Guild Wars 2

I’ve been running around lately to get my locations, because I feel like teleporting to a waypoint makes no sense, so I was thinking, with all the waypoint driven story in the new living world story, maybe something should be explained as to how we can just teleport to a waypoint when we’re in the middle of nowhere. Sure we could use our imagination and come up with something simple, but it still feels immersion breaking when you have to do that.

I know mounts will probably never come to the game, but I can understand why people would want them, it really makes no sense that your character can run for miles on end without getting tired. However I was thinking, maybe Arenanet could sort of split things down the middle so to speak. If a character is under a waypoint they could make it so there’s no cost to travel to any other waypoint. This would create the desire for people to run to a waypoint to teleport somewhere else, and it would also make more sense, since you would have to essentially be “using” the waypoint you’re at to move to another one.

So then the question is, well what if I don’t want to run to a waypoint or what happens when you die? I think there should be some lore introduced that would allow that to make more sense. Maybe something like your spirit energy becomes attuned to waypoints when you discover them, which in turn brings you back to life when you die, but also allows you to move to them from wherever you are on the map. However it creates more stress on the way point when you move to one when you’re not actually by one to begin with, and therefor you have to pay the standard fee for fast traveling that’s in the game now.

Just some things to think about, wondering what other’s thoughts on this are, or if I’m the only one after 2 years that still get’s annoyed by the waypoint system.

Brian.6435:

I’ve been running around lately to get my locations, because I feel like teleporting to a waypoint makes no sense,

Waypoints make no sense, but guardians breathing fire that cure conditions, mesmers making clones of themselves that dissolve into butterflies and rainbow pony shortbows totally do?

Brian has a point. You’re running in the middle of a field then just decide to jump to a waypoint. There’s nothing connecting your location to a waypoint. It certainly would make more immersive sense if you could draw a trail of waypoints so that every waypoint exists on a line like a train station. You can travel from any given waypoint to another on that “line”. At certain points in the waypoint line there are waypoint hubs which might be a partiucularly larger settlement. These hubs allow you to change to other lines linking to the zone portals. The living story introduced the concept of a waypoint network existing along leylines but from the way we interact with waypoints it’s just like we can go places willy nilly

As far as waypoints reviving you, that’s actually something that’s come up for me back when I was RPing.

The answer we came up with was that the waypoints have systems in them to make sure you don’t arrive with your head where your arm should be, or all your organs on the outside. If you’re in very bad shape, they kick in and “reassemble” you as you teleport, though you’re still suffering a sort of shock from it, thus the lingering penalties.

I then proceeded to make an asura from the crew responsible for testing those systems, but he was too creepy to play for long…

As for teleporting from the middle of nowhere to another waypoint? We wrote that off as everyone that uses the waypoints having an experimental linking device that allows it. Perhaps that’s what inspired you to go out and make your start as a hero, the fact that you had been asked to test the device. The reason all the NPCs don’t use waypoints the way you do is because they don’t have such a device.

Waypoints are half mechanical, half lore. And it’s hard to draw that line without a depth study due to the lack of explanation on it.

But given how we see NPCs using waypoints, which is them running up underneath a waypoint then disappearing (and appearing at another waypoint in some cases, like Rytlock’s investigations into the thumpers during Origins of Madness), then us being able to use them from anywhere is mechanical. This includes us reviving via waypoint. We’re told that using waypoints do cost money, thus the free travel in cities is also mechanics. Just start that off.

Palador.2170:

As far as waypoints reviving you, that’s actually something that’s come up for me back when I was RPing.

The answer we came up with was that the waypoints have systems in them to make sure you don’t arrive with your head where your arm should be, or all your organs on the outside. If you’re in very bad shape, they kick in and “reassemble” you as you teleport, though you’re still suffering a sort of shock from it, thus the lingering penalties.

I then proceeded to make an asura from the crew responsible for testing those systems, but he was too creepy to play for long…

As for teleporting from the middle of nowhere to another waypoint? We wrote that off as everyone that uses the waypoints having an experimental linking device that allows it. Perhaps that’s what inspired you to go out and make your start as a hero, the fact that you had been asked to test the device. The reason all the NPCs don’t use waypoints the way you do is because they don’t have such a device.

Deus ex machina!

But how do we teleport? Do we imagine the place where we want to be? Do we have a small device? Why can’t the enemy use this system?

Honsetly, I would prefer they change the system to be consistent with lore. Currently, waypoints are far too easy to use, and map travel would be much more interesting if you had to use an existing waypoint to travel to another waypoint.

Its in the lore. its Asura technology. They little snobby ones arent’ gonna tell you their secrets on how they work. But the long and short of the story is they work off the magic of the world. and we as players are magic therefore we can use them.

That’s sort of a simple, but good point Paradox, but again if the LS is directly effecting the Waypoints, I think more should be explained about them, maybe from Taimi, she doesn’t seem to be too snobbish on explaining how her devices work at least. I guess we can establish at least the fact that they work through “magic” and they are setup on the leylines. Do warriors use magic though? I can’t really think of any magic skills they have, and rangers use more of a spirital energy as their form of “magic”.

All that aside it still doesn’t really explain the cost of waypoint travel either. Where is this money going and how does it get taken? I understand it’s mechanics but I also think it’s important to make a world that is believable.

If I may quote Todd Howard ""tying all those things together to create a more believable world." The point of Skyrim was not dragons – “that was just a very specific feature” – the point was compelling, believable escapism.

I dunno. RP wise it’s pretty crazy.

I like the way ESO did it with their way points – shock, gasp, I know, right.

They way they work it, you can teleport to any waypoint from the middle of nowhere.. for a fee. But if you run in and get to an actual waypoint, transportation is free. I actually think that if you had to run to a waypoint to get onto the ‘waypoint subway’, that’d be perfectly fine. Waypoints are super common anyway.

I like how waypoints work in another game, I don’t want to give u a name of it, but I like to mention it, because both waypoint systems has a same “nature”, they are half magical, and at the same time half science machines.

So 1st of all, you can teleport only to waypoints you know, and only if you have certain amount of money for it. But how do you “find out a waypoint”? In that case you need to discover a place there is a waypoint located, and then “become attuned” to it, technically you become recognized by that waypoint. “Become attuned” to waypoint is a magical action which has cast-time and actual animation of casting.
In a point for gw2 this part is “skipped”, cuz game counts you recognized by wp as soon as you unlock it and it’s become clickable on your map. But I guess this action would actually make sense, cuz it will explain why certain waypoints allows you to use them and others is not. There is no sense of waypoints if u think about them as like a train station, because train can take u to any station on the line, regardless if u been there or not. But it doesn’t work this way for gw2, you certainly cannot discover new locations by using waypoints.

2nd thing is how to teleport from nowhere. So far as u can not interact with waypoints being nearby waypoints won’t give you any benefits, even if it gives u perfect sense why u can teleport. But I must admit it cuz second mechanic is “skipped” also. And that other game to teleport from nowhere to waypoint you have to cast a “teleportation” it has cast-time and own animation, but certainly gives u an idea how all this thing works.

Quite obviously that 1st and 2nd points were skipped by game designers due “making game less alike others” and also saving player time by removing all this “signature moves” to make teleportation faster and easier.

And resurrection, actual resurrection has a different “look” and more dark and tragical animation, but it also eventually shows you that waypoint is actually heals you, while resurrects you. But gw2 also skipped that point and teleportation from condition
“being dead” has just a same mechanic and has nothing new, just similar to one you use while you alive. This also was made because of “quite obvious reasons”.

But as for me I decided to acknowledge this part, because current in-game gw2 lore doesn’t explain this processes as processes (in any possible way). They just there like common nature. So I think it safer to say we actually cast teleportation and we actually being revived by waypoints which can recognize us, even so it doesn’t represented with in-game mechanics.

Also I wish Anet one day will do a story-arc about one crazy-asura fool who recalibrated waypoint network to make Player Character and probably few other Npcs – BANNED from using waypoint network at all or for random amount of waypoints in random times. That will give gamers idea how much they’re actually connected to waypoints more then any crazy green vines..

Brian.6435:

because I feel like teleporting to a waypoint makes no sense

I know mounts will probably never come to the game, but I can understand why people would want them, it really makes no sense that your character can run for miles on end without getting tired.

However .. pulling a horse out of your pocket makes so much more sense .. right ?

Beldin.5498:

Brian.6435:

because I feel like teleporting to a waypoint makes no sense

I know mounts will probably never come to the game, but I can understand why people would want them, it really makes no sense that your character can run for miles on end without getting tired.

However .. pulling a horse out of your pocket makes so much more sense .. right ?

What if you could only do that at a waypoint, by having the horse teleported to you?

Lheimroo.2947:

I dunno. RP wise it’s pretty crazy.

I like the way ESO did it with their way points – shock, gasp, I know, right.

They way they work it, you can teleport to any waypoint from the middle of nowhere.. for a fee. But if you run in and get to an actual waypoint, transportation is free. I actually think that if you had to run to a waypoint to get onto the ‘waypoint subway’, that’d be perfectly fine. Waypoints are super common anyway.

Heck, even in Skyrim you can fast travel to anywhere you have unlocked. It’s called convenience, friends. Also; in GW2, it has a lore explanation so even if you happen to be RP’ing, your character can rest easy: it’s all explained.

@Beldin

Yes pulling a horse out of your pocket wouldn’t make a lot of sense, but this is a fantasy realm, things like that could be explained. What if there’s a pocket horse manufacturer in Rata sum, there’s “magic” in the world after all, right?

That’s the main point I’m trying to reach in this topic. It’s not a matter of questioning things that are ridiculous, it’s a matter of them being explained in someway to give the player a sense of believability.

@lason

The fast traveling in Skyrim is meant to be a skipping of the passing of time it would take had you walked on foot, that’s why if you do fast travel in the game at say, 6 a.m., it’s now all the sudden 12 p.m. when you get there. When you fast travel in this game, it’s assumed to be instant.

Its called MAGIC. dont try to find logic about some stuff as it does not make much sense at times.

Yeah waypoints make almost all things in tyria ridiculous. Instant teleportation anywhere from anywhere is a bit strange, it destroys most things like the living story (dry top was inaccessible but there were waypoints. wut?). And capturing fugitives should be impossible, they’d just teleport away to safety. Res shrines + asura gates would have been a continuation of GW1 lore but…we can boss hunt easier I guess?

And it makes sense for a dolyak to run miles without getting tired?

Players are up to their ears with magic. They won’t get tired or need sleep as long as they can pop a healing skill and recover and a skill with swiftness and speed up.

Also, humans have actually evolved to be able to run for long periods or time. People just got lazy and stopped doing it, so they got fat and get tired if they try to run for too long.

Brian.6435:

[…]

So then the question is, well what if I don’t want to run to a waypoint or what happens when you die? […]

You do not die. Player characters never die. Ever. No exceptions so far.

They replaced the concept of “player death” with “defeat”.

Devs themselves may say “dead” when talking about mechanics, but that’s force of habit from many other games. And some places may refer to player defeat as death like the /death command, but that’s just text they overlooked and forgot to update, like when they changed “death penalty” to “defeat penalty”.

When the human gods went AWOL, that also took part of the gifts they gave. The direct ones hey were managing. One of those were resurrection skills.

People could resurrect because Grenth was actively allowing that.
When Grenth left, resurrection skills stopped working. Only resurrection rituals, and only some, still worked (Like Baelfire’s complicated ritual). You could say things went back to how they were when Dhuum was in charge. No more skeletal undead spawning on their own. No more resurrection skills.

So what happens when you are defeated? You get as close to dead as possible without actually dying. Say a coma, or severe trauma or whatever. But not dead.
NPCs do not die either if you can revive them. When something actually dies, they despawn and no player or other NPC could revive them.

Waypoints canonically won’t be intercepting you before you die to recover you or anything like that, though. In that regard they are like the New-U stations in Borderlands. In Borderlands when you die you are restored in a New-U station, but in canon you simply didn’t die in the first place. Same with waypoints, you could say you using a waypoint while defeated is the waypoint automatically picking your vitals and teleporting you and reviving you, but there’s no need for that, because in the story, the protagonist character is never actually defeated. If you see a defeated protagonist, you could say that whoever is telling their story made a mistake. Like when the narrating prince in Prince of Persian goes “No, no, no, that’s not how it happened.” when the character dies.

Waypoints are merely a fast travel system that allows individuals to travel back to previously visited places for hefty fee (fee that is greatly reduced for players for economic and practicality reasons). That’s why you won’t see armies using them, because you can’t bring your army to some place if not all of them have been there before, and it’ll cost thousands of gold.
Asura gates are also supposed to be costly. We just go for free because of design, not lore. Nobody would use them with their realistic prices.