Guild Wars 2

In life we place value on items that are rare,unique or in some way give us a desire to own them. From trading cards to flat screen TVs to virtual items in a video game, these are items many feel a need to own.

This game has items that are very rare. You can play a (very) long time to acquire rare items, or buy gold from ArenaNet, to bypass the time sink. Some argue that this a fair system. People rich in time can find rare item and people rich in money can just buy the same rewards.

There is an issue though, when rarity is actually controlled by the very source of the gold option. If people stop buying gold, the rarity of items can simply be increased, therefor pushing more people to buy gold. The person “rich” in time just became poorer.
What happens when items are so rare, that almost nobody finds them in game, and the cost of ownership is beyond what can be achieved through normal game play? Are we all expected to “virtually shop”, and stop playing the actual game? Does this give a perceived advantage to real life wealth? Is owning items enough of a reward, even if you simply bought them, or is finding them in game the only rewarding way for you?

So, what is the best balance between rarity and gold?

(Footnote: I do support buying gems for added features such as bank space, character slots, etc, as these are one-time fees and do not advance or influence characters progression. These optional purchases are well defined and are not in any way linked to actual game play. A set price for a specific account upgrade.)

very good post. I think Anet needs to take a hard look at rewarding people fairly for normal play and stop nerfing drops and money gains and forcing people to either play the TP or buy gems for gold. Make acquiring gold a side effect of having fun through normal gameplay(dungeons, WvW, events, etc.)

its funny for as long as I’ve played MMO’s (long time) the folk as you say who are rich in time ( students, unemployed etc) have been the kings of MMO’s. with the subscription model it was largely irrelevant how much time you played each month to the game, as you all payed the same sub.
So in effect the rich in time folk were free to lord it over those of us who are not so rich in terms of spare time to sink into a pastime. ( or even turn it into a virtual job)
One consequence of this was the growing hostility from the Rich in time (hardcore) towards the casual gamers who reacted with utter contempt when the devs would be seen to make any adjustment that would negate their supremacy over the casuals. For example by nerfing a massive time sink (grind) for a certain item .

now the whole dynamic has changed, The market has realised that those with plenty money are willing to pay in order to nerf the massive timesinks themselves and this should be harvested.
after all If I was very wealthy I would pay someone to do the jobs I dislike wasting my time on IRL thus leaving me more free time to enjoy something fun. (for example hiring a house cleaner )
now the market has decided it’s better to cater to the folk with money rather than serve the folk with nothing but spare time.
now where this becomes bad is where they essentially price folk out of the game. where they keep shoving things into folks faces that are highly desirable but very expensive either in terms of time or cash.

when EQ2 went free they offered heaps of very cool armours (cosmetic) for reasonable prices and i bought a few but never felt i was being gouged, I also spent money on mounts for low level toons etc. one off deals. I had no issue spending money like tht.

conversely the F2P release of SWTOR has me uninstalling in 5 mins due to them instantly trying to gouge me simply to unlock all the parts of my UI setup I had used while subscribing.

rickets.1386:

very good post. I think Anet needs to take a hard look at rewarding people fairly for normal play and stop nerfing drops and money gains and forcing people to either play the TP or buy gems for gold. Make acquiring gold a side effect of having fun through normal gameplay(dungeons, WvW, events, etc.)

They have buffed gold gain from dungeons since they introduced sub-boss loot-bags and higher silver drops.

Gold isn’t hard to earn at all, provided we’re referring to actually normal values. With the exception of, say, ascended back items, and mystic forge skins, which are long term projects that go between 60 and 120 gold (Still totally sane values for long term projects) with the exception of anything that uses Charged Lodestones (Which DO need to be fixed). Most of these longer term goals take a proper amount of time for their reward (Jormag’s breath is a pretty awesome skin, and this keeps it rare).

If you’re doing open world stuff as you see fit, and waypointing everywhere, you’re going to lose money, this is kinda a given. That 1000g fast horse back in classic WoW was something you were NOT going to pay off in terms of earnings increase by having it either. If you’re doing open world stuff by wandering the zone, you will pay it off though. Sure, the earnings still aren’t ideal, but that’s more due to the markets for just about everything being flooded.

Dungeons on the other hand earn alot more money, but force people to work together.

If this was some sort of scheme to get people to buy gems to convert to gold, you’d think they’d give you anything approaching a decent gold return on gems. As it stands, working minimum wage and cashing in the money from that returns less than putting that same time into TA/CoE farms with good groups. What is happening is instead, the community showing what items it values, and what items it doesn’t. Which, as it turns out, is Zerks gear, and only Zerks gear.

Two weeks ago I stopped spending money completely, other than an Exotic trident I needed for my Guard as well as Omnomberry Pies. I’ve been running a lot of fractals and dungeons.

I’ve salvaged all the rares and exotic drops I’ve recieved and kept the ectos for ascended upgrades. I’ve sold all the mats other than the ectos. At this point, in two weeks, I’ve saved 71 Gold and 110 Ectos.

Gold is not that hard to come by. One fractal run in particular stands out in memory because it netted me FOUR gold. In ONE run. I’ve only gotten to FotM level 19, so it’s not like I’m getting some crazy level 40 drops or anything.

I think in a game like Gw2, Rarity is actually essential. What gives value to items? like OP said mostly the value is derived from how hard the item is to aquire. Lets take halloween, the backitem you could get from the scavenger hunt was quite good and had a good cosmetic value too. You never get to hear people praising the developers for providing such a great item for free and pretty easy to get.

Now lets take the unending toymaster tonic or the unbreakable bell, how much people desire it and are angry at not being able to get one. If the endless tonic or the unbreakable bell were as easy to get as the back item do we really think people will be as happy of aquiring it as the few person who had it drop off a present were? Dont think so.

As for the length of time required to aquire things, thats a bit tricky. Sure you can use real money to cut down on the time required but you really dont have to because whatever you want to aquire isnt needed really. Now there are a few exception to this like the holiday mini pets. We dont know if they’ll be available next year so I can understand collectors might feel pressured into getting them now just in case. Over all though it doesnt matter if it takes me a couple of days or a couple of months to get a named exotic weapon I want. Nothing wrong with paying money and getting it quickly but I am not so sure it will be as satisfying as actually playing the game, enjoying the game and after 2 months of “work” I can finally aquire the weapon I wanted for so long.

On the other hand you dont want to have to wait forever either. Thats addressed by having stuff that requires a variable amount of time to get. Some named exotics can easily be aquired in a month or two. Others take 6 months+ legendary go into a year+ You can go for the goal you know you can enjoy pursuiting.

I kinda feel its quite a good balance as is.

Hickeroar.9734:

(…)

Gold is not that hard to come by. One fractal run in particular stands out in memory because it netted me FOUR gold. In ONE run. I’ve only gotten to FotM level 19, so it’s not like I’m getting some crazy level 40 drops or anything.

Where those 4g in your pocket after you sold vendor trash – or after selling items from the dungeon on the TP?

i think items that take the work should be left as they are, im saving for vision of the mists – greatsword and its taking a little while to get the 250 globs of ecto and 250 orich greatsword blades but im getting there, BUT it does make me think about how much time i put into playing this game as im a lazy bum who doesnt work. now for some1 who works and has what i call a normal life, gold and leg weps must seem like an eternity. haha tho they work so they can use there irl cash to advance this.

so this = lazy bum has to put time in to get items
= worker can spend his cash to catch up ….. also this game is only a few months old. look at WOW no1 can say this game isnt the bee’s knee’s but look at the time span they have had. GW2 has this potential just give it time.

I think, it is necessary to define, what actually is perceived to be rewarding for a person spending time with a game like GW2. In the end, most of the time it comes down to the acquisition of something rare, of something most of the community don’t have, something that makes you stand out – be it a title, good looking equipment or whatever you can think of. That being said, the way this rare commodity can be acquired is what this discussion should focus on, imho.

In GW2, if you are rich in time and/or money, you can stand out. Some would say, this is only true when it comes to cosmetics. But no, investing either time or money – in contrast to GW1 – is now to a certain extent a substitute for skill. Yeah, I know – if you have the skill, you can beat every part of content having only greens on your toon (excluding higher level fractals of course), but that is not the point. If you are all exotics (and after they continued the creep: all ascended), it is or will be much easier and less time consuming to beat content and earn rewards with the current system. As a side effect, this can even go as far as content getting really boring, because of it being too easy with full exotic gear on. That’s what happened already with the entire game outside the dungeons and this part of the damage is somewhat irreversible.

But at least the issues with the current reward system in GW2 could easily be fixed by adding new types of content to the game (could even be open world DE). That content simply needs to be so hard it can only be beaten by a really well coordinated group, with sound tactics and a high level of skill. The reward then should be a high % chance rare drop, that is NOT sellable on the TP, so the only way of acquisition is to be good at playing the game – riches not helping a bit. That way, the balance between the viable ways to earn rewards in the game could be reestablished. The developers somehow seem to have forgotten, there should be actually three to satisfy the demands of all types of customers: Time, Money AND Skill.

ANet is just as greedy as any player within the game who is willing to do anything to be the best or have the best items.

This game has gone from pure entertainment/enjoyment to a marketing gimmic that revolves around making money viat TP and converting real cash for gems.

Just look at the headline when you first go to GW2 website – “For a limited time, buy Guild Wars 2 and get a free upgrade to the Digital Deluxe Edition (a $20 value)…”

And here is what’s wrong with this picture:

i) Real currency is placed on the bonuses (i.e. free upgrades) which reflects back on the TP and gems.
ii) One of the free upgrades is a ‘Summon Mistfire Wolf Elite Skill’. This you can unlock at a later stage and considering it is quite easy to level up it is worthless.
iii) This “limited time” offer has been on before christmas. Furthermore, I specifically recall that this offer would end BEFORE christmas. Now for some reason it is still up there -weird huh? :P
iv) When a company begins to provide upgrades at standard price, any logically inclined person should know something is up. I’ll let you think about this one…

The balance has been tipped off between gold and rarity. Yes, many players are to blame for manipualting the game mechanics but as the saying goes ‘a stick has two ends’.

AnemoneMeer.7182:

If you’re doing open world stuff as you see fit, and waypointing everywhere, you’re going to lose money, this is kinda a given.

I have no issues. I’m still trying to relate to a lot of people’s experience. I sell 99% of everything I get to the highest buyer, start at the Auction House first, it’s a must, then stuff not wanted there to the vendor. I always get more dough incoming than outgoing, the other two I play with the same. Not sure why everyone’s experience wouldn’t be similar. I feel I get very avg drops. So I don’t get that this is a given. Crafting seemingly is a sink from what I’ve heard, since I can buy what I need, didn’t see a big reason to craft. But your mileage will vary there.