There is something wrong here
The reason they’re cheaper on the TP is you can get them randomly from promoting Rare sigils and / or get them from salvaging exotic gear.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
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This just seems like a broken mechanic to me, Sigils that can be crafted cost way more to craft than the price to buy them from the Tradepost. This is so backwards. I could understand if a few of them were like that, But not all of them,
If crafting is an intricate part of this game, How can you tell me this is not broken? Why would anyone craft a superior sigil, Why is this even an option?
And Who are you people selling your sigils at a 100-200% loss?
Which sigils?
If they are priced according to what they cost to craft, then people probably wouldn’t buy them at all. The system is set up for willingness to buy and willingness to sell. If the buyer isn’t willing to pay cost, then the seller has the option to sell at a lower rate, in order to move their product, or keep it higher in order to break even.
Plus you have to figure the craftable ones are generally made solely to level crafting, so people craft a bunch of them, then drop them on the TP just to get rid of them, and aren’t super concerned about the costs, as they are only trying to level up their crafting.
It’s the chain I beat you with until you
recognize my command!”
The price on the trading post is not based on cost to make but how much others want it. If it costs 1000 gold to make but it’s worthless to use, then don’t expect to get your money back.
ANet may give it to you.
The reason they’re cheaper on the TP is you can get them randomly from promoting Rare sigils and / or get them from salvaging exotic gear.
The reason they are cheaper, is because no one wants them.. Which I just figured out by looking at their value. Maybe the solution is for anet to rework the craftable sigils so that they have more reason to exist in the game.
The ones that only come from drops have more value,
this seems to go against the logic in the quote above.
I really hope people aren’t crafting sigils to level that would be an extreme waste of coin, especially knowing beforehand the sigils are worthless.
“The system is set up for willingness to buy and willingness to sell. "
But isn’t this the point, The sigels are worthless, so why craft them at all, so why have the ability to craft them
(I’m just thinking outloud here)
People can craft the Sigils to gain XP in their crafting profession. Discovering the recipe gives a good boost to their skill, and depending on the given Sigil/Rune it might be cheaper than the materials needed to discover an exotic weapon or armour.
It’s all about the usefulness of the Sigil/Rune, though. Look at the Superior Rune of the Scholar. It’s a crafted Rune, but it’s a popular one, so it sells for more on the Trading Post than it costs to make. I bet if there wasn’t a recipe to craft it from a Charged Lodestone, it might cost twice as much as it does. In that case, the ability to craft it yourself winds up keeping the price from growing out of control, though it’s still expensive because the component material involved is expensive.
People can craft the Sigils to gain XP in their crafting profession. Discovering the recipe gives a good boost to their skill, and depending on the given Sigil/Rune it might be cheaper than the materials needed to discover an exotic weapon or armour.
It’s all about the usefulness of the Sigil/Rune, though. Look at the Superior Rune of the Scholar. It’s a crafted Rune, but it’s a popular one, so it sells for more on the Trading Post than it costs to make. I bet if there wasn’t a recipe to craft it from a Charged Lodestone, it might cost twice as much as it does. In that case, the ability to craft it yourself winds up keeping the price from growing out of control, though it’s still expensive because the component material involved is expensive.
Runes and Sigils are not the same thing – There are no craftable sigils worth the cost to craft them that I am aware of.
Then as I said, you use it to progress XP for your crafting discipline. Runes and Sigils might not be the same thing, but they’re crafted the same way using the same basic components. It just so happens that there is no equivalent to the Superior Rune of the Scholar. Right now, at least.
Crafting is a gold sink in this game because it provides the benefit of granting up to 10 levels’ worth of exp per crafting profession. The results of this crafting will never sell for more than the base products as long as crafting gives a reward besides the end product.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
That isn’t ‘free’ — selling the mats is often enough to pay for certain crafted items and leave you with leftover coin.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
Sadly your post illustrates why crafting isn’t profitable at all.
People don’t bother to find out how much what they just made actually costs.
It seems you are following the logic of other games where not everyone can craft and you’d need to level an annoying class if you wanted to craft your own stuff. In that scenario, it was easier for the seller to set his price.
However, in this game, there are two major advantages to crafting. One is that your character gains 10 levels per maxed profession – and a LOT of people craft to level up fast instead of grinding content for it. The second is that you only gain access to certain items (such as ascended weapons/armor) once you level up your crafting, thus people willingly lose their gold in order to get this.
With so many people crafting in order to achieve those two goals, the demand for materials rise, making crafting more expensive, and the offer of crafted items also goes up, driving the price of said items down. I think the tradeoff is fair enough in comparison to other games.
(edited by Aiuris.9861)
So I guess the general consensus is, the crafting mechanic for this game is not interesting, because it is permanent content, but a 1 day event where peoples arms are intentionally ‘bugged’ in an homage to a real ‘bug’ which occurred previously in game. Is SO insanely important that everyone and their mother must comment on it.
I do not believe people are so stupid as to craft superior sigils to raise their crafting rank/or XP, Although I will concede that people do craft inefficiently the other less worthless items for that purpose.
I stand by my statement , Crafting Sigils in this game is broken.
There’re a lot more things than sigils that are cheaper to buy off the TP than craft.
A lot of the time it’s better to sell the component materials and just buy the item.
I can’t say I’m experienced enough to talk about crafting (only been playing a couple weeks), but I do think this topic is interesting, as crafting is still a bit of a mystery to me.
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Your skin will wrinkle and your youth will fade, but your soul is endless.
“I do not believe people are so stupid as to craft superior sigils to raise their crafting rank/or XP, Although I will concede that people do craft inefficiently the other less worthless items for that purpose.”
Ah, but if it is listed on gw2craft.net, then people will craft it. It’s easier to just follow the listed instructions and get to 400 than to figure it out on your own, or figure out if there is something else you can craft instead of what’s listed.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
That isn’t ‘free’ — selling the mats is often enough to pay for certain crafted items and leave you with leftover coin.
But that wouldn’t unlock the recipe for you. You have to craft it to unlock it.
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The main reason this happens is none of the craftable sigils are actually any good. The ones most people want are Force sigils, and you can’t craft those.
From what I’ve observed, many players try to raise their crafting levels without bothering to look at crafting guides. Instead, once they’ve run out of easy crafting steps (refinement, etc), many of them jump straight to the discovery panel and start trying to combine various items from their inventory in hopes of unlocking a new recipe. For weapon crafter types there are several combinations that can result in unlocking a sigil recipe, while for armor crafter types, there are several combinations that can result in unlocking a rune recipe.
Unfortunately, nearly all of the sigil and rune recipes result in an item that is worth far less gold than the input materials needed to craft it. The reason for the price being low is purely an effect of supply and demand: these sigils and runes are very easy to craft, and they get crafted in abundance by players trying to bump their crafting levels, resulting in a huge supply. However, most of them are useless, so there is little to no demand for them.
TL;DR – Ignore crafting guides at your own risk.
(edited by Kalendraf.9521)
From what I’ve observed, many players try to raise their crafting levels without bothering to look at crafting guides. Instead, once they’ve run out of easy crafting steps (refinement, etc), many of them jump straight to the discovery panel and start trying to combine various items from their inventory in hopes of unlocking a new recipe. For weapon crafter types there are several combinations that can result in unlocking a sigil recipe, while for armor crafter types, there are several combinations that can result in unlocking a rune recipe.
Unfortunately, nearly all of the sigil and rune recipes result in an item that is worth far less gold than the input materials needed to craft it. The reason for the price being low is purely an effect of supply and demand: these sigils and runes are very easy to craft, and they get crafted in abundance by players trying to bump their crafting levels, resulting in a huge supply. However, most of them are useless, so there is little to no demand for them.
TL;DR – Ignore crafting guides at your own risk.
TL;DR – People would rather play the game than some guide.
TL;DR – People don’t need guides to play
TL;DR – People don’t care about the “value” of the item nor mat, they’re just playing the game.
TL;DR – People put too much importance behind these things.
TL;DR – It’s not wrong just because it’s not how you would do it, nor think it should be done.
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The only reason to craft in this game is legendaries or ascended stuff which is why the cost to level your crafting is much higher than the end result.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
If you consider those mats FREE, don’t ever open a business….
Fate is just the weight of circumstances
That’s the way that lady luck dances
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
Why would you craft something when you could sell the mats and get more money? Mats sell way faster than most things.
Reasons.
They are easily discovered and everyone leveling that crafting discipline craft them and dump them onto the TP and excessive supply makes them unprofitable.
Extracting them from various dropped armors provides a steady “free” supply which again causes and excessive supply.
The crafting mats are used in something way more popular and profitable making recovery of cost impossible due to mat costs.
RIP City of Heroes
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
If you consider those mats FREE, don’t ever open a business….
This is a game, not a business. If you find something on the ground it is free. If you had to spend money on it to get it in the first place it is not free. I don’t buy mats, I use what I find. I also horde my mats in case I might ever want to use them to craft something. I also try to unlock every recipe I can, regardless of how useless it is because reasons.
Your argument is invalid.
Also you can craft them for free if you found the mats rather than bought them.
Why would you craft something when you could sell the mats and get more money? Mats sell way faster than most things.
The same answers. Also I’m not in some big rush to get “rich.” It’s a game, there aren’t a lot of things I can do with the gold in the first place. Fun things that aren’t trying to run a business in a game for some reason. Or for some reason trying to define my worth, or whether or not I “won” based on how much gold I’ve accumulated.
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(edited by Kal Spiro.9745)
This is a game, not a business. If you find something on the ground it is free. If you had to spend money on it to get it in the first place it is not free.
Your argument is invalid.
Two words: opportunity cost.
This is a game, not a business. If you find something on the ground it is free. If you had to spend money on it to get it in the first place it is not free.
Your argument is invalid.
Two words: opportunity cost.
Three words. It’s a game.
RIP City of Heroes
This is a game, not a business. If you find something on the ground it is free. If you had to spend money on it to get it in the first place it is not free.
Your argument is invalid.
Two words: opportunity cost.
Three words. It’s a game.
And in what way does that invalidate what I said? Even within the context of the game world, there are better and worse ways to use gold. Given your apparent argument that “it’s a game” trumps the notion of opportunity cost, would you mind sending me the entirety of your gold? Sure it’s not the best use of your gold, but what the heck, it’s a game.
I love how easy it is to derail a thread with philosophy discussions, but back to my point.
The more gold I can make, the more fun I can have in this game – be jealous of my ascended armor, and legendary weapons.
But what ever.
If crafting a sigil has no monetary purpose, why not remove the inference that it does.
This is a game, not a business. If you find something on the ground it is free. If you had to spend money on it to get it in the first place it is not free.
Your argument is invalid.
Two words: opportunity cost.
Three words. It’s a game.
And in what way does that invalidate what I said? Even within the context of the game world, there are better and worse ways to use gold. Given your apparent argument that “it’s a game” trumps the notion of opportunity cost, would you mind sending me the entirety of your gold? Sure it’s not the best use of your gold, but what the heck, it’s a game.
Okay, is it opportunity cost if you find it without seeking it? You are running through a zone and harvest/gather a node you are passing. I can understand the “cost” of play time if you are strip mining a map of all nodes but Point A to Point B discovery along the way? Whatever you picked up is bonus.
RIP City of Heroes
Supply and demand.
Materials for crafting the sigil are also used for crafting other items. Even if the demand for the materials rise, if the supply or demand of the sigil doesn’t change, its price won’t either.
Some people craft sigils to gain crafting experience. If this sigil is one of them, you ‘pay’ the difference in the terms of gaining exp points. It’s the same reason why armor components are a lot cheaper than their base components. (and base components are often used in crafting ascended mats)