Thoughtful criticism of the game

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

The last good addition to the game were Fractals. It was obvious that the team that made them really learned something about designing dungeon instances, considering how awful the regular dungeons were and still are. The same can not be said about the Living Story. It’s still badly written and nonsensical and, since it’s on such a short cycle, there probably isn’t much room for sitting down and thinking of ways to become better. That’s why I assume the LS hurts real content.

Except that parts of the living story are quite good and some are even brilliant. It’s like you’re making the ‘story’ all the living story was about. Lots of people, for example, loved the Molten Facility dungeon. Lots of people also like Southsun Survival and Sanctum Sprint. And a whole lot of people seemed to like the Zephyrite area, when that was in the game. Saying that the fractals was good and something like Zephyr Sanctum isn’t…I’m pretty sure more people visited and enjoyed the Zephyr Sanctum than currently enjoy fractals.

The problem is, people who like dungeons think of dungeons as the main content of MMOs. People who like open world think of the open world as the main content of MMOs. People who like farming think of farming as the main content of MMOs.

I like the new Twilight Arbor path as much as I like the Fractals…yet it’s part of the Living Story, but I’m not at heart a dungeon guy. I much prefer open world content to instanced content (and probably always will).

I think you’re simply saying that the content you like is real content and the content others like is somehow less real.

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Posted by: Alex.9567

Alex.9567

No one can pin point whats wrong with this game because its a design flaw that was there from the very beginning i.e. they tried to build the game from the ground up with ‘balance’ in mind, the irony is its backfired and made a lot of stuff bland. the way forward is to take the same methodology that made the 1st GW have a cult following i.e. for fun and stop worrying about balancing 1st and how to milk the cash shop, why do you keep restraining your imaginations because your afraid of balancing issues? obviously balacing is important but when it makes races/and professions and storys bland then your missing the point

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Posted by: Arimahn.3568

Arimahn.3568

The only balancing that is being done is with sPvP in mind. It’s high time for a PvE/PvP split of skills.

Why don’t they do that? NOBODY KNOWS.

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Posted by: Arimahn.3568

Arimahn.3568

I think you’re simply saying that the content you like is real content and the content others like is somehow less real.

I was largely referring to the story part of the LS. Some of the areas were indeed good but they are gone now, so what did it matter?

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Posted by: DocHolliday.5921

DocHolliday.5921

As a Pve ’er my main problem with the game is how broken Risk vs. Reward is. The fact that you make equal if not more money running in a champ train over running the most difficult content (arah/48+ fractals) blows my mind.

We need INSTANCED elite content as well. PvE is way to easy right now.

Risk/Reward is messed up everywhere in the game.

Pvp balance especially.

My biggest grievance with the game is the lack of skills/build variety and just…. “FUN”.

Still over a year in and still no new traits/skills, and on top of that, skill/traits that have been garbage since beta… are still garbage… Over a year in.. Cmon now.

I still can’t see how people think this is better than GW1 was, at any point from launch.

It depends on what you play for. Guild Wars 1 had great skills and great builds, but not everyone liked that aspect of the game. Guild Wars 1 was completely “pathed”. It was hard to go off road. If you ran into a log, you had to turn around and go back. Not all people liked that aspect of the game.

But mostly Guild Wars 1 was instanced. There was no chance of running into a random stranger out in the open world and a lot of people, myself included, simply prefer a persistent world.

Maybe I don’t want to start over in a zone if I want someone to join me.

Yes, so the only actual improvement in GW2 is the persistent world, and even that is still somewhat instanced as you can only get from one zone to another through portals. (See WoW for how to do it right.) The only other advantage I can think of for GW2 is the AH – and that’s also not nearly as good as in many other MMOs. Everything else in GW2 is worse or at least no better than GW1. That’s just… sad.

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Posted by: scerevisiae.1972

scerevisiae.1972

Yes, so the only actual improvement in GW2 is the persistent world, and even that is still somewhat instanced as you can only get from one zone to another through portals. (See WoW for how to do it right.) The only other advantage I can think of for GW2 is the AH – and that’s also not nearly as good as in many other MMOs. Everything else in GW2 is worse or at least no better than GW1. That’s just… sad.

Yes I really think they made a colossal mistake in leaving out the best parts of the original game: the skill depth & variety, the amount of build choice through secondary classes, skill capping, elite skills, mobs using player skills with decent AI.

As with any software product, the bits you replace have to be better than the bits you’re replacing, and in GW2, they aren’t.

downed state is bad for PVP

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Posted by: Relentliss.2170

Relentliss.2170

Yes, so the only actual improvement in GW2 is the persistent world, and even that is still somewhat instanced as you can only get from one zone to another through portals. (See WoW for how to do it right.) The only other advantage I can think of for GW2 is the AH – and that’s also not nearly as good as in many other MMOs. Everything else in GW2 is worse or at least no better than GW1. That’s just… sad.

Yes I really think they made a colossal mistake in leaving out the best parts of the original game: the skill depth & variety, the amount of build choice through secondary classes, skill capping, elite skills, mobs using player skills with decent AI.

As with any software product, the bits you replace have to be better than the bits you’re replacing, and in GW2, they aren’t.

Agree 100%

The game reeks of shallowness. On the surface it has so much potential, but its just shallow. I agree with everything in the Reddit post.

We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional

Anet lied (where’s the Manifesto now?)

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Posted by: DocHolliday.5921

DocHolliday.5921

Yes, so the only actual improvement in GW2 is the persistent world, and even that is still somewhat instanced as you can only get from one zone to another through portals. (See WoW for how to do it right.) The only other advantage I can think of for GW2 is the AH – and that’s also not nearly as good as in many other MMOs. Everything else in GW2 is worse or at least no better than GW1. That’s just… sad.

Yes I really think they made a colossal mistake in leaving out the best parts of the original game: the skill depth & variety, the amount of build choice through secondary classes, skill capping, elite skills, mobs using player skills with decent AI.

As with any software product, the bits you replace have to be better than the bits you’re replacing, and in GW2, they aren’t.

Also agree 100%. Thank you for a great post.

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Posted by: Xae Isareth.1364

Xae Isareth.1364

But I disagree about Twilight Assault. It’s by far my favorite dungeon in the game to date..well maybe except for the Fractals. But it’s up there.

Is it because of the mechanics, story or both? While i am not really fond of aetherblade retreat-style dungeons and think that Assault could have been made easier a bit, i can understand that there are people that like it. That’s not what i was talking about. I was solely concentrating here on basing its fluff on aetherblade/scarlet story arc (though i guess i didn’t make it clear enough).

It’s not much worse than any dungeon in most MMOs. Everyone seems to think that every story has to be high drama and engaging. Dungeons in most games have mediocre stories. In fact, stories in dungeons are really just excuses for mechanics. If I want great stories, I read books.

The idea isn’t really a bad one, set up wise. You’ve got the Lion Guard who have reason to be angry at Scarlet over the death of a captain. You have Caithe who is lured there for other reasons. And your’e in the middle clearing the way.

The story does exactly what it’s supposed to do for a dungeon. It sets up the action. That’s it. That’s the purpose of stories in dungeons. As far as I can remember, it’s pretty much always been the purpose.

I mean it is better than Heart of the Shiverpeakes in Guild Wars 1 where we’re sent to get a hammer to do a ritual? I don’t think so. That entire hammer quest was an excuse to make is go through a dungeon. The end boss mechanics was more like a minigame. It was fine because that’s what stories in dungeons are. A reason to go do them.

You actually can’t place important story in some dungeons. Imagine if the conclusion to a long arc of plot involves having to beat a hardcore dungeon which only about 5% of players manage, wouldn’t that suck?

Same with the new TA dungeon. That path is almost definitely the hardest dungeon path in the game bar maybe Arah P4, and I’m willing to bet that probably most players havn’t completed it.

Regarding the ‘collossal’ mistake of leaving out a lot of GW1’s mechanics. Its very subjective which areas they place in, for example, a lot of people would absolutely hate it if they ever brought heroes and henchmen back because that wrecked PUGing and grouplay in PvE in general, whilst we’ve also got a ton of people asking for its return.

Giving variety is good, but you often end up sacrificing balance for it, simply because it becomes very hard to balance things. Then balance becomes constantly changing the meta instead of trying to balance all builds.

(edited by Xae Isareth.1364)

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Posted by: DocHolliday.5921

DocHolliday.5921

You actually can’t place important story in some dungeons. Imagine if the conclusion to a long arc of plot involves having to beat a hardcore dungeon which only about 5% of players manage, wouldn’t that suck?

Same with the new TA dungeon. That path is almost definitely the hardest dungeon path in the game bar maybe Arah P4, and I’m willing to bet that probably most players havn’t completed it.

Regarding the ‘collossal’ mistake of leaving out a lot of GW1’s mechanics. Its very subjective which areas they place in, for example, a lot of people would absolutely hate it if they ever brought heroes and henchmen back because that wrecked PUGing and grouplay in PvE in general, whilst we’ve also got a ton of people asking for its return.

Giving variety is good, but you often end up sacrificing balance for it, simply because it becomes very hard to balance things. Then balance becomes constantly changing the meta instead of trying to balance all builds.

Agree more or less with most of your points, but gotta disagree with the premise of your last paragraph. If I understand correctly, you’re implying that it’s therefore better to leave out the variety, and I disagree. It’s impossible to balance different builds, period. The only way you can ever really balance things is by making everything identical. This is why in any kind of PvP game with different skills and such, the balancing is never done. So if you can’t actually balance it anyway, why not give variety? I never saw more complaints about balance in GW than any other game. As far as I can tell, that system worked just as well or better balance-wise as any system I’ve ever seen in any MMORPG for PvP.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

I think you’re simply saying that the content you like is real content and the content others like is somehow less real.

I was largely referring to the story part of the LS. Some of the areas were indeed good but they are gone now, so what did it matter?

Last week we had a block party on my block. It’s gone now. What did it matter? A few months ago, I saw Phantom of the Opera. It’s a good show, but it’s gone now. What did it matter? A new deli opened on main street, and stayed there, while the chicken place next to it went out of business. What did it matter?

What people experiences matter. It really is that simple. Have you ever gone on vacation? At the end, all you have left are photos and souvenirs. That’s it. That’s all you end up with. That’s what Anet gives up. We can take screen shots, we get souvenirs (in the form of minis and back pieces or torches or whatever) and then we move on. And we get achievement points so that keeps ticking over.

There are so many things in this game I’d be happy to never do again. Some paths of Arah come to mind. The new Ghost Eater path comes to mind. The cow event in diessa plateau where you have to dress up like a cow comes to mind. I don’t care if I ever do them again. If they were removed from the game, I couldn’t care less. I’ve done them.

At the end of the day, most people in most games only care about new content. You can deny this if you want, but I don’t think it’s any different from books or movies. Everyone wants to see the new movies, the new TV series, the new books. Older stuff disappears and stops selling pretty fast, for the most part anyway.

The story part of the Living Story was supposed to be innocuous so people didn’t miss it. This is what Anet said. It’s also the reason the Living Story has been renamed the Living World. It’s about the world, not the story. It’s about giving players stuff to do (which at the end of the day is all any MMO is about).

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Posted by: Xae Isareth.1364

Xae Isareth.1364

You actually can’t place important story in some dungeons. Imagine if the conclusion to a long arc of plot involves having to beat a hardcore dungeon which only about 5% of players manage, wouldn’t that suck?

Same with the new TA dungeon. That path is almost definitely the hardest dungeon path in the game bar maybe Arah P4, and I’m willing to bet that probably most players havn’t completed it.

Regarding the ‘collossal’ mistake of leaving out a lot of GW1’s mechanics. Its very subjective which areas they place in, for example, a lot of people would absolutely hate it if they ever brought heroes and henchmen back because that wrecked PUGing and grouplay in PvE in general, whilst we’ve also got a ton of people asking for its return.

Giving variety is good, but you often end up sacrificing balance for it, simply because it becomes very hard to balance things. Then balance becomes constantly changing the meta instead of trying to balance all builds.

Agree more or less with most of your points, but gotta disagree with the premise of your last paragraph. If I understand correctly, you’re implying that it’s therefore better to leave out the variety, and I disagree. It’s impossible to balance different builds, period. The only way you can ever really balance things is by making everything identical. This is why in any kind of PvP game with different skills and such, the balancing is never done. So if you can’t actually balance it anyway, why not give variety? I never saw more complaints about balance in GW than any other game. As far as I can tell, that system worked just as well or better balance-wise as any system I’ve ever seen in any MMORPG for PvP.

I’m not saying to leave out variety, I’m saying that for what they wanted the game to become, GW1’s system would not work for PvP.

The reason why GW2 removed some of the variety in favor for balance was because it wanted to go eSports, which heavily scrutinizes balance. Whether that decision was good or bad, who knows?

PS: frankly I think they should give up the idea of eSports altogether, because in my opinion, becoming an eSport and turning your game into a competition removes most of the fun factor and adds in a ton of red tape.

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Posted by: Drakenvold.9761

Drakenvold.9761

to me my biggest complaint is the story.after you complete the personal story thats it story wise,no side stuff to do..the living story is convulted and leading nowhere,Scarlet is not good enough as an uber vilan mastermind,the home instance is empty and for a whole year ive been the second in command of the Pact,in the shadow of a late arriving NPC sylvari who took all the glory and ive been attending bashes and festivals when there dragons and bandits and villanous stuff to end,where is the human sister after you complete the quest?what of the Orders?the Pact even?..you dont see anyone anymore and the choices i made just affected which nps would stay at my deserted home instance doing nothing,im a lore driven guys,i love a good story and gw2 is lacking in that departement,so if i dont want to pvp or WvW im stuck with mini games and temporary content for a year..i like the game but im finding it kinda hard to log in if i got nothing to do,the same guild missions,the same matches and following the zerg or capture points..it doesnt advance my character,or my story,i dont want a legendary shiny skin,i want meaning,a purpose!!..sorry i dont mean to seem angry or disrespect any of you fine gents,but fellow players its becoming kind of grindy as of late

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Posted by: chemiclord.3978

chemiclord.3978

Incoming rant from a disgruntled ex-player:

That OP is pretty good, but I still think that MMO players as a whole have become far too obsessed with the concept of rewards, and developers have been pandering to them to the detriment of what should really matter: game-play.

Removed most of the quote to save space. I agree with all of your points. Also liked the OP. This plays into what I rediscovered today when I came back for a couple hours after having quit months ago. Sadly, I’ll be leaving again for those same reasons. There’s just nothing here for me right now. I miss the first GW, and would still be playing if my account hadn’t got hacked. This was before they implemented the account roll-back feature, and at the time all they could do was tell me I was SOL. I just didn’t have the heart to regrind my Obsidian set and everything else.

The problem is that a company really CAN’T be the driving factor to changing player behavior. If your customers want [x], and you think it’s for the best they don’t have it, and should have [y] instead… guess what happens when you try to sell [y]?

Customers drop you like a bad habit, and buy from a different vendor that gives them [x].

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Posted by: DocHolliday.5921

DocHolliday.5921

You actually can’t place important story in some dungeons. Imagine if the conclusion to a long arc of plot involves having to beat a hardcore dungeon which only about 5% of players manage, wouldn’t that suck?

Same with the new TA dungeon. That path is almost definitely the hardest dungeon path in the game bar maybe Arah P4, and I’m willing to bet that probably most players havn’t completed it.

Regarding the ‘collossal’ mistake of leaving out a lot of GW1’s mechanics. Its very subjective which areas they place in, for example, a lot of people would absolutely hate it if they ever brought heroes and henchmen back because that wrecked PUGing and grouplay in PvE in general, whilst we’ve also got a ton of people asking for its return.

Giving variety is good, but you often end up sacrificing balance for it, simply because it becomes very hard to balance things. Then balance becomes constantly changing the meta instead of trying to balance all builds.

Agree more or less with most of your points, but gotta disagree with the premise of your last paragraph. If I understand correctly, you’re implying that it’s therefore better to leave out the variety, and I disagree. It’s impossible to balance different builds, period. The only way you can ever really balance things is by making everything identical. This is why in any kind of PvP game with different skills and such, the balancing is never done. So if you can’t actually balance it anyway, why not give variety? I never saw more complaints about balance in GW than any other game. As far as I can tell, that system worked just as well or better balance-wise as any system I’ve ever seen in any MMORPG for PvP.

I’m not saying to leave out variety, I’m saying that for what they wanted the game to become, GW1’s system would not work for PvP.

The reason why GW2 removed some of the variety in favor for balance was because it wanted to go eSports, which heavily scrutinizes balance. Whether that decision was good or bad, who knows?

PS: frankly I think they should give up the idea of eSports altogether, because in my opinion, becoming an eSport and turning your game into a competition removes most of the fun factor and adds in a ton of red tape.

So I simply misunderstood you. Thanks for clarifying.

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Posted by: Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

But what do you miss when you miss that temporary content? Some achievement points and a backpiece? A minipet.

The above seems to be contradicted by the below. You dismiss any concern that one might be missing something by skipping a chapter of living story…

Except that parts of the living story are quite good and some are even brilliant.

…and then claim that one would be potentially missing something very good and even brilliant.

Those two points, both from this very thread, are mutually exclusive. Either one is missing something brilliant by skipping a LS chapter or there is nothing of significance to be missed by skipping a LS chapter.

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Posted by: killcannon.2576

killcannon.2576

But what do you miss when you miss that temporary content? Some achievement points and a backpiece? A minipet.

The above seems to be contradicted by the below. You dismiss any concern that one might be missing something by skipping a chapter of living story…

Except that parts of the living story are quite good and some are even brilliant.

…and then claim that one would be potentially missing something very good and even brilliant.

Those two points, both from this very thread, are mutually exclusive. Either one is missing something brilliant by skipping a LS chapter or there is nothing of significance to be missed by skipping a LS chapter.

You must be new here.

Logic doesn’t work on Vayne.

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Posted by: Alex.9567

Alex.9567

sorry getting a little nostalgic here, OP talks about his gw1 experience and it reminded me of the impact the original game had on me – i remember the first time i got to yaks bend in gw1, it was probably in 2006-2007, looking back i loved how the change of environment suited the storyline progression, i remember getting this sense of having traveled a great distance and arriving at a refuge in the snow, i remember that big pig on the spit in the center of the outpost and just going and sitting by the fire, that was one thing the original nailed that the sequel didn’t – merging the change in landscape to the story progression to really give the player that sense of moving forward and making progress, and that success came from not over thinking what works but just doing what was fun, and imo thats how they need to start thinking again.

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Posted by: DocHolliday.5921

DocHolliday.5921

sorry getting a little nostalgic here, OP talks about his gw1 experience and it reminded me of the impact the original game had on me – i remember the first time i got to yaks bend in gw1, it was probably in 2006-2007, looking back i loved how the change of environment suited the storyline progression, i remember getting this sense of having traveled a great distance and arriving at a refuge in the snow, i remember that big pig on the spit in the center of the outpost and just going and sitting by the fire, that was one thing the original nailed that the sequel didn’t – merging the change in landscape to the story progression to really give the player that sense of moving forward and making progress, and that success came from not over thinking what works but just doing what was fun, and imo thats how they need to start thinking again.

No need to apologize, that’s a very nice post.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

But what do you miss when you miss that temporary content? Some achievement points and a backpiece? A minipet.

The above seems to be contradicted by the below. You dismiss any concern that one might be missing something by skipping a chapter of living story…

Except that parts of the living story are quite good and some are even brilliant.

…and then claim that one would be potentially missing something very good and even brilliant.

Those two points, both from this very thread, are mutually exclusive. Either one is missing something brilliant by skipping a LS chapter or there is nothing of significance to be missed by skipping a LS chapter.

So far the best stuff from the Living Story isn’t gone forever. For example, a lot of people loved the Zephyr Sanctum and it will return. The two most popular minigames from that are still in the game as part of a rotation. And Anet has said that other things like the Queen’s Pavillion will be making a return too.

And of course, there’s permanent stuff too. The new dungeon…the aetherblade jumping puzzle, Tequatl, moa racing, the karka queen.

It’s not a contradiction at all. The best stuff is mostly still around or coming back.

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Posted by: Lalangamena.3694

Lalangamena.3694

the only way to discourage Zerging is to remove the AOE cap completely.

only when small smart group can CC (frezing or immobilizing) whole zergs, and then destroy it with couple of well placed AOEs, people will start spreading around and playing with tactics… and not in a mindless blob…

nothing else will work, nothing!

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Posted by: Arimahn.3568

Arimahn.3568

The new dungeon…the aetherblade jumping puzzle, Tequatl, moa racing, the karka queen.

Two out of five. Oh well.

Also, just because Zephyr Sanctum or any other part of the LS will (rather: may) return at some later point doesn’t mean people will stick around in the meantime. I’m sure Anet doesn’t want people to come back for only two weeks every now and again.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

The new dungeon…the aetherblade jumping puzzle, Tequatl, moa racing, the karka queen.

Two out of five. Oh well.

Also, just because Zephyr Sanctum or any other part of the LS will (rather: may) return at some later point doesn’t mean people will stick around in the meantime. I’m sure Anet doesn’t want people to come back for only two weeks every now and again.

If those are the only reason you’re playing the game you won’t stick around anyway.

If you go to Disneyworld and all you ride is Space Mountain and do nothing else, you won’t be going to Disneyworld every day. Anet is providing a range of experiences. Not all of them will be for everyone. The trick is to have enough experiences to keep most players happy.

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Posted by: Mungrul.9358

Mungrul.9358

Vayne, I know you love the game, but I have to take issue with you describing any part of the Living or Personal stories as being “Excellent”.

Gaming narratives aren’t widely known for their excellence, and the ones in GW2 fall way behind the curve as far as I’m concerned, all being incredibly predictable and mostly consisting of comic book style villains that have to be stopped otherwise something bad will happen to THE ENTIRE WORLD.

Compare Guild Wars 2 to say Spec Ops: The Line, The Walking Dead, The Last of Us, the Marathon Trilogy, Grim Fandango, Psychonauts, Deus Ex, etc. and you’ll find even the best examples of story in GW2 will be found wanting.

Guild Wars 2’s writing is tripe when held up against such exemplars.

Don’t get me wrong, their situational detailing and world-building are pretty darned good, but their narrative design is what you’d expect of a high-school student.

Please note that due to restrictions placed on my account, I am only allowed 1 post per hour.
Therefore I may take some time replying to you.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

Vayne, I know you love the game, but I have to take issue with you describing any part of the Living or Personal stories as being “Excellent”.

Gaming narratives aren’t widely known for their excellence, and the ones in GW2 fall way behind the curve as far as I’m concerned, all being incredibly predictable and mostly consisting of comic book style villains that have to be stopped otherwise something bad will happen to THE ENTIRE WORLD.

Compare Guild Wars 2 to say Spec Ops: The Line, The Walking Dead, The Last of Us, the Marathon Trilogy, Grim Fandango, Psychonauts, Deus Ex, etc. and you’ll find even the best examples of story in GW2 will be found wanting.

Guild Wars 2’s writing is tripe when held up against such exemplars.

Don’t get me wrong, their situational detailing and world-building are pretty darned good, but their narrative design is what you’d expect of a high-school student.

The living story isn’t about story. As long as you think that’s what it is, you’re wrong. It was renamed for a reason. It’s now called Living World. If you don’t believe me, look at your achievement panel.

I’m not saying the story is excellent, and I’ve never implied it. I’m saying the Living World stuff (that is the actual things you do, not the story) are a mixed bag. Different people will like different things and some of that can be excellent. Sanctam Sprint is an absolute hoot. I love it. That makes it excellent to me.

It has no story. You’re distracted by the word story. The living story is just what they’re calling 2 week content updates. I’m not talking about story. I’m talking about content.

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Posted by: Mungrul.9358

Mungrul.9358

I can’t check my achievement panel, because as I’ve said many times over, I stopped playing this drek over a month ago now.
And once people start arguing semantics such as you arguing the meaning of the word “story” or eisberg the meaning of the word “by”, you know there’s no point listening to a thing they’re saying. It’s obvious to any sane observer that such people are desperately searching for the tiniest detail that will help justify their position.

Please note that due to restrictions placed on my account, I am only allowed 1 post per hour.
Therefore I may take some time replying to you.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

I can’t check my achievement panel, because as I’ve said many times over, I stopped playing this drek over a month ago now.
And once people start arguing semantics such as you arguing the meaning of the word “story” or eisberg the meaning of the word “by”, you know there’s no point listening to a thing they’re saying. It’s obvious to any sane observer that such people are desperately searching for the tiniest detail that will help justify their position.

The only thing obvious to me is that people are trying to use a word to program a thought that doesn’t exist in the game.

Anet set a schedule to update the game every two weeks. They provide new content every two weeks. And we’re talking about that process. We’re not discussing story literally and anyone who thinks they are obviously isn’t playing the game. They’re thinking in terms.

We’re not talking about a story. That’s not what this is about. This isn’t a matter of semantics. This is a matter of discussing the reality of the game. The reality of the game is that content has been updated. That’s all anyone is saying and anyone distracted by the word story is simply misinformed.

If you want to discuss story, I’ve said before, this is not what we talk about, since Anet has deliberately made this something you can miss story line. They didn’t want people to come back and be totally confused. So it’s not about story and more, has NEVER been about story. Those who think it is aren’t paying attention.

And in post after post, the examples I’ve given have nothing to do with story, so you’re not only not following the game, but you’re not following my post. I’m talking about mini-games, and dungeons and jumping puzzles, which is what I keep referencing.

I’m sure most people realize the Living World updates are just in game activities. As I said earlier, if I want story I read books.

Thoughtful criticism of the game

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Arimahn.3568

Arimahn.3568

The new dungeon…the aetherblade jumping puzzle, Tequatl, moa racing, the karka queen.

Two out of five. Oh well.

Also, just because Zephyr Sanctum or any other part of the LS will (rather: may) return at some later point doesn’t mean people will stick around in the meantime. I’m sure Anet doesn’t want people to come back for only two weeks every now and again.

If those are the only reason you’re playing the game you won’t stick around anyway.

They’re not reasons I play, they’re the reasons to keep playing. The LS is a short cycle as to allow for quick bursts of content every two weeks to keep people interested. Except it doesn’t really work because the story is forgetable and the activities are, as you said yourself, a mixed bag at best. I’m sure there are people who would be delighted to get new minipets or a new shade of teal out of those events, but I doubt this is what people generally want.

Thoughtful criticism of the game

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

The new dungeon…the aetherblade jumping puzzle, Tequatl, moa racing, the karka queen.

Two out of five. Oh well.

Also, just because Zephyr Sanctum or any other part of the LS will (rather: may) return at some later point doesn’t mean people will stick around in the meantime. I’m sure Anet doesn’t want people to come back for only two weeks every now and again.

If those are the only reason you’re playing the game you won’t stick around anyway.

They’re not reasons I play, they’re the reasons to keep playing. The LS is a short cycle as to allow for quick bursts of content every two weeks to keep people interested. Except it doesn’t really work because the story is forgetable and the activities are, as you said yourself, a mixed bag at best. I’m sure there are people who would be delighted to get new minipets or a new shade of teal out of those events, but I doubt this is what people generally want.

I’m not sure this is true. It’s certainly not true for me. How many people feel this way is anyone’s guess.

My main point is most people don’t really think deeply about the games they’re playing. I really believe this. Some of us are theorists and really think about games. Other people seem to be happy just to have something to do…with the living world, it’s in the form of achievements. There’s a list, you check it off, you feel like you’re getting something done. That’s the strategy at least.

Some of the activities are dull, like carving pumpkins, or opening doors. Some are more interesting. But enough fun things are left behind that make the game more interesting and provide more options over all.

Do some people love jumping puzzles. Sure. And the living story left a jumping puzzle behind. Do some people love dungeons. Sure. And the living story brought us a new dungeon path (even if one was removed for it). It’s brought up minigames and returning content like SAB.

As the content adds up (and it does), we have more things to do generally. Sometimes, I just enjoy playing Sanctum Sprint or Southsun Survival. I wouldn’t enjoy playing it every day, but it’s not around every day anyway.

We’re given a variety of things to do…and for most gamers, that’s probably enough.