The need to post balance changes in advance

The need to post balance changes in advance

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Posted by: Ilias.8647

Ilias.8647

Hey folk!

Tomorrow is the big day! Summer Quarterly Update is almost upon us bringing LS3 and presumably some balance changes. Of course lots of attention goes to LS3 with every right to it but regarding the balance changes we have no list or whatever to know what is coming.

Communities should be informed way earlier about the planned changes, not to have a hundred of QQ posts (you have these no matter what) BUT to have some player feedback on the coming changes. We got no Public Test server or something, at least announce the planned changes a month or two weeks prior to the patch.

This has been discussed a dozen times before but I see little progress in it. I don’t know what the devs get by not announcing upcoming balance changes but we may be spared some of the fuss of the changes “into the wrong direction”. As they do it now, any “unfortunate change” will just go live and stay for the next 3 months.

Currently residing on … Gandara[EU]

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Posted by: TexZero.7910

TexZero.7910

The last time the community had a say in design, DH traps got a 30% damage buff, and extra boons.

Pretty sure the community regretted that shortly after launch.

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Posted by: BrotherBelial.3094

BrotherBelial.3094

The last time the community had a say in design, DH traps got a 30% damage buff, and extra boons.

Pretty sure the community regretted that shortly after launch.

Not really, DH or not that hard to beat on there own, have 2-3 DH on a team, and it get a little harder, but that’s only if you team are dumb and stand in the traps, there are a few skills that let you set off the traps but take no damage from them, that then means the DH’s are at a big disadvantage.

I personally don’t think we need a heads up, people will complain no matter what, and ANet could always change there mind about something. Then you get the “you lied to us ANet” posts.

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Posted by: cranos.5913

cranos.5913

The last time the community had a say in design, DH traps got a 30% damage buff, and extra boons.

Pretty sure the community regretted that shortly after launch.

DH problems were hardly a community created problem. The whole elite spec is trash.

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Posted by: Ilias.8647

Ilias.8647

I personally don’t think we need a heads up, people will complain no matter what, and ANet could always change there mind about something. Then you get the “you lied to us ANet” posts.

ANet won’t be the first company/developer that would do that, so they don’t have to “re-invent the wheel”. Pre-release patch notes usually are subject to change and devs would have the freedom and last word altering them, change something or not include a change at all.

The best thing would be to have a Test Server and make changes there so people can’t experience them and find if something feels wrong. But since they don’t want to adopt the “test server solution” at least having a heads-up. Its not about people complains. Complains will always be there no matter what, pre or post patch!

Thing is that sometimes devs make some changes that are simply wrong (or at least wrong implemented) and you have to live with that for at least 3 months before a tweak/revert happens. Listening to people who are able to provide serious feedback could relieve them of much effort making changes and then revert them back… or worse!

Still all these are theory! Tomorrow is the day and lets hope that what changes are to be made are well though and won’t be reasons for more needless reverts/changes in the Autumn Quarterly Update!!!

Currently residing on … Gandara[EU]

(edited by Ilias.8647)

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Posted by: Raine.1394

Raine.1394

Preferring to delay disappointment, I vote for no advance notice of balance changes.

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Posted by: Ranael.6423

Ranael.6423

The thing is that patch content, for the biggest part, is decided between 3 to 4 weeks ahead of launch from what I understand from previous dev posts. This seems to be the required time for localization and QA testings.
If players would be required to react to proposed changes it should then be done way earlier, a schedule that would lead people to actually wonder why it is taking so much time and create communications issues and I am not sure we need more of those.
About the testing, they test their changes, but not with everyone. It’s like Raid testing, it is done with few people, to be sure to not have too much noise in the feedbacks.

I think a PTS would be bad for the majority of players, because it would increase the release frequency a lot. And since really few people understand what balance mean and are able to have a required exterior view on it I am really not sure that it would increase the quality of said balance changes to ask everyone.
They certainly could preview the balance changes like they used to but I think that people would not understand (and they actually did not when the preview were made) that their feedback is mostly for after release than before.

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Posted by: Aidan Savage.2078

Aidan Savage.2078

A PTS is worse than you think for other ideas Ranael. People never test the new content for bugs or glitches like they should. They test it to see how to make their characters better, or seek out ways that the upcoming patch will effect the economy and then take steps to capitalize on it. Remember when they changed the insignia requirements to include leather? Imagine if someone noticed that because of a PTS and successfully bought out the entire supply, or a good 10-20 thousand pieces of t6 leather on the market? The amount of money they’d make off that action is astronomical.

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Posted by: mrauls.6519

mrauls.6519

Instead of previews, I wish AN would communicate on the profession forums more often. If I saw about 3 red posts in the Guardian forum biweekly, I would be very happy. I feel that AN has stopped talking about professions openly. They talk among themselves, then implement changes.

Mes (Guardian)
I make PvP & WvW videos

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Posted by: Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

Communities should be informed way earlier about the planned changes, not to have a hundred of QQ posts (you have these no matter what) BUT to have some player feedback on the coming changes.

What for? It’s not like they’d listen to those anyway.

Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

ANet sometimes offers pre-patch balance notes, sometimes not. There are always massive numbers of complaints. I don’t see that changing. The only way that early notification would work is ANet offered to discuss the types of changes they are considering and asked for feedback. A week ahead of a scheduled release isn’t enough time to do more than tweak the numbers on changes that they are going to make.

Regarding test servers: ANet has already commented on this. Public test servers turn out to be more work than anyone expects and deliver less value. They essentially make it easier for participants to get good sooner than everyone else, without generating the important feedback folks hope for. In other words, too much work, not enough value.

Short story: as much as I’d like to get patch notes ahead of time, I don’t think ANet must do so and I’m not convinced it would make things better.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Ilias.8647

Ilias.8647

If we are to accept in advance that ANet won’t listen, that the balance patch will be garbage making balance even worse then… no, neither patch not a test server or anything else would help. If people really believe what they write I wonder why they keep up playing the game (not to mention why they check these forums?).

Maybe you are right, notifying in advance or a Test Server might not help in avoiding changes in the wrong direction. But I don’t think that devs aren’t listening. Maybe the communication is slow and clunky and changing things around takes time but I can’t say that devs are not listening. Still, the issue is still here! There are changes that are obviously in the wrong direction and stuff that are wrong and doesn’t get fixed in a timely manner.

I hope ANet could do some progress without any player getting involved but I don’t see it. As I said earlier, lets just hope that this time there will be less mistakes that we ’ll have to live with for another 3 months!

Currently residing on … Gandara[EU]

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Posted by: CynicalFred.9135

CynicalFred.9135

The reason they don’t want the community to have a say is 1) to avoid stupid changes being advocated for 2) to be able to cleanly proceede with changes they think/know are required while the community can’t see it (remember when the champ train in queensdale went away) 3) to see if people even notice. Some changes can sorta just slip by and you find yourself wondering when X changed or if it’s always been like that or simply when the game started running more smoothly.

Do i think they absolutely 1000% should post the changes beforehand? kitten strait. Do i think they will? Probably not, on account of the reasons listed above and because it’s easier to just make changes and change it back if it goes poorly without the wrath of the community at large being involved, even if (imo) community wrath is a good thing and community feedback is paramount. Ultimately they seem to have taken on the “it’s our game and if you don’t like it leave” philosophy…. We’ll see how far that gets them.