Guild Wars 2

I just popped a holo projector in Iron Marches which brought the Orr holos out and it drew two warthogs to boot. Not counting the initial KD, and two evades I was knocked down and/or stunned SEVEN TIMES IN A ROW before I could even begin the fight.

For the love of all that is holy, STOP WITH THE ENDLESS CC in this game from every freaking mob. It is not “challenging” it is not fun it is strictly infuriating and pointless and drags fights out for absolutely no reason.

Getting pulled a half dozen times in ten seconds by spiders is MADDENING. Getting constantly locked down because every enemy in the area can do a knockdown or stun is MADDENING. Stop. With. The. Ceaseless. CC.

Agree…to much CC allover the kitten place.Just like those scouts in WvWvW.CrippleCrippleCrippleCrippleCrippleCrippleCrippleBlindBLindBLindBLindBlindBLindBlindBLindBlindBLind….
Pop in some more random cc’s and you get the idea….

Yeah there needs to be an immunity after the first CC like in other game so that one can’t be permastunned.

While I don’t think they’d ever do much about it I fully agree.. It doesn’t make mobs that already can’t deal damage beyond my perma health regen and high defense on my warrior any more challenging it just obstructs me from running to where I want to run to for a couple minutes and makes me swear a few times as I hobble along.. shake it off and then immediately get cripped or pulled again… The plus side.. all these dragon coffers dropping have given me a reason to stop skipping these easy mobs since it takes 1 100b to just rip through them.

I think the most annoying CC comes from risen spiders. I was doing the Shelter Gate event and practically got ping ponged by spiders at two separate areas and took a chunk of damage immediately each time by the giant swarm of mobs around them and got downed.

That, along with immobilise just makes spiders awful to play against, like another time when I was trying to reach Grenth, got immobilised, used cond removal (pure of voice = shout removes condition, 3 were spec’d), got immobilised again, removed, immobilised again, removed and then I finally got away. I shouldn’t have to spam shouts just to get past boring mobs.

It is rather excessive compared to other games, but it’s not like you lack counters to it. Most pulls/KD from mobs are either melee range or projectiles. Use reflection, cripple, chill, etc. Burn stability as a last resort. Yeah, you’ll kill the enemy slower, but you won’t be stun-locked either.

As the hours played go up so will your knowledge of specific mob cue’s and using stability & stun breakers.

Videos.

You should capture some video of these instances so we can pinpoint the imbalances here when you share them with us.

Use stun breakers etc. The only CC I think needs a nerf is immobolized. And that’s more for WvW and partly because it kind of bugs out a bit. In PvE all you need is some stun break and your good.

Agree completely. I think something like, no CC abilities until you have damaged them would solve a lot of the frustration. It just makes it a chore to travel anywhere currently.

Learn to use your stunbreakers and mitigate attacks properly. This isn’t a game where you can just stand in one place spamming 1

I will have to agree with the OP. Knockdowns/knockbacks/stuns are way to common in this game. Many of the holographic MoBs only highlight this issue more.

Sure, I can just load all of my utility slots with anti-crowd control skills. After all, I did not want any kind of choice in my selection of utility skills.

Oh, wait…

I have two dodge moves I can also use. Good thing the holographic MoBs are not transparent and are easy to see.

Oh, wait…

Well, at least I know that after I have used my dodge moves and all of my utility skills to help me avoid the crowd control that at the least those crowd control skills will be on long cooldowns and won’t be spammable.

Oh, wait…

Michaeas Magister.1589:

I will have to agree with the OP. Knockdowns/knockbacks/stuns are way to common in this game. Many of the holographic MoBs only highlight this issue more.

Sure, I can just load all of my utility slots with anti-crowd control skills. After all, I did not want any kind of choice in my selection of utility skills.

Oh, wait…

I have two dodge moves I can also use. Good thing the holographic MoBs are not transparent and are easy to see.

Oh, wait…

Well, at least I know that after I have used my dodge moves and all of my utility skills to help me avoid the crowd control that at the least those crowd control skills will be on long cooldowns and won’t be spammable.

Oh, wait…

Did you bother to attack in the meantime? They should be dead at that point.

Well now that you know, can’t you equip some utility skills to counter the cc beforehand in anticipation of it all?

Michaeas Magister.1589:

I will have to agree with the OP. Knockdowns/knockbacks/stuns are way to common in this game. Many of the holographic MoBs only highlight this issue more.

Sure, I can just load all of my utility slots with anti-crowd control skills. After all, I did not want any kind of choice in my selection of utility skills.

Oh, wait…

I have two dodge moves I can also use. Good thing the holographic MoBs are not transparent and are easy to see.

Oh, wait…

Well, at least I know that after I have used my dodge moves and all of my utility skills to help me avoid the crowd control that at the least those crowd control skills will be on long cooldowns and won’t be spammable.

Oh, wait…

Are you actually having trouble with the holograms, or just complaining for form. I don’t think the hologram groups are hard at all.

Jrunyon.3012:

Learn to use your stunbreakers and mitigate attacks properly. This isn’t a game where you can just stand in one place spamming 1

Nah, if you’re warrior you spam 2 instead…

this might sound rude. and im saying this as nice as possible…. L2P. stability stun breakers. blinds. oh yeah. and DODGE…

digiowl.9620:

Jrunyon.3012:

Learn to use your stunbreakers and mitigate attacks properly. This isn’t a game where you can just stand in one place spamming 1

Nah, if you’re warrior you spam 2 instead…

Never played warrior so not sure what you mean, but if you mean 100b I do believe that needs to be balanced in PvE to other class skills.

If you’re in an area where you know you can get chain stunned, bring a stunbreaker. Or two, even. If that isn’t enough learn to dodge. If dodging and two stunbreakers can’t keep you safe the problem isn’t with the content, it’s with you.

P.s., stability is your friend.

Michaeas Magister.1589:

I will have to agree with the OP. Knockdowns/knockbacks/stuns are way to common in this game. Many of the holographic MoBs only highlight this issue more.

Sure, I can just load all of my utility slots with anti-crowd control skills. After all, I did not want any kind of choice in my selection of utility skills.

Of course. It’s perfectly reasonable to run a fully offensive setup against mobs built to counter that play-style and then complain about it (/sarcasm). Your build does have some free choices, but it’s also dictated by who you’re up against. You can’t reasonably expect to fight CC oriented mobs without any trouble when you don’t bring some of your own CC.

Michaeas Magister.1589:

I have two dodge moves I can also use. Good thing the holographic MoBs are not transparent and are easy to see.

Aside from snowy areas, they are easy to see. It’s only when their transparent color matches the ground that it becomes troublesome, which can easily be avoided. Lots of classes have weapons/skills that have evade abilities. Use those if necessary.

Michaeas Magister.1589:

Well, at least I know that after I have used my dodge moves and all of my utility skills to help me avoid the crowd control that at the least those crowd control skills will be on long cooldowns and won’t be spammable.

As someone else stated, you don’t just spam CCs and expect to win. You spread your CCs out for maximum longevity and pump out damage in between. This should not be a problem.

As many have stated in this thread, there are ways to counter CC. However, in my opinion, it is only partially a “learn to play” problem. Why?

1) Knockdown, knockback, and immobilize get way overused in this game. More often than not, whenever there is a mob encounter that is supposed to be “interesting” or “challenging,” it’s because you get CC’d. Well, it gets old.

2) Groups of mobs chain their CC’s. Successive knockdowns, knockbacks and immobilizes get really old.

Yes, I know — there are counters to those things, and many players never bother to learn the mechanics. But when we’re faced with the “holy trinity” of knockback, knockdown, and immobilize over and over and over again, the game play gets really stale.

Sometimes I go run the group DE in Caledon where you get polymorphed, just for some variety.

Anna Kruse.3941:

this might sound rude. and im saying this as nice as possible…. L2P. stability stun breakers. blinds. oh yeah. and DODGE…

And then you die when all is exhausted and the mobs still play adventurer ping pong.

foofad.5162:

If you’re in an area where you know you can get chain stunned, bring a stunbreaker. Or two, even. If that isn’t enough learn to dodge. If dodging and two stunbreakers can’t keep you safe the problem isn’t with the content, it’s with you.

P.s., stability is your friend.

err, seems to favor certain professions: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

digiowl.9620:

foofad.5162:

If you’re in an area where you know you can get chain stunned, bring a stunbreaker. Or two, even. If that isn’t enough learn to dodge. If dodging and two stunbreakers can’t keep you safe the problem isn’t with the content, it’s with you.

P.s., stability is your friend.

err, seems to favor certain professions: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

And yet, every class has a stunbreak and dodges.

Can you please post videos? It’s important to show bugs and imbalances when you’re suggesting nerfs to content.

That is to say, when people complained about some of the mobs in Orr doing absurd amounts of damage, they posted combat logs and screenshots.

When the game first came out I had a nightmare time running through Orr.. by the time I hit my 3rd toon, it really felt like a walk in the park. Condition Cleanses, Dodges, Swiftness, Stun breakers. You have all the tools to just run past almost any mob in the game.

From the sound of things you have put everything in healing through damage rather than mitigating it.

Pay attention to the enemy and stun may not be your main issue.

Guys, we’re not having difficulty with the content, the problem is that it ISN’T FUN. Why should I have to spam three shouts just to remove three immobilises in a row? Why when I’m against spiders and my stability runs out should I be ragdolled, immobilised and then have eggs ejaculated on me? Is this “interesting”? Is this “fun”? No, it’s not.

The CC in this game is over the top, and I’m saying this as someone in full zerk who just facerolls everything. It’s not difficult, it’s annoying.

maybe give mob a chance to fail the cc, since they do chain cc perfectly now…

colesy.8490:

Guys, we’re not having difficulty with the content, the problem is that it ISN’T FUN.

That’s subjective. The least you could do is post a video showing how rampant it is. If the problem (of being CC’ed over and over) is too wide spread and common then it can be addressed.

Do the event at Shelter’s Gate, do the Melandru defense event, and try running past the mobs at the temple of Grenth. Anywhere with a moderate to large concentration of risen spiders, just watch yourself getting thrown around.

Existence isn’t evidence though. Technically practically all mobs have the power to kill you if you stand next to them long enough to let them, that doesn’t mean mob damage is rampant and high.

CC, not damage.

Sure, the vet/champ spiders have CC that does more damage, but the problem is getting thrown around by mobs and/or immobilised. It’s not difficult, it’s not interesting, it’s not damaging, it’s annoying.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

colesy.8490:

It’s not difficult, it’s not interesting, it’s not damaging, it’s annoying.

Mobs that don’t just die aren’t difficult or interesting either, most are just annoying so why not let them die with one or two attacks?

What you find is fun is subjective and you’re branding what is unfun to you as out of your control. Do you not see the need of proof there?

I am going to have to agree thakittens pretty darn annoying. We do have the tools to address it, but if we are going to have arbitrary ways of increasing difficulty, I would rather Anet tone the CCs down and increase mob health/damage.

In WvW, though amount of CC that guards can dish out, on seemingly no CD whatsoever, is pretty annoying. Scouts constantly spamming blind is just annoying. All you have to do is switch to ranged, but it seems like the difficulty that is trying to be achieved could be done in much better ways. I cant WAIT for games to get AI to the point where one of those scouts could actually outsmart me.

I just think that Anet could make it just as difficult, but in a less annoying way. One of the things I enjoyed about GW1 was that mobs had the same skills as players, and worked on the same mechanics. It was really kind of a neat system, imo.

The hologram mobs at least have some differentiation. I’d rather have that than what I see all too often in GW2, where ten mobs spawn and they are all the same type, with the same two mechanics.

Like I said in my previous post in this thread, the real problem is that we get the same mechanic over and over and over and over again.

Certainly, given the creativity and talent of the developers, we could have a little more variety.

Like several other people are saying, the problem isn’t how strong cc is or how easy it is to counter it, but how unfun it is when it’s so frequent.

CC takes the player away from the control of their character. It’s disruptive. When used at the right time, it can be great to increase tension in combat. When spammed by the basic AI, it’s annoying, frustrating and otherwise pointless.

DiogoSilva.7089:

Like several other people are saying, the problem isn’t how strong cc is or how easy it is to counter it, but how unfun it is when it’s so frequent.

I’d like to see how frequent and lengthy. AFAIK, things have not changed with CC since beta.

runeblade.7514:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

A number of classes have little or no access to stability. Most notably necros (Who tell me they have none), and mesmers (Who have a mantra that grants 2 second stability on a 40 or 50 second cooldown and requires perfect foreknowledge and timing of the impending CC to be any use) – given it’s duration and prequisite foreknowledge of the impending stun, you may as well dodge roll ;p

Leo G.4501:

DiogoSilva.7089:

Like several other people are saying, the problem isn’t how strong cc is or how easy it is to counter it, but how unfun it is when it’s so frequent.

I’d like to see how frequent and lengthy. AFAIK, things have not changed with CC since beta.

All I can reply to this without getting infracted is just, hmmmm. CC by mobs has tripled if not quadrupled in use, very funny/annoying, especially if your just trying to run by

Leo G.4501:

AFAIK, things have not changed with CC since beta.

There have been some CC changes this year, mostly with the Risen.

• Risen Abomination now has a charge that launches
• Risen Wizards gained a knock-back that applies poison and weakness
• Veteran and higher Risen Noble types gained a radius pull along with their new symbol mechanic
• Risen Farmer/Fisher lost a launch in favor of a turret; still has a stun
• Risen Putrifier replaced a pull with an immobilize
• Risen Acolyte’s immobilize changed to cripple

3 CC added, 1 lost, 2 changed.

What might be more interesting is to determine for different mob groups how many different types have CC.

Those are changes to mobs, not the mechanics of CC. People have been suggesting CC immunity be added purely out of preference. Mobs have been shown to be in flux regarding balance with regard to their attacks, patterns, overall strength and number scaling.

So now we’ve condensed your suggestion to “Make the enemies easier”?

Leo G.4501:

So now we’ve condensed your suggestion to “Make the enemies easier”?

Easier difficulty, or easier to enjoy the game? Because currently, the cc spamfest is a challenge to enjoyability, not to actual difficulty. :P

None of the holo mobs have stability, aside from the single risen abomination. As a warrior, you have more AoE CC than any other class. Don’t let the mobs CC you, equip a hammer and CC them.

DiogoSilva.7089:

Leo G.4501:

So now we’ve condensed your suggestion to “Make the enemies easier”?

Easier difficulty, or easier to enjoy the game? Because currently, the cc spamfest is a challenge to enjoyability, not to actual difficulty. :P

You offer no real solution, just what you think is unfun.

You can’t be CC locked so having mobs throwing multiple CC just means you need to avoid them. Apparently you don’t like to avoid attacks which is the mainstay of this game.

Perhaps you’d be more interested in another game instead? Or better yet, post a video showing just how common it is for mobs to control you.

Leo G.4501:

Those are changes to mobs, not the mechanics of CC. People have been suggesting CC immunity be added purely out of preference. Mobs have been shown to be in flux regarding balance with regard to their attacks, patterns, overall strength and number scaling.

So now we’ve condensed your suggestion to “Make the enemies easier”?

I didn’t make a suggestion.

If I did, it would be, “Change mob group composition in those cases where it’s all one type. Also, add different mob types with different mechanics to make for more varied encounters.”

I like the changes to the Risen because there is more variety — now if they’d look at Risen groups in events and change “10 nobles spawn” to “2 nobles, 2 putrifiers, 2 plaguebearer, 1 ravager, 2 preservers and an abomination spawn.”

And for the record, I don’t think CC immunity is warranted.

Anna Kruse.3941:

this might sound rude. and im saying this as nice as possible…. L2P. stability stun breakers. blinds. oh yeah. and DODGE…

Ah, the old “Learn to play” retort.

How much wiser I now feel after having read such a brilliant response. You could have just kept on playing at your Godlike level and ability and just ignored a mere mortal such as myself, but no. You actually took the time out of your amazing game play to pass on this pearl of wisdom to us less fortunate and less skilled plebeians who are so inept that we cannot handle using three stun-breakers and two dodges to counter the chain crowd-control skills that are relentlessly hurled at our characters. Bless you… Bless you…

However… In my own paltry defense, allow me to state that I am not adverse to having crowd-control effects on MoBs. I actually CAN and DO regularly thwart such attacks with stun-breakers and dodges. This thread was not about crowd-control, but about CHAIN crowd-control and getting endlessly locked down. I highlighted the word “chain” in bold as you were obviously so busy dazzling the rest of the MMORPG gaming community with your brilliance that you failed to read the original post thoroughly. You’re welcome.

I do feel that crowd-control effects have a place in this game and do not object to MoBs having access to such abilities. What I AM advocating against is being CHAIN (highlighted that again for you) crowd-controlled and turning the game into just a video that I watch as my character gets knocked around like a Ping-Pong ball by multiple MoBs that have far more access to these crowd-control skills than I have access to counters.

But this is obviously not an issue with someone of your immortal caliber of game-play. I do thank you however for deigning to come down from on-high and attempting to educate us poor, mere mortals with your impressive and obviously superior wisdom on the game mechanics.

Thanks.

Michaeas Magister.1589:

Anna Kruse.3941:

this might sound rude. and im saying this as nice as possible…. L2P. stability stun breakers. blinds. oh yeah. and DODGE…

Ah, the old “Learn to play” retort.

How much wiser I now feel after having read such a brilliant response. You could have just kept on playing at your Godlike level and ability and just ignored a mere mortal such as myself, but no. You actually took the time out of your amazing game play to pass on this pearl of wisdom to us less fortunate and less skilled plebeians who are so inept that we cannot handle using three stun-breakers and two dodges to counter the chain crowd-control skills that are relentlessly hurled at our characters. Bless you… Bless you…

However… In my own paltry defense, allow me to state that I am not adverse to having crowd-control effects on MoBs. I actually CAN and DO regularly thwart such attacks with stun-breakers and dodges. This thread was not about crowd-control, but about CHAIN crowd-control and getting endlessly locked down. I highlighted the word “chain” in bold as you were obviously so busy dazzling the rest of the MMORPG gaming community with your brilliance that you failed to read the original post thoroughly. You’re welcome.

I do feel that crowd-control effects have a place in this game and do not object to MoBs having access to such abilities. What I AM advocating against is being CHAIN (highlighted that again for you) crowd-controlled and turning the game into just a video that I watch as my character gets knocked around like a Ping-Pong ball by multiple MoBs that have far more access to these crowd-control skills than I have access to counters.

But this is obviously not an issue with someone of your immortal caliber of game-play. I do thank you however for deigning to come down from on-high and attempting to educate us poor, mere mortals with your impressive and obviously superior wisdom on the game mechanics.

Thanks.

I don’t think I’ve ever been chain stunned by anything, not even the holo mobs. Sounds like a L2P issue to me.