Guild Wars 2

Electro dyes aren’t found on the TP nor are they found in BLK Lion chests.

That said the most expensive dyes in this game are indeed from the Electro set Electro Blue for instance is usually found hovering above 1000g on the TP with the others around 500-800. That’s more expensive than most precursors and while as of the time of this post Electro Blue is currently 890 on the TP it’s been known to reach levels where it’s bumping shoulders with the cheaper Legendary Weapons.

I’m sure Taimi’s Dye kit which contains the dyes may return for the anniversary well at least I hope it does but I’d simply like more rotation of the dyes. No dye should be that expensive even Celestial and Shadow Abyss dyes are cheaper than the cheapest of the Electro dyes. You could even combine both of those dyes and they’d still be cheaper than the cheapest of the Electro.

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

It’s not actually a free market when the supply is controlled by one entity. It’s like claiming diamonds were a free market when the supply was (mostly) controlled by the De Beers.

Just curious – if you discovered one in your bank, would you sell it for a nominal 100g or would you sell it for as much as you can get for it?

The prices are up because the supply has dried up.

I’m sure you will be able to get them again at some point, but some people have decided that they would rather pay 800-1000g to get them now rather than wait and get them later.

The electro dyes are some of the best in the game so we’re discovering just what the market is willing to bear – and it’s quite a lot.

If you have any buy orders on electro, I’d cancel them. I have a feeling taimi dye kits are gonna return sometime during the 3rd anniversary sale.

Dreamslayer.7659:

The electro dyes are some of the best in the game so we’re discovering just what the market is willing to bear – and it’s quite a lot.

Anet is also absurdly bad at bringing things back. I understand it’s good to make things special and let them be exclusive for a couple months, but they wait wayyyy too long…

Probably on purpose to make more money from the dye pack hype.

Just as always; If you have an interest in a dye buy it close to it’s release, If not go farm for it.

Electro dyes are my favorite. I would love to see them return to the gemstore soon.

Even if I had nothing I wanted and had 10k gold lying around. . . I wouldn’t buy them from TP at the current price. o.O

Doam.8305:

No dye should be that expensive

you have one? I’ll buy it for what you think it should cost.

Mystic.5934:

Doam.8305:

No dye should be that expensive

you have one? I’ll buy it for what you think it should cost.

I’ll offer that price and a gold more!

I have to agree there is a lot lower supply of dye than there was 6 months after release and wish UI dyes still dropped from gathering.

femalehumanmeta.8351:

If you have any buy orders on electro, I’d cancel them. I have a feeling taimi dye kits are gonna return sometime during the 3rd anniversary sale.

I really hope they do, I managed to get Blue and Green and want the rest lol

people are greedy. Most of the people posting all the super expensive stuff on the TP already have plenty of gold…. but they want more. (but why?) So that they can buy more stuff and sell for even higher and hoard even more gold. etc. etc.

people are greedy.

SenorMoody.5908:

people are greedy. Most of the people posting all the super expensive stuff on the TP already have plenty of gold…. but they want more. (but why?) So that they can buy more stuff and sell for even higher and hoard even more gold. etc. etc.

people are greedy.

If someone is willing to pay that price, they will list for that price, Supply and demand, plenty of sites track what items are selling for, so you can generally guesstimate what someone will pay for a certain given item. If I had an item that was valued at 890g such as electro dye, and people HAVE paid that much for it before, you bet your kitten I’m going to list it for that price, else I’m going to undercut about 50g at a time until someone buys it.

But the buyers don’t really have a choice. Those are the prices set by the greedy ones, and they are not gonna drop.. In fact they will get even more expensive.

If the price of that dye is 1000g and remains constant. (it will be 1000g forever).

Then a non-greedy person that wants the dye would grind until they have 1000g, then buy that dye… then use it.. the end.

but the greedy people I’m referring to Already have 50,000 gold, and they Already have that dye. They don’t need it… But they buy them… they buy them all… and re-sell for even higher… for what purpose?

They already have more gold than they will ever need… but they want more.

That is the kind of disgusting greed in people I was referring to.

~

SenorMoody.5908:

But the buyers don’t really have a choice. Those are the prices set by the greedy ones, and they are not gonna drop.. In fact they will get even more expensive.

If the price of that dye is 1000g and remains constant. (it will be 1000g forever).

Then a non-greedy person that wants the dye would grind until they have 1000g, then buy that dye… then use it.. the end.

but the greedy people I’m referring to Already have 50,000 gold, and they Already have that dye. They don’t need it… But they buy them… they buy them all… and re-sell for even higher… for what purpose?

They already have more gold than they will ever need… but they want more.

That is the kind of disgusting greed in people I was referring to.

You have any sort of proof for anything you’re saying here about the people who are selling those dyes have “more gold than they will ever need”? Any flipper can tell you that flipping high priced items is a fool’s game with the 15% tax per flip. They would have to increase the price by that much per flip, 150 gold at 1000 gold, just to break even.

Posted by: John Smith source
Snip
“PS any flipper that’s attempting to make money on luxury items isn’t good at flipping. It’s a slow, dangerous, rarely-profitable way to attempt to make money (that’s why nobody does it).”

SenorMoody.5908:

But the buyers don’t really have a choice. Those are the prices set by the greedy ones, and they are not gonna drop.. In fact they will get even more expensive.

Potential buyers have the most important choice of all. The choice to not buy.

If no one pays those prices they will come down.

Ashen.2907:

SenorMoody.5908:

But the buyers don’t really have a choice. Those are the prices set by the greedy ones, and they are not gonna drop.. In fact they will get even more expensive.

Potential buyers have the most important choice of all. The choice to not buy.

If no one pays those prices they will come down.

this exactly. These are not essential items.

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

If you think the market is free and controlled by supply and demand from players, you are gullible…

Those dyes come from a dye kit that is currently not offered therefore the six unique dyes are all in limited supply. Also dye kits are RNG and therefore it may cost a lot of gems to find a particular one of the six. Part of the current price is due to the limited supply and part due to the elimination of RNG for the buyer.

I’m sure if you want say Electro Blue, it’s worth more for a sure thing than 100 gems a die roll. At a one chance in 25 for a particular dye, you still had more than a 1 in 3 chance of not getting it in 25 attempts. Right now that’s about 460 gold for a 64% chance of getting the one you want. Back when it was still offered it was 350 gems for 25 kits.

Then toss in standard law of supply and demand. We already established a low supply so the range of prices is based on a dye’s popularity.

Combine them all, discontinued supply, different demands and high cost to initially acquire the supply and you get a high price in gold.

So far, ANet has always brought back dye kits, and then prices drop fast. Wait it out. Unless having a specific color is so important you need it now. In that case, you are competing with all the other people who can’t wait either, and that’s the very definition of a seller’s market.

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

The market is, in the end, entirely controlled by anet. They could dump a trillion dyes onto the game in an instant and the prices would drop to coppers.

Anet are unlikely to do that but it does make the whole thing a MONOPOLY, not a free market.

Then I am one who doesn’t really like these colors, I have other preferences. There are also other, similar dyes available for much less.

not goign to bother quoting everything as I’ll be on for a sec

Even if the dye kit is brought back for the Anniversary it wouldn’t be in the system long enough to adjust the prices. The other items get rotated on occasion but apparently seeing how Taimi isn’t even available from a BLK Lion it isn’t one of those items.

The auction hall is flawed and designed in a way that allows for rampant increases in goods. In other games your auction hall requests will stay active for maybe 48 hours however in GW2 I haven’t noticed a limit to the amount of time an auction can be up doesn’t exist as I’ve had items up for months beck when they first introduced ascended armor so I had overpriced rare armor at the old rate sitting there for months on end apparently. The process of testing out the waters with a premium rate doesn’t exist in the sense that you see elsewhere as you simply post and forget about. If there was a limit and thus you had to pay the fee multiple times to post each time then the free market would be more in-tune. You would be able to adjust those who undercut quite a bit fast and the gears of a the free market wouldn’t be held hostage by persistent items. Anet has there Auction system set up this way so items are typically always present in the shop but it does more to increase the cost than to provide a convenience.

As for whether or not I’d post a 1000g dye for sale on the TP the answer is simple I couldn’t afford to post an item for that much currently. Only the rich can afford to costs of putting such a hefty item on the TP.

Farm SW VW Chest for a Preserved Queen Bee also worth thousands of gold is an option but like the dye that would be an item I’d use instead of sell. Well actually bank till some magic update allows the thing to be used with ascended trinkets.

For the record the last dye I purchased was Imperial Red and it was 66g at the time so I am willing to purchase dyes.

Limited quantity stuff like this is done for the purpose of enticing people to either buy keys to gamble for them or buy gems for gold to get them.

They are a money making proposition.

Annika.7084:

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

If you think the market is free and controlled by supply and demand from players, you are gullible…

Supply is not generated by the players, but the market prices are certainly controlled by player supply and demand, and is definitely a free market.

Anet gives us valueless goods (besides vendor value—which we can consider scrap value here) of which we as players are free to ascribe value. Whether or not Anet controls the supply has nothing to do with the price that players are willing to pay for it.

In the real world, if I decide to paint 10 pieces of art and sell them to an art gallery, I can set any price I want. That art gallery can then turn around and sell them for anything they want as well. They can list it for $50,000 if they want. Maybe they sell, maybe they don’t. That’s up to the purchaser to decide. How is that any different than what’s going on here?

Anet released some stupid dyes that players put stupid high prices on. They are no different than any other dye in terms of scrap value. The high price is because people want them and there is low supply. Just because Anet can randomly add more supply whenever they feel like it doesn’t change the fact it is still a free market controlled by the players. We decided they are worth hundreds of gold, not Anet. We have the choice not to purchase them if we don’t want.

If they were really worth that much the 6-8 dyes would have been sold out by now, not selling 1 every 6 months or so. Which is no doubt someone with tons of money that simply wants to collect all of the dyes.

I would love your explanation as to how the market is not player controlled nor free. I’ll have my tinfoil hat ready.

Annika.7084:

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

If you think the market is free and controlled by supply and demand from players, you are gullible…

If you think you understand what “free market” means, you are incorrect…

Doam.8305:

not goign to bother quoting everything as I’ll be on for a sec

Even if the dye kit is brought back for the Anniversary it wouldn’t be in the system long enough to adjust the prices. The other items get rotated on occasion but apparently seeing how Taimi isn’t even available from a BLK Lion it isn’t one of those items.

The auction hall is flawed and designed in a way that allows for rampant increases in goods. In other games your auction hall requests will stay active for maybe 48 hours however in GW2 I haven’t noticed a limit to the amount of time an auction can be up

Well, of course, having the ability to list and forget does mean it’s more like the real life markets for limited supply, non-perishable goods.

Where people can list something and then just wait (for months, if necessary) until it sells.

Having to relist things every two days tends to do one of two things: makes people list for lower (so they don’t have to relist), or use listing software to do the work for them.

That is probably even more unfair than what we have here, as some people won’t use the software and so will end up being constantly, instantly undercut and either have to spend too much time relisting, or take losses on their items.

But, as you rightly say, the downside is that it will tend to keep prices higher.

A middle road would be for a listing to last for, say, 2 weeks, or a month.

This would (probably) flush out overly high prices, without forcing people to spend day and night relisting stuff.

As others have said, it is (fundamentally) a supply monopoly, though, as Anet entirely control the original supply of everything.

If they wanted to crash a market, they could do so at any time (by flooding it – either themselves directly, or via the drops people receive).

Conversely, they could help bolster a market, if they wanted to, by reducing the initial supply (or even by buying up excess existing stock).

Wouldn’t even cost them anything to do so, as they also create the currency.

Serious.7083:

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

The market is, in the end, entirely controlled by anet. They could dump a trillion dyes onto the game in an instant and the prices would drop to coppers.

Anet are unlikely to do that but it does make the whole thing a MONOPOLY, not a free market.

A monopoly refers to a single entity controlling the supply, with the power to manipulate prices to their benefit. ANet doesn’t control the supply; they control the mechanics which allow players to create that supply. Further, manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

A free market is one in which buyers & sellers are able to pick & choose items and set their own offers (and further in which everyone has access to the same data).

tl;dr the TP economy of GW2 is a free market; ANet doesn’t have a monopoly in any meaningful sense of the word.

Again, for those playing along at home:

• ANet has, so far, always brought limited-edition dye kits back to the gem shop, at which point prices fall quickly.
• Anyone who wants the dye at a “reasonable” price (to them) just needs to wait for that to happen.
• Anyone who wants the dye now has to be willing to pay what others might call “unreasonable” prices, since the supply is low and the number of potential buyers is high.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Further, manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

They do, if people use real money to buy gems, to convert to gold, to buy them.

If they cost more gold to buy, Anet receives more real money.

Of course, this isn’t taking into account the possibility that, if they are very overpriced, they may sell badly and so, end up costing Anet potential money overall…

But, you get what I mean.

Tigaseye.2047:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Further, manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

They do, if people use real money to buy gems, to convert to gold, to buy them.

If they cost more gold to buy, Anet receives more real money.

Of course, this isn’t taking into account the possibility that, if they are very overpriced, they may sell badly and so, end up costing Anet potential money overall…

But, you get what I mean.

No, I don’t get what you mean. You can’t get the Taimi Dye kits today, so ANet can’t make any money off the current prices. As soon as they introduce those kits, how many people do you think are going to buy them that weren’t already planning to spend on in-game lottery tickets? Unless it’s tens of thousands of additional people, the difference isn’t enough to make it worth ANet’s time to try to second guess the market.

Or put another way, it’s a lot easier for ANet just to release limited-edition dyes for limited periods and let the TP market sort itself out. They’ll make just as much in gem sales without trying to psyche-out the community.

People forget that Taimi kits were available for a long time (and dropped from BL chests) and the colors weren’t that popular; they sold for about the same as other limited-edition colors did, while kits were available. It was only later that people decided that they really liked those specific colors and the supply dried up, driving prices up. That isn’t something ANet could have predicted based on the other limited-edition kits.

tl;dr no, ANet can’t easily make more money by doing anything different from what they did in the first place: creating lottery-type items for the gem shop and periodically changing the items for sale. Manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Serious.7083:

Oldirtbeard.9834:

Free market is free market, get over it and start farming SW Chests.

The market is, in the end, entirely controlled by anet. They could dump a trillion dyes onto the game in an instant and the prices would drop to coppers.

Anet are unlikely to do that but it does make the whole thing a MONOPOLY, not a free market.

A monopoly refers to a single entity controlling the supply, with the power to manipulate prices to their benefit. ANet doesn’t control the supply; they control the mechanics which allow players to create that supply. Further, manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

No, in this case they control the supply, they decide when it is available and what percentage of each will be supplied to the market. They can stop or start the supply at any time. The only thing they cannot do is force people to buy them.

They most certainly can make money out of high prices on the Taimi dyes, some people will buy gems, with real money, and trade those for gold if they do not have enough.

r

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Tigaseye.2047:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Further, manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

They do, if people use real money to buy gems, to convert to gold, to buy them.

If they cost more gold to buy, Anet receives more real money.

Of course, this isn’t taking into account the possibility that, if they are very overpriced, they may sell badly and so, end up costing Anet potential money overall…

But, you get what I mean.

No, I don’t get what you mean. You can’t get the Taimi Dye kits today, so ANet can’t make any money off the current prices. As soon as they introduce those kits, how many people do you think are going to buy them that weren’t already planning to spend on in-game lottery tickets? Unless it’s tens of thousands of additional people, the difference isn’t enough to make it worth ANet’s time to try to second guess the market.

Or put another way, it’s a lot easier for ANet just to release limited-edition dyes for limited periods and let the TP market sort itself out. They’ll make just as much in gem sales without trying to psyche-out the community.

People forget that Taimi kits were available for a long time (and dropped from BL chests) and the colors weren’t that popular; they sold for about the same as other limited-edition colors did, while kits were available. It was only later that people decided that they really liked those specific colors and the supply dried up, driving prices up. That isn’t something ANet could have predicted based on the other limited-edition kits.

tl;dr no, ANet can’t easily make more money by doing anything different from what they did in the first place: creating lottery-type items for the gem shop and periodically changing the items for sale. Manipulating those mechanics has zero direct benefit to ANet: they don’t make any money out of the high cost of a low-supplied item such as any of the Taimi dyes.

Um, I don’t really get where the confusion is, here?

The Taimi kits are no longer available through the gemstore, but the dyes from them are still available on the TP.

The Electro Blue one is, currently, 1069g on the TP.

So, let’s say someone really wants that dye, but doesn’t have the available gold, he may decide to buy gems with real money and then convert those gems to 1100g, so he can buy the dye.

That has made Anet more real money than if (/when) the dye was cheaper.

I’m not saying they’re intentionally manipulating anything.

Just that they do control (at the very least) the entire initial supply, the price of things on the TP does (potentially) affect their real money income and that they could manipulate the market (in many different ways – good and bad) if they so chose.

@Doam

Of course the price will drop short term. 25 dye kits are 2500 gems or roughly 500 gold now. The cheapest dye sells for 300 gold and you have a 95.9 % chance get 3 or more from 25. People will flock to it like gang busters and we’ll have a tragedy of the commons problem because they will all be undercutting each other trying to earn back at least the cost.

Within 24 hours the price on the TP will be 20% of the current one. Speculators will then buy them up and in 3 months the price will be back to where it is today or higher.

SenorMoody.5908:

But the buyers don’t really have a choice. Those are the prices set by the greedy ones, and they are not gonna drop.. In fact they will get even more expensive.

If the price of that dye is 1000g and remains constant. (it will be 1000g forever).

Then a non-greedy person that wants the dye would grind until they have 1000g, then buy that dye… then use it.. the end.

but the greedy people I’m referring to Already have 50,000 gold, and they Already have that dye. They don’t need it… But they buy them… they buy them all… and re-sell for even higher… for what purpose?

They already have more gold than they will ever need… but they want more.

That is the kind of disgusting greed in people I was referring to.

Resellers are a dirty but inevitable part of any MMO. The problem is TP stuff keeps getting more expensive while buying salvage kits and fast travel eats up a lot of one’s hard earned silver. The key is to grind…grind…and more grinding and traveling by foot (except for emergencies, like a dragon being up elsewhere) to grab some new money without it going “poof”.

All of this over frekkin’ dyes? Seriously? It’s not as if you can’t make your toon look good without the electro dyes… just get creative with other color combinations.

I swear people just want these dyes because they are expensive and rare thus special snowflake. -.-

A friend got lucky and got the electro pink dye when it was still 30g something. I offered to buy it for personal use but he held onto it. I could have got one myself but it just felt like I didn’t have to rush to buy it… months later we forgot about it… he sold it later for 650g~ while I blew my chance to use it (who the hell is gonna pay that much?!)

Dye is at 30 gold. Looks it over, naaaa. Not worth the price.
(Months pass)
Dye is at 1000 gold. OMG I have to have it now!

#lowerthedyepriceorriot

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Dye is at 30 gold. Looks it over, naaaa. Not worth the price.
(Months pass)
Dye is at 1000 gold. OMG I have to have it now!

#lowerthedyepriceorriot

No, it’s more like:

Dye is at 30 gold. “Hmmm… seems a little high for just a colour. Maybe if I wait it will become slightly cheaper?”

(months pass)

Dye is at 1000g. “OMG, this is insane, this price is never going to come down. Better go on the forum and ask Anet to re-release it.”

Seems fair enough, to me.

£100 for a colour in a game IS insane, whichever way you look at it.

Yes, you can use other fairly similar colours, but it doesn’t change that fact..

I players are still buying it, then price isn’t insane enough.

The threads will be just as funny when the Taimi kits come out again and the people holding the stock scream bloody murder at ANet making their investment “worthless”…

It’s gambling. Only the house wins.

Nike.2631:

The threads will be just as funny when the Taimi kits come out again and the people holding the stock scream bloody murder at ANet making their investment “worthless”…

It’s gambling. Only the house wins.

That’s the game with a hold and trickle release strategy. How much can you make before the market collapses when a new (or old) source is introduced.

And it’s not the house (ANet) that wins but the player base as prices plummet.

Behellagh.1468:

Nike.2631:

The threads will be just as funny when the Taimi kits come out again and the people holding the stock scream bloody murder at ANet making their investment “worthless”…

It’s gambling. Only the house wins.

That’s the game with a hold and trickle release strategy. How much can you make before the market collapses when a new (or old) source is introduced.

And it’s not the house (ANet) that wins but the player base as prices plummet.

I don’t think I could hold on to a 1000 gold dye, expecting any minute for ANet to nerf the price by releasing it again. I would be as nervous as an old maid in an asparagus patch.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Behellagh.1468:

Nike.2631:

The threads will be just as funny when the Taimi kits come out again and the people holding the stock scream bloody murder at ANet making their investment “worthless”…

It’s gambling. Only the house wins.

That’s the game with a hold and trickle release strategy. How much can you make before the market collapses when a new (or old) source is introduced.

And it’s not the house (ANet) that wins but the player base as prices plummet.

I don’t think I could hold on to a 1000 gold dye, expecting any minute for ANet to nerf the price by releasing it again. I would be as nervous as an old maid in an asparagus patch.

So you blink and sell to the current high bid or possibly start a price war by significantly undercutting the low sell price. And when the kits aren’t released and the price is now 1500 gold you become full of regret or when the kits return you laugh at those that held on too long and are now screaming bloody murder. That’s the game.