Guild Wars 2

The way current content is designed, there is no reason to play outside zerker.

I know there are FotM and Arah as exceptions, but still…

It just doesnt make sense how strong they hit on charr with “full control” set. They do get their aggro, but there is no way they could survive. Outside those excepcional instances, people should just be zerker and forget about it.

In my opnion mobs shouldnt be that hard hitting. They could hit far weaker but more constant to make the use of control characters more of an important addition to most groups. That wouldnt allow “zerker” survive alone and would also require a control/support to be using his skills to be alive.

If a bunker can hold aggro mostly with his toughness and his control skills (snares, stuns, pushbacks), make it so they can actually survive a far more.

But then bunkers would be more like
traditional tanks,and the game would not
be as innovative.

not true at all. you can make high damage builds and far from being a zerker plus ~1800 toughness makes a significant damage reduction (close to 35%)

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

Viking Jorun.5413:

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

That is great because thieves have insane spike damage try it on a class that doesn’t and see if you out damage a zerker build.

Use blind more.

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

That is great because thieves have insane spike damage try it on a class that doesn’t and see if you out damage a zerker build.

Apothecary gear infers conditions. When I say I can out-DPS zerkers, it means I don’t run burst. L2Read.

Reihert.1509:

The way current content is designed, there is no reason to play outside zerker.
…
In my opnion mobs shouldnt be that hard hitting.

O.o

I only have two 80s. One is a ranger and the other a necro. My ranger has clerics and my necro has knights. I’ve solo’ed champs, camps, towers and dungeons.

I’m now leveling a staff ele that is as close to zerker as I can get at level 14 (lol) and I need to constantly be moving, and I need to burn down ranged mobs first and fast while kiting melee.

Mobs only hit hard when you have no toughness. Making them hit for less will only make zerker the better choice and reduce/eliminate the need for toughness, vitality, and/or healing gear.

Viking Jorun.5413:

Apothecary gear infers conditions. When I say I can out-DPS zerkers, it means I don’t run burst. L2Read.

You can burst with conditions. That’s why having more than one condition damage party member is generally a bad idea, because then they negate each other’s burst when the cap is reached.

Deamhan.9538:

Mobs only hit hard when you have no toughness. Making them hit for less will only make zerker the better choice and reduce/eliminate the need for toughness, vitality, and/or healing gear.

The point that was raised is that enemies should hit for less damage, but attack more often. This way the zerker player cannot simply negate 100% of the incoming damage by simply making one dodge every 5 seconds.

Viking Jorun.5413:

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

That is great because thieves have insane spike damage try it on a class that doesn’t and see if you out damage a zerker build.

Apothecary gear infers conditions. When I say I can out-DPS zerkers, it means I don’t run burst. L2Read.

Even on Apoc Thieves do more damage than most other classes so my quote still stands, Thieves damage is vastly above most other classes even condi based.

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

That is great because thieves have insane spike damage try it on a class that doesn’t and see if you out damage a zerker build.

Apothecary gear infers conditions. When I say I can out-DPS zerkers, it means I don’t run burst. L2Read.

Even on Apoc Thieves do more damage than most other classes so my quote still stands, Thieves damage is vastly above most other classes even condi based.

I doubt that a 7% crit chance combined with an average hit of 400 on Backstab is anything to cower at. The only reason I ever use my 1 skill is to apply poison when my initiative is recharging. People need to stop assuming that thieves have the highest burst damage when warriors can deal up to 18k with Eviscerate and 33k with 100b. Backstab does a maximum of 8k damage when you go full glass and it crits. But you know what happens when we assume, right? You make an kitten of yourself.

It’d be a pain to check since I’m at work right now but isn’t apoc gear pwr/prec/cond dmg? Where zerker is pwr/prec/crit dmg? I’m willing to bet you do less physical damage than zerker thieves but you may do more physical dps + conditional dps combined.

Deamhan.9538:

It’d be a pain to check since I’m at work right now but isn’t apoc gear pwr/prec/cond dmg? Where zerker is pwr/prec/crit dmg? I’m willing to bet you do less physical damage than zerker thieves but you may do more physical dps + conditional dps combined.

Apothecary’s is
Toughness
Healing Power (main)
Condition

It’s the condition damage version of Cleric’s. You are thinking of Rabid.

I heard dodge was a OP ability……

Viking Jorun.5413:

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

Dante.1508:

Viking Jorun.5413:

I run an apothecary condition build on my thief in PvE with Signet of Malice and out-DPS zerkers while out-surviving them as well the moment I get and maintain 25 stacks on my enemy(s).

That is great because thieves have insane spike damage try it on a class that doesn’t and see if you out damage a zerker build.

Apothecary gear infers conditions. When I say I can out-DPS zerkers, it means I don’t run burst. L2Read.

Even on Apoc Thieves do more damage than most other classes so my quote still stands, Thieves damage is vastly above most other classes even condi based.

I doubt that a 7% crit chance combined with an average hit of 400 on Backstab is anything to cower at. The only reason I ever use my 1 skill is to apply poison when my initiative is recharging. People need to stop assuming that thieves have the highest burst damage when warriors can deal up to 18k with Eviscerate and 33k with 100b. Backstab does a maximum of 8k damage when you go full glass and it crits. But you know what happens when we assume, right? You make an kitten of yourself.

So much misinformation here…

33k with 100b is not burst…its 33k over 3 seconds channel time.
Backstab does well over 8k damage with full glass…try it out sometimes.

By the way this is not a great title for the thread unless you are trying to get troll replies. I also assume you wanted this in the dungeon section? I agree with at least some of the things you’ve said but they generally don’t apply to open world stuff.

There are also other stuff they can do like the Champion of the Stony Shield’s reflect.

Reihert.1509:

The way current content is designed, there is no reason to play outside zerker.

I know there are FotM and Arah as exceptions, but still…

It just doesnt make sense how strong they hit on charr with “full control” set. They do get their aggro, but there is no way they could survive. Outside those excepcional instances, people should just be zerker and forget about it.

In my opnion mobs shouldnt be that hard hitting. They could hit far weaker but more constant to make the use of control characters more of an important addition to most groups. That wouldnt allow “zerker” survive alone and would also require a control/support to be using his skills to be alive.

If a bunker can hold aggro mostly with his toughness and his control skills (snares, stuns, pushbacks), make it so they can actually survive a far more.

The game is not meant to have tanks or healers. Although you can build your toon to be more control and maybe take a few more punches and take more aggro. But in the end, you’ll need to dodge out and let someone else take the aggro..like the elementalist or something ;p.

Lets not forget, the most popular way of gaining ‘hate’ as it is called in this game, is toughness. But that is not the only way, and bosses have different hate mechanics. Some generate hate based on player proximity, for example.

“Control Characters” … This is not an animal that actually exists in PvE.

ALL of our controls are basically built around sPvP Bunker-Ball spiking. CC, even in s{PvP} is not designed around Defense, it’s designed Gw1’s meta of waiting for Pressure to build enough until the other team’s healers either “Lose it for them” by making a mistake, or your team fakes them out on where your Focus fire is and then you quickly spiked the real target you were after all along. It’s like a high stakes Poker game, the skill is in the timing, resources, and bluff.

So for PvE, and defensive CC especially, we would need Skill-Split controls with either much longer durations: 5 or 6 seconds instead of 1-2… or quicker recharges bringing 40sec & 25sec controls CD’s down to 20 & 12 seconds like in Gw1’s PvE splits… (there was HUNDREDS of split skills in Gw1 by the way and no one ever complained about having to learn 2 different sets of skills b/c you already HAD TO LEARN 2 completely different games and Metas just to go from PvE to PvP anyway)

there is a boon somewhere far out there that is called protection. It is highly underrated.