Guild Wars 2

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.
• You can do all you prefer to get what you want: I MUST do fractal for ascended ring, I MUST do daily for ascended amlet, I MUST do guild mission for ascended earings, I MUST do PvE for equip (or at least is the better choice). I want to do WvW and PvP, why if i play the 80% of my time in the mist i can’t get something for my charr for wvw? Why i have to do daily fractal to get the ring that i need to be competitive?
• Is better have more character for a better experience of play: You promise it, you said that there are achievements that you must do with different profession, and after you put the lvl of fractal character bound and now you say that the wvw rank will be character bound too.

Why did you change your philosophy on how this game should be?

Man, If it only takes 120 hours to get a fully geared character I’m glad I picked this game back up!

I bought it back during release and ended up returning it, but was fully engulfed by Rift’s expansion at the time, not because GW2 was bad or anything. After months of grinding dungeons/raids and 300 hours of play time later I’m still not in the best gear in that game.

To the OP: Yes there is a time investment, but if it’s only 120 hours for max level and gear, GW2 headed in the right direction.

Aeonblade.8709

I taked that time with my first character. About 80 hours for lvl 80 and 40 of grind in orr for ecto. But now with acended you need a lot of time for only 1 piece of gear

Laxuar.3504:

Aeonblade.8709

I taked that time with my first character. About 80 hours for lvl 80 and 40 of grind in orr for ecto. But now with acended you need a lot of time for only 1 piece of gear

I see what you are saying, grinding for gear isn’t fun, in any game.

Why do you need to have a fully geared character? I mean, aside from making farming faster. I have 11 characters, 5 80s and not one of them is in full exotics yet. Despite this, I’m not prevented from engaging in ANY kind of content or gameplay.

The idea that you have to be fully geared is nothing but an arbitrary goal set by the players themselves. If you want to focus on that to the exclusion of all else, then don’t complain about grinding. No one is forcing you to do it except you. Play the game and everything will eventually take care of itself. If you’re unable to wait for your goodies, don’t blame the game for giving you the opportunity to speed things up by grinding.

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Just install, log on and BOOM, all your characters are lvl 80 and in full exotics with a legendary of your choice?

I understand your point of view and is correct if you are in a not-competitive game. But wvw is a competitive play, I need that gear because my opponents have it. The main problem is that if i love to play wvw and i don’t like fractals how do i get ascended rings? If i have 4 char why i need 4 month to get 4 ascended amulets?. I can understand if it is only 1% stronger than exotic but is 8% more (the stasts) and i’m warried for armor and weapon. I bouth this game because they promise to me that it isn’t a grind game (and because after 5 years GW1 didn’t change in grind and equip).

No Vol you misunderstand me, i want that people grind for fantastic beatiful legendary gear, but that should be strong like exotic one. I want GW2 like it was in october where i can do what i prefer to reach my goal. I don’t want to play 400 hours for only one character.

exact, once you level up a character to 80 the exotic grind is fine.

but the ascended isnt fun.
id also rather start another toon and explore other areas.

for a game “without grind” as “playable as you want”, alts are definitely not encouraged unless you play 30+ hours a week.

and dont tell me ascended are not necessary, i know, but the more they add the more they are.

Laxuar.3504:

I understand your point of view and is correct if you are in a not-competitive game. But wvw is a competitive play, I need that gear because my opponents have it. The main problem is that if i love to play wvw and i don’t like fractals how do i get ascended rings? If i have 4 char why i need 4 month to get 4 ascended amulets?. I can understand if it is only 1% stronger than exotic but is 8% more (the stasts) and i’m warried for armor and weapon. I bouth this game because they promise to me that it isn’t a grind game (and because after 5 years GW1 didn’t change in grind and equip).

Unless you primarily regularly playing solo, you really, really, really don’t need the extra 8%. Spend that time working on things like team coordination, etc… You’ll get more return for your time.

Vol.5241:

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Just install, log on and BOOM, all your characters are lvl 80 and in full exotics with a legendary of your choice?

You miss the point, mate. Not every game needs to be about gear. GW1 wasn’t about gear. When you hit max level, you bought cheap gear from the vendor, and it had the same stats as every other set of gear. For me, it’s not that I “want gear with zero effort”. It’s that I simply don’t want gear at all. I want to play, not grind.

I want a game that’s about playing and having fun, not grinding out freaking gear.

It’s fun, it’s possible, and it’s been done. By ArenaNet even. No clue where they’re going with GW2, though. Aside from away from fun.

Chuo.4238:

Vol.5241:

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Just install, log on and BOOM, all your characters are lvl 80 and in full exotics with a legendary of your choice?

You miss the point, mate. Not every game needs to be about gear. GW1 wasn’t about gear. When you hit max level, you bought cheap gear from the vendor, and it had the same stats as every other set of gear. For me, it’s not that I “want gear with zero effort”. It’s that I simply don’t want gear at all. I want to play, not grind.

I want a game that’s about playing and having fun, not grinding out freaking gear.

It’s fun, it’s possible, and it’s been done. By ArenaNet even. No clue where they’re going with GW2, though. Aside from away from fun.

So, I guess what we need here is your definition of “fun.”

I re-watched the manifesto recently. They never say “no grinding” – they do say they give you choice. You can choose to grind out the needed stuff to get a Legendary. But you do not have to. Having one has no relevance on the actual game or your character. It does not make you more elite or less elite. It just gives you a very pretty shiny to call your own and to strut around with and say “look at me, I am special!”

The same applies to Ascended gear. Except its less “look at me” because nobody can see it. They do give you some nice stat bonuses. They do give you something you need if you choose (there is that word again) to partake in higher tier FOTM content. Again you can do FOTM with no ascended gear. But if you choose to grind it out and keep doing that same content again and again at higher difficulties…well you are choosing to do that. Nobody is forcing you. And at this point the only reason to keep grinding FOTM is to get gear to fight agony so you can grind out higher levels of FOTM. It just feeds itself, and that content is there for people who like that.

Everyone has different play styles and likes different kinds of content (Gasp! Say it ain’t so!!) That being said: I feel ArenaNet has done a spectacular job catering to as many different play styles as they can. Like grinding out content and working for a specific goal? Well there is Ascended and Legendary gear to get (and to a lesser extent exotics!) If that is not your cup of tea, then there is world completion, different achievements, dailies. monthlies, exploration, and tons upon tons of hidden little things to go find!

After 2 level 80s, both in full exotics (which was a bit of a grind, but I choose to do that) I find no need to grind out anything else. Yes I have seem FOTM, but I am not grinding to get to higher difficulty levels. Why? There is no need to. I have been there and seen that. I may change my mind and do higher level FOTM, which is exciting because that is my choice to do so. I don’t have too. I have seen 68% of what the world has to offer (world completion.) And even then, if I get to 100% I know there is so many hidden things…

That all aside. What I enjoy most is adventuring with my friends (some lower level then me) and finding new things and places I never seen before. I recently stumbled on some events that I have never seen (apparently there are some rather rare events that only happen once certain conditions are met…which I find very awesome!) Building up our guild, helping folks with jumping puzzles… making fun of my Silvari companions with cheap salad jokes… Yeah.

Ascended and Legendary is absolutely not necessary. It just is not. Unless you are going for that specific content where it is. Down the line I seriously think Ascended will not be needed except, again, for the higher level FOTM stuff. That is it. The rest.. its all just for show.

The point is GW2 can be (and is) the game you want to make it. You say you don’t want to grind for gear. Then don’t. You do not have too.

Chuo.4238:

Vol.5241:

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Just install, log on and BOOM, all your characters are lvl 80 and in full exotics with a legendary of your choice?

You miss the point, mate. Not every game needs to be about gear. GW1 wasn’t about gear. When you hit max level, you bought cheap gear from the vendor, and it had the same stats as every other set of gear. For me, it’s not that I “want gear with zero effort”. It’s that I simply don’t want gear at all. I want to play, not grind.

I want a game that’s about playing and having fun, not grinding out freaking gear.

It’s fun, it’s possible, and it’s been done. By ArenaNet even. No clue where they’re going with GW2, though. Aside from away from fun.

100% agree with this statement. Over the last few month I feel if i don’t put 3-4 hours a night doing same daily chores i will fall behind in my character development. I quit WoW because the “daily grind” became exhausting.

I have a great feeling burn out and loosing interest and desire to play. Also, I notice a big drop in population on my server and guild participation.

I hope the developers go back to their roots and ease the daily grind.

Thanks

It’s taking you 3-4 hours to do dailies?

no matter how long it takes, its tedious.

why dota2 is gaining popularity and gw2 going down?
because one game respect the player and one doesnt as much.

give us interesting content
not “a farmable grind”.

ravinboy.1698:

They do give you some nice stat bonuses. They do give you something you need if you choose (there is that word again) to partake in higher tier FOTM content.

Not really, the stat bonuses are there to incentivise grind like every other EQ/WoW clone, the only thing that would of been required for higher FOTM content would be agony resist on the gear.

It is those stat bonuses that mean it is requried in other parts of the game unless you enjoy playing at a disadvantage (an ever increasing disadvantage as they add ascended gear to more slots).

This game is so far away from what it was promoted on it is a joke, the manifesto is somewhat wishy washy, however the Q&As, interviews, blog posts, etc less so, to take one small example, this is from a blog post by the lead dev:

“We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.”

That statement was true at release, when they introduced ascended gear it became a lie, if someone wants their character to be “just as powerful” they now have to hop on the treadmill and get ascended gear.

They also promoted the game on “play it how you want”, so the introduction of ascended gear broke that philosophy too when they rushed it in and it was only available if “play how you want” happened to coincide with playing dungeons. Which in turn broke yet another pre-release claim, their much repeated “when it’s ready”, instead of which they rushed it in.

The game is just another WoW 2.0 with nice graphics and an action type combat style, and no raids.

The problem is, they had two completely contradictory design goals from the start.

A) No or minimal grind
B) Content accesible to casuals, and engaging for hardcores

These two goals couldn’t be fulfilled. The game started with ‘no grind’, and hardcore players had finished virtually everything within two weeks, and obtained a legendary within a month. Whereas casuals had a mid and long-term playthrough. Casuals were staying, hardcores were moving on. (until the point when ANet allowed the economy to be jacked up, and long-term goals for casuals pretty much disappeared)

Then they added some grind to keep the hardcores, but things became inaccesible to casuals.

So, in the recent addition, laurels and dailies. They gated the new content by time rather than by grind. Now casuals can get it in a reasonable time, but hardcores are limited by the time gate, and can only get it slightly faster than a casual.

Personally, it can be argued that this last addition appeases both design goals, but it can also be argued that it appeases neither.

this game should have fully embraced its pvp side.

make a lot of cool pve with doses of pvp type of content.
5 vs 5 vs 5 in a huge dungeon with mobs and traps, 10 + mobs vs 10 + mobs castle storming etc.

Avatar.1923:

no matter how long it takes, its tedious.

why dota2 is gaining popularity and gw2 going down?
because one game respect the player and one doesnt as much.

give us interesting content
not “a farmable grind”.

It’s not tedious at all. 80% of the dailies you can complete just running around and doing what you want to do. In fact, I’ve completely the daily several times without even knowning what they were. 100% of the dailies are completely optional and in no way affect your gameplay.

Honestly, people…stop complaining just to complain.

To me, “engaging for hardcores” means grind for tippity top of the line shinies. But as a casual player, if I can simply play the PvE game, do all the hearts and end up with enough Karma to buy a full set of Orr armor, I’m ecstatic.

I’m just starting to play with jumping puzzles or crafting for gold. Heck I’ve only done one dungeon in story mode so far. I’m still on my original character!

Please someone should make a sticky responding to this kind of arguments:
1. There is no grind!
2. There is grind, but not as mush as in “put a random mmoprg name”
3. Do you want to have all top items with zero effort?1!1!1!111
4. You can’t have all you want!
5. Ascended are not mandatory!
6. You can play everything equipping just green stuff…
7. I can solo Lupicus with my whites, L2P noob.

Erick Alastor.3917:

Please someone should make a sticky responding to this kind of arguments:
1. There is no grind!
2. There is grind, but not as mush as in “put a random mmoprg name”
3. Do you want to have all top items with zero effort?1!1!1!111
4. You can’t have all you want!
5. Ascended are not mandatory!
6. You can play everything equipping just green stuff…
7. I can solo Lupicus with my whites, L2P noob.

Responding to those arguments in that list;

If you want to be the kitten on the team in pve don’t call others noobs and definitely don’t tell others to learn to play. If you’re competitive at all in WvW, you’re going to need best in slot gear unless you want to gank dolyaks all day. It is a daily grind, it is mandatory, and if you try to take on any average player or players in WvW in greens then you’re about as useless as a mini pet.

Yeah Anet, why didn’t you just mail us BiS gear with auto infinite XP on character creation?

Oh wait, maybe because MMORPGs are about leveling and character progression. Go to sPvP if you want everything handed to you.

Ethics.4519:

Yeah Anet, why didn’t you just mail us BiS gear with auto infinite XP on character creation?

Oh wait, maybe because MMORPGs are about leveling and character progression. Go to sPvP if you want everything handed to you.

Ah, but they don’t have to be, and some are not. Think outside the tier gear box…

Ethics.4519:

Yeah Anet, why didn’t you just mail us BiS gear with auto infinite XP on character creation?

Oh wait, maybe because MMORPGs are about leveling and character progression. Go to sPvP if you want everything handed to you.

And you, sir, are included in the 3rd case

If time and being on equal gear footing is so important to you OP they have a mode for that — it’s called sPvP.

If you choose to participate in a mode of the game that does have gear discrepancies, and being top geared takes time, then that’s your choice. All dailies can be completed in WvW. You don’t even have to put much effort into it most times. But really if you think ascended gear is required to be successful in WvW, you’re misinformed.

You can pay 40 dollars, buy crafting materials, and be level 80 from the start.

You can save 4-5g per crafting profession, start from nothing, and be level 80 in a few hours.

The same way people like to reference the ability to attain level 20 in GW1 in a day (Jalis Ironhammer Punch-out challenge), I can get to level 80 in GW2 in much less than half the time.

Vorch.2985:

You can pay 40 dollars, buy crafting materials, and be level 80 from the start.

You can save 4-5g per crafting profession, start from nothing, and be level 80 in a few hours.

The same way people like to reference the ability to attain level 20 in GW1 in a day (Jalis Ironhammer Punch-out challenge), I can get to level 80 in GW2 in much less than half the time.

Yea…except Kilroy’s Punch-Out didn’t cost 40 bucks or a kittenload of gold…

OP, it took me 200 hours to get my first character to just get 50% elite gear(By elite, I am talking about the high end gear) and I did that by just playing the game. Really. I just played the game since launch and I only found out that I can get really good gear using the karma from the dailies I’ve done.

In short, it doesn’t feel very grind-y compared to other the MMOs I’ve played (SW:TOR and WoW)

Cowrex.9564:

OP, it took me 200 hours to get my first character to just get 50% elite gear(By elite, I am talking about the high end gear) and I did that by just playing the game. Really. I just played the game since launch and I only found out that I can get really good gear using the karma from the dailies I’ve done.

In short, it doesn’t feel very grind-y compared to other the MMOs I’ve played (SW:TOR and WoW)

And you, sir, are included in the 2nd case
Ok, I’ll quit here for today xD have fun grinding :*

The main problem that a lot of you don’t understand is that the wvw (that is pvp) share the equip and level with pve. I don’t care if i need 1000 hours of grind for pve, but when i am in pvp. I don’t want that some who play pve have an advantage on me because i play wvw only.

Anyway this is a preventive post because accessory have only attributes, but weapon and armor have base damage and defence. If i will meet someone with full ascended than 10% more stats 10% more weapon damage 10% more armor that means 20% better than me that isn’t pvp is equipped versus not equipped.

An other problem of grind is that i have 6 characters at 80, i love to play in wvw with all of them and now anet is blocking me the possibility to do that in a fair mode with others.

@Lexuar. Guild Wars 2 is about 90% PvE content and 10% PvP(WvW and s/tPvP). Realize it’s YOUR choice that you want to focus on only the half of 10% of the game – WvW.

It’s like you chose to mountain biking on a unicycle and are complaining that it’s slower than a mountain bike. Get some perspective.

If gear differences are that big of a concern for you in PvP(since you keep beating that horse) then that’s what s/PvP is for. That’s ANets answer to your complaint. If that answer isn’t good enough for you, then find another game. Come back to GW2 at another time and maybe they’ll have added some s/PvP stuff that appeals more to you.

Vol.5241:

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Just install, log on and BOOM, all your characters are lvl 80 and in full exotics with a legendary of your choice?

Guild Wars 1 did it, at the tradeoff of “YOU CANNOT PVE WITH THIS CHARACTER”. In return, set em up as you like. My brother did that for half his characters :P

Dear Laxuar,

Laxuar.3504:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80

Completing content to progress you character to 80 is not grinding.
You’re actually just playing the game.
Now, if you were forced to do fetch tasks to do so it would be grindy, but you aren’t so this point is invalid.

Laxuar.3504:

20 hours for exotic gear

Exotics come basically free by just completing lvl 70+ maps and selling the rewards.

Laxuar.3504:

30 runs in fractal for ascended rings.

Doing one single fractal run per day for one month (or less, if you don’t want them immediately) isn’t grinding.

Laxuar.3504:

You can do all you prefer to get what you want

That’s not what they said.
They said you can play GW2 in the way you want – and is true.
They did not say you get anything by doing anything.

Laxuar.3504:

Is better have more character for a better experience of play

This sentence doesn’t make any sense so I’m not sure what to tell you.

Laxuar.3504:

Why did you change your philosophy on how this game should be?

They didn’t, you simply misinterpreted completely (if not completely changed sentences) of what they actually said.

Anet never said you create your character and BAM you are lvl 80 with max gear, which is what you’re asking for basically.
Don’t try to make it seem Anet said this because no one would have bothered to buy the game if it was the case.
Nobody plays a game where you’re handed everything up front and have nothing to do thereafter.

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.
• You can do all you prefer to get what you want: I MUST do fractal for ascended ring, I MUST do daily for ascended amlet, I MUST do guild mission for ascended earings, I MUST do PvE for equip (or at least is the better choice). I want to do WvW and PvP, why if i play the 80% of my time in the mist i can’t get something for my charr for wvw? Why i have to do daily fractal to get the ring that i need to be competitive?
• Is better have more character for a better experience of play: You promise it, you said that there are achievements that you must do with different profession, and after you put the lvl of fractal character bound and now you say that the wvw rank will be character bound too.

Why did you change your philosophy on how this game should be?

Go and play some console games that have a start and an end, MMO’s aren’t what you’re looking for.

ravinboy.1698:

I re-watched the manifesto recently. They never say “no grinding”

You are correct. They never explicitly stated that the game would have no grinding in that Manifesto video.

They did, however, claim back in November (after the tremendous backlash of Ascended gear) that they would actively pursue a “zero grind” game.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/13tuac/im_the_studio_design_director_on_guild_wars_2_ama/

I would also like add that we have never said there would be no vertical progression. We do intent to focus on horizontal but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve.

So even though the Manifesto doesn’t make that claim, the developers still did promise a “zero grind” game. So players are right to point out that they’re not living up to that advertisement, though I would say it’s unfair to expect absolutely no grind at all.

But back to the original point: the reason people keep waving around the Manifesto is because of this statement:

“Guild Wars 2 takes everything you love about Guild Wars 1 and puts it into a persistent world.”

One of the things that many people loved about GW1 was its emphasis on horizontal progression and not having to grind for stats. Yet somehow, the devs interpreted that as “everyone loves vertical progression”.

Clearly, something got lost in translation.

BrimstoneAshe.5043:

@Lexuar. Guild Wars 2 is about 90% PvE content and 10% PvP(WvW and s/tPvP). Realize it’s YOUR choice that you want to focus on only the half of 10% of the game – WvW.

It’s like you chose to mountain biking on a unicycle and are complaining that it’s slower than a mountain bike. Get some perspective.

If gear differences are that big of a concern for you in PvP(since you keep beating that horse) then that’s what s/PvP is for. That’s ANets answer to your complaint. If that answer isn’t good enough for you, then find another game. Come back to GW2 at another time and maybe they’ll have added some s/PvP stuff that appeals more to you.

This is the kind of attitude that turns an awesome game like GW2 at launch into a convoluted pile of yak droppings like GW2 today. Your answer to people with other play styles apart from your entitled, time privileged, dungeon treadmill is to stop playing? See how well this game turns out when the type of player who funds the dev team buying cosmetics are playing other games and all you’re left with are tiered stat chasers, enjoy that community.

You can’t understand me cause you didn’t play on GW1: 14hours to get max level and equip.
For me is ok 150 hours for a full equipped character (with no legendary or fantastic weapon armor skin). But not 150+20 days of daily and monthly + 10 weeks of guild missions + 30 fractal + 200g for a back. And i don’t talk about infusions that gives only few stats

Anet says: “we want to make GW2 an E-Sport” That mean hard core farming of fractal lvl over 9000. Yeah you have right this is a 90% pve game for developers.

I just posted this in the Imagine a “Tyria without Ascended gear…” thread, but I think it answers the OPs question on why they have changed their philosphy so ill repost it here too:

Gw1 had it right in terms of gear. A huge selection of stunning armour sets to work towards and a plethora of weird and wonderful looking weapons to match. None of which came with inflated stats. You could work toward standing out visually but you never felt compelled to do so in order to have the highest available stats, something I think most mmo gamers will strive for.

The thing is, Anet know this. People will hang around for months on end to have these measly stat-boosted gimmick items which are carefully gated behind time-locked currencies. And all the time they are playing the game they are potential gem store customers. That’s the bottom line here, money. Gw2 is far more a commercial enterprise than the original. The huge grinds for legendaries, the slow aquisition of currencies for ascended gear, it’s all to keep the cash flowing.

It will work too! Hell it is working, I’m guessing most of us here are still playing the game after all. That’s all time they can tempt us into buying gems for backpacks, gold or whatever other garbage they can push on us. You think it’s a coincidence that they release a time-gated guild mission system the same time they start a month long sale in the gem store? All of this ascended gear, influence, laurels, legendaries stuff is just there to get us to hang around in the shop longer.

. . . you can always blame Nexon if it makes you feel better

It’s not grinding, it’s called game play. If you expect the best of everything with little to no effort what is the point? Grinding is spending months and months and months to get even the most basic of things.
Exotics, ascended etc, need you to play the game to get them and it won’t be an instant gratification deal – it will involve time to play and skill. The thing is though, you don’t need exotics or ascended if you don’t want. You can still play the game perfectly fine without them.
This game is multi-faceted. You can do a great deal of things in it all the while not needing to grind to get there. If you want to grind a dungeon/event/path/whatever, that’s your choice, it’s not compulsory.

Rhaps.8540:

Gw1 had it right in terms of gear. A huge selection of stunning armour sets to work towards and a plethora of weird and wonderful looking weapons to match. None of which came with inflated stats. You could work toward standing out visually but you never felt compelled to do so in order to have the highest available stats, something I think most mmo gamers will strive for.

The thing I think people seem to forget is Guild Wars 1 is a game that is in it’s eighth (8th) year. Sure things look great now in terms of armour etc, but when it first started in 2005 there was no where near the option now available and there was certain nowhere near the level of armor/skin/weapon/classes available. Intially there was very limited options available, it took time for things to grow. By comparing GW2 with GW1 is unfair. Yes, they share the same lore, the same developers and the same publishers, but one game is in it’s 8th year while the other is yet to hit one year. GW2 will grow over time just as GW1 did. Gear, armor, weapons, everything will be expanded on. Patience and understanding are needed instead of the “I want it all and I want it now!” attitude that many on this forum take at the moment.
That’s my opinion on things at least

Looks to me that, months and months later, the community is still strongly divided over this.

I bet everyone would like new content to play, new events, new Living Story stuff, maybe new dungeons, and areas to explore. Everyone would enjoy seeing the world grow and change over time, and having new and fun things to do, as they choose and at their leisure.

I bet not everyone wants to grind gear.

Solution: keep putting lots of that love and creativity that ArenaNet became famous for into this game, and stop adding Ascended pieces. Keep what’s there – people worked for them. Add no more. Just work on making the game the amazing mmo it should have been…

kash.9213:

BrimstoneAshe.5043:

@Lexuar. Guild Wars 2 is about 90% PvE content and 10% PvP(WvW and s/tPvP). Realize it’s YOUR choice that you want to focus on only the half of 10% of the game – WvW.

It’s like you chose to mountain biking on a unicycle and are complaining that it’s slower than a mountain bike. Get some perspective.

If gear differences are that big of a concern for you in PvP(since you keep beating that horse) then that’s what s/PvP is for. That’s ANets answer to your complaint. If that answer isn’t good enough for you, then find another game. Come back to GW2 at another time and maybe they’ll have added some s/PvP stuff that appeals more to you.

This is the kind of attitude that turns an awesome game like GW2 at launch into a convoluted pile of yak droppings like GW2 today. Your answer to people with other play styles apart from your entitled, time privileged, dungeon treadmill is to stop playing? See how well this game turns out when the type of player who funds the dev team buying cosmetics are playing other games and all you’re left with are tiered stat chasers, enjoy that community.

It’s not an attitude. It’s an answer to his problem. I spend all of my time in WvW just like the OP. I’ve died alot in WvW and NEVER once said “I would have won that if I had ascended gear.” If the OP likes PvP, and wants to be on even ground in gear with their opponent but doesnt want to spend time bothering gearing up, A-Net has an answer. It’s called s/PvP. It’s not an attitude — it’s just reality.

WvW isn’t going to adopt the s/PvP model of instant free gear which it sounds like that’s what he wants. It’s not going to happen. So if s/PvP isn’t appealing then there isn’t a fix for his issue. So move on. I understand why people enjoy WvW over s/PvP and vice versa. Maybe they’ll eventually add different s/PvP maps that appeal more to WvWers. That’s more likely to happen before allowing people instant gear for WvW.

To re-iterate the reality of this game — the majority of GW2 content is PvE. I spend all my time playing WvW. But I realize it’s a choice I made and that choice has limitations. But again, I’ve never felt like I needed ascended gear to compete in WvW.

Laxuar.3504:

Anet says: “we want to make GW2 an E-Sport” That mean hard core farming of fractal lvl over 9000. Yeah you have right this is a 90% pve game for developers.

If A-Net ever refers to GW2 being an E-Sport it’s always in context of t/PvP. It’s never been implied with WvW.

Vol.5241:

Laxuar.3504:

Dear Anet Staff

I bought this game because you promise a lot of innovative and intresting things like:

• No Grinding: but now there are 60 hours to get 80, 20 hours for exotic gear, 30 runs in fractal for ascended rings. I don’t know what do you mean with grind but 120 hours to get a full equipped character for me is quite long.

So you want the best gear in the game with zero efforts? 0 hours played?

Straw man. Good try though.

Grind is there, but it’s not necessary…

You ask “why the grind?”
I ask “Why are you grinding?”

Ascended gear is over-rated, and it doesn’t make you a better player.

In all, I don’t like the laurels either. The argument you are making is seriously lacking any sense, but there is point to be made.

Problem is 90% of people complaining about laurels are attacking it as if it was the core of the game, it’s not.
The REAL problem of laurels is that it’s bland content and that was proclaimed to extend the longevity of the game. Three months of events scrapped to stabilize bugs, even out the classes, and add a over-hyped “living story”. This was enough to keep most players playing, but there is a small good sized number of disappointed players growing.

Some would disagree with me, but I feel the content is only going to continue to be watered down to small events being over hyped.
If you disagree and decide to continue to play, GOOD ON YOU.
If you want to cry about laurel grind as if it were important, great find another game and be happy.

I think ANet should be fully aware of the situation at hand, and the route it’s going isn’t good. Only time will tell, Maybe I am wrong… Who knows.

Soulstar.7812:

Grind is there, but it’s not necessary…

You ask “why the grind?”
I ask “Why are you grinding?”

Ascended gear is over-rated, and it doesn’t make you a better player.

In all, I don’t like the laurels either. The argument you are making is seriously lacking any sense, but there is point to be made.

Problem is 90% of people complaining about laurels are attacking it as if it was the core of the game, it’s not.
The REAL problem of laurels is that it’s bland content and that was proclaimed to extend the longevity of the game. Three months of events scrapped to stabilize bugs, even out the classes, and add a over-hyped “living story”. This was enough to keep most players playing, but there is a small good sized number of disappointed players growing.

Some would disagree with me, but I feel the content is only going to continue to be watered down to small events being over hyped.
If you disagree and decide to continue to play, GOOD ON YOU.
If you want to cry about laurel grind as if it were important, great find another game and be happy.

I think ANet should be fully aware of the situation at hand, and the route it’s going isn’t good. Only time will tell, Maybe I am wrong… Who knows.

Blacklight.2871:

Why do you need to have a fully geared character? I mean, aside from making farming faster. I have 11 characters, 5 80s and not one of them is in full exotics yet. Despite this, I’m not prevented from engaging in ANY kind of content or gameplay.

The idea that you have to be fully geared is nothing but an arbitrary goal set by the players themselves. If you want to focus on that to the exclusion of all else, then don’t complain about grinding. No one is forcing you to do it except you. Play the game and everything will eventually take care of itself. If you’re unable to wait for your goodies, don’t blame the game for giving you the opportunity to speed things up by grinding.

Ema.4953:

It’s not grinding, it’s called game play. If you expect the best of everything with little to no effort what is the point? Grinding is spending months and months and months to get even the most basic of things.
Exotics, ascended etc, need you to play the game to get them and it won’t be an instant gratification deal – it will involve time to play and skill. The thing is though, you don’t need exotics or ascended if you don’t want. You can still play the game perfectly fine without them.
This game is multi-faceted. You can do a great deal of things in it all the while not needing to grind to get there. If you want to grind a dungeon/event/path/whatever, that’s your choice, it’s not compulsory.

We have two possible scenarios.

1.) Exotic gear is the best. You can get it through any style of play in a reasonable amount of time.

2.) Ascended gear is the best. You can get it only through specific content, and over a long period of time. Ascended gear is X% better than Exotic.

In scenario 1 everyone wins. In scenario 2, nobody benefits while others are frustrated.

This is one of the main reasons why people don’t want this. Does nothing good, causes only problems.

Alarox.4590:

Soulstar.7812:

Grind is there, but it’s not necessary…

You ask “why the grind?”
I ask “Why are you grinding?”

Ascended gear is over-rated, and it doesn’t make you a better player.

In all, I don’t like the laurels either. The argument you are making is seriously lacking any sense, but there is point to be made.

Problem is 90% of people complaining about laurels are attacking it as if it was the core of the game, it’s not.
The REAL problem of laurels is that it’s bland content and that was proclaimed to extend the longevity of the game. Three months of events scrapped to stabilize bugs, even out the classes, and add a over-hyped “living story”. This was enough to keep most players playing, but there is a small good sized number of disappointed players growing.

Some would disagree with me, but I feel the content is only going to continue to be watered down to small events being over hyped.
If you disagree and decide to continue to play, GOOD ON YOU.
If you want to cry about laurel grind as if it were important, great find another game and be happy.

I think ANet should be fully aware of the situation at hand, and the route it’s going isn’t good. Only time will tell, Maybe I am wrong… Who knows.

Blacklight.2871:

Why do you need to have a fully geared character? I mean, aside from making farming faster. I have 11 characters, 5 80s and not one of them is in full exotics yet. Despite this, I’m not prevented from engaging in ANY kind of content or gameplay.

The idea that you have to be fully geared is nothing but an arbitrary goal set by the players themselves. If you want to focus on that to the exclusion of all else, then don’t complain about grinding. No one is forcing you to do it except you. Play the game and everything will eventually take care of itself. If you’re unable to wait for your goodies, don’t blame the game for giving you the opportunity to speed things up by grinding.

We have two possible scenarios.

1.) Exotic gear is the best. You can get it through any style of play in a reasonable amount of time.

2.) Ascended gear is the best. You can get it only through specific content, and over a long period of time. Ascended gear is X% better than Exotic.

In scenario 1 everyone wins. In scenario 2, nobody benefits while others are frustrated.

This is one of the main reasons why people don’t want this. Does nothing good, causes only problems.

Does nothing good and causes problems, you say…

I’m fine. I don’t have problems.

/yourlogic.

Call it what it really is… Your problem…
and even you can solve it a number of ways.