Guild Wars 2

I play on an old laptop from New Zealand. You just have to get used to it.

That said, the Wintersday one is bad because it forces you to use the horrible in-combat movement, instead of the OOC one.

Axialbloom.8109:

I play on an old laptop from New Zealand. You just have to get used to it.

That said, the Wintersday one is bad because it forces you to use the horrible in-combat movement, instead of the OOC one.

In combat speed is barely a problem here because this jumping puzzle design with that in mind. There is no large gap jump that you require to be in normal speed to pass.

In fact . It’s make some section like small pole jump easier.

You want to argue semantics?

Tatwi.3562:

forcing them

Show me the guns at everyone’s heads.

The irony behind the OP’s post and their really liberal application of words is great.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Tigaseye.2047:

I used to be good at jumping, in offline games.

I have no reason to believe I’m not still at least passable.

Problem is, online games are not like offline ones and them trying to pretend they are, against all the evidence to the contrary, is really not working, for me.

Maybe if I had a $3000 laptop, instead of my reasonably new, but less expensive “gaming” one and I lived on the same continent as the server I play on, it would be OK?

But, in my current location, with my current laptop?

Nope.

I could also turn all my settings down, but I don’t want to.

Why play a beautiful game, just to spend all your time looking at rubbish graphic quality?

Or, for significantly less you could get not a laptop. And considering WP plays on the NA servers (I believe) and has a whole series of the Jumping Puzzles, it seems like that is probably your biggest issue, though ISP is still a valid complaint.

No, I don’t do desktops for games.

Internet should be OK, my end, as they upgraded the broadband a couple of months ago.

Made no difference to the game.

I even tried reducethelag, before that and again, made absolutely no difference.

A guildie said it was to do with the old game engine and how it distributes stuff between only 2 cores, but I’m certainly no expert on all that.

I’m not complaining about any of that, here.

Just saying that me+JP+online games don’t mix and I don’t think I’m alone.

Tigaseye.2047:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Tigaseye.2047:

I used to be good at jumping, in offline games.

I have no reason to believe I’m not still at least passable.

Problem is, online games are not like offline ones and them trying to pretend they are, against all the evidence to the contrary, is really not working, for me.

Maybe if I had a $3000 laptop, instead of my reasonably new, but less expensive “gaming” one and I lived on the same continent as the server I play on, it would be OK?

But, in my current location, with my current laptop?

Nope.

I could also turn all my settings down, but I don’t want to.

Why play a beautiful game, just to spend all your time looking at rubbish graphic quality?

Or, for significantly less you could get not a laptop. And considering WP plays on the NA servers (I believe) and has a whole series of the Jumping Puzzles, it seems like that is probably your biggest issue, though ISP is still a valid complaint.

No, I don’t do desktops for games.

Internet should be OK, my end, as they upgraded the broadband a couple of months ago.

Made no difference to the game.

I even tried reducethelag, before that and again, made absolutely no difference.

A guildie said it was to do with the old game engine and how it distributes stuff between only 2 cores, but I’m certainly no expert on all that.

I’m not complaining about any of that, here.

Just saying that me+JP+online games don’t mix and I don’t think I’m alone.

So you don’t like jumping puzzles and don’t do them – this is sensible. The OP should do the same thing.

Coulter.2315:

Tigaseye.2047:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Tigaseye.2047:

I used to be good at jumping, in offline games.

I have no reason to believe I’m not still at least passable.

Problem is, online games are not like offline ones and them trying to pretend they are, against all the evidence to the contrary, is really not working, for me.

Maybe if I had a $3000 laptop, instead of my reasonably new, but less expensive “gaming” one and I lived on the same continent as the server I play on, it would be OK?

But, in my current location, with my current laptop?

Nope.

I could also turn all my settings down, but I don’t want to.

Why play a beautiful game, just to spend all your time looking at rubbish graphic quality?

Or, for significantly less you could get not a laptop. And considering WP plays on the NA servers (I believe) and has a whole series of the Jumping Puzzles, it seems like that is probably your biggest issue, though ISP is still a valid complaint.

No, I don’t do desktops for games.

Internet should be OK, my end, as they upgraded the broadband a couple of months ago.

Made no difference to the game.

I even tried reducethelag, before that and again, made absolutely no difference.

A guildie said it was to do with the old game engine and how it distributes stuff between only 2 cores, but I’m certainly no expert on all that.

I’m not complaining about any of that, here.

Just saying that me+JP+online games don’t mix and I don’t think I’m alone.

So you don’t like jumping puzzles and don’t do them – this is sensible. The OP should do the same thing.

Well, it helps that I don’t really care about the reward.

Whereas, he probably does.

I don’t, generally, do stuff in games for the rewards.

But, if all they ever produced was jumping puzzles and/or they kept locking stuff that I really did like behind them (and it wasn’t available elsewhere), even I would complain.

I like jumping things, but I find it really annoying when they add artificial difficulty by implementing randomness or time limits.

Takoyakii.2146:

Axialbloom.8109:

I play on an old laptop from New Zealand. You just have to get used to it.

That said, the Wintersday one is bad because it forces you to use the horrible in-combat movement, instead of the OOC one.

In combat speed is barely a problem here because this jumping puzzle design with that in mind. There is no large gap jump that you require to be in normal speed to pass.

In fact . It’s make some section like small pole jump easier.

It feels horrible, and you have to build momentum. In combat jumping is just sluggish and should never be the basis of any jumping thing.

Gilburt.9146:

When you regularly speed run this puzzle you can find all kinds of small shortcuts, patterns in the exploding presents, timing of the snowflake respawns, etc. There’s absolutely a puzzle aspect to it.

I would agree with that, the thing I hate about this that the OP mentions is the forced nature of it caused by the disappearing platforms.

I love the JPs in this game, many I can’t do, which is fine, but this added ‘feature’ means there’s no time to even pause to think especially with so many other players around.

The worst thing though IMO is the amount of time you need to queue to actually get into it, took me literally 20 mins to get in with many failed zone loads due to max players.

Why isn’t this instanced like everything else with multiple copies when player numbers are exceeded?

Anything done for disabilities often makes it to easy for others so it always a problem.

But this is a hand and eye control game in so many areas I don’t see much can be done without ruining for most.

There is even a average vs more skilled or better study players that often results in nerf that makes things boring for players with more skills or willing to study and work harder types.

Yes when possible I like to see accommodations but only in things given to players who need the help not a nerf that makes content boring or less special for others.

I hate jumping puzzles. Especially the diving goggle aetherblade one.

However, I actually love this winter jp, I don’t know why. It just looks nice, and it’s amusing to see people fall off.

Milferd.3780:

Anything done for disabilities often makes it to easy for others so it always a problem.

But this is a hand and eye control game in so many areas I don’t see much can be done without ruining for most.

There is even a average vs more skilled or better study players that often results in nerf that makes things boring for players with more skills or willing to study and work harder types.

Yes when possible I like to see accommodations but only in things given to players who need the help not a nerf that makes content boring or less special for others.

Then why not find an additional activity which is “equally annoying” but can be done when physically impaired.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Tatwi.3562:

Kal Spiro.9745:

It’s still 100% optional. It is required for a skin….

You know that you’re wrong and you clearly say so. Thanks!

:)

I don’t need to respond, all the others who did for me made sufficiently effective points, but I will anyway.

Don’t cut a quote off so that the ragged edges of the statement make you’re point. That’s called Cherry Picking. It’s disingenuous and and frankly rude. Skins are optional extras and always have been. It’s not something you need and if you’d quoted the whole statement you would have me saying the same thing twice in a row. Optional is optional. Since you don’t need the skin for any reason you don’t need to do any of the things “required” to acquire the skin.

The whole game, every achievement, gear or part of the game is totally optional. You do not need it and no one is forcing you to play any part of the game.

Because everything is optional, every criticism is wrong? I do not think so. I think the “it is optional” is a cheap way to justify a few things like grind etc.

Kal Spiro.9745:

If you WANT the skin more than you want to not do the puzzle, then you’ll have to do it. But that is you making a decision on what is more important to you, it is gauging your priorities, not being forced to do something you don’t want to do it. No one is making you do it other than you.

Right. The same is with everything else in the game. As an example: No one is forcing you to level to 80. All level 80 content is totally optional. It is your decision you want to play level 80 content and to level to 80.

So the whole “it is optional” answer to invalidate someones critique or opinion does not count and I think it is improper.

In the OP’s next rant:

• Stainless steel isn’t completely stainless.
• Iceland is greener than Greenland.
• There are no “guild wars” in “Guild Wars”.

While we’re arguing about semantics for no apparent reason…

What’s Winterfest?

Lets just settle this by having Anet put every single JP + goggles achievement + 3000 gold + 100 fractals + 25,000 achievement points as a prereq for the next awesome skin. That way, everyone will be kittened instead of just some people.

Oh, and THEN, maybe players will stop fighting each other and actually look at who’s creating the problems. Maybe.

Minx.7521:

Lets just settle this by having Anet put every single JP + goggles achievement + 3000 gold + 100 fractals + 25,000 achievement points as a prereq for the next awesome skin. That way, everyone will be kittened instead of just some people.

Oh, and THEN, maybe players will stop fighting each other and actually look at who’s creating the problems. Maybe.

I support this idea. That should be a legendary journey for… something.

I use my brain doing it so its a puzzle.

PopeUrban.2578:

While we’re arguing about semantics for no apparent reason…

What’s Winterfest?

Something similar like Oktoberfest – with lots of booze.

They’re called Jumping puzzles because the vast majority of them requires you to “puzzle” out how to get from point 1 to point 2. Unless of course you simply watch a tutorial about how to do it. Once you know what to do it’s then all mechanical, your reflexes and motor skills.

I’ve spent a few hours and have barely made it half way through the snow flake portion, so yes I lack the reflexes and motor skills as well.

I’m astonishingly bad at the static ones so the concept of jumping accurately at the correct time to hit flickering/moving/temporary platforms is utterly beyond me.

Toypocalypse much more my thing. Choose the events you like and have fun.

I was trying to collect the bits for the present tree in my personal instance and I was trying to do the JP in Iron Marches for like 3 hours. The worse was the strobes when effects get applied on you, mid jump. Not looking forward to the remaining 5 items to get, nearly all behind JPs.

Behellagh.1468:

I was trying to collect the bits for the present tree in my personal instance and I was trying to do the JP in Iron Marches for like 3 hours. The worse was the strobes when effects get applied on you, mid jump. Not looking forward to the remaining 5 items to get, nearly all behind JPs.

If you are patient you don’t need to do the JPs. I got all but one of the Grawk items from Grubby Packages i had saved up from normal open world stuff over the last few months. I’m not sure where they came from but I have not done most of the JPs that are listed in the wiki and dulfy guides. The green bauble was the only one I had to JP for and it was part way along the route so I did not have to succeed at the JP.

So as long as you have opened the collection during Wintersday you can spend as long as you like over the collection.

Zok.4956:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Tatwi.3562:

Kal Spiro.9745:

It’s still 100% optional. It is required for a skin….

You know that you’re wrong and you clearly say so. Thanks!

:)

I don’t need to respond, all the others who did for me made sufficiently effective points, but I will anyway.

Don’t cut a quote off so that the ragged edges of the statement make you’re point. That’s called Cherry Picking. It’s disingenuous and and frankly rude. Skins are optional extras and always have been. It’s not something you need and if you’d quoted the whole statement you would have me saying the same thing twice in a row. Optional is optional. Since you don’t need the skin for any reason you don’t need to do any of the things “required” to acquire the skin.

The whole game, every achievement, gear or part of the game is totally optional. You do not need it and no one is forcing you to play any part of the game.

Because everything is optional, every criticism is wrong? I do not think so. I think the “it is optional” is a cheap way to justify a few things like grind etc.

Kal Spiro.9745:

If you WANT the skin more than you want to not do the puzzle, then you’ll have to do it. But that is you making a decision on what is more important to you, it is gauging your priorities, not being forced to do something you don’t want to do it. No one is making you do it other than you.

Right. The same is with everything else in the game. As an example: No one is forcing you to level to 80. All level 80 content is totally optional. It is your decision you want to play level 80 content and to level to 80.

So the whole “it is optional” answer to invalidate someones critique or opinion does not count and I think it is improper.

Not true. In order to play anything in HoT you are required to be level 80. In order to enter certain dungeons you are required to be certain levels. In order to do Fractals at all you are required to be level 80. In order to do Fractals at some level gear is required to be on par. In order to do Raids you have to be level 80 and gear has to be on par. In order to complete the personal story you must reach level 80. In order to do certain things other things are required. Level 80 isn’t an option if you want to play the game.

What will never be required for anything is a gear skin. That will always be optional because it doesn’t provide for anything and doesn’t allow for anything. It’s just cosmetic. That’s the actual difference between optional and required.

If you’d like eating, drinking and breathing are optional. It’s your choice to continue living. It’s not actually required for anything. This is why YOUR argument is invalid.

I would love to experience the JP for myself before commenting, but so far I have not been able to get in to it. I either get a message saying it’s full or, after sitting for a while on the JP’s flash screen, am ejected back out to DR. And what is Anet’s solution for an already overcrowded instance? Make it a daily. Brilliant.

TBH, I think all this is just demonstrates why they just need to accept that some people are more naturally gifted and/or younger and/or more able (or less disabled) and/or more willing/able to put in the time required and/or have better hardware and/or better internet and/or live nearer the servers, or whatever and just make different servers, in games, with different levels of difficulty.

I proposed/supported this idea, in WoW and it was really the only area where most of the hardcore and the casuals could agree.

There’s a good reason why vintage games were made with different levels of difficulty…

You didn’t have to do them all – you just picked the one you felt you would be best suited for at the time and then, could always progress/switch to the harder/less hard one, depending on how you felt while playing.

If they did this in online games, it would mean we could also avoid the type of players we didn’t get along with.

Instanced grouping, in games that had it, could try to put you with people from the same types of servers, as well.

No harder content, like “real” raids, should be barred to the easier server people, if they wanted to do it; but anyone who chose the harder servers would not be able to enter any lower difficulty version of them (like LFR, in WoW, for example).

This is because some of these type of players tend to disrupt easier versions of instances and spend their time complaining and/or bragging.

They also tend to reduce the difficulty level for others, by outgearing them and/or knowing tactics too well.

The few people, who had chosen the easier difficulty server, but had still done the harder versions of the raids, would still be welcome in the easier versions, however.

I know the raid difficulty thing isn’t relevant here, yet, but still.

In the case of something like this jumping puzzle, an easier version, or a different activity altogether, could be offered on the easier difficulty server.

You could then gain the same achievements/items, with less difficulty/effort.

However, if you then decided to transfer to a harder difficulty server, you could no longer use/display any rewards/titles you had gained on the easier server there, without redoing them (or the relevant part(s) of them) on the harder one.

I’ve probably made it sound more complicated than it would actually be, to implement and I realise not all of this is relevant to this particular game, at this point in time, but yeah.

I know they want us to all try to play together happily, but I think it’s safe to say it would make for less stressed players and would retain more of them, more of the time, if we didn’t even have to try to.

I just want to say, can we retire the “it’s optional” argument and try for something a bit more eloquent and context-specific? That argument is so overused and so ill-fitting so often. It’s like the Blue Steel of half the people who post on this forum. “Alright, you call my bluff… but I’ve got an ace up my sleeve! Four of them in fact!”

“None of those are aces, or even pairs. It’s a 2, a 5, a 10, and 3.”

“No, they are definitely aces. Four of them. Now give me the pot!”

“I’m not giving you the pot. None of those are aces.”

“Well… I suppose it is optional. I do say that.”

“Yes. Yes you do.”

Beast McDragon.1703:

I would love to experience the JP for myself before commenting, but so far I have not been able to get in to it. I either get a message saying it’s full or, after sitting for a while on the JP’s flash screen, am ejected back out to DR. And what is Anet’s solution for an already overcrowded instance? Make it a daily. Brilliant.

This is the thing I don’t understand. This has never been a thing before, as far as I recall. So I don’t know what changed this year.

yea i hate jumping puzzles, why cant i just BUY the snowglobe

Tigaseye.2047:

TBH, I think all this is just demonstrates why they just need to accept that some people are more naturally gifted and/or younger and/or more able (or less disabled) and/or more willing/able to put in the time required and/or have better hardware and/or better internet and/or live nearer the servers, or whatever and just make different servers, in games, with different levels of difficulty.

Is this what it has come to? Putting people who struggle at the children’s table and giving them no respect?

Frankly just because some people come on the forums and wave whatever inconvenience can’t be argued with on the internet and demand their shiney does not mean we should start segregating people… Some people may find it harder and some people may not complete it – that is life – but we should not disrespect them by excluding them from the same game as everyone else.

Coulter.2315:

Tigaseye.2047:

TBH, I think all this is just demonstrates why they just need to accept that some people are more naturally gifted and/or younger and/or more able (or less disabled) and/or more willing/able to put in the time required and/or have better hardware and/or better internet and/or live nearer the servers, or whatever and just make different servers, in games, with different levels of difficulty.

Is this what it has come to? Putting people who struggle at the children’s table and giving them no respect?

Frankly just because some people come on the forums and wave whatever inconvenience can’t be argued with on the internet and demand their shiney does not mean we should start segregating people… Some people may find it harder and some people may not complete it – that is life – but we should not disrespect them by excluding them from the same game as everyone else.

I’m not disrespecting casuals, or people who struggle, as you well know.

No one said anything about excluding anyone, or putting them at the “children’s table”, or anywhere else.

That’s your take on this – not mine, or anyone else’s that I have ever heard.

Or, more likely, it’s an attempt to try to make the suggestion look bad, or disrespectful; as you don’t even want casuals to have fun, on a server you would have nothing at all to do with…

If anything, this suggestion is more about including more people and catering to people’s different needs, properly.

It’s not my fault that some hardcore players, or would-be hardcore players, seem to want everything on hardmode, all the time and for there to be no easymode (or even medium mode) options, at all.

Or that, if there are, despite their constant protestations against them, they insist that people should get no rewards from them.

I didn’t make them selfish, dictatorial and antisocial.

They just are.

So, the only answer, IMO, if the games devs are determined to cater to these people (which they seem to be, despite it being patently wrong to do so), is to at least offer people alternative difficulty settings.

So, we can all just get on with doing our own thing and play the game in peace.

Without this constant, unending war, which is threatening to drive me (for one) from ALL games (not even just MMOs), forever, it’s so utterly sickening.

No one should have to plead for a game they can play, or fight with other players’ bad and utterly selfish attitudes, constantly.

I’m not even really a casual myself, but I simply can’t stand it, for much longer and would happily take playing with just casual players, simply to get away from the total psychos.

I fled from WoW because of all this and now it’s happening here, too.

Also, people would be totally free to choose which server difficulty they wanted to play on.

No one would force them to play on a certain mode and they would be free to transfer, at any time, if they wanted.

So, no “children’s tables”.

You can argue and make derogatory metaphors all you want, but people are being driven away from games here and some of these people are the main funders of games.

No one should want that.

Oh look, it’s thread # 9994 about “mandatory” festival jumping puzzles.

Tom Gore.4035:

Oh look, it’s thread # 9994 about “mandatory” festival jumping puzzles.

You’re right, they’re not mandatory, but then nothing in the game is.

As long as you don’t want to play a game.

Maybe casuals and people with physical issues, or whatever, should just shut up and sit in DR, buying stuff from the gemstore and playing the harp?

Would that be acceptable?

Tigaseye.2047:

Tom Gore.4035:

Oh look, it’s thread # 9994 about “mandatory” festival jumping puzzles.

You’re right, they’re not mandatory, but then nothing in the game is.

As long as you don’t want to play a game.

Maybe casuals and people with physical issues, or whatever, should just shut up and sit in DR, buying stuff from the gemstore and playing the harp?

Would that be acceptable?

Yes but it is a game which by definition includes some sort of challenge. There are various different ways that Anet and other game developers achieve that, but one of those ways is by testing physical coordination.

It’s a shame that some people can’t do the puzzle, for various reasons, and I do sympathize.

But if you remove the idea that some content should require you to overcome a challenge to obtain it, what do you have? Not much game left!

Tigaseye.2047:

Tom Gore.4035:

Oh look, it’s thread # 9994 about “mandatory” festival jumping puzzles.

You’re right, they’re not mandatory, but then nothing in the game is.

As long as you don’t want to play a game.

Maybe casuals and people with physical issues, or whatever, should just shut up and sit in DR, buying stuff from the gemstore and playing the harp?

Would that be acceptable?

If that’s all they’re capable, yes. That’s what they should do.

Or maybe we just hand everything to everyone at login. Or better, yet, email it to them so they don’t actually have to login into the game.

Would that be acceptable?