Guild Wars 2

Topic. I just wanna know, we give them great feedback and how to improve but instead they gave us broken DH, nerfed Ele and a 1s CD on stealth skills for Theives (Nobody in the ENTIRE Gw2 community was even complaining or even talking about “hey let’s give thief 1s CD on backstab”) yet they randomly nerf thief.

Anet does listen to it’s community often. I don’t know why people are always complaining about this kind of stuff. It’s always, “Anet have lost their minds! It’s broken now, I can’t chain lava fonts.”

Good riddance. I loved playing ele but the class was seriously too OP. It could do everything. Dh being broken? I don’t see how. It got the better part of the buffs this class. Symbols even a sword.. epic. Banish cd was reduced too. I don’t care much for thieves, but the only people complaining are people who got to comfortable in their rotations and play style.

The reality is that they probably listen, but can’t do much.

Why doesn’t Anet listen to us?!? 98% post in sPvP secrion is only river of tears from bad players.

My opinion is that spvp section should be made available to players who are level Dia+ maybe Lege+. It is very tiring every day to read posts from Amber players who have just crying

They listen to “us” they don’t listen to “you” every company must do this or go insane.

Or don’t listen at all like Blizzard,

just be happy that sometimes, something in the forum is read and might even cause some actions from A-Net, don’t forget that this is still a much better relationships to the company than you can have to most others.

Anet listens to everything I suggest. The trick to get this to happen is to make all your suggestions right after they implement the stuff you’re suggesting.

Evilek.5690:

Shovel Face.4512:

Gibon.1705:

I think they actually listen to ppl but not every one single whiner on forums (OP) but rather some known personas in the community/esport(lol) pros who actually have deeper understanding of balance and mechanics. If they were to listen to everyone who is Q_Q all the time that class XXXX is op cuz its countering my playstyle or buff YYY cuz its my fav class we would be kittend

Lol I guess the one time Anet did listen to the community was when everyone was crying to their mothers about how Thief was beating everyone in PvP because “they have stealth.” Anet responded by nerfing the hell out of the class for the next 3 years. They took away everything that made the class fun (S/D and D/D, to name a few) and basically shoved D/P down our throats in PvP. If you do some digging around the forums, you’ll realize that no other class has been nerfed as hard as Thief. Literally no other class comes close to the amount of nerfs recieved compared to thief. Anet is constantly beating the dead horse by nerfing thief time after time after time. The thief class we have now is a shadow of its former self.

You kidding right ? I play a thief from beta as the main character And I’ve read more nonsense.

Every single weapons on Thief hit a huge boost, same trait line. last 3 years Thief hit only perma stealth nerf on D/P.

What? So you’re telling me those nerfs we got over the last 3 years were buffs? LOL.

Btw, here’s a list made 2 years ago of all the nerfs. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Complete-List-of-Thief-Nerfs/first#post4052788

I’m telling you, literally no other class comes close to the amount of nerfs thief got. Mind you, all the nerfs stemmed from people who QQed on these forumns about thief supposedly being OP.

Remember: every change is the worst thing to ever happen and will kill GW2 and is terrible and made the dinosaurs die.

Shovel Face.4512:

Evilek.5690:

Shovel Face.4512:

Gibon.1705:

I think they actually listen to ppl but not every one single whiner on forums (OP) but rather some known personas in the community/esport(lol) pros who actually have deeper understanding of balance and mechanics. If they were to listen to everyone who is Q_Q all the time that class XXXX is op cuz its countering my playstyle or buff YYY cuz its my fav class we would be kittend

Lol I guess the one time Anet did listen to the community was when everyone was crying to their mothers about how Thief was beating everyone in PvP because “they have stealth.” Anet responded by nerfing the hell out of the class for the next 3 years. They took away everything that made the class fun (S/D and D/D, to name a few) and basically shoved D/P down our throats in PvP. If you do some digging around the forums, you’ll realize that no other class has been nerfed as hard as Thief. Literally no other class comes close to the amount of nerfs recieved compared to thief. Anet is constantly beating the dead horse by nerfing thief time after time after time. The thief class we have now is a shadow of its former self.

You kidding right ? I play a thief from beta as the main character And I’ve read more nonsense.

Every single weapons on Thief hit a huge boost, same trait line. last 3 years Thief hit only perma stealth nerf on D/P.

What? So you’re telling me those nerfs we got over the last 3 years were buffs? LOL.

Btw, here’s a list made 2 years ago of all the nerfs. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Complete-List-of-Thief-Nerfs/first#post4052788

I’m telling you, literally no other class comes close to the amount of nerfs thief got. Mind you, all the nerfs stemmed from people who QQed on these forumns about thief supposedly being OP.

But also any other class did not get as much boost and reworked weapon skills as Thief.
And 90% “nerfs” on your link only balance new initiative regen boost =)

Shovel Face.4512:

Topic. I just wanna know, we give them great feedback and how to improve but instead they gave us broken DH, nerfed Ele and a 1s CD on stealth skills for Theives (Nobody in the ENTIRE Gw2 community was even complaining or even talking about “hey let’s give thief 1s CD on backstab”) yet they randomly need thief.

1) Anet doesn’t just do things what people ask for. They see what happens in game via metrics for example and if certain classes overperform by too big a margin they will make changes
2) There is no “us”. The community is always divided and has different opinions on everything. You will never see anything happen that everybody either agrees or disagrees with.

Are there things broken in this game? Yes. There are things broken in all games. Just because they have not been able to fix bugs doesn’t mean they don’t listen. I am pretty sure that if you put up a poll asking people what they see as the 3 most urgent bugs that need to be fixed in GW2, you will find that you’ll get a lot of different answers and half the stuff people mention won’t be bugs but things they simply don’t like.

They may not have done what you wanted but that doesn’t mean there is a greater “us”. This is a fictional concept only.

Evilek.5690

My opinion is that spvp section should be made available to players who are level Dia+ maybe Lege+. It is very tiring every day to read posts from Amber players who have just crying

Even if this has a faint smack of elitism, I totally agree. To complain about a class you should have deep knowledge regarding that class. And to suggest changes that means you have a high lvl of skill and you know (or you can have a good idea) of how that change will modify the class performances.
Until now all the changes to a class or another were made with the PvP in mind. And in some cases these changes damaged the PvE performance of that class. If Anet will listen to any newcomer with a low lvl skill crying because he loses in PvP, we can have serious issues in PvE.
Ah, almost forgot that: I think it is a fair way to ask improvements to your class and not nerfs to OTHER classes.
This is an almost fair post: the OP complains about the nerfs for Ele and Tief. I don’t PvP so I don’t know if this is an OK complain or not. But I saw hundreds of demands for nerfs: I play X class and the Y class beats me 9 times out of 10. Nerf Y! Or: The skill Z is so powerful for class T, it is almost impossible to beat it. Nerf that skill !
Again – is fair and normal to have complains. Is a very non realistic attitude to hope that Anet will act according to it. Unless the majority of the community shares your point of view.

Players have to learn that buffing other professions to match an OP one isn’t the solution any sane development team with choose, so live with your nerf.

People complained about mapping WvW for 100% completion and it got taken out.
People complained about only having LS episodes, they wanted an PAID expansion and we all remember the complaints about having to “pay again”
People complained about they wanted to “hunt for elites” so they made have to do different quests and kill certain things to get the elites and people complained that that’s not what they meant and so they changed it again.
People complained about dyes and they should have them available on all chars not just the one that found it first, they made the dye wallet thing
People complained …….. how many more examples do you want about them listening to feedback and changing and fixing things?

People are always complaining, they are never happy with what they get/got, grass is always greener on the other side, people don’t know what they want or what is actually good for them, ….

They do listen. The forums aren’t the only place they gather information from, nor are their sole source to consider for change. While the forum zeitgeist is important, you place far too much importance on it.

The average player is almost never in any reliable position to understand what is a healthy, mechanically-feasible, labor-feasible, profitable, or balancing change to make to the game.

~EW

PyrateSilly.4710:

People complained about mapping WvW for 100% completion and it got taken out.
People complained about only having LS episodes, they wanted an PAID expansion and we all remember the complaints about having to “pay again”
People complained about they wanted to “hunt for elites” so they made have to do different quests and kill certain things to get the elites and people complained that that’s not what they meant and so they changed it again.
People complained about dyes and they should have them available on all chars not just the one that found it first, they made the dye wallet thing
People complained …….. how many more examples do you want about them listening to feedback and changing and fixing things?

All this change were made after constructive discusion.

But topic like.

" Buuuu i die on condition dmg because i have zero condition cleanse, please nerf condition dmg."

“Buuu i die on traps iam so laizy use dodge, please nerf traps.”

“Buu i die on fall damage, please nerf gravity.”

These comments have no value.

Evilek.5690:

PyrateSilly.4710:

People complained about mapping WvW for 100% completion and it got taken out.
People complained about only having LS episodes, they wanted an PAID expansion and we all remember the complaints about having to “pay again”
People complained about they wanted to “hunt for elites” so they made have to do different quests and kill certain things to get the elites and people complained that that’s not what they meant and so they changed it again.
People complained about dyes and they should have them available on all chars not just the one that found it first, they made the dye wallet thing
People complained …….. how many more examples do you want about them listening to feedback and changing and fixing things?

All this change were made after constructive discusion.

But topic like.

" Buuuu i die on condition dmg because i have zero condition cleanse, please nerf condition dmg."

“Buuu i die on traps iam so laizy use dodge, please nerf traps.”

“Buu i die on fall damage, please nerf gravity.”

These comments have no value.

Do you have any proof that any changes were made solely on those kinds of posts?

Seera.5916:

Evilek.5690:

PyrateSilly.4710:

People complained about mapping WvW for 100% completion and it got taken out.
People complained about only having LS episodes, they wanted an PAID expansion and we all remember the complaints about having to “pay again”
People complained about they wanted to “hunt for elites” so they made have to do different quests and kill certain things to get the elites and people complained that that’s not what they meant and so they changed it again.
People complained about dyes and they should have them available on all chars not just the one that found it first, they made the dye wallet thing
People complained …….. how many more examples do you want about them listening to feedback and changing and fixing things?

All this change were made after constructive discusion.

But topic like.

" Buuuu i die on condition dmg because i have zero condition cleanse, please nerf condition dmg."

“Buuu i die on traps iam so laizy use dodge, please nerf traps.”

“Buu i die on fall damage, please nerf gravity.”

These comments have no value.

Do you have any proof that any changes were made solely on those kinds of posts?

All this change make this game really better and they have been discussed for many months before they were implemented.

Account bound items and Wardrobe,Dyes,Outfits liked on account instead on charracter they were the best from all change in this game

ANet listens. It’s ANet communicating that’s sparse.

And, honestly, with the snotty elitist toxicity and uncontrolled ragebabies, there’s not much content to actually analyze for their design notes. Nothing in a hate-fueled diatribe is worth sifting through.

It’s actually rare that the community embraces an idea enough to be considered reasonable consensus for moving forward.

Dude. This thread is toxic af.

First off, Anet beyond listens to their community. Ascended weapons only exist because of the “pve progression WoW first mmo” outcry community. It is my opinion that they listen to the community too much. The forums are a very vocal minority of their player base.

Second, you are not a game developer. You have no idea what it takes or what balance even means. Unless you’re a top-level fighting game player, Leagues player, or have a formal degree in computer science (specifically with finite state machines) — then your opinion is, frankly, uneducated. If they listened to every whim the forums put forth, we would hate the game. Players do not know what they want. Game designers are the creatives and experts. What I want is ArenaNet to step back into the driver’s seat and give us the amazing content that LWS1 and GW1 are known for.

Lastly, they are fine with communication. The community is so entitled to want hourly updates from them (or whatever pipe dream you’re expecting). Time is money for any company, and the more time they spend on here the less time they are working on a product — that is free to play — for you to enjoy. Knock it off with the entitlement. They said they would patch 6 times a year. What do you want them to say? “Yes, we are looking at balance issues” — Of course they are looking at balance issues. What do you think happens? They don’t push some change and not examine it. They are looking at a lot of things, and I would much rather them keep working on it than take time out of their day to answer some petty forum nonsense.

The community in this game is terrible and you should feel ashamed.

Glenstorm.4059:

Lava Font wasn’t even an issue till raids came along. Instead of improving raid mechanics, they went with the nerfbat.

Resources are probably stretched what with the upcoming expansion and all, but still.

In PvE, staff ele was broken. Completely broken. It needed to be toned down. Every ele main who’s not kittened knew that. It had nothing to do with raids, either. It’s been that way for a long time.

Once again, the issue at hand isn’t the nerf itself, it’s HOW it was nerfed. That’s what we’ve been saying since the patch.

ANet has listened to and acted on what “we” have said entirely too much.

Glenstorm.4059:

Tentonhammr.7849:

Glenstorm.4059:

Lava Font wasn’t even an issue till raids came along. Instead of improving raid mechanics, they went with the nerfbat.

Resources are probably stretched what with the upcoming expansion and all, but still.

In PvE, staff ele was broken. Completely broken. It needed to be toned down. Every ele main who’s not kittened knew that. It had nothing to do with raids, either. It’s been that way for a long time.

Once again, the issue at hand isn’t the nerf itself, it’s HOW it was nerfed. That’s what we’ve been saying since the patch.

Maybe, but the issue has always been about encounter design IMO. Lava Font is OP when enemies don’t avoid damage. The timing of the nerfs—coming right after raids—is also suspicious.

But I agree, they could have shaved things down better.

I partially agree. Bosses standing still and never moving isn’t exactly perfect, but “Enemies avoiding damage” is a slippery kitten slope. Look at the HoT mobs that have such a penchant for charging and running away or evade spamming. It’s not fun to fight. It’s just endlessly frustrating as you chase them down to melee and they run out of aoes.

And as great as the breakbar is overall, it had a serious serious downfall by making soft cc like chill and cripple completely worthless against this type of mechanic, which IMO is precisely how you should counter it.

JediSange.1645:

Second, you are not a game developer. You have no idea what it takes or what balance even means. Unless you’re a top-level fighting game player, Leagues player, or have a formal degree in computer science (specifically with finite state machines) — then your opinion is, frankly, uneducated.

JediSange.1645:

What do you think happens? They don’t push some change and not examine it. They are looking at a lot of things, and I would much rather them keep working on it than take time out of their day to answer some petty forum nonsense.

One could argue, as you similarly did in the upper quote, that a person would need to work for ArenaNet to know what they do or do not do. I hope you understand this made my contradiction sensors tingle to some degree.

JediSange.1645:

The community in this game is terrible and you should feel ashamed.

I suspect that your particular brand of self-righteous anger will probably not improve any of that. Quite the contrary in fact.

And do not forget that even if the vast majority of this community were in fact entitled little wretches, they are still customers and this tends to be significant to companies. That would be a sad reality, but a reality nonetheless.

I don’t feel Arenanet doesn’t listen at all.

I made many complaints over the last 4 years, mostly in the german forum, and if I review my complaints, I see some of these complaints resulted from my misunderstanding of game mechanics, some were just rants, and some were valid.

Many, perhaps even most of the valid complaints were dealt with and the game was changed. I remember update notes with half of it looked like a list of fixes answering my complaints.
I was not the only one with these complaints, of course. The same was voiced by many players as well.

My only complaint with this is that it often took much too long with the changes. Half a year or longer between report and change of the game. In this time, new players come, join the game, and leave again – they may have stayed if some of these fixes were in place sooner.

Also, some things were changed more than once, because the first change wasn’t good. Here is my complaint that Arenanet could have made it better, if they knew their players better.

Many of such complaints contained proposals how to change things, and after 2 updates the last update actually contained what was proposed in the first place. Arenanet tends to try every wrong way first and only after that they take the most apparent (and right) way. I call this trolling the players. The history of the changes with the traits that now became specializations is such an example – remember you weren’t able to change your traits as you like at game release? That you were forced to buy a reset at a NPC in a main city? As far as I remember it took more than a year to free the trait changes.

Gehenna.3625:

One could argue, as you similarly did in the upper quote, that a person would need to work for ArenaNet to know what they do or do not do. I hope you understand this made my contradiction sensors tingle to some degree.

Do not mistake what I’m saying: I’m saying we don’t know what happens there. But I’m asking the community, assuming they are logical, what do you really think happens man? They push changes then stop caring? Stop telling them to look at DH balance. Stop telling them to look at this that or the other. They know. Is that an assumption? Yeah, kind of. But it’s a relatively safe one.

Gehenna.3625:

I suspect that your particular brand of self-righteous anger will probably not improve any of that. Quite the contrary in fact.

And do not forget that even if the vast majority of this community were in fact entitled little wretches, they are still customers and this tends to be significant to companies. That would be a sad reality, but a reality nonetheless.

Don’t mistake me writing with conviction as anger. I’m not trying to improve ArenaNet, nor the community. If I was trying to help the community I would donate money to K-12 education and hope the situation naturally works itself out in a decade.

The vast majority of the community is exactly as you described. The issue is, the community on the forums is such a vocal minority. They are not the millions of players ArenaNet has had over the year. There is no evidence pointing to the forum community spending more money with ArenaNet (be it gems, etc) than the less vocal players. (I’m sure they actually do measure and track that internally, but I doubt we will ever be privy to that).

My point is that the community here on the forums is just toxic. You are not game designers. You do not understand formal balance. You are not educated to speak on the topikittenil people can humble themselves on that, and turn this more into discussion (rather than outcry) — nothing will ever get fixed.

Edit: To clarify, I’m not viewing people who don’t post on the forums as part of the “community” we’re describing.

JediSange.1645:

Dude. This thread is toxic af.

The community in this game is terrible and you should feel ashamed.

So you say there is no anger there. Interesting,

No matter, I do believe we agree that the orginal poster is off the mark.

I disagree with author. The game gives me hope that ANet wants seriously repair this game.

Evilek.5690:

“Buu i die on fall damage, please nerf gravity.”

This one cracked me up, because they gave us Gliders

The only fall-damage complaint I’ve seen is on the Capricorn map’s starting location – if you enjoy throwing yourself onto the battlefield exuberantly (Such as by jumping out the starting gate into the arena), you take a bit of falling damage and it keeps you from rushing to the battle as quickly as you should be able to go, because it thinks you’re in combat with the ground.

If only they listened to us…

Some of the most commonly requested things are mounts, dueling, open world PvP, gear inspection, player to player trading. Many people have given feedback asking for these things.

And yet we have none of them.

Probably just as well they have selective deafness.

looks at recently locked thread.. they are listening.