Guild Wars 2

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

idk…..boosters&trading gems for gold,you do the rest

Serv.6073:

How are non gem buyers supposed to compete with players who buy gems? I feel gw2 is becoming another mmo where you have to pay to real life money to be the best or grind until you are dead.

You need none of those shinies to “compete” as you put it. You can make your character look awesome without the extra fluff, so even the “looks competition” is fair.

The grind is minimal, because the grindiest items are not necessary to enjoy the game. No one needs legendaries, or even Ascended gear in order to play this game-even low level Fractals are doable, so you wouldn’t be missing much by not having these grindy items you are complaining about.

Finally, I doubt most people buy gems with $$$ for their in-game stuff, plus it’s fair for them to do with the money whatever they want, for better or worse. It’s not THAT hard to make gold as of now, and I say so as a player who have not even ever hit one hundred pieces.

The best way to enjoy GW2 is to play the game, rather than grind for items, though some players find the grind fun, which is also valid for them.

No offense intended, though.

The only boosters that matter are WXP boosters, and they don’t make that much of a difference given how fast you can farm wxp in a karma train before reset.
Gold is a non-issue, as there’s no statistical improvement by getting higher-priced exotics, and ascended things are account-bound and unpurchasable.

Serv.6073:

idk…..boosters&trading gems for gold,you do the rest

I’ve never bought boosters and I have stacks of at least three of each kind (and up to 6 of some) sitting in my bank. They’re readily available in game.

So selling gems for gold nets them more gold- but it’s not hard to make money in game. It’s really not a huge advantage.

Xae Isareth.1364:

I suppose you can fork out what would buy you a good new PC for a Legendary but who the heck would want to do that?

You’d be surprised actually, this happens already in lots of MMOs.

Kozume.9035:

Xae Isareth.1364:

I suppose you can fork out what would buy you a good new PC for a Legendary but who the heck would want to do that?

You’d be surprised actually, this happens already in lots of MMOs.

Even if that happens, a legendary isn’t a huge power buff. It’s mainly for the visual appeal. All the content can be completed in rares, really.

Kozume.9035:

Xae Isareth.1364:

I suppose you can fork out what would buy you a good new PC for a Legendary but who the heck would want to do that?

You’d be surprised actually, this happens already in lots of MMOs.

If someone wants to spend 400 pounds or more on pixels, I’m quite happy for them to ‘be the best’.

As other people have said there is nothing you can buy that actually gives you an advantage.

You don’t even need to use gold to get the best equipment. You can get exotic armor with karma, ascended accessories with laurels and you can’t buy ascended weapons even if you wanted to. (Except legendaries and those cost so much it’s not worth doing unless you’re actually a millionaire and can afford to spend a few hundred pounds/euros/dollars on one.)

Other than that it’s all cosmetics and then ‘best’ is a matter of opinion. But again you have a lot of options that don’t require gold. All the armor sets I like for example come from dungeons and have to be bought with tokens, gold won’t help you.

Sure there’s boosters in the gem store but they give you a very minor advantage. You can also get them from several places in-game. I’ve got an entire row of them in my bank and honestly I only use them to get rid of them. The tiny bonuses they give usually aren’t worth the hassle of going to get them from the bank.

Serv.6073:

How are non gem buyers supposed to compete with players who buy gems? I feel gw2 is becoming another mmo where you have to pay with real life money to be the best or grind until you are dead.

Have you played GW2? Or any MMO that actually is pay-to-win? Or one that has excessive grind?

I have 5 lvl80 characters (a recent 6th started), all in exotics, most in Ascended orns/trinkets, 6 Ascended weapons, and skinned the way I like them. I don’t play excessively, sometimes only 2 or 3 hours a day. Know how much I charged? $10, once. And that was to just buy a new character slot.
Of all the flaws or problems you could have with GW2, this one is confusing as GW2 IMO (from experience with actual pay-to-win MMO’s), is about as far from being pay-to-win as a b2p/f2p MMO can get without getting rid of gem-exchange completely.

Ascended tier are mostly all account-bound (some basic mats are not, but buying these out when you need to get other account-bound stuff still holds you back, so you’re not really gaining much of an advantage)

Cashshop is all fluff, luxury and conveniences. Nothing in there gives anyone an advantage of any kind, unless you count prettiness as a game-breaking advantage.

He asked if you’ve played GW2, not if you’ve purchased it. ;P (Of course, he’s joking.)

In seriousness, of all the reasonable complaints to have about GW2, pay-to-win just doesn’t feel like one of them. Everything but ascended gear is reasonably obtainable without grinding for cash, and with ascended gear, money will only get you so far in crafting weapons. (And won’t help at all with trinkets.)

Heck, even with the best gear straight money can buy (exotic armor/trinkets, legendary weapons,) a player with a lot of gold isn’t going to be very far ahead of a regular player in…exotic armor/trinkets and weapons. Skills is going to be the deciding factor there much more than wealth.

Psst: It’s not a competition.

If you want Pay2Win go to Rift, there you can buy a full epic set for just as low as 500 Euros!

Seriously, the Shop in GW2 is very nice, it offers alot of convenience and there is nothing unbalancing or overpowering you could get out of the gemshop.

Sure you can convert gems to gold so you could aquire ingame stuff. But it does not take very long to actually get the stuff with ingame means. Look at exotics, you can get a good set of items for what 100 gold? Thats easily doable in a few hours of gameplay. (Or a bit market trading on the TP)

There are no real inhibitors, look again at Rift, I have startet Rift again because it went free to play and its horrid how Pay2Win it has become.

You can only get dungeon gear very slow, there is a once per day limit to get dungeon marks for dungeon gear (there is no real limitation like that in GW2, sure you get less if you perma run the dungeon, but you still get some marks, in Rift you get none after that 1 run per day (for all dungeons))

After playing Rift again for a while, I have to say that GW2 is absolutely not Pay2Win and the shop is the most unobstrusive I have seen in any f2p game so far.

I don’t even know anybody who buys gems, it’s more a matter of how can players who have real lives compete with ‘hardcores’ whose 24/7 farming constantly damages the economy?

OP brought up a valid complaint, that people that don’t buy gems can’t compete in gold purchases, and everyone suddenly starts talking about cosmetics and ‘endgame’ and exotics.

This is the current state of the game. Unless you get incredulously lucky in drops, or grind all day it is impossible to be better off versus players that transfer from gems to gold. Even then, players that convert to gold can compete better than you in farming because they can buy ectos for the luck salvage.

If you guys are trying to look like corporate shills, then congratulations, you succeeded.

Conncept.7638:

I don’t even know anybody who buys gems, it’s more a matter of how can players who have real lives compete with ‘hardcores’ whose 24/7 farming constantly damages the economy?

Isn’t that in every game?

bravoart.5308:

OP brought up a valid complaint, that people that don’t buy gems can’t compete in gold purchases, and everyone suddenly starts talking about cosmetics and ‘endgame’ and exotics.

This is the current state of the game. Unless you get incredulously lucky in drops, or grind all day it is impossible to win versus players that transfer from gems to gold. Even then, players that convert to gold can compete better than you in farming because they can buy ectos for the luck salvage.

If you guys are trying to look like corporate shills, then congratulations, you succeeded.

The question is, what are you trying to compete on?

Stats? You can’t buy Ascended gear.

Looks? Its quite subjective (personally I think reinforced plate is the best looking armor top in the game).

His question is actually valid. There’s no way anybody with any grasp of how the game actually functions, should believe you can pay for power. For the handful of people that care to spend hundreds of dollars to buy their legendary, sure, they just bought a tiny boost for 1 weapon, grats.

bravoart.5308:

OP brought up a valid complaint, that people that don’t buy gems can’t compete in gold purchases, and everyone suddenly starts talking about cosmetics and ‘endgame’ and exotics.

It’s not a valid complaint, because it’s based on a false premise — that you need to be rich to ‘compete’ in the first place. Gear makes less of a difference in this game than in any I’ve played going back to the days of DOS single player RPGs.

bravoart.5308:

OP brought up a valid complaint, that people that don’t buy gems can’t compete in gold purchases, and everyone suddenly starts talking about cosmetics and ‘endgame’ and exotics.

This is the current state of the game. Unless you get incredulously lucky in drops, or grind all day it is impossible to be better off versus players that transfer from gems to gold. Even then, players that convert to gold can compete better than you in farming because they can buy ectos for the luck salvage.

If you guys are trying to look like corporate shills, then congratulations, you succeeded.

No, I’m saying it’s not a valid complaint. The exchange rates for gems to gold is not that great. There is NOTHING you can buy with gems (which is necessary to the game) and cannot be purchased with gold.

Xae Isareth.1364:

Conncept.7638:

I don’t even know anybody who buys gems, it’s more a matter of how can players who have real lives compete with ‘hardcores’ whose 24/7 farming constantly damages the economy?

Isn’t that in every game?

Fair enough

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

Buying gems for gold is extremely expensive and any normal player can still catch up to top gear pretty easy anyways, even if it is time gated it’s still an easy process. They just want the epic looking skins mainly.

Conncept.7638:

I don’t even know anybody who buys gems, it’s more a matter of how can players who have real lives compete with ‘hardcores’ whose 24/7 farming constantly damages the economy?

Just a note, and this should be put out each and every time someone who thinks farming hurts the economy. By definition, farming adds materials to the game – this results in an overall DROP in the price of the materials. Farmers are not to blame for inflation.

Comparatively, the power traders, who add literally thousands of gold to the game daily, directly cause inflation, even after allowing for the TP “tax”.

For real life examples, read some history. Adding more money to an economy, without adding goods to offset the money, results in runaway inflation.

stale.9785:

Comparatively, the power traders, who add literally thousands of gold to the game daily, directly cause inflation, even after allowing for the TP “tax”.

Hm, I might have missed something but how do power traders add thousands of gold?
I was under impression that they traded, and thus didn’t add a single gold to the game, but instead removed some of it due to the tax.

No gold is created on the TP, it is people trading gold for items, so it is just changing hands.

bravoart.5308:

This is the current state of the game. Unless you get incredulously lucky in drops, or grind all day it is impossible to be better off versus players that transfer from gems to gold. Even then, players that convert to gold can compete better than you in farming because they can buy ectos for the luck salvage.

If you guys are trying to look like corporate shills, then congratulations, you succeeded.

First, the MF thing is kind of a scam. When RNG is involved, those 300% will barely matter.
Second, what’s the purpose of farming ? To get more gold to buy what ? The only thing excessive farming is needed for are Legendaries. It will take less time and money to get an Ascended Weapon than a Legendary if you only want one for the skin.
If you want to buy an armor skin on the TP, it takes less than 2 hours per day for a week to get the necessary gold if you really want it. Instead of coming here and saying that this game is p2w.

lordkrall.7241:

stale.9785:

Comparatively, the power traders, who add literally thousands of gold to the game daily, directly cause inflation, even after allowing for the TP “tax”.

Hm, I might have missed something but how do power traders add thousands of gold?
I was under impression that they traded, and thus didn’t add a single gold to the game, but instead removed some of it due to the tax.

No gold is created on the TP, it is people trading gold for items, so it is just changing hands.

Fair enough – the actual process is that truly staggering amounts of gold get moved about, withheld from the market, then flooded back in in waves. (Check spidey.) The net effect is that power traders fairly regularly add enormous amounts of gold to the market, in ways that deliberately destabilize prices to their advantage.

Since the total amount of cash in-game is continually going up (gems to gold) at more of it is being horded than spent on gold-sinks (extrapolated from spidey) and then the excess horded, previously not in-game gold gets dumped into the market. Net effect is that everyone’s gold is worth less, and prices jump to compensate.

Now, it’s possible that that’s not happening, and the numbers on spidey are either incomplete or outright false, but if spidey is trustworthy, then power-trading is directly linked to inflation. It’s not a steep curve, but every single iteration of large volume trades is followed by universal price increases.

There is one assumption involved in this, and that is; Whenever every available copy of an item is bought at once, it’s power trading, and not the collective population deciding they are going to all buy the same item at the same instant. While I can’t prove that, it seems more reasonable to view it as one person trying to manipulate prices, rather than the entire game population developing a fetish for an item simultaneously.

stale.9785:

Conncept.7638:

I don’t even know anybody who buys gems, it’s more a matter of how can players who have real lives compete with ‘hardcores’ whose 24/7 farming constantly damages the economy?

Just a note, and this should be put out each and every time someone who thinks farming hurts the economy. By definition, farming adds materials to the game – this results in an overall DROP in the price of the materials. Farmers are not to blame for inflation.

Comparatively, the power traders, who add literally thousands of gold to the game daily, directly cause inflation, even after allowing for the TP “tax”.

For real life examples, read some history. Adding more money to an economy, without adding goods to offset the money, results in runaway inflation.

You blew away your own argument with that last statement.

Farming creates far more gold from nothing than it does needed materials. Some guy on the forums just did the math, the thread was up within the last week if you want to look for it. Champion farming is averaging an addition of 7.5 gold into the economy per hour per participating character. It isn’t bringing in nearly that amounts worth of materials per hour. So it is causing inflation.

Conncept – based on the last time I bothered doing the champ run (been weeks now, though I’m familiar with the 7G an hour thread, and I hope the guy has healed up) you get 10-15 times the value in materials as you do straight money. This is especially true now, since they nerfed the monetary reward on champs.

1 champ box used to give you about 10 silver, and 2-3 weapons + materials. Now, if you’re me, you salvaged the weapons, and sold the resulting materials for 5s-1g, depending. Expand the sample size, and the material value (quantity multiplied by cost) far eclipses any potential profit from the silver alone.

I’ll admit, my assumption is that the majority is farming frostgorge, and thus are getting 1-3 ecto from every other bag. (I know that assuming everyone has the same results as me is a huge bias, but for the bags, I’m the only example I can check.) It’s possible the majority of farmers are selling everything they get directly to the merchants, but that would be stupid. It not only lowers your potential (though not guaranteed) profit, but it WILL cause inflation. I like to believe people aren’t quite that stupid.

Also, the last statement, about checking history, is drawn from real life examples. Every nation that ever added money to it’s economy without the materiel to back it has suffered massive inflation.

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

bluestocking.6148:

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

You’d be amazed the number of people who consider the lack of balance in Costume Brawl to be a gamebreaking flaw.

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

Lol, it has a 600 range rush on 3s cooldown, even higher ranger if you have +movement speed or swiftness. Ive seen entire packs of gankers in WvW use it to catch up to and roll over unsuspecting victims. This item also single handedly removes Mesmer’s ooc mobility weakness, among other classes like necro and guard.

roamzero.9486:

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

Lol, it has a 600 range rush on 3s cooldown, even higher ranger if you have +movement speed or swiftness. Ive seen entire packs of gankers in WvW use it to catch up to and roll over unsuspecting victims. This item also single handedly removes Mesmer’s ooc mobility weakness, among other classes like necro and guard.

You’ll have to forgive me, I don’t play WvW. You’re saying they switch into town clothes, zoom up to people, and then switch back and attack?

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

Lol, it has a 600 range rush on 3s cooldown, even higher ranger if you have +movement speed or swiftness. Ive seen entire packs of gankers in WvW use it to catch up to and roll over unsuspecting victims. This item also single handedly removes Mesmer’s ooc mobility weakness, among other classes like necro and guard.

You’ll have to forgive me, I don’t play WvW. You’re saying they switch into town clothes, zoom up to people, and then switch back and attack?

Yeah, or just use it to zoom around large maps.

Technically, you need 500 in crafting to make an ascended, but how do you get there if your not buying the mats from the AH?

Well you grind, meanwhile the guy who was able to money hat his way to 450 or beyond, already has his ascended weapon, and if you happen to be WVWing against said money players…

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

Lol, it has a 600 range rush on 3s cooldown, even higher ranger if you have +movement speed or swiftness. Ive seen entire packs of gankers in WvW use it to catch up to and roll over unsuspecting victims. This item also single handedly removes Mesmer’s ooc mobility weakness, among other classes like necro and guard.

You’ll have to forgive me, I don’t play WvW. You’re saying they switch into town clothes, zoom up to people, and then switch back and attack?

They do. And they use the Blood Prince Staff for the skill that grants stealth.

I don’t think it is such a huge advantage and I do not agree with the OP, anyway.

Builds and skill matter much more in WvW than ascended gear.
Boosters are useless (I have tons of them stacked in my bank, there is no need for them)
There is no need for gold since ascended cant be bought with it. Except food, don’t forget to use food in WvW.
IMO people who buy gems don’t have an advantage over others.

Actually, buying a Twilight would cost $638. So it’s somewhere between “twenty” and “thousands.” (Even Eternity, two legendaries fused together, is only $1023.5, and most weapons are substantially cheaper than that. Obviously the cost goes up if you’re buying more than one. I just thought real numbers would be useful here. /aside)

As for competing cosmetically, I’m…less than sold on the idea. I’ve seen so many terrible dye jobs, mixed pieces, and outfits/weapons that visually scream “Look at me! Look at me!” that I think a sense of taste is going to go farther than any amount of gold.

Redenaz.8631:

Actually, buying a Twilight would cost $638. So it’s somewhere between “twenty” and “thousands.” (Even Eternity, two legendaries fused together, is only $1023.5, and most weapons are substantially cheaper than that. Obviously the cost goes up if you’re buying more than one. I just thought real numbers would be useful here. /aside)

As for competing cosmetically, I’m…less than sold on the idea. I’ve seen so many terrible dye jobs, mixed pieces, and outfits/weapons that visually scream “Look at me! Look at me!” that I think a sense of taste is going to go farther than any amount of gold.

Really? Well, I stand corrected. Just based on the conversion rate I had assumed it would be quite a bit more. Either way, it’s still an absurd amount of money to spend on a small stat upgrade that’s “flashy”, unless of course… You’re in the fashion competition.

Ascended weapons.

To get your weaponcrafting skill to level 400, you have to spend 30g.

http://www.gw2crafts.net/weaponcraft_fast.html

After that, to get to 450, you have to spend an extra 40g.

http://www.gw2crafts.net/weaponcraft_450.html

To get that last 50 levels, you have to spend 140g.

http://www.gw2crafts.net/weaponcraft_400.html

Real life money can be converted to gems. Gems can be converted to gold. Gold can be converted to Ascended weapons. Ascended weapons is the advantage over poor players.

Guild Wars 2 is definitely not pay2win.

Redenaz.8631:

As for competing cosmetically, I’m…less than sold on the idea. I’ve seen so many terrible dye jobs, mixed pieces, and outfits/weapons that visually scream “Look at me! Look at me!” that I think a sense of taste is going to go farther than any amount of gold.

pretty much, the amount of times I see someone with twilight/dawn with the hellfire achievement shoulder/glove skins, the ascended fractal capacitor and either the four winds helmet, etc the more I question how they can stand to look at that day in day out since it all clashes and seems just about wearing whatever has particle effects :\

bravoart.5308:

OP brought up a valid complaint, that people that don’t buy gems can’t compete in gold purchases, and everyone suddenly starts talking about cosmetics and ‘endgame’ and exotics.

This is the current state of the game. Unless you get incredulously lucky in drops, or grind all day it is impossible to be better off versus players that transfer from gems to gold. Even then, players that convert to gold can compete better than you in farming because they can buy ectos for the luck salvage.

If you guys are trying to look like corporate shills, then congratulations, you succeeded.

The thing is, stat wise, the only thing you can buy that is better is the legendary weapon (and even then you have ascended weapons as an option and the biggest road block there is dragonite, a non buyable account bound mat…the other stuff drops far more during normal play than when actively farming dragonite), all ascended level equips require some form of grinding to get. So realistically it is down to cosmetics…..

This is hilariously funny thread, ignorance is bliss.

Protoavis, what sort of advantage does a t3 armor with legendary on full serker stat against a crafted exotic armor with crafted exotic weapon full serker stat?

Cosmestics has nothing to do with “competition”.

If you think cosmetic counts as a competitiveness along with statistics(Vitality,toughness etc) and numerical computation for damages in this game, where is your common sense?

Gabby.3205:

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

bluestocking.6148:

roamzero.9486:

Guhracie.3419:

What is in the gem store that’s giving an advantage, exactly?

The toy axe with the executioner outfit gives an unfair mobility advantage. But so far, other than the transmutation crystal racket they’ve got going that’s the only time Anet’s really crossed the line IMO.

An unfair mobility advantage … in costume brawl?

Lol, it has a 600 range rush on 3s cooldown, even higher ranger if you have +movement speed or swiftness. Ive seen entire packs of gankers in WvW use it to catch up to and roll over unsuspecting victims. This item also single handedly removes Mesmer’s ooc mobility weakness, among other classes like necro and guard.

You’ll have to forgive me, I don’t play WvW. You’re saying they switch into town clothes, zoom up to people, and then switch back and attack?

They do. And they use the Blood Prince Staff for the skill that grants stealth.

I don’t think it is such a huge advantage and I do not agree with the OP, anyway.

That sounds more like abusing a flaw in the system than having an advantage. I wonder what happened to Anet, at launch they banned people for stuff like that.

Serv.6073:

How are non gem buyers supposed to compete with players who buy gems? I feel gw2 is becoming another mmo where you have to pay with real life money to be the best or grind until you are dead.

If you feel you can’t beat the game without buying Gems, you’re doing it wrong. It’s not a rich or poor issue, it’s learn to play.

I didn’t fork out a single cent for this game save for the box copy, and I don’t have any issues with making gold. Like Penguin said, it’s a l2p thing, you haven’t given yourself enough time to really explore this game, have you?

Is this thread serious?

Let’s give him the benefit of doubt, shall we? Although I won’t deny I have an urge to cause trouble… but hey, I’m human.