Guild Wars 2

And even if it is confusing for a new player. Just skip it! what’s the big deal? It’s not like game over when you can’t figure out how to attack under water or use a friggin bundle. Just come back later when you’re less “confused”.
Never have I experienced such a drastic dumbing down of a game that was just fine.

I feel the same way about the changes in Wayfarer.

This answers the question Ive been asking, how do you do the Poison Ampule/corrupted underwater creature heart, when you cant fight underwater.

Stupid change.

The early part of metrica that has been changed left me bored, confused and unsure of what to do, so I ran out of it to the level 7 areas. I was lucky to have a friend with me so I could do that without dying horribly.

In my experience when you’re confused in this game you have to go back to heart and read. I do realize it’s too much to ask though of the latest generation. I won’t be surprised if next change will make levelling from 1 to 10 be a game where you are presented with left and right arrow, and have to press the corresponding arrow on your keyboard when one of them flashes green :P

And all the vistas are going to be moved to the ground level, in a neat row, because they are too hard to reach currently.

I was confused for the longest time about vistas. That surely means they must be either removed entirely or made very easily accessible (this is sarcasm, btw).

Gimli.9461:

I dread to go and see what changes were done to other zones (I hope not too many)

Hoo boy… make a human, right now, and walk to the first heart with the cows. I don’t want to spoil it anymore than that.

Gimli.9461:

I dread to go and see what changes were done to other zones (I hope not too many)

They added an additional heart quest in caledon forest at the POI of Rime’s Garden (Village of Astorea basically). You have to kill grubs and feed moas with apples. Unfortunately they copy &pasta some appletrees from Queensdale which look really out of place in the otherwise alien landscape of Caledon Forest.

In the Plains of Ashford they added two new hearts. One is placed at the cow ranch right next to the ramp that leads up to the Black citadel and involves killing spiders, killing wurms and putting hay into the troughs.
The second one is where the skill challenge takes place (where the skritt have their hideyhole in the wall). Involves killing skritt and firing cannons.

I’m sure there are more changes in the other starting zones.

Gimli.9461:

In my experience when you’re confused in this game you have to go back to heart and read. I do realize it’s too much to ask though of the latest generation. I won’t be surprised if next change will make levelling from 1 to 10 be a game where you are presented with left and right arrow, and have to press the corresponding arrow on your keyboard when one of them flashes green :P

And all the vistas are going to be moved to the ground level, in a neat row, because they are too hard to reach currently.

I was confused for the longest time about vistas. That surely means they must be either removed entirely or made very easily accessible (this is sarcasm, btw).

Hearts were originally implemented in the game as a way to get players to slow down, spend some time in an area where dynamic events happen. I have 7 level 80s and 4k hours in the game, and have played in metrica/with asura before. I’m familiar with the mechanics.
But I choose to play in the way that’s fun for me, which does not involve waiting around for events, i explore and if something’s happening I participate.

The way the progeny heart was moved, it is now off to the side and you have to look UP to see it, so I didnt even notice it. The golem chess was the most obvious thing I saw but I couldn’t interact with it, so I moved on. Next there was a big open space with nothing where the progeny used to be. Empty field, check. Then a small jumping exercise with diving goggles which I could not use. The whole starting area is vague. I didn’t know what to do so I started hitting enemies with my 2 skills, which was boring, didn’t give much xp, didn’t unlock new skills, didn’t seem to progress me in any way except as a slow xp grind. I wandered further away and couldn’t tell if I was meant to be there at my level or not.

The changes have impacted the conveyance, made it more tell than show, and it is a game design issue.

Straylight.7529:

Gimli.9461:

I dread to go and see what changes were done to other zones (I hope not too many)

They added an additional heart quest in caledon forest at the POI of Rime’s Garden (Village of Astorea basically). You have to kill grubs and feed moas with apples. Unfortunately they copy &pasta some appletrees from Queensdale which look really out of place in the otherwise alien landscape of Caledon Forest.

In the Plains of Ashford they added two new hearts. One is placed at the cow ranch right next to the ramp that leads up to the Black citadel and involves killing spiders, killing wurms and putting hay into the troughs.
The second one is where the skill challenge takes place (where the skritt have their hideyhole in the wall). Involves killing skritt and firing cannons.

I’m sure there are more changes in the other starting zones.

That’s great, I will for sure go check them out, I think I’ll do the low level zones sweep on this character first thing to check out collections that pop up in there and the changes.

It’s good to hear some changes are good – additions. Additions are gooood! Dumbing down is baaaaad (and not worth spending dev power on, come on).

Straylight.7529:

Gimli.9461:

I dread to go and see what changes were done to other zones (I hope not too many)

They added an additional heart quest in caledon forest at the POI of Rime’s Garden (Village of Astorea basically). You have to kill grubs and feed moas with apples. Unfortunately they copy &pasta some appletrees from Queensdale which look really out of place in the otherwise alien landscape of Caledon Forest.

In the Plains of Ashford they added two new hearts. One is placed at the cow ranch right next to the ramp that leads up to the Black citadel and involves killing spiders, killing wurms and putting hay into the troughs.
The second one is where the skill challenge takes place (where the skritt have their hideyhole in the wall). Involves killing skritt and firing cannons.

I’m sure there are more changes in the other starting zones.

For Wayfarer Foothills they’ve taken out the southern Dredge heart in Wayfarer; moved the potato farm; removed the permanent rich copper from the jp; moved Bjarni off the mountain.

If any of the stuff that’s been removed was only just moved (like the taters) then I can’t find them.

Oh, and rock dogs added to the Jotun trade camp heart. Rock dogs!

To be fair, Golem Chess is kinda annoying as a heart.

I do think it’s a cool minigame, but it really shouldn’t be the first heart.

Kain Francois.4328:

To be fair, Golem Chess is kinda annoying as a heart.

I do think it’s a cool minigame, but it really shouldn’t be the first heart.

Now it’s gone forever. Better the first heart than no heart.

Kain Francois.4328:

To be fair, Golem Chess is kinda annoying as a heart.

I do think it’s a cool minigame, but it really shouldn’t be the first heart.

But it was only one of the 3 (maybe more) ways to do the heart! You didn’t have to play it

Honestly, I think Anet should be focusing not on dumbing things down and changing things that are fine, but educating new players better. For instance:

Food. I , being a veteran, run my lowbies equipped with a stack of T-Bone STeak, which gives +20 power, has no level requirement, and can be purchased in plains of ashford.
This makes a HUGE difference to survivability.

So instead of making things stupider, why don’t Anet place a good food vendor at the start of the map and add a tutorial on that?
Or why don’t they add a good tutorial on Combo Fields and conditions?

It took me as a new player ages to understand how to use these things properly.
Or a good tutorial on vistas?

But no lets take away all the skills introduce them one by one and not really add anything good.

facepalms

I liked Golem chess just like I liked feeding cows.

I really wish we could have a feature to turn off the stuff aimmed at the ‘so called new people’ and leave in the stuff I liked and enjoyed.

I wouldn’t mind seeing Golem Chess come back at one point. The cities need more mini-games.

How about making actual chess tables in the city, which any player could walk up to and play? I mean, Chess-Chess; the real Chess.

Bad management choices are bad.

It absolutely blows my mind how much content they are willing to remove and the pace at which they do it, compared to the pace of content addition and the size of that added content.

Why the kitten are you spending your time taking away things? Make a Baby’s First Dungeon instance and put that in for the drooling idiots you think you need to cater to, don’t take away things that baffle those same idiots.

“Hmm, rates of high school graduation are dropping! Let’s extend pre-school by 5 years, that should fix things.”

NonToxic.9185:

“Hmm, rates of high school graduation are dropping! Let’s extend pre-school by 5 years, that should fix things.”

^ summary of leveling changes

Kamui.4038:

Gimli.9461:

I dread to go and see what changes were done to other zones (I hope not too many)

Hoo boy… make a human, right now, and walk to the first heart with the cows. I don’t want to spoil it anymore than that.

My initial reaction:

My new Norn warrior couldn’t pick up a tasty fish to give to bear cubs which used to be part of the second Heart in Wayfarer Foothills. But he could still disable traps and kick trees. And he could still kill stuff.

No RC golem chess mini game.

First it’s no SAB and now this? NOW THIS?!

WHY DON’T YOU JUST TAKE MY HEART ANET, WHY DON’T YOU TAKE THAT TOO.

Did they get rid of the Jotun trading heart in Wayfarer Foothills? That would be awesome :P

I started a new asura yesterday to firsthand check out the leveling (am a vet, all classes 80, map complete, blah blah blah) and was just sad once I got out of the tutorial. Metrica, we hardly knew thee.

I bought and still play this game because of the world, the art and the races with their little quirks and types. Sure, loot is great, but theres Diablo 3 if I really need to scratch that itch. But D3 and many other generic fantasy RPG/mmo/whatever don’t have the “personality” that GW2 has (had?) IMO.

RC golem chess is no more than a 2 minute activity, but I still remembered the impression it left on me as a new player coming in from GW1 (and one who ran around in the cerebral or Vekk tonic form as often as possible). The golem chess represented part of the personality of the game and more importantly made me want to go out and see “what other cool asura stuff is in the zone?” "A nuclear reactor?!? " What does Rata Sum look like now? etc. It was a far bigger motivator to keep playing and exploring this game than a level popup ever will be.

thehipone.6812:

I started a new asura yesterday to firsthand check out the leveling (am a vet, all classes 80, map complete, blah blah blah) and was just sad once I got out of the tutorial. Metrica, we hardly knew thee.

I bought and still play this game because of the world, the art and the races with their little quirks and types. Sure, loot is great, but theres Diablo 3 if I really need to scratch that itch. But D3 and many other generic fantasy RPG/mmo/whatever don’t have the “personality” that GW2 has (had?) IMO.

RC golem chess is no more than a 2 minute activity, but I still remembered the impression it left on me as a new player coming in from GW1 (and one who ran around in the cerebral or Vekk tonic form as often as possible). The golem chess represented part of the personality of the game and more importantly made me want to go out and see “what other cool asura stuff is in the zone?” "A nuclear reactor?!? " What does Rata Sum look like now? etc. It was a far bigger motivator to keep playing and exploring this game than a level popup ever will be.

It’s like everything is being normalized; homogenized. Sacrificing everything for an experiment.

Gimli.9461:

- Why would you dumb down the content of the race that’s smart by lore?

You should have seen the Asura heartquests during the Beta. You had to do entire mathematical equations to complete them lol.

http://youtu.be/-PofqxrBYnU?t=8m54s

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Gimli.9461:

- Why would you dumb down the content of the race that’s smart by lore?

You should have seen the Asura heartquests during the Beta. You had to do entire mathematical equations to complete them lol.

They still had one of those in the zone. Maybe this update just removed it, who knows. I haven’t bothered to log in even into my level 80s until they at least resolve my human female’s idle animations. I didn’t make a tiny Norn, I made a Human.

However we look at it, a large amount of content has been removed from the game.

Why did they remove the Golem Chess minigame in Metric proviance?
This better be a bug…
This kitten is broken…

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Why did they remove the Golem Chess minigame in Metric proviance?
This better be a bug…
This kitten is broken…

Bundles were deemed too confusing for new players. The chess minigame is considered a bundle. Therefore it was removed.

Welcome to the year 2014, where game developers have to protect their customers from confusing thoughts. Afterall these thoughts could rouse feelings of severe discomfort. Would you like a stress ball with your copy of GW2?

Straylight.7529:

DreamyAbaddon.3265:

Why did they remove the Golem Chess minigame in Metric proviance?
This better be a bug…
This kitten is broken…

Bundles were deemed too confusing for new players. The chess minigame is considered a bundle. Therefore it was removed.

Welcome to the year 2014, where game developers have to protect their customers from confusing thoughts. Afterall these thoughts could rouse feelings of severe discomfort. Would you like a stress ball with your copy of GW2?

My copy didn’t come with one and I could really use it right now…

I’m tempted to try out a private server after this patch to play the golden days of GW2.
Though I never actually played on a private server before and worry about getting hacked if I do…

This sucks. Why must thoughts like this enter my mind…

What?! They not only dumb down leveling experience, but also exploration experience? Wtf. So if i go with level 80 character to metrica province, it’s still gonna be nerfed, compared to old metrica? (dumbed down heart quests, mobs amounts, difficulty levels). I really have to voice against this. Anet please for the love of God embrace the following: “DON’T FIX WHAT AINT BROKE”

When I finally think they learned from their mistakes (living story is not permanent, not temporary), they removed the Core of the game. Litteraly piece by peace (heart quest by heart quest). Instead of expanding the game they are shrinking it… The world upside down, i have no words for this.

If low IQ people that are ultra confused are so desparate on your agenda make a tutorial for them. Make new character, next next, ‘new pop up menu: New player tutorial are veteran player mode’? Click either and be happy if you are either veteran or newb. But this solution? WTF. Bad bad bad Anet.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

What?! They not only dumb down leveling experience, but also exploration experience? Wtf. So if i go with level 80 character to metrica province, it’s still gonna be nerfed, compared to old metrica? (dumbed down heart quests, mobs amounts, difficulty levels). I really have to voice against this. Anet please for the love of God embrace the following: “DON’T FIX WHAT AINT BROKE”

Yep. And I’m a thousand, maybe a million, times more outraged about than the skill lock thing.

I want to know who out of the focus group was too dumb to handle 3 utility skills by lvl 20 and an elite by 30.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Gimli.9461:

- Why would you dumb down the content of the race that’s smart by lore?

You should have seen the Asura heartquests during the Beta. You had to do entire mathematical equations to complete them lol.

http://youtu.be/-PofqxrBYnU?t=8m54s

God that would have been an awesome heart/skillpoint/whatever to do. But no… we have to dumb down everything…

1. They did a LOT of extensive testing and research on what players in China would be receptive too and wanted in an MMO.
2. They used this info to alter the existing GW2 game “starting experience” for the China release.
3. They introduced the TRAIT changes to NA/EU last feature pack.
4. They released in China.
5. They realized the PitA it was to maintain 2 code sets (maybe they knew this all along and realized later the extra resources it took).
6. Decided to consolidate the 2 code bases (to make it easier, less expensive?)
7. Attempted to present the Chinesse changes to the NA/EU players as a “fresh start” (best thing since sliced bread!).
8. Introduced all the changes (except the Trait changes they made BEFORE the China release).
9. Do not appear to be coping with all the criticism in a very good manner….

Note that the fact that they introduced the TRAIT changes BEFORE the China release tells me they had this “consolidation” planned all along and just didn’t want to dump all the leveling changes on us at one time.

I’m guessing they now realize this possibly could have been handled differently / better, but since most of these changes are being looked upon by a good number of players as a fully dressed feces sandwich, I’m not sure how.

No more robot chess?

meh… wasted content…. not saying it was amazingly fun but I don’t understand this kind of moves… just don’t remove it! place it somewhere else, with no benefit or purpose,… maybe someone had fun just playing with the robots? I mean,… its an extra filling the world and make it more complete; Y U REMOVE IT!?

Asuran species got stupid? That’s preposterous! but i’m not surprised. too many bookah messing around with their sacred ground these days polluting everything.

China has a way bigger potential playerbase (they do have one of the largest populations in the world) and as stated before we knew they wouldn’t upkeep a NA version of the game and a China version of the game (because let’s be real, they LOVE grindy games where you throw all of your money into them to be better than the average player). We all knew this was coming…it just hurts to see it cut away so harshly. I loved MP as a starting zone, I used to take all of my characters over there to level…now it’s like a half-digested Husk that isn’t even a champion.

We are not stupid, new players are not stupid. If you playtested in China and they didn’t understand the mechanics it’s because GW2 isn’t like all other games. They needed time to figure out the mechanics, not 5 mins to sit down with the game and then ask for a survey.

rabidsmiles.5926:

China has a way bigger potential playerbase (they do have one of the largest populations in the world) and as stated before we knew they wouldn’t upkeep a NA version of the game and a China version of the game (because let’s be real, they LOVE grindy games where you throw all of your money into them to be better than the average player). We all knew this was coming…it just hurts to see it cut away so harshly. I loved MP as a starting zone, I used to take all of my characters over there to level…now it’s like a half-digested Husk that isn’t even a champion.

We are not stupid, new players are not stupid. If you playtested in China and they didn’t understand the mechanics it’s because GW2 isn’t like all other games. They needed time to figure out the mechanics, not 5 mins to sit down with the game and then ask for a survey.

Well, if they are getting a lot of extra cash from there, then they should have more than enough profits to upkeep two different versions of the game. Just the thought that we may get outsourced to China makes me ill, so I think I’m gonna stop thinking about it for now.

They are removing everything from the game until all that’s left is living story

zenleto.6179:

I feel the same way about the changes in Wayfarer.

I did the L3 bear heart in Wayfarer yesterday. I was sad to see that using the fish traps no longer gave me a fish to give to a bear cub, instead merely producing a fish I could not interact with which a bear cub then swatted. I’m not saying that needing to interact twice with the game world was the height of engaging gameplay. However, thinking that there is a need to reduce in-game clicking because doing so twice to get progress is too much for some players makes me wonder whether humanity is doomed.

What an absolute shame! Metrica province used to be my favourite starting zone because there were so many interesting and fun hearts there. Plus the little extra stuff like golem chess.

Please change this back, for the sake of the new players!

eyestrain.3056:

Hearts were originally implemented in the game as a way to get players to slow down, spend some time in an area where dynamic events happen.

Actually, hearts were originally added to the game because the clickers and other types complained that they didn’t know what to do. There wasn’t an arrow pointing them to where to go. They didn’t know how to explore. So, Arenanet added the hearts which were easy to find, but apparently not easy enough because a lot of stuff in low level areas just got dumbed down on 9/9

I’d be fine with the no-hearts original version where everything was run by dynamic events.

Ishtar.6457:

Asuran species got stupid?

Nonono. You got it all wrong. They dumbed down their starting zone to CONVINCE the other races that they got stupid. In the meantime, they have perfected golems. Series 7 attack golem on Asura characters does insane amounts of damage now. So, we don’t have any reason to believe that the Asura have gotten any dumber.

I think it’s a ploy to take over Tyria. ASURA MASTER RACE!!!!!!

I was also sorry to see many of the changes in Metrica. Much of the introductory variety of the game is removed. And the lake! sob

I understand why they did it however it removed quite a few cool activities. They were fun to do. They were engaging and partly what made some areas unique. A lot of the bundles in the beginning areas is what added the flavor to the races and helped you immerse yourself into the race.

I think the proper thing to do is have the compass guide players to the hearts and not show the heart on the UI until they have talked to the heart vendor and received their instructions. This would have got rid of a lot of confusion not only on the bundles themselves and why your skills suddenly changed. But it would be a perfect time to explain more the mechanics of a heart.

Kain Francois.4328:

To be fair, Golem Chess is kinda annoying as a heart.

I do think it’s a cool minigame, but it really shouldn’t be the first heart.

It should have been moved. Not removed. Move one or two to rata sum. It was a fun minigame.

Read this, so had to have a looky at the progeny heart. After a quick run past, my first impressions, if I was a brand new out of the box beginner——Why is this place so empty?

I am afraid this is appears as classic example of the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. One the one hand we had the mega servers, which was, on the whole a good thing, as, as was quite rightly pointed out made the place seem a busy, vibrant game. Then on the other hand, the Progeny heart is moved to who knows where (I didn’t bother searching for it—-why should I? An absolute beginner would be completely unaware of its presence in any case), and in its place is replaced with—-nothing. If they had tumble weed blowing through that area would be more fitting, with a big sign—-‘Move along please—Nothing to see here’.

NonToxic.9185:

It absolutely blows my mind how much content they are willing to remove and the pace at which they do it, compared to the pace of content addition and the size of that added content.

Why the kitten are you spending your time taking away things? Make a Baby’s First Dungeon instance and put that in for the drooling idiots you think you need to cater to, don’t take away things that baffle those same idiots.

“Hmm, rates of high school graduation are dropping! Let’s extend pre-school by 5 years, that should fix things.”

Here is what worries me: Imagine that the drooling idiots who need these changes do stick with the game and make it to 80. What sort of game do you think they will demand? Arenanet has made clear that they will cater to these players.