Guild Wars 2

I’m confused. Prior to the AMA, everyone was up in arms about the new gear tier and the way it’s been implemented. Chris has now said over and over that the dev team acknowledges that they made several missteps in many aspects of the patch, but they are learning from them and don’t intend to repeat them. Also, he’s said outright that the problems brought on in the patch will be made right.

It’s not just the FotM/Ascended gear issue. Many other points that I’ve seen brought up again and again here over the last few weeks have been touched on in the AMA. Quite a few times Chris has stated that the dev team is working on fixes. But now all I’m seeing here is “OMG it’s all PR nonsense and deflections!” My god people, is it possible to please you? Do you actually prefer to believe that the dev team is trying to trick you into playing the game as long as possible while they steer as far away from their own manifesto as possible?

Calm down. The sky is not falling. It may seem that way because of rendering bugs, but I’m sure they’re working on that too. You’re choosing to believe that Anet is desperately trying to cheat you out of your money when it’s just as likely that they are simply learning from their mistakes while trying to produce an incredible game.

Thanks for your hard work, dev team. Don’t let the rude kids get you down.

Well considering that 10,000 post hread about the disaster that was the lost Shores weekend now seems to have disappated, I’d say people have moved on. Don’t forget all the crying was BEFORE they launched fractals….Now everything is all about lfg (pick you difficulty) fractals spam in LA. People moan, but they secretly love grinding the new gear

There are people that are to invested in their hate now. They have gotten themselves to worked up, and said to much to admit they were wrong. This is the kind of thing that causes parents and children to not speak for decades, and what causes generational wars. Here it is just a computer game, but it is the same principle.

Mitch, I’m talking about all the alarmists in the AMA thread.

People are too invested in the hate. It’s become a case of hate for the sake of hate really. I’ve actually not bothered grinding for Ascended gear as I know they’re going to have to add other ways to get it that aren’t insane.

I’m hoping they run a constant case of releasing a new Ascended slot item in one patch that requires hellish grinding, and then a month later, making it absolute cake to get, then after that, releasing yet another grindbait.

Facepunch.5710:

Mitch, I’m talking about all the alarmists in the AMA thread.

Yup…and most of them are all out there grinding the new fractals. People threaten to leave and scream the house down, but deep inside they want those ascended rings. They NEED those rings…

It had been stated for awhile now that we will be able to get the gear other ways, so I have yet to even run the fractals even once, dungeons are just not my thing. I’ll get the new gear with the tons of karma and badges of honor that are just gathering dust right now. They have now admitted this should have been added at the same time as the fractals, ok they made a mistake, time to move on and play the game the way you want, you’ll be able to get the new gear soon enough.

To be honest before this AMA I was very concerned with GW2’s general direction but a lot of questions which needed answers got them. There was no silly PR cover up al la BioWare, there was no arrogance. there the “hey guys, this didn’t turn out exactly as we envisioned it. We’re working on fixing it.”

Some people might not find that reassuring but I do, it was down to earth and it was communication which was needed.

So from now on when people start screaming negativity on the forums I’ll simply go grab a bag of popcorn and watch the daytime soap without having to pay for cable.

I agree. It’s really not as bad as everyone else makes it out to be. The AMA covered many points that people were concerned about with regards to the general direction of the game.

I have faith that Anet will do the right thing by most of the player-base. I have a good feeling about where the game will be in 6 months time so let’s wait it out and see what actually happens.

I really think people just want to see Ascended gear (a notion of ever increasing Stat-Based Progression) removed from the game and thrown back into the closet of bad ideas never to return.

This is what I am more or less seeing.

grumbles.5412:

I really think people just want to see Ascended gear (a notion of ever increasing Stat-Based Progression) removed from the game and thrown back into the closet of bad ideas never to return.

This is what I am more or less seeing.

I’m seeing people the complete opposite to be honest. Lion’s Arch has been completley taken over by spam lfg by people trying to get the mats and drops from fractals….all for better stats.

Gear grinding is almost a dealbreaker for me. That they have the audacity to tell us that it isn’t one, and that there’s little grind involved, takes the friggin cake. I honestly had planned to go back to playing, at least a little bit, after this AMA – but those responses just drove me out the door. May this game go down in flames.

~Your former fan(boi) and supporter.

Unhappy casual/GW1 players is why. This is why the best games of all time made games more than a niche game. They made games that appealed to many styles of play. Something Anet is trying to accomplish with GW2.

If you want 100% casual, feel free to hit up another game. This isn’t Kansas anymore.

Maybe they’re complaining because this AMA has been going on for over eight hours and he hasn’t answered a single question.

If all it takes to please you is a dev saying ’we’re thinking about it and we might do something vaguely related to it at some point in the future,’ well, I guess it’s easy to be you.

Mitch.4781:

grumbles.5412:

I really think people just want to see Ascended gear (a notion of ever increasing Stat-Based Progression) removed from the game and thrown back into the closet of bad ideas never to return.

This is what I am more or less seeing.

I’m seeing people the complete opposite to be honest. Lion’s Arch has been completley taken over by spam lfg by people trying to get the mats and drops from fractals….all for better stats.

There is an apparent need to get it (stats are increasing we better stay on that train choo choo) Its also hard to say everyone wanting to get into Fractals is doing so just to grab the new gear. Its new content and it offers progressive skill challenges (to some extent) I personally enjoy skill challenges.

Though lets face it, most people will do Fractals in order to get the gear either because they enjoy stat grinds or because they have to stay up in the power curve.

Mitch.4781:

Well considering that 10,000 post hread about the disaster that was the lost Shores weekend now seems to have disappated, I’d say people have moved on. Don’t forget all the crying was BEFORE they launched fractals….Now everything is all about lfg (pick you difficulty) fractals spam in LA. People moan, but they secretly love grinding the new gear

Yea well I don’t think they’ve all negative!

Ualtar.5047:

There are people that are to invested in their hate now. They have gotten themselves to worked up, and said to much to admit they were wrong. This is the kind of thing that causes parents and children to not speak for decades, and what causes generational wars. Here it is just a computer game, but it is the same principle.

Perhaps some have, I don’t think that vaguely fits that many. Nothing has changed for anyone to change their stance that I’m aware of.

I really have to respect Chris and his efforts today but to be completely honest it makes me angry, disappointed and bewildered all over again.

I know it’s just a game, and I’m just a crazy MMO player passionate about the hobby and genre.

I waited for this game for so long, it finally arrived, I got to play it for 3 months, then someone went off their meds and BooM! We’re back in beta waiting for them to fix the game again.

I think GW2 is an incredible game. The design team behind it showed some real genius in their ideologies, but the live teams just seems to be relearning these lessons over again instead of following through on the strength of the game. I’m more angry now that this fracture in the game and community happened at all.

It sounds like they got the message. Gear progression is here to stay, but they get it that all players regardless of how they CHOOSE to play the game need a path to the gear and that path allows them to have fun.

And, I know some will not be happy with anything short of a total reversal of vertical progression, but that’s not going to happen by the sounds of it. For those hoping to hear that today, I truly am sorry.

It’s negative because the main reason for someone to come to the forums is because they are confused or upset about something.

People having fun rarely feel the need to come to the forums. They just play the game.

It’s redundant to ask, “Why is the complaints box full of complaints?” It only take a moment’s thought to see why there aren’t several hundred thousand posts saying, “Everything is fine, good job.”

Some ppl just want the game to die because its not THERE ideal game. There was a lot of hype leading up to this game and it got ppl going so you got a major flam war over GW2 and WoW but you had a number of ppl come over from WoW thinking its Eden but they did not know any thing but WoW so all they have to go on is a WoW aimed mind for both good things and bad things in a game so they are unable to judge the game on an even playing field with other non mmorpg games. So every small thing gets magnified best example is in the first month of the game there where bugs not crazy amounts but bugs non the less and you saw ppl go comply crazy over this yes a lot of them got fixed but non of these ppl where happy with that they wanted more. And that the problem why every thing so Negative there is no praise for good only scorn for bad.

BabelFish.7234:

To be honest before this AMA I was very concerned with GW2’s general direction but a lot of questions which needed answers got them. There was no silly PR cover up al la BioWare, there was no arrogance. there the “hey guys, this didn’t turn out exactly as we envisioned it. We’re working on fixing it.”

Some people might not find that reassuring but I do, it was down to earth and it was communication which was needed.

I’ve still got concerns:
1. From the AMA I get the feeling that what they regard as a grind and what I regard as a grind are quite different.
2. Its good that he’s taken responsibility for many of the issues but IMHO they never should have been implemented in the first place, as a result I’ve got concerns over the way they implement new features and live support, and they won’t be allayed until new content gets rolled out that doesn’t have the same issues and demonstrates that they are paying attention to their design philosophies.

Whether the recent decisions came from someone at some other big company or not, the recent mistakes they are making have been done by countless other developers and PR folks over the years. Honestly, I’m guessing most of them have been in the business long enough to know that several game mishaps and a number of PR disasters in a row will result in angry forum-goers. It’s not exactly a shocking thing to me. Sorry if it is to you.

Logun.2349:

…And, I know some will not be happy with anything short of a total reversal of vertical progression, but that’s not going to happen by the sounds of it. For those hoping to hear that today, I truly am sorry.

I really enjoy this game. So much exploration, brings me back to when I first started playing MMOs. I’ve been for Ascended gear, because I think it opens up options, gives people yet one more thing to work toward. But, with all the negativity towards it, I now feel they should reverse it. I don’t want to see the game die out because of this. If it loses its loyal fanbase because they are completely against vertical progression, well, that’s no good. You can’t just have players who are in to the latest craze, because if you don’t feed them constantly, they’ll move on to the next game. I do understand that part of it better. It’s unfortunate. This game has so much potential. I don’t want it all to go to waste because they chose a direction that split the community and drove away the fans.

I don’t know how to explain it any better but here goes…

Say there’s a book, or a movie, or a comic, or a TV show, or a series of book, or paintings, whatever. You love them and you just can’t get enough, and you are excited about them and you talk about them to other people, online, friends, it’s all great.

But then you have to start writing reports on them. It doesn’t have to be very frequent, and they don’t have to be overly long, but you HAVE to do them, or you start missing out on blooper reels, or maybe blog posts from the authors… and you have to keep doing them because if you stop, you start getting slowly cut off, over time. In time it will kill any and all joy you ever had for that thing you once loved.

The arguments of "it’s only 5 pages (only 5 % better stats guise, chilaxxxx), or that you don’t have to do it very often (we won’t release a new tier every three months), are irrelevant. When the activity becomes mandatory, fun starts to slowly fade, and then die.

Mitch.4781:

Well considering that 10,000 post hread about the disaster that was the lost Shores weekend now seems to have disappated, I’d say people have moved on. Don’t forget all the crying was BEFORE they launched fractals….Now everything is all about lfg (pick you difficulty) fractals spam in LA. People moan, but they secretly love grinding the new gear

people just quit

I’m willing to go to a wait and see approach. It’s not like there’s a monthly fee.

I do appreciate Anet’s responses and that they gave their stance on what the direction of the game is gonna be. I agree that it is miles better than Bioware’s arrogance. The reason I left SWTOR (and came back to LoTRO) is not because of the bugs, or that my class got nerfed (Scoundrel btw), or game designs. The reason I left is because of Bioware’s arrogance, nothing else. Had Bioware responded as such, I wouldn’t have left SWTOR.

But you also have to consider that the next step after all the anger dissipates is that people are finally gonna move on. Whether that means staying here in GW2 or not is ultimately up to the gamer. They paid, and got their money’s worth out of it after all.

Rhotsbin.8579:

Gear grinding is almost a dealbreaker for me. That they have the audacity to tell us that it isn’t one, and that there’s little grind involved, takes the friggin cake. I honestly had planned to go back to playing, at least a little bit, after this AMA – but those responses just drove me out the door. May this game go down in flames.

~Your former fan(boi) and supporter.

This is just wrong on so many levels. You have made a personal choice. I don’t see why you would wish harm to the game (and people still playing it) though. I doubt you were ever a true supporter. If someone told you they wish you will be out of a job and homeless how would you feel?

Random people don’t just walk up to you and say things like that. Someone has to feel very cheated to get that kind of emotional response.

I for one would stop and ask myself if i had maybe done something wrong.

Amonde Daneren.2380:

Random people don’t just walk up to you and say things like that. Someone has to feel very cheated to get that kind of emotional response.

I for one would stop and ask myself if i had maybe done something wrong.

Considering the level of self entitlement and melodramatics the people on this forum display, it really wouldn’t take a lot to set someone off like that.

morrolan.9608:

BabelFish.7234:

To be honest before this AMA I was very concerned with GW2’s general direction but a lot of questions which needed answers got them. There was no silly PR cover up al la BioWare, there was no arrogance. there the “hey guys, this didn’t turn out exactly as we envisioned it. We’re working on fixing it.”

Some people might not find that reassuring but I do, it was down to earth and it was communication which was needed.

I’ve still got concerns:
1. From the AMA I get the feeling that what they regard as a grind and what I regard as a grind are quite different.
2. Its good that he’s taken responsibility for many of the issues but IMHO they never should have been implemented in the first place, as a result I’ve got concerns over the way they implement new features and live support, and they won’t be allayed until new content gets rolled out that doesn’t have the same issues and demonstrates that they are paying attention to their design philosophies.

I would agree on both points.

For grinding, I consider getting an Ascended ring, for me, thus far, a grind. I don’t have one yet. I’ve completed 86 fractals, and either 7 or 8 level 10 tier daily chests, and no ring. I’m grinding because I’m not doing content I haven’t done before, and I’m not getting rewarded for doing it (in a way that I would deem acceptable).

I’m just being RNG gated from progressing to further Agony levels by not having a ring that many people already have multiples of, including duplicates they can’t even use.

By every definition I can think of, that’s grinding.

As for the 2nd point – the problems he’s taking responsibility for were, for the most part, predicted before the patch went live, and yet it was still implemented. Just read the 10k + thread for what people were saying, and much of it is already true. The fact that they either couldn’t foresee these problems or willingly added content knowing these problems would exist says they’re either not very good at predicting MMO behavior or so intent on getting this content out when they got it out that they simply accepted it was subpar. Either one of those possibilities is a bit scary.

Mitch.4781:

Well considering that 10,000 post hread about the disaster that was the lost Shores weekend now seems to have disappated, I’d say people have moved on. Don’t forget all the crying was BEFORE they launched fractals….Now everything is all about lfg (pick you difficulty) fractals spam in LA. People moan, but they secretly love grinding the new gear

They locked that thread, actually. It was still going strong.

Personally my plan and that of my friends, we will stick around to see when and what kind of grind they come up with when they put ascended gear out in the world and wvw this will decide alot for us til then well hell its free to play if its takes a long time we will just resubscribe to one the games we played before and split our time and keep are wallets closed to black lion trading til we know if we want to stay and invest in the game It all comes down to their solution

Mitch.4781:

[…] that 10,000 post hread about the disaster that was the lost Shores weekend disappeared […] People moan, but they secretly love grinding the new gear.

No. I don’t think that’s the case at all. I think that, as the earlier part of your post suggests, ArenaNet are just really good at damage control and clean-up.

deborah.2068:

Personally my plan and that of my friends, we will stick around to see when and what kind of grind they come up with when they put ascended gear out in the world and wvw this will decide alot for us til then well hell its free to play if its takes a long time we will just resubscribe to one the games we played before and split our time and keep are wallets closed to black lion trading til we know if we want to stay and invest in the game It all comes down to their solution

Same. If it is an unreasonable grind, I am done.

Got me. The story seems to get better and better via the personal storyline. I feel as if I am fighting for something, and that the game content is filled with story.

People ragequitting are too much in a subscription mindset.

Just stopping any money flow towards them is essentialy the same thing anyway, and with this you can play while it still lasts.

Personaly i´m going to wait and see, but not a cent will leave my pockets before i´m satisfied with what they´ve done with the new direction.

Carltonbanks.1754:

Amonde Daneren.2380:

Random people don’t just walk up to you and say things like that. Someone has to feel very cheated to get that kind of emotional response.

I for one would stop and ask myself if i had maybe done something wrong.

Considering the level of self entitlement and melodramatics the people on this forum display, it really wouldn’t take a lot to set someone off like that.

People are so entitled when they pay for something they were advertised and they get something they didn’t want. I mean wow, what were people expecting right? Everyone should just accept everything and anything that happens and buy more black lion keys. I mean, playing the game for 1000 hours and getting screwed over is completely good. People should really stop being so melodramatic. I mean its not like they have anything invested in the game or anything.

Esrever.8613:

Carltonbanks.1754:

Amonde Daneren.2380:

Random people don’t just walk up to you and say things like that. Someone has to feel very cheated to get that kind of emotional response.

I for one would stop and ask myself if i had maybe done something wrong.

Considering the level of self entitlement and melodramatics the people on this forum display, it really wouldn’t take a lot to set someone off like that.

People are so entitled when they pay for something they were advertised and they get something they didn’t want. I mean wow, what were people expecting right? Everyone should just accept everything and anything that happens and buy more black lion keys. I mean, playing the game for 1000 hours and getting screwed over is completely good. People should really stop being so melodramatic. I mean its not like they have anything invested in the game or anything.

Being completely negative just makes you look like a whiner. They have answered your questions, said what they intend to do. Leave or dont, stop posting negativity about the same topic..its just lame at this point.

I actually think it was a good AMA and I appreciated the fact that they owned up to mistakes that where made.
It also gives answers so that people can now decide what they want to do.
Ultimately it is up to each player.
Face it, no-one is perfect and the Anet team are just people like you and me, they are not gods.
I am sure that they do want to keep all sorts of players and play-styles happy in the game- they spent years building this world after all.
How possible that will be, remains to be seen.

Strang.8170:

People ragequitting are too much in a subscription mindset.

Just stopping any money flow towards them is essentialy the same thing anyway, and with this you can play while it still lasts.

Personaly i´m going to wait and see, but not a cent will leave my pockets before i´m satisfied with what they´ve done with the new direction.

At this point why even put more time into characters when ArenaNet is going to continue down this path? I was planning on getting all classes to 80, but that’s been put on hold. I have no real reason to continue playing if it’s going to be a vertical progression. When they spend more time making WvW and DE’s that have depth I’ll start playing again, but I’m certainly not going to spend hours grinding out gear. I’ve played that game already and it got old 6 years ago.

Also just stopping the money isn’t enough. If you really wanted to show ArenaNet the repercussions of their poor designs then you stop playing. Those that are satisfied with the game are far less likely to buy stuff when there is no one left to play with. They aren’t going to buy gems to convert to gold to buy awesome looking armor when there isn’t anyone to show it off to. When no one is doing events they won’t put money into karma boosts.

Esrever.8613:

Carltonbanks.1754:

Amonde Daneren.2380:

Random people don’t just walk up to you and say things like that. Someone has to feel very cheated to get that kind of emotional response.

I for one would stop and ask myself if i had maybe done something wrong.

Considering the level of self entitlement and melodramatics the people on this forum display, it really wouldn’t take a lot to set someone off like that.

People are so entitled when they pay for something they were advertised and they get something they didn’t want. I mean wow, what were people expecting right? Everyone should just accept everything and anything that happens and buy more black lion keys. I mean, playing the game for 1000 hours and getting screwed over is completely good. People should really stop being so melodramatic. I mean its not like they have anything invested in the game or anything.

oh well many players tired of playing mmorpgs saw the advertising tried the game..

After few months bought a new pc, a gaming mouse etc because they had what they are promised….then suddenly…….BAM a patch and all disappears.

If it wasn t for the manifesto i would’ve stuck to my x360 …..because there aren t many other games i like on th pc but a no grind mmorpg was alone enough….

I really liked the AMA and the responses.

The guy explained their thinking in detail, and answered a lot of very difficult questions quite openly. It was courteous to players while still being positive and decisive about GW2.

ArenaNet are the most communicative and honest MMO makers out there (alongside the people who made Rift). In comparison companies like Funcom, Bioware and Blizzard never admit mistakes and have a really arrogant and smug attitude.

People won’t be mad about the ascended items thing forever, it’s already just another part of the game.

The whining is only overshadowing what is a really good and open communication about what ArenaNet are doing with expanding the game and moving it forward.

BabelFish.7234:

To be honest before this AMA I was very concerned with GW2’s general direction but a lot of questions which needed answers got them. There was no silly PR cover up al la BioWare, there was no arrogance. there the “hey guys, this didn’t turn out exactly as we envisioned it. We’re working on fixing it.”

Some people might not find that reassuring but I do, it was down to earth and it was communication which was needed.

I feel the same way. It was PR-covered (Ofc it has to be for damage control) but it was straightforward. Chris’s answers calmed me down, a lot. Especially his repeated saying “not what we intended”, “was a mistake” and him apologizing. Personally, I feel like his answers were straightforward, down to earth and not trying to insult anyone’s intelligence. I think he couldn’t have given better answers than what he did.

read 1 billion complain posts which was closed, infractured, banned …

then you will know why almost everyone is so negative

im negative couse i hate the new ascended gear, i hate the dungeon which throws you out on dc, i hate the fact they dont take the game stability as the highest priority those random-pc-crashes and the broken proffessions…
im negative couse i waisted 60€ for this game, couse of they FALSE promises and lies:
dynamic events? what is so dynamic about them, they just start repeadetly after some time passes
no grinding? what is about crafting proffessions? what is about ascended gear?