to adjust them back upward.

I’m not sure that making gambling for a precursor more expensive is problem enough to not try and balance T5 demand against lower tier mats.

John Smith, the game economist also stated that he doesnt see a problem with higher tier mats being more expensive than lower tier mats. And Elder/mithril arent at vendor value, as silk was.

Actually, the high price of t2-4 mats is a good way to add value to loot in lower tier maps and transfer wealth from veteran players to newer players.

This would only be a temporary thing though. Surely it won’t take that long to rebuild LA if we give them stuff to build with

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

Gibson.4036:

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

How do short, substancial price swings of common and luxury goods benefit the economy/player base in your opinion?

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

How do short, substancial price swings of common and luxury goods benefit the economy/player base in your opinion?

What’s to say that there couldn’t be future uses as well? The idea being, if we have temporary ones, they come to an end and can be adjusted. Once LA is rebuilt, as prices start to fall, there can be future things implemented to add demand, and therefore value back to T5 mats.

We don’t have things like “Oh no, silk scraps are at vendor cost!” followed by permanent Ascended recipes added to the game that send them shooting up to stay.

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

How do short, substancial price swings of common and luxury goods benefit the economy/player base in your opinion?

What’s to say that there couldn’t be future uses as well? The idea being, if we have temporary ones, they come to an end and can be adjusted. Once LA is rebuilt, as prices start to fall, there can be future things implemented to add demand, and therefore value back to T5 mats.

We don’t have things like “Oh no, silk scraps are at vendor cost!” followed by permanent Ascended recipes added to the game that send them shooting up to stay.

But mithril and elder wood arent at vendor cost.

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

How do short, substancial price swings of common and luxury goods benefit the economy/player base in your opinion?

What’s to say that there couldn’t be future uses as well? The idea being, if we have temporary ones, they come to an end and can be adjusted. Once LA is rebuilt, as prices start to fall, there can be future things implemented to add demand, and therefore value back to T5 mats.

We don’t have things like “Oh no, silk scraps are at vendor cost!” followed by permanent Ascended recipes added to the game that send them shooting up to stay.

But mithril and elder wood arent at vendor cost.

That was a reference to the wild swing of silk, not to the fact that it was at vendor cost.

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Wanze.8410:

Gibson.4036:

Hah, Gobble. Yes, the idea was that it would be a temporary thing, though of course it wouldn’t matter whether we contributed or not, LA will get rebuilt whenever ArenaNet decides.

Tying it to the rebuilding of LA seemed like a good way to eat up some excess stock, let the price rise a little, and yet not have it be a permanent thing that could swing the pendulum too far the other way.

How do short, substancial price swings of common and luxury goods benefit the economy/player base in your opinion?

What’s to say that there couldn’t be future uses as well? The idea being, if we have temporary ones, they come to an end and can be adjusted. Once LA is rebuilt, as prices start to fall, there can be future things implemented to add demand, and therefore value back to T5 mats.

We don’t have things like “Oh no, silk scraps are at vendor cost!” followed by permanent Ascended recipes added to the game that send them shooting up to stay.

But mithril and elder wood arent at vendor cost.

That was a reference to the wild swing of silk, not to the fact that it was at vendor cost.

But what is the point of introducing a short term price increase?
What is the benefit?

We seem to be starting to go around in a circle, here, Wanze. I have the sense it’s because you are very knowledgeable about economics and place a high value on a strong economy, while I only have a introductory understanding of economics, and wouldn’t count a strong economy on the top of my lists of things I value in a fantasy game.

There are a couple of reasons I started thinking about the cost of high tier mats with respect to low tier. As I wrote before, the one that started me thinking about it was that while collecting foxfire clusters, I ended up with a large quantity of elder wood, and discovered it’s not particularly useful.

On a purely story level, it seems weird that a fantastical metal like mithril, named for a rare, incredibly light, incredibly strong metal envisioned by Tolkien would be cheaper, significantly so, than good old iron. Within the world of the game, T5 mats are presented as rarer, more valuable, more powerful materials than T3 mats.

I know, that has nothing to do with economy, and I understand why it is that way.

So I combined that with things in game pointing to the eventual rebuilding of LA, and thought there might be a way to adjust things. The idea behind temporary is that it could adjust the price upward, but not send it permanently soaring. Eventually the new demand would end, and prices would come down again. Depending on whether it worked too well, or not well enough, something else could be introduced to then add value with the lessons learned.

Perhaps that’s naive thinking.

So, the benefit of “short term” would be building in an automatic period where adjustments could be made, rather than introducing something that might swing the pendulum too far the other way, and require even more ideas to swing it back. Perhaps it’s a problem that doesn’t need solving.

So let’s just continue rebuilding LA with mithril and elder wood for the rest of the lifetime of the game.

The benefit of a price increase would be to make the fantastical mats you can get in the (supposedly) most dangerous parts of the game actually reflect their precious nature in cost. As you’ve pointed out, that would not be a benefit to people gambling for precursors at the Forge.

Although I remember something about the cost of mats dropping also means player income, which largely comes from selling mats, dropping as well, so I wonder why that doesn’t work the other way. If mats rise, then endgame player income rises, right?

Again, not an economist, so this is not something I’m familiar with.

You’re all forgetting one thing. Anet hates Lion’s Arch. It’s like it was designed by a guy (we’ll call him Gary) who later decided to quit in a spectacular fashion. So Gary is regarded very lowly.

Consider the history of Lion’s Arch. Destroyed by dragon Orr thing before game start, rebuilt by pirates. Game starts. Halloween event blows up the fountain. Fountain is broken pretty much forever, finally gets repaired. Directly after, Scarlet shows up with the Tyrian Death Star. Lion’s Arch is utterly destroyed. Also the fountain, because apparently SCREW THE FOUNTAIN!

If, and a big if here, Lion’s Arch is repaired, I fully expect that to last perhaps a month or two before something else blows it up. Which is REALLY a shame as it was by far my favorite city in the game.

Edit: Also forgot about the hologram thing above the fountain. Because they REALLY hate that fountain.