Guild Wars 2

Everyone in these kinds of games wants to be the main ‘Hero’ type, but if everyone else is the ‘Hero’ too, it doesn’t feel as ‘Heroic’…

Just wondering what other people’s opinions are on what words like ‘Heroic’, ‘Powerful’ or ‘Important’ mean for them in terms of MMOs.

Is it something that we use to compare ourselves to other players?

Does it mean better stats? Higher level? Cool looking armour? Having some special item/ability? Recognition(titles etc.)? Having done something that few others have achieved?

What would there need to be in a game for you to feel like you actually matter?

I guess being the main focus of the story, or at least making a difference along the way..

Not sure i care if i’m a hero or not but i’d have liked to been the central character in the story quests, and the backup NPC’s at least could have been a little likeable..

The story can do it by making the player do badkitten stuff. Like slaying a god in Nightfall campaign. That made me feel like a hero.=P Just killing something big and powerful is enough for me to feel like a hero in a game, but it must be done right.

It needs to come along with a decent challenge along the way, unfortunately the story in GW2 is simply too easy to be considered heroic. Other things that help are unique graphics for bosses (I don’t feel heroic slaying a slightly bigger version of a normal mob), engaging boss mechanics (don’t give me a tank’n’spank boss) and fitting music that sounds epic (too many games lack this).

Milennin.4825:

The story can do it by making the player do badkitten stuff. Like slaying a god in Nightfall campaign. That made me feel like a hero.=P Just killing something big and powerful is enough for me to feel like a hero in a game, but it must be done right.

Having my avatar do bad-kitten stuff is what makes me feel heroic also, especially when it involves really active playing instead of just being part of a raid doing the one thing that my class was brought there to do.

It doesn’t have to be in the story though. Some of my most heroic moments were killing champs solo or with one other player that happened to be wandering by when I jumped into the fight (or happened to be fighting when I wandered by).

Watching Trahearne get handed a Legendary weapon during my personal story.

Not having to bend over to Trahearne for the later part of the game would be nice.

Being able to rescue Nebo Terrace and the nearby Ascalon Settlement. Then moving on, destroying tons of Tamini plans, warriors and weapons and finishing off by killing their special dog. Makes me feel like a hero, but then I realise that everything resets by the time i’m done…

I like it when your character isn’t presented as this super special someone, but rather an equal to other NPCs or maybe slightly higher up. That way it’s not as obvious that you are meant to be this amazing person, but you can still easily feel special without it being pointed out to you as much.

City of Heroes did a nice job of making me feel like a hero, even with thousands upon thousands of other heroes, some doing even more "heroic" things that I was. I think what really did it was the fact that I could take on multiple enemies at once and emerge victorious, as opposed to struggling to kill a single, overgrown grub or--say--a freaking DEER.

Pandemoniac.4739:

It doesn’t have to be in the story though. Some of my most heroic moments were killing champs solo or with one other player that happened to be wandering by when I jumped into the fight (or happened to be fighting when I wandered by).

True, some of my most epic moments come from dungeon parties where I save the day by soloing the last bit of HP of the final boss.=P Or help res all the people to turn the tide in an intense fight.

I have felt like a hero many many times since I started playing GW2.
It has nothing to do with story, stats or things like that.

What made me feel heroic is changing the tide in a battle, bringing down a group boss with 1-2 other players and hanging on by the skin of our teeth, some epic fights where I completed DE’s by myself against what felt like insane odds.

Stuff like that.

The fact that sometimes you are so very glad to see another player and you think " not this day" and just proceed who wipe over whatever tried to chew your face off a moment before..

Morrigan.2809:

The fact that sometimes you are so very glad to see another player and you think " not this day" and just proceed who wipe over whatever tried to chew your face off a moment before..

Or you’re seeing someone getting their face chewed off and think “not this day” when you come flying in for the assist.

darkace.8925:

Watching Trahearne get handed a Legendary weapon during my personal story.

LOL! I thought the same thing. I thought I was going to get Cadalbog (however you spell it). So sad. What makes me feel like a hero is having a superior title, a superior weapon/armor set, having a story revolve around me saving the world, or having a pet/creature that in and of itself is legendary. I’m not saying I need all of those to feel heroic, any of those will do. Being able to have a legendary creature as a pet is definitely a big point winner in my book.

Uruz Six.6594:

Morrigan.2809:

The fact that sometimes you are so very glad to see another player and you think " not this day" and just proceed who wipe over whatever tried to chew your face off a moment before..

Or you’re seeing someone getting their face chewed off and think “not this day” when you come flying in for the assist.

^^
This

Also, being one being chewed and seeing friendly players jumping in and helping — for me, that added even more hero feeling than killing any of the “big” baddies.

I really had few epic moments when I or a small group was hanging by the thread and seeing rush of the players (sometimes literally) jumping in to help and in the end emerging victorious (or even failing) — that’s why I’ll always get out my way to help anyone I see in trouble / downed, and that’s why I think that’s whole “hero” feeling is community driven and (at least for now) GW2 has one of the best ones I was part of.

For me being “heroic” is continuing to fight in spite of weakness and when bad *@!# happens or Aeris dies you pick yourself up and run headlong into danger.

For me a hero isn’t just one person, its a band of people coming together and standing united regardless of their differences and having their enemies fall divided!

I also like saving the world everynow and then.

As a ranger, I often find myself being a quiet hero. Just now, we tried fractals a little above our AR at high levels. Jade Maw repeatedly attacked my moa, even when everyone was down but me. It allowed me to rez everyone and prevent a full wipe. Being a hero means a lot of different things to a lot of people. I’d say our guild leaders are heroes in terms of leadership and guidance and tolerance, for example. Rock on, have fun.

I wanted to be a villein. But Anet thinks we all want to be heros.

And how many games nowadays allow you to play a villain?

Each and every time I alt into a hated or under appreciated spec for a class and then spank the hell out of the favored builds and classes. Makes me feel good every time.

Solo’ing champs also gives me great pleasure.

Oooo, can’t forget, watching a guardian, d/d ele or other survival spec get their butts handed to them by a boss and then I continue for another 5 minutes finishing off the boss solo style and then raising the masters of survival. Has happened often playing my 0/0/30/10/30 BM ranger. Awesome part, the pets don’t die.

So I guess it comes down to, I feel epic whenever I put haters in their place.

maybe I should have read questions. I feel like a hero when I can finish a build and it can persistantly be last man standing against horrifying odds.

Sweet armor has always kept my interest in games as well. LOTRO did it best with your stat armor and then you massive closet of skin overlays. Loved my Turtle Hermit Lore Master. I am glad though that GW2 still allows customization, perfecting my look is my end game for any game.

Everything is relative. Higher stats, better gear, more abilities, titles etc.. All that adds to the sense that the character is changing, growing. But at any point if the growth stops, so does the sense of heroism. It becomes the new status quo.

Joseph Campbell’s “Hero’s Journey”, which is just a universal story archetype, would say the penultimate phase of the journey is the ability to give back to one’s peers. In guild wars that amounts mostly on money to spend on either casual festivities for all to enjoy, or advantages in WvW.

To some degree the change in npc’s reactions towards the player is an extension of this, as they demonstrate appreciation for the players actions. Without new tasks and accolades from the npcs, it too becomes status quo though. The massive horde of supervillains can only be beaten so many times before even it becomes commonplace and less than heroic.

I think it’s fairly common within games to take things a bit outside the framework. By either creating your own heroic escapades within the social structure of a guild. Or taking things outside the game entirely by recording your skillful gameplay for all to see and comment on.

For me though, in guild wars, at level cap it’s mostly the money and what it can do.

As a philosophical aside. The difference between a hero and villain is only a matter of perspective. How many “creatures” have you slain, how many cultures, sects, and ecosystems have you personally disrupted in your hero’s quest? I know I’ve personally slain quite a few skritt who wanted nothing more than to stare at something shiny. I’m certainly a villain to the skritt populace.

Matt.3284:

I know I’ve personally slain quite a few skritt who wanted nothing more than to stare at something shiny. I’m certainly a villain to the skritt populace.

And then you do the Skrittsburg hearts and events and now you’re a skritt hero!

I don’t care about being a hero. I want to influence things from behind the scenes. If EVE was a fantasy game instead of a space opera, I’d probably love it.

who wants to be a hero, when you could be the villain…muahahahahahaha!!!!

randomly seeing a down player overrun at a kait event and tellnig them “i’ll rez him” conditioning every enemy on screen , stealthing and rezing them so fighting them off covering each others back till we complete the event, with the npc’s respawing after the event to cheer us on. thats when i felt like a hero.

Making me OP against level 1 mobs.

RebelYell.7132:

I don’t care about being a hero. I want to influence things from behind the scenes. If EVE was a fantasy game instead of a space opera, I’d probably love it.

So much this. Can we have EVE the fantasy RPG now please?

As far as being a hero, after playing this story, I know what DOESN’T make me feel like a hero…

Trahearne.

Oh, wait a second…

Matt.3284:

Joseph Campbell’s “Hero’s Journey” . . .

. . . is over-utilized and worn down so thin it’s not worth using as a template for your story. I want writers to stop using it as a checklist or a map of what points need to be hit while you’re writing your story. It’s not meant to be a primer for you to follow, it’s meant to be an examination of myth and legend.

So anyway. What makes me feel like a hero? From a few other games:

- Hearing the MIDI of “Clad in Darkness” kick in and knowing things are going to go very badly for someone.
- Climbing Darm Tower to the top and destroying anything in the way.
- Delivering the mother of all beat-downs to a Rathalos.
- World 1-1 to 8-4. no warp zones, a Saturday afternoon, and only a break for dinner.
- Zelda: A Link to the Past. Two hours, 100% completion, no deaths.
- Saving Aribeth.

In Guild Wars 2?

- Showing someone how to do something and making it look easy.
- Diving in at the last second to revive someone trying to do one of the world events and standing them up.
- Two words: Searing. Cauldron.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

. . . is over-utilized and worn down so thin it’s not worth using as a template for your story. I want writers to stop using it as a checklist or a map of what points need to be hit while you’re writing your story. It’s not meant to be a primer for you to follow, it’s meant to be an examination of myth and legend.

If it is over-utilized, I think perhaps it was over-utilized before it was ever created. Which I think is what comes from being an examination of myth and legend. For a writer looking to understand what elements drive and resonate with us as a society, I feel it is worthwhile to explore. One might very well do an examination of myth and legend themselves and come to similar findings.

I think I understand your reservations though. For me at least the thought of a story written from a checklist, regardless of what that checklist is, seems a dry and boring affair. Though the breadth of myth within our culture is certainly varied enough, even though much of it does seem to follow a basic design. I imagine no amount of structure will help a truly poor story.

I feel an understanding of what memes our culture resonates with is important for writers to understand. While not every story needs be a heroic epic. Topics such as at temptation, atonement, failure, redemption and salvation, be they on a grand or small scale, drive us in life as they do in story.

I think Campbell’s work is particularly relevant to a forever ongoing story due to it’s cyclic nature. Which is why I bring it up here. I think it answers precisely what keeps us going once we have already proven our heroism.

A lot of the answers here seem to be about saving other players.

I must say, saving NPCs does not make me feel like a hero, you know that they don’t really care about what you have done, and will just get someone else to help them in a few mins with the same problem.

But when saving another player, you know that they are aware, that they are thankful for your help. Even something like being a major community member that everyone knows can add a sense of heroism. I guess the heroicness (or evilness) of whatever you do is influenced by if that deed earns you recognition among your peers.

Sure I would feel a bit epic soloing the Claw of Jormag, but I would feel a whole lot more epic if a few hundred other people had witnessed me do it.

Seems like the social interaction aspects of what you are doing is just as important as what you are doing itself when wanting to feel like a hero/villain.

Even everyone dies, and you’re left alone finishing off a boss! LIKE A BOSS!

Personnally, I’d say something along this worked pretty well to make me feel like a hero :

Music is a big part of it. Also this specific video lacks the entrance :p

Storyline triumph!
Awesome looking armor & weapons (screenshot)
Being the only one standing at the end of a rough encounter. Or being that last one to kite, KD, quickness rez your teammate mid-battle to keep the fight alive.