Guild Wars 2

Anet really needs to think about the future of GW2 to keep players coming back and a reason to login everyday. They need to breathe new life into this game, and a two week Living Story will simply not cut it. I am hinting at an expansion. Yes, this has been discussed many many times. I’m not sure why it hasn’t been done yet though. Anet needs to wake up and do something major to this game. Unlock the other parts of the world, add new events, give a reason for players to keep playing in the other zones that we cannot access. A new commando class would be fantastic. New skills for existing classes, new weapons, etc. We want diversity!!

And this can’t be done with the living story because…?

I rather like the living story thank you very much. However I do think that 2 weeks isn’t long enough. I felt it rushed the story too much, but nonetheless, kept things in the world moving and changing. Yes they could use the Living Story to open more zones, add a new profession, skills etc. I think thats where they were leaning with the new GM traits being unlock by certain events. I wouldn’t want an expansion, in the classical sense. It would kill whatever current stuff they had. There wouldn’t be any reason to stay in the current zones, because all the new shiney stuff is elsewhere.

They don’t have the resources to make an expansion, its that simple…all the revenue is going to the Chinese game development.

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms. They should have just worked on new, unique zones that players could work through at their own pace.

They still could have had gem store items unique to these zones too, and players buy those items if and when they need them.

As it stands I missed most of LS season 1, and I can never play that content again. Stupid, stupid, stupid…

Why would you create something only a portion of your player base can participate in, rather than something everyone can do in their own time?

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms. They should have just worked on new, unique zones that players could work through at their own pace.

They still could have had gem store items unique to these zones too, and players buy those items if and when they need them.

As it stands I missed most of LS season 1, and I can never play that content again. Stupid, stupid, stupid…

Wait, do you seriously request that they will put the entire game on hold, just because they didn´t know you weren´t playing? And that way you want them to work against a core part of their philosophy, which they used to advertise the game with?

They told all of you that it was a living, changing world. And even if i missed huge parts of the story as well, they listened to players like us and introduced ways of discovering that part of story and lore as well.
And honestly, how strange would it be if we could walk into Kessex Hills these days and still enter the tower of nightmares? Scarlet´s dead, but nevermind, here you go and she´ll trick you once again?

There´s no way they will implement an expansion anywhere soon. Simply because it would make no sense for them to launch an expansion, while a large amount of chinese players haven´t gone through the core game. And they wouldn´t want to be called a discriminating company for launching content only in the EU and NA. Excluding the chinese people now could really break their necks over there.

An expansion is aimed towards getting people to come online for a month or two, play all the content and leave again. Living story is aimed towards endless new content to encourage players to come play regularly.

The only problem right now, from what I can see, is that LS usually brings zerg content with not particularly good rewards.
Personally, I really like the Living Story and think it’s the right direction for ANet to go towards. I’m sure that the LS will improve in season 2, as well.

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

Presumably you have data to back up this “fact”?

Name.9625:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms. They should have just worked on new, unique zones that players could work through at their own pace.

They still could have had gem store items unique to these zones too, and players buy those items if and when they need them.

As it stands I missed most of LS season 1, and I can never play that content again. Stupid, stupid, stupid…

Wait, do you seriously request that they will put the entire game on hold, just because they didn´t know you weren´t playing? And that way you want them to work against a core part of their philosophy, which they used to advertise the game with?

They told all of you that it was a living, changing world. And even if i missed huge parts of the story as well, they listened to players like us and introduced ways of discovering that part of story and lore as well.
And honestly, how strange would it be if we could walk into Kessex Hills these days and still enter the tower of nightmares? Scarlet´s dead, but nevermind, here you go and she´ll trick you once again?

There´s no way they will implement an expansion anywhere soon. Simply because it would make no sense for them to launch an expansion, while a large amount of chinese players haven´t gone through the core game. And they wouldn´t want to be called a discriminating company for launching content only in the EU and NA. Excluding the chinese people now could really break their necks over there.

Who is suggesting they put the game on hold? I’m saying that rather than do updates every two weeks for 6 months they should have released 2-3 new zones that people could have either played at release or any time in the future.

uknortherner.2670:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

Presumably you have data to back up this “fact”?

Obviously I don’t but the gem store items available during LS were only available to a limited amount of players, for a limited amount of time.

Those items could/should have been available to any player when they have the time to play that content.

Sube Dai.8496:

uknortherner.2670:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

Presumably you have data to back up this “fact”?

Obviously I don’t but the gem store items available during LS were only available to a limited amount of players, for a limited amount of time.

Those items could/should have been available to any player when they have the time to play that content.

Why?

And still how would that show that Living Story is a failure? …Even in revenue terms…

I have missed alot lot of cool stuff in other MMO’s becouse I don’t play them very much… That’s how MMO’s work, they change and we have to live with it.

speak for yourself,
I quite enjoy the LS, (I missed most of it because of not really getting ‘into’ the mmo aspect wehn I first picked up the game. But I am really looked forward to LS, season 2!
I think the temporary content is great and I dont feel overwhelmed by the amount there is to do outside of it. While it’s not here, I can take a break if there’s nothing else I want to do.

What you dont seem to be taking into account, is permanent content is only better for a short while, once you’ve done it all, we’re back to square one. “needs new permanent content”. SO it really makes no difference if it’s temporary or not. (unless you only play for 1 or 2 months in the year …>.> )

As someone who prefers to cycle through large amounts of content (working on my 6th map completion) instead of hammering away at a different tiny bit of content every 2 weeks, I’d certainly prefer a substantial expansion rather than being rationed like the LS does. A greater amount of content to cycle through keeps everything more fresh.

The LS was always something of a bad idea, with a worse execution. I’m sorry for the people that like it, but you’re in the minority, and with many good reasons.

GW2 is a game that most people are likely to play intermittently. Having a focus on fleeting story events and temporary content does nothing but discourage the majority of players from coming back to the game because they miss too much when they go on hiatus. Furthermore, it ends up being a development vacuum that keeps the game world from actually growing, so when someone who stopped playing a few months ago or last year wants to check the game out again immediately lose interest because it doesn’t feel like much has changed. Timed events also tend to create rushed, buggy content that consistently seems of middling quality and causes people to burnout in the achievement race, etc.

It’s a novel concept, just not a particularly good one. It drove hordes of people from the game, and they very likely know it at this point, so the gears are likely to switch this year. It’s not really the release format that’s the problem, but rather the focus on fleeting story arcs and temporary content. The focus should always be on permanent additions like new zones, dungeons, skills, etc.

As much as I love the living story (actually giving players stuff to do. Just needs some better & more interesting rewards in my opinion.)

An expansion would be great: New events, new maps, new (or returning?) classes, new races, new weapons, new set skills (not just traits), increased lvl cap, new PvP game modes (1v1 duels, Free for all), …

Would all be great in my opinion.

Einlanzer.1627:

The LS was always something of a bad idea, with a worse execution. I’m sorry for the people that like it, but you’re in the minority, and with many good reasons.

GW2 is a game that most people are likely to play intermittently. Having a focus on fleeting story events and temporary content does nothing but discourage the majority of players from coming back to the game because they miss too much when they go on hiatus. Furthermore, it ends up being a development vacuum that keeps the game world from actually growing, so when someone who stopped playing a few months ago or last year wants to check the game out again immediately lose interest because it doesn’t feel like much has changed. Timed events also tend to create rushed, buggy content that consistently seems of middling quality and causes people to burnout in the achievement race, etc.

It’s a novel concept, just not a particularly good one. It drove hordes of people from the game, and they very likely know it at this point, so the gears are likely to switch this year. It’s not really the release format that’s the problem, but rather the focus on fleeting story arcs and temporary content. The focus should always be on permanent additions like new zones, dungeons, skills, etc.

And this folks is why living story just doesn’t make the game feel great. It’s just temporary zerg content and if you miss out on it because of real life stuff going on then boo-hoo too bad for you in Anet’s eyes. This is why we need new zones, new skills, new weapons, PERMANENT things that an expansion offers, that way people can play it at their own pace and not feel pressured to log-in to the two week zerg rush.

You’re finally comprehending the definition of living story. It’s something you live through as opposed to something you can repeat over and over and over like your character’s Personal Story. If you didnt play the game during the LS, tough luck, you werent around for it.

At least Anet’s working up to the point they can logically release an expansion. Outside of the Crystal Desert zones, what exactly did Anet have that the story of GW2 would legitimately explore? As it stands now, even the Crystal Desert area would not be explored because the Pact is, presumably, still trying to secure Orr’s regions from the remnants of Zhaitan’s minions.

With the LS1 conclusion, now there’s a legitimate reason to expand into the Maguuma wastes.

I understand what you’re saying and im reserving judgement until I get a peak at LS season 2. If we continue to see this temporary content I don’t think it will be received well and the playerbase will decline.

As someone who has taken multiple, long breaks from the game, I would quite like some more permanent content. I logged on recently and Lion’s Arch is apparently gone for some reason. Well, obviously I can see it was destroyed. That much I know. But I have no idea how or why and to be honest I find it hard to care that much since story (well, the personal story at least) was never even remotely this game’s strong suit. Still, it’s a bit weird if nothing else.

Other than that, the only noteworthy content they added, that I can tell of at least, is a new zone with more of not much of anything to do and some more traits. Sadly, seeing as how I play a ranger, let’s just say I wasn’t exactly bursting with excitement when I saw those traits.

I’m sure people like the LS and everything and that’s all fine and dandy, but I’d like a little something more. And by a little I mean a lot and permanent.

I get the objective behind the Living Story/World but it’s incredibly impractical to have temporary content for people that play this game very casually. People will play this game casually because of the non-existent subscription fee. Players come back after a month or two while being away and have missed an entire chapter of the events that have happened. Players should be able to replay these stories somehow.

Not only is it worthwhile for the casual players but honestly, as far as content goes, what has really changed in almost two years of the game’s release? New Fractal levels (cool, but not everyone enjoys Fractals), a new TA Aetherblade Path (who even does that anymore?), a new Wurm world boss (again, not that many people do it), and what else? I can’t honestly think of anything else at the top of my head. I don’t mean to bash the game but we really don’t have a lot to show for two years of a game’s release. Something big and permanent is definitely needed.

Another thread based on opinion being presented as fact. I guess all this Living story content I thought I was enjoying all this time must have invoked some form of delusional state hiding the fact that I really hated it all along.

Sorry there OP, but the living story is a unique way of injecting new, fresh content regularly into the game in a way that I’ve quite enjoyed and look forwards to.

Sube Dai.8496:

uknortherner.2670:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

Presumably you have data to back up this “fact”?

Obviously I don’t but the gem store items available during LS were only available to a limited amount of players, for a limited amount of time.

Those items could/should have been available to any player when they have the time to play that content.

yes, limited editions and temporary sales are completely unsuccesful or unheard of in any other business…

VOLKON.1290:

Another thread based on opinion being presented as fact. I guess all this Living story content I thought I was enjoying all this time must have invoked some form of delusional state hiding the fact that I really hated it all along.

Sorry there OP, but the living story is a unique way of injecting new, fresh content regularly into the game in a way that I’ve quite enjoyed and look forwards to.

That’s the point. Many of us would also like to enjoy this content but we can’t because its temporary. This seems to be the fundamental bugaboo for Anet right now, even with mega servers.

People want to enjoy the game when they feel like it/ have time to do it. Anet believes content should be on a schedule of their choosing. First it was temporary living story and now its bosses on a set schedule thanks to megaserver that many of us can no longer do due to real life obligations.

Fact is people wont stand for this kitten for very long you can see by the piles of threads full of kittening that Anet has been locking. The customer dictates what they want, when they want it or you don’t get paid. Give it to them or suffer a decline in population , its that simple.

Sube Dai.8496:

uknortherner.2670:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

Presumably you have data to back up this “fact”?

Obviously I don’t but the gem store items available during LS were only available to a limited amount of players, for a limited amount of time.

Those items could/should have been available to any player when they have the time to play that content.

I’m not sure you understand what a failure in revenue terms is.

The idea of LS was very good, and the storyline could have went in a different direction. However, the execution left much to be desired. 2 weeks was not enough time to allow players to finish the “chapter”. A month would have been much better.
I do wish, however, that Anet would bring back Zephyr Sanctum and even SAB , which in my eyes were the best parts of last year. With the demise of LA, I don’t know if there will be a Dragon Bash – also fun, along with the Pavillion in DR.

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

They were getting an equivalent of 500,000+ people subscribing for $15 a month in sales revenue. That is far from being a colossal failure. In an interview article I read some time ago, interviewing various developers/publishers about subscription less MMOs, and they mentioned that they make ~$5 per person who plays their games (note that does not mean every player is paying money), so with $15 a month for 500,000 people equivalent in sales using the average would mean that ~1.5 Million people are playing this game every month ~half as many who bought the game. This game is not a colossal failure financially.

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

It’s interesting that half the forum complains about how short the LS usually is, and the other half complains that 2 weeks isn’t long enough.

Phy.2913:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

It’s interesting that half the forum complains about how short the LS usually is, and the other half complains that 2 weeks isn’t long enough.

Not long enough to grind out the achievements you mean. The fresh content added every LS cycle is minimal at best. Wasn’t one cycle like a 60 second conversation between two NPCs?

Speaking out of my own experience and i don’t wait for everyone to agree with me: I left the game because of the Living Story, i’ve run about 50-70% of it, but it ended up being boring for me and left the game, came back around the end, and a week ago ended up leaving the game again because the game crashes every 10-15 mins, i’ve took all the mesures up to fix the problem and yet my problem persisted, and after months of submiting crashes reports and getting no improvment i’ve decided the best for me was to stop playing it, the fact that i’am now in the forums is because i was checking my tech support post and yet after a week no answer.

So, speaking planly, i don’t know if it’s only the living story that kills the game. But to that sum all the other technical problems, among others: errors trying to leave overflow, travel from overflow to end up in another overflow, and crashes

Dark Catalyst.1028:

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

I suppose it’s like people who like to post on the forums of games they don’t play, but hey, everyone is different, so go figure.

Personally, I think that the LS should have mostly used sparodic temporary content to implement mostly permanant content and changes. I feel it should also be more player driven and less on a shedule to give players the feeling of influencing the story. For example, rather than telling the players where the dungeon was, have the players search for it. Patch in little clues, like mobs running to / from a location nearby.

Granted, easier said than done. Just my 2 cents.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Phy.2913:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

It’s interesting that half the forum complains about how short the LS usually is, and the other half complains that 2 weeks isn’t long enough.

Not long enough to grind out the achievements you mean. The fresh content added every LS cycle is minimal at best. Wasn’t one cycle like a 60 second conversation between two NPCs?

That was more an epilogue to the whole season one arc.

Phy.2913:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

People like the half hour’s worth of poorly written content that gets released every two weeks? Go figure.

It’s interesting that half the forum complains about how short the LS usually is, and the other half complains that 2 weeks isn’t long enough.

Hardly interesting, because it’s really not about the same thing, so the complaints are not in opposition to each other.

Complaining about 2 weeks not being long enough is in practically all cases in reference to the time required to complete all achievements. Complaining about the length of the story content is in reference to the time it takes to absorb the story. Two different things to complain about.

Edit: Oh well, ninja’d by Dark Catalyst.

If you actually cared about the achievement, then you had more than enough time to get them.

Phy.2913:

If you actually cared about the achievement, then you had more than enough time to get them.

“My gaming schedule tells me I can keep up with the grinding pace, therefore everyone can keep up, too.”

BlueZone.4236:

Phy.2913:

If you actually cared about the achievement, then you had more than enough time to get them.

“My gaming schedule tells me I can keep up with the grinding pace, therefore everyone can keep up, too.”

“Everybody gets a trophy” syndrom

The Living story to me was no different than what other games do in regards to updates. Only real difference here is that the Living Story experiment wanted to give added life to the world by having it be temporary. An artificial feeling that the actions of the players and npc villians had impact on the world.

We got dungeons, a few+fractals+ a piece of the few being added to fractals. We got world bosses that have proven to be somewhat a challenge. We have had some decent boss fights and events that were good as far as GW2 goes. We have had altered zones and a destroyed LA.

I have been playing MMO’s for over 10years and can tell you this about the expansion game, There have been next to 0 expansions released for any of them with the amount of time GW2 has been out for purchase. We are closing in on the 2year mark which seems to be the average for the first expansion to come out for the games that have even had one.

We know nothing about what Anet is doing behind the scenes until they tell us something. They could be working on an expansion and the Living Story. When most companies are laying people off after 6months to a year, Anet has been hiring or keeping people on. That tells me they are working on something, possibly many things at once.

I agree that temporary content doesn’t provide added enjoyment beyond the due date of removal, but it’s a price Anet seems to be willing to pay with the concept of how they want their world to work. I don’t think all content should be like this, but I accept the living story and can deal with it. I also accept that this was a test run. Hopefully the story they try to tell has:
1. Better plot
2. Better dialogue
3. More in depth fleshed out characters
4. No joker villain wannabe.

Ideally what I want is for failure to guide the story also, which I assume would be an enormous amount of work hours to be put into content that may never happen. We only get to see one outcome to each progressive step in the story and that content I assume is crafted a few months or more in advance.

May get to see that sort of thing in upcoming games cough cough EQ:N where each server will have it’s own identity made possible through players action’s, meaning a town will exist on one world and not the other because of how players handled the content.

Should try playing a sandbox where you may have things happen that never happen again.

I will say though that like many things in this game, we should get alternating versions of items and content.
1 week we get Living Story, 1 week we get permanent content. 1 week we get gem store armor, 1 week we get armor that can be obtained through actually playing the game. Same for weapons and such.

Phy.2913:

BlueZone.4236:

Phy.2913:

If you actually cared about the achievement, then you had more than enough time to get them.

“My gaming schedule tells me I can keep up with the grinding pace, therefore everyone can keep up, too.”

“Everybody gets a trophy” syndrom

Exactly! We’re here to work. Keep up the grinding pace.

I think the better question is: How is Anet attracting new players? Current players will come and go, and it is important to make sure you keep your current player base. However, I can’t imagine it’s easy to get new players when they’ve missed half of the content either.

The Living Story was fine. If you people who couldn’t find the time to participate often because of Life, and are going to whine about it, need to examine your priorities. Anybody who didn’t play much during the season because they think GW2 is meh and were playing/doing other things instead, and are going to whine about it, can have a bunch of tough kittens.

Until we hear otherwise then the Living Story is going to be what GW2 is all about. In one form or another.

eisberg.2379:

Sube Dai.8496:

Living story was a colossal failure, even in revenue terms.

They were getting an equivalent of 500,000+ people subscribing for $15 a month in sales revenue. That is far from being a colossal failure. In an interview article I read some time ago, interviewing various developers/publishers about subscription less MMOs, and they mentioned that they make ~$5 per person who plays their games (note that does not mean every player is paying money), so with $15 a month for 500,000 people equivalent in sales using the average would mean that ~1.5 Million people are playing this game every month ~half as many who bought the game. This game is not a colossal failure financially.

Can that revenue be shown as being tied to the LS ?

Remember that he did not say that the game was a colossal failure.

Personally I doubt that LS was a colossal failure in the sense he seemed to mean. I do think that it is a design philosophy failure however. The game was pitched as one you could feel comfortable stepping away from when you desired and then come back later. The LS’s emphasis on, “play now or miss it forever,” contradicts that original philosophy in my opinion.

Then again LS1 was a first attempt. I think that the concept has a lot of merit and am curious to see how Anet attempts to improve upon it in the future.

I hope that they add a bit more replayability to the next iteration. A nice (IMO) compromise might be for future LS episodes to have special or unique rewards tied to the initial run while implementing the story in such a way as to allow it to continue to be played.

Ashen.2907:

I hope that they add a bit more replayability to the next iteration. A nice (IMO) compromise might be for future LS episodes to have special or unique rewards tied to the initial run while implementing the story in such a way as to allow it to continue to be played.

How about this: opening up new areas as the story progresses. Some time after their initial release, which could still include temporary events and the like as we’ve seen in season 1, they could fill them out with ‘aftermath’ events and other stuff relating to the developing story. A bit like the way explorable dungeon paths relate to the story dungeons.

Seems like a best-of-both-worlds approach.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ashen.2907:

I hope that they add a bit more replayability to the next iteration. A nice (IMO) compromise might be for future LS episodes to have special or unique rewards tied to the initial run while implementing the story in such a way as to allow it to continue to be played.

How about this: opening up new areas as the story progresses. Some time after their initial release, which could still include temporary events and the like as we’ve seen in season 1, they could fill them out with ‘aftermath’ events and other stuff relating to the developing story. A bit like the way explorable dungeon paths relate to the story dungeons.

Seems like a best-of-both-worlds approach.

Absolutely. I thought that’s how LS1 was going to be, in fact. We’ll find out soon enough I suppose.

Everyone in the industry knows that games are valued based upon replayability. A game that does not have replayability (you exhaust the content once, and then move on) is not a success while games like FPS & RTS are huge success because even though their single player story may suck they have infinite replayability in multiplayer.

There are exceptions, but this is the general rule. Games with a high degree of replayability can last a decade after they are first created.

Guild Wars 2 partially solves the problem by making its Personal Story have a degree of replayability by requiring different alts, etc, to experience all the paths. It also partially solves the problem by having PvP and WvW.

But PvE wise, the Living Story falls short of replayability by a mile. There is nothing in the Living Story that is replayable save for a few changes to some maps and some new dungeon paths added (mostly to Fractals of the Mists).

I loved the LS, but its over, I will never see it again. I will never be able to enjoy the intricate details of it instead of all of the stress that I received from rushed schedules, zerg mechanics and lots and lots of bugs and balance issues.

The game is headed no where good at this rate, if this just continues.

Keep bringing us the Living Story, don’t abandon your model. But please, for the love of the six gods, add it to the game in some permanent format.

To quote a guild member of mine that came back this week after being gone for 6 months and asking what changed in the time he wasn’t here.

“Well that doesn’t do me much good”

New and returning players have gained nothing from the living story and players that did stay around received very little worthwhile content, most of it boring zerg content.

I don’t know…..the living story part of this game has been working for me so far.