Guild Wars 2

Squee.7829:

“The story could detail the struggles that a transgender person in the world of Tyria,” is the most problematic line in your original post, regarding this issue.
You can’t detail the struggles of a transgender person in Tyria because there literally are none. No one cares at all that she used to be a man. No one is giving her a hard time about it. And no one stopped her from doing it. It’s exactly the way it should be. I’d say we already have all the inclusion possible.

Actually, even if there aren’t external struggles, there are still internal struggles with dealing with gender dysphoria pre- and post-transition

I’m sure there are some internal struggles. As there are with literally any big life decision. Starting a family, getting married, buying a house. But we don’t usually talk about these personal boring details in a video game because they’re boring personal details.
And it’s even more particular when dealing with trans issues. Because while everyone at some point can relate to things like home ownership, only a very few people can relate to the personal issues of gender reassignment. Why even bother making it an issue in the story when most people will just never relate? You may end up making like 10-12 people think “Man, this really hits home. Thanks Anet”, but inversely make 1283721831 people think “Why do I care about your gender identity? You’re supposed to be helping me kill things.” and even a few people who feel, no matter what you say, that the trans issue is being “forced”

Long story short, you’ll offend far more people than you’ll help. Too risky a move for an entertainment business.

I want to be really clear that right now my biggest “issue” with Gw2 is the sheer amount of social agenda pushing which worries me. Look, im not against transgender, im not against lesbians, gays, bisexuals or anyone else.

I myself am disabled, I have autism, aspergers, I however do not want to see a character “with” aspergers in a fantasy world, frankly I find the idea rather unnerving.

Honestly, what I dont like is seeing “real” world issues being put into a virtual reality. It kind of eliminates the point of escapism, fantasy is an escape from reality, its designed to avoid these things in the first place. People dont play a fantasy game to see their specific gender/disability/trope being covered, they play it for the very reason that they escape the boundries of any of these things being mentioned or judged, because in the end, a virtual, fantasy world, should in no way or form, represent, the real one.

Ideally speaking, what I think we need is more focus on the writing actually focusing on the story, the fantasy, and generally, the progression of the characters within it, rather than trying to represent minorities, majorities or anyone else.

Example:

I liked the Jory/Kasmeer relationship in Season 1 because I thought the build up felt like a natural growth from friends to lovers, it just, fit, perfectly well, it didnt seem forced because it was all growing in the background.

But in season 2 nearly every dialogue involving the two together focused on their relationship and had nothing to do with their personal growth.

We didnt even get a moment of tender comfort between Kasmeer and Jory with the loss of her sister, we just got “hey its good to see you” in the pact summit and that was kind of it.

Relationships that feel hollow are meaningless, if your “going” to make this a thing, focus on actually fleshing it out and giving it meaning. The struggles characters go through are very much as important as the representation they exist towards.

An example of a character actually growing and developing in this way done right, would be Taimi. Taimi accepts after her reckless, chaotic and childish rage fit she cant fight every battle alone. Scruffy getting broken and Taimi being left to the mercy of the Inquest as Braham saved her was a classic point of what im trying to say. It was growth, both characters grew, Taimi especially, realizing, she cant be some reckless child in the middle of a danger zone.

And yet, in HoT, she still manages to develop (albiet small, no pun intended) with Scruffy dying yet again (for the third time if you played S1) and final time with HoT, she accepts the death of her beloved golem and we get a brief tender moment of the Golem hesitating to kill itself before deciding to do what it had to do.

Taimi also realizes, with a giant asura lab capable of protecting her like a small fortress, there is absoleutley “no” need for her to leave and wisely chooses instead to stay in the secure defended position because, for once, its not dangerous to be there alone.

This contrast shows where I feel the char growth in GW2 really needs to go, focusing more on actual character growth, and not just on representing character minorities for the “sake” of representing them.

I dont like when someone pushes their agenda so its a no for me

CaptainVanguard.4925:

An example of a character actually growing and developing in this way done right, would be Taimi. Taimi accepts after her reckless, chaotic and childish rage fit she cant fight every battle alone. Scruffy getting broken and Taimi being left to the mercy of the Inquest as Braham saved her was a classic point of what im trying to say. It was growth, both characters grew, Taimi especially, realizing, she cant be some reckless child in the middle of a danger zone.

And yet, in HoT, she still manages to develop (albiet small, no pun intended) with Scruffy dying yet again (for the third time if you played S1) and final time with HoT, she accepts the death of her beloved golem and we get a brief tender moment of the Golem hesitating to kill itself before deciding to do what it had to do.

Taimi also realizes, with a giant asura lab capable of protecting her like a small fortress, there is absoleutley “no” need for her to leave and wisely chooses instead to stay in the secure defended position because, for once, its not dangerous to be there alone.

Dude! What happened to “Spoiler Alert”? Sheesh!

As a person that is half African American and German American I don’t understand why a character should be put on a pedestal because of their sexuality or nationality a good character should be based on their substance like the feeling in her flaws of their personality. For me I do not give a care that there is no African American looking character in the main cast I rather have good backstory then just a character with a dark skin color

Smooth Penguin.5294:

There’s a lot of people who misunderstand what I’m suggesting. I’ll break it down:

• I’m not asking for any type of forced sexual preference based story. I’m just asking that a NPC, who happens to be transgender, be included in our party. Yes I’d personally want to see Sya made into a hero, but I think it’d be a nice gesture to the LGBT community to have an even more diverse cast in GW2.

• Anet’s writers are top notch. They’re able to include homosexual characters into the Living Story without having an agenda pushed. That’s what I’d like for Sya as well.

• Yes I push for social justice in real life. Everyone deserves to be treated equally with respect. The way you do that is to show different lifestyles as normal, everyday occurrences. That’s how you break barriers in society. As an example in real life, my Muslim friends avoid going outside when someone in the news does a terrible thing in the name of their religion. People make incorrect assumptions that the whole religion thinks the same, where in fact only a small radical few ruins the image for the whole. How you combat this is through education. Call it propaganda if you will, but unless someone’s willing to address the fallacies, the masses will keep thinking the assumptions are real.

• As a compromise to my position, I would be happy if Anet made a side quest that involved Sya. Completely optional, non-forced story. Maybe like for the next Greatsword Legendary journey.

TL;DR – Inclusion doesn’t have to be forced. The mere existence of a transgender NPC in the main story is all that I suggest.

Buy asking for it, you are forcing it. I’m sure you can see this. If we are gong for inclusions why is there not a black person, or any other ethnic groups? Lets make the party a massive one so we cover all the bases so no one is left out.

Next thing you know people will be asking for a one legged homeless veteran with a drug addiction to be added to the party.

This is a game, that’s for fun. It dose not need to be inclusive, not everyone needs to be represented. If you want to make a difference do it in real life. Ultimately no one is going to care all that much about a fictional character in a game. Not once have I ever thought “oh that’s cool, this game has a gay/lesbian character”. Why? Because it doesn’t matter, not one bit, because in the end we are all just people, making a fuss about something is sometimes the worst thing you can do, it can draw all kinds of attention, including the kind you don’t want/need.

Now can we kill this thread.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TPMN.1483:

~~~ snip ~~~

I’m quite aware of what’s going on in Russia. But consider this:

1) Anet is an American company. Russian laws do not have any effect or enforcement.
1a) That wouldn’t be the case of Anet had an office in Russia. Thank goodness their data servers aren’t there.
2) GW2 already has homosexual storylines (i.e. Jory and Kas). They kissed as part of the end scene to the Living Story.

1 and 2 are meaningless, if they have a game that is used by Russian customers they must follow Russian laws..

Why do you think Steam got Sued by the Australian ACCC, and had massive law suits here over Refunds.. Steam does not have any Bricks and mortar here in Australia but they still had to follow the laws of the countries they sell too..

That said i’m not sure why this thread even popped up, Grats for Anet i guess but its still a can of worms.

If you want to get technical all Asura are transgenders because Anet forces all the females to wear male costumes…

Dante.1508:

If you want to get technical all Asura are transgenders because Anet forces all the females to wear male costumes…

Until you realize that Asuran males wear skirts, so yeah… Not sure where you are going with that.

Unless you saying that a male wearing skirt and female wearing pants make them transgenders. Because I’m sure both the Scottish and every female in the western world would probably disagree with you.

Dawdler.8521:

Dante.1508:

If you want to get technical all Asura are transgenders because Anet forces all the females to wear male costumes…

Until you realize that Asuran males wear skirts, so yeah… Not sure where you are going with that.

Unless you saying that a male wearing skirt and female wearing pants make them transgenders. Because I’m sure both the Scottish and every female in the western world would probably disagree with you.

I’ve always been a bit weirded by kilts myself…

But yeah the Asura Situation is worry some.

BrotherBelial.3094:

If we are gong for inclusions why is there not a black person, or any other ethnic groups?

Queen Jenna can be considered “black”.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

I find the resistance to this rather humorous . . . given the majority of ‘women’ in-game tend to be played by men. . . .

I make female human toons because I like to look at them. That doesn’t make me transgender in any way.

Dante.1508:

1 and 2 are meaningless, if they have a game that is used by Russian customers they must follow Russian laws..

No actually. Russian laws have no affect on how American companies operate. The only time they apply is when the company has a presence within Russian borders. The most they can do is block their own retailers from carrying the game. Same with China. Due to a partnership with a Chinese company, GW2 had to change things to become compliant with Chinese law. That doesn’t stop it’s citizens from purchasing NA or EU versions of GW2 and playing on our uncensored servers.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

BrotherBelial.3094:

If we are gong for inclusions why is there not a black person, or any other ethnic groups?

Queen Jenna can be considered “black”.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

I find the resistance to this rather humorous . . . given the majority of ‘women’ in-game tend to be played by men. . . .

I make female human toons because I like to look at them. That doesn’t make me transgender in any way.

Dante.1508:

1 and 2 are meaningless, if they have a game that is used by Russian customers they must follow Russian laws..

No actually. Russian laws have no affect on how American companies operate. The only time they apply is when the company has a presence within Russian borders. The most they can do is block their own retailers from carrying the game. Same with China. Due to a partnership with a Chinese company, GW2 had to change things to become compliant with Chinese law. That doesn’t stop it’s citizens from purchasing NA or EU versions of GW2 and playing on our uncensored servers.

Pretty sure you missed my reply to you…

Swagger.1459:

Pretty sure you missed my reply to you…

Sorry about that. In response to your previous post, I know of no other game that has openly homosexual lifestyle themes in a main story line and a transgender NPC. I see GW2 as groundbreaking in many ways.

Now as for storytelling, my suggestion would be just to add Sya to the cast. It’s my personal, selfish suggestion that we make a hero out of her as a way to empower transgender players. Either way, it’s a subtle way to “educate” the masses on different lifestyles. It’s not enough to have parents have to sit down with kids to explain why a video game adding these characters in. But it’s enough make their existence known.

And to be honest, if GW2 utilized real life religions in game, I’d be the first to ask if they could add a Muslim hero to the main cast (if one didin’t already exist).

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

All of my human characters are Elonian. I suppose they could be considered “black” by some.

But… It would be senseless for me to drag Black Lives Matter into Tyria. Elonians haven’t experienced any of the issues important to BLM. What would it accomplish except to drag horrible real world polarization into Tyria?

I don’t care how “important” real world issues are. We don’t need to be choosing sides and making “statements” in a game that simply does not have those RL issues.

Racism exists in game. Some of us have issues with Salad gone bad. Human separatists hate Charr, for ingame lore and content reasons. Genocide is bad mmk. But it is Tyrian racism with imaginary races, not a RL Earth issue destined to inflame RL based conflict.

Restrict controversy to In Game scenarios. Avoid provoking conflict between the Actual People behind the keys.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

But then one could ask, out of the hundreds of random NPCs in the game, why Sya?

Please no more political agendas in video games. There is enough of that already

Do trans and gay people in Tyria even face any struggle? There’s been no signs of prejudice and everyone is just chill with it, magic even makes actually transitioning a non issue.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

Its not an assumption. He has said, multiple times now, that it is what he wants. He wants a transgender character focus for the sake of influencing players in real life, with any in game story considerations as secondary (if that) to his stated sociopolitical agenda.

Shinzan.2908:

Do trans and gay people in Tyria even face any struggle? There’s been no signs of prejudice and everyone is just chill with it, magic even makes actually transitioning a non issue.

That’s the thing. Tyria is such a PG place that it’s basically inconsequential to the story anyway.

Some games have touched on real life issues (the Witcher comes to mind, with the Scoia’tael/racism subplot) and done a fantastic job with the material, but I think topics like this are far better suited to M-rated titles where the theme can realised in a meaningful way.

Shinzan.2908:

Do trans and gay people in Tyria even face any struggle? There’s been no signs of prejudice and everyone is just chill with it, magic even makes actually transitioning a non issue.

They don’t. People in Tyria don’t care. Its a nonissue over there. It’s the OP that wants to bring issues from this world into that world in order to score sjw points.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Swagger.1459:

Pretty sure you missed my reply to you…

Sorry about that. In response to your previous post, I know of no other game that has openly homosexual lifestyle themes in a main story line and a transgender NPC. I see GW2 as groundbreaking in many ways.

Now as for storytelling, my suggestion would be just to add Sya to the cast. It’s my personal, selfish suggestion that we make a hero out of her as a way to empower transgender players. Either way, it’s a subtle way to “educate” the masses on different lifestyles. It’s not enough to have parents have to sit down with kids to explain why a video game adding these characters in. But it’s enough make their existence known.

And to be honest, if GW2 utilized real life religions in game, I’d be the first to ask if they could add a Muslim hero to the main cast (if one didin’t already exist).

Ok so you didn’t bother following the link correct?

You were asking for a prominent role for an npc to raise awareness on a real world topic. Any real world topics that are brought up here draw away from the theme and story of the game. Our characters are the heroes and should be central to it all… Not the npcs.

Bolded part- It is not the developers job to “educate” teens or adults on anything. It is their job to provide online entertainment. There are a plethora of real world mediums and resources and programs… that are the appropriate ways and channels to discuss and raise awareness on real world topics.

There are a plethora of subjects that we could raise attention to, but the online gaming platform is not the right place to do it.

I understand your intent, and I do not oppose various npcs in game, I do however take issue with anything that shifts the focus away from our personal characters and their purpose in the game as the heroes.

Swagger.1459:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Greetings all. There are those who may not be aware of this, but Anet is one of the most LGBT friendly game companies in existence. Not only do they have a bunch of openly transgender people employed in development and music composition, but they are the first to incorporate homosexual relationships in GW lore, and had the first same-sex kiss in the main story line of a top MMO. To add to this, GW2 also features the first transgender NPC mesmer in Lion’s Arch!

Being a pioneer in gaming, I think it’s time for Anet to once again push the envelope further towards equality for all. I believe the time is right for Aid Worker Sya to join our heroes in the next Living Story arc. What better way to teach acceptance and tolerance than to put a transgender character front and center in a main story? The story could detail the struggles that a transgender person in the world of Tyria, why Symon became Sya, and how she overcomes adversity in the face of Elder Dragon threats. Dare I suggest that Sya be the one to deal the killing blow to the Elder Dragon in the next expansion?

As a straight liberal male, I salute Anet for all they’ve done to connect with all types of players. Good job MO and Colin (if you still lurk our forums)!

Bolded parts

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_themes_in_video_games

I’m not sure what you mean by pioneer, could you explain?

Remember Trahearne? Our characters should be the central figures in game, not npcs.

Storytelling can take a number of routes, but it has to be done carefully and not draw away from the overall theme of the game. Also, the devs responsibility is to provide a fun and compelling gaming experience through their product, not to teach us customers real world lessons. Gaming platforms are here for a reality escape, we don’t really need to mirror real world struggles because then that opens the door to many others.

I’m not opposed to much, but I am opposed to how things like these are delivered and how much the devs shift the experience away from our characters. I don’t oppose this topic specifically, but if npcs and their mirrored real world struggles become central to any story, then we open that door to things like lessons of violence, mental health issues, slavery, animal abuse, war, politics, religion… you see where I’m going?

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

But then one could ask, out of the hundreds of random NPCs in the game, why Sya?

Why not?

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

Ashen.2907:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

Its not an assumption. He has said, multiple times now, that it is what he wants. He wants a transgender character focus for the sake of influencing players in real life, with any in game story considerations as secondary (if that) to his stated sociopolitical agenda.

“I’m not asking for any type of forced sexual preference based story. I’m just asking that a NPC, who happens to be transgender, be included in our party.” -Smooth Penguin.5294

Mii noh theenk u reed 2 gud.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

But then one could ask, out of the hundreds of random NPCs in the game, why Sya?

Why not?

I’m not saying Sya couldn’t be part of it, providing the character would be well written and brought something to the plot. But why Sya and not one of the hundreds of other NPCs?

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

but why someone else?
that’s the true question, when you remove any trans whatever then she is just like everybody els, a nobody forced in the main story.

Subtly including a lesbian relationship between two characters designed with bodies with genetics that would make Greek gods jealous isn’t exactly being a pioneer nor are they the first to do it.

It’s promoting liberal values while being safe, because Americans make a stunning exception when it comes to homosexualality presented to us in the form of two really hot girls kissing.

What’s not being safe is male on male relationships.

What’s even less safe is transgender, because of how vicious the average American reaction is to any form of gender bending or direct challenge to the lanes of gender roles. Transgender community has always gotten it a lot worse.

Beyond that, it’s very difficult to subtly add a transgender character and have people become aware they are transgender without being so blatant about it that it comes off as putting them on some kind of pedestal to be looked at like some kind of sideshow freak.

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

Up to Anet to decide. If they have a good story that includes Sya I’m all for it. If they have a good story to tell that doesn’t include Sya I’m all for it. Why do you think if Sya becomes a prominent character it instantly means it’s pushing an agenda? It just means Anet has a story they want to tell that includes her.

sorudo.9054:

BrotherBelial.3094:

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

but why someone else?
that’s the true question, when you remove any trans whatever then she is just like everybody els, a nobody forced in the main story.

We already had one of those.
His name was Trahearne.
He’s dead now.
We need another nobody to be forced in to take the limelight.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

Up to Anet to decide. If they have a good story that includes Sya I’m all for it. If they have a good story to tell that doesn’t include Sya I’m all for it. Why do you think if Sya becomes a prominent character it instantly means it’s pushing an agenda? It just means Anet has a story they want to tell that includes her.

I couldn’t care less, if you had read through the thread I’m probably the only one here who has had a family member go through with going from a man to a woman. So I can say with hand on heart I don’t care. What I do care is when someone comes on the forum with out a clue about what that decision can do to a person, a family, just because they think it would be “cool” annoys me to no end. I don’t want to see the impact this choice has on a person and there family be trivialized in a game. You could never do it justice. It’s not something you wake up.one day and decide it’s what you are going to do today. People who are your friends might not be after, family members might disown you. This is a big thing. Sure the same.could be said about being gay. But there are a lot less trans people out there than gay.

But you keep on talking about something you know jack about, because there is nothing cool or hip about it. Want to make a difference to the transgender population, go out there and help the transgender people in your community, a game won’t help people in the real world, no matter how good the story is.

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

But then one could ask, out of the hundreds of random NPCs in the game, why Sya?

Why not?

I’m not saying Sya couldn’t be part of it, providing the character would be well written and brought something to the plot.

I think you are in greater agreement with the relatively frictionless penguin than you realize. lol

I for one am glad that Anet included Sya in the game and made it in such a manner that has her fit into the lore without feeling superfluous or bringing the topic “in your face”. It was nice following Symon’s journey from previous releases into becoming Sya and how it all tied into the overarching plotline with war in Tyria and its effect on her and other Tyrians.

Whether that means we ever get a transgender character in our close circle of friends seems unlikely since we haven’t even had a black character in the main recurring cast yet; the closest we have of black characters who have stuck around longer than a mission or two has been Ela Makkay who may be E for various lore reasons and hints we’ve received throughout the game (and if so, that will elevate her importance higher from what it’s been in the story so far), but at least we have Marjory with her Canthan ancestry instead of having only whites in the reformed Destiny’s Edge. It would’ve been interesting if Kasmeer had been black or at least a darker skinned Krytan (like the ones seen in GW1) instead of white since ultimately her skin colour didn’t play a part in the story and the devs could’ve diversified the cast a bit from the usual Caucasian fare with such a subtle addition without calling attention to her skin colour, but maybe their decision was dictated by metrics or they just didn’t think of such a possibility of inclusion. Even Anet’s inclusion of mostly women in the recurring cast (which I find a nice take on mostly male-focused fantasy games) is less about diversity and more about IRL limitations of recurring male voice actor availability because originally both Marjory and Ellen Kiel were intended to be men.

As unfortunate as it is, the topic of gender and what it’s perceived to be is still controversial among many people around the world, so Anet likely won’t draw that much focus on any transgendered character to avoid potential controversy among players. Granted, they already have tackled gay stuff with sylvari and our recent female couple, but all of such moments were met with quite vocal backlash on the forums and elsewhere (from the comments I’ve read back in the day), which might discourage the writers from trying such a tactic again. I’d love to be proven wrong but only time will tell how the writers will approach the matter.

All that ultimately matters, however, is how the characters in question are written into the story as the story shouldn’t need to delve deep into gender or sexual orientation issues if Tyria is as free-spirited regarding such as it is hinted to be just like we’re not drawing attention to straight people’s orientations in Tyria. So if, say, the Squad Leader from the raids ends up playing a big role in a raid wing and off-handedly mentions having a loved one of the same sex waiting back home without making the sexual orientation some grand announcement, that’s fine as it’s not hitting you in the head with a hammer about it but still allows some diversity in Tyria while keeping the character awesome all at the same time.

Also, a couple of points I’d like to comment on:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think the hatred comes from the fact that Trahearne took credit for all of our hard work.

That’s actually not the case as the lore community has corrected people about it time and time again. In the Personal Story Trahearne only ever takes credit from us for one thing and one thing only: the naming of Fort Trinity, which I suspect was a lore oversight from the writers because they needed to cram all the different race/order storylines into a single, Orr-focused storyline for the finale and try to have it all make sense no matter which storylines you took (see, for example, how Almorra is totally open to talks with Order representatives in the finale of the Vigil storyline only for her to change her attitude in the very next mission where all the Order leaders are seen bickering, which is rather immersion-breaking, IMHO).

CaptainVanguard.4925:

Honestly, what I dont like is seeing “real” world issues being put into a virtual reality. It kind of eliminates the point of escapism, fantasy is an escape from reality, its designed to avoid these things in the first place. People dont play a fantasy game to see their specific gender/disability/trope being covered, they play it for the very reason that they escape the boundries of any of these things being mentioned or judged, because in the end, a virtual, fantasy world, should in no way or form, represent, the real one.

The thing is, though, that even “escapist fantasy”, no matter how crudely or well written, still tends to involve elements from the real world in some way because the art, writing, voice acting etc. is used to convey that sort of verisimilitude for various reasons, whether it happens accidentally or is in the devs’ interest (e.g. using Roman and Mongol stuff for charr culture, giving specific accents for specific races to convey a certain feel for them derived from our world, see e.g. largos having a Russian accent which makes them sound exotic to the English speaking audience; I’d be really interested in hearing how the localized versions for other languages have tackled the unique accents different GW2 races have and if they follow the English pattern of conveying “otherness” via their own stereotypes).

The world of Tyria is full of symbolism, metaphors and downright references to IRL history and its problematic and celebratory aspects. Take note of, for example, the female charr and their history in the present day and how their rebellion and rise to respect came about from troubled beginnings under the hegemony of the chauvinistic Flame Legion. Heck, there’s even dialogue in the game today which references breeding camps for female charr held in Flame territory (which paints Flame Legion as bad guys we shouldn’t feel guilty taking down), and that’s just the tip of the iceberg regarding topics which the game discusses (some more subtly than others) and which are based on historical stuff from our world.

Whether you look at Tolkien’s Lord of the Rings, Carl Barks’s Donald Duck and Uncle Scrooge comics, the Secret of NIMH (whether the novel or the animated film version) or Richard Adams’s Watership Down among countless other examples, you see each and every one of them having rather subtle references to their authors’ experiences and views of world, regarding politics, gender issues etc.

Simply put, there’s no escaping the real world in “escapist” stuff because as long as people keep creating art, no matter how fluffy said art might be on the outside, that art always reflects the society it’s been created in and the makers’/audience’s values in one way or another, which is what makes fields of study such as film theory, art and comics studies, and comparative literature so fascinating. Games, especially ones created today when the makers have more advanced tools at their disposal and more complex stories to tell and depict via gameplay/art/writing/etc (see e.g. the depiction of PSTD and war crimes in Spec Ops: The Line which is one of the more discussed games out there), are no different. I for one am glad Anet is tackling various issues in their game and how most of the time they’ve done so in a subtle enough manner that integrates such issues into the world and its lore without making them look anvilicious,..at least most of the time.

BrotherBelial.3094:

You know what? There are no transhumans! I demand representation! We need a NPC that has technology implanted in them to make them more than what they where born to be! I want my Cyborg Charr!

It’s easily solved as we already have the tools for that. Grab a transformation tonic that turns you into an Exalted, and you can RP a transcended human/charr etc. After all, in lore the Exalted went through the Forgotten’s trials and a ritual to leave behind their human bodies in order to become the magical, nigh-immortal beings we now know them as. Which makes me have an inkling of which GW1 character their Luminate originally was before being appointed as the leader of the Exalted, but that’s a lore discussion for another day…

Dante.1508:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TPMN.1483:

~~~ snip ~~~

I’m quite aware of what’s going on in Russia. But consider this:

1) Anet is an American company. Russian laws do not have any effect or enforcement.
1a) That wouldn’t be the case of Anet had an office in Russia. Thank goodness their data servers aren’t there.
2) GW2 already has homosexual storylines (i.e. Jory and Kas). They kissed as part of the end scene to the Living Story.

1 and 2 are meaningless, if they have a game that is used by Russian customers they must follow Russian laws..

Why do you think Steam got Sued by the Australian ACCC, and had massive law suits here over Refunds.. Steam does not have any Bricks and mortar here in Australia but they still had to follow the laws of the countries they sell too..

They don’t sell it in Russia.

This whole thread shows us two facts. Most of us are already beyond inclusive of LGBT people, and don’t need a lesson in PC culture. We accept you. Help us kill dragons in fictional lands.

Those who aren’t are clearly not ready for whatever lesson your trying to teach them. And it’s not your place to set their values anymore than they should tell you yours. In Tyria, there is no agenda for trans or straight anything. Everyone is happy to just leave it that way.

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

Up to Anet to decide. If they have a good story that includes Sya I’m all for it. If they have a good story to tell that doesn’t include Sya I’m all for it. Why do you think if Sya becomes a prominent character it instantly means it’s pushing an agenda? It just means Anet has a story they want to tell that includes her.

I couldn’t care less, if you had read through the thread I’m probably the only one here who has had a family member go through with going from a man to a woman. So I can say with hand on heart I don’t care. What I do care is when someone comes on the forum with out a clue about what that decision can do to a person, a family, just because they think it would be “cool” annoys me to no end. I don’t want to see the impact this choice has on a person and there family be trivialized in a game. You could never do it justice. It’s not something you wake up.one day and decide it’s what you are going to do today. People who are your friends might not be after, family members might disown you. This is a big thing. Sure the same.could be said about being gay. But there are a lot less trans people out there than gay.

But you keep on talking about something you know jack about, because there is nothing cool or hip about it. Want to make a difference to the transgender population, go out there and help the transgender people in your community, a game won’t help people in the real world, no matter how good the story is.

I have a transgender friend and friends ranging throughout the LGBT spectrum. Not family but do you really want to whip out a measuring stick about this?

And I think you’re mistaken if you think media can’t move people or make a difference. I remember a very moving thread started by a physically disabled player complimenting Anet for creating Taimi. Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

You know it’s a weekend when threads like this ramble this much and last this long.

RoseofGilead.8907:

You know it’s a weekend when threads like this ramble this much and last this long.

What amuses me most of all about that is someone said posts had been removed but the thread’s still here. How long do you give it once Monday gets here?

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

Daredevil has better senses than people with working eyes xD He’s hardly a poster boy for the blind – he can “see” better than me. Remember the thing you think is “seeing” is just a picture your brain draws you from electrical sense input and guesses, Daredevil has a better input and thus a better picture and is not in any way disabled (sorry if you’re blind and loved DD and I ruined it for you).

He’s essentially Usain Bolt going around in a wheelchair cause he likes the easier parking.

I have a degenerative uncurable condition that has left me one handed, basically, and slowly affecting the other hand as well.

Dumping Tiami in game was offensive to me. Pity is offensive. It raised a miniscule amount of actual awareness. If I mention my disability affects my ability to platform I am told to find another game, often by players “inspired” by ANET’s “inclusiveness” of Tiami.

Useless, shallow, feel good “inclusiveness”. Tiami’s addition to the game did absolutely nothing for disabled people in game. Nothing real was done, in fact, the game has become far less friendly for a person with an actual motive/dexterity disability. Platforming is now the norm, and it’s not optional.

Cosmetic garbage. Lip Service. No actual care or concern at all.

Hilarious how this thread got so many replies with such obvious bait.

Coulter.2315:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

Daredevil has better senses than people with working eyes xD He’s hardly a poster boy for the blind – he can “see” better than me. Remember the thing you think is “seeing” is just a picture your brain draws you from electrical sense input and guesses, Daredevil has a better input and thus a better picture and is not in any way disabled (sorry if you’re blind and loved DD and I ruined it for you).

Yeah DD takes it to superhuman extremes, but there’s some truth to enhanced touch, hearing, etc. for blind people last I checked. Regardless I’ll bet many people find Batman stories moving and relate to him losing loved ones despite never having his ridiculous superpower of “wealth” nor being the greatest detective in the world. You don’t have to be superhuman to relate to superheroes.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Coulter.2315:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

Daredevil has better senses than people with working eyes xD He’s hardly a poster boy for the blind – he can “see” better than me. Remember the thing you think is “seeing” is just a picture your brain draws you from electrical sense input and guesses, Daredevil has a better input and thus a better picture and is not in any way disabled (sorry if you’re blind and loved DD and I ruined it for you).

Yeah DD takes it to superhuman extremes, but there’s some truth to enhanced touch, hearing, etc. for blind people last I checked. Regardless I’ll bet many people find Batman stories moving and relate to him losing loved ones despite never having his ridiculous superpower of “wealth” nor being the greatest detective in the world. You don’t have to be superhuman to relate to superheroes.

Hmm. I am inspired by real people overcoming real obstacles. Not fictional characters who overcome everything with mythical plot devices.

But, carry on.

Wow, for a bunch of people who don’t care one way or the other this thread has certainly sparked a lot of activity lol.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Coulter.2315:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

Daredevil has better senses than people with working eyes xD He’s hardly a poster boy for the blind – he can “see” better than me. Remember the thing you think is “seeing” is just a picture your brain draws you from electrical sense input and guesses, Daredevil has a better input and thus a better picture and is not in any way disabled (sorry if you’re blind and loved DD and I ruined it for you).

Yeah DD takes it to superhuman extremes, but there’s some truth to enhanced touch, hearing, etc. for blind people last I checked. Regardless I’ll bet many people find Batman stories moving and relate to him losing loved ones despite never having his ridiculous superpower of “wealth” nor being the greatest detective in the world. You don’t have to be superhuman to relate to superheroes.

Hmm. I am inspired by real people overcoming real obstacles. Not fictional characters who overcome everything with mythical plot devices.

But, carry on.

And for blind people with your attitude they have Stevie Wonder. Doesn’t mean fictional universes can’t have them either.

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

BrotherBelial.3094:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

Zynt.5769:

DaikonSamurai.6714:

I don’t get why so many people are against this. Why not give a transgender character some prominence. I just want it to be a good story lol. As long as it’s a good story I don’t care what sexuality the characters are.

It’s not that people are against a transgender character, it’s that people don’t want a character shoehorned in, for the sake of it.

And you’re all assuming that’s what the OP wants. I’m pretty sure Mr. Penguin wants a well told story just as much as anyone here. Background characters gain prominence in stories all the time, so if an element of the story calls for it, why not Sya?

He wasn’t Sya thrust in to the light just because Sya is trans. No other reason. We still know very little about the people in DE 2.0, we don’t really know all that much about DE, unless you’ve read the book.

And if it’s because he wants someone overcoming adversity, my PC necro did that, she grew up on the streets, she never knew her parents. The first time she leave the city she saves a village and becomes a hero, she has the ear of the captain of the Seraph. Saves the queen, joins a order, rises through the ranks quickly, becomes second.in command of an army, kills 2 dragons. Now if that’s not inspiring I don’t know what is.

Plenty of Sylvari had to overcome adversity too both PC and NPC. If Anet has a good story to tell I don’t see why Sya can’t develop into something more important as well.

But why dose it have to be Sya? Because they are trans? Is that the only reason? Why not someone else. What makes her special enough to be elevated above the rest? I can tell you why. Because trans has been in the media as of late so it’s the “cool” thing to be supporting. That is the only reason. If it was because of just raising awareness of transgender then this thread would have come up asking this when the character was introduced. That is the truth, and you can handle the truth!

Up to Anet to decide. If they have a good story that includes Sya I’m all for it. If they have a good story to tell that doesn’t include Sya I’m all for it. Why do you think if Sya becomes a prominent character it instantly means it’s pushing an agenda? It just means Anet has a story they want to tell that includes her.

I couldn’t care less, if you had read through the thread I’m probably the only one here who has had a family member go through with going from a man to a woman. So I can say with hand on heart I don’t care. What I do care is when someone comes on the forum with out a clue about what that decision can do to a person, a family, just because they think it would be “cool” annoys me to no end. I don’t want to see the impact this choice has on a person and there family be trivialized in a game. You could never do it justice. It’s not something you wake up.one day and decide it’s what you are going to do today. People who are your friends might not be after, family members might disown you. This is a big thing. Sure the same.could be said about being gay. But there are a lot less trans people out there than gay.

But you keep on talking about something you know jack about, because there is nothing cool or hip about it. Want to make a difference to the transgender population, go out there and help the transgender people in your community, a game won’t help people in the real world, no matter how good the story is.

I have a transgender friend and friends ranging throughout the LGBT spectrum. Not family but do you really want to whip out a measuring stick about this?

And I think you’re mistaken if you think media can’t move people or make a difference. I remember a very moving thread started by a physically disabled player complimenting Anet for creating Taimi. Daredevil cheered up a lot of disabled Marvel fans. If it brightens even one person’s day over whatever unjust struggles they have to go through, I think that’s “cool” and “hip” regardless of whatever cringe people in this thread seem to perceive.

Really? A measuring stick. You clearly do not have a clue do you. If that’s all you took away from what I posted you must be full of it.

Meh, think what you want. I’m not LGBT so I won’t pretend to understand their challenges. I only hear what a handful of them describe to me. Still nothing you have said to me challenges what I’ve said from the start. If Anet has a good story to tell and it includes Sya, then why not? I think positive representation of any rarely represented class or group is cool.

Hmmm- why do Quaggans pop into my mind when we discuss anything trollish?