Guild Wars 2

Not sure if this is the right thread for this topic

Does anyone hold this opinion? I’d like to think of GW 2 as a fantasy game… Guns, cannons… pfff, okay… Flying airships, okay… But Risen ROFL-copters? Charr Thundercat mobiles? It’s ridiculous. This game seems to be evolving in the same way the Fable franchise did starting of as fantasy and ending in ridiculous steampunk.

I’m just hoping that the developpers don’t choose to go down this path any further or next Guild Wars 3 will be more akin to SWTOR than to GW 1 in terms of setting

Well time has moved on and it was sort of logical these elements were gonna be in the game.
I agree with you on the thundercat mobiles, but they do look awesome
All in all if you consider the sheer amout of content in this game and then look at the amount of steampunkish stuff it’s neglectable.
You can walk for hours without even seeing stuff like that and for the Charr regions it really sets the mood for the industrial revolution they are in.

First, GW3 is highly unlikely so don’t worry about that.
Second, yes, you are right. Too much technology for my taste. I almost quit playing instantly when I saw the “Charr Tanks” (why them are still running with swords and axes is beyond my understanding). And lets not talk about the Asura, those little oversize rats are just in the wrong game IMO).
But well, this is not the typically “fantasy” game anyway. It may not make no sense at all but this is not gonna change so the best we can do is enjoy what we can and ignore all the rest.

Kind of agree yes, I too prefer the “medieval” component than the weird one.

I hate asura for that, and their zone actually. Labs, illusions, techno google…. Too much technology. Need more nature, castles, mansions, deeps, cliff etc…

OP did you ever play Final fantasy ? Your idea of what a fantasy game should be like is a bit screwed , nothing electrical,no planes,choppers,or anything on wheels,basically a Medieval setting,right ? Well heres the prob,gw is not a medieval game.

For me it’s not enough. Truth be told I’m steampunk fan so my opinion is biased. I would live more weapons skins like “Steam” ones. Maybe less big parts but more smaller elements.

Odinius.9826:

Well time has moved on and it was sort of logical these elements were gonna be in the game.
I agree with you on the thundercat mobiles, but they do look awesome
All in all if you consider the sheer amout of content in this game and then look at the amount of steampunkish stuff it’s neglectable.
You can walk for hours without even seeing stuff like that and for the Charr regions it really sets the mood for the industrial revolution they are in.

Yes time did move on, but in a fantasy setting that generally does not (have to) coïncide with technological advancement – the general argument being that there is no need for technology when you have magic, etc. And as a general rule you could say that Fantasy RPG settings are characterised by their immobility in this field, which makes them so kitten interesting. I don’t say I don’t dislike steampunk, just that I like the – as mentioned by another poster – “medieval” fantasy a hell of a lot more. And I could play either one, but mixing is what I generally find unsuitable.

The main issue is that it looks horribly imbalanced in terms of setting. Humans still dable with swords and bows while Charr have tanks and Thundercat-mobiles? True that in terms of gameplay this doesn’t matter but the point I want to make has nothing to do with the gameplay just with the setting, since a game is more than just how it plays but also the amount of immersion it has.

Walking into the Black Citadel really broke immersion for me. Even the Asura’s technology at least looks feasible as it are magically powered device and they look as such. The Charr vehicles are just a step to far imho.

Just making the mental exercise of thinking away all the dragons and simply think of how the races of Tyria would interact in your average geopolitical situation would mean that the Charr would steamroll all of Tyria in a matter of decades and it would mean that to stand up to them you’d need to be on the same technological level, hence all nations within the span of years would need to have their own Thundercatmobiles – except for the Asura, they have Golems

That’s my beef: it breaks immersion.

I don’t mind steampunk, especially clockwork stuff. But some of the “technology” is just way beyond steampunk.

Submarines, Helicopters, Motocycles, Cars, Tanks, Etc is just way over the top and I have had woes over it. At least with the Asura technology like golems and holograms we would always pretend it was powered by magic which was good enough for me. But I pretty much hate all the Charr and Pact technology.

Mardukar.8327:

Walking into the Black Citadel really broke immersion for me. Even the Asura’s technology at least looks feasible as it are magically powered device and they look as such. The Charr vehicles are just a step to far imho.

In my opinion the style fits them nicely. They despise magic anyway so they have to compensate with ingenuity and technological advancement. But that’s just a matter of taste anyway.

The charr race was forged in the merciless crucible of war. It is all they know.

The humans won’t use charr technology, not yet. There’s too much bad blood there. The Asura don’t need it, simply put. The sylvari are too nature based to allow themselves to be surrounded by that much metal, there’s one in Divinitys that complains about the cobblestones I think. The norn…. Frankly they’re too busy forging their own legend to try to evolve technologically. The charr have made leaps and bounds in the field of technological warfare but what do you expect when 1/3 of your population is dedicated to that and are locked in a 250 year long siege against magic users?

I love those elements, actually
I mean, 250 years passed since GW1, you’d have to see some improvements.
Also, the highly industrial nature of the Charr really fits their overall ‘alignment’, in my opinion. (Although I can’t help but chuckle every once in a while when I walk into the Daethstar…I mean, Black citadel)

Wait, what’s wrong with Steam Punk? Steam Punk is great!!! And it fits the evolution of this game.

Well it all comes down to a matter of taste I love High Fantasy more. I only think that as it stands it’s to unbalanced as far as immersion go. Cannons, guns, ok – actually this is where it should stop for me… Thundercatmobiles? Naaah

Steampunk is extremely fashionable in fantasy at the moment. Love or loathe it (I love it, undecided in this context though), it’s here to stay I’m afraid.

You’re comparing the world of GW2 too relatively to our world. Crudely speaking I’d say you’re tying down the fantasy with strict standards. Personally I don’t see how having non magic elements make it less immersive. This just says not everyone can use magic or not all the time for everything, and the Charr hate it in particular.

You can’t use real world rationality in a fictional world.
They just don’t go together.

I think we need the opposite, more generalized steampunk elements. Moving-gear shields for every class, steam-fuming shoulderpads, upgraded siege weaponry that has multiple or heavier counter-weights, etc.

It’s at the point that even though I am 80 and in full Knights Draconic with the Primeval Skin that I would rather farm the Moletariat and get the Dredge Armor. (The medium dredge armor is so awesome..)

I agree OP it was a bit immersion breaking for me too, i generally ignore the charr side of the game it annoys me, i wanted a fantasy game not Sci fi..

Preferred Guildwars one its was a fixed time scale.

The steampunk elements are one of the few redeeming qualities of this game.

Tyria is an alien world with several sentient and semi-sentient species co-existing, and there is magic. It is just not possible to compare technological development with human history on our own world.

For a start – magic is integral to daily life even in the cultures that prefer not to use too much of it. Magically enhanced materials are used for armor and weapons even in the Charr culture – we know this from crafting. The Charr have magic users in all three legions of the armed forces (you can play all professions as a Charr) and are not above employing magitech weapons technology (the Mortis Verge is supposedly based on Charr technology according to the Durmand Priory).

So while the Asura have the most exuberant and advanced magitech in Tyria, all races can be seen to use magic mixed in with their technology to varying degrees. This is only logical – magic is one of the fundamental natural forces in Tyria, so any engineering and technology would develop to incorporate this to some degree. This completely changes how we would expect technology to develop. For example, many design bottlenecks in our engineering history were due to the lack of of sufficiently strong and light materials, or lack of a suitable energy source. Leonardo da Vinci and chums could probably have built the helicopter he designed if they had the energy source that runs the lathes in Lion’s Arch crafting stations, or the magitech which magically infuses and strengthens cloth in light armor.

My point is that in a world where magic is real, the kind of steampunk creations we see in the game are actually quite appropriate to the lore. Technology would just develop differently and probably more rapidly in some areas due to magically enhanced materials and energy sources.

Whether or not this is to our own personal taste or not is another matter – I love the steampunk stuff myself but respect the OP’s tastes are different.

Wait until they add UAV’s and AC130’s in their first expansion.

Those are barely enough reasons to think this game is going down the Steampunk road…

Sure there are elements of it, but the feel of it isn’t there.

I am not happy with the steampunk either, though people do make some good points. In the absence of magic, Charr had to advance somehow… so that makes me feel a little better about it. BUT

Since Charr are so anti-magic, why are they able to use magic wielding classes?? That’s what breaks the immersion for me. I realize from a “we want anyone to play how they want” standpoint, it is necessary, but for the Charr to be so technologically advanced AND have magic, just doesn’t make sense.

The Asura I am fine with because I can at least convince myself that their Eternal Alchemy is just another brand of magic.

The Charr as a whole are fairly ant-magic. That doesn’t prevent individuals from dabbling in it. Even though the Charr don’t like magic, they can still see its uses.

Everything in the game makes perfect sense. Anyone that knew the lore and background of the Asura and the Charr would realize that their tech is perfectly in line with what is to be expected.

Just because you don’t like it doesn’t make it the general view. I, personally, love the asuran tech. I only play humans, but I wish I could have a lab in Rata Sum.

The steampunk elements of this game are one of the biggest drawing factors for me. If I wanted heavy fantasy, I could go back to LotRO. Go there and enjoy all the massive, heavy fantasy setting you’d like. They did it insanely well.

But Guild Wars 2 has some steampunk(keyword here is SOME. When only one race out of five really has anything considered to be steampunk, I’d say that’s a pretty small factor), sure. But, it also has a crap-load more magic. In a world filled with magic that can transform you, teleport you, design constructs, etc…then why would it be out of place to also have steampunk technology?

Honestly the setting reminds me of one of my favorite games of all time: Final Fantasy VI. It’s got the magic, the steampunk, and the mixture of the two throughout the whole world. And you easily find that various areas on the planet have different levels of that technology.

ChaK.3254:

Kind of agree yes, I too prefer the “medieval” component than the weird one.

I hate asura for that, and their zone actually. Labs, illusions, techno google…. Too much technology. Need more nature, castles, mansions, deeps, cliff etc…

I kinda disagree here. I like the medieval component as well and it exists in the game. I love the Asura for what they bring to the game. Imo, a mix of technology and medieval components fits GW perfectly. If you have the Asura you will have labs; if you have the Charr you will have steampunk. And, I like having them both.

LordGustoff.3752:

I am not happy with the steampunk either, though people do make some good points. In the absence of magic, Charr had to advance somehow… so that makes me feel a little better about it. BUT

Since Charr are so anti-magic, why are they able to use magic wielding classes?? That’s what breaks the immersion for me. I realize from a “we want anyone to play how they want” standpoint, it is necessary, but for the Charr to be so technologically advanced AND have magic, just doesn’t make sense.

The Asura I am fine with because I can at least convince myself that their Eternal Alchemy is just another brand of magic.

You forget before the Flame Legion were defeated and lost power, magic was their primary source of power. You wouldn’t see a group of Charr without an Ele, Necro, or Mesmer. Although the Charr are now against magic, there are ofcourse some who will still use it, despite it being frowned upon in their society.

I think we need more steampunk fashions.

Not enough steampunk elements I think.

Conncept.7638:

Not enough steampunk elements I think.

Patch notes:

All headwear in game has been modified to include a toggle to switch a monocle on/off.

Lapel size on all gear has been increased by 20%

Enjoy 50% off savings on the new top hat in gem store.

New parasol gearslot added.

Guns with barrels that do not get wider near the end have been modified.

Vlaxitov.5693:

The steampunk elements are one of the few redeeming qualities of this game.

So much this, I would especially include the magic/alchemy-tech of the Asura.
Some here really need to polish up their history in regard to Leonardo DaVinci.

Even our own medieval times would´ve looked much different without the dark-age causing mini ice-age we´re actually just now getting out of again.
Just ask Al Gore, he knows it very well(muahaha). And is making tons of money with his disinfo.

Charr frown upon magic, they aren’t anti magic

They aren’t stupid.

It makes sense that they would be more subtle or hidden in their magic use (crafting traditional technology with magical materials) rather than being blatant about their magic like the Asura are.

It doesn’t break any immersion for me anyway 250 years is a long time and the paths the races took makes perfect sense.

Charr have Steampunk
Humans have Mid Evil Fantasy
Asura have Alchemy
Sylvari have Nature
Nords are like Vikings without boats

Each race has it’s own theme. Meaning this game is not meant to be a pure mid evil game.

Each city reflects the themes of it’s race. With the exception of Lion’s Arch.

Charr have Steampunk
Humans have Mid Evil Fantasy
Asura have Alchemy
Sylvari have Nature
Nords are like Native Americans/Vikings without boats

Each race has it’s own theme. Meaning this game is not meant to be a pure mid evil game.

Each city reflects the themes of it’s race. With the exception of Lion’s Arch.

Onshidesigns.1069:

pure mid evil game.

Dude..
M E D I E V A L
Neither right nor left and surely not MID EVIL!

And it´s Norn!

Boy, hadn´t had such a powerful grammar-nazi attack in ages.
Whew, glad it´s over.

HawkMeister.4758:

Onshidesigns.1069:

pure mid evil game.

Dude..
M E D I E V A L
Neither right nor left and surely not MID EVIL!

And it´s Norn!

Boy, hadn´t had such a powerful grammar-nazi attack in ages.
Whew, glad it´s over.

So kittening what

Minion of Vey.4398:

Conncept.7638:

Not enough steampunk elements I think.

Patch notes:

All headwear in game has been modified to include a toggle to switch a monocle on/off.

Lapel size on all gear has been increased by 20%

Enjoy 50% off savings on the new top hat in gem store.

New parasol gearslot added.

Guns with barrels that do not get wider near the end have been modified.

Don’t believe me? Make an engineer, and just try to make him or her actually look like a steampunk engineer. It isn’t possible, there are barely any steampunk articles in the game, and none of them even belong to the armor type that engineers can use.

I would not be playing GW2 if I wanted a all out classical ‘high fantasy’ game. The technological and actually also social evolution within the various races is one of the factors that made me like this game so much. It fits very well and I have to say that the usual stagnation of fantasy worlds that artificially always keeps them on the same level of development is one of the factors that makes them less interesting to me.

I am very happy that the GW-team moved away from that and allowed the world and those living in it to advance and develop. Otherwise it would have just been another game following the same basic rules as so many games before. Doing the same things over and over again with just changing names and looks gets rather boring over time.

I usually also joke about how in GW5 or 6 the races will go out into space. So development is great and allowing the races to do it creates the feel for a real history behind them too. Not just some tales of ancient heros.

And I am sure that the spaceships the various races would come up with would look awsome ;D

Conncept.7638:

Minion of Vey.4398:

Conncept.7638:

Not enough steampunk elements I think.

Patch notes:

All headwear in game has been modified to include a toggle to switch a monocle on/off.

Lapel size on all gear has been increased by 20%

Enjoy 50% off savings on the new top hat in gem store.

New parasol gearslot added.

Guns with barrels that do not get wider near the end have been modified.

Don’t believe me? Make an engineer, and just try to make him or her actually look like a steampunk engineer. It isn’t possible, there are barely any steampunk articles in the game, and none of them even belong to the armor type that engineers can use.

I was making a joke about what a future patch that added steampunk elements might include.

I have no opinion on whether there are too many/too little steampunk elements in the game currently.

Steampunk is the reason why Engineers are very unpopular. The whole idea of the class feels out of place and breaks immersion. It’s like puting a space marine next to a ninja and a samurai.

Guild Wars 2 doesn’t take place in a medieval world. It doesn’t take place during the Renaissance. It doesn’t take place in Middle Earth.

It takes place in Tyria. Tyria has machines and magic intertwining, as well as different cultures clashing together, who have varying degrees of technological advancement. Granted, sometimes the anachronisms are a little far-fetched — welcome to FANTASY, people!

The so-called “steampunk” elements, machines, etc., were there from the beginning of the game — sometimes they’re just more or less prominent depending on the race you chose. It’s not like ArenaNet made you play through some low-fantasy Game of Thrones setting for 90% of the game, only to bombard you with fighter jets and Gundams in the final chapter. It’s always been in there, you just came to a point in the story where you couldn’t choose to ignore it anymore.

If you don’t like the mix of tech & tanks VS swords & magic, you’re entitled to your opinion. Heck, sometimes I feel like they overdo it with the technology, but there are a million generic “high-Fantasy” MMOs out there. People have been debating this aspect of Final Fantasy for generations, and I’m sure similar conversations were had about World of Warcraft. Tyria is what it is. It’s a made-up world, with made-up circumstances. It doesn’t have to abide by the rules of our world, nor especially the rules of other fictional worlds.

Onshidesigns.1069:

HawkMeister.4758:

Onshidesigns.1069:

pure mid evil game.

Dude..
M E D I E V A L
Neither right nor left and surely not MID EVIL!

So kittening what

So, learn it, please..?

Well the thing is that ppl are putting way too much of real history on to a game history just because it happened one way with only one “thinking” animal dose not mean it will happen the same way when there are more then one “thinking” animal (they even have thinking plants!). We humans have nothing to talk to that is not human nor do we truly fight any thing that is not human the ppl in GW2 DO.

For me its not steampunk enough.

We need to replace all those stupid bandito masks with all sorts of different headgoggles and monocles!

And by monocle, I mean the REAL monocle!

I think we should also get Abe Lincoln-style tophats, and reading glasses for headpieces.

I hope my idea doesn’t sound silly, because we had them in GW1 (INCLUDING Tuxedos!) and they were my favorite headpieces!

Yes, MORE Steampunk please! And how about some Diessel Punk in the Crystal Desert too!? Asura already have a Star Wars-thing going on, so give them Diessel Punk!

I think it makes complete sense for the Charr.
Magic enslaved them so they needed an option outside of it.
Technology is the only other option, so for 250 years they focused on technology and as such are the most technologically advanced race.
Magic impairing the growth of technology makes sense if you rely on it, but Charr don’t so obviously it wasn’t going to stop their technological growth like it did everyone elses.
The world of Guild wars has existed for thousands of years and the amount of technology was pitiful, showing how much they relied on it.
It’s not that Charr stuff breaks immersion, it fits right in, as an answer to “What if magic didn’t exist”

The steam punk monsters though? I found that weird, no-one made them, they apparently come from the future or some alternate dimension… They feel kind of tacked on without more…development?

Fyrebrand.4859:

Onshidesigns.1069:

HawkMeister.4758:

Onshidesigns.1069:

pure mid evil game.

Dude..
M E D I E V A L
Neither right nor left and surely not MID EVIL!

So kittening what

So, learn it, please..?

Don’t make me go on every one of your post and correct you.

@HawkMeister-

You are correct, and I am aware daVinci’s ‘aerial screw’ was neither the first historical reference to the helicopter idea nor the most practical, but in popular parlance the daVinci helicopter meme is well known, so I used it to highlight my point about the effects of magic on technogical development

I don’t much care, I don’t like a lot of it, but some people do.

I do think they jumped a bit too far at times. They could have included Hot Air balloons, Derigibles, all kinds of lighter than air..without plopping a Charr Helicopter into the landscape. That is a big jump in tech.

You would think the Charr would have one rail line. Nope, they have tanks and pack animals.

Apparently they skipped the entire phase of dragging guns into battle with teams of draft animals. They seem to build cannons on the spot with pocket toolkits.

It’s kind of hard to think of a culture that could conceptualize wheels, sprockets, chain drives and never manage to build a bicycle.. but went straight to huge armored vehicles.

I guess I am more opposed to the randomness of tech, rather than the presence of it.

They didn’t jump to bikes because charr don’t need bikes. I assume they haven’t bothered with rail lines because the potential for sabotage is too great. Dolyaks and oxen are slower, but a road is easier to fix than heavily-mined rail lines.

Actually it is more gearpunk I think. I mean it is gears running all that kitten. Not steam.
I was initially against these things too. But you know what… it fits. It really fits the game and the charr.

Sure these things are powerful, but they are still just an alternative to magic. It wont overpower the other elements, it just lets less magically inclined people have a go too.