Guild Wars 2

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

MikaHR.1978:

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

Is that a fact?

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

And this ladies and gentlemen is what people do when they can’t counter an argument. They dismiss and ridicule.

Conner.4702:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

And this ladies and gentlemen is what people do when they can’t counter an argument. They dismiss and ridicule.

Right. And this is what people do when they intentionally do what they dont like even if alternatives are provided. You achieved….something.

Its pointless for him to repeat broken arguments, but as he likes to farm, i guess thats what he likes best wether he likes it or not.

MikaHR.1978:

Conner.4702:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

And this ladies and gentlemen is what people do when they can’t counter an argument. They dismiss and ridicule.

Right. And this is what people do when they intentionally do what they dont like even if alternatives are provided. You achieved….something.

Its pointless for him to repeat broken arguments, but as he likes to farm, i guess thats what he likes best wether he likes it or not.

You don’t even know what we’re talking about at this point, so this is a waste of time.

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Conner.4702:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

And this ladies and gentlemen is what people do when they can’t counter an argument. They dismiss and ridicule.

Right. And this is what people do when they intentionally do what they dont like even if alternatives are provided. You achieved….something.

Its pointless for him to repeat broken arguments, but as he likes to farm, i guess thats what he likes best wether he likes it or not.

You don’t even know what we’re talking about at this point, so this is a waste of time.

Again wrong. Its pretty obvious from your participation in the thread what youre talking about.

Yes its a waste of time.

Limited Time Event + Achievement Points + Loot = Zerg

The flavour of last week (not for all, but a zerg nontheless) was the pit of the gauntlet. Here the champions reign – now – uncontested, from what I’ve seen yesterday.

With the current structure, grouping system etc – I don’t see a solution. More instanced maps so only 20 people fit on it?

In the meantime I will continue to spray and pray, killing some invisible enemies and getting loot from them.

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

the problems with apples are problems a) to d). Here is a suggestion for a solution. NAH, LOLZ, YOU NOOB, there are oranges. Yeah, right, he cannot argue and you can reasonably.

AntiGw.9367:

I agreee This is a major design failure.

It’s not the only thing you can do in game, and for the most part it’s only temporary.

I think the devs have made clear that the Living Story will dabble in all kinds of content: dungeons, personal instances, zergs, ect. It’s good to give different players different things to do in the game.

Even though it’s not my thing personally, I’ll be glad zerging fun is there for players who want it occasionally.

It keeps the casuals happy; which is what the target market for GW2 is. Spam 1 or 2 skills and be rewarded.

If you fail; you get a medal and more rewards than if you succeed.

Algreg.3629:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

MikaHR.1978:

Knote.2904:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

Definately, I go over that a bunch in other threads. If more things were as rewarding, especially doing the events in smaller groups, things would be SO much better.

There wouldn’t even be this “OMG EVERYONE GREEDY FARMER RUINS EVENT” thing that happens.

MikaHR.1978:

Gehenna.3625:

Knote.2904:

I would love that, make dungeons as profitable as zerg farming.

Well, that’s part of the issue isn’t it. Zerg farming is what’s rewarded most. It would be fair to tell people to stick to their prefered playstyle but it is a bit odd if they are not rewarded equally.

I sitck to www. Im rewarded the most because i enjoy it the most.

In over 1000 hours of my time spent on GW2 i did maybe 10 dungeons and havent stepped in fractals.

But then i play it to enjoy myself.

We’re getting really close to this broken argument again about FUN, that’s not what this topic is about.

I also do things that I find fun, even if they’re not rewarding, but they should be. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to achieve carrots and grind for skins, that’s what this game is all about and relies on.

The condemnation of farming and farmers needs to stop.

Despite what you’re bashing me for about my stance about Zerging, it doesn’t change the fact that it comes down to poor game design, plain and simple.

Facts? rofl, one more random forum poster that thinks he is most important and his opinion count as fact.

I dont think you realize how broken your “arguments” are. Thats the problem.

So you’re saying the 4 points I posted about zergs aren’t true?

Then dont zerg. Very simple. Duh. Broken arguments and all that.

the problems with apples are problems a) to d). Here is a suggestion for a solution. NAH, LOLZ, YOU NOOB, there are oranges. Yeah, right, he cannot argue and you can reasonably.

Pretty easy and simple: if you dont like apples choose something else. If you complain and want to completely change apples TO oranges, and you have oranges right beside apples, but intentionally choose what YOU DONT LIKE, and then even go and rant about YOUR choice, well, theres a name for that rofl

It becomes more and more funny.

Calae.1738:

It keeps the casuals happy; which is what the target market for GW2 is. Spam 1 or 2 skills and be rewarded.

I’m a casual player…that doesnt play much anymore because this is what everyone is doing. Other places and instances are barren because people are doing this. The majority of my guild is doing this whenever I log on. If i wanted to be a zombie pressing the same button repeatedly with no effort or thought process, I’ll go lay on the couch and channel surf. I’ll probably get more mental stimulation from the commercials anyway.

And at this point I don’t know whats more mind-numbing……the zerging itself or the people who are whole heartedly endorsing this as an engaging gaming experience.

MrRuin.9740:

Calae.1738:

It keeps the casuals happy; which is what the target market for GW2 is. Spam 1 or 2 skills and be rewarded.

I’m a casual player…that doesnt play much anymore because this is what everyone is doing. Other places and instances are barren because people are doing this. The majority of my guild is doing this whenever I log on. If i wanted to be a zombie pressing the same button repeatedly with no effort or thought process, I’ll go lay on the couch and channel surf. I’ll probably get more mental stimulation from the commercials anyway.

And at this point I don’t know whats more mind-numbing……the zerging itself or the people who are whole heartedly endorsing this as an engaging gaming experience.

You sir get my vote! I don’t understand how people find zerging “fun” but some do so be it. I have come up with a theory that the majority of the people that claim it’s “fun” are really just doing so from a standpoint of they like getting rng loot, much like pulling on a handle from a slot machine. It’s not particularly engaging but it can potentially be rewarding.

OP gets 100 internets for the day. 150% agree.

Once, we had Guild Wars 2.
Then Ascended Wars 2
Then Grind Wars 2
Then Nerf Wars 2
Then Grind Wars 2
now Zerg Wars 2.

MrRuin.9740:

Calae.1738:

It keeps the casuals happy; which is what the target market for GW2 is. Spam 1 or 2 skills and be rewarded.

I’m a casual player…that doesnt play much anymore because this is what everyone is doing. Other places and instances are barren because people are doing this. The majority of my guild is doing this whenever I log on. If i wanted to be a zombie pressing the same button repeatedly with no effort or thought process, I’ll go lay on the couch and channel surf. I’ll probably get more mental stimulation from the commercials anyway.

And at this point I don’t know whats more mind-numbing……the zerging itself or the people who are whole heartedly endorsing this as an engaging gaming experience.

I made a post about this exact thing. These LS events take people out of WvW, dungeons, other zones, and zerg in pavilion or invasions.

I don’t want to say it is time to look for a new game completely..not yet. But maybe its worth considering.

We need to all get together and sing a few rounds of “Old McDonald Had A Farm”. {:-þ

Im Mudbone.1437:

We need to all get together and sing a few rounds of “Old McDonald Had A Farm”. {:-þ

And Guild Wars was his name-o

oh wait..wrong song.

ShadowPuppet.3746:

people that claim it’s “fun” are really just doing so from a standpoint of they like getting rng loot, much like pulling on a handle from a slot machine. It’s not particularly engaging but it can potentially be rewarding.

This is the other huge point I fail to understand about this zerging trend.
People go on incessantly about RNG. RNG cashshop. RNG chests. RNG drops.
Zerging is RNG put to the max, you’re getting RNG drops and chests/bags both from these champ zergs…..and this same population is feeding more and more into it.
We don’t want RNG, but we are going to farm it in the most mindless way possible and claim to love it like there’s no tomorrow?

MrRuin.9740:

ShadowPuppet.3746:

people that claim it’s “fun” are really just doing so from a standpoint of they like getting rng loot, much like pulling on a handle from a slot machine. It’s not particularly engaging but it can potentially be rewarding.

This is the other huge point I fail to understand about this zerging trend.
People go on incessantly about RNG. RNG cashshop. RNG chests. RNG drops.
Zerging is RNG put to the max, you’re getting RNG drops and chests/bags both from these champ zergs…..and this same population is feeding more and more into it.
We don’t want RNG, but we are going to farm it in the most mindless way possible and claim to love it like there’s no tomorrow?

I don’t care about the crap for drops, I enjoy the huge mobs of people and baddies to squish and the gold.

First off you can perhaps lower your detail and post processing, less shinies and so forth and you can see the character models better. It’s a massive fight, and really this is what you would expect to see.

What perhaps should happen is that there should be content for Solo or small groups where these same characters can be fought. Of course, at a much scaled down and toned down level of difficulty.

I think that’s what GW2 is missing, and I’m surprised since the ability to scale encounters seems to be there.

However, once there are 30 or 40 players at once, I’m not sure how much animation etc. you are going to see.

I would also like a UI indication of attack telegraphs as well. However, I think at first people thought this was a “feature”. I think they can make UI based telegraphs optional.

azureai.9764:

AntiGw.9367:

I agreee This is a major design failure.

It’s not the only thing you can do in game, and for the most part it’s only temporary.

I think the devs have made clear that the Living Story will dabble in all kinds of content: dungeons, personal instances, zergs, ect. It’s good to give different players different things to do in the game.

Even though it’s not my thing personally, I’ll be glad zerging fun is there for players who want it occasionally.

I’m saying that in the context of the OP’s list.

They could have designed the boss fights so that his attacks are not obscured by a holocaust of particle effects, his AI would encourage more challenging and varied skill use instead of spamming ranged 1 skill (because even as a guardian I end up using my scepter) etc.

cesmode.4257:

OP gets 100 internets for the day. 150% agree.

Once, we had Guild Wars 2.
Then Ascended Wars 2
Then Grind Wars 2
Then Nerf Wars 2
Then Grind Wars 2
now Zerg Wars 2.

TBH It was Zerg Wars 2 from the start hehe. =p

Astewart.8415:

First off you can perhaps lower your detail and post processing, less shinies and so forth and you can see the character models better. It’s a massive fight, and really this is what you would expect to see.

What perhaps should happen is that there should be content for Solo or small groups where these same characters can be fought. Of course, at a much scaled down and toned down level of difficulty.

I think that’s what GW2 is missing, and I’m surprised since the ability to scale encounters seems to be there.

However, once there are 30 or 40 players at once, I’m not sure how much animation etc. you are going to see.

I would also like a UI indication of attack telegraphs as well. However, I think at first people thought this was a “feature”. I think they can make UI based telegraphs optional.

Yeah I had some of my settings on in that screenie, but they wouldn’t make a difference anyway, unless they add a way to cull particle effects.

I would propose people making up events that would defy human nature and make people spread out over things they want to do.

What would work is to bring back mob tagging. Only one person gets loot from the mob they defeated. No more working together, just you and a mob.

But really, zerging is always going to happen within a social MMO, always. You can’t design around it, without bringing back mob tagging. What you could do is letting mobs don’t have drops at all as well, and let everyone get their share of drops from completing the event.

ANd even then, Zerging is still the easiest to play. More people means you dont need to do that much.

One thing, which I haven’t experienced, but I heard from others, is the Champion Risen Jester in Orr killing whole zergs and that people had a whole lot of fun with that. And that is still with zergs.

But other than that, there is nothing that can make zerging not a valuable thing, because events happen at a specific moment in time instead of like quests happen when a player activates them for their own character.

What you guys are asking is unreasonable as you would restructure the whole game and it’s reward structure. There’s little you can do to design around it.

For future events, what needs to happen is to only use champions that don’t have champion loot. (silvers) And even then the fact that all mobs drop for everyone n a shared fashion will make people form a zerg. You’re safer in a zerg, you don’t have to think.

Oh and when you do deviate from the zerg like sometimes happened in the crown pavilion, and by any chance killed the other boss, you could prepare yourself for loads and loads of rage from the other people.

I haven’t seen any people at all in-game that are like, let’s take on balthazar with only 5-15 people. In all EU servers anyway Balthazar is NEVER up. Because it’s “too hard”. No one, none, not anyone. People don’t want harder content, they want an easy time and get easy loot. Now good luck designing for that. (And then came tribulation mode SAB and everyone cried their socks off. lol I already see the rage coming)

Im Mudbone.1437:

MrRuin.9740:

ShadowPuppet.3746:

people that claim it’s “fun” are really just doing so from a standpoint of they like getting rng loot, much like pulling on a handle from a slot machine. It’s not particularly engaging but it can potentially be rewarding.

This is the other huge point I fail to understand about this zerging trend.
People go on incessantly about RNG. RNG cashshop. RNG chests. RNG drops.
Zerging is RNG put to the max, you’re getting RNG drops and chests/bags both from these champ zergs…..and this same population is feeding more and more into it.
We don’t want RNG, but we are going to farm it in the most mindless way possible and claim to love it like there’s no tomorrow?

I don’t care about the crap for drops, I enjoy the huge mobs of people and baddies to squish and the gold.

You get the gold from the rng drops……
It is rewarding quantity over quality, all the current design system requires of you in these huge fights is that you show up and hit the mobs to get tags and credit for participation and in many cases it does not matter if you even complete the event. It does not push the envelope so to speak in terms of engaging you in the actual fight and it makes a already fairly shallow combat experience all the more shallow because of it.

Im Mudbone.1437:

I don’t care about the crap for drops, I enjoy the huge mobs of people and baddies to squish and the gold.

The intention may be there, but its not happening.
Cause again, I could go watch TV and take comfort in the fact millions of other people are watching the same show at the same time and as a group we are contributing to the shows further success and subsequent episodes. Otherwise, we do not interact, do not communicate, do have anything else to stimulate or further enhance the experience. I am having the same amount of interaction with those people as I am with those in a GW2 zerg.
MMO is a stretch of the terminology in a case like zergs. Its more like a single player game that just happens to have other people playing at the same time, but you have nothing to do with them and no interaction has any effect at all. All people have to do is show up and be present for the continuation, much like people just have to tune to the same channel. Whee.

MrRuin.9740:

Im Mudbone.1437:

I don’t care about the crap for drops, I enjoy the huge mobs of people and baddies to squish and the gold.

The intention may be there, but its not happening.
Cause again, I could go watch TV and take comfort in the fact millions of other people are watching the same show at the same time and as a group we are contributing to the shows further success and subsequent episodes. Otherwise, we do not interact, do not communicate, do have anything else to stimulate or further enhance the experience. I am having the same amount of interaction with those people as I am with those in a GW2 zerg.
MMO is a stretch of the terminology in a case like zergs. Its more like a single player game that just happens to have other people playing at the same time, but you have nothing to do with them and no interaction has any effect at all. All people have to do is show up and be present for the continuation, much like people just have to tune to the same channel. Whee.

Exactly. It’s definately ironic, and tricks a lot of people into thinking it’s “social” when it’s not.

Not compared to going out in the world in Everquest (old school) and grouping up with others and actually socializing.

I had hoped the spontaneous open grouping-ness of events would spark that randomly gained friendship but it doesn’t, because there is no teamwork, no need for teamwork and teamwork isn’t rewarded (in fact is punished), thus nothing social ever comes from it.

If the rewards were shifted in a way that rewarded teamwork and punished selfish gameplay it’d be a totally different story.

GW2 in a nutshell….

Log in, whack a few trees, kill some monsters for their loot, cross 2 items off your laundry list for the day….

Zergs are fun though how can you deny what GW2 gameplay is all about? Go play SWTOR or WoW if you want complicated mechanics with micro-management. This is a new era for MMOs, this is Gw2.

“I don’t like playing with a lot of people. It’s not fun when all my friends are on at the same time.”

“We should only limit guilds to 25 people max, that way when we do guild events the party is smaller and the gameplay is more rewarding/challenging.”

“There’s a bunch of people participating in something? I’m totally NOT going to be interested in what’s developing over there.”

…said nobody, ever.

I play this game to play with other people. The more people, the better. I don’t give a kitten about the loots and the golds.

Maybe making these things more challenging for large groups, or rather, scaling the difficulty appropriately, would be a better solution.

-PM

Superfast.5901:

Zergs are fun though how can you deny what GW2 gameplay is all about? Go play SWTOR or WoW if you want complicated mechanics with micro-management. This is a new era for MMOs, this is Gw2.

Zergs are fun at times and as far as micromanagement I’d love to be able to micromanage my kitten pet.

Superfast.5901:

Zergs are fun though how can you deny what GW2 gameplay is all about? Go play SWTOR or WoW if you want complicated mechanics with micro-management. This is a new era for MMOs, this is Gw2.

Or we could have both and let people play w/e they want when they feel like it.

I don’t hate zerging, I hate when zerging is the only option for money or current events.

MrRuin.9740:

The problem is these massive amounts of people don’t interact. They dont socialize, theres no reason for them to coordinate, no reason to help each other out, no strategy, no reason to learn anything at all.
If there ware different mechanics involved, it would likely be a different story, where the masses had to coordinate and use strategy, bring people together to work for a common goal.
Zerging has none of this. Zerging promotes anti-social behavior, where the goal is just make sure you press 1 quick enough to get auto-attacking on the mob to get credit before it dies.

I fully agree with you. But at the same time I am pretty sure that this is what like 90% of the MMO playerbase wants.

Just imagine these encounters required team work and coordination. I bet the forums would explode.

No, sorry, the modern MMO player prefers solo play and the online part is only for showing off.

No, sorry, the modern MMO player prefers solo play and the online part is only for showing off.

This will get old very fast.

If this is the best that Anet can do they’re going to be in trouble at some point. The MMO crowd is hungry for something new and innovative; you can tell from the ups and downs of these massive budget MMO’s that have been release in the past 5 years.

It’s nice to see Anet succeed but; I fear it’s because there’s nothing better at the moment. That doesn’t mean that it’s good.

How to fix zerging for both PvE and WvW,

Remove unlimited shared loot and rewards.

Been saing it from day 1.

Perhaps make it so that only 1 parties worth of people will be rewarded for a champ kill for example.

Something like this would either completely eliminate zerg play, or make it significantly more engaging than it is now.

Reikou.7068:

How to fix zerging for both PvE and WvW,

Remove unlimited shared loot and rewards.

Been saing it from day 1.

Perhaps make it so that only 1 parties worth of people will be rewarded for a champ kill for example.

Something like this would either completely eliminate zerg play, or make it significantly more engaging than it is now.

How would you deal with champ camping? Something that would very likely happen.
Or do you mean we should all just whack on the champ and then hope that we get anything? Like the RNG before the RNG? Sounds more frustrating at the moment (if I understand you correctly).

Professor Marvel.7584:

“I don’t like playing with a lot of people. It’s not fun when all my friends are on at the same time.”

“We should only limit guilds to 25 people max, that way when we do guild events the party is smaller and the gameplay is more rewarding/challenging.”

“There’s a bunch of people participating in something? I’m totally NOT going to be interested in what’s developing over there.”

…said nobody, ever.

I play this game to play with other people. The more people, the better. I don’t give a kitten about the loots and the golds.

Maybe making these things more challenging for large groups, or rather, scaling the difficulty appropriately, would be a better solution.

-PM

Its not the amount of people, or that people do it together. Noones advocating solo play or reduced player input.
Its that all these people have no need to interact, noone does anything significant, all you have to do is show up. You got it right at the end. They need to be made more challenging. Not just scaled upwards in difficulty, which ultimately means just more HP. Give all these people a reason to work together and to interact. Give them more to do than spam the 1 key and run to the next mob.

Superfast.5901:

Zergs are fun though how can you deny what GW2 gameplay is all about? Go play SWTOR or WoW if you want complicated mechanics with micro-management. This is a new era for MMOs, this is Gw2.

If this is a new era of MMO’s, the genre will go stagnant and die very quickly. A market flooded with games where all they need is bosses with massive amounts of HP that all players have to do is rush and press 1? Yeah, that’ll last a long time.
Who wants micro-management? Is there no middle ground between the overly complicated and zombie-like gameplay?
Noones asking for WoW mechanics. Noones asking for super complicated. I’d just like to have more to do with this new content.
I can go into an event with my all exotic/ascended Guardian and do zerg farming. Alternatively, I can also strip my elementalist naked to wearing no gear at all and do the same thing with little to no difference in the effect or reward of participating. This is a major flaw in gameplay design.

Maybe Anet should make both zerg related content and instanced related content for like 5 player teams. oh wait.

Rouven.7409:

Reikou.7068:

How to fix zerging for both PvE and WvW,

Remove unlimited shared loot and rewards.

Been saing it from day 1.

Perhaps make it so that only 1 parties worth of people will be rewarded for a champ kill for example.

Something like this would either completely eliminate zerg play, or make it significantly more engaging than it is now.

How would you deal with champ camping? Something that would very likely happen.
Or do you mean we should all just whack on the champ and then hope that we get anything? Like the RNG before the RNG? Sounds more frustrating at the moment (if I understand you correctly).

What is there there to “deal with” regardin champ camping?

You should all whack the champ and the top 5 contributors would get rewarded. Want loot? Up your game. Simple as that.

Reikou.7068:

What is there there to “deal with” regardin champ camping?

You should all whack the champ and the top 5 contributors would get rewarded. Want loot? Up your game. Simple as that.

Ah – I was thinking in regards of mob tagging, aka greyed out for the others.

Seriously, that would not work here. The whole system with combo fields, buffs etc.

No thanks, there have to be better ways.

Reikou.7068:

What is there there to “deal with” regardin champ camping?

You should all whack the champ and the top 5 contributors would get rewarded. Want loot? Up your game. Simple as that.

Maybe not this extreme, but I’m starting to think something like this needs to be added, and not just to zergs.
Maybe you get less of a reward for your mob tagging that gets you a bronze in events. No chance of exotic or certain level stuff. Want the good stuff, earn a gold.
Still doesn’t fix the mindlessness of zergs, but would prevent leeching and going a_f_k (edit: seriously this kitten filter is a bit too sensitive)

Something similar should apply to world events, IMO. People who loiter in the swamp, won’t do pre-events (some of whom also complain in map chat how long the pre-events are taking other people to do), whack behemoth a couple times and get the same as those who ran to all 3 portal locations outside the swamp, for example. You do less, you should get less.

I remember when I first heard about public quests, around when WAR was in beta.

I thought, “Wow, what a great idea! I’ll never be friendless in an MMORPG again! I’ll make myself a skilled contributor and everyone will want to associate with me.”

Things sure have changed. From there, to Rift, to here, to FF14ARR I’ve yet to be anything but another face in the crowd going 1111111111 and desperately trying to tag stuff.

The manifesto promised more than this. C’mon guys.

MrRuin.9740:

Maybe not this extreme,

Definitely not that extreme.

MrRuin.9740:

but I’m starting to think something like this needs to be added, and not just to zergs.
Maybe you get less of a reward for your mob tagging that gets you a bronze in events. No chance of exotic or certain level stuff. Want the good stuff, earn a gold.
Still doesn’t fix the mindlessness of zergs, but would prevent leeching and going a_f_k (edit: seriously this kitten filter is a bit too sensitive)

Something similar should apply to world events, IMO. People who loiter in the swamp, won’t do pre-events (some of whom also complain in map chat how long the pre-events are taking other people to do), whack behemoth a couple times and get the same as those who ran to all 3 portal locations outside the swamp, for example. You do less, you should get less.

Totally agree with this. A person’s reward should reflect contribution, both in regards to any given fight or event, as well as the state of the world that comes as a result. Tag n’ run behavior should go completely unrewarded, those who stuck around for the whole fight should be getting the best rewards, and everyone in between should be rewarded as it reflects their contribution.

In terms of WvW, there will ALWAYS be zerging … what’s better then a small army? a larger army (5 times the size!)! Please dont give the crap about, “but my smaller group is more skilled then the larger group”… yeah sure, previous guild, we could do 1:3 (20 to 60, not too bad) ratio when zerging and we would come out alive. But really when the ratio becomes 1:4 (20 to 80) or 1:5 (20 to 100) or 1:6 (20 to 120)… skilled players will start to get crushed by just sheer numbers.

MrRuin.9740:

Reikou.7068:

What is there there to “deal with” regardin champ camping?

You should all whack the champ and the top 5 contributors would get rewarded. Want loot? Up your game. Simple as that.

Maybe not this extreme, but I’m starting to think something like this needs to be added, and not just to zergs.
Maybe you get less of a reward for your mob tagging that gets you a bronze in events. No chance of exotic or certain level stuff. Want the good stuff, earn a gold.
Still doesn’t fix the mindlessness of zergs, but would prevent leeching and going a_f_k (edit: seriously this kitten filter is a bit too sensitive)

Something similar should apply to world events, IMO. People who loiter in the swamp, won’t do pre-events (some of whom also complain in map chat how long the pre-events are taking other people to do), whack behemoth a couple times and get the same as those who ran to all 3 portal locations outside the swamp, for example. You do less, you should get less.

No, that’s the opposite of what needs to happen.

Increasing the competition that already exists (tagging) is rewarding selfish gameplay even more than it already does, that’s a horrible idea.

Champs/events should just be made more difficult so you CAN’T just sit there with auto attack on and afk, and if you want your rewards you’re going to have to do as much as you can to help beat it, which means teamwork. Everyone sitting there with auto attack on no matter how many people shouldn’t suffice, should atleast have to move and dodge aoe’s enough that’s it’s pretty active, and support/rezzing people becomes important.

Here’s an example, the big Centaur event chain in Harathi that ends up with a pretty tough boss mob that chucks fireballs and aoe’s that hurt really really hard, you actually need some teamwork with the random people there to beat him, constantly rezzing people and doing your best to avoid getting downed from the aoe’s or fireballs when he targets you, while keeping your dps up.

Tagging isn’t an issue with that fight, and the reward only come after you can finally beat him and get his loot + the chest, there is no other weak champs or regular mobs spawning constantly for people to farm so they can get tons of loot even if they fail.. No, if you can’t beat him, you get NOTHING, thus if you want loot you have to work together and beat a tough boss.

That’s how it should be. Compared to say Grenth chain, I remember doing it back in november when it was great because it spawned a crap load of mobs for loot, and that’s all that mattered, who cares if you beat it? If you lose it restarts and you get to farm even more mobs. That’s an example of how it SHOULDN’T be.

The game rewards failing too much because all the loot is tied to mob drops and tagging, and in term encourages everyone to be selfish.

I’m also against zerg play, but I disagree with one of your points.

Knote.2904:

1. No meaningful difficulty will ever be present in a fight.

I don’t think this is so. With thoughtful design and other constraints on encounters, even world bosses can be challenging if they give enough tasks for players to do that are necessary for event success. Proper enemy scaling that includes new skills (or new enemies) that are better at dealing with massive amounts of players that don’t pay attention will also help. Making it so player attack don’t affect the bosses unless certain conditions are met will further add strategy to the encounters. Limiting zone player cap size can also help (i.e., the size needed before creating an overflow). Unfortunately the overflow system does not retain the state of the zone, so this is an undesirable option for many reasons.

I agree the events aren’t challenging ¹, but I don’t think this to be an unsolvable problem, just an engineering problem in need of a solution. Whether or not Arena Net has the creative and technical resources available to solve it, I can’t say.

¹ – Though some do fail even with a zerg, like the risen priest of grenth event.