Guild Wars 2

One that the expansion doesn’t address. And it’s a problem with the very core of the game. Perhaps you guys know what it is? It’s not the balancing. It’s not then enemies. Not the lore or the players or the items or anything like that…

It’s the combat controls.

Or more specifically, how utterly clunky and unfriendly to new players they are. Especially if you’re playing an Elementalist where you have 4 sets of powers you can use at any one time. I’m sorry but it seems every time I think about GW2 and how I want to come back to it, I keep thinking back to the terrible combat controls. How I have to keep track of a crazy amount of keys all while CONSTANTLY moving and dodging, UT style.

I mean, are any of your guys noticing this too? I feel like everyone’s just having a party and I’m one of the few who can’t enjoy anything there because I keep bumping and crashing into things due to incredibly terrible and cramped room layout. This is really getting quite silly.

The combat and movement is the best thing about this game.

How would you propose to improve it?

I don’t like the saying but it may just be that GW2 isn’t for you because the combat and movement IS the game.

This isn’t problem; its collection of subjective and minor grievances. Opinionated at that.

And to be fair, Anet is still working on the whole first player experience any way.

I’m a very casual player and I don’t have a problem with combat controls. Moving and dodging makes it fun for me. I don’t think there are a “crazy amount of keys” to keep track of even playing an Ele. Then again I use a gaming mouse where most of my skills are on my thumb buttons. Even before I got my gaming mouse I didn’t find the amount of keys I had to use or follow excessive as opposed to games I have played in the past.. It is better than other games where you are rooted in place while initiating an attack and trying to track a larger number of skill bars.

The game’s combat is fine, but skills and classes need a better balance (specially useless skills and traits) and the targeting system needs improvement (like an option to ignore enemy pets, mesmer clones and ambient creatures when you aim for nearest target)

I’ve never had any problems with combat controls in GW2.

Interesting view point. However, it is entirely Subjective.
But the entire game is based around active combat. If its integral to the basic design, and it does work as intended, the by definition it cannot be a problem. While there is some problems that do exist (Balancing for one) actove combat isnt one of them.

I understand if its not your cup of tea, but that doesnt mean its a problem, and needs to change. In fact the active combat system is one of the biggest draws to GW2, if it didnt have it, it would have been ignored as another WoW clone and summarily dismissed by the masses.

Crysto.7089:

The combat and movement is the best thing about this game.

How would you propose to improve it?

It is and it isn’t. It has a massive amount of potential. Unfortunately, the controls aren’t streamlined at all. Let’s take a look at a typical FPS’s controls, another genre where you have to leverage your abilities and destructive power with ammo/movement/quick thinking/etc.

I’m just going to go with Half Life 2 here. Luckily I have it handy on my PC. Now looking through the controls, you have a total of (including mouse controls) 11-12 keys to keep track of and need to be able to press at a moments notice in combat when you need to. Pretty standard stuff.

Now lets look at GW2 playing as an Elementalist. (My current starting profession.) Counting them up all up, you have about 22 keys for combat that you need to be able to press at any time in order to be competent. (and that’s being nice and not including the four different dodge directions.) That’s twice the amount that you need for HL2. And since I don’t have any sort of gaming mouse either… Yeah, see what I’m trying to say?

I might also add that it is NOT the active combat that i have a problem with. It’s how it’s been implemented.

Arnox.5128:

Or more specifically, how utterly clunky and unfriendly to new players they are. Especially if you’re playing an Elementalist where you have 4 sets of powers you can use at any one time. I’m sorry but it seems every time I think about GW2 and how I want to come back to it, I keep thinking back to the terrible combat controls. How I have to keep track of a crazy amount of keys all while CONSTANTLY moving and dodging, UT style.

I mean, are any of your guys noticing this too? I feel like everyone’s just having a party and I’m one of the few who can’t enjoy anything there because I keep bumping and crashing into things due to incredibly terrible and cramped room layout. This is really getting quite silly.

Its not just you, though I don’t know if it is “clunky and unfriendly” as much as it is much more active and fast paced and complex than traditional MMOs and my taste.

I’m supposed to juggle 10 different skills, keep track of boss attack animations, and not stand in the red circles? I can do that. Move around and dodge at the same time…. I can manage. Add in different attunements or stances, combo fields, attack effects that hide the fight in the center of a fireworks show, and a second weapon set with 5 more skills, etc…. Sorry, but I, personally, just can’t keep track of it all, especially since I only play an average of 30 minutes a day.

Still, for a lot of other people the active combat is what they find most fun.

I agree the design was kinda meh but it can never go addressed because that’s what the game is designed around. But honestly, I prefer these active mechanics in a hack n’ slash rather than my MMOs. It’s easier to dodge in God of War than Guild Wars 2. So…if this keeps you from enjoying the game, I’m afraid you might have to find a new game to play. This just isn’t something that is a “problem” so much as a “design mechanic.”

Tbh, I didn’t find combat that enoyable until I started using Combat Mode 1.1. Anet made a funky hybrid between action and tab targeting combat, which, imho, doesn’t work that well.

I don’t have any problem with the combat controls. And yea, it is entirely a subjective sort of thing.

Arnox.5128:

How I have to keep track of a crazy amount of keys all while CONSTANTLY moving and dodging, UT style.

I mean, are any of your guys noticing this too? I feel like everyone’s just having a party and I’m one of the few who can’t enjoy anything there because I keep bumping and crashing into things due to incredibly terrible and cramped room layout. This is really getting quite silly.

Crazy amount of keys? you have like 10 abilities on your hotbar. As an elementalist you will have 10 + another 15. But you know what? who says that you have to constantly swap between fire, water, air and earth all the time? If you are doing it to maximize your effectiveness then i would think that you know what you are doing and are a new player to the game, but not to the genre. I have a dagger/dagger Elem and i just run around in air all the time and if i run into a group taking on a Champ i will switch to water if i think they need a tiny bit of help with healing.

You need to not get confused by all 20 of the abilities that you have. Instead ask yourself what kind of situations will you find yourself needing to switch to fire? what kind of situation will you need to switch to water? what situation for air? what situation for earth? I’m only up to level 40 on mine but while i am running around solo questing i stay in air full time. And as mentioned earlier i switch to water if a group i come upon needs healing/cleansing (though i dont always change). There isnt a situation where i will have to switch to fire or earth. I would probably do more damage as a fire D/D but i dpsing as air D/D. I might get a little more protection as earth D/D but if i’m constantly in situations where the protection from earth will make or break a fight then maybe i need to rethink my rotation, playstyle, or gear.

cosmatman.9306:

Crazy amount of keys? you have like 10 abilities on your hotbar. As an elementalist you will have 10 + another 15. But you know what? who says that you have to constantly swap between fire, water, air and earth all the time? If you are doing it to maximize your effectiveness then i would think that you know what you are doing and are a new player to the game, but not to the genre. I have a dagger/dagger Elem and i just run around in air all the time and if i run into a group taking on a Champ i will switch to water if i think they need a tiny bit of help with healing.

You need to not get confused by all 20 of the abilities that you have. Instead ask yourself what kind of situations will you find yourself needing to switch to fire? what kind of situation will you need to switch to water? what situation for air? what situation for earth? I’m only up to level 40 on mine but while i am running around solo questing i stay in air full time. And as mentioned earlier i switch to water if a group i come upon needs healing/cleansing (though i dont always change). There isnt a situation where i will have to switch to fire or earth. I would probably do more damage as a fire D/D but i dpsing as air D/D. I might get a little more protection as earth D/D but if i’m constantly in situations where the protection from earth will make or break a fight then maybe i need to rethink my rotation, playstyle, or gear.

You know what? I don’t know. I’ve played a whole bunch of games over the years and now whenever I’m beginning one, I like to know and at least be competent in ALL aspects before I do anything. I guess I do this due to really fast-paced games drilling it into me to be quick and in full control or be dead.

So when I’m starting out GW2, well now I feel I gotta master the skills, the utility skills, the weapons, the conditions, the dodging, the movement, the healing, how GW2 monsters behave, my attunements and how they differ and can be used, and how I can combine these sets together, and etc. etc. or else I feel I’m just gonna start dying all the time and be worthless.

I came from WoW, Lotro, and RoM, and prefer the combat here to either of the three. Most attacks in GW2 don’t require you to stand still or root you into an animation. Some notable and frustrating exceptions are in the Ranger class, which really need to be fixed.

Even with the Ranger problems, I don’t think I could go back to any of the other games I listed because I despise how so many attacks require you to stand still to cast.

So, yeah, it could be better here but, no, I don’t think its clunky. If you want to learn about clunky, go play Lotro for a bit.

Arnox.5128:

You know what? I don’t know. I’ve played a whole bunch of games over the years and now whenever I’m beginning one, I like to know and at least be competent in ALL aspects before I do anything. I guess I do this due to really fast-paced games drilling it into me to be quick and in full control or be dead.

So when I’m starting out GW2, well now I feel I gotta master the skills, the utility skills, the weapons, the conditions, the dodging, the movement, the healing, how GW2 monsters behave, my attunements and how they differ and can be used, and how I can combine these sets together, and etc. etc. or else I feel I’m just gonna start dying all the time and be worthless.

You notice that they gradually give you your weapon powers as you level? on game release they used to have it so that when you hit 10 times with power #1 for a weapon it unlocked power #2, then you hit power 2 for 10 times and it would unlock power 3 and so on (and you would repeat this for every weapon). Now the abilities are level locked for each weapon. So now you dont get overwhelmed and it works like most other games where new powers are given to you gradually.

I didnt say that you shouldnt master all powers, i just said that you dont have to use all 4 attunements all the time. You need to find what situations each attunement powers are good for. OBVIOUSLY to make that kind of a decision you would need to know how each power in each attunement works right? I did the same thing when i first started playing my Elem too. I messed around with Fire, Earth and Air. Saw which weapons/powers did the most damage, had the shortest cooldowns, or worked well with my playstyle. I knew that water was mostly for healing so i wasnt about to solo level with that. Eventually i settled on air because fun is still a factor for me and i’m not just ‘gomg moar deeps’.

Every time I watch a dev play in a live stream I understand some of the frustrating control design choices.

The gamepad generation ruins all.

Rebindable untargeting (anything but Double-ESC) and mouse that doesn’t disappear when you hold down right click to move with camera… Please, just that.. The rest I can live with.

I have to admit, the camera, lack of first person, and uncomfortable controls are what stopped me from playing so long, despite buying at launch… However, I did manage to fix it.

I mapped everything to my controller. Everything I do works pretty good, with only one exception, and honestly think anet should consider adding controller support to this game. Its more intricate than most people are used to, but it works well, the sole issue is when using ground targeting skills, its not AS easy to aim. But meh, the games more fun this way, so forget being optimal.

if you like, I could give you the profile (I used pinnacle to map it) and you could see if you like it yourself.

Guild Wars 2 is my first MMO. Ever. I played warrior, ranger, and elementalist during the third BWE (only participated in one BWE). Mostly played warrior.

My first character come first day of headstart for the pre-order crowd: elementalist.

I was not overwhelmed by the number of skills I had.

Didn’t take me long to figure out that fire and air were for damage, water was for healing, earth was for defense. And it was mostly instinctual.

And to add on to what cosmatman said, the NPE now also locks attunements behind levels. I’m not sure if you get just fire or fire and water at level 1. Haven’t rolled an ele since the change. Still only have just the one ele.

I’ve played many an MMO over the years. I find GW2 absolutely refreshing in how minimal the key needs are (granted Ele and Eng do demand more, one reason they are among my least played professions).

I was a Minstrel in LotRO and had way more necessary things to press than fit in the 1 to 0 keys. There were banks of hotbars above the main one, requiring shift, ctrl, and alt modifiers to use. This meant I mostly clicked those, because my hands are small and it’s painful to repeatedly press those combinations. It was a freaking bank of 40 skills! Then they did the Isengard release, and I logged in to find that all my skills had been redone in a total class revamp and I no longer had a clue how to play her. That was the end of my LotRO time.

I’ve been doing some WoW lately (mostly just managing a garrison for a bit). It took a long time to learn my keybinds again after years away and it’s still way too many, some things just have to be mouse clicked.

GW2’s controls are a dream. (Ok, so I did buy a Naga HEX so I could fully mouse-move and dodge). F1 to F4, 1 to 0, ~, and T/Ctrl-T cover everything I need to do in a hurry. Add in B to dodge with when I can’t hit the mouse thumb keys fast enough, J to autoloot everything, and I’m good. Other binds can be used at leisure outside of combat.

Arnox.5128:

Crysto.7089:

The combat and movement is the best thing about this game.

How would you propose to improve it?

It is and it isn’t. It has a massive amount of potential. Unfortunately, the controls aren’t streamlined at all. Let’s take a look at a typical FPS’s controls, another genre where you have to leverage your abilities and destructive power with ammo/movement/quick thinking/etc.

I’m just going to go with Half Life 2 here. Luckily I have it handy on my PC. Now looking through the controls, you have a total of (including mouse controls) 11-12 keys to keep track of and need to be able to press at a moments notice in combat when you need to. Pretty standard stuff.

Now lets look at GW2 playing as an Elementalist. (My current starting profession.) Counting them up all up, you have about 22 keys for combat that you need to be able to press at any time in order to be competent. (and that’s being nice and not including the four different dodge directions.) That’s twice the amount that you need for HL2. And since I don’t have any sort of gaming mouse either… Yeah, see what I’m trying to say?

I might also add that it is NOT the active combat that i have a problem with. It’s how it’s been implemented.

I can’t really argue what is too many keys for a person to handle, but I can say that ANet has tried to make it as simple as possible working with the assumption that they need all those keys. ex. The shortest cooldown skills are the easily reached keys (1+2). I can also say that GW2 is quite simple compared to many other games in the MMO genre where 40+ binds are common. That is little consolation for someone new to the genre, but fewer keybinds does mean fewer options and you risk further dumbing-down what is already one of the most streamlined/restricted control schemes of the genre if you try to remove keys.

Having an answer for every situation is a very powerful thing but all those options comes at the price of your own personal skill.

A big reason that warriors are so popular is that they perform well with minimal difficulty. Just throwing down your banners and mashing 1 and 2 will get you most of the way there. That said, the same thing is true of the elementalist. You do have a ton of options and skills available to you, but odds are you will stick to 3 or 4 of them. One of the current most effective ele PvE builds revolves around stacking might with a couple blast finishers (one in earth, the rest are utilities) and then sitting in Fire spamming 1 and 2 on cooldown. You may occasionally press 5 for your meteor shower, but for the majority of a fight you only need to focus on 3 keys for combat and the rest you can focus on movement/dodging which should be second nature for anyone who has played a PC game (WASD). So yea, you might have 22 keys you could be ready to use, but in practice its more like 8. Those extra 14 keys are what separate the good from the great and its something to learn and improve yourself with.

Xillllix.3485:

The game’s combat is fine, but skills and classes need a better balance (specially useless skills and traits) and the targeting system needs improvement (like an option to ignore enemy pets, mesmer clones and ambient creatures when you aim for nearest target)

Tab priotitises epic bosses→ enemy legendary/champions→ enemy players/clones→ enemy elites→enemy veterans→enemy pets/minions/phantasms/etc.→enemy normal mobs→ ambients in that order.

Clones will always be on the same priority as players because that’s the entire point of them.

GW2 has some of the best combat controls and mechanics in the genre (if not the best).

The OP is complaining about the elementalist, which I count as an advanced class for those with 20 fingers on their wasd hand. Its the type of class you play when a “normal” one is starting to limit you. All kit engineer is the same thing.

So its understandable, but not a problem.

You may have 20 weapon skills, but only a handful are useful on a regular basis. For a significant amount of weapons, they either just use one skill on a cooldown and auto-attack, with the rest of the skills being miscellaneous utility you probably aren’t going to use in open world PVE.

Things like cripple, immobilize, knockback and such. Ele can honestly get by fine just hitting 1 with mainhand daggers. The enemy will die before you do.

The most unyieldy thing about GW2’s controls, is probably using utility ground targets while moving.

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Every time I watch a dev play in a live stream I understand some of the frustrating control design choices.

The gamepad generation ruins all.

Rebindable untargeting (anything but Double-ESC) and mouse that doesn’t disappear when you hold down right click to move with camera… Please, just that.. The rest I can live with.

Yes please.

@thread
OP is just complaining about the elementalist class, or is also new to MMO’s in general.
I recall 50 skill slots being used simultaneously in the last MMO I played.

Seems like a you problem

DeceiverX.8361:

OP is just complaining about the elementalist class, or is also new to MMO’s in general.
I recall 50 skill slots being used simultaneously in the last MMO I played.

OK… To all who keep spouting off this stupid “I’ve just played an MMO with 30+ keys, newb.” nonsense:

Do those MMO’s also require you to move around ALL THE TIME and DODGE? Because anyone can just stand there and click on hotbar buttons all day. The reason I love and hate GW2 is that it is far from that. That’s the core of what makes GW2 frustrating for me. Not because I have all these abilities and attunements and etc, but because you ALWAYS need a hand on the WASD keys WHILE having all that stuff. You cannot stand there. Well… I guess you could but you’re gonna take it hard.

I really really really want to like this game. Heck, I loved a lot of the first one. (Although GW and GW2 play pretty differently to be fair.) And especially now that that expansion pack with those features we’ve all been waiting for is coming out. But GW2 is really not making this easy. Now, could I have selected a wrong class to begin with? Most likely. But 1. I’ve played an Ele before in GW so I thought I would have a somewhat easy time with this and 2. To put it quite stubbornly, I picked an Ele because that’s what I wanna be and play. Not a warrior or anything else. At least not right now.

Anyway though, I really want to thank everyone who gave me some advice and tips on how to control my character. Know I’ve read every word of that advice and do plan to suck it up and go at it again. Thank you.

The combat is he most fluid ive ever seen in any ‘action’ mmorpg… i dont see or have any problems with it.. and i am playing a ele

Arnox.5128:

DeceiverX.8361:

OP is just complaining about the elementalist class, or is also new to MMO’s in general.
I recall 50 skill slots being used simultaneously in the last MMO I played.

OK… To all who keep spouting off this stupid “I’ve just played an MMO with 30+ keys, newb.” nonsense:

Do those MMO’s also require you to move around ALL THE TIME and DODGE? Because anyone can just stand there and click on hotbar buttons all day.

I know that comment wasnt directed at me

I started out playing WoW during the vanilla days on a prot warrior and combat/dagger rogue. Moving around and dodging stuff wasnt necessary on most fights. But i moved around anyways even if i didnt need to. I would circle strafing back and forth in little arcs behind bosses and hop around like a maniac while doing my rotation. Now somebody might see me doing that and think i was trying to be annoying. But i wasnt being annoying…I was actually giving both hands and all my fingers as much to do as possible. And the best place to practice all of that was easy boss fights. That way when i did the hard fights i could maintain my rotation, stay mobile, move out of aoe and pan my camera around all at the same time. All of that experience transferred over to games like GW2, TSW and Wildstar. It even helped me out on ranged classes that could cast while on the move.

Maybe you should try something similar? Stick with your Elem but maybe try Fire or Air dagger/dagger (air imo). Do like i mentioned above and give both your fingers and hands as much to do as possible. When fighting a mob do random circle strafes left and right but dont hop since in GW2 that cancels some of your attacks i think. Maybe bind your dodge key to a mouse button and see if that improves your response times? When you are fighting mobs in an area pay attention to their ability “tells” and learn how to see which attacks are which. First focus on perfecting your ability to stay mobile, doing those arcs and dodging attacks. Maintain a simple rotation (which D/D air is good for) at first and as you get comfortable moving and dodging you can start to make your rotation a bit more complex.

Try playing a warrior or guardian. The minimum difficulty involved in playing elementalists and engineers isn’t on the same order of magnitude as playing those two.

And by the way, Arnox, with regards to:

“Do those MMO’s also require you to move around ALL THE TIME and DODGE?”

Tera does. For the Slayer class in particular, in addition to positioning within a 3 degree margin of error being compulsory for your attacks to even hit (you must manually aim, you don’t attack automatically in the correct direction), you also have up to 3 seconds of delay before your skill activates. You’re also expected to use them on moving targets. And your only form of defense is dodging – you don’t have invuln skills like GW2 elementalists do. Tera still has 20+ odd skills on the skill bar, and to make things worse, for some skills to be at maximum viability, they have to be chained in a specific order – so you have to keep track of that while dodging while timing and aiming your attacks.

GW2’s difficulty isn’t anywhere close to that.

Never had any problem with it, though my first character is an ele. You just rebind the f key abilities to something easier to press.

My little lady hands are thankful for my logitech gaming mouse :p

I like how the OP proposes to be a champion of “the new player” for whom all this is supposedly hard.

We don’t all share your experience with it. I found it trivially easy pretty much since day 1, thanks. I find the auto-targeting to be maybe the dumbest in the history of MMOs, but “cluttered” is definitely not a reaction I have to 10 whole skill buttons and a loot vacuum/interact key.

other then the f1-f4 and 10 hotbar keys wsad dodge and loot key thats 20 keys whats the last 2? ( and other then some classes only having 1-4 f keys all others are the same )

and sure as a elemntalist you got 20 weapon skills but you reuse the same keys 4 times anyway so its still only 5 keys like any other class.
Whats the big deal?

The OP is the reason gaming mouses exist. I don’t know that I could play this game without one.

Cluncky and unfriendly? YOu must be an Elder Scrolls Online troll. The combat system in GW2 is the reason I can’t play any other MMO ever again. Cuz it’s friggin awesome. Cluncky?! Ever played Elder Scrolls Online, Rift, LOTRO,…

Vayne.8563:

The OP is the reason gaming mouses exist. I don’t know that I could play this game without one.

My wife tried playing it with a regular 3 button mouse for a couple weeks. Then she hopped on my gaming rig one day and fiddled around with my Razr Naga, then promptly went and got a Logitech g600 for herself (she liked it better. They’re kitten spiffy too).

She’ll never go back. Frankly, neither would I in a game that’s as reflex-heavy as this one.

naiasonod.9265:

Vayne.8563:

The OP is the reason gaming mouses exist. I don’t know that I could play this game without one.

My wife tried playing it with a regular 3 button mouse for a couple weeks. Then she hopped on my gaming rig one day and fiddled around with my Razr Naga, then promptly went and got a Logitech g600 for herself (she liked it better. They’re kitten spiffy too).

She’ll never go back. Frankly, neither would I in a game that’s as reflex-heavy as this one.

I’m an old old old school gamer. Prior to game past we only had joysticks. This whole having to hit a zillion keys at the same time is way past my body’s learning curve. I move with my left and and, for the most part skill with my right, except my heal and my elite which are Q and E. I have my strafe keys at A and D. I had to take off keyboard turning to force myself to learn to mouse turn. And it still took a while.

But then, I’m playing catch up to people who played this games from birth and to them it’s just second nature.

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but have you tried messing with the keybindings? You can set the numerous keys to whatever is easier for you. In consoles it’s called ‘button config’. I’m guessing you aren’t used to playing games on a PC and too accustomed to console games and their limited button options. It takes practice. I remember when I first started playing PC games. I felt overwhelmed by the number of buttons I could press. After a while though I got used to it. THe first time I played a shooter on the PC I was like “OMG the camera moves too much! The slightest movement of my mouse moves my cursor like crazy!” Now, years later, I can’t go back to consoles… It’s just not as fun for me. I feel like you are in the minority, but with ArenaNet catering more to casual gamers it’s not surprising that more console gamers are starting to get their feet wet in the realm of PC gaming. That adjustment period is a must, though. It’s what sets apart good players from bad ones. Don’t be a bad player. Practice. Learn. Adapt. I did it, so can you.

Hylgeriak.8250:

Cluncky and unfriendly? YOu must be an Elder Scrolls Online troll. The combat system in GW2 is the reason I can’t play any other MMO ever again. Cuz it’s friggin awesome. Cluncky?! Ever played Elder Scrolls Online, Rift, LOTRO,…

you must have died allot in ESO if you think ESO doesn’t need as much control as GW2, GW2 is all autopilot whether ESO is all manually from the player.
GW2 has the battle system (within autopilot ofcouse) of ESO but has the old targeting system of GW, something that makes this combat system chunky as hell.

have you any idea how many times i attacked a neutral enemy just because the target system sucks so horribly, do you have any idea how many times i died just because the game de-sellects the enemy i was attacking and then attacks a different enemy group…
if they fixed the targeting system for ones then yes, i can say it’s not so chunky but until then, it’s a horrible mess.

Let’s see if I got this right…

First of all, I have truly never realy mastered Elementalist becouse I can’t realy atunement dance that good. I am good with elementalist but there is so much I miss to be realy effective. So I will say that Elementalist is one of the hardest classes to master but you don’t have to attunment dance to be a good Elementalist.

In my opinion, Combat engine in this game is the best ever and I am a real fan of it. I think that this engine gives GW2 a life that is realy missing from other MMOrpg’s where fights are usually stale and booring. The only gripe (Is that the word “gripe”?) I have with it is the target system, I hate that when targets get of screen I sometimes loose target or sometimes I just drop target without reason (I have tried every target option, it still happens) and that you can’t target nearest enemy if it out of screen and big bosses target box is so high up that if you are to close you have to pan camera up to be able to use Target Nearest enemy.

Also as Vayne says, a mouse with some extra buttons is nice. I got my F1, F2 and 9 skills on my mouse (Do not have a gaming mouse) and it helps alot.

And… I am not that used to FPS so I am not sure why I doing this but when I play I do not like to use the scroll weel to switch weapons I do like to press a button to choose correct weapon. In some FPS I have played buttons are.

1, 2, 3 ,4 , 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0, W, A, S, D, Q, E, Mouse 1, Mouse 2, Mouse X, F, G, Space, Shift, C, Z I can’t remember more but this to play efficiently with Jump, Walk, Strafe, Crouching, Crawling, Look over corners, Throw Granades, Use devises, Sprinting, Fire/Shooting, change weapons, Zooming with scoopes and secondary fire.

In GW2
1, 2, 3 ,4 , 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0, W, A, S, D, Mouse 1, Mouse 2, F ,Space, F1, F2, F3, F4. What I can remember. This to play efficiently with; Move, Jump, using skills, Move camera, Move character+Camera, dodge, use Devices.

In both types of games you can keybind the keys however you want so it fits your playstile. I don’t think GW has to many buttons, atleast not if we compare to other MMOrpg’s atleast.

i use 1 2 3 4 5 wsad utility z x c heal shift +x and elite shift e f1-f4 q e m3 m4 rest aint changed so no need to type em

Arnox.5128:

…else I feel I’m just gonna start dying all the time and be worthless.

The second half of this quote is accurate.

If playing Elementalist is too hard for you then pick one of the the other seven classes. No one said you had to hold your hand in the fire if it hurts…

When I first started out I had a bit of a rough time with the controls because of how awkward it was to be strafing or running while holding down W or D and trying to reach over to mash 6 to heal (and hitting 5 instead, which can potentially catapult me toward the enemy I’m trying to get away from, depending on class).

Things became a lot easier when I mapped alternate keys for the 6-0 skills: Shift + 1-5. All of my controls are condensed to the left side of the keyboard with this setup, which improves my mobility, ability to fire off the skills I want, and lets me AoE target/mouse look with my trackball instead of wasting time trying to poke at the utility bar with the cursor (which tends to get lost in the confusion usually).

Arnox.5128:

DeceiverX.8361:

OP is just complaining about the elementalist class, or is also new to MMO’s in general.
I recall 50 skill slots being used simultaneously in the last MMO I played.

OK… To all who keep spouting off this stupid “I’ve just played an MMO with 30+ keys, newb.” nonsense:

Do those MMO’s also require you to move around ALL THE TIME and DODGE? Because anyone can just stand there and click on hotbar buttons all day. The reason I love and hate GW2 is that it is far from that. That’s the core of what makes GW2 frustrating for me. Not because I have all these abilities and attunements and etc, but because you ALWAYS need a hand on the WASD keys WHILE having all that stuff. You cannot stand there. Well… I guess you could but you’re gonna take it hard.

I really really really want to like this game. Heck, I loved a lot of the first one. (Although GW and GW2 play pretty differently to be fair.) And especially now that that expansion pack with those features we’ve all been waiting for is coming out. But GW2 is really not making this easy. Now, could I have selected a wrong class to begin with? Most likely. But 1. I’ve played an Ele before in GW so I thought I would have a somewhat easy time with this and 2. To put it quite stubbornly, I picked an Ele because that’s what I wanna be and play. Not a warrior or anything else. At least not right now.

Anyway though, I really want to thank everyone who gave me some advice and tips on how to control my character. Know I’ve read every word of that advice and do plan to suck it up and go at it again. Thank you.

Aside from dodging, yes. Actually, in most of these games, there are no AOE circles, so often you have to just know exactly where to be and when by memorizing all pre-cast animations/effects and knowing their radii by practicing a lot. I came from a game where the only form of active defense my main class had from was kiting/not getting hit by anything at all, for it had no other defenses and the lowest HP and armor values in the game with no other forms of defense. If you got hit by any stray AOE, got in the range of any CC, or simply didn’t know exactly when all of your enemy’s cooldowns were ready or not, you fell over dead and died in one auto-attack.

So no, it’s not a problem with GW2. It’s general ineptness with keeping up with the APM for playing the elementalist you need to do. I’m not saying you’re “bad” or anything, it’s just that your complaint is pretty much directly related to the fact you are playing the highest-APM class in the game in general, and one that frankly does require a lot of attention/practice in regards of what to press and when. It’s really not uncommon in these kinds of games to need to meet such requirements, and to say this is a problem with GW2 alone is simply a fallacy. Even runescape offers higher APM than some of the classes in GW2. Positional knowledge and requirements are part of playing any game, and in time you come to learn and better understand them. It’s not GW2’s fault so much as it is your inexperience either playing the game/class or games that are more demanding like it.

If you want to call those who say that your claims are incorrect as “stupid,” on the sheer basis that you think they are wrong with no evidence whatsoever, you’re not going to get positive responses. This is seriously just a matter of practice.

So yea, I have no advice if you believe this is a problem with GW2 rather than the elementalist class or overall requirements of most MMO’s out there and dismiss any other claims otherwise, because if you genuinely believe that, other class recommendations (I.E., not an elementalist or engineer) mean nothing and simply you’re helpless.

OP should change the title of the thread to “I have a problem with GW2 battle mechanics”……as it is obviously a subjective problem. If the OP is having that many problems playing an ele, I don’t understand why he/she doesn’t switch to trying an easier(keyboard/mouse wise) sort of character, rather than just being stubbornly frustrated with an ele and thinking one has to do some sort of absurd attunement dance. Yea, an ele can be a bit more difficult, but one rarely has to use even close to all the attunement skills that an ele is given to play one effectively.

I find them to be very fun characters to play, because they require a bit more skill and focus to play well, especially in wvw. And the attunements are basically for different sorts of battle situations and/or combatants. You don’t enter every battle thinking you have to use all 4 attunements during that battle…..you will ALWAYS be frustrated with the ele if you approach it in that way.

Try another, easier on the keys toon so you can get used to the combat system first. After doing that, I think you’d be less frustrated with the ele, unless you’re stubbornly convinced that you have to use all the attunements.

And on the subject of battle mechanics…..GW2 is far better and easier than most mmorpgs. And yea, you moved around a lot while in combat in those other mmorpgs, too. Some of the older mmorpgs got just absurd with how many different specials, abilities, etc that you had to use during combat.

Not trying to be offensive or cruel, OP. Just be patient, try and get used to the combat mechanics, be creative with your specials and such, and don’t feel like you have to use all of them……kick back and enjoy the game…..learn from your frustrations, and try an easier character first if your frustration with the ele outweighs your fun with it.

And I also agree with those that recommended mapping different actions to different keys and mouse buttons, if possible. The defaults that are setup in the game are not the best for most people. Also, I agree with getting programmable mouses/keyboards that make gaming easier for a lot of people. Even a fairly simple, extra buttons somewhat programmable mouse makes a big difference for some players.

Best of luck!

You can always rebind your keys to something more comfortable, so that you won’t have to stretch your hands to reach the 6-7-8-9-10 keys

No, the biggest problem truly, is the lack of being able to zoom the camera while holding down right-click via the mouse scroll wheel.

For the title to make more sense, what really needs address is how user unfriendly containers are. I would love them to finally add an Open All function for bags, chest and ect. GW2 has some of the best Quality of Life features of any MMO and this one single horrible quality of life destroying aspect still exist.

Arnox.5128:

Now lets look at GW2 playing as an Elementalist. (My current starting profession.) Counting them up all up, you have about 22 keys for combat that you need to be able to press at any time in order to be competent. (and that’s being nice and not including the four different dodge directions.)

Uh, 22? I come up with 20 best case, and that’s assuming a class with a full class bar (compare, say, Necromancer) and assuming you need to WvW and use siege and all.

• 10 action slots
• 4 directional movement keys
• 4 class bar slots
• dodge key (it’s one, not four)
• potentially the interact key

I can’t really come up with anything else I’d use in combat.

Now comparing most “modern” (read: weapon-limited) FPS, and ofc, yes, that’s ~10 keys more as most modern FPS use only 3-4 weapons.
Yet that’s the point, GW2 is more difficult to play well than a FPS, by virtually of having more abilities to use which in turn recharge longer.
The latter is a very important point. Yes you are using more abilities, but individually they have fairly lengthy cooldowns, meaning at any given time you only need to worry about 10-11 keys (and abilities).

This is how I meow and it workz majestically.