The real problem with Signets

The real problem with Signets

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Apolo.5942

Apolo.5942

This is a bit of a wall of text, but i think it merits discussion.

This comes from another post related to the incoming nerf to the warrior`s Signet of Health, but that is just an example of poorly a designed signet and not that the passive healing it self is too strong thus the active rarely used.

The real problem is that both the active and the passive effect are coupled.

What do i mean by coupled?, i mean that both effects, the active and the passive are coupled in one skill and work towards the same goal or same effect. This makes it that in essence both effects compete against each other, which in theory is what we want, but in practice what actually happens is that 1 of them is more optimal 90% of the time and the other is only actually better in the remaining 10% of the time which default to forcing you to use it on those situation.
The real draw back is that it removes choice from the player, the best player will always choose the optimal effect for the situation, and that choice is defined by the parameters of the effects which both work towards the same goal.

To illustrate lets take the warrior`s Signet of Health, the only situation where a little burst of healing is actually better than a significant steady healing is when you are close to death, being burst down and in need of pushing through the burst to stabilize, that is because at that point the number on the passive healing becomes irrelevant(baring something ridiculous). There is no choice, passive is always better unless you need to survive at witch point passive becomes irrelevant.
NOW Lets say they changed it and the passive was terrible and the active was amazing. The same would still be true, when you needed to heal a significant chunk of hp (not necessarily dieing) you would always trigger it because the active would be more optimal than the passive.
The point is that in either case choice is removed from the player wanting to do the optimal play.

Further down is an incomplete list of Signets that have effects coupled and a description of why they are not real choices, as you will come to realize by the sheer number of them, most of the signets in the game are coupled.

The better designed signets are the ones that are decoupled. This are Signets on which the passive effect does something completely different than the active or that work towards different goals.

To illustrate lets take the Guardian`s Signet of Resolve which incidentally coupled with base stats and default passive healing heals for about 75%-100% (depending on stats) as the warriors Healing signet (its just less transparent and people for some reason dont complain about it).

This signets effects are A burst healing and a condition Cleansing over time. These effects do not compete against each other(save extreme cases), the choice is there, do i try to aegis, roll, run and try to keep that constant cleansing that i really like and is useful or do i want to get my health up and try to keep the overall HPs of signet as high as possible.
This is a real choice between 2 different effects where one is not more optimal than the other because they do different things (even thou in flavor yes they are both “defensive”).
Or the Necromancers signet of vampirisim, do i want to keep that damage mitigation or do i want to try a play of me and a couple of team mates bursting down an enemy?.

These choices come from what is happening, what play i want to do, what is my situation awareness of the battle. They dont come from which is the optimal solution for this situation. They define game flow from the choice made, instead of the game flow defining the choice which is what happens when both effects compete towards the same goal.

Continued on next post.

The term Exploit means nothing in GW2 –
Vials Maize Balm Exploit(Halloween) 2014
Locked out of JP (Wintersday) 2015

(edited by Apolo.5942)

The real problem with Signets

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Apolo.5942

Apolo.5942

Continuation

This are just a few Signets that have their effects coupled, and the reason of why there is no real choice about when to trigger the active/preserve the passive.

Signet of Renewal
Passive: Cures a condition every ten seconds.
Active: Your pet pulls all conditions from nearby allies to itself.
Passive is always better, unless overwhelmed with conditions flooded with conditions. There is no choice to be had here, if you are overwhelmed you need to stop it.

Signet of Stone
Passive: Improves toughness for you and your pet.
Active: You and your pet takes no damage from attacks.You and your pet are still susceptible to conditions and control effects.
180 toughness is irrelevant, you never think “oh wait i am loosing 180 if i use this” you always use it to survive burst, it essentially works as a regular skill with an almost insignificant upside.

Assassin’s Signet
Passive: Grants increased power.
Active: Deal 15% more damage on your next five attacks.
Passive is always better, unless going for the final burst, Again no choice you should always try to maximize your damage on burst down.

Signet of Malice
Passive: Heals when you attack.
Active: Gain health.
Passive healing is always better unless trying a last ditch effort to survive the burst, if you are dead healing over time is irrelevant, the choice is dictated by the situation.

Signet of Restoration
Passive: Grants health every time you cast a spell.
Active: Heal yourself.
Same as before

The better designed signets are the ones that do offer a choice depending the situation and have its effects decoupled.
For instance:

Bane Signet
Passive: Improved Power
Active: Knock down and damage your foe.
More damage vs Interrupt/snare. This are 2 different things and there is a real choice to make, want more damage or want to know down say a fleeing enemy, or an enemy going for a revive or stomp?.

Dolyak Signet
Passive: Reduces incoming damage.
Active: Gain stability.
Want to take less damage or secure a stomp/burst.

In essence, when 2 effects compete towards the same goals, the environment, singergies and so on, will always dictate that one is more optimal than the other. That is how metas, combos and so on are born. Signets are not immune to these realities.

The term Exploit means nothing in GW2 –
Vials Maize Balm Exploit(Halloween) 2014
Locked out of JP (Wintersday) 2015

(edited by Apolo.5942)