Guild Wars 2

Well, most of the people I know were waiting this event to farm on the Pavillion, imagine their surprise when they didn’t see a real way to farm anything (you can’t be sure to complete all the times the Boss Blitz with a gold reward thanks to megaservers)…

The economy of this game is going to hell, and you can see it by looking at the prices of precursors (some at 1500g), fine T6 mats, runes and other random mats. Right now, a normal player (not a casual) could take more than a year to get the money to buy a precursor (assuming that they won’t raise on price anymore), is that normal for you?

I don’t think going on this way would be good for the state of the game, ‘cause if you expect that people are going to buy gold by converting gems (that’s your goal I guess, no?), many would quit the game to find something where you actually have a chance to farm to get what you want.

The game needs some farming, even not during the events to let the economy being more stable and players able to get money to get what they want. We’ve seen several farming for several months: Cursed Shore, Karka, Cof p1 and so on, but now people who want to “farm” some money, can actually only do dungeons every day (about 30g/day in almost 4 hrs) and that’s not a way to help “new players” to get their money to buy skins and so on.

Do you want people to buy gems with real money and converting them to gold? Just say it please, so we wouldn’t ask anymore for any way to farm gold in game, by playing.

TL;DR The game need a way to farm money to control the economy and help people get their money to buy skin/things.

Get More Gold!

Remember that you can exchange gems and gold at our currency exchange on the second tab of the Black Lion Trading Company! Currently, you can get 1 gold for about 15 gems and 50 gold for about 670 gems!

Source.

Did I answer your question?

Lishtenbird.2814:

Get More Gold!

Remember that you can exchange gems and gold at our currency exchange on the second tab of the Black Lion Trading Company! Currently, you can get 1 gold for about 15 gems and 50 gold for about 670 gems!

Did I answer your question?

I know about it, and that’s why I started a thread like this one

Kronos.3695:

TL;DR The game need a way to farm money to control the economy and help people get their money to buy skin/things.

guess what happens if you introduce more gold to the economy than the gold sinks are removing, prices rise.

I’ve just been called a ‘naab’ for finishing the severed breach defense event. People wanted to fail the last wave. Farming is easy to hate.

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

Asmodeus.5782:

I’ve just been called a ‘naab’ for finishing the severed breach defense event. People wanted to fail the last wave. Farming is easy to hate.

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

well, as the saying goes you’re “playing how you want to” and that’s not always compatible with how other want to play.

GW2 is a fantastic game with plenty of things to enjoy – as long as one doesn’t focus on a single goal, like getting a special item. Because then it turns into the probably most expensive and heaviest grind game by chance on earth. So try to avoid wanting anything specific to prolong the fun as much as possible :-/

Currently 10g gets you 100 gems. ANet doesn’t want you to have a lot of gold because that means you don’t buy gems with cash.

As the game matures, people have bought all the legendaries and ascended gear they really want so the spare gold goes to gems and the viability of ANet’s business model goes down. If it goes down enough then no more ANet. It’s a tough balancing act they have to make.

Asmodeus.5782:

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

I think it’s again time to quote myself from another now deceased thread:

I’m amazed at how short-sighted many people are: they’re happy at making other players suffer without understanding that those people were the ones who made their life easier by repeating monotonous task which the first players wouldn’t have to do. It’s like being happy at a limit of those dirty lousy yardmen – before seeing that they’ll have to pick up all the trash themselves now.

Fasalina, Nerelith and others who admit they haven’t studied economics, here’s a Wiki image.

The image shows an increase in supply – the price drops. When supply decreases, the price increases.

• Let’s say we had 100 players who needed 1 charged lodestone per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week.
• We had 10 farmers who farmed 10 lodestones per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week.
• Let’s say the price got an equilibrium at around 2g.
• After patch, we still have 100 players who need 1 charged lodestone per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week – nothing changed.
• After patch, the 10 farmers can only farm 5 lodestones per week.
• When the first 50 lodestones at 2g are sold, the other 50 players still need 50 more lodestones.
• Because they need these lodestones but can’t get them, they offer more for these lodestones – let’s say up to 4g per lodestone.
• 10 other non-farmers see that the offers for lodestones got higher and decide to go farming.
• Now we have 20 people farming instead of 10 people to provide enough supply of 100 lodestones per week, while players pay more for the exact same lodestones because otherwise the farmers will stop farming.

Result of the train-nerf which you’re so happy about? More people have to grind, more casual players suffer from an increase in prices. Both sides become unhappy (and eventually leave the game).

…and let’s not forget that world boss trains for ecto and Orr event farming for T6 also got nerfed.

The exchange doesn’t add more gold to the economy as it’s paid with gold others used to buy gems. Actually the exchange sinks gold twice, once going in and once going out which is why the gold exchange rate is 72.25% (or 85% squared) of the gem exchange rate.

New gold only comes from drops, vendors and achievement chests (and a small chance from BL Chests).

Farming is ok. I like farming too.

What is not OK is if pressing 111111 nets you more gold than other activities with a higher skill-requirement. And thats what the Pavillion last year was, that’s what the champ trains are, that’s what the game teaches you. That makes no sense, because it’s like the local street cleaner earning more money than a doctor.

However, we do need more activities with a high skill requirement which has high payouts.

For the millionth time, buying gems with gold still generates revune for ArenaNet, as all gems bought with gold were originally sold from player who bought gems with cash.

Encouraging people to buy gold with gems actually decreases the price and allows you to buy gem store items for cheaper.

Also the reason why they nerfed the farm events is because people complained that people were using living story to farm and inflation is occurring in the game at an extremely fast pace.

Stop with your conspiracy theories, I don’t care if you study economics as a college student. The fact the matter is there’s an actual economic expert that works for this game, he is well aware of what happens when you nerf things.

I feel you might be getting this backwards. More ways to farm and make gold will make the situation worst not better.

The more gold farmers make the high prices they will be willing to pay.. hence Trading post Prices go up. Having tons of gold means they’ll buy tons of gems so Gold to gem exchange rate will go up as well. It then becomes a war of attrition. You have to farm and farm and farm so that you’re one of the top farmers who are actually setting the prices. Everyone else will get penalized.

OP mentioned right now after the nerf they can still make about 30g per 4 hrs so about 7g per hour. Players who dont farm dont make anywhere close to that. I make maybe 5g per week … maybe and 1/2 of that comes from guild missions so players who dont run regular guild missions might be making even less then 5g per week. So what I am getting at. That gap is whats crucial in this scenario. If you make 7g per hour and play say an average of 20hrs a week paying 1500g for a precursor is about 2 – 3months work. A LOT but doable (well technically we should be working this base don the amount of gold people did prior the last champion nerf since that level of income boosted pre-cursor prices to 1500g) for someone like me. who does about 25s an hour its not 3 months its 28 times that or about 7 years no one like me is every going to buy a precursor at those prices.

To fix that increasing farming opprotunity and income isnt going to fix anything its going to make things worst. If farmers income were to double it means now farmers are willing to pay 3000g for a precursor cause if right now they feel the income from 3 months of game time is reasonable prices to pay they’ll still feel 3 months of game times is a reasonable price to pay, the fact before in 3 months they did 1500g instead of 3000g will not change anything. But for players like me who dont farm? well if farming profits double in size and precursor prices shoot at 3k? well now we need 14 years instead of 7. Awesome.

To solve the problem you’re having OP we dont need to boost income we need to equalize income between different activities. As long as farming is more profitable then whatever else people do be it doing JPes, DE, WvW whatever the problem will persist.

The argument against farming is just stupid.

Higher supply means lower cost, you don’t have to be an eco major to understand that.

Nerfing loot hurts everyone even if you’re not interested in chasing loot. No matter who you are, you still have to interact with the people around you. If they’re in a happy mood, they will project positively towards you. If they’re kittened off because of the bad loot, they’re going to make your life miserable.

Had the pavilion given good loot, everyone would be working together, coordinating, and having a blast like the Marionette. But because it gives such terrible loot, no one will even try, and everyone is kittening on the forums.

Xae Isareth.1364:

Farming is ok. I like farming too.
What is not OK is if pressing 111111 nets you more gold than other activities with a higher skill-requirement.

Yep, this. ANet hasn’t made the Pavillion non-farmable. They’ve just made it harder to farm than “11111111111” was. People are saying Megaserver makes it impossible to dependably farm it, but it doesn’t really. It just takes a little bit of organizational effort. It requires you (yes, you, not someone else) to be proactive.

1) Talk to a few guildies who want to farm gold Blitzes for a few hours.
2) Go to a Pavillion together.
3) Politely discuss with others in the map the possibility of organizing to farm gold events.
4) If they don’t want to, go to a different Pavillion map and try again.
5) Teamspeak helps but is not required, invite anyone in the map who is willing to join your guild or server Teamspeak.
6) Form 6 small groups and farm. It only takes like 15 minutes per cycle and you do get good loot for the time invested. Repeat immediately. And again to your heart and wallet’s content.

Farming. Clearly, ANet doesn’t hate it.

But yeah, you do have to work for it. Sorry.

Peetee.9406:

The argument against farming is just stupid.

Higher supply means lower cost, you don’t have to be an eco major to understand that.

Nerfing loot hurts everyone even if you’re not interested in chasing loot. No matter who you are, you still have to interact with the people around you. If they’re in a happy mood, they will project positively towards you. If they’re kittened off because of the bad loot, they’re going to make your life miserable.

Had the pavilion given good loot, everyone would be working together, coordinating, and having a blast like the Marionette. But because it gives such terrible loot, no one will even try, and everyone is kittening on the forums.

No it does. Prices arent fixed in stone. Not even gem to gold exchange rate is fixed.
If we start making say for example 10x the amount of money right now that will not mean we can buy a precursor in 10x less time then before what will happen is that will just inflate the prices of precursors by 10 times. Same thing with everything else. Now consider that we’re talking about farming here. Something which isnt done by everyone.

what is money after all? a representation of value. What gives value to stuff in an MMO. Most of all by a great margin is the time required to acquire that item I would say. Then you may have a bit of value in terms of aesthetics and power.

But think about it, If I gather say ancient logs for profit and in 1hr I gather say 288 of them I am not going to sell them for less then I would make 1hr farming champions.
So if right now they sell for 5s which would be around 14g. if instead of about 10g per hour farming champions (thats the number people throw about never did it myself dont know how much is the actual number) now they start making 100g per hour do you think gathers would still be happy selling those 288 logs for 14g? of course not they will not sell them for less then 100g else there wouldnt be a point for them to gather for profit. They’ll farm champions instead. Besides if they increase the price to 100g – 140g it will still sell because farmers would still be trading an hour of what they like for an hour of what they may not like so much.

Only difference people who dont farm and dont make 10x as much money now can really buy logs anymore cause with the 25s an hour they do they’ll never afford those prices.

So no nerfing doesnt hurt everyone, nerfing doesnt hurt anyone really in the long run at least (sure you have a bit of time where its hard for the people experiencing the nerf as the market stabilizes and prices fall to the level of what farmers actually afford … pain which those who dont farm feel already and that will not go away until farming is nerfed!)

Let me give you a history of all farming since the start of release. and what happened to each one

Plinx (Karma farm) – Nerfed after a few months by increasing respawn time
Shelt/Pen (loot/karma) – Nerfed 6-8 months after release, respawn time time increased as well as removing loot from spider spawnlings. Nerfed again in the champion scaling update
Fish heads (loot) – Nerfed after 1 month by limiting loot dropped from the grubs
Lyssa waypont farm (loot) – Nerfed after <1 month. Operated along the lines of being an exploit, so IMO it was deserved.
Anchorage ember farm (loot) – Nerfed after 1 month by introducing a timer to the event. (although the capability to farm this one was available for longer since the champ update, it was discovered late)
Skelk – Southwest WP in Southsun had a high density of skelk that could be farmed for bloods. Density nerfed.
Dolyak Escort – nerfed the frequency of the event
FSG – nerfed by turning Champions into Dynamic Event Champs
Queensdale – nerfed by turning Champions into Veterans. A well deserved fix, however they should have ‘moved’ it into other higher level zones.
Grenth farming – nerfed through the introduction of Megaservers
Melandru 2nd beacon – same as above
Angaria – same as above, but also nerfed by removing all mobs

So that brings us to the current day. What farming is available now? The options are small and ineffective. Off the top of my head:

-Karka farming – the price of karka shells however have been halved, so it’s not as efficient
-Corpse farming – lots of mobs but a long respawn time that has to be completed, so it’s not efficient at all
-EOTM – only good for karma AFAIK. Loot is negligible

There are other champ farms that I know of, but they shall remain private.

Chase.8415:

For the millionth time, buying gems with gold still generates revune for ArenaNet, as all gems bought with gold were originally sold from player who bought gems with cash.

Except that’s not the case. The Exchange was stocked with a massive supply of gems and a little amount of gold at launch. While it’s true that most of the gold you get from selling gems was originally from players, the percentage of gems that a player gets that were added to the exchange by another player has been increasing as time goes on, it’s likely not even at 50% yet.

It most certainly isn’t “all”.

Asmodeus.5782:

I’ve just been called a ‘naab’ for finishing the severed breach defense event. People wanted to fail the last wave. Farming is easy to hate.

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

Guess you didn’t see the facts. It’s not farmers that are the problem, it’s the gem-gold exchange that is the problem, and it’s the TP focus of the game that is the problem.

If the game were to suddenly lose it’s ability to exchange gems for gold, you’d see the prices of everything tremendously drop, people wouldn’t have to farm anything to get what they need because the prices would be so low eventually that people could actually gear up alts without pulling out the wallet or spending weeks building up gold.

If they went even further and eliminated the TP and while doing that removed DR and loot manipulations that give players piles of gold or having an RNG for a bag and then an RNG for opening said bag as the only means of gathering crafting materials, poof the game might actually GASP become fun! And then they could spend the rest of their resources not on nerfing valid means of getting PVE open world drops to occur, but they might actually have enough resources and personnel to come out with a permanent new completely fun open world experience based off of the main storyline.

now wouldn’t that sound like a good idea? I think so.

Let me also add this one more fact. Exactly NONE of the things they’ve done to loot in the open world to try to prevent the gold sellers from both influencing the TP and from even being in the game advertising has had any positive affect to the game. The whole reason these gold sellers are here is directly due to the TP and the loot manipulations keep the majority of players from getting anything other than nickles and dimes from the open world experience. Eliminate the TP as the focus of the game and you eliminate the gold sellers. Oh and finally this can be achieved without adding an enormous grind for anything it’s already happened before in other successful titles some of us are just waiting for them to realize that it’s time for this title to mature and go that same direction.

Anet does not hate farming.

Actually, Anet loves it’s players farming – but only farming what Anet feels is appropriate.

Achievement Points – Farming
LS – Farming
Festival/Events – Farming
PvP – Farming
World Bosses – Farming (Heck they even gave us a schedule to farm them more efficiently)

This game lack so much content its almost unbearable. So you are forced to farm the same content which is now over a year and a half old but with a few VERY unfortunate rules.

Gold – Due to the gem shop Anet does NOT feel comfortable with you farming gold since it would dip into their profits. So from release to now – all gold farms have been nerfed with each and every patch. You want money – time to buy gems I guess.

DR – Diminishing returns have to be the most ludicrous thing I have ever experienced in this game. Why does it exist? IF I want to spend 5 hrs farming a particular spawn for particular materials – why should I not be able to?

The reason is simple – DR makes it not worth your time. Its far easier to use gold and the TP to aquire mats.

Once again this is pushing people to buying gems.

In terms of loot this entire game has had a problem with risk vs reward from the start. GW2 has become a cash grab and quite frankly I am in a pretty decently large guild and it was interesting on TS the other nite exactly how may people are totally unhappy with this game in it’s current state and how most are only playing it to pass time until a title they are waiting for is released.

My friends lists and guilds I know are getting smaller by the day – and I can assume it’s not just me experiencing this shrinkage of players.

I suggest Anet really rethink their ways. From the lack of content issue to the apparently money / cash grab tactics they now use – Their player base is not very happy.

Azreell.1568:

Anet does not hate farming.

Actually, Anet loves it’s players farming – but only farming what Anet feels is appropriate.

Achievement Points – Farming
LS – Farming
Festival/Events – Farming
PvP – Farming
World Bosses – Farming (Heck they even gave us a schedule to farm them more efficiently)

This game lack so much content its almost unbearable. So you are forced to farm the same content which is now over a year and a half old but with a few VERY unfortunate rules.

Gold – Due to the gem shop Anet does NOT feel comfortable with you farming gold since it would dip into their profits. So from release to now – all gold farms have been nerfed with each and every patch. You want money – time to buy gems I guess.

DR – Diminishing returns have to be the most ludicrous thing I have ever experienced in this game. Why does it exist? IF I want to spend 5 hrs farming a particular spawn for particular materials – why should I not be able to?

The reason is simple – DR makes it not worth your time. Its far easier to use gold and the TP to aquire mats.

Once again this is pushing people to buying gems.

In terms of loot this entire game has had a problem with risk vs reward from the start. GW2 has become a cash grab and quite frankly I am in a pretty decently large guild and it was interesting on TS the other nite exactly how may people are totally unhappy with this game in it’s current state and how most are only playing it to pass time until a title they are waiting for is released.

My friends lists and guilds I know are getting smaller by the day – and I can assume it’s not just me experiencing this shrinkage of players.

I suggest Anet really rethink their ways. From the lack of content issue to the apparently money / cash grab tactics they now use – Their player base is not very happy.

The posters on this forum are not happy but many of them don’t play the game any more and just come here to whine. This forum is a VERY SMALL subset of players of GW2.

The Guild I belong to is growing – we have had 5 new members in the last 5 days (we don’t recruit aggressively either). B2P games tend to have people come and go so it is no big deal if people leave. It happens. Now, if it was a sub game, then you could say it is a big deal.

Dusty Moon.4382:

Azreell.1568:

Anet does not hate farming.

Actually, Anet loves it’s players farming – but only farming what Anet feels is appropriate.

Achievement Points – Farming
LS – Farming
Festival/Events – Farming
PvP – Farming
World Bosses – Farming (Heck they even gave us a schedule to farm them more efficiently)

This game lack so much content its almost unbearable. So you are forced to farm the same content which is now over a year and a half old but with a few VERY unfortunate rules.

Gold – Due to the gem shop Anet does NOT feel comfortable with you farming gold since it would dip into their profits. So from release to now – all gold farms have been nerfed with each and every patch. You want money – time to buy gems I guess.

DR – Diminishing returns have to be the most ludicrous thing I have ever experienced in this game. Why does it exist? IF I want to spend 5 hrs farming a particular spawn for particular materials – why should I not be able to?

The reason is simple – DR makes it not worth your time. Its far easier to use gold and the TP to aquire mats.

Once again this is pushing people to buying gems.

In terms of loot this entire game has had a problem with risk vs reward from the start. GW2 has become a cash grab and quite frankly I am in a pretty decently large guild and it was interesting on TS the other nite exactly how may people are totally unhappy with this game in it’s current state and how most are only playing it to pass time until a title they are waiting for is released.

My friends lists and guilds I know are getting smaller by the day – and I can assume it’s not just me experiencing this shrinkage of players.

I suggest Anet really rethink their ways. From the lack of content issue to the apparently money / cash grab tactics they now use – Their player base is not very happy.

The posters on this forum are not happy but many of them don’t play the game any more and just come here to whine. This forum is a VERY SMALL subset of players of GW2.

Actually it could be considered a viable sample size of the current player bases feelings on the game.

Also, I don’t think its fair to assume that the people who post on this forum do not play anymore.

Azreell.1568:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Azreell.1568:

Anet does not hate farming.

Actually, Anet loves it’s players farming – but only farming what Anet feels is appropriate.

Achievement Points – Farming
LS – Farming
Festival/Events – Farming
PvP – Farming
World Bosses – Farming (Heck they even gave us a schedule to farm them more efficiently)

This game lack so much content its almost unbearable. So you are forced to farm the same content which is now over a year and a half old but with a few VERY unfortunate rules.

Gold – Due to the gem shop Anet does NOT feel comfortable with you farming gold since it would dip into their profits. So from release to now – all gold farms have been nerfed with each and every patch. You want money – time to buy gems I guess.

DR – Diminishing returns have to be the most ludicrous thing I have ever experienced in this game. Why does it exist? IF I want to spend 5 hrs farming a particular spawn for particular materials – why should I not be able to?

The reason is simple – DR makes it not worth your time. Its far easier to use gold and the TP to aquire mats.

Once again this is pushing people to buying gems.

In terms of loot this entire game has had a problem with risk vs reward from the start. GW2 has become a cash grab and quite frankly I am in a pretty decently large guild and it was interesting on TS the other nite exactly how may people are totally unhappy with this game in it’s current state and how most are only playing it to pass time until a title they are waiting for is released.

My friends lists and guilds I know are getting smaller by the day – and I can assume it’s not just me experiencing this shrinkage of players.

I suggest Anet really rethink their ways. From the lack of content issue to the apparently money / cash grab tactics they now use – Their player base is not very happy.

The posters on this forum are not happy but many of them don’t play the game any more and just come here to whine. This forum is a VERY SMALL subset of players of GW2.

Actually it could be considered a viable sample size of the current player bases feelings on the game.

Also, I don’t think its fair to assume that the people who post on this forum do not play anymore.

Not a viable way to count – if they aren’t playing – they don’t count and many on this forum don’t play any more. Also, most come on here to whine, very few come on to say how good the game is, so you already have a skewed sampling.

It would be like using Raptr to count the number of players in GW2 – not a viable way either.

Fugu.7842:

Kronos.3695:

TL;DR The game need a way to farm money to control the economy and help people get their money to buy skin/things.

guess what happens if you introduce more gold to the economy than the gold sinks are removing, prices rise.

Nice try. While true in a vacuum, the GW2 economy is not a vacuum. It’s a pity for your observation that farming mats and selling them on the TP is way more lucrative than coin drops. ANet reward design is centered on the idea that most drops aren’t worth selling, but can be salvaged for things that are. Of course, people farming mats increases supply, and increases the amount of coin taken out of the economy via TP fees — both of which serve to control prices. Precursor/Legendary pricing is indicative of high demand for them coupled with very low availability.

Behellagh.1468:

Chase.8415:

For the millionth time, buying gems with gold still generates revune for ArenaNet, as all gems bought with gold were originally sold from player who bought gems with cash.

Except that’s not the case. The Exchange was stocked with a massive supply of gems and a little amount of gold at launch. While it’s true that most of the gold you get from selling gems was originally from players, the percentage of gems that a player gets that were added to the exchange by another player has been increasing as time goes on, it’s likely not even at 50% yet.

It most certainly isn’t “all”.

Why does it have to be stocked? Gems are not physical, they are virtual and can be created out of nothing. Anet just keeps a track of the supply and demand and adjusts the prices based on that. There is no pool of gems or anything. Just some number crunching.

tigirius.9014:

Asmodeus.5782:

I’ve just been called a ‘naab’ for finishing the severed breach defense event. People wanted to fail the last wave. Farming is easy to hate.

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

Guess you didn’t see the facts. It’s not farmers that are the problem, it’s the gem-gold exchange that is the problem, and it’s the TP focus of the game that is the problem.

You honestly think prices in TP are high because of gem->gold conversion rather then farming? because if we look like say dawn, in january 2013 it was being sold for 420g. In August 2013 it was being sold for 480. A rise of 40g in 6 months. Okey. Then Champion rewards got introduced and farming started. In 1 month price reached 622g to reach 1000g today. Gem to Gold exchange has been there since launch why did prices start to increase right the month after champions rewards where boosted?

We had a farmer say that after the nerf they still make 7g per hour. I dont farm and make maybe 25s per hour if even. Do you honestly think that removing gem to gold exchange would change anything for non-farmers?

Eliminating any form of trade would work of course but then it would make for one boring single player game. Not just that but you’d kill the game for crafters, gathers, market speculators, traders and all the players who’s enjoyment of the game involves trading of some sort.

no matter what is done some people are going to suffer.

Lankybrit.4598:

Behellagh.1468:

Chase.8415:

For the millionth time, buying gems with gold still generates revune for ArenaNet, as all gems bought with gold were originally sold from player who bought gems with cash.

Except that’s not the case. The Exchange was stocked with a massive supply of gems and a little amount of gold at launch. While it’s true that most of the gold you get from selling gems was originally from players, the percentage of gems that a player gets that were added to the exchange by another player has been increasing as time goes on, it’s likely not even at 50% yet.

It most certainly isn’t “all”.

Why does it have to be stocked? Gems are not physical, they are virtual and can be created out of nothing. Anet just keeps a track of the supply and demand and adjusts the prices based on that. There is no pool of gems or anything. Just some number crunching.

Because supply = stock.

They don’t hate farming specifically.

They hate everything that gives players gold that wasn’t bought with gems.

DancingMad.8504:

They don’t hate farming specifically.

They hate everything that gives players gold that wasn’t bought with gems.

BINGO.

We have a winner !

DancingMad.8504:

They don’t hate farming specifically.

They hate everything that gives players gold that wasn’t bought with gems.

Yeah that explains why they don’t nerf dungeon exploits that players use to earn hundreds of gold in a single day lol.

Spirigo.2897:

DancingMad.8504:

They don’t hate farming specifically.

They hate everything that gives players gold that wasn’t bought with gems.

Yeah that explains why they don’t nerf dungeon exploits that players use to earn hundreds of gold in a single day lol.

What? Dungeons were nerfed with the Apr 15th patch. People now report making tons less gold in Dungeons from before.

Farming or grinding gold? Because to me it looks like you are referring to grinding gold.

Anyway the only reason I can think of that they dislike farming is because then people van work towards the item they want them-self, directly. If make sure you have general loot that drops low then everything gets traded between people with gold. So gold is everything in this game and now guess what they sell.

PS I am not a gold-grinder myself but I don’t like the fact that everything is so focused on currencies and then mainly on gold.

No just the forums hate farming and every time ppl do not post in the “end this farm” threads your saying its ok to end that farm. Anet doing nothing more then what these forums are asking.

Dusty Moon.4382:

The posters on this forum are not happy but many of them don’t play the game any more and just come here to whine. This forum is a VERY SMALL subset of players of GW2.

The Guild I belong to is growing – we have had 5 new members in the last 5 days (we don’t recruit aggressively either). B2P games tend to have people come and go so it is no big deal if people leave. It happens. Now, if it was a sub game, then you could say it is a big deal.

And why did these 5 join? Ask them.

I’d bet on at least 2-3 saying that they were in another guild, but it dried up and died, so they moved on to yours.

From what I’ve seen, numbers ARE going down. Maybe not as fast as some claim, and maybe some groups and guilds are gaining new members from the collapse of other groups, but it is a downward trend.

Palador.2170:

Dusty Moon.4382:

The posters on this forum are not happy but many of them don’t play the game any more and just come here to whine. This forum is a VERY SMALL subset of players of GW2.

The Guild I belong to is growing – we have had 5 new members in the last 5 days (we don’t recruit aggressively either). B2P games tend to have people come and go so it is no big deal if people leave. It happens. Now, if it was a sub game, then you could say it is a big deal.

And why did these 5 join? Ask them.

I’d bet on at least 2-3 saying that they were in another guild, but it dried up and died, so they moved on to yours.

From what I’ve seen, numbers ARE going down. Maybe not as fast as some claim, and maybe some groups and guilds are gaining new members from the collapse of other groups, but it is a downward trend.

They were new players not from other guilds. If you look at the larger servers, the guilds are doing well, especially the WvW ones.

B2P games will ebb and flow – it is how they are. Now, if the this was a sub game then you should complain. A.Net got your 60 bucks already, anything over that is pure gravy.

tigirius.9014:

Guess you didn’t see the facts. It’s not farmers that are the problem, it’s the gem-gold exchange that is the problem, and it’s the TP focus of the game that is the problem.

Exactly
Saying this for a long time now
But a Gold <=> Gem Exchange system is destined to end in a situation like that.

Why? Cause you bring big amounts of ingame cash into the game out of nothing and farming has to be limited big time cause it has to give you a carrot you can spend money on.

The exchange isn’t bringing in a lot of gold from nothing. The vast majority of it is gold players used to by gems. On top of it the gold is sunk twice, once going into the exchange and once coming out which is how we get the difference between the two exchange rates.

“New” gold only comes from drops, vendors when you sell to them, achievement chests and the occasional bag of coins from BL Chests. It doesn’t come from selling gems.

Actually, farming destabilizes the economy, because the farmers end up as the only people with money.

Sure, as farmers increase supply of things, the prices drop – but so does the value of everything the non-farmers get. People don’t get their gold from nowhere – they get it from selling the stuff they find.

In the lodestone example above, the people pre-patch who stumbled across a lodestone and didn’t need it were only getting 2 g for it. Post-patch, when they stumble across a lodestone they don’t need, they get 4 g from it.

I heard about players being disappointing in the pavilion, I don’t know exactly what mostly because I was not paying to much attention to it since I’m not much of a farmer. (Should see my RF4 crop fields lol) Old school Korean MMOs have turned me off farming for a few lifetimes.

Now I’m not an expert but… Isn’t everything driven by “Supply and Demand”? sure if numbers are lower it looks bad, but isn’t it about the same amount of effort to achieve a goal no matter what once an economy is somewhat stable? Surely all the prices will eventually even out to based on the standard income rates right?

That all being said why would you play a game like this to farm? Come PvP with me we have rewards now, or do a dungeon. Hell jump into WvW and zerg rush some keeps or down teq.

The answer is 100 gems can buy you 7.5g! On sale now!

Dusty Moon.4382:

They were new players not from other guilds.

Color me shocked.

Lankybrit.4598:

Spirigo.2897:

DancingMad.8504:

They don’t hate farming specifically.

They hate everything that gives players gold that wasn’t bought with gems.

Yeah that explains why they don’t nerf dungeon exploits that players use to earn hundreds of gold in a single day lol.

What? Dungeons were nerfed with the Apr 15th patch. People now report making tons less gold in Dungeons from before.

Now re-read my previous post.

Kronos.3695:

Well, most of the people I know were waiting this event to farm on the Pavillion, imagine their surprise when they didn’t see a real way to farm anything (you can’t be sure to complete all the times the Boss Blitz with a gold reward thanks to megaservers)…

The economy of this game is going to hell, and you can see it by looking at the prices of precursors (some at 1500g), fine T6 mats, runes and other random mats. Right now, a normal player (not a casual) could take more than a year to get the money to buy a precursor (assuming that they won’t raise on price anymore), is that normal for you?

I don’t think going on this way would be good for the state of the game, ‘cause if you expect that people are going to buy gold by converting gems (that’s your goal I guess, no?), many would quit the game to find something where you actually have a chance to farm to get what you want.

The game needs some farming, even not during the events to let the economy being more stable and players able to get money to get what they want. We’ve seen several farming for several months: Cursed Shore, Karka, Cof p1 and so on, but now people who want to “farm” some money, can actually only do dungeons every day (about 30g/day in almost 4 hrs) and that’s not a way to help “new players” to get their money to buy skins and so on.

Do you want people to buy gems with real money and converting them to gold? Just say it please, so we wouldn’t ask anymore for any way to farm gold in game, by playing.

TL;DR The game need a way to farm money to control the economy and help people get their money to buy skin/things.

Correct TL;DR Let’s print more money so stuff would cost less.

What?!

Currency can’t inflate if there’s a limited amount of it. Champ zerging is an unlimited faucet for gold(there are similar if not better champ farming methods still around, you just have to meet a higher skill cap/coordination than pressing 1 on your lootstick so its kinda limited now)

Currency will actually deflate if its amount stays fixed and amount of resources(lets say T6 fine mats or Lodestones) infinitely increase.

Of course demand would also factor into this if the resource becomes more attractive for buyers over time but printing more money won’t solve this situation.

Lishtenbird.2814:

Asmodeus.5782:

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

I think it’s again time to quote myself from another now deceased thread:

I’m amazed at how short-sighted many people are: they’re happy at making other players suffer without understanding that those people were the ones who made their life easier by repeating monotonous task which the first players wouldn’t have to do. It’s like being happy at a limit of those dirty lousy yardmen – before seeing that they’ll have to pick up all the trash themselves now.

Fasalina, Nerelith and others who admit they haven’t studied economics, here’s a Wiki image.

The image shows an increase in supply – the price drops. When supply decreases, the price increases.

• Let’s say we had 100 players who needed 1 charged lodestone per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week.
• We had 10 farmers who farmed 10 lodestones per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week.
• Let’s say the price got an equilibrium at around 2g.
• After patch, we still have 100 players who need 1 charged lodestone per week each, which makes 100 lodestones per week – nothing changed.
• After patch, the 10 farmers can only farm 5 lodestones per week.
• When the first 50 lodestones at 2g are sold, the other 50 players still need 50 more lodestones.
• Because they need these lodestones but can’t get them, they offer more for these lodestones – let’s say up to 4g per lodestone.
• 10 other non-farmers see that the offers for lodestones got higher and decide to go farming.
• Now we have 20 people farming instead of 10 people to provide enough supply of 100 lodestones per week, while players pay more for the exact same lodestones because otherwise the farmers will stop farming.

Result of the train-nerf which you’re so happy about? More people have to grind, more casual players suffer from an increase in prices. Both sides become unhappy (and eventually leave the game).

…and let’s not forget that world boss trains for ecto and Orr event farming for T6 also got nerfed.

I do not hate farming. I have never hated farming. In fact one of the issues I have with Gw2, is the lack of ability to consistently farm, without DR Kicking in.

I hate the champion train in Queensdale. I think it creates a toxic environment for new players to see some champion riders calling players names for daring to take on a champion, By themselves…Out of turn How dare they?

Secondly it becomes a crutch for new players who accept it as the most efficient way to earn gold… they learn the awesome skills of 1…. w….dodge… and cursing out Non-train riders.

The issue is, I do not consider 99 to 100 people running from champ to champ to be farming. It’s dumbed down, and it is a distroportionately wealthy reward, if you look at the skill involved. ….. w….1…..dodge.

I used to farm ancient Bone, I needed it for some tailored armor I wanted to make. It took me a while to find out what mobs dropped it.

Mind you, I didn’t want the Bones for sale…Just for personal use… 10 dropped the first hour… then 3 dropped the next..then the next I got 1. Then I quit. See One player taking on a camp for me is farming, it takes some skill,… means you need to understand CC and pulling… How to avoid patrols, How to handle adds… and how not to agro other groups By running into a new group while handling an old one.

This is Not the champ train. Maybe they consider what they do farming. I sure don’t. I’ve played MMO’s since EverQuest. and to paraphrase Inigo Montoya..

" farming…joo kip using that word…i do not tink it mins what joo tink it mins."

Galen Grey.4709:

tigirius.9014:

Asmodeus.5782:

I’ve just been called a ‘naab’ for finishing the severed breach defense event. People wanted to fail the last wave. Farming is easy to hate.

And yes, a lot of farmers makes it helluva hard to buy anything valuable for any non-farming player.

Guess you didn’t see the facts. It’s not farmers that are the problem, it’s the gem-gold exchange that is the problem, and it’s the TP focus of the game that is the problem.

You honestly think prices in TP are high because of gem->gold conversion rather then farming? because if we look like say dawn, in january 2013 it was being sold for 420g. In August 2013 it was being sold for 480. A rise of 40g in 6 months. Okey. Then Champion rewards got introduced and farming started. In 1 month price reached 622g to reach 1000g today. Gem to Gold exchange has been there since launch why did prices start to increase right the month after champions rewards where boosted?

We had a farmer say that after the nerf they still make 7g per hour. I dont farm and make maybe 25s per hour if even. Do you honestly think that removing gem to gold exchange would change anything for non-farmers?

Eliminating any form of trade would work of course but then it would make for one boring single player game. Not just that but you’d kill the game for crafters, gathers, market speculators, traders and all the players who’s enjoyment of the game involves trading of some sort.

no matter what is done some people are going to suffer.

No actually it would improve the game tremendously to eliminate the TP entirely as we’re seeing with D3 right now which incidently did exactly the same thing with their game as Anet did, create a TP system, make it the focus of the game, and give players the option of pouring money into the game to buy things from the TP while similtaneously strangling loot.

There’s something a bit more drastic that Anet did however and that’s DR.

In case you haven’t noticed already the prices in the TP are going up consecutively continuously despite losing players we saw that when it was easier to watch where players were going (ie leaving before megaservers leaving empty servers) it went up 400% over just a few months after they added loot manipulations. If that many players were leaving than farming was down and players farming wouldn’t be a factor, this is also taking into account players basic laziness when leveling crafting and their tendency to buy things with real money. I should point out also that this increase in price did NOT happen however in the beginning of the game when there were millions of players bursting at the seams prior to the loot manipulations, the more people spend of real life money the more rare the loot the higher the prices in these RMTAH type economies.

It’s repeating of history. All you have to do is follow the prices of something everyone needs, Runes, and you’ll see what I mean.

Galen Grey.4709:

To solve the problem you’re having OP we dont need to boost income we need to equalize income between different activities. As long as farming is more profitable then whatever else people do be it doing JPes, DE, WvW whatever the problem will persist.

This ^
We need only more variety..

Sartharina.3542:

In the lodestone example above, the people pre-patch who stumbled across a lodestone and didn’t need it were only getting 2 g for it. Post-patch, when they stumble across a lodestone they don’t need, they get 4 g from it.

What lodestones are you talking about ? Before champ bags we were happy when we get 1-2 corrupted because they were worth 1g70s maybe, after champ bags they dropped to 70s.
Also farming normal mobs in Frostgorge for T6 mats gave me maybe 2-3g per hour before, now i can make 7-8g maybe.
The same happened at that time when they also gave us ascended weapons, that suddenly i could make 8-10g/h with harvesting wood and herbs, and it went even up to 12-15g sometimes at the first Queens Palace event when Rosemary could be sold for 12-16s a while.

So, i support what here was said:

You honestly think prices in TP are high because of gem->gold conversion rather then farming? because if we look like say dawn, in january 2013 it was being sold for 420g. In August 2013 it was being sold for 480. A rise of 40g in 6 months. Okey. Then Champion rewards got introduced and farming started. In 1 month price reached 622g to reach 1000g today. Gem to Gold exchange has been there since launch why did prices start to increase right the month after champions rewards where boosted?

We had a farmer say that after the nerf they still make 7g per hour. I dont farm and make maybe 25s per hour if even. Do you honestly think that removing gem to gold exchange would change anything for non-farmers?

Before the champ bags and Queens Palace only FZ speedrunners were able to make 8g/h, after that there were suddenly a lot of other ways to get that much money, and there still are even now. The only difference is that all those ways don’t produce new gold, like champ bags and dungeons, but instead remove gold from the economy since you have to sell the stuff you gather on the TP to make your money.

Sartharina.3542:

Actually, farming destabilizes the economy, because the farmers end up as the only people with money.

Sure, as farmers increase supply of things, the prices drop – but so does the value of everything the non-farmers get. People don’t get their gold from nowhere – they get it from selling the stuff they find.

In the lodestone example above, the people pre-patch who stumbled across a lodestone and didn’t need it were only getting 2 g for it. Post-patch, when they stumble across a lodestone they don’t need, they get 4 g from it.

What patch are you talking about? Currently, the only lodestone above 1G is Charged, and that peaked at ~4 gold in January, 2013. After champ bags were introduced, it dropped under 2G and was fairly stable (~2-2.5 G) until recently, where it’s up over three.

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24305

The most likely explanation for the recent increase in prices would be increased demand due to rune changes in the April patch. However, reduced supply due to fewer champ bags being farmed may also play a role.

I cant buy gems if they keep nerfing the material i need to Exchange for gems