Guild Wars 2

I thought it was warrior but people say Ele is that true?

Warrior is third iirc. Also iirc Ele is highest dps.

from what i know its ele > guard > warrior but warrior brings the best survivability and is easy to play.

Everyone forgets poor thieves …

from what i know its ele > guard > warrior but warrior brings the best survivability and is easy to play + good support ( banners ect. )

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners. More than 1 warrior in your party is already a dps loss for absolutely nothing in return and it would be better to replace them by one of the other 2 classes i mentioned or a ranger with spotter and a traited frost spirit.

Yea warriors are only popular because they have high DPS (not highest), but are also a bit more survivable and have banners for support. Plus they are significantly easier to play. Just Hundred Blades everything basically.

It is Elementalist, followed by Thief.

After that I’m not sure but I’d say Warrior>Guardian

without Fiery GS pre patch actually was

Mesmer>warrior>ele or Mesmer >ele>warrior

Post patch i don t know

There are lot of variables.
Also the viability to actually deliver that damage and the buff you receive.

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners. More than 1 warrior in your party is already a dps loss for absolutely nothing in return and it would be better to replace them by one of the other 2 classes i mentioned or a ranger with spotter and a traited frost spirit.

You are wrong. Warriors are taken above Ele’s in dungeons or Thiefs for that matter, that the DPS is cleaving and still reasonable while they are able to effectively stack through the course of the dungeon. Add in, For Great Justice and banners and you are good to go. I am not saying you cant melee stack with Ele’s, but I can imagine it would be pretty bad.

Warriors are taken over ele because if the guard is not good enough, ele dies to everything if you stack.

Warrior instead can do enough damage to kill its target, provide buffs and ress, and doesn t even needs to stop dps to heal.

If you have a good guardian eles are better than warriors (but warrior is still superior for offensive support).

It shifted a lot with the ferocity change. I wouldnt say guangs numbers are correct. But theres probably some truths to them assuming he made the same (hopefully reasonable) assumptions for each class.

Edit: Cant find the rankings. Seems guang removed the original post and linked his new ranking thread instead which excludes some classes because hes lazy and only considers solo dps.

From what I can remember of the original thread it shifted to be:

Ele
mesmer (still unrealistic)
Thief
Necro
Warrior
Guard
Ranger
Engi

Basically necro moved up some places and guard went down some places. But I have no idea what assumptions and builds guang used for these. So this list could be completely wrong.

Ele have the best dps NOT because of FGS btw. They can remove completly the FGS and ele would still have the higher DPS. The reason, why people were sure that Warrior had the best DPS in the beginning of the game is because ppl didn’t really know the HUGE advantage that a good build with damage multiplier can do. Warrior don’t have access to that much damage modifier so they have good dps whaterver you do. They get their offense and defense from raw stats, making them easy to be good with them, when compare to other profession.

Right now. Elementalist have the highest DPS because of they can more than double their damage with access to A LOT of damage modifiers at low tier of trait (you can get 5 or 6 of them in Adept tier (you can’t see that nowhere else). If you had to that FGS, then their 1st place is well secure.

Thief is second but only for single target. They can bring a lot of vulnerability, really quickly with FGS (like a Ele can if build correctly) and have access to a lot of damage modifiers.

Mesmer have the possibility to be one of the highest DPS of the game (if not the highest), but for that they need to drop the utilities that the focus bring (which is not the bets idea in a group for several fight), but they also need a bit of chance and they need time to reach that DPS potentiel. Since they need 3 good phantasm up, they usually reach their peak DPS when the fight is already finish (most of the time). Mesmer already need to reflect in order to get the 1st place, which is not possible in every fight. Feedback is one of the most powerful skill in the right hands and in the right situation.

Guardian have the possibility to get higher DPS than a Warrior. But for that they need a good build, they needs boons, they need the same buff as a Warrior (which they can’t bring by themselves so they need a warrior to buff them) and they need Aegis on them. The DPS of a guardian will fluctuate a lot during a fight, even if they have the potentiel to be better than a warrior, that doesn’t mean that they will reach that all the time. Also, usually the guardian need to concentrate more about the surviability of his team (reflect, aegis, blind, etc), decreasing the focus they have on their rotation to get the highest dps possible. While the warrior can concentrate to get the best damage out of their rotation (they take care of the support they bring after and before the fight, not really in the middle of it, freeing their concentration)

Like i said, warrior will most of the time have better DPS than the guardian. You need to be good with the rotation, but you get your Damage from your raw stats, meaning your DPS will be good almost constantly and won’t fluctuate as much as any of the other profession since you don’t really base your DPS on damage modifier that activate only in certain situation.

Ele has also unreliable Attacks and slow CDs even on auto.
Reality.
Times you actually hit, some bosses are already have been killed by warriors.
Everytime you evade/heal etc, you lose lot of dps

To build offensively you die by a sneeze… (even a good ele placed in a bad Group will sleep on the floor, a warrior instead will carry the Group).

LordByron.8369:

Ele has also unreliable Attacks and slow CDs even on auto.
Reality.
Times you actually hit, some bosses are already have been killed by warriors.
Everytime you evade/heal etc, you lose lot of dps

To build offensively you die by a sneeze… (even a good ele placed in a bad Group will sleep on the floor, a warrior instead will carry the Group).

Do you even ele?
Staff ele can hit multiple times per second with Fireball and Lava font together against multiple targets.
D/X has reliable auto attack.
S/X use conjures anyway.

Dalanor.5387:

Do you even ele?
Staff ele can hit multiple times per second with Fireball and Lava font together against multiple targets.
D/X has reliable auto attack.
S/X use conjures anyway.

+1

It’s always easy to see who doesn’t actually play ele but maybe tried them once when they heard their DPS potential was good, then couldn’t figure out how to ele. Lava font staff dungeon ele may literally be the most boring playstyle in the game, but melt melt melt melt melt melt melt melt melt.

Draknar.5748:

Yea warriors are only popular because they have high DPS (not highest), but are also a bit more survivable and have banners for support. Plus they are significantly easier to play. Just Hundred Blades everything basically.

^^This. In a dungeon run you’d want 2 eles and 2 thieves using damage modifiers with fiery GS(particularly fiery rush) and a mesmer to speed things up. Since GW2 dungeon pick up groups don’t need precise play but do need to correct poor play, the warrior is a better pick overall.

cmud.5689:

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners. More than 1 warrior in your party is already a dps loss for absolutely nothing in return and it would be better to replace them by one of the other 2 classes i mentioned or a ranger with spotter and a traited frost spirit.

You are wrong. Warriors are taken above Ele’s in dungeons or Thiefs for that matter, that the DPS is cleaving and still reasonable while they are able to effectively stack through the course of the dungeon. Add in, For Great Justice and banners and you are good to go. I am not saying you cant melee stack with Ele’s, but I can imagine it would be pretty bad.

Warriors are taken above any other classe because people like you keep on spreading the wrong information. In an optimal setup you only need 1 warrior that brings both disc and str banners, that’s all they’re good for, they are support DPS. Wat does a second warrior bring if the first one covers both banners? Exactly. Nothing. Now if you replace him with a guard you’ll have more active defenses for your group, if you take a ranger he can boost your party dps by 14% with appropriate traits and utilities while having high DPS, an ele has higher dps and can stack more might + fury and a thief has higer dps, blind fields, vulnerability and stealth for skips.
Optimal groups run with a 2 ele, 1 warr, 1 thief, x setup and they can ‘meelee stack’ trough the content by using active defenses, not to mention that they burn trough bosses in mere seconds.

petyr baelish.9675:

cmud.5689:

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners. More than 1 warrior in your party is already a dps loss for absolutely nothing in return and it would be better to replace them by one of the other 2 classes i mentioned or a ranger with spotter and a traited frost spirit.

You are wrong. Warriors are taken above Ele’s in dungeons or Thiefs for that matter, that the DPS is cleaving and still reasonable while they are able to effectively stack through the course of the dungeon. Add in, For Great Justice and banners and you are good to go. I am not saying you cant melee stack with Ele’s, but I can imagine it would be pretty bad.

Warriors are taken above any other classe because people like you keep on spreading the wrong information. In an optimal setup you only need 1 warrior that brings both disc and str banners, that’s all they’re good for, they are support DPS. Wat does a second warrior bring if the first one covers both banners? Exactly. Nothing. Now if you replace him with a guard you’ll have more active defenses for your group, if you take a ranger he can boost your party dps by 14% with appropriate traits and utilities while having high DPS, a thief and an ele both have higher personal DPS.
Optimal groups run with a 2 ele, 1 warr, 1 thief, x setup and they can ‘meelee stack’ trough the content by using active defenses, not to mention that they burn trough bosses in mere seconds.

You forgot the Empower Allies trait for the warrior. I don’t care if you have to give up your 10-15% personal damage modifiers or whatnot to take it, adding an extra 150 power to everyone is always worth it.

Do as you wish. Just don’t spread the wrong information. 18 might = 35*18 = 630 power btw.

Edit: this was a bad post

It always depends on the time window.
What does the most dps in 10 seconds is completely different to what does the most dps in 10 minutes.

Highest DPS against 1 or multiple enemies?
Over a short or long time window?

This are important question?

D-DPS:
One enemy and short period = DD Thieves
Multiple enemies and long period = GS/AA Warriors

C-DPS:
One enemy and short period = Necros
Multiple enemies and long period = Engis

I miss when forums were about discussing stuff and not bragging and writing random L2p.

It was before the game tried to appeal to WoW players maybe….

At that time people knew the difference between doing 4 Attacks for 8000 in 4 seconds or doing one for 32000 after 4 seconds.

Too complex maybe….

@blackteagan:
Posted at same time meant exactly what you meant…

Kibazuka.1390:

It always depends on the time window.
What does the most dps in 10 seconds is completely different to what does the most dps in 10 minutes.

aka burst vs sustain dps

I have all classes at 80 so I will try to rate them in burst:

1. Thief (heartseeker spam)
2. Mesmer (them shatters)
3. Ele (attunement swapping combos)
4.Warrior (lol Hundred Blades)
5. everything else is pretty close to bleh in burst

Sustain DPS:

1. Elementalist (spam lava font)
2. Warrior
3. Guardian
4. Thief
5. Mesmer
6. Ranger
7. Engineer
8. Necro

engineer and necro are bottom of my list because I play them as condi damage….and while condi damage is pretty good sustain…its not as good as raw power, hence the zerker meta

Ele has THE best sustain with lava font hitting REALLY hard and basically spammable with 100% upkeep

Warrior beats Guardian for me because i just feel like i do damage on my warrior

thief and mesmer are burst reliant….it is very much a use everything you have, wait for CD’s(or initiative or revealed debuff) while using auto attacks….where as ele, warrior, and guardian usually always have something up to use upon weapon swapping/attunement swapping

Ranger relies too heavily on the pet and as such, can be bursty like thief and mesmer…..go all in, pet dies, wait 40s to go balls deep again

cmud.5689:

You are wrong. Warriors are taken above Ele’s in dungeons or Thiefs for that matter, that the DPS is cleaving and still reasonable while they are able to effectively stack through the course of the dungeon. Add in, For Great Justice and banners and you are good to go. I am not saying you cant melee stack with Ele’s, but I can imagine it would be pretty bad.

No you are wrong. Warrior is use more often than Ele because :
1) They used to be view as the best DPS of the game. Because we didn’t had figure out how to be good on other profession yet. Ppl still seem to view the Warrior as TOP dps and not the average they have.
2) They can bring a lot of offensive support (FGJ, Banners, etc). For that several ppl take them, but you really one 1 to do that.
3) Warrior are easy to be good on. They rely on raw stats, meaning that even a poor player can survive (high hp and defense) wihtout dodging as much and can do good DPS (don’t need to care about the requirement for damage modifier). A group a warrior can also max vulnerability and might on easy mode. All that make Warrior obvious choice for pugs.
4) Most of the video on internet come from a moment in the game when Warrior were view as the best profession. Even if its not the case anymore, ppl check video and think that they are still the best profession for everything.

petyr baelish.9675:

Do as you wish. Just don’t spread the wrong information. 18 might = 35*18 = 630 power btw.

Are you talking about the Empower Allies? Because that a powerful trait for a warrior in a group to have. When the 1 warrior is there for party buffing, they usually don’t have a phalanx build (might come from eles mainly in that kind of group). So Empower Allies is a trade off between personnal DPS and party buffing. 150 power can seem to be not that high, but when you buff 2-3 Elementalist with high DPS, that make a difference. Empower Allies is a good thing to bring for a Axe only warrior, but its not the only good options. Its all these little buff that allow speed runner to get crazy high amount of dmg compare to normal group.

LordByron.8369:

Ele has also unreliable Attacks and slow CDs even on auto.
Reality.
Times you actually hit, some bosses are already have been killed by warriors.
Everytime you evade/heal etc, you lose lot of dps

To build offensively you die by a sneeze… (even a good ele placed in a bad Group will sleep on the floor, a warrior instead will carry the Group).

The ele FGS on a wall will make more DPS in 10sec than a warrior can do in a minute. The Ele LH can do more dmg than a warrior, ’’But’’ he also have to take care of might stacking meaning that a warrior can be him in the first 10sec. A staff Ele, have a constant burst dmg, that’s why he have the best DPS from Laval Front.

But you are right for the squishiess of a full glass Ele. THAT’S FREAKING HARD. This build was the hardest I ever had to learn, but you can do it. If i have 2 or 3 of my guildmate I now have no problem staying alive on my squishy Ele. But if i’m in a Bad pug, true, i’ll have a harder time. On some dungeon i can simply carrry the pug like a warrior do, but in some fight (the ones that have a lot of small attack), i’m in deep kitten. Ele are like a F1, they work like crazy in the right condition, but you don’t bring them on a dirty road. That’s where the Warrior shine with its raw brutal force. Each have their strength and weakness.

spoj.9672:

It shifted a lot with the ferocity change. I wouldnt say guangs numbers are correct. But theres probably some truths to them assuming he made the same (hopefully reasonable) assumptions for each class.

Edit: Cant find the rankings. Seems guang removed the original post and linked his new ranking thread instead which excludes some classes because hes lazy and only considers solo dps.

From what I can remember of the original thread it shifted to be:

Ele
mesmer (still unrealistic)
Thief
Necro
Warrior
Guard
Ranger
Engi

Basically necro moved up some places and guard went down some places. But I have no idea what assumptions and builds guang used for these. So this list could be completely wrong.

My problem with mesmers is that although they can pump out some crazy DPS, they need a large buildup to summon all their phatasms, and for them to not die. Between uncontrollable AI, bugs, and bosses often dying <15 seconds, it just doesn’t work in practice.

Jordo.5913:

Kibazuka.1390:

It always depends on the time window.
What does the most dps in 10 seconds is completely different to what does the most dps in 10 minutes.

aka burst vs sustain dps

I have all classes at 80 so I will try to rate them in burst:

1. Thief (heartseeker spam)
2. Mesmer (them shatters)
3. Ele (attunement swapping combos)
4.Warrior (lol Hundred Blades)
5. everything else is pretty close to bleh in burst

Sustain DPS:

1. Elementalist (spam lava font)
2. Warrior
3. Guardian
4. Thief
5. Mesmer
6. Ranger
7. Engineer
8. Necro

engineer and necro are bottom of my list because I play them as condi damage….and while condi damage is pretty good sustain…its not as good as raw power, hence the zerker meta

Ele has THE best sustain with lava font hitting REALLY hard and basically spammable with 100% upkeep

Warrior beats Guardian for me because i just feel like i do damage on my warrior

thief and mesmer are burst reliant….it is very much a use everything you have, wait for CD’s(or initiative or revealed debuff) while using auto attacks….where as ele, warrior, and guardian usually always have something up to use upon weapon swapping/attunement swapping

Ranger relies too heavily on the pet and as such, can be bursty like thief and mesmer…..go all in, pet dies, wait 40s to go balls deep again

No offense but you can’t compare the raw damage performance of a berserker warrior to a condi engie. Its already also proven that grenades is best used in berserker gear especially with the modified ammunitions trait.

I have all 8 professions at 80 in full berserker gear and I am going to disagree with your entire list.

Ele
Thief
Mesmer (In magical Christmas land where your phantasms never die)
The rest
…
Necro

Its ele , Warrior was the highest 15 months ago but meta changed.
I don’t like the playstyle on ele so i still play subpar warrior.

I made my previous post while in a dungeon which is why it was so short, I also made the mistake that a s/d ele stacks 18 might while it’s 15 with a rotation.

A warrior with empower allies which gives 150 power for the party, 8% crit chance, 170 power, 8 sec fury + 3might=35*3=105 power and 5% + 3% + 15% + 10% modifiers. This is the gs build which deals the highest dmg if i’m not mistaken. You can run ps for more party support but there is no need for that when there is an ele present.

A LH ele can stack up 18 might = 35*18= 630 party wide power with 10% + 20% + 10% + 20% + 1%Xboon modifiers.

Staff ele 9 might = 35*9=315, 100% fury uptime (20% crit) with 10% + 10% + 20% + 10% + 10% modifiers, this is the highest dps build in the game.

Thief: 5% + 10% + 20% + 5% + 10% + 5% modifiers (-5% + 10% for improvisation), stealth for skipping, perma blind field uptime and vulnerability.

Ranger: don’t know his personal modifers but 7% crit chance trough spotter and a 10% party wide modifier with 70% chance of triggering.

The point i’m trying to make here is that in the best possible situation a warriors personal dps is far below of that of an ele or a thief and not just 10 – 15%. Most of the party boosts this warrior gives are unique so a 2nd warrior only adds raw mediocre damage with negligible fury and might. Sure a 2nd warrior can run a PS build but as I said an ele covers might stacking better. It is therefore unwise to stack multiple warriors in a party if you want maximum DPS or maximum utlity. It’s better to replace them with other classes and if you want to stack classes stack eles or thieves because they have higher dps and strong utilities that are not unique so they can be ‘stacked’.

Edit: Changed the numbers on s/d ele might stacking since Thaddeus i was right the first time and a full rotation stacks 18 might not 15.

Ele damage is much higher than warrior, it pretty much is staff spaming fire. and guardian easily out damages warriors as well, no question; however, for a group, you’d still want a warrior for the banner and strength trait.

and on a personal preferance, i’d still take a necro over ranger, sure rangers have spotter, but single target necro dps is much more reliable, and for things like fractals that’s really all that matters. Plus i’ve never been in a situation where I needed extra precision after discipline

petyr baelish.9675:

I made my previous post while in a dungeon which is why it was so short, I also made the mistake that a s/d ele stacks 18 might while it’s 15 with a rotation.

No you were right the first time. Dragon’s Tooth, Phoenix, Churning Earth, Earthquake, Arcane Brilliance and Arcane Wave for 6 blast of 3 might each. 6 × 3 = 18 might. Same thing with D/F but you replace Churning Earth and Earthquake for Magnetic Wave and Comet.

petyr baelish.9675:

The point i’m trying to make here is that in the best possible situation a warriors personal dps is far below of that of an ele or a thief and not just 10 – 15%.

I’m pretty sure Xhyrox didn’t mean that Warrior have 10-15% less DPS than a Ele. I think he meant. You are better to use EA if you are the only Warrior because to get it you sacrifice 10-15% of your personnal DPS as a warrior to get a +150 power for all the party. I think it was just a minor misunderstanding here

Indeed I probably messed up dragon’s tooth or cancelled an animation because I was too eager to test it since I started to doubt myself while in the dungeon. There goes my credibility….

I remember when I first started playing ele last year that people thought their DPS was terrible (specifically mean elitist warriors). But now look whos talking, Eles have finally gotten the respect we deserve! mwahahahah!

And for D/F might stackin dont forget that water 3 is now a blast too, and is a bit easier to use than comet.

nearlight.3064:

I remember when I first started playing ele last year that people thought their DPS was terrible (specifically mean elitist warriors). But now look whos talking, Eles have finally gotten the respect we deserve! mwahahahah!

And for D/F might stackin dont forget that water 3 is now a blast too, and is a bit easier to use than comet.

We were talking about S/D or S/F might stacking. D/F might stacking is not as good, but that,s not the strength of D/F anyway.

considering that necromancer can hit 4k on an auto attack(daggers) we should be pretty high up there too.

Lightsbane.9012:

considering that necromancer can hit 4k on an auto attack(daggers) we should be pretty high up there too.

but that’s single target, necros can also auto attack with life blast for about 7k which pierces, but sometimes stacked enemies don’t get pierced right.

EDIT: necro dps is actually pretty good, but again, lack of a cleave hurts them. But for like fractals, where the most of it is spent against one boss at a time, I would reckon they’d be valuable there.

A Massive Headache.1879:

Lightsbane.9012:

considering that necromancer can hit 4k on an auto attack(daggers) we should be pretty high up there too.

but that’s single target, necros can also auto attack with life blast for about 7k which pierces, but sometimes stacked enemies don’t get pierced right.

EDIT: necro dps is actually pretty good, but again, lack of a cleave hurts them. But for like fractals, where the most of it is spent against one boss at a time, I would reckon they’d be valuable there.

lack of cleave. my eyes just watered up. yes that hurts us immensely.

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners.

don’t listen to this guy, he doesn’t really know what he’s saying. thieves only have better single-target dps, and aren’t useful for most dungeons except when needing to stealth through mobs. Eles have probably highest dps potential for speedruns, but they are squishy as hell especially if theres no guard to mitigate dmg for them. Eles are actually less useful for pugs because for the harder content (not including AC) they are downed or die a lot, so stacking warriors is better then. Warrior dps is far from mediocre, in fact for solo situations warriors usually out dps eles and thieves, because they can stack might/fury easier and sustain it longer. With phalanx trait, warriors can also stack more might for the group than Eles. so the argument that the only reason to bring warriors is for banners is wrong. In fact other classes wouldnt reach their highest dps potential without a warrior in group. For pugs, I’ve seen stacking warriors (3 or so warriors in group) leads to much faster times than stacking guards, thief, ele etc. in the end it doesn’t matter which class does most dps but which is more useful for situations.

I think ele is holding up pretty good in DPS meters, as ele is my main i switched form staff to s/f and tripled my dmg just like that, attument switch in the right time plus focus provides me excelent survivability. I think if i switch to d/d dmg would be off the charts but i suck in melee and am scared of daggers. Problem is most eles i’ve met in pugs are staff, and in my opinion staff is only for crowd control, which is bollocs in dungeons where most bosses are single targets. No crowd control needed.

nagr.1593:

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners.

don’t listen to this guy, he doesn’t really know what he’s saying. thieves only have better single-target dps, and aren’t useful for most dungeons except when needing to stealth through mobs. Eles have probably highest dps potential for speedruns, but they are squishy as hell especially if theres no guard to mitigate dmg for them. Eles are actually less useful for pugs because for the harder content (not including AC) they are downed or die a lot, so stacking warriors is better then. Warrior dps is far from mediocre, in fact for solo situations warriors usually out dps eles and thieves, because they can stack might/fury easier and sustain it longer. With phalanx trait, warriors can also stack more might for the group than Eles. so the argument that the only reason to bring warriors is for banners is wrong. In fact other classes wouldnt reach their highest dps potential without a warrior in group. For pugs, I’ve seen stacking warriors (3 or so warriors in group) leads to much faster times than stacking guards, thief etc. in the end it doesn’t matter which class does more dps but which is more useful for situations.

Dont listen to this guy.

Dalanor.5387:

nagr.1593:

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners.

don’t listen to this guy, he doesn’t really know what he’s saying. thieves only have better single-target dps, and aren’t useful for most dungeons except when needing to stealth through mobs. Eles have probably highest dps potential for speedruns, but they are squishy as hell especially if theres no guard to mitigate dmg for them. Eles are actually less useful for pugs because for the harder content (not including AC) they are downed or die a lot, so stacking warriors is better then. Warrior dps is far from mediocre, in fact for solo situations warriors usually out dps eles and thieves, because they can stack might/fury easier and sustain it longer. With phalanx trait, warriors can also stack more might for the group than Eles. so the argument that the only reason to bring warriors is for banners is wrong. In fact other classes wouldnt reach their highest dps potential without a warrior in group. For pugs, I’ve seen stacking warriors (3 or so warriors in group) leads to much faster times than stacking guards, thief etc. in the end it doesn’t matter which class does more dps but which is more useful for situations.

Dont listen to this guy.

Nope, it’s true. Theoretically Ele has higher potential DPS, but Zerker Warrior is 10x more survivable than Zerker Ele.

nagr.1593:

petyr baelish.9675:

Both ele and thief have the highest potential dps out there, this is due to multiple damage multipliers in their traits.
Despite what most of the community thinks warrior dps is mediocre and the only reason you have them in your party is because of their banners.

don’t listen to this guy, he doesn’t really know what he’s saying. thieves only have better single-target dps, and aren’t useful for most dungeons except when needing to stealth through mobs. Eles have probably highest dps potential for speedruns, but they are squishy as hell especially if theres no guard to mitigate dmg for them. Eles are actually less useful for pugs because for the harder content (not including AC) they are downed or die a lot, so stacking warriors is better then. Warrior dps is far from mediocre, in fact for solo situations warriors usually out dps eles and thieves, because they can stack might/fury easier and sustain it longer. With phalanx trait, warriors can also stack more might for the group than Eles. so the argument that the only reason to bring warriors is for banners is wrong. In fact other classes wouldnt reach their highest dps potential without a warrior in group. For pugs, I’ve seen stacking warriors (3 or so warriors in group) leads to much faster times than stacking guards, thief, ele etc. in the end it doesn’t matter which class does most dps but which is more useful for situations.

I rest my case. You don’t know kitten about this game. No decent PVE player worth his salt kisses the floor in the first 30 seconds on any class even without any support from his party during a boss fight. If you play properly the fight should have already been over for a long time by then. The stuff you said about thieves is wrong. PS gives up a lot of dmg for the might support and the stacks build up slowly. With 1 staff and 1 conjure ele in your party you can cap might instantly for 20 secs with perma fury. Even if you are the only ele 3 blast finishers from your teammates on your fire field is enough to cap might.
In case anecdotal evidence counts: I hardcarry every kittenty pug group i get on ele, if the party wipes I’m the last man standing and when I die it’s because my fgs has run out of charges or I got crystal bugged by alpha.

Edit: I never said anything about stacking guards.

Just gotta say thank you Petyr

obviously it’s keyboard gladiator with “thick skull” trait and “i’m smarter than you” on auto-attack

/close thread

Note i said they ‘usually’ out dps eles/thieves for solo situations. Also I did say Eles are highest dps for speedruns, so you’re not proving anything by showing one of a group with 3 of them. and of course, you havent rly proved anything just by a lupicus solo on an Ele, besides the number of people that can pull that off is very small. Some other solos in which warriors will out dps other classes:

also why don’t you list an Ele solo for Alphard and see how it compares to warrior time. I don’t see one anywhere…

Oxidia.8103:

I think ele is holding up pretty good in DPS meters, as ele is my main i switched form staff to s/f and tripled my dmg just like that, attument switch in the right time plus focus provides me excelent survivability. I think if i switch to d/d dmg would be off the charts but i suck in melee and am scared of daggers. Problem is most eles i’ve met in pugs are staff, and in my opinion staff is only for crowd control, which is bollocs in dungeons where most bosses are single targets. No crowd control needed.

Actually staff eles have the highest dps in the game, followed by s/d(or s/f) conjure eles. d/d is a poor weapon set for dungeoning, d/f is useful for higher lvl content because it uses dagger autos in air attunement to sustain your dps in between cooldowns so you won’t have to use conjures to sustain dps which in turn allows you to have acces to the utilities on your offhand focus, making you a lot more self reliant.

Everything you need to know about ele for PVE can be found in here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Guide-DPS-Elementalist-for-PvE

nagr.1593:

Note i said they ‘usually’ out dps eles/thieves for solo situations. of course you havent rly proved anything just by a lupicus solo on an Ele, besides the number of people that can pull that off is very small. Some other solos in which warriors will out dps other classes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whhCKL2-nOQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MO-mSYHb4M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mpj4v6WBM6A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VaLt6v7XY4

also why don’t you list an Ele solo for Alphard and see how it compares to warrior time. I don’t see one anywhere…

I hit above 200k into a rabbit with necro. Warrior now is S tier.
C’mon at least link solos with the same enemies …

nagr.1593:

Note i said they ‘usually’ out dps eles/thieves for solo situations. of course you havent rly proved anything just by a lupicus solo on an Ele, besides the number of people that can pull that off is very small. Some other solos in which warriors will out dps other classes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whhCKL2-nOQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MO-mSYHb4M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mpj4v6WBM6A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VaLt6v7XY4

also why don’t you list an Ele solo for Alphard and see how it compares to warrior time. I don’t see one anywhere…

The point of the first 2 videos was to show you that elementalists deal more damage than warriors and can clear content with varying levels of difficulty solo at times warriors won’t even get close to. Unlike your post claimed they obviously had no trouble staying up the entire fight without the help of a guardian.
The last video was a record run and I didn’t even see 1 warrior there, to be fair in most groups 1 warrior would be desirable but i have yet to see a record run with more than 1 warrior in the group.
You claimed some things about thieves and I said those were false, you have yet to respond to that. I can assure you they bring a lot more to the table than ‘SR for skips’ and strong ‘single target dmg’ being: massive cleave damage(not only single target), perma aoe blind upkeep, vulnerability stacking and projectile defense. I wish there was a video showing the dmg a thief can do with fiery rush compared to warrior with fiery rush just to show you how significant the difference actually is.

What were the condi thief solo vids for?

nagr.1593:

don’t listen to this guy, he doesn’t really know what he’s saying. thieves only have better single-target dps, and aren’t useful for most dungeons except when needing to stealth through mobs. Eles have probably highest dps potential for speedruns, but they are squishy as hell especially if theres no guard to mitigate dmg for them. Eles are actually less useful for pugs because for the harder content (not including AC) they are downed or die a lot, so stacking warriors is better then. Warrior dps is far from mediocre, in fact for solo situations warriors usually out dps eles and thieves, because they can stack might/fury easier and sustain it longer. With phalanx trait, warriors can also stack more might for the group than Eles. so the argument that the only reason to bring warriors is for banners is wrong. In fact other classes wouldnt reach their highest dps potential without a warrior in group. For pugs, I’ve seen stacking warriors (3 or so warriors in group) leads to much faster times than stacking guards, thief, ele etc. in the end it doesn’t matter which class does most dps but which is more useful for situations.

PLEASE don’t blend everything together.

1) In a party setup, Ele will have a lot more DPS than a Warrior. Stop
2) Glass Ele vs Glass Warrior, the Warrior will have more surviability. Stop.
3) For pugs, Warrior have a better potentiel since Ele is a high risk, high reward element. So for a pugs, where you can’t limit the risk as much as an organized group, ya Warrior is a pretty good pick. Stop
4) Exactly. Thief have high single-target dmg. But he also have huge damage modifiers AND can give vulnerability like crazy on crits which if mix together with a FGS can give you a huge advantage in Boss situation. Its not the best options for everything, but its a good option in some situation. Stop.
5) Warrior have average DPS only. But like you said, they bring by themselve a lot of offensive support that the thief CAN’T bring. Now Warrior vs Ele in solo situation, that a pretty kitten tough answer. The Ele will still have better overal DPS, but the Warrior will bring more offensive support than most Ele and he will have more surviability. But the point here is only that Warrior could be a better solo profession for some ppl, nothing else. (If you are good on your Ele and know the encounter Ele will be a better Solo profession because of the speed you can down ennemies) Stop.
6) Warrior can bring more might than Ele and sustain it for longer. Ya. But Ele can stack a good chunk while still having more DPS than a full DPS Warrior. On the other end the Warrior will have to decrease even more its personnal DPS to gain the group stacking capability that Ele can give. PS Warrior are awesome in pugs and for offensive support, but lack the DPS to populate a organized group with more than 1 (with some exception, because there is always some exception). Stop.
7) For pugs you had faster stacking with 3 warriors than with anything else? Of course, Warrior are pugs king. They are not the best at anything except offensive support, but its easy to be more than decent with one. Compare to an Ele, which have the potential to ridicule the DPS of a warrior, but can only do so in the good hands.

That’s 7 different good point that you bring. But that doesn’t change the fact that Ele have more DPS than a warrior and that good organized group, are usually better off with only 1 Warrior.