Guild Wars 2

I figured the new world boss would be a mega-boss type scenario, unfortunately its not. I don’t understand why we can’t have organized group level difficulty. Anet has designed the perfect system for this with the multiple-tier event system that can cater to casual and hardcore alike.

A good example of the perfectly designed event was Escape from Lions arch. It has like 5 difficulties of tier completion. Lower to mid were for pugs and it was fine, then there was a high 1500 citizens saved(or 1200) which needed an organized group usually, and that was perfect for guilds.

I don’t see why this wasn’t done with silverwastes or dry top. All that really needs to be done is adding another tier that is the hardcore tier. I think thats actually a more efficient way of designing hardcore content, because its so easy to do. You could make any event have a hardcore level difficulty, if naturally it has a tier system to it.

Alienates players that are not good at coordination or playing the game.

They did the tier thing for Dry Top and many players complained about it. It wasn’t “casual” enough.

Ayrilana.1396:

Alienates players that are not good at coordination or playing the game.

They did the tier thing for Dry Top and many players complained about it. It wasn’t “casual” enough.

Wow that’s a wild misinterpretation. The problem is that most people can’t easily control what server you get on, and you’re at the mercy of the server.

isnt that is not hard , the problem is that you have been doing the same things for almost 3 years , i think is time to move to another game and dont ask for kitten

Windsagio.1340:

Ayrilana.1396:

Alienates players that are not good at coordination or playing the game.

They did the tier thing for Dry Top and many players complained about it. It wasn’t “casual” enough.

Wow that’s a wild misinterpretation. The problem is that most people can’t easily control what server you get on, and you’re at the mercy of the server.

Read his post again. Many players complained about Dry Top thinking it needed an organized guild when it really didn’t. All they needed was a little coordination.

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

if dry tops need coordination then the map is build wrong, the worst thing you can have in an MMO is the roller coaster effect and that’s exactly what GW2 has plenty of.

Megaservers add a level of difficulty all by themselves. Now try it when you can’t communicate with a large number of the players on the server because they don’t/wont/can’t speak your language.

I already dislike this new boss event as much as I disliked the marionette boss.

I’m done this story. I don’t see myself going back to Silverwaste any time soon.

Jerus.4350:

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

you’re overthinking it. im asking for more difficult open world event tiers, so yes coordination is one part of it, as is individual skill.

sorudo.9054:

if dry tops need coordination then the map is build wrong, the worst thing you can have in an MMO is the roller coaster effect and that’s exactly what GW2 has plenty of.

thats not what i said. keep the tiers that are already there, just add additional ones that can be done by higher organized groups.

how about making a mega boss without fixed,predictable animations.
things like jormag,shatterer,tequatl.

Why not make a huge powerfull boss such as tequatl, and turn it into a legendary mob.

the one that can move freely around the map, target freely players , go full zerker on US the players and just wreck everything in his path with a tail swipe.

no more siting under his feet and full dps 1111, no more siting comfy at turrets.

if you wanna dps it you gotta run after it and catch it, set up long range siedges that can get destroyed if they attract the mobs attention too much, set up large snare traps to slow it down so we can dps it harder idk..think of something.

“Marionette”

All I’ve got to say.
I want it back!! <3

Jerus.4350:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Jerus.4350:

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

you’re overthinking it. im asking for more difficult open world event tiers, so yes coordination is one part of it, as is individual skill.

Not overthinking it, just simply saying that I think you used the wrong term as these cooperative events only require a minimal amount of personal effort if everyone understands the basics of what they as a whole need to get done. If people understood to split up so all events were covered in dry top, it was simple. Same can be said for every one of these types of events. CP is probably the only one I’d say is an exception to that, it took an average level of competency from at least most of the people in the area to secure gold in a timely manner consistently.

Point still being though. Requirements of cooperation does not make something difficult, requiring individuals to have a higher level of skill than is normal is what creates difficulty. That’s something we haven’t seen in quite some time.

I only post because I do want difficult content. Cooperative content isn’t really my cup of tea, so I think the distinction is important.

So essentually by difficult you mean Liadri and to a lesser extent Marionette?

Ayrilana.1396:

Jerus.4350:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Jerus.4350:

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

you’re overthinking it. im asking for more difficult open world event tiers, so yes coordination is one part of it, as is individual skill.

Not overthinking it, just simply saying that I think you used the wrong term as these cooperative events only require a minimal amount of personal effort if everyone understands the basics of what they as a whole need to get done. If people understood to split up so all events were covered in dry top, it was simple. Same can be said for every one of these types of events. CP is probably the only one I’d say is an exception to that, it took an average level of competency from at least most of the people in the area to secure gold in a timely manner consistently.

Point still being though. Requirements of cooperation does not make something difficult, requiring individuals to have a higher level of skill than is normal is what creates difficulty. That’s something we haven’t seen in quite some time.

I only post because I do want difficult content. Cooperative content isn’t really my cup of tea, so I think the distinction is important.

So essentually by difficult you mean Liadri and to a lesser extent Marionette?

Bah, I wanted to rephrase what I wrote (why it’s deleted) but ohh well.

Yes, difficult implies that it takes an above average level of competency to complete.

Events that take organization only really require one personal has a plan, and that everyone else can at least somewhat follow instructions. I mean I guess if you consider being able to follow the instruction “Go to X and do the event there” an above average level of competency, well… yeah… I’ll just have to shake my head and disagree.

Liadri would surely count as one of those. Marionette I have to say I never did Heard good things.

Jerus.4350:

Ayrilana.1396:

Jerus.4350:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Jerus.4350:

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

you’re overthinking it. im asking for more difficult open world event tiers, so yes coordination is one part of it, as is individual skill.

Not overthinking it, just simply saying that I think you used the wrong term as these cooperative events only require a minimal amount of personal effort if everyone understands the basics of what they as a whole need to get done. If people understood to split up so all events were covered in dry top, it was simple. Same can be said for every one of these types of events. CP is probably the only one I’d say is an exception to that, it took an average level of competency from at least most of the people in the area to secure gold in a timely manner consistently.

Point still being though. Requirements of cooperation does not make something difficult, requiring individuals to have a higher level of skill than is normal is what creates difficulty. That’s something we haven’t seen in quite some time.

I only post because I do want difficult content. Cooperative content isn’t really my cup of tea, so I think the distinction is important.

So essentually by difficult you mean Liadri and to a lesser extent Marionette?

Bah, I wanted to rephrase what I wrote (why it’s deleted) but ohh well.

Yes, difficult implies that it takes an above average level of competency to complete.

Events that take organization only really require one personal has a plan, and that everyone else can at least somewhat follow instructions. I mean I guess if you consider being able to follow the instruction “Go to X and do the event there” an above average level of competency, well… yeah… I’ll just have to shake my head and disagree.

Liadri would surely count as one of those. Marionette I have to say I never did Heard good things.

How would you personally categorize Teq and Triple Wurm? Both of which the difficulty relies on organization/coordination than personal skill.

“Why cant we have difficult content?”
Because they keep putting it in the open world.

- If it requires too many players to play well, then the failings of a few can ruin it for everyone else (see Marionette).
- If it requires only a few players to play well to succeed, then most people don’t have to care and can even be carried. So it wasn’t really all that hard.
- If the rewards for reaching the hard tier are too good, then the hardcore players can become toxic against anyone perceived as not pulling their weight or causing failures – such as casual players just wanting to play the zone normally.
- If the rewards aren’t good enough, then hardly anyone will bother even trying.

Sure, if the game allowed easy separation between the people aiming for hard tier and people who don’t really care, then it might work out. But with random megaservers and all that’s a pain.

And yet, if they just tried this with instanced content, it would be so much easier on everyone. Players would have the choice of how hard they want to aim for and could group themselves accordingly. I think Fractals works reasonably well at this, and even vaguely similar models could be applied just as well.

Ayrilana.1396:

Jerus.4350:

Ayrilana.1396:

Jerus.4350:

SkylightMoon.1980:

Jerus.4350:

It seems you’re trying to link “difficult” with “cooperative”. I don’t feel that’s right. I’d love more Difficult content, things that actually make the individual play to a high level. More Cooperative content could be cool too, but with that you have the frustrations of trying to get your whole team onto the same map and trying to deal with griefers and general mouthbreathers scaling events while contributing nothing. I can’t say I’m a huge fan of the cooperative play in this game, Especially after the megaservers were added in.

you’re overthinking it. im asking for more difficult open world event tiers, so yes coordination is one part of it, as is individual skill.

Not overthinking it, just simply saying that I think you used the wrong term as these cooperative events only require a minimal amount of personal effort if everyone understands the basics of what they as a whole need to get done. If people understood to split up so all events were covered in dry top, it was simple. Same can be said for every one of these types of events. CP is probably the only one I’d say is an exception to that, it took an average level of competency from at least most of the people in the area to secure gold in a timely manner consistently.

Point still being though. Requirements of cooperation does not make something difficult, requiring individuals to have a higher level of skill than is normal is what creates difficulty. That’s something we haven’t seen in quite some time.

I only post because I do want difficult content. Cooperative content isn’t really my cup of tea, so I think the distinction is important.

So essentually by difficult you mean Liadri and to a lesser extent Marionette?

Bah, I wanted to rephrase what I wrote (why it’s deleted) but ohh well.

Yes, difficult implies that it takes an above average level of competency to complete.

Events that take organization only really require one personal has a plan, and that everyone else can at least somewhat follow instructions. I mean I guess if you consider being able to follow the instruction “Go to X and do the event there” an above average level of competency, well… yeah… I’ll just have to shake my head and disagree.

Liadri would surely count as one of those. Marionette I have to say I never did Heard good things.

How would you personally categorize Teq and Triple Wurm? Both of which the difficulty relies on organization/coordination than personal skill.

Both the same way as Dry Top honestly. Both take very little individual effort. I think I see your point though, at least Wurm gets a lot easier if a few people are able to do things like use reflects on the wurm.

The problem with these types of events though lies heavily with the shear amount of people allowed to take part. When fighting the decapitated wurm heads, there are things you need to dodge… don’t? ohh well, someone will pick you up because there’s enough poeple there to do that easily and quickly. It takes most of the individual difficulty out when you have that level of safety net available.

I like some of the stuff one of my old games did to counter that safety net. Things like having people spawn extra nasty adds when they died, or even exploding if they failed to execute properly. They even went as far as having entire events fail because one person screwed up, not sure it should be taken that far, but some counter to that safety net would surely make things more interesting.

I don’t see that happening though, ANet doesn’t seem interested in adding difficulty. They don’t want to to have the less skilled players feel that they are as incompetent as they are at playing the game. Of course I’ll just come off as a grumpy old man type attitude but it’s just a sad state when the potential for this game to have some truly amazing content is squashed by the fact that most people would complain because they feel entitled to be able to beat anything and everything regardless of the effort they put forth.

This game is catered to the lowest common denominator. There are far more casual players than hardcore ones.

Probably because contrary to all the hooting and hollering for more difficult content, very few players actually do it when they give it to us (Liadri, TA Aetherpath, etc.)

Why have hard large-scale content when hard small scale content would suffice?

I’d agree with Sir black, except they should keep hard content small.

Heavy coordination and heavy difficulty are an inherently destructive combination, and it’s totally unnecessary.

The gain of difficulty can be done plenty well in solo or single-group content. This will give the chance to excel and compete without putting even more resources into content for an even smaller subset of the community.

Karizee.8076:

Probably because contrary to all the hooting and hollering for more difficult content, very few players actually do it when they give it to us (Liadri, TA Aetherpath, etc.)

I’ve never heard of people intentionally doing the fractals with the hardest instabilities either

Karizee.8076:

Probably because contrary to all the hooting and hollering for more difficult content, very few players actually do it when they give it to us (Liadri, TA Aetherpath, etc.)

Aetherpath is a gimmick filled path that simply doesn’t make me want to go back to it. Unlike say something like soloing Arah paths which is something I actively work at. There’s a big difference between a gimmick and difficult content. Liadri on the other hand would count, and I did see people banging their heads on her at all hours of the day for quite a while when that event happened, it wasn’t until at least half way through that time period that it seemed to die off and everyone was simply farming their tickets with whatever they found the fastest opponent.

The mordrem are fairly difficult. That defense of the Camp was a nightmare if you weren’t one of the people who immediately subscribe to maximum damage output for the sake of the game. The boss, on the other hand, wasn’t difficult but it required more strategy.

Windsagio.1340:

Karizee.8076:

Probably because contrary to all the hooting and hollering for more difficult content, very few players actually do it when they give it to us (Liadri, TA Aetherpath, etc.)

I’ve never heard of people intentionally doing the fractals with the hardest instabilities either

Indeed. There’s also very few guilds that attempt Triple Headed Wurm.

To go meta, I think more than difficulty, people want a way to compete and excel.

They want to do content that others can’t do or be recognized for doing it in a manner that others can’t. This is very different than sheer difficulty.

I feel like speed or efficiency bonuses would be a better way to give people what they actually want than just making the encounters inaccessible.

Because you are at the mercy of what server/overflow you are in.

Windsagio.1340:

To go meta, I think more than difficulty, people want a way to compete and excel.

They want to do content that others can’t do or be recognized for doing it in a manner that others can’t. This is very different than sheer difficulty.

I feel like speed or efficiency bonuses would be a better way to give people what they actually want than just making the encounters inaccessible.

I’ve never really minded talent achieving more. In GW1, speedclears were much more profitable than playing on the down low, yet if you wanted to be an imbagon with KWay because you thought it was fun, nothing was actually standing in your way of completing said content.

In GW2 however it’s becoming a bit of a different story. You can’t really go with sword/shield warrior in PvE, staff mesmer, etc. because by doing so you’re signing away your ability to just complete content, nevermind be profitable.

The core concepts of this game are flaky and pretty rubbish.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Because you are at the mercy of what server/overflow you are in.

Yep. That’s already annoying enough and causes enough fracturing on its own.

Cuddy.6247:

Windsagio.1340:

To go meta, I think more than difficulty, people want a way to compete and excel.

They want to do content that others can’t do or be recognized for doing it in a manner that others can’t. This is very different than sheer difficulty.

I feel like speed or efficiency bonuses would be a better way to give people what they actually want than just making the encounters inaccessible.

I’ve never really minded talent achieving more. In GW1, speedclears were much more profitable than playing on the down low, yet if you wanted to be an imbagon with KWay because you thought it was fun, nothing was actually standing in your way of completing said content.

In GW2 however it’s becoming a bit of a different story. You can’t really go with sword/shield warrior in PvE, staff mesmer, etc. because by doing so you’re signing away your ability to just complete content, nevermind be profitable.

The core concepts of this game are flaky and pretty rubbish.

Bolded section is ludicrously untrue. Almost all pve content can be easily completed with far off builds, that’s part of the complaint people have.

Sir Black.7423:

“Why cant we have difficult content?”
Because they keep putting it in the open world.

- If it requires too many players to play well, then the failings of a few can ruin it for everyone else (see Marionette).
- If it requires only a few players to play well to succeed, then most people don’t have to care and can even be carried. So it wasn’t really all that hard.
- If the rewards for reaching the hard tier are too good, then the hardcore players can become toxic against anyone perceived as not pulling their weight or causing failures – such as casual players just wanting to play the zone normally.
- If the rewards aren’t good enough, then hardly anyone will bother even trying.

Sure, if the game allowed easy separation between the people aiming for hard tier and people who don’t really care, then it might work out. But with random megaservers and all that’s a pain.

And yet, if they just tried this with instanced content, it would be so much easier on everyone. Players would have the choice of how hard they want to aim for and could group themselves accordingly. I think Fractals works reasonably well at this, and even vaguely similar models could be applied just as well.

But we have difficult content in the open world. Id be satisfied if the wurm was the most difficult open world content ever got, teq as well. We just didnt get any of that for season 2.

The mordrem were a lot more deadly when dry top launched but then they nerfed them because ppl were dying too easily.

The Moar-Harder crowd is very tiny and making content for them is not a sound investment when one has to try to entertain a far larger audience that is far more typically populated by players that cannot complete AC storymode reliably than by people that can solo Arah P.3.

I go so often to the triple wurm event. I love that event. I love how when it goes right, its such a beautiful exercise in coordinating multiple teams.

But it rather infrequently goes right. Rarely do enough people show up for it except once or maybe twice a day (at best), and even if many do, too many don’t even seem to have map chat on to be aware that anyone’s trying to organize tactics, if anyone’s even trying to at all.

I see Teq succeed rather more often because its essentially a very simple hokey-pokey dance that merely require a lot of people doing something useful to get it done decently. Even still, its not unusual to see a turret or two go down, or for there to be more than enough people to git’r’done and the event fails anyway because too many were hanging around being dead rather than respawning and zooming back, etcetera, so forth.

People routinely fail what is, in actuality, content that is only difficult because of the coordination it attempts to require. Compared to MY idea of difficult, neither triple wurm nor teq are hard – getting enough people that know where buttons other than 1 are to do the right things at the right time is.

Coordination, in other words.

God help us all if they make truly elaborate requirements for coordination further than they already have.

naiasonod.9265:

The Moar-Harder crowd is very tiny and making content for them is not a sound investment when one has to try to entertain a far larger audience that is far more typically populated by players that cannot complete AC storymode reliably than by people that can solo Arah P.3.

I go so often to the triple wurm event. I love that event. I love how when it goes right, its such a beautiful exercise in coordinating multiple teams.

But it rather infrequently goes right. Rarely do enough people show up for it except once or maybe twice a day (at best), and even if many do, too many don’t even seem to have map chat on to be aware that anyone’s trying to organize tactics, if anyone’s even trying to at all.

I see Teq succeed rather more often because its essentially a very simple hokey-pokey dance that merely require a lot of people doing something useful to get it done decently. Even still, its not unusual to see a turret or two go down, or for there to be more than enough people to git’r’done and the event fails anyway because too many were hanging around being dead rather than respawning and zooming back, etcetera, so forth.

People routinely fail what is, in actuality, content that is only difficult because of the coordination it attempts to require. Compared to MY idea of difficult, neither triple wurm nor teq are hard – getting enough people that know where buttons other than 1 are to do the right things at the right time is.

Coordination, in other words.

God help us all if they make truly elaborate requirements for coordination further than they already have.

i hear this often but i feel it isnt true. i mean we don’t have statistics for it so i can’t say how big the crowd is that wants harder content. there was a massive poll done on the gw2 reddit a while ago with some several thousand participants, maybe that says something. but from my experience, i feel that the vast majority of people i meet in game do enjoy working for events like teq and the wurm, and would enjoy harder content in game.

SkylightMoon.1980:

i hear this often but i feel it isnt true. i mean we don’t have statistics for it so i can’t say how big the crowd is that wants harder content. there was a massive poll done on the gw2 reddit a while ago with some several thousand participants, maybe that says something. but from my experience, i feel that the vast majority of people i meet in game do enjoy working for events like teq and the wurm, and would enjoy harder content in game.

Without data, I can only go from personal experience, yeah. I wouldn’t hold my opinions up like they’re the magical triforce of TruFax accordingly, though I don’t really see the same.

I do see a lot of tendency for the people I often wind up playing these games with (as opposed to monkeying around RPing with, as they’re rarely the same people) do the hard things however many times it takes to get whatever cheevos and shinies there are, then never bother again. The challenge might have been an ‘Oh, cool’ thing until it was overcome, but the only thing that tends to really matter is the rewards.

Challenging content with no meaningful rewards? I’d win a lot of bets that that would be some extremely under-utilized and seldom-frequented content right there. The tumbleweeds would be rolling eternally.

I do see a lot of people do an awful lot of chestbeating in public forums for no greater reason than I can intuit than that they don’t want to admit, before the proverbial god and everybody, that they’re not good at things.

What I see certainly isn’t all there is to see, no bones about it. Yet I do not suspect its irrelevant or even particularly marginal either. I see an awful lot of very predictable human nature going on, is the sum of it.

Human nature doesn’t need me to observe it for me to feel reasonably safe in expecting that it isn’t doing magically different things where I can’t see compared to where I can.

It all lends me the suspicion that my input isn’t garbage, at the very least.

Answer : Because difficult doesn’t equal fun. And usually, difficult equals cheap gimmicks that just annoy/frustrate players.

Nilkemia.8507:

Answer : Because difficult doesn’t equal fun. And usually, difficult equals cheap gimmicks that just annoy/frustrate players.

i dont think thats true either. i mean, i thought doing the wurm and teq were fun. its awful when its pugged and no one listens or cooperates because thats what the events require(at least the wurm does nowadays). but when we worked together and completed it, it felt really good.

Windsagio.1340:

Cuddy.6247:

Windsagio.1340:

To go meta, I think more than difficulty, people want a way to compete and excel.

They want to do content that others can’t do or be recognized for doing it in a manner that others can’t. This is very different than sheer difficulty.

I feel like speed or efficiency bonuses would be a better way to give people what they actually want than just making the encounters inaccessible.

I’ve never really minded talent achieving more. In GW1, speedclears were much more profitable than playing on the down low, yet if you wanted to be an imbagon with KWay because you thought it was fun, nothing was actually standing in your way of completing said content.

In GW2 however it’s becoming a bit of a different story. You can’t really go with sword/shield warrior in PvE, staff mesmer, etc. because by doing so you’re signing away your ability to just complete content, nevermind be profitable.

The core concepts of this game are flaky and pretty rubbish.

Bolded section is ludicrously untrue. Almost all pve content can be easily completed with far off builds, that’s part of the complaint people have.

New stuff certainly can’t. Your lack of reading comprehension is showing.

difficult content requires noteworthy rewards to match or it will quickly become ignored. Those rewards would exclude GW2´s key audience. Forum apocalypse and unhappy customers. Computer games have to be autowin these days to be succesful on a major scale. Anet knows that very well.

One reason: Casuals that love farming. Spamming pewpew is a relief it seems.

Valento.9852:

One reason: Casuals that love farming. Spamming pewpew is a relief it seems.

It is kind’ve stress relieving, you know? I wouldn’t go so far as to say cathartic, but sometimes, I come home from work and I’m stressed as all kitten, but after an hour or two of going around mindlessly killing the crap out of things, sometimes I really do feel much better.

Is that a poor thing, do you suppose?

naiasonod.9265:

Valento.9852:

One reason: Casuals that love farming. Spamming pewpew is a relief it seems.

It is kind’ve stress relieving, you know? I wouldn’t go so far as to say cathartic, but sometimes, I come home from work and I’m stressed as all kitten, but after an hour or two of going around mindlessly killing the crap out of things, sometimes I really do feel much better.

Is that a poor thing, do you suppose?

No. Absolutely not. By all means, pewpew all night long if you wish. But let other people who enjoy actual hard content to have theirs, as there’s already so much for casuals. 2% of the game makes use of some organization/coordination (and Triple Trouble/fractals are still work-in-progress in terms of difficulty).

SkylightMoon.1980:

naiasonod.9265:

The Moar-Harder crowd is very tiny and making content for them is not a sound investment when one has to try to entertain a far larger audience that is far more typically populated by players that cannot complete AC storymode reliably than by people that can solo Arah P.3.

I go so often to the triple wurm event. I love that event. I love how when it goes right, its such a beautiful exercise in coordinating multiple teams.

But it rather infrequently goes right. Rarely do enough people show up for it except once or maybe twice a day (at best), and even if many do, too many don’t even seem to have map chat on to be aware that anyone’s trying to organize tactics, if anyone’s even trying to at all.

I see Teq succeed rather more often because its essentially a very simple hokey-pokey dance that merely require a lot of people doing something useful to get it done decently. Even still, its not unusual to see a turret or two go down, or for there to be more than enough people to git’r’done and the event fails anyway because too many were hanging around being dead rather than respawning and zooming back, etcetera, so forth.

People routinely fail what is, in actuality, content that is only difficult because of the coordination it attempts to require. Compared to MY idea of difficult, neither triple wurm nor teq are hard – getting enough people that know where buttons other than 1 are to do the right things at the right time is.

Coordination, in other words.

God help us all if they make truly elaborate requirements for coordination further than they already have.

i hear this often but i feel it isnt true. i mean we don’t have statistics for it so i can’t say how big the crowd is that wants harder content. there was a massive poll done on the gw2 reddit a while ago with some several thousand participants, maybe that says something. but from my experience, i feel that the vast majority of people i meet in game do enjoy working for events like teq and the wurm, and would enjoy harder content in game.

I can give you at least what our german CM postet a while ago :

only 7% of the players read the forums and only 1% post in the forums.

Then we know from Lotro for example that there only around 5% were raiding and
that those people were very overrepresented in the forums so that maybe 50% of
the forum posters were also raiders.

In Everquest2 on our server there was also mostly only 1 guild with maybe 30 members
that was able to beat the hardest content before a new expansion was released.

And finally .. just look at the awsome “success” of Wildstar that tried to cater just to
the “gimme harder content” crowd.

Nilkemia.8507:

Answer : Because difficult doesn’t equal fun. And usually, difficult equals cheap gimmicks that just annoy/frustrate players.

Yeah .. mostly its : more hps and more damage of the mobs .. maybe even more oneshot-kills .. and not to forget more CCs .. where you just stand around and can’t do anything than waiting.

Oh .. wait .. exactly what we have now in the battle with the new boss.

Quite simply it’s a minority complaint and MMO’s answer to the majority.

Not neglecting your request mind you OP but if you consider the evolution, or devolution, of MMO’s in general it’s really the last place I’d personally look for difficult game play anymore, way more so in this game.

Other MMO’s or genres handle that niche.

It’s like walking into McDonalds expecting fine dining while most are perfectly happy chugging back Big Macs.

Valento.9852:

naiasonod.9265:

Valento.9852:

One reason: Casuals that love farming. Spamming pewpew is a relief it seems.

It is kind’ve stress relieving, you know? I wouldn’t go so far as to say cathartic, but sometimes, I come home from work and I’m stressed as all kitten, but after an hour or two of going around mindlessly killing the crap out of things, sometimes I really do feel much better.

Is that a poor thing, do you suppose?

No. Absolutely not. By all means, pewpew all night long if you wish. But let other people who enjoy actual hard content to have theirs, as there’s already so much for casuals. 2% of the game makes use of some organization/coordination (and Triple Trouble/fractals are still work-in-progress in terms of difficulty).

I tend to like a decent amount of content I find challenging too. I don’t care for fractals much strictly due to my ‘gear treadmill makes brain sad’ brain condition, but I don’t know that there’s anything especially wrong with those either.

I love that they’re utterly optional. I ignore them entirely and don’t feel like I’m missing a thing.

I do love me a good world boss though. Coordination and organization aren’t anathema to me, though I won’t lie – I do strongly tend to prefer doing my own casual-skrub thing off on my putzy own.

Far be it from me to begrudge them having harder stuff. I’m just not certain they could make a lot much harder than they already do and not essentially be making it for a tiny handful of people almost exclusively.

SkylightMoon.1980:

i hear this often but i feel it isnt true.

It is true by definition. “hard content”, after all, is something that is not meant for an average person – and half of the players of this game are below average.
Remember, that your view is skewed by two factors – first, if you yourself are a skilled player, you are far more likely to associate with other skilled players than with unskilled ones. Second, casuals generally do not frequent community sites like this forum or game subreddit. Thus, those places will have their “elite” percentages elevated significantly.

Now, if you were there during first Marionette events (which were already skewed, seeing as lot of people didn’t even try to attempt them), before many players just gave up, and looked at platform fights, you’d see the true skill level of the GW2 community.
Trust me, it’s far lower than you believe it to be.

Jerus.4350:

There’s a big difference between a gimmick and difficult content.

100% agree with this statement.

I feel as if the GW2 team doesn’t do more than focus on gimmicks for “difficulty.”
Chain stuns or chain fears. Instant death attacks. Indomitable.

Sadly, the gimmicks stack with frequently poor conveyance about when an ability is going to fire or how it separates from other, less dangerous abilities. So it ends up being that many combats are merely frustrating instead of appropriately challenging.

I find it fascinating that everyone here says that difficult content needs lots and lots of coordination when that, with the way Guild Wars 2 handles battles etc, clearly isn’t the case.
Remember Tower of Nightmares? Or the Attack on Lions Arch? The latter may not be the hardest thing there is but it still was challenging in a way.
What we mostly would need wouldn’t be tons of coordination but people going that tiny step away from damage.
Lots of enemies could just get a skill that buffs other enemies around them, heals a little, an autoattack maybe even a condition or two.
What would that take from the players? Well, suddenly you would have to use more from your skillbar, but honestly, would that be so bad?
Would that make you play more coordinated with skills that already heal in an area, purge conditions or buffs in areas and so on?
I can’t imagine.

The big problem isn’t coordination but the fact that people apparantely can’t step up to the fact that Guild Wars 2 already puts all players on a server in a huge party and that they maybe should start acting like it.

LouWolfskin.3492:

The big problem isn’t coordination but the fact that people apparantely can’t step up to the fact that Guild Wars 2 already puts all players on a server in a huge party and that they maybe should acting like it.

Well, having every player work as a part of the greater whole, and not as an individual is exactly what coordination is about.

In theory I wouldn’t mind it much but do keep in mind that Gw2 is a very different game from many other MMOs. One of it’s crucial components is how the world tries to never be frustrating, always inviting and never creating friction.

One effect of that is that content should never be difficult enough so that a bad player wipes the people around them. Sure, there might be a mountain of a difference between a mediocre and a truly godlike player (have you tried doing claw of jormag without getting by the ice waves in P2? Is very much possible, removes virtually any damage you could be taking, but ofc is not at all required outside of wanting to do it for yourself), but in game terms the game lets either pass just the same, before one upsets the other.

GW2 already have a wide range of difficulty for different players. They will never make a content that please everyone. A tier system like Dry Top/Lion Arch and some ppl complain that they can’t reach the higher tier for the good reward because they never end up on a good map. A coordinated event that need individual skill and ppl will complain that they can’t do the event because of some of the player that are bad, like with the marionnette. Give a hard content like the Triple Wurm and ppl will complain that they can’t do it unless they join a specific guild. Give a easy content and ppl will complain its not hard enough.

I think the new event is alright. Not too hard that most map won’t fail it in a week, but not too easy as it became a afk fight like some World Boss. Not the best fight for me, but overall I think It can be appreciate by most ppl.