Guild Wars 2

Hello!

Today, for the first time, I tried to solo AC P1 with my lv 80 warrior. It took me approximately 1 hour and 30 minutes to reach the last boss. Then I took down the HP of the boss to around 5% and opened LFG to sell spot. 2 people initially entered and purchased the spot and then after some time 2 more people entered simultaneously and they kicked me out of the dungeon for no reason. They didn’t even entered the dungeon themselves and yet they kicked me out. The first 2 guys told me that one of those last guy entered the dungeon and instantly kick me from the party which the other guy approved immediately. I had to refund the first 2 guys and just lost my whole time and effort. I am really disappointed with the attitude of these people and the unfair policy of the party system in GW2.

I wasn’t able to note down their names (as I was struggling with the boss) nor did the first 2 guys noticed the names. So, I couldn’t report them. But, I don’t understand how some random people can enter my party and kick me, the party leader, within a few seconds. The whole party system seems unfair to me. Just tell me guys what’s wrong with these people?

P.S. I am new to this game.

Don’t sell loot slots? Then you won’t be surprised when people that cheese loot are less than spectacular.

I am inclined to agree with the post above me.

There are people against selling the slots on principle, or perhaps competitors that want to frustrate you. Either way it was a crappy thing to do.

Griefers are just scum.

First of all,

I am really sorry you had a bad experience. It really sucks when players are trying to ruin other peoples fun on purpose.

ArenaNet tries very hard to avoid this. In fact, much of the PvE design was created with this context – Including the Dungeon party design. In your case it was unfair that you got kicked out, but from another point of view, is it the system that is really unfair?

Fortunately what you are describing have never happened to me, but in other MMOs that I have played, I have often found myself in a group of people were the group leader (or group creator) acted like a jerk who bossed everyone around because he could kick people at random.

I don’t think GW2 wants to foster that sort of community. But what you are describing is a problem, and I feel that a problem with dungeons in GW2 in general is not being able to keep your own instance open if you get kicked out, accidently teleport out or get a game crash or lose connection. You should have been able to get back in without it resetting. It is after all your instance.

I don’t think ArenaNet shuns people who want to make money of Dungeon runs. I think it’s a really cool meta game in itself, but the game was obviously not created for that. When I worked towards Dungeon Master title, I bought 2 of the Arah Paths for a couple of gold each, and in those transactions I had to trust that the guy doing the run would not just kick me after receiving the money.

Fortunately, between getting a bad rep, and the real threat of getting banned being reported I think most people are detteriated from it. Which brings me to my final question: Is it possible that the guys who kicked you for no reason didn’t know what they are doing?

The Dungeon Finder system is still in beta and believe it or not, some people are really confused by it. It’s kind of hidden away, and has some strange workings!

they should just scrapped the kicking system altogether.

put in an afk kicker timer , thats it problem solved.

or make it every other member must agree to kick before it happens

some guy did the same to me once in arah

dont wanna say names **********

the name i mentioned was not the real name but i understand what u mean

It’s completely absurd only one person has to approve the kick, it should be at least 3 people to get the kick done. Sadly Anet likes to give people troll stuff like this.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Don’t sell loot slots? Then you won’t be surprised when people that cheese loot are less than spectacular.

Or how about people stop being pathetic and griefing sellers? I’ve had these fools appear in my groups as well, kicking me from my Arah instances.

and this is the point where I wish for a friendly fire.Add them to friendly list and nuke them on every segment of world.This is what I loved in other MMORPG,I don’t name any,when he had nothing better to do only kill the low levels of my alliance I just camped the * of him until he said Sorry or I got bored.That was all what I wished to hear.Then never see him again :-D

It takes 2 votes to kick someone. I’ve not experienced it myself yet, but surely the person who makes the group should have ultimate control of who is kicked, not a couple of random premades who fill in the last 2 slots, then kick the leader for the lols.

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

Mac.3872:

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

That’s funny. I’ve seen paths being sold without scamming or grieving.

Best solution is for everyone to stop being jerks.

Mac.3872:

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

I believe in enabling players. I’ve used dungeon sellers before and I have only had good experiences. In one case, Lupus bugged on Arah Path 4, so it took more like an hour, but we still got it and the owner honored our deal.

These thread appear on a daily basis, clearly there is a problem here and until Anet address the problem people will continue to be scammed and grieved. fact

well.. if you are in a large guild and they are okay with it you can sell it to some in your guild
if then one spot is free its okay he alone cant do much to screw u up…
i feel sorry for you
gl next time

Mac.3872:

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

No. How about we don’t remove one of the few skill-gated sources of income in the game?

Yeah, don’t remove or change anything. Its buyer and seller beware when it comes to dungeon selling/buying. You can have pay before join in LFG, but still would have to watch out for trolls.

Mac.3872:

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

Or just i don’t know, pay attention to not get scammed and don’t be a kitten to grief others? I know, being a good person nowadays is unacceptable.

ANet ought to print signs to put on the wall in every developer cubicle. The signs should read:

“Any system in an online game that can be abused will be abused. When designing game systems, keep this in mind.”

I can understand that the kick function was included as a convenience feature. However, kicking and instances disappearing when the creator leaves are two “convenience” features that have created an awful lot of inconvenience.

Granted I can’t imagine anyone will ever agree that instances closing down when the one that starts it leaves can fall under “Convenience”, it is quite possibly one of the most ridiculous things in Guild Wars 2 and something that keeps most of the community confused as to why has it been kept after two years of complaints.

maha.7902:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Don’t sell loot slots? Then you won’t be surprised when people that cheese loot are less than spectacular.

Or how about people stop being pathetic and griefing sellers? I’ve had these fools appear in my groups as well, kicking me from my Arah instances.

Again, perhaps, consider your target market.

Mac.3872:

The ability to sell dungeon paths causes nothing but trouble. Either the buyer gets scammed or the seller gets ‘grieved’. Best solution would be to remove it from the game entirely, for the sake of a more pleasant community.

Tell me how they get scammed? The person beat the dungeon for them and is asking for payment for it.

Anet can’t control the action of all players, if they could the game would by so crippled that it would not be worth playing. As for selling dungeon runs I see no problem with it it’s like selling runs in the original GW1 to get to a town or outpost you didn’t have yet
But like anything else in a game were you pay someone to help you threw a part of the game there will be issues that Anet can’t get involved in. So if your the person that is selling the run or the person paying for the run there are going to be people that won’t play nice and you have to just deal with and move on. There is nothing that can be done.

Its huge issue that many people in this game abusing.Anet need to do something about this,untill then do dungeons ONLY with guild members and friends.That way you wont have any issues.

The dungeon leader/instance owner should have kick immunity and veto power over kick requests. You don’t need to be selling paths for this crap to happen. I started a LFG listing, two people joined and kicked me at the start of CM p3. Some people are jerks with a heart of pure jerk.

While the OP’s story kinda sucks, I’m even more shocked that he’d spend 1h30m to sell slots for AC Path 1 and then people bought those slots.

…The dungeon can be ran with a crappy PUG in like 15-20 minutes.

Feirlista Xv.1425:

it’s like selling runs in the original GW1 to get to a town or outpost you didn’t have yet

Except they aren’t anything alike.

hannah mee.7925:

While the OP’s story kinda sucks, I’m even more shocked that he’d spend 1h30m to sell slots for AC Path 1 and then people bought those slots.

…The dungeon can be ran with a crappy PUG in like 15-20 minutes.

Feirlista Xv.1425:

it’s like selling runs in the original GW1 to get to a town or outpost you didn’t have yet

Except they aren’t anything alike.

People like me may make a character but not want to level them doing tedious open world, so we can buy cheap AC paths to get easy levels.

I agree with you all on the kicking issue there needs to be some control to the person that started the instance, at least they can’t be kicked if you find yourself in an instance were the starter has no clue there is always that option to just leave. Kicking the starter is just rude no matter what. I think a better way would be if a person was AFK for a period of time then there name in the party list changes color and the kick option is active. If you get someone that just doesn’t get it, then there is no kick option at all you will just have to leave the party instance and start over in a new group.

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. Just stick to other money-making stuff and move away from risky ones like selling slots.

If you really wanna sell slot, get 3 others of your friends, to make sure you dont get kicked. Sure you lose 3 other sales, but it’s safer.

As for the game mechanics, I’m pretty sure these things happen very rarely so Anet don’t really changed the way party-kick happens. But I like what Anet did, that anyone can propose a kick and not just the party leader, but maybe change so that no one can kick the dungeon maker coz that kicks everyone else out of dungeon (that seems odd right?)…

Wow that’s just terrible behaviour, I really dislike it when I hear of windbags like those. I’ve never bought or sold dungeon paths myself, but it sounds like a totally legit way of earning gold, indeed a bit like the outpost runners in GW1.

Since it sounds like quite a popular phenomenon, it would actually be a cool QoL thing if it was acknowledged in a way, with an interface designed for it. A bit like a trading post or notice board, where runners could advertise their path and price and buyers could purchase it. The gold would then be awarded to the runner after the completion of the path.

You’re selling dungeon runs and complaining about fairness? Do you even know what that word means?

serves you right. next time finish the dungeon yourself and don’t sell spots.

Am I missing something here? Is doing the community a service and making some gold on the side like some heinous sin which deserves to be punished?

Like, literally, why is anyone even trying to argue against the OP? Griefing someone in-game is wrong no matter what the context is, it doesn’t matter how jealous you are of sellers making more gold than you ever will, griefing their instance is wrong.

Selling dungeon spots is no different from selling spots for a Droks run in GW1. Why would anyone have anything against it?

Conncept.7638:

You’re selling dungeon runs and complaining about fairness? Do you even know what that word means?

Fair
adjective
1. in accordance with the rules or standards; legitimate.
2. (of hair or complexion) light; blond.
adverb
1. without cheating or trying to achieve unjust advantage.
2. to a high degree.
noun
a beautiful woman.
verb
(of the weather) become fine.

This is fair in most definitions (If we’re thinking of the same one). He beat 5 man content, and is willing to let you in on the rewards for a fee.

I feel really sorry for you, man. I had something similar happen once to me too.

Here’s what you do:

Get 3 guildies to hold spots for you. When each single person joins, ask them to send money, or kick. Once a buyer accepts the spot, another guildy leaves.,

Assuming each individual person would’ve sent the money already, no one would take the risk to kick you. And if someone does take the risk, then they would’ve made a fool of themselves while you keep everyone’s money. (While this seems unfair, it is the buyer’s responsibility to make sure no one kicks.)

Conncept.7638:

You’re selling dungeon runs and complaining about fairness? Do you even know what that word means?

Ever solo Arah p2 and get kicked at the end? And yes, you can solo Arah p2. Do you think it’s fair to be kicked after all the hard work?

I’m assuming the “fairness” is because you think OP used exploits, which is wrong. Either that, or do some growing up. People have a right to complain when sadistic sociopaths try to ruin other’s fun. Could you imagine if you saw such a thing happen in real life?

Let’s think of a more realistic situation. You’re sitting in a LAN Gaming Cafe, and the people you sell are sitting right across from you. You can actually see their faces. But one of them decides to kick you and laughs: “lolololotrollinglolololoumad?lololo”. Is that fair? How would you react?

If you were playing Monopoly with a friend in the park, and some jerk came and flipped the table upsidedown, you would complain too. You would probably remark: “WTF is that guy’s problem?” and your friend would probably say under his breath “That dude is craaazy…..” Would you accept when someone tells you: “You’re playing monopoly in the park and complaining about fairness?”

Eric.6109:

serves you right. next time finish the dungeon yourself and don’t sell spots.

Why?

It’s been like this since launch two years ago. At this point, don’t even dream about it being dealt with.

The safest way to sell is to fill the slots with your friends first and bring in customers one by one, each customer replacing a friend after having paid.

People are probably not accustomed to path selling, and maybe people thought dungeon are supposed to be done in groups.

Since the dungeon behavior don’t happen in other games that much, people are probably surprised. If you tell people coming from other mmorpg that rangers are supposed to use greatsword or sword in dungeon because they deal more damage, other people might tell you “WHA! rangers dont’ use bow?”

maha.7902:

Am I missing something here? Is doing the community a service and making some gold on the side like some heinous sin which deserves to be punished?

Like, literally, why is anyone even trying to argue against the OP? Griefing someone in-game is wrong no matter what the context is, it doesn’t matter how jealous you are of sellers making more gold than you ever will, griefing their instance is wrong.

I won’t deny the /kick function is messed up. It seriously needs addressed.

That being said, I don’t see how misusing a game function for gold is any different than misusing one for amusement.

I highly doubt the mechanic for allowing /join mid dungeon was ever intended as an income device.

Nice play of the Jealousy card. Did you Raid?

Selling slots/loot rights is ancient. Raiders did it all the time to sell BOP gear. I found it amusing that the majority of them screamed bloody murder at the idea of Pay to Win items bought from a cash store, but had no issue with pay to win if the plat was going into their pockets. And generally the “you are just jealous” argument was standard fare.

So, how would you react if I could buy Dungeon completions/exp, Tokens and gear at the Gem store? After all, they would just be “doing the community a service and making a little income”.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

maha.7902:

Am I missing something here? Is doing the community a service and making some gold on the side like some heinous sin which deserves to be punished?

Like, literally, why is anyone even trying to argue against the OP? Griefing someone in-game is wrong no matter what the context is, it doesn’t matter how jealous you are of sellers making more gold than you ever will, griefing their instance is wrong.

I won’t deny the /kick function is messed up. It seriously needs addressed.

That being said, I don’t see how misusing a game function for gold is any different than misusing one for amusement.

I highly doubt the mechanic for allowing /join mid dungeon was ever intended as an income device.

Nice play of the Jealousy card. Did you Raid?

I’m trying to figure out if you played gw1. Because… dungeons and runs were sold. It’s not a misuse. It is fine and anet is only against selling if exploits are utilized. Please. Please. Understand this.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

maha.7902:

Am I missing something here? Is doing the community a service and making some gold on the side like some heinous sin which deserves to be punished?

Like, literally, why is anyone even trying to argue against the OP? Griefing someone in-game is wrong no matter what the context is, it doesn’t matter how jealous you are of sellers making more gold than you ever will, griefing their instance is wrong.

I won’t deny the /kick function is messed up. It seriously needs addressed.

That being said, I don’t see how misusing a game function for gold is any different than misusing one for amusement.

I highly doubt the mechanic for allowing /join mid dungeon was ever intended as an income device.

Nice play of the Jealousy card. Did you Raid?

I’m trying to figure out if you played gw1. Because… dungeons and runs were sold. It’s not a misuse. It is fine and anet is only against selling if exploits are utilized. Please. Please. Understand this.

10k hours in GW. More in EQ2. Pay to Win isn’t a good thing, ever. Common practice or not. I’m also fairly sure that story instance “skip” running in proph was why it became nearly impossible to do in Factions and NF. You could “beat” Proph only having to actually enter 4 missions (5 if you count leaving Pre) and get the same reward at the end as anyone who had done the whole campaign.

Anet “condoned” the practice simply because there was no way to police it.

That was why Proph elite armors were no big deal. Not when you had level 3s in Grotto. May as well have sold it in Ascalon City.

I earned my Statues. Others AFK’d them. Knowing that titles could be bought made them fairly meaningless.

There is the attitude that cheating vs a nonentity, PvE “game” is fine. Do the exact same thing in PvP and watch the fur fly. But, it is still the same thing.

Players are selling content completion. If Anet did the same thing, these forums would burn down.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Players are selling content completion. If Anet did the same thing, these forums would burn down.

Before Ascended at least both players and Anet sold BiS gear, No forum burn down over it.

I completely understand that in your opinion it is a misuse of a game element. I even understand why. I earned my own way in GW1 too. If I saw people spamming looking for a mission run in prophecies I would offer to go along with them, help them with the mission, even explain what we needed to do and why, but I wouldn’t run the mission for them. I firmly believe that doing something, even with help, is more satisfying than paying someone else to do it for you.

But

Just because I don’t like the idea of getting a dungeon run does not mean that dungeon runs are an exploit or misuse of game elements.

Scrubs and dungeon sellers are a match made in heaven. People should take a hint from the title and join a guild – guaranteed success in any dungeon if u arent an kitten.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Don’t sell loot slots? Then you won’t be surprised when people that cheese loot are less than spectacular.

This is the kind of attitude that the people who ruined your party have, OP.
Sadly many of the community feel threatened by the selling of dungeon slots, even if it does not affect them at all. So threatened in fact that they take the time out of their day to grief you because you are doing something that upsets them. This is an emotional thing for them. This is how they cope with their personal problem, by screwing over other people

My advice to you is to have a network of friends who will sit in your party and fill slots for you so that you can trickle in buyers one by one, or have them set up a proxy party to take in buyers and forward the money and customers to you.

Well first let’s address the fact that Warriors are still so OP that they can solo dungeons period. That’s not part of a normal game design and no don’t insult our intelligence by acting like it’s supposed to be happening. It is however disturbing that there’s a ton of things wrong with Engineers yet warriors are allowed to continue to run amok like this.

Second, selling slots in dungeons really? That’s what this game has turned into? I guess they really haven’t been paying attention to their game much less their forums to allow this kind of thing to continue.

There isn’t a method for trading in the game period. Anet won’t punish them because they have broken no rules and people have been told time and again “trade at your own risk”.

And I have to say, if you are surprised people act like kitten when they can get away with it completely in anonymity then welcome to the internet. Maybe ask for the money upfront next time.

I just find people who buy dungeon slots in GW2 lamentable. It is possibly understandable if they wanted Arah skins before PVP reward track was introduced because there would be no other ways of getting the skins and are unwilling to grind Arah with PUGs for tokens but now there can be no excuse.

Its not about “earning” the title Dungeon master – it is about the need to get a title that has no rewards whatsover and has no time limit and then having to cheat rather than try the dungeons a few times to get the necessary experience to beat them. If it is about dungeon chests, go do the other shorter dungeons to get them.

On the other hand, I completely understand if people sold portals for JPs (most ppl accept donations rather than straight up selling portals and some even do it for free). In the first place, I have no need for the title etc chest but if someone was willing to give people a ride for a bit of money and save them the effort of doing something which is not part of the game’s core mechanic, power to them. I think people making G this way cannot be griefed in any way – well if people wanted to weasel out of paying even then no loss.

Substance E.4852:

There isn’t a method for trading in the game period. Anet won’t punish them because they have broken no rules and people have been told time and again “trade at your own risk”.

And I have to say, if you are surprised people act like kitten when they can get away with it completely in anonymity then welcome to the internet. Maybe ask for the money upfront next time.

Didnt playing solo RPGs teach u something? Like half upfront and half upon completion?

Sellers aren’t the problem. Game is just so easy to grief in or harass at times.

tigirius.9014:

Well first let’s address the fact that Warriors are still so OP that they can solo dungeons period. That’s not part of a normal game design and no don’t insult our intelligence by acting like it’s supposed to be happening. It is however disturbing that there’s a ton of things wrong with Engineers yet warriors are allowed to continue to run amok like this.

Second, selling slots in dungeons really? That’s what this game has turned into? I guess they really haven’t been paying attention to their game much less their forums to allow this kind of thing to continue.

tigirius.9014:

Well first let’s address the fact that Warriors are still so OP that they can solo dungeons period.

Have you ever played Warrior? They don’t have anything that other professions don’t, besides a few damage buffs which aren’t any relevant in solo runs.

You could solo some dungeons on a Necromancer even easier than a Warrior, especially since a Necromancer can Facetank bosses like Arah P2’s Belka using their life drain. Engineers and Thiefs are also amazing at dungeon solo runs, since they have stealth and tons of endurance regeneration.

Here’s a Mesmer example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qf-PP2VBBBI

tigirius.9014:

It is however disturbing that there’s a ton of things wrong with Engineers yet warriors are allowed to continue to run amok like this.

Offtopic, but according to DnT’s recent DPS tiers, Engineers are THE second highest DPS in the game, after only Elementalists. I’m curious why you would say there’s “tons of things wrong with Engineers…”? Flamethrower? That’s being fixed next patch anyways. But as it currently stands, Engineers are actually one of the better professions in the game, possibly OVERPOWERED since they are incredibly useful in pretty much any game mode, have tons of survivability (Healing Turret, perma-vigor, blind…), and great team support too! (Healing Turret, combo fields, MAX VULNERABILITY reflect, stealth, blast finishers, etc…)

As for Solo dungeon running, Engineer is actually one of the easier classes to solo on too, since they have perma-swiftness, perma-vigor (+more endurance from Toolbelt), stealth, bombs (dps while kiting), turrets (for distracting bosses), TONS of reflect, and nades for maximum range. They also have tons of HP restoration sources like Healing Bombs and Backpack Regenerator, which allow you to facetank bosses like Agent Belka.

I main an Engineer.

tigirius.9014:

Second, selling slots in dungeons really? That’s what this game has turned into?

Players have been playing this game for 2 years. It’s not that surprising their skills have progressed to the point of soloing dungeons. Soloing a dungeon really opens up a new form and perspective of gameplay Traits overlooked in PvE suddenly become useful, and it really changes the way you think about boss encounters.

The fact players are soloing dungeons is actually quite healthy for this game, because it means the dungeon design is capable of satisfying multiple game modes, and it allows ArenaNet to gather valuable data for designing future Personal Story content.

As for selling, why not? It takes an hour or two in order for an experienced player to solo Arah p2, and you only get 6g per person. Let’s assume it takes 30 more minutes to find enough guildies to sit on your spots, and then enough people to actually sell the path. Considering the immense amount of practice and skill it takes (and LOTS of patience to defeat Berserker Abomination), earning 24g+3g for daily is a satisfying reward for 2 hours of something which requires immense skill.

tigirius.9014:

I guess they really haven’t been paying attention to their game much less their forums to allow this kind of thing to continue.

They’ve been paying attention, and I think a few are even proud. I remember the devs even congratulated the first person to solo Lupicus.

Methinks you should give it a try. Arah p2 solo is really fun!

I want you to answer this: Have you ever bothered to even try soloing a path before making your post? Have you tried on a profession other than Warrior? And how far did you get?