Guild Wars 2

Visual Aesthetic Rewards.

Seriously, I mean there has got to be people from City of Heroes/Villains, Champions Online and DCUO who understand this reward mechanic for armour and weapons is just a visual aesthetic with standardized numbers (in the case of those games, just skins you get rewarded for).

Heres what I mean, I recently stumbled into a guild chat where someone was complaining about the hard to earn legendary and how its pointless because its got the same stats as exotics.

I tried explaining to them what visual aesthetics was and if you want it go for it, if you don’t want it you can still go make it to sell it.

And before long into the conversation, someone else comes in and says Legendaries have higher stats than exotics, I face palmed at that point and pinged Twilight and an Exotic Greatsword from AC which have the same stats and was called a Troll.

So now being right and having facts backing up your claim makes you a troll.

Its really hard trying to explain to people the way gear works in Gw2 is if you WANT it you can get it, you don’t NEED to get it because it does not has higher numbers, guildwars2 is not a cookie cutting, number crunching, stand and slash game where you get rewarded with leet equipment for wasting your time on, its a game that makes you hone your skills and playstyle

With that said if the expansion adds more levels and higher tier gear I will flip a table

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

im ok with aesthetic rewards but this game lacks aesthetics rewards.

before i get stoned to death again I LOVE this game i have an absurd amount of played time and i will keep playing but we need more aesthetic rewards.

Agreed with OP, some ppl just dont seem to grasp the word “visuals” or or plain out “looks”…

And yeah i also hope expansions wont add more lvl/better stat gear, but just more beautiful looks

It really just sounds like that guild is bad if thats what they define as a troll or can’t get things like that through their heads.

Lets face it, any decently popular MMO, especially one that is purposefully stepping away from many of the norms of the industry, are going to confuse people. Best to inform when possible, ignore when that fails.

Yeah, I’ve run into this too, (some) people simply won’t believe you when you tell them that once they have the exotics they want thats it, linking stuff doesn’t seem to do the trick either

Man I wish this game had a cosmetic tab like DCUO did. That game was the best I ever played, when it comes to character gear customization.

Denial Of Service.5732:

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

im ok with aesthetic rewards but this game lacks aesthetics rewards.

before i get stoned to death again I LOVE this game i have an absurd amount of played time and i will keep playing but we need more aesthetic rewards.

I feel the same way about leather armour, they’re always some trench coat or some assymetrical fashion disaster.
But theres one set of armour i saw that I liked and I got it, I didn’t need it but it got it coz it looks nicest of all.

As far as the weapons go they have more visual aesthetics than armour, but since the short bow the kudzu looks like a unicorn that shoots rainbows I dont need to get it as a long term plan, now if the kudzu had 20+ more numbers then yeah Id be pretty kitten telling me I need a shortbow that looks like a unicorn and shoots rainbows

Corew.8932:

Yeah, I’ve run into this too, (some) people simply won’t believe you when you tell them that once they have the exotics they want thats it, linking stuff doesn’t seem to do the trick either

nope they really wont

Speaking as someone who does a LOT of dungeons.

Weapons are easily more appealing. Just look at HoTW weapons vs armor.

Armor is quite largely a hit or miss. They went so overboard to please the “I hate particle effects” crowd when you go to look at armor it really doesn’t “wow” you.

For example:
AC weapons – They are normal looking at day but glow a “ghostly” aura at night. Hey thats REALLY neat and unique. You can tell that it is from ac and fits the dungeon.

Go look at the armor and look at it at night. No particle effects. Nothing special. The ones that do have neat effects all seem based around fire (SE/CoF). Boo.

Let us have visual set pieces for dungeons only.
For example at night if you have a FULL set of AC armor you turn into a ghostly version of your race.
If you have HoTW gear you begin to freeze over.
CoE you have tech gadgits or a little robot flying above your shoulders.
CM can be a “base design” w/o particles since it is based on human style nobles attire.
TA can have something “naturey” growing on you.

*edit: and if you really hate particle effects then you can simple Xmute a piece and break the set piece stopping all particle/fun effects.

a long grind costing many hours and much silver for repairs should be rewarded. cosmetic skins for gear … not a reward in my opinion. Why sign up for a cost sink and a money sink for gear no better than what you have?

To those who feel their valuable game time is worth cosmetics – more power to you. I see little value.

It is not like it was misrepresented. It was very specifically made clear before release, how the system worked. Based on that premise alone, everyone who complains about it should get a nice electrical charge sent through them when they post the complaint.

I love skins.

skin > stats. I did a lot of stuff in DCUO just for some specific skins, so it’s a nice reward for effort. Still need more skins and variety, especially with medium armor. Too much GW1 ranger style

so is it hard to understand that anet put zero effort into putting in a reasonable variety of stat combination. Hell they managed to screw up the valkire stats something awful.

szar.9054:

so is it hard to understand that anet put zero effort into putting in a reasonable variety of stat combination. Hell they managed to screw up the valkire stats something awful.

Reasonable?
Well these complaints where aired before and Anet responded as to why some stat combinations do and don’t exist at this time. What do you say in response to the reasons they gave about it?

Icecat.4528:

a long grind costing many hours and much silver for repairs should be rewarded. cosmetic skins for gear … not a reward in my opinion. Why sign up for a cost sink and a money sink for gear no better than what you have?

To those who feel their valuable game time is worth cosmetics – more power to you. I see little value.

Oh right so you wish guildwars 2 is like the many other MMORPGs out there who reward players for their timesink?

And have it so they out perform other players not base on their skills but base on their equipment.

Sorry that’s not what guildwars2 is about.

If you want the cosmetic look, you get it because you want it, not because you need it.

If Legendaries were a tier above exotic and does not visually please some people then there would be some issues as they would NEED to get that item as well, gear is COSMETIC, if you WANT it get, if you don’t want it you dont have to get it.
You do not NEED it. what you need is skill based game play.

I honestly am I player that doesn’t care much about color or looks. So dye’s and things that look different but have the same stats, almost worthless. I have to surrender if something looks stupid vs something else that looks majestic, yes I prefer the later. Something with a terrible color palette combo vs a cool one, I’ll take the later to.

But if all look reasonably cool and their palettes were properly balanced. These are the least things I care for in character progression. I do believe I’m in the minority, but I never ever get the love for dye’s and paying for them or paying for armor sets. I’m just as happy out-playing you with a $50 guitar vs your $1500 neck through Jackson. I’m an older gamer, and boringly practical.

Guys, the game is only a couple of months old. Chillax!

We’re yet to hit the first major content patch (which I hear is November). Stuff will get added including new armor sets and weapons. Patience.

what is the point of this thread?

@Rizzy.8293 – your argument is illogical.

1. Dungeons are open to all at the appropriate level, so even if the instance loot had better stats it would be available to all who completed the instance.

2. Yes – reward for time spent is good. I can’t see the fun in running the same dungeon a dozen times for tokens knowing there is no reward at the end.

3. Outperform… see point 1. Also you do realize that anyone who crafts their gear can outperform those who rely on drops and have gear below their level right? Likewise anyone who makes $ can buy gear and outperform those who are poor. This is NOT at all like WOW and pvp purple gear which allowed pve players to outperform as you well know.

4. Skill based game… lol.

5. You want cosmetics – by all means knock yourself out. The hours of grind in an instance, for me, are better spent leveling alts or playing wvwvw.

Denial Of Service.5732:

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

What does your inability to deal with female characters that aren’t half naked, have to do with the topic? They aren’t “irrational haters”, for telling you to stop making gamers look bad.

I’m sorry the OP’s guildmates called her/him a troll.

Is striking that the games referenced were all super-hero genre. I wonder if that’s part of the conflict.

The idea for particle or special-effects on armor… I have a bit of resistance, for two reasons. First, there are a lot of us who want to look good in the sense of handsome or pretty, like a real person could be wearing this outfit. Secondly, we’re already dealing with a game engine that struggles to render even moderate sized group encounters. Looking great in Lion’s Arch is fine, but not when it borks encounters in Tyria or the Mists.

Yeah I don’t know why people have such trouble understanding it. Working for vanity items is nothing new in gaming. Look at the success of TF2 hats. Even in WoW people put a huge amount of time into farming for < 1% drop mounts and raid mounts. They aren’t faster, they just look special and not many people have them.

@mulch.2586 re:The other MMOs: LoTRO that is all.

I agree with both the OP and the guy right under him. People don’t seem to understand the visual/asthetic nature of the armors/weapons. I realize that the legendary weaponry is for the overall look. That’d be why I won’t bother until maybe more are added with different looks. I have no desire to have my ranger running around with a wreath of flowers that shoots rainbows and little gold stars. Some will love that, I don’t particularly, so I’ll find a nice exotic with the stats I want and be happy. shrug

FiachSidhe.3654:

Denial Of Service.5732:

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

What does your inability to deal with female characters that aren’t half naked, have to do with the topic? They aren’t “irrational haters”, for telling you to stop making gamers look bad.

You my friend are one of his “irrational haters”. People have different preferences in gear and that doesn’t give gamers a bad reputation unless you’re crazy and super uptight. It’s fantasy, a video game! This is not real life, I don’t shoot fire out of a Staff and run super fast in my real life. I do however like getting into the visual aspect of any game I play and as a girl, I prefer characters that look pretty. Head to toe covered up with no style at all is not pretty to me. More fashionable looks with feminine styles like dresses and skirts is what I like and lucky me my main is an Ele who gets to wear that stuff.

Honestly one of the reasons I haven’t leveled my Guardian very far is because the heavy armor for females is the ugliest thing I have ever seen. They need more cute/pretty fashionable and feminine styles. More skin is a good start but it doesn’t need to look like chain/plate armor because in real life chain/plate is ugly as sin. Nothing wrong with making it look different for the sake of style – after all the endgame here is all about looks anyway, right?

Icecat.4528:

@Rizzy.8293 – your argument is illogical.

1. Dungeons are open to all at the appropriate level, so even if the instance loot had better stats it would be available to all who completed the instance.

2. Yes – reward for time spent is good. I can’t see the fun in running the same dungeon a dozen times for tokens knowing there is no reward at the end.

3. Outperform… see point 1. Also you do realize that anyone who crafts their gear can outperform those who rely on drops and have gear below their level right? Likewise anyone who makes $ can buy gear and outperform those who are poor. This is NOT at all like WOW and pvp purple gear which allowed pve players to outperform as you well know.

4. Skill based game… lol.

5. You want cosmetics – by all means knock yourself out. The hours of grind in an instance, for me, are better spent leveling alts or playing wvwvw.

The game has a gear plateau, it was intended and widely broadcast that this would be the case. It was always intended that cosmetic gear is something to work towards, not chasing an extra few stats to keep you on the performance edge.

Your argument about players and crafting is irrelevant, leveling up, people will have gear at all sorts of levels, if they choose to keep it up to date they can, it’s not difficult and everyone can do it. At max level once you’ve worked your way to exotics (which don’t give a totally insurmountable edge over people with them, like other MMO’s blues vs purples) you will have the same amount of stats as everyone else, and it’s up to you if you want to make your character look better, if you don’t care about that, it’s your decision, but the game hasn’t made any mistakes by not offering you other wise, as it was a design choice that was made very clear.

And yes skill based game play. I’d rather play sPvP with people all at the same level and be able to out perform somebody based purely on my own skill as a player. If I watch boons/conditions and time my abilities accordingly then I am going to beat somebody who doesn’t and visa versa. In a game with constant time-spent-playing-wins gear progression, unless I keep on the bleeding edge of gear, constantly all the time I will be at an often sever disadvantage regardless of how good or bad I am.

And to end it all, if you want to spend time doing WvWvW do it, I don’t see why you feel the need to bash players who actually enjoy this philosophy of cosmetic rewards.

It’s not the others that don’t understand, it’s the op and his ilk who are the true believers, the same disposed men of faith that pack the pews on sunday with their tired diatribe of righteous belief. Just like the true believers they lack the rationality to understand any criticisms slanted toward thine lord (anet).

At my current playing rate, I will never reach the legendaries but if a person plays ten times than me, I think he/she deserves better stats and being stronger than me.

There should be a challenge that only few can accomplish and rewarded by strength in return. only visuals can’t accomplish that. twilight seems great but not worth the effort if it can’t slice me to half when it hits.

edit: Also there aren’t many cool armors. everyone walk around is the same in the game.

coglin.1496:

Man I wish this game had a cosmetic tab like DCUO did. That game was the best I ever played, when it comes to character gear customization.

Cosmetic tabs are nice. They are also at odds with transmutation stones, which I imagine make revenue for the company.

Transmutation stones work just as well as a single cosmetic tab does (I liked that in Rift you could have a bunch of them), and serves as a gold-sink.

There’s a lot of neat looks but a lot is locked in with the mystic forge. The challenges for “prestige cosmetics” are not really anything more than a grind fest; and ultimately subject to the player.

Even GW1 had gear that not everyone could get, yet wasn’t any better than what most folks could get. That doesn’t exist in this game. The main deterrent in getting or not getting something is not for lack of skill but rather time you’re willing to commit. I like the GW idea that the entry fee for trying is uniform, but it’s rather un-GW like to say the prestige is farming over skill (at least in PvE)

I liked the armor system of GW1. You got the looks and were free to mod the way you wanted on demand. In GW2, the preset stats make the armor system more static. You have to get multiple version of them and transmute to make sets for mix-n-match looks and stats. I think Gem Store played a major role in this decision of putting stats on armors.

I’m ok with cosmetic rewards as they are, but they don’t exactly offer much incentive to play. I mean, once my guardian gets his TA set, he’s effectively done with PvE in the game because that’s really the only heavy set I like.

Leiloni.7951:

FiachSidhe.3654:

Denial Of Service.5732:

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

What does your inability to deal with female characters that aren’t half naked, have to do with the topic? They aren’t “irrational haters”, for telling you to stop making gamers look bad.

You my friend are one of his “irrational haters”. People have different preferences in gear and that doesn’t give gamers a bad reputation unless you’re crazy and super uptight. It’s fantasy, a video game! This is not real life, I don’t shoot fire out of a Staff and run super fast in my real life. I do however like getting into the visual aspect of any game I play and as a girl, I prefer characters that look pretty. Head to toe covered up with no style at all is not pretty to me. More fashionable looks with feminine styles like dresses and skirts is what I like and lucky me my main is an Ele who gets to wear that stuff.

Honestly one of the reasons I haven’t leveled my Guardian very far is because the heavy armor for females is the ugliest thing I have ever seen. They need more cute/pretty fashionable and feminine styles. More skin is a good start but it doesn’t need to look like chain/plate armor because in real life chain/plate is ugly as sin. Nothing wrong with making it look different for the sake of style – after all the endgame here is all about looks anyway, right?

and you, my friend, sound like one of those TERA players signing petitions to put the Elin characters back in panties, or posting on GameFAQS about how hot the chicks from Borderlands are.

More skin isn’t a “good start”. You want that lame kitten pandering kitten go play TERA. I’m not irrational, irrational is not playing a character because there isn’t enough of your midriff showing.

The rest of your babbling doesn’t even make sense, chain and plate doesn’t look good on skin?!? What??!?

Someone who calls you on being a stereotypical gamer, nerd boy who needs stereotypical skimpy armor, isn’t irrational.

Because it’s not well implemented? I mean if PvE had something like the PvP locker things would be a lot more interesting.

But we haven’t.

And instead of collecting visually different pieces we have to use the clunky fine transmutation stones, which to add insult to injury, are always needed when you’re 80, so what should I do with all the basic ones?

Furthermore you can only get fine transmutation stones in the cash shop.

I wanted to like the concept of collecting gear but with the current implementation. No thank you.

Cosmetic rewards are indeed the main ‘rewards’ you can chase in this game.
But I do feel like the system is lacking on many fronts:

1. lack of diversity. Simply too much of the same, and too litle variations.

2. pvp gear looks good in Heart of the Mists… that’s it.
In pvp too the sole reward is looks on gear. But in battles it’s smudged with blue or red paint and you can’t make anything out aside the hats.
to make it worse: you can’t take your earned looks back to pve with you (not the stats, just the looks…).
Even if you log out in Mists, the character screens shows your pve gear.

You simply only chase gear in pvp, to stand in the Mists with it. That is so disapointing in terms of ‘cosmetic rewards’.

3. As it happens the main incentive, these looks on gear, are also the major money sink, and even a ‘real money’ sink.

It’s odd that a game that set out to be a non-grinding MMO, actually ended up being one big and long grind for gear that looks slightly different, but still the same as what the next one is wearing.

‘Visual aestethic rewards’ is a wonderfull concept.
But the implementation in the game makes it rather boring for me.
Too much the same, too long of a grind for most.

Icecat.4528:

a long grind costing many hours and much silver for repairs should be rewarded. cosmetic skins for gear … not a reward in my opinion. Why sign up for a cost sink and a money sink for gear no better than what you have?

To those who feel their valuable game time is worth cosmetics – more power to you. I see little value.

Are you the same with other forms of entertainment?

Do you refuse to go the the cinema unless they give you a load of free kitten?

What about going to a gig to see a band, do you only go when you know you will gain something more then enjoyment & entertainment?

FiachSidhe.3654:

Leiloni.7951:

FiachSidhe.3654:

Denial Of Service.5732:

perhaps because every medium set looks like the same, heavy armor sets are all bulky and when someone says (myself) we could have another couple of skimpy ones i get stoned to death by irrational haters, where only light sets (for females) looks good and i struggled to get one that looked decent and manly (for my mesmer).

What does your inability to deal with female characters that aren’t half naked, have to do with the topic? They aren’t “irrational haters”, for telling you to stop making gamers look bad.

You my friend are one of his “irrational haters”. People have different preferences in gear and that doesn’t give gamers a bad reputation unless you’re crazy and super uptight. It’s fantasy, a video game! This is not real life, I don’t shoot fire out of a Staff and run super fast in my real life. I do however like getting into the visual aspect of any game I play and as a girl, I prefer characters that look pretty. Head to toe covered up with no style at all is not pretty to me. More fashionable looks with feminine styles like dresses and skirts is what I like and lucky me my main is an Ele who gets to wear that stuff.

Honestly one of the reasons I haven’t leveled my Guardian very far is because the heavy armor for females is the ugliest thing I have ever seen. They need more cute/pretty fashionable and feminine styles. More skin is a good start but it doesn’t need to look like chain/plate armor because in real life chain/plate is ugly as sin. Nothing wrong with making it look different for the sake of style – after all the endgame here is all about looks anyway, right?

and you, my friend, sound like one of those TERA players signing petitions to put the Elin characters back in panties, or posting on GameFAQS about how hot the chicks from Borderlands are.

More skin isn’t a “good start”. You want that lame kitten pandering kitten go play TERA. I’m not irrational, irrational is not playing a character because there isn’t enough of your midriff showing.

The rest of your babbling doesn’t even make sense, chain and plate doesn’t look good on skin?!? What??!?

Someone who calls you on being a stereotypical gamer, nerd boy who needs stereotypical skimpy armor, isn’t irrational.

I have respect for designing the female armor is this game because it doesn’t sexualize them and retains the meaning of protection and heavy armor. There are still aessthetic differences between females and males but they all look good and practical for being called heavy armor. Leather armor theres a few more revealing outfits you can say. Skimpy cloth doesn’t really matter since its cloth and adding more cloth doesn’t help stop a giant two-handed sword. I was walking around and saw a female character in some IMPRESSIVE looking combination of armor and commented on the incredible look and gained myself a friend. “Now that’s a female knight”

Also yes, this is fantasy, not real life, but it is Anet’s fantasy and this is how Anet views female warriors

People need to stop acting like the world will end if we see some digital skin…

A couple dudes in some guild you were in doesn’t represent everyone.

Pants.8315:

Icecat.4528:

@Rizzy.8293 – your argument is illogical.

1. Dungeons are open to all at the appropriate level, so even if the instance loot had better stats it would be available to all who completed the instance.

2. Yes – reward for time spent is good. I can’t see the fun in running the same dungeon a dozen times for tokens knowing there is no reward at the end.

3. Outperform… see point 1. Also you do realize that anyone who crafts their gear can outperform those who rely on drops and have gear below their level right? Likewise anyone who makes $ can buy gear and outperform those who are poor. This is NOT at all like WOW and pvp purple gear which allowed pve players to outperform as you well know.

4. Skill based game… lol.

5. You want cosmetics – by all means knock yourself out. The hours of grind in an instance, for me, are better spent leveling alts or playing wvwvw.

The game has a gear plateau, it was intended and widely broadcast that this would be the case. It was always intended that cosmetic gear is something to work towards, not chasing an extra few stats to keep you on the performance edge.

Your argument about players and crafting is irrelevant, leveling up, people will have gear at all sorts of levels, if they choose to keep it up to date they can, it’s not difficult and everyone can do it. At max level once you’ve worked your way to exotics (which don’t give a totally insurmountable edge over people with them, like other MMO’s blues vs purples) you will have the same amount of stats as everyone else, and it’s up to you if you want to make your character look better, if you don’t care about that, it’s your decision, but the game hasn’t made any mistakes by not offering you other wise, as it was a design choice that was made very clear.

And yes skill based game play. I’d rather play sPvP with people all at the same level and be able to out perform somebody based purely on my own skill as a player. If I watch boons/conditions and time my abilities accordingly then I am going to beat somebody who doesn’t and visa versa. In a game with constant time-spent-playing-wins gear progression, unless I keep on the bleeding edge of gear, constantly all the time I will be at an often sever disadvantage regardless of how good or bad I am.

And to end it all, if you want to spend time doing WvWvW do it, I don’t see why you feel the need to bash players who actually enjoy this philosophy of cosmetic rewards.

+1

TrickSmartly.7391:

It’s not the others that don’t understand, it’s the op and his ilk who are the true believers, the same disposed men of faith that pack the pews on sunday with their tired diatribe of righteous belief. Just like the true believers they lack the rationality to understand any criticisms slanted toward thine lord (anet).

HAH! This is laughable.
I’m no Anet fanboy son
Trust me theres a lot of wrong in this game, but this one aspect the game did right.

Arsenal.2601:

coglin.1496:

Man I wish this game had a cosmetic tab like DCUO did. That game was the best I ever played, when it comes to character gear customization.

Cosmetic tabs are nice. They are also at odds with transmutation stones, which I imagine make revenue for the company.

The thing is Cosmetic tab system can be monetized as well, like say you start with on tab but you can buy others plus you still have the costumes that are sold via the store which now are more attractive to some people now that they can wear them in combat. This is similar how LoTRo does it.

“So now being right and having facts backing up your claim makes you a troll.”
Now you know how Romney feels.

Anyway…
Yeah you’re dead on right about this, pity so many cannot fathom the idea.

The irony is that non cosmetic gear progression exists in this game. It would be one thing if all the gear progression was texture pimping from the get go but even the developers of this game can recognize the value of meaningful gear progression beyond textures.

coglin.1496:

Man I wish this game had a cosmetic tab like DCUO did. That game was the best I ever played, when it comes to character gear customization.

Did you ever try City of Heros? I think it had the most extensive costume customization of any MMO in existence. You could make yourself a robot, a minotaur, a little girl, a large man with duck feet, a flaming demon with horns dripping “blood”. . . And none of it related at all to your abilities/gear in game, so you could match any character concept you liked. The only time in that game I ever saw even similar costumes was when people developed a coordinated look for a group.

Since it is shutting down and I think GW2 is hiring, perhaps they will get some graphics folks from that. It would be nice if some other legendary gear had the same impressive effects as the Greatswords seem to.