Guild Wars 2

In other MMOs, trading is done like that : A box, with two compartiments. A player puts items in a compartiment, the other in the other compartiment. If they both click accept, the transaction is done. What impact could such a system have on the game economy ? Is it good or bad ?

This is not another MMO.

And its bad for the economy.

Guild Wars (1) had pretty much exactly that – 7 item slots plus one money slot for each side, and both had to accept to finalize a trade. While you’d think it was really safe way to trade, it was ridden with scams – one common way was to do a late replace with an item of the same Icon but worthless, and hope that the other part didn’t notice. Another was to offer, say, 10K, and then do a late replace with only 1K, again hoping to get the other to accept.

So, overall, I much prefer the TP since it’s 100% guaranteed scam free.

Player to Player trading offers the following negatives:

1. It is inefficient.
2. It bypasses the gold sink.
3. It can easily be used to scam people.
4. It increases the workload of ArenaNet employees who have to deal with #3.
5. Chat channels are filled with WTB/WTS spam.

Player to Player trading offers the following positives:

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My summary of the 1000 other P2P threads:

Lishtenbird.2814:

[+] Arguments in favour:

• That other game has it; we’ve seen it done there and used it.
• Adding it won’t hurt anyone, only help people who do not want to waste money on TP tax.
• Direct trading will make people happier because the RNG factor of rare items will be a bit offset by easier acquisition.
• Spamming should not be a problem: ANet can create a “trading” channel in chat to deal with spam.

[-] Arguments against:

• That other game also has massive trading spam and out-of-whack economy.
• It will hurt everyone. Gold sink is what keeps inflation low in game economies where gold is generated out of thin air; the Trading Post tax is that major gold sink. Remove the gold sink, and you’ll be the one crying about how everything is getting more and more expensive.
• Any system which can be ignored, will be ignored. People will turn off the trading channel because of the WTB/WTS spam, and people will keep spamming in map/say/whisper chat. No matter what you do, real players will be hurt more than spammers (message suppression is already bad enough at organised world events).
• The TP tax encourages you to play for your items yourself instead of buying them. It is good for the game community.
• You are not disallowed to trade via mail – you’re just doing it at your own risk; mail trade frauds will be reviewed by Support and scammers will be suspended/banned, but the items/gold won’t be returned.

[=] Current state of affairs:

• There is a considerable amount of people who think that player to player trading will hurt more than help.

Back to CONTENTS

A recent thread on the topic: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Personal-Trading

TL;DR: Use TP, it’s your insurance and helps the game and you in return.

Anet created the TP as a marketplace INSTEAD of player-to-player trading. I doubt they’d go back on their word and return to a system that is antiquated and rife with scamming.

GW1 had player-to-player trading, and even though it seemed fool-proof, there were plenty of ways that people could get scammed. (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Scam)

The main reason why people want this method of trading is to bypass the listing an selling fees that the trading post has. If Anet made a player-to-player trading system, it would have to uphold the 15% tax anyway or they risk creating a double economy and huge inflation This 15% tax would negate most people wanting to sell through player-to-player anyway, considering how convenient the TP is.

Lastly, if they made a player-to-player trading system they would have to spend a lot more resources maintaining it (and its advertising channels) and increase the amount of moderators dealing with scammers.

Crimson Clouds.4853:

Anet created the TP as a marketplace INSTEAD of player-to-player trading. I doubt they’d go back on their word and return to a system that is antiquated and rife with scamming.

GW1 had player-to-player trading, and even though it seemed fool-proof, there were plenty of ways that people could get scammed. (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Scam)

The main reason why people want this method of trading is to bypass the listing an selling fees that the trading post has. If Anet made a player-to-player trading system, it would have to uphold the 15% tax anyway or they risk creating a double economy and huge inflation This 15% tax would negate most people wanting to sell through player-to-player anyway, considering how convenient the TP is.

Lastly, if they made a player-to-player trading system they would have to spend a lot more resources maintaining it (and its advertising channels) and increase the amount of moderators dealing with scammers.

And since there isn’t really a good way to determine what 15% of an item for item trade is, they will never put this in the game.

Look for my suggestion with postage stamps. It would solve this as you are required to pay postage on both the send and receive end before anyone can take anything. The postage will be a lesser gold sink or more depending on quantity of items + gold sent however. So 5 items + gold attached = a bigger sum to pay vs 1 item and no gold attached.

The 2 main reasons there is no Player 2 Player trading.

1. It has to be policed as no matter HOW secure you make it, someone is eventually going to get scammed (by similar looking objects, fast swaps, etc.) and be upset and report the other guy for taking advantage of them. Yes, this happens with the mail system, but Anet has made it VERY clear that while they will punish someone for scamming, they will NOT refund any items or gold lost in that manner. That should make intelligent players NOT email trade with someone they do not 100% trust, so mail trades are a fraction of what player 2 player trades would be.
2. The game NEEDS a gold sink and the TP fees are the best one available. Gold needs to be taken OUT of the economy to maintain stability and those that pay the most are making the most gold, so it’s quite a fair method. You can argue it’s a tax and you can do better with a mail trade, but nobody has EVER been cheated on a TP trade (sans clicking a button wrong).

1 is a Support reduction reason and 2 is a game economy one.

The only time I have ever seen a player be a “victim” to the TP trade only system is if a very new player gets their hands on an extremely valuable item and they do not have the funds to list it on the TP and sell it. I doubt that happens very often, but I’m sure it does happen from time to time.

Where is that dead horse.gif

Not really dead. I’ve got another idea. If yo want to trade something in GW2 to a certain player, you can’t. Here is another idea:
1. You send to a player a special mail, in which you attach your item you want to sell. The player can get the attachment, but only if he pays a sum determined by the seller. The transaction could also have a TP fee.

Some might want to sell items just for guildies. If they put them on TP, other players outside the guild might grab them first.

You aren’t getting the point. This game doesn’t and won’t have trading outside of the trading post.

mahri.8410:

Not really dead. I’ve got another idea. If yo want to trade something in GW2 to a certain player, you can’t. Here is another idea:
1. You send to a player a special mail, in which you attach your item you want to sell. The player can get the attachment, but only if he pays a sum determined by the seller. The transaction could also have a TP fee.

Some might want to sell items just for guildies. If he puts them on TP, other players outside the guild might grab them first.

Yay, now gold sellers can bomb us with trade mail that we have to carefully ensure we appropriately decline!

Not if this is limited to guild only/guys in your friendlist

mahri.8410:

Not if this is limited to guild only/guys in your friendlist

Selling to guildies can already be done via the in game mail system or through the guild bank.